Guild Wars 2

The Longbow/Greatsword Ranger

I made these videos per requests in another thread. The general consensus in the thread was that Longbow is only good for long range fighting and hugging the zerg and is not good for skirmishing. While I do believe short bow is great for skirmishing, I believe LB is a very capable skirmishing weapon and for some builds/play styles may even be superior.

The discussion was also that you have to give up too much survivability (WS and BM) in order to effectively use LB. I used two builds for these videos and neither produce any kind of mega dps or give up survivability. Both have 30 in WS. One has 25 in BM and focuses on healing/regen and the other has 20 in BM and focuses a little more on crit and life steal.

After defending LB as a good skirmishing weapon I was asked by multiple people to make a video demonstrating that it could effectively do it. So….I downloaded Bandicam and spent the last two nights roaming and looking for duels. LB/GS is a complimentary weapon set that I like for all aspects of the game (PVE, PVP & WvW). I’m not claiming to be the best duelist in the game or OP in any way as I’m sure there are much more talented players out there. I just want to show that LB can be used effectively in skirmishing situations. Really the video is just as much about GS as I find they compliment each other well and switch often.

I’m not discounting SB’s prowess as a skirmishing tool. It’s great for it. Just don’t dismiss LB as a power/crit/glass cannon/zerg hugging only weapon.

http://youtu.be/NUvNw1LdPdM

http://youtu.be/bcd4a-RBg1k

edit = spelling

I started using the GS/LB combo for skirmishing because ppl said it is “bad”. I am absolutely happy with it two really nice videos you made there! I am currently using soldiers gear with the 30/30/5/0/5 glasscannon traits, but your setup seems interesting aswell

Videos like those make me wonder what I’m doing wrong heh.
Those vids were pretty awesome to watch!

I switched not too long a ago from a SB traps build to LB GS jaguar focused and I like it a lot. I even started planning to craft kudzu since it fits a sylvari ranger so well…. So I was wondering is Kudzu worth the effort? And also how long did it take?

I run 0/30/30/0/10 with zerker gear in paids. I love it. If any other class running zerker tries to take me out I can easily roll them if I am 50% health or higher. The versatility is all there. Though my build focuses more on single target CC than yours does.

thats not skirmishing. those are mostly 1on1’s. none of your opponents even know how to use their profs, and it takes you about 7 minutes to kill two complete newbs. you dont fight a single competent opponent. i could spec conditions, use sword/horn and do the same thing u did.

as already known, LB builds have zero sustain. you have no sustain in those vids and your damage is paltry. you basically demonstrate that LB is a terrible 1v1 weapon. in a small skirmish where you might have 2-3 opponents on you at a time, you would fold like paper.

the SB, or any condition build would get kills much, much faster. on my roaming condi/BM build, i dont win a 1v1 in 20-30 seconds, im doing something wrong or the opponent is very good. just to give an idea for a good turnaround time.

nerva.7940:

thats not skirmishing. those are mostly 1on1’s. none of your opponents even know how to use their profs, and it takes you about 7 minutes to kill two complete newbs. you dont fight a single competent opponent. i could spec conditions, use sword/horn and do the same thing u did.

as already known, LB builds have zero sustain. you have no sustain in those vids and your damage is paltry. you basically demonstrate that LB is a terrible 1v1 weapon. in a small skirmish where you might have 2-3 opponents on you at a time, you would fold like paper.

I guess I misunderstood what you wanted Nerva. I thought you wanted 1v1 close range skirmishes since you said you have to stick with a zerg and go glass cannon in order to use LB. In none of these did I stick with a zerg or go glass cannon at all. Several of those opponents do know what they’re doing, they just get interrupted and cc’d when they try to do it. I spent two nights looking for duels and those were the best opponents I ran accross so I’d say it’s a very realistic view on what anyone could expect who wants to roam. Yes, I’m sure their are better opponents out there but I didn’t run accross any in my two nights of recording. Yes the one fight is long and as I quoted in the video I should have stomped two previous times. You said you wanted to see bunker LB right? That obviously means the fights may be longer due to reduced damage.

I have no sustain? My heavy 0/0/30/15/25 bunker build wearing full cleric armor and accessories (used in some of those fights) has just as much sustain as any ranger bunker does. How can you say it doesn’t? Both builds used in those videos have plenty of sustain.

