Rangers seriously need PvE love. A story.

Rangers seriously need PvE love. A story.

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Posted by: Ltomato.8649

Ltomato.8649

I have over 3k hours on Ranger. I’ve gotten all the Fractal Weapons playing only Ranger. I’ve pretty much mastered sword. I know Ranger. I thought it was in a fine place.

2 days ago, under peer pressure, and halfway as a joke, I made my first Elementalist.

Today, I did my first Fractal 50 on that Elementalist.

And suddenly my mind was opened to a world of possibility.

A world where skills had impact! Where when I used a skill, I could tell that I was helping my team. Where I could dodge and still maintain dps! Where I didn’t have to count and time my attacks! And what dps that was! Sweet Dwayna, the dps. It was more sustained than ranger at that! If they just spam lava font and fireball, they’re still doing more damage than the best micro’d sword ranger, in a 5 man aoe!

And merciful Melandru, it didn’t stop there. If my teammates needed some love, if they had conditions that needed clearing? I didn’t have to slot out a utility and waste a long cooldown! I could swap to water attunement and poof! I could actually heal my allies! I could put down a water field where my ally was heading and it would instantly start working! I could put it all down and blast it for more healing! And this was on the same build as dps!

And the swiftness from air that I could just give to people without swapping weapons! The on demand blast finishers from my utilities and heal.

Now, you’re thinking, it can’t be better than that. But you’d be wrong.

By blazing Balthazar, in the same build, Elementalists have access to the single best cc in the game with ice bow 5! And 25 stacks of vulnerability with lightning storm! Or perma blind with sandstorm!

Bear pet? What about Earth Elemental? That thing tanks just enough, without the hassle of dragging it around or swapping pets and renaming them.

And then I went back to Ranger. Where my damage was subpar. Where that subpar damage took so much effort to execute. Where I can’t really save my team, or make an impact.

The design philosophy is “The Ranger is a resilient profession that excels at skirmishing by drawing from nature to support themselves as well as their allies. Alongside their pet, they have some of the best single target and sustained damage that will whittle their opponents down.”

4th or 5th out of 7 isn’t even close to “some of the best single target and sustained damage”. (engi/ele on a tier above all else, then thief, then war/guard, then ranger, then necro/mes)

And it’s hard to argue that it’s a feature that Ranger supports its allies with Frost Spirit and Spotter when Warriors have banners that do the same thing but better. When other classes have much better support options across the board.

Rangers don’t even have the best personal survivability- that falls to warriors who also provide more damage and support.

It’s so frustrating and sad that I can spend 2 days on a class and instantly feel the massive increase in power, support, and control, compared to a class that I’ve spent the majority of my time on.

It’s to the point where I don’t think even flat increasing Ranger sword and longbow autoattack damage by say, 20% will even fix things.

Spirits really need a massive buff. Nature Spirit didn’t really gain anything in exchange for being single use. Nature’s Vengeance Grandmaster trait is literally a joke. 1/3rd a stack of might uptime on Frost Spirit is insulting. Give frost spirit quickness, give stone spirit aegis, give water spirit resistance- make the boons given actually powerful enough that 1 second of uptime every 3 seconds will have ANY impact at all.

What about the actives? What if Frost Spirit’s active ability made enemies that entered the aoe slip and fall like engi slick shoes? What if Nature Spirit cleansed conditions BEFORE reviving allies so that they could be rezzed through poison?

Halve the cooldown on Signet of the Wild, Hunt, and Renewal. Heck, make Signet of Renewal a 15 second cooldown! Signet of the Hunt’s active is miserable right now! What if it gave you and your allies within 300 radius 150% damage for 3 attacks?

What if Rangers had a trait that made activating a signet set off a blast finisher? Or made spirit actives blast finishers?

What if Rangers could move during Whirling Defense? (What if whirling defense did more than 1 (one) whirl finisher?)

These changes would bring Ranger to at least the level of guardian or warrior in terms of support, if not damage. It would give Ranger at least a fighting chance.

