I seen a Shortbow + Sword/Dagger Zerk ranger fight and he seems very very strong…
I never linked shortbow with zerk so I was quite surprised when I saw it.
Anyone else run this build and what are its weaknesses/strengths?
I run power SB build but with GS but ofc S/D is as good. The setup is quite solid.
strengths – good control and mobility, continuous damage, excellent poison up-time and some filler bleed damage. Works very well with “on crit” sigils and foods.
Weaknesses – Think about it more of a melee build in terms of defense requirements, you cant be as galssy as with a LB build. Only single target- not suited for outnumbered fights, no aoe damage etc… No high spikes burst combo, its unlikely u’ll be able to kill celec d/d ele that know what he’s doing.
Shortbow is a solid Celestial weapon.
Not Zerk for sure. Definitely not Zerk. The coefficients are too low.
EDIT: Probably Power>Crit>Toughness could work too, to be a Sigil Proc weapon.
Sinister as well. But Sinister is a PvE stat combination, where double A/T just wins by far.
I don’t know I have been playing SB zerk for a long time now and I can tell you it can work its not as good as lb cause it lacks the deeps you just need to play it in a different way
I don’t know I have been playing SB zerk for a long time now and I can tell you it can work its not as good as lb cause it lacks the deeps you just need to play it in a different way
Zerker is all about DPS and mechanics.
Point Blank shot > Concussion Shot (lower CD, better effect)
Hunter’s Shot > Quick Shot (3 sec of stealth > 0,5 evade)
Rapid Fire > Crippling Shot (No discussion. Point Blank is even better than Concussion and crippling combined)
Barrage > Poison Volley.
Plus LB has much better range, easier time surviving, higher damage and better mechanics.
No, Shortbow just cannot compete with Longbow at Zerging. No discussion.
I don’t know I have been playing SB zerk for a long time now and I can tell you it can work its not as good as lb cause it lacks the deeps you just need to play it in a different way
Zerker is all about DPS and mechanics.
Point Blank shot > Concussion Shot (lower CD, better effect)
Hunter’s Shot > Quick Shot (3 sec of stealth > 0,5 evade)
Rapid Fire > Crippling Shot (No discussion. Point Blank is even better than Concussion and crippling combined)
Barrage > Poison Volley.
Plus LB has much better range, easier time surviving, higher damage and better mechanics.
No, Shortbow just cannot compete with Longbow at Zerging. No discussion.
Well okay I understand your opinion and i will respect it I will only say " SB cannot compete with lb at zerk " I doubt that its just different playstyle
Well okay I understand your opinion and i will respect it I will only say " SB cannot compete with lb at zerk " I doubt that its just different playstyle
It’s just that we often see people say:
“Hey, Full Power Axe/Torch works”
And I won’t say it doesn’t. Because sententional calculus logic approves it. But after all, even going in bare-handed using a bear as a pet only works, too.
Well yes, it does. It will last ages to kill a critter but you’ll kill it eventually.
Results and efficiency are what I try to bring into forums, and your statement just felt into the category. No wrong intentions. I’m just trying to prevent people from possibly playing ineffective builds/game-styles.
For open world content no one really cares. But number of BearBow rangers is just too high. I hope I didn’t bring any hard feelings with my reply.
Cheers
I would guess if you considered yourself a melee ranger and only used the SB for when your opponent kites out of range, it might be valid. Does SB compete with LB over the course of 8 seconds?
Without trying it, I suspect RF would do a lot more damage, but maybe the SB skills can contribute something worthwhile. Both weapons have an interrupt, one has an evade while the other has stealth. Both have a cripple that is applicable to melee fighting. The poison from SB is pretty short and probably can’t compete with a sigil of doom.
I think LB is the better pairing with a melee weapon, but I don’t think SB would be a total disaster. I can’t remember trying to roam with a berserker shortbow. It’s literally the only weapon I don’t have an ascended version of because I don’t particularly like it.
Well yeah lb is better just because the dmg on the RF imo but maybe its just me cause I don’t like the way lb works and SB to me aways looked as better weapon +if they fix mesmer runes sb/gs will have a place as a dps/rupt build as it should be played imo , but tbh it doesn’t matter as long as you don’t play top tier pvp Most builds work and honestly we have seen lb builds apear in high lvl pvp just few times so yeah. And Tragic positive we are just having discussion so no hard feelings
I’m not sure as if Shortbow Zerk was ever a great option… I mean, it’s a condi weapon…
It was fantastic before they nerfed the hell out of it. It still works decently for 1v1’s but the more people you add to the fight the less effective it becomes.