Malleus Maleficarum.2603:

I switched not too long a ago from a SB traps build to LB GS jaguar focused and I like it a lot. I even started planning to craft kudzu since it fits a sylvari ranger so well…. So I was wondering is Kudzu worth the effort? And also how long did it take?

It took me about 3 months to make it Malleus. Stats wise there’s no reason to have it, but I wanted a Legendary longbow as a personal goal so to me it’s worth it yes. Go for it. It’ll look better on your Sylvari than mine does on me!

darb.9231:

nerva.7940:

thats not skirmishing. those are mostly 1on1’s. none of your opponents even know how to use their profs, and it takes you about 7 minutes to kill two complete newbs. you dont fight a single competent opponent. i could spec conditions, use sword/horn and do the same thing u did.

as already known, LB builds have zero sustain. you have no sustain in those vids and your damage is paltry. you basically demonstrate that LB is a terrible 1v1 weapon. in a small skirmish where you might have 2-3 opponents on you at a time, you would fold like paper.

I guess I misunderstood what you wanted Nerva. I thought you wanted 1v1 close range skirmishes since you said you have to stick with a zerg and go glass cannon in order to use LB. In none of these did I stick with a zerg or go glass cannon at all. Several of those opponents do know what they’re doing, they just get interrupted and cc’d when they try to do it. I spent two nights looking for duels and those were the best opponents I ran accross so I’d say it’s a very realistic view on what anyone could expect who wants to roam. Yes, I’m sure their are better opponents out there but I didn’t run accross any in my two nights of recording. Yes the one fight is long and as I quoted in the video I should have stomped two previous times. You said you wanted to see bunker LB right? That obviously means the fights may be longer due to reduced damage.

I have no sustain? My heavy 0/0/30/15/25 bunker build wearing full cleric armor and accessories (used in some of those fights) has just as much sustain as any ranger bunker does. How can you say it doesn’t? Both builds used in those videos have plenty of sustain.

sorry, i guess u just cant please me. wvw is all about dispatching people quick, cuz 70% of them (true stat) are bads. and when you fight one, more will pile up on you quick, as you probably know. killing a bunch of bads with an LB proves that you have a basic grasp of the profession, but it doesnt demonstrate effectiveness of the weapon by a long shot. i would like to compliment you in saying that you just about push the weapon to the max in 1v1, and maybe it shows youre a decent player, but the vids blatantly show how bad the weapon is because power/prec SB, or a proper condi build would achieve the same in much less time.

usually, to demonstrate the effectiveness of a build, you need to show yourself under some adverse circumstances, like fighting 2-3 decent opponents at a time, or downing a few people in a middle of a zerg, or surviving very close battles. LB just doesnt give you the tools for that, and thats my point. it’s a zerg weapon, and it shines when youre in the back.

You are entitled to your opinion Nerva. I’m sure your build and your weapons are great. It was not my point to say other builds or weapons are trash. As I said from the begining. I just want to demonstrate that LB can work for in-your-face battles. That’s part of the beauty of this game and of the Ranger in particular. We have a lot of really good weapon choices, and I do literally use them all in certain circumstances (especially different dungeon scenarios).

yea but it was my point to say that LB is trash. you should be advocating for your class. but im sure youre happy killing bads 1on1 all day with your LB bunker build >.<

LB isn’t bad, it’s just heavily dependent on your circumstances to be good…which terrifyingly enough WvW fits those moments so often that it’s almost mandatory there.

I hope you feel better now that you were able to insult me Nerva. I’m a little more mature than that so I’m going to remain civil despite your blatant lack of tact.

Please post your vids of dominating 1v3 against good players like your saying you do.

Great videos. You will alway have nay say’ers. Even when you give them what they want. I think you fought just about every class. You showed what can be done and what is possible.

To many ranger have gotten comfortable with the mindlessness of the short bow auto attack (myself included). You have inspired me to go back to my Longbow.

On another note love your weapons. I’m not to crazy about Kudzu going for Bolt myself, But your great sword is a thing of beauty. Nice alternative to the Legendary greatswords.

nerva.7940:

yea but it was my point to say that LB is trash. you should be advocating for your class. but im sure youre happy killing bads 1on1 all day with your LB bunker build >.<

okay, I dont get it. WHAT do you want? him fighting a 1 v zerg? go ahead and make a video, find 3 good players in wvw and kill them in a 1 v 3 with any weapon the ranger has. then you might convince me, that the LB is trash. the LB/GS combo is viable, thats my opinion, and he showed it in his video. I am excited about your video…

Oh yeah, and no bunker build, because otherwise I am sure "you would be happy killing bad players with your “insert weapon here” bunker build".

