Guild Wars 2

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I thought they were going for a traditional type ranger, like Aragorn. He mainly used swords and his bow.

Near.7439:

I thought they were going for a traditional type ranger, like Aragorn. He mainly used swords and his bow.

He actually didn’t use a bow in the books. But yeah.

Guns are an invention of technology.
You have the classes that use magic, and some incidental technology, like guardian, mesmer, elementalist, necro, revenant. The tech enhances their magic.

Then you have that classes that use technology, and some incidental magic.

Engineer basically uses no magic, warriors use a bit more, thief use a considerable amount but normally only to enhance their technology.

Then you get to ranger. Ranger uses an EXTREME amount of magic in comparison to the other non-magical classes. Yes it uses it to enhance combat, but there is a large amount of magic going on that isn’t directly enhancing the ranger.

You call out to spirits of nature, you summon healing water from the earth, you call out plants from the earth to ensnare your enemies.

Notice how the engie shares no weapons with the ranger. They have opposite philosophies. And just as the engie elite spec went further into tech, the ranger spec will go further into magic.

tldr: For now, and unless there is a massive lore change, ranger won’t be getting guns.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Near.7439:

I thought they were going for a traditional type ranger, like Aragorn. He mainly used swords and his bow.

He actually didn’t use a bow in the books. But yeah.

I’d take being a pokemon ranger over what we have now. At least pokemon would be more useful than our current pets.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Then you get to ranger. Ranger uses an EXTREME amount of magic in comparison to the other non-magical classes.

Completely disagree.

I went through and counted all the ranger skills and came up with ~17% that possibly be classified as magic (i.e. I guess we can call healing spring “magic” but then you also have to call things like shadow refuge “magic”) and the overwhelming majority of that was spirits that are a niche, possibly that bridges the gap with druid. If you’re not a spirit ranger, your ranger is probably carrying 1 to 0 “magical” skills.

Likewise their traits suggest knowledge of nature (‘oakheart salve’ or literally ‘wilderness knowledge’) rather than mastery of nature (‘lingering magic’, although that just applies to what pets do.) Much more prominent is the theme animal handling and pet synergy.

Rangers are the 3rd least “magical” of the professions, behind warrior and engi. So little of their gameplay is non-martial it’s not even mentioned in their description on the wiki. “Rangers are flexible and durable—proficient with the bow, yet surgical with the sword. Their loyal pets, which rangers tame and train, distract enemies while the rangers strike safely from a distance.” That sums up non-spirit rangers pretty perfectly.

Magic in quotes every time because it’s a fantasy game and I would guesstimate <1% of all skills are realistic. Warriors throw a 2 handed sword like a boomerang.

Rangers are martial, not forest wizards.

#FullOnNerdy

Fluffball.8307:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Then you get to ranger. Ranger uses an EXTREME amount of magic in comparison to the other non-magical classes.

Completely disagree.

I went through and counted all the ranger skills and came up with ~17% that possibly be classified as magic (i.e. I guess we can call healing spring “magic” but then you also have to call things like shadow refuge “magic”) and the overwhelming majority of that was spirits that are a niche, possibly that bridges the gap with druid. If you’re not a spirit ranger, your ranger is probably carrying 1 to 0 “magical” skills.

Likewise their traits suggest knowledge of nature (‘oakheart salve’ or literally ‘wilderness knowledge’) rather than mastery of nature (‘lingering magic’, although that just applies to what pets do.) Much more prominent is the theme animal handling and pet synergy.

Rangers are the 3rd least “magical” of the professions, behind warrior and engi. So little of their gameplay is non-martial it’s not even mentioned in their description on the wiki. “Rangers are flexible and durable—proficient with the bow, yet surgical with the sword. Their loyal pets, which rangers tame and train, distract enemies while the rangers strike safely from a distance.” That sums up non-spirit rangers pretty perfectly.

Magic in quotes every time because it’s a fantasy game and I would guesstimate <1% of all skills are realistic. Warriors throw a 2 handed sword like a boomerang.

Rangers are martial, not forest wizards.

