Guild Wars 2

warriorjrd.8695:

Atherakhia.4086:

Warriorjrd hit the problem square on the head and points out why the Ranger’s water field isn’t as valuable as you’d think it is. In reality, the only time we use them anymore is when PvD’ing and just healing through arrow cart spam.

In a perfect world, you’d think the Ranger would act as a vital rally location for a melee train. The idea being the melee train goes into the enemy zerg in either a GvG or Zerg Busting function. They do the damage and pull out for re-empowers. When rallying, they could rally on the Ranger’s location which would allow a low CD, large duration water field to be bursted to top the group back up.

The problem with this is the Ranger lacks adequate survivability to sustain themselves against not only the periphery classes but also the opposing teams backline. They also lack the ability to reposition themselves safely so the melee train can rally in more strategic locations.

In other words, very rarely will your group move forward 900 yards, hit some people, and move directly back 900 yards to the Ranger. Instead they’ll likely move forward 1500 yards to hit the opposing groups back end and force their DPS classes along the periphery which gives their thieves and dps warriors more targets to choose. Meanwhile the opposing team probably did the same but the Ranger died due to being trained or he fled to the periphery which is not an ideal rally location to re-empower.

Just in my experience this is how we’ve attempted to use Rangers in the past with not so great results.

Ranger has the ability to be mobile and get to a safe location, but that’s unnecessary when you take into account two 1200 range fields from an ele.

This is the core of the issue.

Is healing spring a good team support skill in a situation with multiple blast finishers? Yes, absolutely.

Is it something we bring to the zerg that another class can’t also do while performing tasks we can not? No, not at all.

I’ve been on Blackgate for over a year and a half now and I almost never hear for water fields from Rangers. In fact, the VAST majority of both chat and TS speak concerning rangers is jokes about how they are easy prey in a zerg or other general “lol a ranger in wvw” riffs.

If water isn’t placed right the elementalists get yelled at. The fact that I didn’t place it never comes to mind. Same with if a water is dropped at just the right time.

At the end of the day Healing spring is very good but that’s about it. Ele water fields are also very good but they can drop them from range while also bringing heavy area damage and borderline OP area hard CC. Two things the ranger can’t even begin to do. Good luck trying to match the power of meteornado on a ranger when your pet can’t get anywhere near the hammer train.

Prysin.8542:

In terms of ranged single target DPS the “leaderboard” has since before december last year been;
LB Ranger
GS Mesmer
LB Warrior
SB Thief
tha rest

Ranger IS the best ranged damage dealer. The most reliable and tanky? that is another discussion entirely.

Zerker Staff Ele says Hullo?

nearlight.3064:

Prysin.8542:

In terms of ranged single target DPS the “leaderboard” has since before december last year been;
LB Ranger
GS Mesmer
LB Warrior
SB Thief
tha rest

Ranger IS the best ranged damage dealer. The most reliable and tanky? that is another discussion entirely.

Zerker Staff Ele says Hullo?

Even specter fresh air

@ substance E: sharknado getting nerfed next patch. I made a water field with my tears. =’’’’’’’’’(

warriorjrd.8695:

nearlight.3064:

Prysin.8542:

In terms of ranged single target DPS the “leaderboard” has since before december last year been;
LB Ranger
GS Mesmer
LB Warrior
SB Thief
tha rest

Ranger IS the best ranged damage dealer. The most reliable and tanky? that is another discussion entirely.

Zerker Staff Ele says Hullo?

Even specter fresh air

@ substance E: sharknado getting nerfed next patch. I made a water field with my tears. =’’’’’’’’’(

S/F ele is literally a breath of fresh air to play in this stale game. It is love. It is lyfe.

Anyway back to crying about how underwhelming the necromancer changes were! #someonekillmebeforeIusecheesynightmarebuildonemoretime

warriorjrd.8695:

nearlight.3064:

Prysin.8542:

In terms of ranged single target DPS the “leaderboard” has since before december last year been;
LB Ranger
GS Mesmer
LB Warrior
SB Thief
tha rest

Ranger IS the best ranged damage dealer. The most reliable and tanky? that is another discussion entirely.