As of right now, it is really hard to justify playing my Ranger over my Elementalist.
On the one hand, I can worry about stupid pet responsiveness, bugs, and ai issues and precise timing with sword, or I can faceroll things and actually feel like I’m not only doing more damage, but also actively supporting my team, and having an impact.

(edited by Ltomato.8649)

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Posted by: Ltomato.8649

Ltomato.8649

tl;dr

Thought Ranger was in a fine place.
Made my first Ele since launch 2 days ago.
Ranger is not in a fine place.

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Posted by: idontnoso.9850

idontnoso.9850

+1

I love my ranger hands down. But its true. I rolled a warrior and I would just auto attack and still do more than my ranger could, and I put in some effort I would do double. Its sad really.

Anet either needs to buff up all the low tier classes to be a match for the all powerful warrior, eles, and guardians. Or they need to give them a massive debuff.

But as far as I know, nothings going to happen. Its always 3 steps forwards for the high tier classes and 1 step forward for everyone else.

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Posted by: Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582

+1

Really don’t want to play any other class, but when you feel like you are contributing far more with your (pre-patch builds here) GS camping Knights/Hoelbrak/Zerk PS warrior with 4/4/0/6/0 or even more so with Zerk/Flame Legion/Valkyrie (exotic) Frostbow/Staff Ele, or even my Knights/Pack/Zerk 0/0/6/6/2 Guard over your full Zerk/Scholar 6/6/2 S/A FrostSpotter something is very wrong.

That is just PvE.

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Posted by: Harnel.6810

Harnel.6810

I love playing my ranger. Have since I got the game a month after launch. She’s the only character I seriously enjoy playing out of all of them, but I have a level 80 character of every other profession because the ranger just doesn’t feel good enough to compete, and I keep drifting over to characters that can actually do things.

It HURTS.

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Posted by: Solid Gold.9310

Solid Gold.9310

+1

I love my Ranger, but it’s always been below par.

Nice post OP some good points there, not that anythings going to ever change for the better for the Ranger.

Jumping puzzles, love them or hate them, I hate them. Thread killer.

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Posted by: Alerno.1425

Alerno.1425

I love my Ranger. It was my first class and I had all ready decided on that well before Beta (which is why I didn’t play Ranger in betas).

But after leveling it to 80 and then going to other classes I was horribly surprised that all the other classes were much better in over all than Ranger. Sure I could kite and kill just about anything. Even Mesmer was far superior on taking down groups without even getting hit and even Warrior with it’s “weak” DPS was killing mobs much faster than my Ranger.
My latest is my Necro and everyone whines how weak he is, but he can still kill group of mobs in the time Ranger kills one.

Then came the realization that my Ranger actually didn’t do anything use full in groups. My DPS is weak and pet AI mucks up in just walking straight lines, I have very few combo finishers (unless I use warhorn) and also not very good fields (except water field) that I can put down.

On boss fights I struggle to do enough DPS to get a bag from Champions and even doing 50k+ damage I still won’t get it sometimes.
Still I do love my Ranger and I still can kill just about anything while soloing, it just takes more time and effort than with my other classes.

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Posted by: Lazze.9870

Lazze.9870

I rolled a warrior and I would just auto attack and still do more than my ranger could, and I put in some effort I would do double. Its sad really.

In a buffed team, autoattacking on ranger sword does more damage than autoattacking on any warrior weapon.

We don’t need exaggeration to point out that ranger isn’t best at anything that matters in any game mode.

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Posted by: Photinous.4628

Photinous.4628

+1

Really great written post. Like you, I also rerolled to elementalist for fractals because I was sick of groups that constantly only wanted thief/guard/ele/warr. Now fractals are easier than ever. I also rerolled to necro in PvP because we all know the problems of ranger there too..

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Posted by: Prophet.1584

Prophet.1584

+1

I have an 80 of each and since this last patch I find myself running around a lot more on my ele. My ranger is fully geared in ascended, now I have to make another set for my ele.