I watched the videos and I have to say at first, I was tempted to say that the enemies were sub-par, but after watching the full length of the video I’d have to say that I agree with everything in ur original post. After playing with the SB cond builds, I have been trying to reach back out to the longbow and greatsword, as those are the weapons I originally made a ranger to play with. I have been dabbling with the longbow in skirmishes in wvw for a few days now, and our numbers as far as damage go seem very similar. I’d be interested to pick ur brain sometime about traits and gear setup, so feel free to shoot me a pm in game anytime to the IGN Black Scout.

Black Scoutsman.5830:

I watched the videos and I have to say at first, I was tempted to say that the enemies were sub-par, but after watching the full length of the video I’d have to say that I agree with everything in ur original post.

I didn’t use any videos of downleveled players other than the knock off the cliff one or if they were with a legit 80 in a 1v2. I also didn’t use a bunch where people were extremely over the top poor players (probably new to the profession or something). I legitimitely used the fights with the best players I encountered. Were they the best duelers in the game….of course not. But, they were the best I could find on a T2 WvW server in two nights. That said, I know there are some great players out there….some much better than myself.

Hey Darb

Are you using P/T/V gear?

For these videos I used two sets.

Some were with a full cleric set…both armor and jewelry. For that build I just go as bunker/regen as possible and use healing spring. Dwayna runes. I have over 3k armor with decent power, little to no crit, and regen about 450/sec on myself and about 800/sec on my pet. 0/0/30/15/25

The majority were with a set consisting of PTV chest and legs, knights shoulders and valk gloves, helm and boots. Zerk neck, one zerk access and 3 knights. 0/20/30/0/20. I use Troll Ungeunt unless in group with that build. Have to go 20 in Skirm for reduced LB on that one so I’m missing out on Natures Protection which is pretty important. For that reason I use Earth Runes on that set for the protection proc to make up for it and I love the projectile block at 20% health. I know the set sounds really mix and match but I’m looking at final stats…not having a matching set. With food it’s at just shy of 3k power, 42%ish crit rate, 40% crit dmg and over 3k armor. Omnom pies for 338 health on 60% of my crits on this build means a rapid fire or barage can give me a couple thousand health sometimes.

Back piece is Ascended PTV quiver for all builds.

darb.9231:

Black Scoutsman.5830:

I watched the videos and I have to say at first, I was tempted to say that the enemies were sub-par, but after watching the full length of the video I’d have to say that I agree with everything in ur original post.

I didn’t use any videos of downleveled players other than the knock off the cliff one or if they were with a legit 80 in a 1v2. I also didn’t use a bunch where people were extremely over the top poor players (probably new to the profession or something). I legitimitely used the fights with the best players I encountered. Were they the best duelers in the game….of course not. But, they were the best I could find on a T2 WvW server in two nights. That said, I know there are some great players out there….some much better than myself.

No insults intended, I was just being honest with my first impression. when lookling at your trait setups, I noticed taht we run the same traits, I just need to get a few new pieces of gear as I still have my Carrion and Rampagers gear for the SB. I was thinking about going for a zerker set of armor, and PVT ascended pieces for jewelry, with Clerics ear pieces. Just gonna take me some time to gather the resources and ascended pieces :/

darb.9231:

I hope you feel better now that you were able to insult me Nerva. I’m a little more mature than that so I’m going to remain civil despite your blatant lack of tact.

Please post your vids of dominating 1v3 against good players like your saying you do.

i will be posting such a vid shortly. been compiling my wvw footage that ive captured over the last 2 months or so. anyway, i wasnt insulting you in any way, so youre being a little oversensitive. i actually complimented you, but youre too kitten to read it. LB sucks, and your vids will not convince any experienced pvp’ers otherwise. you would be doing about 30% (estimate) more effective damage with a power/crit SB.

but as long as youre having fun, thats all that matters.

nerva.7940:

LB sucks, and your vids will not convince any experienced pvp’ers otherwise. you would be doing about 30% (estimate) more effective damage with a power/crit SB.

