Guild Wars 2

Most people don’t even think Rangers are viable in WvW or GvG as is. In fact its a rarity to see a decently played Ranger, yet I can command on my Ranger, as well as contribute quite a bit to a GvG team and a WvW zerg, I do so often, and had a lot of minds in my guild changed. But this new patch.

This patch is an insult and a slap in the face to most viable ranger builds. We are already a kitten class, and it takes a lot of work to become viable, but go ahead a-net screw us over yet again. 10% loss for zerker builds? Screw you. Do you know how long it took me to learn survivability playing that way? Exact positioning in a zerg in order to be the most effective and still have a dmg output that keeps up with everyone else while not dying 80% of the time?

This also means for my zerg busting build I am going to have to rework… Superior runes of divinity are now going to be kitten.

Thanks for making my hard work and class absolutely useless. Are you ever going to get around to making the Ranger class viable without screwing us over?

Precision is our bread and butter if you want to play ranged. Crit damage is next to that, and what do you go and do? REWORK THE kittenING THING. 10% decrease is no small thing, especially to a class that has to work hard at keeping up with the rest of them. Now, an ele or necro can do my job and be better at it, as it stood I was just keeping par with them.

Keep in mind I am not just talking about a full zerker build, I am talking about all RANGED bow builds. Everything that we do that required Precision and crit dmg to do decently. To have the same amount of dmg output everyone else had. And to be viable in these situations, all of our builds were just shafted.

From what we can see, they clearly want us to stick to condibunkers and don’t even dare to try anything else.

Bows? What’s that? Those things that are outhealed by dancing Warrior with Healing Signet equipped?

Um, you get that it’s across the board right? This isn’t a thing that was done to us specifically.

Kal Spiro.9745:

Um, you get that it’s across the board right? This isn’t a thing that was done to us specifically.

Apparently he doesn’t. In fact it hurts the other classes more than it hurts Rangers.

Do we need to be so dramatic about this? According to most, running a zerker ranger in WvW is 100% kitten useless, and yet here we are running them with no problems. Worst case scenario I have to drop my crit— sorry ferocity— a little bit and take a piece of knights or something. Life is over.

OK Oddoad, you make a dramatic, but resonable point.
It is sad to hear that you are going to stop playing ranger because they will no longer be viable. Unfortunately as it is, if you no longer feel useful, you should try to be more productive in a different manner.

I wish you good luck with whatever profession you choose to reroll to, and i sincerely ask you to send me your stuff.

Good luck, and thank you for reading this post
- Lynx

Prysin.8542:

OK Oddoad, you make a dramatic, but resonable point.
It is sad to hear that you are going to stop playing ranger because they will no longer be viable. Unfortunately as it is, if you no longer feel useful, you should try to be more productive in a different manner.

I wish you good luck with whatever profession you choose to reroll to, and i sincerely ask you to send me your stuff.

Good luck, and thank you for reading this post
- Lynx

Too late. He PMed me earlier. We met, and he gave me his stuff about an hour ago.

No, but what I am saying is that this is going to kill the bow ranger, bow rangers precision and crit dmg are our only viable options, sure if you want throw some survivability in there until you learn situational positioning, and how to survive. But for a ranger that’s really your best option. Take that out by reducing the amount of damage we can do and now we are 100% useless in zerg fights. Our pets don’t last through the AOE fields in zerg fights as is, and that’s supposedly 20% of our dmg? Now take 10% off a damage build and we just lost everything that makes us viable, while still being ranged, yes we can switch to other builds, but not bow based and still be viable, across the board or no this change hits us harder then them. I can throw at least 4 different zerg damage builds for each and every other class. We had ONE viable option and its being nerfed. That’s where my anger originates, I don’t want to be anything but RANGED on a kitten RANGER.