I used to play zerker shortbow, sword dagger just like you, but then I got an ar…
sorry about that. On point. Viable? No. Fun? Yes.The way I used to play it was with warhorn actually, and might to pet on crit. I ran chilli pepper poppers with it. If I wasn’t getting might, I was giving chill, which was super useful as zerker. It was a gimmick build with quickness on pet swap. You enter the fight with your pet stowed and instant quickness, then swap pet and quickness again. It only worked as a gimmick build though. I lured players to attack me. They ate cripple and chill because I was trying so hard to stay away, and concentrated on getting in my face. When they did I swapped pets and pressed F1 if it was to wolf, or F2 if it was to owl. Almost instant high hitting skill from pets with no running required, and I just evaded with my weapon skills as long as I could. It only worked sometimes but when it did it was hilarious. In the hand of better players it could work wonders.
Right now I run something similar with rabid and LOTS of posion and bleed. It works for yak slapping, and you can pewn newbies and scrubs with it, but shortbow as viable… I don’t think we will see any. Dat 900 range…. still turns my stomach when I think about the podcast where they practically said they take away range because everyone runs shortbow instead of longbow. Bleh…
The DPS isn’t too bad because of the high rate of fire. People play it with air/fire to get more damage out of it.
that was what I felt too. a shortbow seems to shoot faster on autos than a longbow?
also shortbow has double evade if you trait the quickdraw. pair that with dodges and evades on sword/dagger, you have a lot of evades that still do damage at the same time.
in terms of short term quick burst, a longbow is stronger. but shortbow gives a lot more survivability and sustained continuous damage i feel.
The DPS isn’t too bad because of the high rate of fire. People play it with air/fire to get more damage out of it.
that was what I felt too. a shortbow seems to shoot faster on autos than a longbow?
also shortbow has double evade if you trait the quickdraw. pair that with dodges and evades on sword/dagger, you have a lot of evades that still do damage at the same time.
in terms of short term quick burst, a longbow is stronger. but shortbow gives a lot more survivability and sustained continuous damage i feel.
Nope, Shortbow doesn’t provide better DPS than Longbow. Even if flanking.
That’s the maths.
And you can get double invisibility with Quick Draw. Or double Point Blank shot with Quick Draw. And Sword/Dagger is completely irrelevant, you can get that with LB, too.
Resulting in 6 seconds stealth or 2x 450 range pushback.
Which is superior to 2x 0,5 sec evade I wonder?
I have run zerk SB as my main build since January.
It’s a different animal to other weaponsets, and requires practice to perfect. Remember, all of your arrows do the same upfront damage, it’s a matter of using the correct arrow for the situation.
Of course, sitting at 2k range auto attacking with longbow will do more damage, but I prefer to work for my kills and not rely on a gimmick weaponset.
I have run zerk SB as my main build since January.
It’s a different animal to other weaponsets, and requires practice to perfect. Remember, all of your arrows do the same upfront damage, it’s a matter of using the correct arrow for the situation.
Of course, sitting at 2k range auto attacking with longbow will do more damage, but I prefer to work for my kills and not rely on a gimmick weaponset.
Since the rapid fire and auto attack buffs, LB has done more damage at every range than SB, even less than 500, even factoring flanking, even without LtW. This was before the implementation of quickdraw and light on your feet, but considering what effect rapid fire has on the numbers I would think QD rapid fire pushes the numbers even more in favor of LB. Damage aside, I think outside of MoC builds most would argue that the cd’s on LB are much more useful in a wide variety of scenarios as well.
I love SB, but it needs to be loved back. It really isnt the power weapon it once was.
SBI | Oceans | Ranger – Thief – Ele – Eng – Nec – Guard – Rev
Celestial Avatar is like an old man: Takes forever to get up and is spent in 4 seconds
I have run zerk SB as my main build since January.
It’s a different animal to other weaponsets, and requires practice to perfect. Remember, all of your arrows do the same upfront damage, it’s a matter of using the correct arrow for the situation.
Of course, sitting at 2k range auto attacking with longbow will do more damage, but I prefer to work for my kills and not rely on a gimmick weaponset.
It’s practically saying the same as “Longbow Condition builds with Sharpened Edges are viable”.
It’s exactly the same. If you want to work your kitten off, you can pick shortbow for any situation. I mean you can play barehanded and use your pet as the only source of damage. And if you are good enough – you will manage to win the fight.
But you will never be efficient for people around you. Ever. That’s completely self-centered style of play and shouldn’t be promoted.
So is there any SB build that is viable to play in both PVE and PVP? I just want to be able to use The Dreamer. Sigh.
Yes, it is viable. For sPvP.
I’m currently running it and have a great success with it.
Use Condi>preci>toughness.