I use LB/GS in paid pvp. I believe SB is a great skirmishing weapon but that LB is just as viable in the right hands. Granted his vids did not convince me to use LB but experience has. As for the 30% dmg the LB has much more burst capabilities than the SB so if you are swapping weapons then LB is better. However, if in a sustained bow fight then the SB would win hands down.

GJ on the vids, I enjoyed watching them

I’ve been using LB/GS for a long time now in WvW as well. LB has been my favorite weapon since i started using it when I reached 80. I just feel it has more oomph than a shortbow. GS just adds so much mobility to rangers that it makes it really hard for me to swap it for something else.

jubskie.3152:

GJ on the vids, I enjoyed watching them

I’ve been using LB/GS for a long time now in WvW as well. LB has been my favorite weapon since i started using it when I reached 80. I just feel it has more oomph than a shortbow. GS just adds so much mobility to rangers that it makes it really hard for me to swap it for something else.

Yes on the GS mobility. I’ve tried to like other weapons in WvW but I can’t go without swoop.

I know you lose the long range, but have you tried to run with GS/Sword+Offhand in WvW for 1vs1?
People get surprised by a ranger with it

There is always a catch with every build, but its pretty fun to tear people apart with it

Eurantien.4632:

nerva.7940:

LB sucks, and your vids will not convince any experienced pvp’ers otherwise. you would be doing about 30% (estimate) more effective damage with a power/crit SB.

I use LB/GS in paid pvp. I believe SB is a great skirmishing weapon but that LB is just as viable in the right hands. Granted his vids did not convince me to use LB but experience has. As for the 30% dmg the LB has much more burst capabilities than the SB so if you are swapping weapons then LB is better. However, if in a sustained bow fight then the SB would win hands down.

i hope i meet you in paid
same point like ever..the lb deals not more dmg than the sb..it was testet so often even with the rapid fire you can not get the dmg of sb.
lb sucks

Bambula.3649:

Eurantien.4632:

nerva.7940:

LB sucks, and your vids will not convince any experienced pvp’ers otherwise. you would be doing about 30% (estimate) more effective damage with a power/crit SB.

I use LB/GS in paid pvp. I believe SB is a great skirmishing weapon but that LB is just as viable in the right hands. Granted his vids did not convince me to use LB but experience has. As for the 30% dmg the LB has much more burst capabilities than the SB so if you are swapping weapons then LB is better. However, if in a sustained bow fight then the SB would win hands down.

i hope i meet you in paid
same point like ever..the lb deals not more dmg than the sb..it was testet so often even with the rapid fire you can not get the dmg of sb.
lb sucks

I’d love a duel. Can never get enough practice vs. sb rangers.

darb.9231:

The Longbow/Greatsword Ranger

I made these videos per requests in another thread. The general consensus in the thread was that Longbow is only good for long range fighting and hugging the zerg and is not good for skirmishing. While I do believe short bow is great for skirmishing, I believe LB is a very capable skirmishing weapon and for some builds/play styles may even be superior.

The discussion was also that you have to give up too much survivability (WS and BM) in order to effectively use LB. I used two builds for these videos and neither produce any kind of mega dps or give up survivability. Both have 30 in WS. One has 25 in BM and focuses on healing/regen and the other has 20 in BM and focuses a little more on crit and life steal.

After defending LB as a good skirmishing weapon I was asked by multiple people to make a video demonstrating that it could effectively do it. So….I downloaded Bandicam and spent the last two nights roaming and looking for duels. LB/GS is a complimentary weapon set that I like for all aspects of the game (PVE, PVP & WvW). I’m not claiming to be the best duelist in the game or OP in any way as I’m sure there are much more talented players out there. I just want to show that LB can be used effectively in skirmishing situations. Really the video is just as much about GS as I find they compliment each other well and switch often.

I’m not discounting SB’s prowess as a skirmishing tool. It’s great for it. Just don’t dismiss LB as a power/crit/glass cannon/zerg hugging only weapon.

http://youtu.be/NUvNw1LdPdM

http://youtu.be/bcd4a-RBg1k

edit = spelling

The videos you posted are not viewable – they show as “private”.

Odd how one has to build in toughness and condition damage to a clerics longbow/greatsword build (wasting 300 stat points) in order to get the toughness you need. Isn’t there a better way or am I misundertanding what you’re doing? By the way, the videos show up as private on my phone.

nerva.7940:

darb.9231:

I hope you feel better now that you were able to insult me Nerva. I’m a little more mature than that so I’m going to remain civil despite your blatant lack of tact.