Oddoad.5478:

No, but what I am saying is that this is going to kill the bow ranger, bow rangers precision and crit dmg are our only viable options, sure if you want throw some survivability in there until you learn situational positioning, and how to survive. But for a ranger that’s really your best option. Take that out by reducing the amount of damage we can do and now we are 100% useless in zerg fights. Our pets don’t last through the AOE fields in zerg fights as is, and that’s supposedly 20% of our dmg? Now take 10% off a damage build and we just lost everything that makes us viable, while still being ranged, yes we can switch to other builds, but not bow based and still be viable, across the board or no this change hits us harder then them. I can throw at least 4 different zerg damage builds for each and every other class. We had ONE viable option and its being nerfed. That’s where my anger originates, I don’t want to be anything but RANGED on a kitten RANGER.

- Your lack of understanding how the math works….strike one.
- LB Ranger that has his pets die in zerg AOE? ..strike two
- 4 different zerg damage build for every class? lol ..strike three

Less bear bow rangers? Good.

Also, if you think that 10% damage was the only thing keeping you viable… lolololol. Oh my. Maybe you should rethink what you are saying.

We’re getting a second sigil on our bow. Other zerker builds on other professions typically already use two 1-handed weapons, so we’re actually getting a buff.

Also factor in that our gear has been progressively better and better since release. First ascended weapons, then armor, and WvW infusions. And we all have more money to blow on the most expensive cons.

You’re just being way too dramatic.

Lets compare the current full zerker ascended set (armor, weapon, trinkets, without runes) to future zerker set.

If you look at a soldiers ascended helmet, the stats are 47/34/34. I’m assuming zerkers will also become 47/34/34.

Current zerker ascended set:
71% additional crit dmg
101% additional crit dmg if traited for crit dmg.

Future zerker ascended set:
745 ferocity (49.67% additional crit dmg)
1045 ferocity (69.67% additinal crit dmg) if traited for crit dmg and assuming a full traitline will give 300 ferocity.

This is around 30% reduction in crit dmg.

For runes, we can use divinity’s runes as an example:

Current full set:
12% additional crit dmg

Future full set:
60 ferocity (4% additional crit dmg)

I hope not everyones running a full zerker bearbow ranger in WvW, but this is just an idea of how much crit dmg is taken away. I think rangers that rely on crit dmg is going to take a very big hit with the ferocity change just coz our damage coefficients are pretty low already.

Sounds like you have no idea how to use traps/muddy terrain if you link Lbow 5 is our best aoe…. glassy builds = little usage. As for pets, passive use to strike players off the group / theirs skills over dps from them. And only 4builds for others and what in your mind ONE for rangers???? /facepalm

Well I am running WWW in mostly Zerker Gear…
My key is to not being hit at all (really hard with all these longrange immobilises and leaps/teleports in my face…), so the “Risky but Rewardable” gamestyle is okay.
Problem is, if I lower my DMG, I will have even less chance to defeat a random joe crossing my way… Since even if the autoaim manages to hit (miss miss evade miss evade out of range (10 meter??)), I won’t be able to pressure anyone. They just outheal.
Burst? Rapid Fire takes ages, it usually worse than AutoAttack in longer time measure.
Not to mention it fails to hit a lot, since a single dodge bug-evads ~5 of 10.

What am I going to do now? Sacrifice damage and an armor piece to get Read to Wind?
In this exchange, I’ll swap an armor piece to +Vitality, because that or Thougness is what I can sacrifice, but those traits are so kitten essential to have a little chance to survive at all..
I don’t think I will do that, but will give it a try to see is how a bow should work by BASIC

Really hope they will change their minds and correct this gall…
If not… let’s help those incomes drop even deeper I guess?
I can keep playing and still struggle the same way as a year before, or just end it all.
Is it really what They want? To force us leave their game?

P.s.: I have $200 in a box. Its saved to spend on awesome GemStore Skins & GW2 Expansion… They did not yet happen… money stays….

Rym.1469:

From what we can see, they clearly want us to stick to condibunkers and don’t even dare to try anything else.

Bows? What’s that? Those things that are outhealed by dancing Warrior with Healing Signet equipped?

warriors passive healing is also going to get nerfed so no worries about that, just check all the profession specific forums to see that everyones griping about everything.

