Stormbluff Isle
Remorseless Trait
this trait is amazing you just dont know how to Utilise it. it is again other party dps buff since you can stack Vun at anytime , with a second stealth support thief and running this with a soimoth+quickdraw stacks damage fast for everyone on more than one target too. using LB+ area effect traps or barrage or even huntershot>entangle will let those entangles apply Vun where you wont need to worry about having the target in frontal view so you can apply Vun+entangle rooting on the target to kite away while applying a damage buff on the target for team mates to focus.
its much more than a stright up personal damage boost.
the trade is personal dps for Team dps this combined with spotter is a huge team buff in pvp.
(edited by Zenos Osgorma.2936)
It is an overrated trait created to try to make more use of a set of minor traits that (like much of the entire profession) wasn’t really well planned or implemented.
Pets have been hidden due to rising Player complaints.
this trait is a team trait it needs team support to work effectively if you plan on using this for PvE or WvW . for PvE your better off with just the normal rtw or predators onslaught.
for WvW it can be very handy against those with low condi removal or low defence since it will give you extra 5% damage at all times while used in rotation with huntershots and soimoth combo ups that to 10% at all times (not including the pets Applied Vun) just let the soimoth hit once and swap to a high damage pet and you’ll have 15 average stacks after every stealth>huntershot > AA combo , leaving open all othe attacks and RF free to be Purely damage with the already stackd 15 vun RF is nearly max vun stacks from the get go.
with the long durations of Vun if you add 40% food these stacks really build up in intensitiy the longer the fight goes on meaning your damage just keeps increasing to the max limit of 25Vun and if there are multipul targets in the area they suffer a lower amount of vun around 10perm stacks each rotation untill you make a different target your main focus of attack then that target suffers 25vun at a near perm up keep on rotation.
effectively adding signet of the wild to this scales damage dramaticly with having the stacks prepaired for RF or barrage or any team combo will even spike down Guardian bunkers if co-ordinated with team mates so dont put it down so quickly.
(edited by Zenos Osgorma.2936)
It is still too heavy of an investment for it’s effect, but that is the problem with the majority of ranger traits.
Spew our all the praises you can heap upon it polished excrement is still excrement.
Pets have been hidden due to rising Player complaints.
It is still too heavy of an investment for it’s effect, but that is the problem with the majority of ranger traits.
Spew our all the praises you can heap upon it polished excrement is still excrement.
what other classes can stack 10vun every 12seconds + 10 Vun every 12secs from RF ? on a aoe + single target focused attacks , not many and not from range ether thats the price we pay for that effective range support , rather than just Kittening up damage vs one target.
and being preloaded with stealth options gives the Lb more ammo to fire.
for other types of builds it may not be worth the points but it is a trait to be considered if your taking a different route on constructing a build.
if you still think its not worth the points , they can’t do much else to it as it adds flavour to the marksman tree it is the only grandmaster that offers some form of team support.
to make the trait look more appealing because thats all people care about now days is the +5% extra damage though this just does that in a different way , so it is worth the points just not in your typical normal casual builds.
Imo I think it should proc off crit/interrupt (both lets and yours) if it’s to compete at all with the other options. That and then it’ll also be useful with all/most our weapons instead of only one.
We already have a GM trait designed specifically for the LB and in 99% of scenarios you’d be using a longbow it’s better, in the other 1% you may as well just take the Predators Onslaught or w/e it’s called. I
They sing dark, delicious notes about power and family.
As their mother, I have to grant them their wish. – Forever Fyonna
As their mother, I have to grant them their wish. – Forever Fyonna
The problem with Remorseless is a lot of things, but not necessarily the trait itself.
- Weapon availability: It’s only readily available on one of our weapons, and it isn’t even a weapon that can take full effect of the entire line of Opening Strikes traits because it lacks a “big hit” skill.
- Opening Strikes: 3 minor traits add up and barely even matter or are barely in effect throughout the duration of most combat.