I’m sorry, Dave. I’m afraid I can’t do that.

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Posted by: Wondrouswall.7169

Wondrouswall.7169

+1

Dropped my Ranger entirely with the last patch that screwed up Healing Spring and only use it to look for or test bugs. I adore the class, but it’s difficult to justify bringing it any longer over another class. I also run an Elementalist (in my group) and decked it out in full ascended.

PET PRECISION & DPS TESTS -OUTDATED-
Will update once Path of Fire releases.

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Posted by: Tusk.3846

Tusk.3846

+1 OP

Eloquently stated.

WPS!

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Posted by: Quarktastic.1027

Quarktastic.1027

I rolled a warrior and I would just auto attack and still do more than my ranger could, and I put in some effort I would do double. Its sad really.

In a buffed team, autoattacking on ranger sword does more damage than autoattacking on any warrior weapon.

We don’t need exaggeration to point out that ranger isn’t best at anything that matters in any game mode.

The problem is:

In a team, where everyone has permanent fury/25 might etc, the ranger’s DPS wins. But in situations where it’s just the ranger and his pet, the warrior will win the DPS race every time.

Warriors can maintain better fury/might than a ranger on his best day. Banners also provide stronger boosts than frost spirit/spotter. It’s part of why you never see videos of rangers soloing arah. Even if they could, it would take twice as long as soloing with a warrior.

Those armadillos would be a lot cooler if they looked more like real armadillos. mmm armadillos
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Posted by: Fluffball.8307

Fluffball.8307

I took my mesmer into WvW. I DO NOT KNOW HOW TO PLAY MESMER… AT ALL, and I was 1v3ing people and slaughtering them. I was like ‘are you gall dang kidding me? seriously bro?’

I know we’re talking PvE, it’s just a real shock to me anytime I play an alt. I feel the same way about pretty much all my alts in PvP.

(edited by Fluffball.8307)

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Posted by: Archon.6480

Archon.6480

+1 I’ve been using mesmer to see what life is like on the other side. Same experience.

Jade Quarry – Esparie
Illustrious Exhausted Primordial Legendary Druid, and Mesmer for fun
PvE | PvP (1500)| WvW | Fractals | Dungeons

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Posted by: MikuMikuDesu.2415

MikuMikuDesu.2415

i made a ranger cause i was getting bored at how easy it was to play thief, warrior, and ele, i personally think ranger auto attack has nice dps, and any of the feline pets hit harder than 1 sword auto, i dont run numbers or anything like that, but im pretty sure ranger auto combined with pet damage is more than other classes’ auto attack damage

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Posted by: Lazze.9870

Lazze.9870

I rolled a warrior and I would just auto attack and still do more than my ranger could, and I put in some effort I would do double. Its sad really.

In a buffed team, autoattacking on ranger sword does more damage than autoattacking on any warrior weapon.

We don’t need exaggeration to point out that ranger isn’t best at anything that matters in any game mode.

The problem is:

In a team, where everyone has permanent fury/25 might etc, the ranger’s DPS wins. But in situations where it’s just the ranger and his pet, the warrior will win the DPS race every time.

Warriors can maintain better fury/might than a ranger on his best day. Banners also provide stronger boosts than frost spirit/spotter. It’s part of why you never see videos of rangers soloing arah. Even if they could, it would take twice as long as soloing with a warrior.

I said “in a buffed team”, so yeah, I’m perfectly aware of this. Except I wouldn’t call it a “problem”. Rangers have never been any good at buffing its own damage, except from a few quirky tricks with bugged, pet swap-related traits. But then again, you could say the same thing about mesmers or guardians – they’re hardly capable of buffing their own sustained damage.

My point is, the damage itself ain’t a problem, the lack of utility is, therein lies buffing capabilities. FrostSpotter is inferior to banners, and that’s without taking EA and PS into the equation. Our only reflect barely covers our own character’kitten box, and to make the matter worse, the radius increasement from the old off-hand training was neither made baseline nor merged with a new trait.