First of all, I am not a bear bow, and if you play that way especially in a zerg your worthless. This is a discussion on PvP/WvW viability and them screwing with our builds to stay ranged. I am a commander in IoJ, as well as in a reputable WvW guild, and I provide decent dmg output and CC for my team. But with the changes coming to the ranger and my dmg output being lowered by 10% when another class who doesn’t rely on crit dmg isn’t going to have there damage lowered makes us a weaker class. Its only across the board to those who rely on crit dmg to keep up. Precision and crit dmg is our bread and butter to staying viable on the dmg scale for classes. An extra sigil that melee classes have had since release is not going to change that for us. Show me a viable damage based build built around only power and no precision or crit damage for the ranger, with enough survivability to last in a zerg bust. You can’t. Now show me viable power based builds for the warrior, ele, guardian, ect. I understand perfectly what is going on, and across the board or no, its the rangers that are going to feel this 10% hit the most.

Everyone who’s damage is based about crit is going to feel it. Regardless of the fact that other builds may exist for classes based on different stats any build based on crit damage is going to feel it equally. You’re the only who is choosing to play the way you are. That is the set and build you wanted, and unfortunately it’s the one being hurt, but it’s still being hurt for everyone of like mind and design. So too bad. Your options are, give up, figure out how to make it work, or try something else. All are viable with enough time.

Kal Spiro, you are missing the entire point of my post. Yes all who are crit based are going to feel it, tell me though, whats a viable alternative to playing a RANGED ranger in WvW in zerg fights? One that has enough damage capabilities to keep up with other characters? I am choosing the play the class as it is CALLED ITS CALLED A kitten RANGER. My anger is based off of the fact that when we finally were able to begin to keep up with other classes in PvP/WvW situations, we are now being nerfed again. Yes its across the entire board, but other classes have better options to deal with this kind of damage nerf, we as rangers do not, for those who actually want to play the ranger as a RANGED character. And not be a condi bunker build.

If anything a zerker build will be more viable in WvW since you’ll be taking less damage from everyone else.

Personally I can modify my build from being tanky-zerk to being a little more zerk; and stay basically the same since everyone is more tanky by default.

Are you high? “Thanks for making my hard work and class absolutely useless.”
Don’t over-exaggerate if you want to be serious.

solrik.6028:

Are you high? “Thanks for making my hard work and class absolutely useless.”
Don’t over-exaggerate if you want to be serious.

I really can’t tell if he is serious, trolling, or being sarcastic.

I usually reside in the Necro forums but I can aasure you Ranger is not the only profession to have its highest dps build trimmed back. Dhuumfire will go from 80%, or so, uptime on a power/precision/crit build to somewhere around 10%, by my estimate. Burning will only be available without a sigil in Death Shroud, will have a big tell to dodge, and a longer CD. So, after previous Dhuumfire-related nerfs to other damage like Terror and Bleed, Necro will not be hitting as hard, anymore. Rangers can all relax, now.

And all of this is made for our good, and will make things working…
HellNo!

Oddoad.5478:

Kal Spiro, you are missing the entire point of my post. Yes all who are crit based are going to feel it, tell me though, whats a viable alternative to playing a RANGED ranger in WvW in zerg fights? One that has enough damage capabilities to keep up with other characters? I am choosing the play the class as it is CALLED ITS CALLED A kitten RANGER. My anger is based off of the fact that when we finally were able to begin to keep up with other classes in PvP/WvW situations, we are now being nerfed again. Yes its across the entire board, but other classes have better options to deal with this kind of damage nerf, we as rangers do not, for those who actually want to play the ranger as a RANGED character. And not be a condi bunker build.

You understand that the Range in Ranger has nothing even remotely to do with ranged weapons, right? To Range is to wander hither and yon. It means to go on extended excursions. A Ranger is a person who travels the wilds for a living, not a person who shoots a great distance. So, not sure what to tell you.