#FullOnNerdy

… The traitline is called nature magic.
You should also realise that almost all of the survival skills are magical. The whole concept of bark skin fits in with the dnd enhancement spells that, go figure, druids have.

http://www.icyvpn.com/72629/ Although it might be better to just read anets official reason rather than my lore theories

[Eric]Yeah, I think we’d like to look at as the Ranger profession has evolved the same way that the world has evolved, and the Rangers have sort of gone anti-technology, they’ve gone into the wild, they’ve gone and embraced sort of spirit, and things like that. There are other professions in our, you know, five unye, as yet revealed, we mentioned Warriors for example have no problem using rifles. There are plenty of other professions remaining we’re going to use both rifles and pistols, and so for the Ranger it just didn’t feel right for them to be using firearms.

lol, survival skills being magic? An Unguent is a medicinal paste, Muddy Terrain is throwing mud, Lightning Reflexes is self explanatory, as is Sharpening Stone, the only ones that could possibly be construed as magical is Quickening Zephyr and Entangle, so 2/6 that even seem possible to be magic. Nope, not a lot of magic there bro.

The point is you have traits called nature magic, there is nothing set in stone to say that the ranger is not a good mix of martial and magic.

The devs have said that everyone in Tyria including small children use magic on a daily basis. One of the writers posted in the lore forum a couple years ago that basically every single skill in the game is magically affected, which is why none of them are at all realistic. She used the thief as an example; thieves get good at martial skills then use magic to enhance them. Everytime a thief autoattacks with a shortbow, he makes the arrow bounce around (and teleports and going invisible?). Same for engis, especially asura who don’t make any distinction at all between magic and technology. Magic just exists because it’s a fantasy game.

So ya, most of the skills rangers use are magic, but nearly 100% of all warrior skills are magic as well. The point is, rangers are by no means a casting class. Just like the thief, they get good at fighting hand to hand and surviving in the woods, and use magic to supplement that.

Fluffball.8307:

The devs have said that everyone in Tyria including small children use magic on a daily basis. One of the writers posted in the lore forum a couple years ago that basically every single skill in the game is magically affected, which is why none of them are at all realistic. She used the thief as an example; thieves get good at martial skills then use magic to enhance them. Everytime a thief autoattacks with a shortbow, he makes the arrow bounce around (and teleports and going invisible?). Same for engis, especially asura who don’t make any distinction at all between magic and technology. Magic just exists because it’s a fantasy game.

So ya, most of the skills rangers use are magic, but nearly 100% of all warrior skills are magic as well. The point is, rangers are by no means a casting class. Just like the thief, they get good at fighting hand to hand and surviving in the woods, and use magic to supplement that.

I need a source on this. The part on the warriors though seems very wrong. There is very little magic going on in any of their skills.

Also lets look at thieves. Trickshot is a trick shot, not a shot necessarily pulled off with magic. We can consider shadowstepping a technique, yes magical, but 10 variations of the same technique is not the same as 2 different magical ranger skills. Similarly stealth is a technique.

So for thief the only magical things seem to be shadow’s refuge and shadowstep, and all other magic is just a variation of two ninja techniques.

One could say that nature magic is one thing, while stealth and shadowstepping is two. However, contained within the variations of nature magic are many different things that can be uniquely separated, unlike stealth and shadowstep.

Spirit summoning. Plant manipulation, wind/storm manipulation , earth/stone manipulation, frost/water manipulation. Empathic links with animals. Access to stealth. Defensive magic. Healing magic.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

lol, survival skills being magic? An Unguent is a medicinal paste, Muddy Terrain is throwing mud, Lightning Reflexes is self explanatory, as is Sharpening Stone, the only ones that could possibly be construed as magical is Quickening Zephyr and Entangle, so 2/6 that even seem possible to be magic. Nope, not a lot of magic there bro.

I said most, and not at all.

Muddy terrain is not throwing mud. It is earth manipulation http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Muddy_Terrain. It is a continuation of a gw1 nature ritual. Most of the survival skills are continuations of nature rituals. 1/6

Lightning reflexes is evading back with a crack of lightning. This lightning damages foes. The name is a pun. 2/6

You already accepted zephyr and entangle so 4/6.

Loki.9412:

I’m a newish player, trying to find my feet with a couple of alt characters now iv hit 80 on my main. I quite like the hunter, good ranged burst, but why…WHY can’t I use pistols or a rifle, I mean seriously is this some kind of joke?

Yes, it’s an elaborate joke by ANet to upset you….