Traited Stone Spirit has a pretty high protection uptime, but as good as that is, it’s not like it’s ever needed (and even if protection was needed, it is still, not surprisingly, inferior to a hammer guardian in a game mode that promotes stacking and balling everything up). We’re good at party wide fury uptime, but elementalists makes that obsolete with one, single trait. That’s about it from a pve perspective. And chances are, whatever the druid will bring and whatever support or debuff capabilities one may need for the upcoming expac content, the ranger still won’t be best at anything that matters.

People still find it relevant to bring up sustained dps in a solo environment, which is only a byproduct of the main problem. Easy access to might wouldn’t do us any good in group content anyways, and neither would buffing our personal damage to top tier.

(edited by Lazze.9870)

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Posted by: Sina.9208

Sina.9208

.., and neither would buffing our personal damage to top tier.

I disagree, that would totally do it in pve I think.

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Posted by: Lazze.9870

Lazze.9870

.., and neither would buffing our personal damage to top tier.

I disagree, that would totally do it in pve I think.

Ehe, no, it wouldn’t “totally do it”. It would help, but it wouldn’t solve any of the problems the ranger actually has.

Speedrunners don’t look at the party composition that can do theoretically flat out most dps. They look at what utilities are needed, and what roles they need to fill. Rangers won’t see a spot in record runs or optimal meta comps until they can bring something that, combined with the rest of the group, they do better than other comps do.

The ranger lacks useful group utility. And that goes for pvp aswell, and you see the same pattern there. We’re not best at anything that matters.

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Posted by: alain.1659

alain.1659

Not only in pve but also in wvw and pvp the ranger is becoming more and more useless. Every kitten thing in the game has some form of reflect. Everybody can contribute with some sort of skill or ability. You think rangers do good dps? The OP is right, Zerker ele can do 9+k damage with her meteor ( just a single shot from a meteor) while a ranger can only achieve 7.8 k with rapid shot. And it is bloody single target. Rangers are good? Nope, they are bull… Even in spvp when I see a ranger in opponent team, I feel relieved. This should not be.

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Posted by: SkiTz.4590

SkiTz.4590

There are CLEARLY better classes for PvE (open world events, soloing, dungs/fracs)
so why not just play one of those classes? like Ele, guardian, etc

If you expect anet to make rangers as useful as a class like Ele in PvE, you will be disappointed.

Thats been the nature of the game for 3 years.
There are classes that HILARIOUSLY outperform rangers in ALL aspects of the game (except MAYBE solo WvW Roaming)
This ranger subforum has been asking for love for ages… I’m absolutely convinced it is not happening which is why I have switched my main. There is no point in playing this class I loved because how far behind it is compared to other classes and I’m tired of gimping myself as well as my party when I team up and play with them..

Some of you can remain optimisitc about the rangers future, good luck with that. I couldn’t be happier now playing as a different, more useful class (ele).
If HoT fails to deliver for rangers, I think its time to just wipe the class honestly lol.
Its been a bottom 3 class in all aspects of the game for 3 years running now..

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Posted by: SkiTz.4590

SkiTz.4590

.., and neither would buffing our personal damage to top tier.

I disagree, that would totally do it in pve I think.

Ehe, no, it wouldn’t “totally do it”. It would help, but it wouldn’t solve any of the problems the ranger actually has.

Speedrunners don’t look at the party composition that can do theoretically flat out most dps. They look at what utilities are needed, and what roles they need to fill. Rangers won’t see a spot in record runs or optimal meta comps until they can bring something that, combined with the rest of the group, they do better than other comps do.

The ranger lacks useful group utility. And that goes for pvp aswell, and you see the same pattern there. We’re not best at anything that matters.

We are mediocre at everything. Fact.

We do have group utilites/support. They just happen to not be on par with what other classes bring to the table.
We do have some burst/spike. They just happen to not be on par with other classes.
We have condi builds. They just happen to not be on par with other classes..

You get the picture here.