With you there Kal Spiro.9745…. the more i reread his posts the more i cringe. He seems to think that a Ranger is a RANGED ONLY class/build set up which it is not. I do not even understand how people think pure zerker is our “best” dps since it is not by a far shot in my experience.

I wonder if this will help you understand the ARCHETYPE of the class: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ranger_%28character_class%29

Kal Spiro.9745:

Oddoad.5478:

Kal Spiro, you are missing the entire point of my post. Yes all who are crit based are going to feel it, tell me though, whats a viable alternative to playing a RANGED ranger in WvW in zerg fights? One that has enough damage capabilities to keep up with other characters? I am choosing the play the class as it is CALLED ITS CALLED A kitten RANGER. My anger is based off of the fact that when we finally were able to begin to keep up with other classes in PvP/WvW situations, we are now being nerfed again. Yes its across the entire board, but other classes have better options to deal with this kind of damage nerf, we as rangers do not, for those who actually want to play the ranger as a RANGED character. And not be a condi bunker build.

You understand that the Range in Ranger has nothing even remotely to do with ranged weapons, right? To Range is to wander hither and yon. It means to go on extended excursions. A Ranger is a person who travels the wilds for a living, not a person who shoots a great distance. So, not sure what to tell you.

This!
Ranger is not a range-r…

Plus, Rangers are going to be the less affected by ferocity change because 30% of it’s base DPS is from the pet…
(Calculations been made over and over to show that rangers were the ones who’s zerk DPS would be the less affected when ferocity was first announced… don’t feel like going on in older posts, but should be easy to find somewhat in january, I think)

People who will be the most affected are the ones who min/maxed with a PVT armor and zerker trinkets… cause armor is pretty much the same, still but trinkets will be lowered, which should have been expected by any min/maxer noting crit damage on accessories was higher than crit damage ratio on other builds…

(PS: big numbers are not the only use a ranger has, I’d even say we have to give up too much for those big numbers, compared to DPS classes…
But, we have excellent CC, which are not affected by stability, which can definitively also help win a fight… think outside the box…
What are rangers naturally good at?
If you have to give up everything for numbers, our strength sure isn’t DPS…
We have good CCs on short CDs… use wisely!)

Kal Spiro.9745:

Um, you get that it’s across the board right? This isn’t a thing that was done to us specifically.

This change hits the Ranger harder; it’s not just the Ranger but their pet as well. They are also subject to the ferocity change which means their damage is also taking a hit. Do you think Anet will buff the pet to compensate? Wishful thinking.

DeadlySynz.3471:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Um, you get that it’s across the board right? This isn’t a thing that was done to us specifically.

This change hits the Ranger harder; it’s not just the Ranger but their pet as well. They are also subject to the ferocity change which means their damage is also taking a hit. Do you think Anet will buff the pet to compensate? Wishful thinking.

screw crit damage, jump into the water and you got more DPS then what some of the others can get on land. True story, and you know it is true.
So grab your wetsuit, diving goggles and dip your toes. There will always be that final frontier were we excel at everything.

Someone post a video of a rangers pet actually doing 30% of the rangers damage in a zerg fight. Please do that, because most pets don’t last longer then 20seconds in a all out zerg WvW fight, I do not want a roaming character. And you are right we have excellent CC, and that goes well with a zerg fight, but I don’t want my character to only be viable in one situation, DPS is an important factor, and with our pets not doing the required damage they should, we become the equivalent of a kitten.

I shouldn’t have to play a melee based ranger to be viable, regardless of the way you want to determine what the RANGE in ranger means, bows are clearly our bread and butter, and should get more support.

I’ve been patient and collected full ascended trinkets over the time…
Now they will make it a waste, we’ll be really low at dmg now.
Even others, but when we face a Bunker build now, they’ll just laugh in our face and T-bag our corpses…

For start, for the designated archer, needs to be buffed to be better at this amongst all other classes. The best to start with would be higher ROF (even without dmg stat increase) and a little +range.