- Trait Investment: Simply put, it isn’t GM worthy. Heck, it isn’t even Major worthy. It could be a minor, 1 point trait, and still not really be all that effective in combat outside of it’s highly competitive with other classes ultimately better options (vulnerability stacking) niche.
What it needs? Any number of things. I personally want it to make Opening Strike reset on weapon swap. It could make Opening Strike also remove boons. It could improve your critical chance against enemies with vulnerability. It could make critical hits also apply vulnerability. Really, it could do ANYTHING more than it does now to begin with. The sky is the limit with exactly what that functionality could be.
Jroh | Former SOAC Ranger Podcaster | Platinum Division Top 100 Player
www.twitch.tv/itsJROH For stream, stream schedule, other streamers, builds, etc
https://www.youtube.com/user/JRoeboat
www.twitch.tv/itsJROH For stream, stream schedule, other streamers, builds, etc
https://www.youtube.com/user/JRoeboat
[…] using LB+ area effect traps or barrage or even huntershot>entangle will let those entangles apply Vun where you wont need to worry about having the target in frontal view so you can apply Vun+entangle rooting on the target to kite away while applying a damage buff on the target for team mates to focus.
This kinda implies that Opening Strike works in connection with multi-hit attacks, but it actually does not. Just wanted to clarify this. Opening Strike applies the vulnerability stacks to only one target, even when you use an AoE attack. That’s the real issue, if you ask me. If you could apply vulnerability on mutliple targets with skills such as barrage or entangle, this trait might actually be worth a shot.
It is still too heavy of an investment for it’s effect, but that is the problem with the majority of ranger traits.
Spew our all the praises you can heap upon it polished excrement is still excrement.
what other classes can stack 10vun every 12seconds + 10 Vun every 12secs from RF ? on a aoe + single target focused attacks , not many and not from range ether thats the price we pay for that effective range support , rather than just Kittening up damage vs one target.
and being preloaded with stealth options gives the Lb more ammo to fire.
for other types of builds it may not be worth the points but it is a trait to be considered if your taking a different route on constructing a build.if you still think its not worth the points , they can’t do much else to it as it adds flavour to the marksman tree it is the only grandmaster that offers some form of team support.
to make the trait look more appealing because thats all people care about now days is the +5% extra damage though this just does that in a different way , so it is worth the points just not in your typical normal casual builds.
Remorseless applies to one target, and rapid fire needs piercing arrow to hit multiple target, which unfortunately remorseless is stuck into that same line, so you have to give up the whole line of Marksmanship just to make this vulnerability stacking works. (While we can just take an engi and do it way better for vulnerable stacking, instead of a sub-par damage ranger)
Engineer can get 3~6 targets to 25 stacks of vulnerable through grenades with a grandmaster “minor” trait XD.
(edited by Aomine.5012)
Imo I think it should proc off crit/interrupt (both lets and yours) if it’s to compete at all with the other options. That and then it’ll also be useful with all/most our weapons instead of only one.
We already have a GM trait designed specifically for the LB and in 99% of scenarios you’d be using a longbow it’s better, in the other 1% you may as well just take the Predators Onslaught or w/e it’s called. I
Personally, I think the whole of the opening strike minor traits should reset on weapon swap as a base effect (provided you have a point into marksmanship). That way, the traits actually help you after you’ve started a fight, otherwise they give a one time bonus at the beginning of a matchup which isn’t all that great anyhow.
I understand that sigils of intelligence do this, but I still don’t think it would really matter. People who use intelli sigils will put the crit to waste, but they still get vulnerability and a pet crit. And those who prefer not to now get a neat minor trait function from marksmanship that actually does something during a fight.
As for remorseless, I really think it just needs to go and be replaced with something better.
Stormbluff Isle
[…] using LB+ area effect traps or barrage or even huntershot>entangle will let those entangles apply Vun where you wont need to worry about having the target in frontal view so you can apply Vun+entangle rooting on the target to kite away while applying a damage buff on the target for team mates to focus.