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Posted by: Neko.9021

Neko.9021

Speaking as an Ele main, I think the bigger problem is that Ele is just so utterly over the top these days. I actually think the Ele needs to be brought a bit down, rather than the Ranger brought up.

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Posted by: Harnel.6810

Harnel.6810

Speaking as an Ele main, I think the bigger problem is that Ele is just so utterly over the top these days. I actually think the Ele needs to be brought a bit down, rather than the Ranger brought up.

I’m pretty sure a bit of both is in order.

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Posted by: Azure.8670

Azure.8670

Agree with everything you said but your dps rankings are a bit off. Engi doesn’t compete with thief or ele anymore from my understanding. Mesmer dps is a lot higher than ranger now

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Posted by: UnitedChaos.8364

UnitedChaos.8364

+1 so much it hurts.
I can’t count the threads I’ve made asking ANET for Ranger love, but the threads are swamped with other professions who seem to have it out for Rangers. Every thread a warrior or thief pops in and screams louder than the rangers that “rangers are fine, everything is fine, keep it that way”; and with the forums he who screams louder gets their way.

Add “United Chi” to your friends list or guild!

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Posted by: Fluffball.8307

Fluffball.8307

Every thread a warrior or thief pops in and screams louder than the rangers that “rangers are fine, everything is fine, keep it that way”; and with the forums he who screams louder gets their way.

I used to think the devs would be above this, but in reality they “listen to the community” a lot (dhuumfire, perplexity, turrets, and so on.) Big uproars get dev reactions, and that’s bad when rangers are the least popular class to play AND play against.

The overwhelming majority of the community doesn’t play rangers competitively (in all formats), hates playing against them, and the devs listen to the overwhelming majority.

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Posted by: UnitedChaos.8364

UnitedChaos.8364

Every thread a warrior or thief pops in and screams louder than the rangers that “rangers are fine, everything is fine, keep it that way”; and with the forums he who screams louder gets their way.

I used to think the devs would be above this, but in reality they “listen to the community” a lot (dhuumfire, perplexity, turrets, and so on.) Big uproars get dev reactions, and that’s bad when rangers are the least popular class to play AND play against.

The overwhelming majority of the community doesn’t play rangers competitively (in all formats), hates playing against them, and the devs listen to the overwhelming majority.

Yup.

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Posted by: Quarktastic.1027

Quarktastic.1027

Every thread a warrior or thief pops in and screams louder than the rangers that “rangers are fine, everything is fine, keep it that way”; and with the forums he who screams louder gets their way.

I used to think the devs would be above this, but in reality they “listen to the community” a lot (dhuumfire, perplexity, turrets, and so on.) Big uproars get dev reactions, and that’s bad when rangers are the least popular class to play AND play against.

The overwhelming majority of the community doesn’t play rangers competitively (in all formats), hates playing against them, and the devs listen to the overwhelming majority.

This may no longer be relevant, but the ranger was at one point the second most played profession in the game, closely following warrior.

If anecdotal evidence is to be believed, this still holds true. Though I’m not sure if popularity of a profession has any bearing on how Anet conducts its balance.

Those armadillos would be a lot cooler if they looked more like real armadillos. mmm armadillos
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Posted by: Harnel.6810

Harnel.6810

This may no longer be relevant, but the ranger was at one point the second most played profession in the game, closely following warrior.

If anecdotal evidence is to be believed, this still holds true. Though I’m not sure if popularity of a profession has any bearing on how Anet conducts its balance.

A recent survey done by a user on Reddit got over ten-thousand responses. Rangers, according to that survey, are the third least played class, barely beating out Engineer and Necromancer, both of which are classically low population classes.

If you recall, Ranger was the preferred class of bots, suggesting that they hyper-inflated ranger numbers near launch.

(edited by Harnel.6810)

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Posted by: Fluffball.8307

Fluffball.8307

Rangers are really popular as alts for PvE boss trains, but that’s why I clarified competitively. Effectively no one plays rangers competitively in PvE, WvW, or PvP. Pretty close to 0%, which is… disheartening.