Zerker Staff Ele says Hullo?

Even specter fresh air

@ substance E: sharknado getting nerfed next patch. I made a water field with my tears. =’’’’’’’’’(

lol Season 3 will interesting to say the least without the 4-5k shower hits.

Substance E.4852:

warriorjrd.8695:

nearlight.3064:

Prysin.8542:

In terms of ranged single target DPS the “leaderboard” has since before december last year been;
LB Ranger
GS Mesmer
LB Warrior
SB Thief
tha rest

Ranger IS the best ranged damage dealer. The most reliable and tanky? that is another discussion entirely.

Zerker Staff Ele says Hullo?

Even specter fresh air

@ substance E: sharknado getting nerfed next patch. I made a water field with my tears. =’’’’’’’’’(

lol Season 3 will interesting to say the least without the 4-5k shower hits.

4-5k? I’ve seen eles hit 10k+ with sharknado, but maybe that was full glass non support build =p

warriorjrd.8695:

Substance E.4852:

warriorjrd.8695:

nearlight.3064:

Prysin.8542:

In terms of ranged single target DPS the “leaderboard” has since before december last year been;
LB Ranger
GS Mesmer
LB Warrior
SB Thief
tha rest

Ranger IS the best ranged damage dealer. The most reliable and tanky? that is another discussion entirely.

Zerker Staff Ele says Hullo?

Even specter fresh air

@ substance E: sharknado getting nerfed next patch. I made a water field with my tears. =’’’’’’’’’(

lol Season 3 will interesting to say the least without the 4-5k shower hits.

4-5k? I’ve seen eles hit 10k+ with sharknado, but maybe that was full glass non support build =p

Mostly just based on the average hits I take with ~2800 armor on my ranger though it’s often hard to tell whether I’m getting hit by a nado shower or a regular one critting me. I’d imagine that zerk Ele’s take much more.

nearlight.3064:

Prysin.8542:

In terms of ranged single target DPS the “leaderboard” has since before december last year been;
LB Ranger
GS Mesmer
LB Warrior
SB Thief
tha rest

Ranger IS the best ranged damage dealer. The most reliable and tanky? that is another discussion entirely.

Zerker Staff Ele says Hullo?

read – single target Ranged DPS

If looking at AOE or cleave (pierce/splash) – ele is vastly superior in every way.

Apparition.1576:

Correction, in GW1 Rangers WERE forced to use bows. Ranger/Warriors, like the Aragorn reference, could use other weapons effectively. Make sure your information is completely accurate next time. =)

Are you seriously gonna clinch on the to the straw man argument? You never played the first game as a mono class, and second professions was never just a game mechanic, it was a part of the lore.

You would always get a second profession before any requirements for weapons even mattered. And every builds utilizing second profession weapons were always built upon some the the rangers abilities, mainly the Expertise attribute line.

Which by the way was the ranger’s primary attribute line. Marksmanship wasn’t. I’m gonna leave it with that, ‘cause I’m pretty sure people are tired of the off-topic nonsense.

Prysin.8542:

nearlight.3064:

Prysin.8542:

In terms of ranged single target DPS the “leaderboard” has since before december last year been;
LB Ranger
GS Mesmer
LB Warrior
SB Thief
tha rest

Ranger IS the best ranged damage dealer. The most reliable and tanky? that is another discussion entirely.

Zerker Staff Ele says Hullo?

read – single target Ranged DPS

If looking at AOE or cleave (pierce/splash) – ele is vastly superior in every way.

In PvE, zerk staff ele is better at single target too…

In PvP-type situations, people will just step out of the Lava Font…but in those situations, AoE tends to be superior to single target dps anyways. =P

Prysin.8542:

nearlight.3064:

Prysin.8542:

In terms of ranged single target DPS the “leaderboard” has since before december last year been;
LB Ranger
GS Mesmer
LB Warrior
SB Thief
tha rest

Ranger IS the best ranged damage dealer. The most reliable and tanky? that is another discussion entirely.

Zerker Staff Ele says Hullo?

read – single target Ranged DPS

If looking at AOE or cleave (pierce/splash) – ele is vastly superior in every way.