This kinda implies that Opening Strike works in connection with multi-hit attacks, but it actually does not. Just wanted to clarify this. Opening Strike applies the vulnerability stacks to only one target, even when you use an AoE attack. That’s the real issue, if you ask me. If you could apply vulnerability on mutliple targets with skills such as barrage or entangle, this trait might actually be worth a shot.
does it? i’ll have a look next time im in pvp and see if it does apply vun to more than one target using the stealth>trap or barrage combo.
though it does say your next attack not hit , so it should apply AoE 5 stack vun from a barrage.
and i did not mention Multipul hits for the combo , since the gist of it is opening strikes only works on the first attack or did you forget that part while reading my commnet.
anyhow i’ll test it and if it is apply vun on first hit , the Mechanics dont match the tooltip of first Attack . so the trait should apply to first attack wave of Barrage.
(edited by Zenos Osgorma.2936)
Imo I think it should proc off crit/interrupt (both lets and yours) if it’s to compete at all with the other options. That and then it’ll also be useful with all/most our weapons instead of only one.
We already have a GM trait designed specifically for the LB and in 99% of scenarios you’d be using a longbow it’s better, in the other 1% you may as well just take the Predators Onslaught or w/e it’s called. I
Personally, I think the whole of the opening strike minor traits should reset on weapon swap as a base effect (provided you have a point into marksmanship). That way, the traits actually help you after you’ve started a fight, otherwise they give a one time bonus at the beginning of a matchup which isn’t all that great anyhow.
I understand that sigils of intelligence do this, but I still don’t think it would really matter. People who use intelli sigils will put the crit to waste, but they still get vulnerability and a pet crit. And those who prefer not to now get a neat minor trait function from marksmanship that actually does something during a fight.
As for remorseless, I really think it just needs to go and be replaced with something better.
I like the idea of remorseless, and i’d like to see the “When you kill an enemy regain opening strikes.” part stay, but as you and jacob, and others, have mentioned opening strikes needs to be reappliing itself WITHOUT an additional trait (maybe combine the 1pt and 3pt and make the new 3pt you regain it on weapon swap or crit or something).
Then they can make remorseless give it to you on a kill AND buff it again, maybe make it so we strip a boon, or if we’re not allowed boon strip make it so we deal % more damage per boon when we have opening strikes (I’d say make it boost our crit damage by like 5% per boon on the enemy to give us a lot of burst with it but that’s me)
They sing dark, delicious notes about power and family.
As their mother, I have to grant them their wish. – Forever Fyonna
As their mother, I have to grant them their wish. – Forever Fyonna
It is still too heavy of an investment for it’s effect, but that is the problem with the majority of ranger traits.
Spew our all the praises you can heap upon it polished excrement is still excrement.
what other classes can stack 10vun every 12seconds + 10 Vun every 12secs from RF ? on a aoe + single target focused attacks , not many and not from range ether thats the price we pay for that effective range support , rather than just Kittening up damage vs one target.
and being preloaded with stealth options gives the Lb more ammo to fire.
for other types of builds it may not be worth the points but it is a trait to be considered if your taking a different route on constructing a build.if you still think its not worth the points , they can’t do much else to it as it adds flavour to the marksman tree it is the only grandmaster that offers some form of team support.
to make the trait look more appealing because thats all people care about now days is the +5% extra damage though this just does that in a different way , so it is worth the points just not in your typical normal casual builds.
Remorseless applies to one target, and rapid fire needs piercing arrow to hit multiple target, which unfortunately remorseless is stuck into that same line, so you have to give up the whole line of Marksmanship just to make this vulnerability stacking works. (While we can just take an engi and do it way better for vulnerable stacking, instead of a sub-par damage ranger)
Engineer can get 3~6 targets to 25 stacks of vulnerable through grenades with a grandmaster “minor” trait XD.
can’t you read i did not mention Piercing arrows hitting multi target or RF doing so.