Mastermavrick.2439:

I wonder if this will help you understand the ARCHETYPE of the class: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ranger_%28character_class%29

Besides Aragorn, some noteworthy fictional rangers are Drizzt Do’Urden and Hank in the Dungeons and Dragons Cartoon.

Oh man, the D&D Cartoon! I forgot all about that! That’s also hysterical someone picked Hank out of all the rangers in books and movies.

Kal Spiro.9745:

Oddoad.5478:

-snip-

You understand that the Range in Ranger has nothing even remotely to do with ranged weapons, right? To Range is to wander hither and yon. It means to go on extended excursions. A Ranger is a person who travels the wilds for a living, not a person who shoots a great distance. So, not sure what to tell you.

If a ranger is a person who travels the wilds for a living then it means that the ranger is hunting and I don’t think anyone would try running after a rabbit/deer/bear and then kill them with a sword or greatsword. That is where RANGE comes in. A ranger needs to be very skilled in ranged weapons in order to hunt game because running after a rabbit with a sword in hand or trying to sneak up on a bird with a greatsword is no fun.

Oddoad.5478:

First of all, I am not a bear bow, and if you play that way especially in a zerg your worthless. This is a discussion on PvP/WvW viability and them screwing with our builds to stay ranged. I am a commander in IoJ, as well as in a reputable WvW guild, and I provide decent dmg output and CC for my team. But with the changes coming to the ranger and my dmg output being lowered by 10% when another class who doesn’t rely on crit dmg isn’t going to have there damage lowered makes us a weaker class. Its only across the board to those who rely on crit dmg to keep up. Precision and crit dmg is our bread and butter to staying viable on the dmg scale for classes. An extra sigil that melee classes have had since release is not going to change that for us. Show me a viable damage based build built around only power and no precision or crit damage for the ranger, with enough survivability to last in a zerg bust. You can’t. Now show me viable power based builds for the warrior, ele, guardian, ect. I understand perfectly what is going on, and across the board or no, its the rangers that are going to feel this 10% hit the most.

viable damage based build built around only power no precision or crit damage with enough survivability… I actually have that on my ranger in pvp. Its incredibly easy to find so no point in pointing it out to you. Seek and ye shall find.

Because the crit damage changes are only affecting Rangers.

solrik.6028:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Oddoad.5478:

-snip-

You understand that the Range in Ranger has nothing even remotely to do with ranged weapons, right? To Range is to wander hither and yon. It means to go on extended excursions. A Ranger is a person who travels the wilds for a living, not a person who shoots a great distance. So, not sure what to tell you.

If a ranger is a person who travels the wilds for a living then it means that the ranger is hunting and I don’t think anyone would try running after a rabbit/deer/bear and then kill them with a sword or greatsword. That is where RANGE comes in. A ranger needs to be very skilled in ranged weapons in order to hunt game because running after a rabbit with a sword in hand or trying to sneak up on a bird with a greatsword is no fun.

Actually, if you want an etymology lesson then the word Range comes from the actual meaning of Range, which is to travel far. Someone would say a target is ranging, which would become at range, meaning out there in the distance, traveling far. It has nothing to do with hunting. Nor for that matter does Ranging have to do with hunting specifically. Someone who is Ranging could be hunting, or scouting, or exploring. A Ranger is far more likely to use traps to get meat than to shoot things with a bow, though a bow and axe would classically be the combat oriented equipment some who was Ranging would bring with them. No one chases a rabbit, because that’s stupid. Equally stupid is trying to shoot a rabbit with a bow, when you can just trap them in a snare.

So again, Range in Ranger has nothing to do with long distance combat.

Kal Spiro.9745:

Actually, if you want an etymology lesson then the word Range comes from the actual meaning of Range, which is to travel far. Someone would say a target is ranging, which would become at range, meaning out there in the distance, traveling far. It has nothing to do with hunting. Nor for that matter does Ranging have to do with hunting specifically. Someone who is Ranging could be hunting, or scouting, or exploring. A Ranger is far more likely to use traps to get meat than to shoot things with a bow, though a bow and axe would classically be the combat oriented equipment some who was Ranging would bring with them. No one chases a rabbit, because that’s stupid. Equally stupid is trying to shoot a rabbit with a bow, when you can just trap them in a snare.