Even if we discredit AOE skills (idk why) to find single target dps, zerk staff ele would be near the top of that list. And then there is scepter fresh air ele xD That at least has the burst to be higher than LB ranger (even after the patch) and DPS to be second if not first on that list probably.

warriorjrd.8695:

Prysin.8542:

nearlight.3064:

Prysin.8542:

In terms of ranged single target DPS the “leaderboard” has since before december last year been;
LB Ranger
GS Mesmer
LB Warrior
SB Thief
tha rest

Ranger IS the best ranged damage dealer. The most reliable and tanky? that is another discussion entirely.

Zerker Staff Ele says Hullo?

read – single target Ranged DPS

If looking at AOE or cleave (pierce/splash) – ele is vastly superior in every way.

Even if we discredit AOE skills (idk why) to find single target dps, zerk staff ele would be near the top of that list. And then there is scepter fresh air ele xD That at least has the burst to be higher than LB ranger (even after the patch) and DPS to be second if not first on that list probably.

the thing about SF fresh air is this;
If you have stability, 70% of the rotation for SF will be worthless. Because your CC will not work, thus its nigh impossible to land any skills unless the enemy is AFK

Prysin.8542:

warriorjrd.8695:

Prysin.8542:

nearlight.3064:

Prysin.8542:

In terms of ranged single target DPS the “leaderboard” has since before december last year been;
LB Ranger
GS Mesmer
LB Warrior
SB Thief
tha rest

Ranger IS the best ranged damage dealer. The most reliable and tanky? that is another discussion entirely.

Zerker Staff Ele says Hullo?

read – single target Ranged DPS

If looking at AOE or cleave (pierce/splash) – ele is vastly superior in every way.

Even if we discredit AOE skills (idk why) to find single target dps, zerk staff ele would be near the top of that list. And then there is scepter fresh air ele xD That at least has the burst to be higher than LB ranger (even after the patch) and DPS to be second if not first on that list probably.

the thing about SF fresh air is this;
If you have stability, 70% of the rotation for SF will be worthless. Because your CC will not work, thus its nigh impossible to land any skills unless the enemy is AFK

lolno. And again, if you are simply calculating DPS or burst potential you do not take into account what the enemy does or what boons they have, otherwise you would get kittened numbers. If that was the case GS maul just lost it’s burst because it’s easy to dodge, rapid fire is useless after patch because it can be reflected, traps do no damage because the conditions can be cleansed and people can step out of the rings, 100b does 0 damage because you can just step back, eviscerate does 0 damage because you can dodge… I mean do I really need to continue?

Once you try and argue that X skill is useless because enemy will do X action, you can apply that to any skill making it impossible to calculate DPS and burst potential. Idk why you have such a hard time accepting ele has infinitely higher burst than rangers will ever have, and their dps competes with ours even with both on zerk, despite the fact you and I have killed plenty of eles to know ranger isn’t worse or better than an ele. Just because a class can do something better than a ranger doesn’t automatically make ranger bad, you of all people should know that, but you seem to always take a defensive manner when somebody claims a class can do something better than a ranger.

Prysin.8542:

warriorjrd.8695:

Prysin.8542:

nearlight.3064:

Prysin.8542:

In terms of ranged single target DPS the “leaderboard” has since before december last year been;
LB Ranger
GS Mesmer
LB Warrior
SB Thief
tha rest

Ranger IS the best ranged damage dealer. The most reliable and tanky? that is another discussion entirely.

Zerker Staff Ele says Hullo?

read – single target Ranged DPS

If looking at AOE or cleave (pierce/splash) – ele is vastly superior in every way.