“10vun every 12seconds(huntershot) + 10 Vun every 12secs from RF(single target)
on aoe (barrage + single target focused attacks RF+AA (if you add a Sigil of Frailty
too)” will apply 12x , 2secs idc per vun = 5 total vun , increasing in intensitiy past the first opening strike the target/ targets will still have vun on the second round of stealth again increasing the intensity per RF against a single target.
though as my other comment it says next attack not hit so it should apply to the first wave of barrage as an attack not per hit plural 1 hit one target , though it does say attack in the tooltip so the first wave should count making it a Aoe Vun stack.
i’ll test it if not , its other problem that needs to be fixed .
also for the purpose of the current reapply when stealthed , it gives synergy to work with other stealth users , changing it to weapon swap or on kill is not the answer it again promotes self use and can’t be benfited from other stealth sources from team mates , i’d rather it stayed the same but as First attack so it counts as a Aoe Vun while using any attack out of stealth.
though you could use it for a trap < opening strikes applies it to the first attack currenty so you could stealth>trap>stealth trap each trap should hit for 5 Vun also.
now if that is also broken , things really need fixing.
(edited by Zenos Osgorma.2936)
though it does say your next attack not hit , so it should apply AoE 5 stack vun from a barrage.
It doesn’t. Only the first hit counts.
Barrage is essentially 12 “attacks”, not one. It makes sense that only the first strike applies vuln.
(edited by Lazze.9870)
though you could use it for a trap < opening strikes applies it to the first attack currenty so you could stealth>trap>stealth trap each trap should hit for 5 Vun also.
now if that is also broken , things really need fixing.
Trapper runes works with remorseless. Flame trap, spike trap and viper’s nest trigger the opening strike.
though it does say your next attack not hit , so it should apply AoE 5 stack vun from a barrage.
It doesn’t. Only the first hit counts.
Barrage is essentially 12 “attacks”, not one. It makes sense that only the first strike applies vuln.
i know it only applies to the first wave/attack , the first wave should apply aoe 5 targets 5 vun each on the first WAVE attack not per 1 hit.
if you get what i mean here , per wave attack , if that was the case if the first wave was classed as hits it would be 5×12 = hits , rather than the attack of one entire wave 1/12.
so yes please use maths. i’ll do some real tests and report the results , though if it is on hit rather than Attack , the tooltip is wrong or the trait + the combos used are not working as intented.
though you could use it for a trap < opening strikes applies it to the first attack currenty so you could stealth>trap>stealth trap each trap should hit for 5 Vun also.
now if that is also broken , things really need fixing.Trapper runes works with remorseless. Flame trap, spike trap and viper’s nest trigger the opening strike.
thats the point i was making, if the trait works like that it will work with other stealth souces so why does it only effect 1 target if the trap can hit more targets than 1 , as the trait should be attack rather than 1 hit.
that some people are getting confused about. if this is the case the trait is fine but the comboed skills with the trait or some of the skills are not working correctly or underperforming while this trait is combined with said skills , as the attack aka trap should apply 5vun to everyone damaged by said attack aka trap.
so yes please use maths. i’ll do some real tests and report the results , though if it is on hit rather than Attack , the tooltip is wrong or the trait + the combos used are not working as intented.
It IS working as intended. That first hit counts as one attack. Common ranger knowledge, no need for testing. Barrage is 12 attacks, each attack behaving independently.
Traps would apply vuln on the first hit. Works the same way.
You hit more than one foe with Maul? Too bad, opening strike will only apply vuln to one of them. That’s how it works, and how Anet intended it to be. There is a reason why people think opening strike (+remorseless) is underwhelming. Marksmanship is the only traitline in the whole game with minor traits that potensially only has an impactt during the first seconds of a fight.
Alpha Training should merge with the adept trait or precice strike, and free up the grandmaster minor. The new trait could bascially do anything related to opening strike. Remorseless could then have some additional effects to it. As of now, people (as far as PvP goes) only put six points in marksmanship to max out the potensial of the LB. The minor traits does nothing except boosting the initial longbow burst.