(edited by Fluffball.8307)

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Posted by: Harnel.6810

Harnel.6810

Rangers are really popular as alts for PvE boss trains, but that’s why I clarified competitively. Effectively no one plays rangers competitively in PvE, WvW, or PvP. Pretty close to 0%, which is… disheartening.

There was a pvp tournament a while ago. Each class, except for ranger, was represented by at least three people. Often five or more.

Ranger had one.

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Posted by: Substance E.4852

Substance E.4852

Every thread a warrior or thief pops in and screams louder than the rangers that “rangers are fine, everything is fine, keep it that way”; and with the forums he who screams louder gets their way.

I used to think the devs would be above this, but in reality they “listen to the community” a lot (dhuumfire, perplexity, turrets, and so on.) Big uproars get dev reactions, and that’s bad when rangers are the least popular class to play AND play against.

The overwhelming majority of the community doesn’t play rangers competitively (in all formats), hates playing against them, and the devs listen to the overwhelming majority.

This may no longer be relevant, but the ranger was at one point the second most played profession in the game, closely following warrior.

If anecdotal evidence is to be believed, this still holds true. Though I’m not sure if popularity of a profession has any bearing on how Anet conducts its balance.

I do still see a large amount of newbies (you can tell they just bought the game based on how they kind of flounder around) who are playing Ranger.

The problem is that they rapidly disappear as levels go up. I’ll see a bunch in a starter zone but maybe half as many by lvl 40-50 zones and then they are a rare sight by the time you get to Orr.

I have a feeling that its simply a matter of the players either being the kind who play for a month and then get bored and stop or they try another class and stick with it because it’s fun to watch pve mobs evaporate with no effort or planning.

There’s always also the basic Ranger stigma in the game that will inevitably cause people who ask about the class to likely be told it’s worthless kitten and then they never even try it in the first place or give it up because of that, not knowing any better.

Connection error(s) detected. Retrying…

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Posted by: Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582

The more I look at the other classes, the less I like my Ranger. Which is a shame because although I had more than one of each class in GW1, I always played my Ranger as I found it the most fun and also very effective at how I like to play and devastating in PvP.

Don’t get me wrong, I love to LB in PvE, melting mobs as glass cannon is pretty fun and good for farming, but when you can bunch up 10 at a time with your war/guard/ele and vaporise them all at once, it is a touch disheartening. I’ll always use my Ranger for farming Sparks though

As it is now, a Charr Revenant with Shiro & Jalis or Ventari is probably going to take the place of my Charr Ranger. It has better damage and support than Ranger and no need to think about the pet all the time, plus heavy armor, same health, lots of lifesteal for sustain, a Ferocity “Spotter” trait, a much longer QZ, better LR and the sword skills are amazingly good.

Sigh.

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Posted by: ProtoGunner.4953

ProtoGunner.4953

I am an avid player of both Ele and Ranger and think Ranger is easier to play, you die less. The DPS isn’t bad for Ranger, really… Don’t know what you mean but if you trait with piercing arrows, full zerker and the shorter LB cooldown you can dish out a lot DPS in group fights. Yes, Ele does more, no discussion. But it is an Ele, it’s the epitome of DPS :-) On the other hand I had a really hard time to kill the last story seaon 2 boss with Ele, died about 3-4 times due to squishiness and there was also a bug that didn’t damage the boss during burn phase.

‘would have/would’ve been’ —> correct
‘would of been’ —> wrong

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Posted by: Guanglai Kangyi.4318

Guanglai Kangyi.4318

Ranger is actually currently one of the highest DPS classes in the game. You might just be using the wrong build.

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Posted by: Ltomato.8649

Ltomato.8649

I’m pretty sure that
1. that build isn’t even optimal condi damage- it takes a lot of defensive traits and doesn’t take advantage of poison master. It also misses out on the cool synergy between krait runes and Strength of the Pack.

2. zerkers is still better, at least for rangers. You lose so many damage modifiers from going condi in terms of frost spirit, warrior banners, signet of the wild, etc.