So again, Range in Ranger has nothing to do with long distance combat.

This has nothing to do with etymology because words are adapted to the current time. I won’t call you g** (homosexual) and then justify it by saying that the word was used as ‘happy’ is used in the current time.

Please, don’t attempt to pick on single words because it is fairly obvious that by range I meant distance.

Hunting for food with a bow (and spear) has an extensive history. MMO’s also have a history of calling the archer/bow class as the “Ranger”.

Anyway, please come with a real argument instead of picking on my wording and/or examples.

In grammar is obvious and true; It’s RANGEr.
But in this scenario the ranger means travel-range, size of territorry, not ranged weapons.
“Rangers” known by excellent marksmans everywhere, even if its a cowboy in texas or the marines.
What matters here is the original D&D role.

solrik.6028:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Actually, if you want an etymology lesson then the word Range comes from the actual meaning of Range, which is to travel far. Someone would say a target is ranging, which would become at range, meaning out there in the distance, traveling far. It has nothing to do with hunting. Nor for that matter does Ranging have to do with hunting specifically. Someone who is Ranging could be hunting, or scouting, or exploring. A Ranger is far more likely to use traps to get meat than to shoot things with a bow, though a bow and axe would classically be the combat oriented equipment some who was Ranging would bring with them. No one chases a rabbit, because that’s stupid. Equally stupid is trying to shoot a rabbit with a bow, when you can just trap them in a snare.

So again, Range in Ranger has nothing to do with long distance combat.

This has nothing to do with etymology because words are adapted to the current time. I won’t call you g** (homosexual) and then justify it by saying that the word was used as ‘happy’ is used in the current time.

Please, don’t attempt to pick on single words because it is fairly obvious that by range I meant distance.

Hunting for food with a bow (and spear) has an extensive history. MMO’s also have a history of calling the archer/bow class as the “Ranger”.

Anyway, please come with a real argument instead of picking on my wording and/or examples.

I’m sorry, what? Words are adapted to mean things other than their original use, that’s true. Range is one of them. Ranger is not.

It is obvious you meant distance, which is why you were wrong.

Hunting with a bow and spear does have history, in fact it’s still done today. Maybe not spears so much. This still has nothing to do with the meaning of Ranger, nor what they are about. MMOs have a tendency of putting a lot, not just bows, in the hands of Rangers. This includes dual wielding, leather armor, pets, healing and nature magic, survival skills. No one thing is the key to a Ranger, rather, it is the whole combined. Sorites paradox aside, if you take away each of the parts until you are only left with a bow you will not have a Ranger, but an Archer.

Now if you’re looking for improved arguments I recommend you look at your own, because nothing you have provided here has been meaningful nor valid.

Kal Spiro.9745:

I’m sorry, what? Words are adapted to mean things other than their original use, that’s true. Range is one of them. Ranger is not.

It is obvious you meant distance, which is why you were wrong.

Hunting with a bow and spear does have history, in fact it’s still done today. Maybe not spears so much. This still has nothing to do with the meaning of Ranger, nor what they are about. MMOs have a tendency of putting a lot, not just bows, in the hands of Rangers. This includes dual wielding, leather armor, pets, healing and nature magic, survival skills. No one thing is the key to a Ranger, rather, it is the whole combined. Sorites paradox aside, if you take away each of the parts until you are only left with a bow you will not have a Ranger, but an Archer.

Now if you’re looking for improved arguments I recommend you look at your own, because nothing you have provided here has been meaningful nor valid.

Okay…
Woodmen never hunted with bows.
Bows and spears have no history.
Ranger wasn’t at first described as “Unparallelled archer”
Everything is about etymology.
Running after rabbits with a sword is fun.
Woodsman are not skilled with ranged weapons.

Sorry for being so invalid. I will, from this day and on, pick on people who happen to say “range” instead of “distance”.