(edited by Lazze.9870)
no need to get snappy. if a trap counts as one attack why does not it not apply the Vun to all targets hit by the trap then ? that is what im going to test , if this combo should work with the first attack vs more than 1 target if the attack is 3 to the 1 attack .
i’v got nothing against if it is working intented or not , the trait is working as is but its after effects combined with other skills might not be, and is unfair since you guessed it , its a grandmaster and it should beable to do this by applying vun to more than one target IF the attack hits more than the 1/1 ratio e.g traps or the first wave of barrage rather than it only applying to a single target under the Area of effect.
if a trap counts as one attack why does not it not apply the Vun to all targets hit by the trap then ?
Because as soon as you hit several targets with an aoe in this game, those hits count as independent attacks. That’s also why an aoe attack may only crit one of those targets.
if a trap counts as one attack why does not it not apply the Vun to all targets hit by the trap then ?
Because as soon as you hit several targets with an aoe in this game, those hits count as independent attacks. That’s also why an aoe attack may only crit one of those targets.
right then , so Remoreless needs to grant opening strikes for x secs with a independent cooldown so stealth>combo aoe can’t be spammed a 15secs idc will do perfectly , indefinatly removing the First attack rule.
and presto we now have a grandmaster trait that turns opening strikes after stealth into somthing that can be used as a Aoe benifit.
if a trap counts as one attack why does not it not apply the Vun to all targets hit by the trap then ?
Because as soon as you hit several targets with an aoe in this game, those hits count as independent attacks. That’s also why an aoe attack may only crit one of those targets.
right then , so Remoreless needs to grant opening strikes for x secs , indefinatly removing the First attack rule.
Unless I misunderstand how you’d want it to work, that would be to powerful. You could basically crit for an x amount of time if it worked like that due to Precise Strike.
Opening Strike and Remorseless should have a slight rework. Merge two of the minors, add a new minor grandmaster trait and buff the Remorseless trait. I don’t ever see Anet do that, but I doubt slightly buffing and altering the mechanic would be OP in any way.
There are better ways to fix it than making it possible to apply aoe vuln in my opinion.
(edited by Lazze.9870)
if a trap counts as one attack why does not it not apply the Vun to all targets hit by the trap then ?
Because as soon as you hit several targets with an aoe in this game, those hits count as independent attacks. That’s also why an aoe attack may only crit one of those targets.
right then , so Remoreless needs to grant opening strikes for x secs , indefinatly removing the First attack rule.
Would be to powerful. You could basically crit for an x amount of time if it worked like that due to Precise Strike.
Opening Strike and Remorseless should have a slight rework. Merge two of the minors, add a new minor grandmaster trait and buff the Remorseless trait. I don’t ever see Anet do that, but I doubt slightly buffing and altering the mechanic would be OP in any way.
well then precice strikes needs a limit to the amount of times it can give you a crit bonus limit that to a max of your next 3 attacks crit. that way we get some other form of Aoe support.damage rather than the single target limits we have now.
it will open up new combos that should of been already included in the weaponset with remorseless , its more of a problem with how to make remoresless better machanicly without changing remorsless. since it is a good grandmaster it is just Machanicly limited and can not perform the combos i mentioned above in prevoius comments again limits it to single target . the changes of precice strikes and moddfided version of opening strikes added to Remoresless
give opening strikes a x duration time limit and icd a IDC so when all 4 are combined it is limited to 1 or 2 Vun combo chains and limited precice strikes to 3 crits so it can’t go into overload making it unbalanced.
Aoe vun is powerful thats like giving your team a % damage bonus to focus on targets , combined with spotter just taking these two ramp up party damage and dps.
that sounds better .
(edited by Zenos Osgorma.2936)
Until I literally regain Remoseless after killing something instead of having to get out of combat to regain it, I’ll never use it. Ever…. Even then I probably still won’t use it because Predator’s Onslaught is much better because Predator’s Onslaught isn’t on a 20s internal CD. Only way I would take it over Predator’s Onslaught is if Remoreseless was on a 5 sec or less CD and I didn’t have to get out of combat to regain it and/or it actually hit on critical with 5 sec or less CD.