Srsly though: Rangers in GW aren’t too much into high-tech stuff like that. That’s just how it is.

If you want sth. similar to the ranger, but with guns and rifles, go for engi after the upcoming elite-specs: He’ll have sth. similar to pets with the Gyro’s and you can make all the pewpew you want with your beloved guns.

Daniel Handler.4816:

…
I need a source on this. The part on the warriors though seems very wrong. There is very little magic going on in any of their skills.

Anything with a boon is magic. Just about every skill contains magical things barring a couple of the Physical skills.

Fluffball.8307:

MiniEquine.6014:

Guns do go against the philosophy of the natural, so it makes sense that a core ranger would not be able to use them or rather would choose not to. They may get them as a future elite spec as others have stated, but this is why they don’t have it now.

Swords aren’t exactly something you find growing on trees either. I guess you could craft yourself some black powder for crude blunderbuss type thing if you were unusually crafty.

There is a 2nd definition of ranger that I’ve always felt was just as appropriate: a member of a body of armed men, in particular, a commando or highly trained infantryman.

To me that fits exactly the playstyle of a ranger, especially in WvW. Basically a scout (not the WvW definition of scout.)

/ramble

You don’t need to make yourself a new sword every month, though. If you have one, and take decent care of it, it will last you. A gun might…although the moving parts are more prone to corrosion than a sword is. And no, it isn’t likely that you’d be able to make black powder while out in the woods. Even if you could find the sulfur, the ammonium nitrate isn’t so easily obtained. And, after all that, you need to measure it out extremely precisely or else it will just burn slowly and the bullet won’t be going anywhere fast. Even people who know the ideal ratios typically can’t do it without the proper measuring tools.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

lol, survival skills being magic? An Unguent is a medicinal paste, Muddy Terrain is throwing mud, Lightning Reflexes is self explanatory, as is Sharpening Stone, the only ones that could possibly be construed as magical is Quickening Zephyr and Entangle, so 2/6 that even seem possible to be magic. Nope, not a lot of magic there bro.

Lolwut? When you use lightning reflexes, you hit nearby enemies with a bolt of lightning. When you use muddy terrain, you convert the ground beneath their feet into mud. Do you really think that throwing a glob of mud at someone will completely immobilize them? As for troll unguent, it heals serious wounds in seconds. Every profession in GW2 uses magic, they just do it to greater or lesser extents. Ranger uses quite a bit.

Unholy Pillager.3791:

You don’t need to make yourself a new sword every month, though. If you have one, and take decent care of it, it will last you. A gun might…although the moving parts are more prone to corrosion than a sword is.

Absolutely. Rangers are sort of ‘practical survivalists’. My point was that they don’t have religious beliefs or something that prevents them from having guns, it’s just not practical if you’re not in a city for months at a time. My ranger, however, spends 95% of her time in the mists fighting with and against people using firearms. Seems like a good time to pick up a readily available firearm herself. Edit: Another though, if we assume the personal and living stories are where your character actually spend their time, that’s even more reason to use a gun. It may be no coincidence that a Pact ranger uses a gun in the personal story. He is, after all, in an army at war and not in a hut being a hermit.

Shortly after launch (presumably before elite specs were dreamt up based on what little we’ve heard about behind the scenes) the devs said they wanted to make sure every profession had access to every weapon. Elite specs appear to be the current method of making that happen.

Also I looked diligently for the quote that all professions and even normal citizens use magic on a daily basis, but it appears that thread was deleted. I’m quite sure it was by Angel McCoy and I believe it was in a layline thread. I looked through her entire post history and couldn’t find anything. Maybe it was Bobby Stein and it was just too long ago…

I believe that’s fairly ‘common knowledge’ among the lore folks though. The wiki offers this, anyway: “Almost every being in Tyria has access to magic in some way or another, and there are countless ways of utilising that magic.”

Fluffball.8307:

Unholy Pillager.3791:

You don’t need to make yourself a new sword every month, though. If you have one, and take decent care of it, it will last you. A gun might…although the moving parts are more prone to corrosion than a sword is.

Absolutely. Rangers are sort of ‘practical survivalists’. My point was that they don’t have religious beliefs or something that prevents them from having guns, it’s just not practical if you’re not in a city for months at a time. My ranger, however, spends 95% of her time in the mists fighting with and against people using firearms. Seems like a good time to pick up a readily available firearm herself.