3. Even if condi were stronger than zerker, I just did a quick build based off of your link in PvP (using rampagers), and the damage was a significant amount less than berskerker’s. Even if Sinister came out ahead by a small margin, it still wouldn’t be anywhere near the top.

4. Axe mainhand is so boring to play :c

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Posted by: Guanglai Kangyi.4318

Guanglai Kangyi.4318

I’m pretty sure that
1. that build isn’t even optimal condi damage- it takes a lot of defensive traits and doesn’t take advantage of poison master. It also misses out on the cool synergy between krait runes and Strength of the Pack.

2. zerkers is still better, at least for rangers. You lose so many damage modifiers from going condi in terms of frost spirit, warrior banners, signet of the wild, etc.

3. Even if condi were stronger than zerker, I just did a quick build based off of your link in PvP (using rampagers), and the damage was a significant amount less than berskerker’s. Even if Sinister came out ahead by a small margin, it still wouldn’t be anywhere near the top.

4. Axe mainhand is so boring to play :c

1) Getting an extra 25% burn duration is worth more than 20% bleed duration and one stack of bleed every 60 seconds.

Poison Master is pointless because you don’t deal poison damage with this build.

2) It’s not.

3) A PvP simulation with the wrong gear and no consumables is not an accurate projection of anything PvE. In fact, go ahead and try the same thing with Berserker, I guarantee you it’s going to be significantly less DPS.

Rangers seriously need PvE love. A story.

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Posted by: leman.7682

leman.7682

Ranger is actually currently one of the highest DPS classes in the game. You might just be using the wrong build.

GW2Guru Lawl. Surprised it still exists.

Leman

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Posted by: Ltomato.8649

Ltomato.8649

I did try it with zerkers too in PvP, and I killed things 4 times faster.

A single barrage rapid fire killed the heavy golem.
A single path of scars and sword chain killed the heavy golem.

I easily got the signet of the wild bug where if you activate it and leave combat, you can’t swap utilities from the hotbar.

Also you do realize that Sun Spirit has an 8 second internal cooldown between burn procs?

(edited by Ltomato.8649)

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Posted by: TheFantasticGman.9451

TheFantasticGman.9451

tl;dr

Thought Ranger was in a fine place.
Made my first Ele since launch 2 days ago.
Ranger is not in a fine place.

And now you know why I shelved my Ranger a couple of weeks ago. I play thief, ele, guard, and warrior now (and in that order) pretty much exclusively in Fractals upto 50 with a few p1 dungeons sprinkled in here or there. Maining the thief, with ele running a close 2nd… reason why is there’s already plenty of people out there with eles. That way I can swap to whatever someone needs. That being said I’m still learning optimal rotations and whatnot for those classes since I spent the vast majority of my in-game time on the Ranger… which now I feel was mostly a waste of time.

Speaking from a PVE-only point of view…

(edited by TheFantasticGman.9451)

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Posted by: Guanglai Kangyi.4318

Guanglai Kangyi.4318

I did try it with zerkers too in PvP, and I killed things 4 times faster.

A single barrage rapid fire killed the heavy golem.
A single path of scars and sword chain killed the heavy golem.

I easily got the signet of the wild bug where if you activate it and leave combat, you can’t swap utilities from the hotbar.

Also you do realize that Sun Spirit has an 8 second internal cooldown between burn procs?

A PvP golem with 2600 armor and 20k health isn’t exactly Giganticus Lupicus.

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Posted by: Neko.9021

Neko.9021

Guang, your build looks pretty cool. In a long lasting fight how would you say it stacks up against the Berserker builds that players generally run? I kinda want to try this myself.

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Posted by: Guanglai Kangyi.4318

Guanglai Kangyi.4318

Guang, your build looks pretty cool. In a long lasting fight how would you say it stacks up against the Berserker builds that players generally run? I kinda want to try this myself.