Anyhow, grats on abusing the ability to outword someone who may not be as good at typing in english as you are.

Obviously you don’t understand the argument, nor the purpose of the argument in the first place.

The Ranger is more than a guy who can shoot far. The OP is of the opinion that he has to be as good as he can at ranged damage because the word Ranger has Range in it. I was explaining why that is wrong. Then you come in and start arguing about, I’m honestly not sure what, but also unable to actually support your own claims in the process.

I really don’t care what your primary language is, if you don’t understand the subject and can’t support your own claims you shouldn’t be getting involved in the argument. I will not, however, hold back just because of those facts.

Problem is not so much the lack of real, meaningful ranged options…
This is the same across the game…
They should just change
“Rangers rely on a keen eye, a steady hand, and the power of nature itself. Unparalleled archers, rangers are capable of bringing down foes from a distance with their bows. With traps, nature spirits, and a stable of loyal pets at their command, rangers can adapt to any situation. "
for
“Rangers rely on a keen eye, a steady hand, and the power of nature itself. Unparalleled skirmishers, rangers are capable of bringing down foes with sustained damage. With traps, nature spirits, and a stable of loyal pets at their command, rangers can adapt to any situation they have to face alone.”

gets expectations straight from the start…

:p

Oddoad.5478:

Kal Spiro, you are missing the entire point of my post. Yes all who are crit based are going to feel it, tell me though, whats a viable alternative to playing a RANGED ranger in WvW in zerg fights? One that has enough damage capabilities to keep up with other characters? I am choosing the play the class as it is CALLED ITS CALLED A kitten RANGER. My anger is based off of the fact that when we finally were able to begin to keep up with other classes in PvP/WvW situations, we are now being nerfed again. Yes its across the entire board, but other classes have better options to deal with this kind of damage nerf, we as rangers do not, for those who actually want to play the ranger as a RANGED character. And not be a condi bunker build.

Finally, the crux of the issue-Ranger has nothing to do with ranged. Too many games forcing the Archer Ranger kit (including GW1) has forced people to think otherwise. Though of course, it’s an option to use your bow if you want (have nothing against them myself), it’s far from the only way to play Rangers in this game. Show and prove to me that the Profession word Ranger is tied to the verb “to attack enemies at range.”

Talking about bears and Rangers, did Ranger Smith was named as such because of his bow mastery? Because Ranger is all about range, right? That is my point.

I do not mean to offend or single anyone out-it’s a very common mistake in and out of these forums to believe that Ranger means “the character class who attacks at range” (they are “unparalleled archers”-they can use longbow/shortbow/axe as ranged options when no one else can-but that doesn’t make the GW2 Ranger an Archer kit.)

DPS builds based on Berserker’s will still be the most powerful anyway, and you’ll be taking slightly less damage from the few Professions/players that focus solely on DPS for WvW.

(If max DPS Longbow is your playstyle, I doubt you will have problem keeping up the same thing anyway. Don’t let “math” fool you, you are still the player behind the character, and the damage nerf won’t impair your abilities to do well.)

Finally, according to these forums, everybody is getting “shafted”, all the time and purposefully by ANet, and they “don’t play” their favorite Professions. :P I doubt complaining in such manner is effective towards the change they would hope to achieve for their characters.

If they really want us to sustain damage, increase ROF already!!

RoyalPredator.9163:

If they really want us to sustain damage, increase ROF already!!

LB1 actually hits really hard. I will be crucified for this, but I think increasing its RoF would be OPed. It hits from SOOOO far away.

Cleaving 3 people in a zerg for 4k every .5 seconds with zero risk to yourself is too much. You need a risk vs reward.

“But it never HITS!”
This is only relevant to 1v1 or other small skirmishes where piercing is irrelevant. I’m going to always start my roaming runs with RtW up to ensure I hit anyone I see. If I wind up in an ad hoc group of 5, I’ll consider the rearrangement of piercing arrows (and spotter, etc.) In large groups you will always land as many shots as you can line up.