Please post your vids of dominating 1v3 against good players like your saying you do.

i will be posting such a vid shortly. been compiling my wvw footage that ive captured over the last 2 months or so. anyway, i wasnt insulting you in any way, so youre being a little oversensitive. i actually complimented you, but youre too kitten to read it. LB sucks, and your vids will not convince any experienced pvp’ers otherwise. you would be doing about 30% (estimate) more effective damage with a power/crit SB.

but as long as youre having fun, thats all that matters.

It has been 9 months and i have yet to see the video???

I can’t watch the videos but I certainly understand what Nerva is saying. This class isn’t designed very well. For Longbow to outshine shortbow at all it needs to maintain max range, something this class can’t do because ANet doesn’t want players kiting melee. Longbow also provides no real burst as we’ve seen the math to show rapid fire isn’t a large increase over auto-attack damage at max range. It’s only real value is the vulnerability and to use for moderate damage when you can’t attack at max range.

Worse still is its defensive value hinges on your opponent not having stability because if you can’t knock them back all you have for defense is a short duration stealth and to swap weapons. SB still has a snare and an evade.

For Longbow to ever work for this class it will need real, on-demand burst. Giving the class real burst will also make traits like Remorseless and Moment of Clarity have real value as right now both traits are very underwhelming.

I’ll watch the videos later if they’re made public again simply because I enjoy watching Ranger videos and I’m sure they display more skill and effort than I’m capable of. I just understand where Nerva is coming from.

But but There’s no video…

Yep, LB rocks for skirmishing! I didnt like it leveling but fully traited out with the cooldown and eagle eye, you dont miss what autoattack takes away from it. The utility (stealth, aoe cripple, knockback) and dps (rapid fire) really make it a lot of fun. Although I prefer sword/horn over GS, I’ve been meaning to go back and try it again.

I found a great consensus with Longbow vs. Shortbow. I use both of them

LB/GS is my wvw default gear these days, on a signet build with predominantly soldier gear and a couple knight and zerker bits. I find it decent-ish at everything, i like it.

Traited LB provides range and decent lootbag tagging when near the zerg, and GS/soldier stats/signet of stone provide the survival when needed, including becoming part of the melee train when needed, with a cleaving weapon in hand.

The skirmishing is sub-par due to low damage, but doable, in a very attritional style, making the most of the evade and CC provided by the weapons. As often in this game, it comes down to not spamming skills. Careful use of the stealth/knockback/cripple of the LB and the leap/block/daze of the GS goes a long way to keep you alive while nibbling away with pet and arrows. On pets, i often run jungle spider and wolf, for more time-wasting as well as both melee/ranged options.

Off topic, but I started to enjoy the norn Bear Form as an elite recently, for the sheer HP sponge you become. As well as that sprint to contest a camp or run away.

Umm… guys. It’s 8 moths old topic, and author last posts are also from 8 months ago. I wouldn’t wait for any videos or responce from him.

Terkov.4138:

Umm… guys. It’s 8 moths old topic, and author last posts are also from 8 months ago. I wouldn’t wait for any videos or responce from him.

well kitten , and here I was expecting to watch videos when I got him. Glad to see Longbow still sucks 8 months and counting though

Atherakhia.4086:

Terkov.4138:

Umm… guys. It’s 8 moths old topic, and author last posts are also from 8 months ago. I wouldn’t wait for any videos or responce from him.

well kitten , and here I was expecting to watch videos when I got him. Glad to see Longbow still sucks 8 months and counting though

Omg they said they’re working on it. At this rate, it should only take about 1-3 decades so stop being so impatient :P

Terkov.4138:

Umm… guys. It’s 8 moths old topic, and author last posts are also from 8 months ago. I wouldn’t wait for any videos or responce from him.

Haha, good catch. ^^

If you really want some videos with LB check one in my sig. Not the most pro actions, but always sth. Footage from before any buffs (projectile speed, 4. cast time fix, aftercast reduction, stealth).

Well, 8 months old huh? I feel even dumber than usual. Listen, this guy thought longbow was any good 8 months ago? It’s a lot better now and many still say “ew”.

8 months ago! I was just a baby ranger back then doing work with LB/GS. Thinking back it is nice to see the changes they’ve made but still not quiet there imo.