It’s probably the highest practical DPS you will get out of any class in this game currently. Engineers have more in theory but you need to manage your cooldowns really well. Zerk staff ele remains top tier for zerk DPS but requires a bunch of buffs you don’t normally get with common group comps (i.e. Spotter+Frost Spirit) or which aren’t always up.

The one downside to this particular build is that you don’t stack might very well on your own, so you need someone else to put it on you if you want max DPS.

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Posted by: Raven.9603

Raven.9603

Ranger is actually currently one of the highest DPS classes in the game. You might just be using the wrong build.

You are citing yourself as a source?

Why not cite yourself as a source from your same-topic post here, which was widely criticized for its fallacies? https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Why-condition-damage-is-OP-and-zerk-sucks

Condition damage is in a good spot for rangers.
Power damage is in a good spot for rangers.
Group support is in a terrible spot for rangers.
Our marginally better damage than some classes is not nearly as valuable to the overall gameplay as having almost-as-good damage with excellent support.

OP makes a good post, but his claim that a staff ele auto attack / lava font rotation outperforms ranger sword single target dps is bogus given an equal min/max scenario.

OP’s claim that the ele is superior to ranger in general by doing very competitive damage while still providing nearly unmatched party support is totally accurate.

SBI | Oceans | Ranger – Thief – Ele – Eng – Nec – Guard – Rev
Celestial Avatar is like an old man: Takes forever to get up and is spent in 4 seconds

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Posted by: KaporHabakuk.6219

KaporHabakuk.6219

True story.Ranger dps is very low,and you dont even have to compare it to staff ele which is the highest dps “ridiculous OP in pve”.My full zerk ranger is slower in killing than my knight/zerk survival medi guard,that just aint right.Not even saying that its 100% more boring to play with sword ranger and more dangerous.

OTAN guild,WSR server

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Posted by: Guanglai Kangyi.4318

Guanglai Kangyi.4318

Ranger is actually currently one of the highest DPS classes in the game. You might just be using the wrong build.

You are citing yourself as a source?

Why not cite yourself as a source from your same-topic post here, which was widely criticized for its fallacies? https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Why-condition-damage-is-OP-and-zerk-sucks

Condition damage is in a good spot for rangers.
Power damage is in a good spot for rangers.
Group support is in a terrible spot for rangers.
Our marginally better damage than some classes is not nearly as valuable to the overall gameplay as having almost-as-good damage with excellent support.

OP makes a good post, but his claim that a staff ele auto attack / lava font rotation outperforms ranger sword single target dps is bogus given an equal min/max scenario.

OP’s claim that the ele is superior to ranger in general by doing very competitive damage while still providing nearly unmatched party support is totally accurate.

Sometimes when you’re the best source, you have no choice but to cite yourself.

Rangers seriously need PvE love. A story.

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Posted by: Ltomato.8649

Ltomato.8649

It’s probably the highest practical DPS you will get out of any class in this game currently. Engineers have more in theory but you need to manage your cooldowns really well. Zerk staff ele remains top tier for zerk DPS but requires a bunch of buffs you don’t normally get with common group comps (i.e. Spotter+Frost Spirit) or which aren’t always up.

Please provide some proof of your claim; pictures, math, etc. All I can see is maybe 4 or 5 stacks of burning, with supplemental bleed. Nowhere close to zerker damage.

OP makes a good post, but his claim that a staff ele auto attack / lava font rotation outperforms ranger sword single target dps is bogus given an equal min/max scenario.

This is false. Lava font + fireball can very simply reach 8k ticks and autoattacks. Ranger sword reaches at most 6.5kish with occasional bursts of 20-22k. And that’s with Signet of the Wild on. Once that falls, the damage drops too.

(edited by Ltomato.8649)

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Posted by: Neko.9021

Neko.9021

The irony is lost on people I guess where Guang was one of the first to post a DPS Fire Staff Ele build. Oh well.

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Posted by: Sarision.6347

Sarision.6347

^If I recall, he’s also one of, if not the first, to come up with Frost Spirit + Spotter.