Besides, we usually have a warrior in party spamming vul.
Pretty much my Marksmanship traitline almost never changes. Look at it any random time and I’ll have Steady Focus/Spotter/Predator’s Onslaught.
RNG is a bell curve. Better hope you’re on the right side.
(edited by thefantasticg.3984)
Until I literally regain Remoseless after killing something instead of having to get out of combat to regain it, I’ll never use it. Ever…. Even then I probably still won’t use it because Predator’s Onslaught is much better because Predator’s Onslaught isn’t on a 20s internal CD. Only way I would take it over Predator’s Onslaught is if Remoreseless was on a 5 sec or less CD and I didn’t have to get out of combat to regain it and/or it actually hit on critical with 5 sec or less CD.
Besides, we usually have a warrior in party spamming vul.
Pretty much my Marksmanship traitline almost never changes. Look at it any random time and I’ll have Steady Focus/Spotter/Predator’s Onslaught.
you know you get opening strikes when you stealth using the huntershot, its better that way you can’t rely on killing somthing in pvp because of said reses and it could take even longer than just stealthing when you need that bonus.
for PvE i wouldnt even bother with this trait since the other two are more suited for PvE mode.
ps there is no internal cooldown the opening strikes on the remorseless trait lasts for 20secs not a cooldown of 20secs, so you can huntershot escape and save that opening strike for else where.
so it lets you use Opening stikes while in combat.
though it currently lacks the power of a grand master because the Minor adpet Limits it to one hit rather than the attack gains Vun so it would do e.g all targets hit by a maul get 5 additional Vun from getting hit from opening strikes, but since it only effects 1 target its usless for any other purpose does not do anything else and lacks that grandmaster level .
if it did grant 5 vun stacks to the multi hit targets 5 to 1/12 of barrage the Vun is applied on the first 1 of 12 barrage waves but with how barrage works also by hitting centre first then it spreads out , it again limits the Remorseless trait to 1 hit / 1 target.
so opening strikes and percing strike need to improve as these two improve to allow multi hit attack to hit more than one target , by effect that will made remorseless a great grandmaster it will allow any attack after stealth to apply 5 vun (once) so the combination of attacks and allows the ranger some form of Decent AoE outside of running trapper condi specs.
its going to be difficult to balance since it is basicly using 3 traits that equal the grandmaster it should be seen collectively rather than remorseless on its own.
though if opening strikes did lets say change to stacks charges , one per stealth and the opening strikes was allowed to hit multi targets using Multi target attacks , this would prevent Percing strikes from doing too many crits.
so e.g below
Minor adept=
Opening strikes(45secs)
On your first skill applies 5 Vun(8secs) stacks in charges one per stealth
(stealth is a limited effect and can only be applied upto 3 times while using a soimoth pet in combination with huntershot all are which spaced out by cooldowns so you can never alone stack more than 1 or 2 charges) though to gain other charge you will have to Destealth then reapply making use of the short stealth durations on huntershot + quick draw.
minor master = Alpha Training Pets have Opening Strike (again limited to the amount of charges, this traits charges are shared to the pet to have equal charges to the ranger.
Minor grandmaster= Percing strikes (effected by opening strikes )
makes your next opening strike crit ( since opening strikes is limited to amount of charges)
the trait will only crit to the amount of charges stacked.
though the way of opening strikes has machanicly changed to stacked charges and removes the first hit to skill.
so rather than applying on hit , it will apply the 5vun to the first skill after using the opening strike.
give the tread some feedback and discuss rather than saying no no no or im not going to be happy till xxxx happens.
and make sure to think the idea through over all game modes.
also what happens if you don’t have warriors in the party ? sure this change can open a role for ranger in PvE to spike Vun on mobs and bosses without being limited to the 1 hit rule.
(edited by Zenos Osgorma.2936)
for PvE i wouldnt even bother with this trait since the other two are more suited for PvE mode.
Yeah, I don’t pvp.. only PVE… so I don’ t bother with it lol
RNG is a bell curve. Better hope you’re on the right side.