Shortly after launch (presumably before elite specs were dreamt up based on what little we’ve heard about behind the scenes) the devs said they wanted to make sure every profession had access to every weapon. Elite specs appear to be the current method of making that happen.

Also I looked diligently for the quote that all professions and even normal citizens use magic on a daily basis, but it appears that thread was deleted. I’m quite sure it was by Angel McCoy and I believe it was in a layline thread. I looked through her entire post history and couldn’t find anything. Maybe it was Bobby Stein and it was just too long ago…

I believe that’s fairly ‘common knowledge’ among the lore folks though. The wiki offers this, anyway: “Almost every being in Tyria has access to magic in some way or another, and there are countless ways of utilising that magic.”

Of course everyone uses magic. That’s what signets are, that’s what allows engineers to build autonomous turrets, that’s what allows everyone to heal themselves within seconds…

I just think of their lack of guns as a ‘just in case’ type of thing. A ranger wants to be prepared to trek into the wilderness for a few months, and if that situation arises, any guns and firearms expertise would become dead weight and wasted time, respectively.

Unholy Pillager.3791:

Of course everyone uses magic. That’s what signets are, that’s what allows engineers to build autonomous turrets, that’s what allows everyone to heal themselves within seconds…

That wasn’t in response to you but a couple people who didn’t believe all the professions use magic (specifically engis and warriors were noted, and signet are by very definition a source of magic.)

Unholy Pillager.3791:

I just think of their lack of guns as a ‘just in case’ type of thing. A ranger wants to be prepared to trek into the wilderness for a few months, and if that situation arises, any guns and firearms expertise would become dead weight and wasted time, respectively.

So would that fancy 6 foot two handed sword, though. There is no excuse for carrying that thing through the Maguuma jungle.

Firearms are extraordinarily easy to use. Within minutes of the first time I picked up a rifle I was bulls-eyeing targets at a hundred yards, and that includes historic weapons (my dad uses an historic black powder muzzle loader to hunt; it’s actually more accurate than modern weapons.) I think we both agree rangers are thematically practical, and it would be practical to pick up a gun if your current situation warrants it. Certainly the player character ranger’s situation warrants a gun.

I guess I would also note that IRL, let’s say American pioneers going west, rifles were one of their most prized possessions. They weren’t going out into the wilderness for a while, they were going out indefinitely.

Fluffball.8307:

Unholy Pillager.3791:

Of course everyone uses magic. That’s what signets are, that’s what allows engineers to build autonomous turrets, that’s what allows everyone to heal themselves within seconds…

That wasn’t in response to you but a couple people who didn’t believe all the professions use magic (specifically engis and warriors were noted, and signet are by very definition a source of magic.)

Unholy Pillager.3791:

I just think of their lack of guns as a ‘just in case’ type of thing. A ranger wants to be prepared to trek into the wilderness for a few months, and if that situation arises, any guns and firearms expertise would become dead weight and wasted time, respectively.

So would that fancy 6 foot two handed sword, though. There is no excuse for carrying that thing through the Maguuma jungle.

Firearms are extraordinarily easy to use. Within minutes of the first time I picked up a rifle I was bulls-eyeing targets at a hundred yards, and that includes historic weapons (my dad uses an historic black powder muzzle loader to hunt; it’s actually more accurate than modern weapons.) I think we both agree rangers are thematically practical, and it would be practical to pick up a gun if your current situation warrants it. Certainly the player character ranger’s situation warrants a gun.

I guess I would also note that IRL, let’s say American pioneers going west, rifles were one of their most prized possessions. They weren’t going out into the wilderness for a while, they were going out indefinitely.

I will reiterate two things.

One I already posted earlier in the thread that the dev vision for ranger is anti technology.

Second. Not all professions use magic to the same degree. You will notice engineers do not have signets. There is a difference between a robot that runs on magic, and a person summoning water out of the ground. The difference is one person is actively casting, while the other is just using magic as a tool. And when you aren’t the caster, one could easily say you are using magic only indirectly.

What is important is the level of direct magic use.
Tied for first is elementalist/mesmer/necro/guardian/revenant, after that comes ranger, then thief, then warrior, then engie. This orders frequency of magic use. If you reverse the order you get technology use.