Even if we discredit AOE skills (idk why) to find single target dps, zerk staff ele would be near the top of that list. And then there is scepter fresh air ele xD That at least has the burst to be higher than LB ranger (even after the patch) and DPS to be second if not first on that list probably.

the thing about SF fresh air is this;
If you have stability, 70% of the rotation for SF will be worthless. Because your CC will not work, thus its nigh impossible to land any skills unless the enemy is AFK

Dragon’s tooth is more for area denial on points and telling people not to rez downed allies, and is not “70%” of the rotation. Phoenix is very easy to land if you can predict where the enemy is going. The air bursts in between comet, hurl, and arcane blasts never miss unless the target dodges, and those account for the “70%” of the rotation you were talking about.

ranger needs following nerfs, signet of stone needs to be 3 seconds tops, ranger already has acces to most evades (with thief) in game, gs block skill needs added cd for cause now it is just spammable, and it already has acces to most evades in game (with thief) rapid fire needs a max range of 900 cause spamming it like that at range 1200+ is just full kiddo..especially when rolling gs…the mobilty is beyond overpowered and makes for full easy reset and spam rapid fire over and over…the cd of rapid fire makes reflect skills on most classes not viable enough to play…stealth shot of ranger also need a huge additional amount of seconds to its cd, cause paired with the dmge mobilty and survivabilty ranger alrdy has…its just to much…pet res…once pet gets interupted…it goes on cd, ranger is by far the strongest duelist in game hands down for the least effort of input required, does it need to have a godmode downstate as well compared to other classes? you can all rage and deny this…but many many people fully agree on these nerfs…it will make the class more technical to play and less of a garbage like spammer….the ranger as roamer on zerker setup is in extreme advantage of pretty much all classes except for thief…(maybe) that run a zerker spec as well, also maul is highly superior to eviscerate, less cd, pretty much same damage, 5 targets instead of just one and more range..both predictable…so “the but its such slow animation” counter theory is of no value in this case besides eviscerate is a burst skill that requires adrenaline as well….eviscerate should be at least 200% more useful than maul is, thats it.

Darksteel.8412:

ranger needs following nerfs, signet of stone needs to be 3 seconds tops, ranger already has acces to most evades (with thief) in game, gs block skill needs added cd for cause now it is just spammable, and it already has acces to most evades in game (with thief) rapid fire needs a max range of 900 cause spamming it like that at range 1200+ is just full kiddo..especially when rolling gs…the mobilty is beyond overpowered and makes for full easy reset and spam rapid fire over and over…the cd of rapid fire makes reflect skills on most classes not viable enough to play…stealth shot of ranger also need a huge additional amount of seconds to its cd, cause paired with the dmge mobilty and survivabilty ranger alrdy has…its just to much…pet res…once pet gets interupted…it goes on cd, ranger is by far the strongest duelist in game hands down for the least effort of input required, does it need to have a godmode downstate as well compared to other classes? you can all rage and deny this…but many many people fully agree on these nerfs…it will make the class more technical to play and less of a garbage like spammer….the ranger as roamer on zerker setup is in extreme advantage of pretty much all classes except for thief…(maybe) that run a zerker spec as well, also maul is highly superior to eviscerate, less cd, pretty much same damage, 5 targets instead of just one and more range..both predictable…so “the but its such slow animation” counter theory is of no value in this case besides eviscerate is a burst skill that requires adrenaline as well….eviscerate should be at least 200% more useful than maul is, thats it.

Feel better now that you’ve let it all out? By the way, you missed the party by 4 months.

The ranger is the worst class at top tier PvP. So that means it is a learn to play issue.

Eurantien.4632:

The ranger is the worst class at top tier PvP. So that means it is a learn to play issue.

Well eura, to be frank, top tier PvP accounts of the icing of the cake, all the rest of the cake is far below top tier.
If you gonna compete at top tier, eles, engies, warriors, guardians and thief makes for much better icing, but if you just gonna play with “the average peasant” then ranger will be totally fine.

At this point though, ranger is depending on one thing to happen to become top tier.
Either the multiple heals of engi and ele must be reduced by making them unable to blast as many fields as fast as they currently can, OR ranger must be given access to a direct heal of medium power (2.5-3k) that is not tied to its healing skill or any unreliable pet function. If this happens, atleast ST AD ranger will be able to hold their ground in PvP. But if either of these does not happen, then ranger sustain will be far too low compared to ele and engi, and subsequently it is far from good enough.

TL;DR – Currently the ranger is not good enough of a survivor to actually survive.

I hope they will change and not nerf things