Use Skirmishing with Sharpened Edges
Wilderness Survival and the 3rd trait is up to you.
I suggest SoS, LR, Entangle, Troll Unguent, 1 ability of personal preference (Zephyr is Fine)
Rune of the Krait.
Happy hunting.
(EDIT: Be extra cautious around Burning. That is your hard and only real counter)
I have run zerk SB as my main build since January.
It’s a different animal to other weaponsets, and requires practice to perfect. Remember, all of your arrows do the same upfront damage, it’s a matter of using the correct arrow for the situation.
Of course, sitting at 2k range auto attacking with longbow will do more damage, but I prefer to work for my kills and not rely on a gimmick weaponset.
SB is more of a gimmick weapon than LB ever since RF was changed.
Zerk SB is nowhere near similar to ‘’Condi LB’’ in viability like Tragic put it.
Sure SB is weaker in dps compared to LB but it gives you different tools to work with and a different play style without totally off-putting the damage, so it does work on some level. Certainly not on the top level where LB sits when it comes to power builds, but Zerk SB is not completely unviable.
Zerk SB is nowhere near similar to ‘’Condi LB’’ in viability like Tragic put it.
Sure SB is weaker in dps compared to LB but it gives you different tools to work with and a different play style without totally off-putting the damage, so it does work on some level. Certainly not on the top level where LB sits when it comes to power builds, but Zerk SB is not completely unviable.
But so is Condi Crit LB.
What’s the point then? Haven’t you tried it yet? It can stack around 15 stacks of bleed with real ease if you have cooldowns. That’s more than a shortbow can pull off.
And I’m absolutely positive somebody just posted a Rampager LB build for WvW and did fine. Your point is still only as solid as mine. You haven’t proven anything about it’s viability, at all.
Shortbow just needs to be reworked. The weapon was nerfed hard in order to make longbow more appealing, and it was recently nerfed again with the condi change. Bleeding for hybrid builds isn’t nearly as effective anymore and the positional restrictions hurts it for straight condi builds.
Crippling shot is terrible and needs to be changed to pretty much anything. Maybe something like brutal strike where you and your pet both do a heavy damage hit. Something like that would synergize well with concussion shot in a MoC build.
Poison volley is counter intuitive since it requires you to be in melee range to land the hits.
Quick shot needs something more… like super speed, quickness, or add cripple and torment to the attack.
The auto attack needs to lose the flanking requirement, maybe let it cycle between cripple and bleeds.
Or just scrap the whole thing and focus more on adding a bunch of interrupt skills. Bring back that GW1 flavor.
Zerk SB is nowhere near similar to ‘’Condi LB’’ in viability like Tragic put it.
Sure SB is weaker in dps compared to LB but it gives you different tools to work with and a different play style without totally off-putting the damage, so it does work on some level. Certainly not on the top level where LB sits when it comes to power builds, but Zerk SB is not completely unviable.
But so is Condi Crit LB.
What’s the point then? Haven’t you tried it yet? It can stack around 15 stacks of bleed with real ease if you have cooldowns. That’s more than a shortbow can pull off.
And I’m absolutely positive somebody just posted a Rampager LB build for WvW and did fine. Your point is still only as solid as mine. You haven’t proven anything about it’s viability, at all.
I am beastmastery(instead of marks) atm and having more success now. When you chase a full stacks,food,utility dd ele away repeatedly it says something ;-)
I am beastmastery(instead of marks) atm and having more success now. When you chase a full stacks,food,utility dd ele away repeatedly it says something ;-)
Exactly.
See my point? This guy over here is the proof. If you watch his video, you’ll notice that he is winning by far thanks to his play-style (he dodged every immobilize and most of bursts). We cannot say what builds are the enemies running, but we can definitely tell that constant CD awareness is remarkable, if anything.
I am convinced the guy would be able to chase d/d ele the same way in Full Zerk (if not easier), just as several of my fellow roaming rangers do.
I thought we were talking about Condi LB, not Hybrid. Also, I speak mainly from PvP perspective, where I’ve even seen Zerk SB builds, but not a single Condi LB, ever.
I thought we were talking about Condi LB, not Hybrid. Also, I speak mainly from PvP perspective, where I’ve even seen Zerk SB builds, but not a single Condi LB, ever.
That’s closely the same.
LB is a pure Power weapon – and builds promoting Condition Damage (hybrid) work with it.
SB is a hybrid weapon – so builds with pure Zerk stats work with it.
But is there enough efficiency? Well, not really. Both cases involve only a part of the stats they are made for. The situation is exactly the same.
I will only say " SB cannot compete with lb at zerk " I doubt that its just different playstyle