Fluffball, they need to adjust it ofc. Higher ROF means more DPS until they don’t lower the hit values. Right now I’m shooting 3k+s in a buffed zerg. Would look better if I’m shooting 2k-s constantly without those huge spaces between shots.

Another big problem is with the time to shoot a single arrow, downed enemies die faster than we would hit them once (which still not guarantees the drop)

RoyalPredator.9163:

Fluffball, they need to adjust it ofc. Higher ROF means more DPS until they don’t lower the hit values. Right now I’m shooting 3k+s in a buffed zerg. Would look better if I’m shooting 2k-s constantly without those huge spaces between shots.

I don’t understand this, can you reword? I think you’re saying you’d rather have lower damage at a faster RoF?

RoyalPredator.9163:

Another big problem is with the time to shoot a single arrow, downed enemies die faster than we would hit them once (which still not guarantees the drop)

That’s not a problem. Tagging things a single time purely for getting a loot bag is not something that can be taken in to account for class balance.

Yes, what I’m suggesting is to boost ROF by ~50% and adjust the damage for a good visual of sustaining it. But in equal to the other classes. Then QZ would have a real burst impact, even better with shortened cast of Rapid Fire which isn’t that rapid now at all.

At second, I feel it a problem. We have to keep at the back of the zerg, and they usually kill downeds within seconds, so it isn’t that easy to hit them at least once compared to any melee who is in the middle of action. Not horrible now but would be nice, maybe as some kind of boost of Opening Strike.

If I were in AN HQ as a dev, would try to overhaul Rangers anyway.
(Professional animations, ~Initiative, hunter conditions, logical skill bonuses without making us OP, new armor and weapon sets, etc)

RoyalPredator.9163:

Yes, what I’m suggesting is to boost ROF by ~50% and adjust the damage for a good visual of sustaining it. But in equal to the other classes. Then QZ would have a real burst impact, even better with shortened cast of Rapid Fire which isn’t that rapid now at all.

At second, I feel it a problem. We have to keep at the back of the zerg, and they usually kill downeds within seconds, so it isn’t that easy to hit them at least once compared to any melee who is in the middle of action. Not horrible now but would be nice, maybe as some kind of boost of Opening Strike.

If I were in AN HQ as a dev, would try to overhaul Rangers anyway.
(Professional animations, ~Initiative, hunter conditions, logical skill bonuses without making us OP, new armor and weapon sets, etc)

Honestly, I agree with this. Sustained damage means it just keeps coming, not that it’s obscene damage. I love seeing big numbers, but if we did less damage more often it would even out and potentially become more dangerous since it’s happening in a compressed period of time. It’s harder to ignore.

RoyalPredator.9163:

Yes, what I’m suggesting is to boost ROF by ~50% and adjust the damage for a good visual of sustaining it. But in equal to the other classes. Then QZ would have a real burst impact, even better with shortened cast of Rapid Fire which isn’t that rapid now at all.

At second, I feel it a problem. We have to keep at the back of the zerg, and they usually kill downeds within seconds, so it isn’t that easy to hit them at least once compared to any melee who is in the middle of action. Not horrible now but would be nice, maybe as some kind of boost of Opening Strike.

If I were in AN HQ as a dev, would try to overhaul Rangers anyway.
(Professional animations, ~Initiative, hunter conditions, logical skill bonuses without making us OP, new armor and weapon sets, etc)

Yes, this would help a decent amount, but would definitely like to see pets be able to withstand zerg AOE, maybe a 150%-170% spike in AOE damage reduction. Seems like a lot but its very much needed in zerg situations. These changes would help a decent amount but not fix the underlying problem of still not having the damage needed to be competitive with other classes in DPS builds. However being able to get the damage from our pets that’s supposedly 10-30% of our overall damage would help a decent amount, as it stands they are kittens comparatively in a WvW fight that involves more then 3 people.

Also I am at the very least looking forward to faster f2 times.

Still won’t help the fact that we are severely underpowered for zerg fights, and that most teams reject having a Ranger in a GvG fight.