Guild Wars 2

Whew huge topic title, sorry.

So yeah

I’m probably the minority enjoying the CURRENT sword auto (leap/stick to target)

But I do understand the change (I did die many times in the first few weeks from falling off cliffs and such)

But, they’re removing a pretty good gap closer.

My suggestion, much like the topic title, would be to add a 1s superspeed component to the 3rd chain – would add the gap closer element they’re removing. It would balance things out, considering superspeed cannot stack

Swift Strike (…or any other name)
‘Strike your foe, granting yourself superspeed. Your pet gains might’
Damage: 293 (0.8)
Might (5s)
Superspeed (1s)
Number of Targets: 3
Range: 170

maybe they did? wait and see? chain already has cripple?

I’m pretty skeptical they thought this through… I have a bad feeling they just caved to the masses of non-ranger-mains who want to log onto druid for 1 day a year, left the skills 100% as-is and just removed the rooting, which is a situational nerf. We see from the twitter video they didn’t add superspeed like a few people have suggested. (Can you see conditions on target golems?)

Undeniable nerf in WvW, probably equal or small gain in PvP, sort of irrelevant for any form of PvE (small loss in open world, small gain in hard content). Net loss.

Eh, I’ve been bracing myself for this for years, we have to take Justine’s advice.

Current sword aa doesn’t show cripple condition either with UI off.

As far as I can tell the first two attacks hit target with same hit animation.

The current third attack does a dust cloud on ground. I cannot see in the Anet vid if its still present because the quality is lower.

If I had to guess, Id say they maybe increased pet buff on skill 3, and/or maybe kept cast time same but streamlined entire chain thus improving its dmg. I doubt they preserved the mobility.

Justine.6351:

If I had to guess, Id say they maybe increased pet buff on skill 3

That would fall in line with their statement saying they want to connect the ranger to the pet more back when they were talking about the direction each profession would go.

I think we’re over thinking this though, I bet they did nothing. #GlassHalfEmpty

If the auto does give the pet a little buff that would make sword an amazing option for beastmaster rangers. Cripple spam makes it a lot easier for the pet to land it’s big hitting moves, and the might can be transferred to the pet for easier might stacking. Adding a third effect could be interesting.

I do miss those cool kicks though. I guess they couldn’t get the kicking animation to look good with strafing.

Tried to suggest this multiple times before, except with enough super speed to cover the cast times of 1b & 1c. Distance loss would have been minimal, would have been affected by movement impending conditions, but could retain the unique animations and dodge.

On the flip side, I wouldn’t be surprised if they did not buff or change the sword auto (other than the animations) as it’s technically a small DPS buff. Video looks as though it’s using the Thief sword change with lower after-casts.

Since each strike appears to be the standard ½s cast and may be able to cleave multiple targets on the entire chain, I’m guessing the devs would leave it alone.

Honestly people are overrating the importance of the “gap closing” element of the leap. Often this could actually make you jump in a wrong direction. If enemies want to create distance they just use their own teleports/leaps/stealths anyway.

The skill already cripples. I am really curious what the new version does. Before we know the exact details threads like this one are pointless. I get that a small minority liked the old chain and you kept this change from happening years earlier. This is your win. Now accept Arenanets decision to finally change it.

Dojo.1867:

Honestly people are overrating the importance of the “gap closing” element of the leap.

Don’t tell us what we value and how highly we valued it. You got your way, stop arguing this point.

Fluffball.8307:

Dojo.1867:

Honestly people are overrating the importance of the “gap closing” element of the leap.

Don’t tell us what we value and how highly we valued it. You got your way, stop arguing this point.

The leap was counterproductive to the skill, at least in pvp. End of story.

Zelda.6325:

Fluffball.8307:

Dojo.1867:

Honestly people are overrating the importance of the “gap closing” element of the leap.

Don’t tell us what we value and how highly we valued it. You got your way, stop arguing this point.

The leap was counterproductive to the skill, at least in pvp. End of story.

actually PVP was the only game mode were the leap was useful, to stick to a thief. check your information before you drop that kind of statements.

the sword AA chain was however really annoying in pve and wvw mostly because it would get you into unnecessary hairy situations most of the time.

i did like the 1 button mode in pve with the sword AA but i really hated the lock that negate your dodges.

i just hope the sword dont get nerfed damage wise, and Anet reworked the other skills to make up for the mobility lost.

for example change the weird serpents strike for the leap with the evade in very short cooldown so we can keep the mobility.

The best way to improve the skill would be to leave them as leap skills but let us stow them any time or dodgeroll during cast. This would be different that current movement skills but still.

anduriell.6280:

actually PVP was the only game mode were the leap was useful, to stick to

Zelda doesn’t have the slightest idea what he’s talking about.

PvP for sticking and also WvW is losing massive functionality. Sword gets infinitely better the more targets there are. I always bring up FrouFrou’s video where she was reported for hacking because she was bouncing around in a 1v5 or something and no one could kill her. Also in zergs, I know I’m not the only one who would “zerg surf” with stability up to pummel the backlines then quickly get back to your own zerg.

Fluffball.8307:

anduriell.6280:

actually PVP was the only game mode were the leap was useful, to stick to

Zelda doesn’t have the slightest idea what he’s talking about.

PvP for sticking and also WvW is losing massive functionality. Sword gets infinitely better the more targets there are. I always bring up FrouFrou’s video where she was reported for hacking because she was bouncing around in a 1v5 or something and no one could kill her. Also in zergs, I know I’m not the only one who would “zerg surf” with stability up to pummel the backlines then quickly get back to your own zerg.

So the sword is good because it can be used in harmless troll play and this fabled “zerg surfing”?

Regardless of how much you want to argue about the chain – it was statistically disastrous in numerous occasions.

The chain was more harmful than not in most environments. In PvE it prevented (delayed) dodges which cost the player his life.
Same goes for PvP and WvW.
You could do some nice neat tricks but the truth is the majority of players would enjoy the new user-friendly mechanic. There’s no discussion. Yes, the us – veterans will miss it. The rest of ranger community and former ranger community forced to reroll (which is like 95% compared to us) will like the change.
I have to say I have expectations myself. I’ll wait and see.

Substance E.4852:

So the sword is good because it can be used in harmless troll play and this fabled “zerg surfing”?

No, it was good because you could use it to kill people. But like tragic said, the unskilled masses and Substance E couldn’t make use of it. :P

Really, it’s over, I don’t know why the rooting-problem folks are still trying to tell us that sword had no advantages. You guys won, you don’t even need to understand our point of view anymore.

How should “zerg surfing” work with sword auto? It offers nothing which would prevent the zerg from just killing you.
And i wouldn’t call a very short range leap which can’t be used from movement a “great disengage tool”. Yea, you could do some cool stuff with sword auto, but in many situations (including pvp/wvw) the animation lock is more harmful than usefull.

UmbraNoctis.1907:

How should “zerg surfing” work with sword auto? It offers nothing which would prevent the zerg from just killing you.
And i wouldn’t call a very short range leap which can’t be used from movement a “great disengage tool”. Yea, you could do some cool stuff with sword auto, but in many situations (including pvp/wvw) the animation lock is more harmful than usefull.

Remove the words auto and lock and some crazy things can happen with sword 1 chain.

The way I see it most people who talk about tricks and jumps of the original sword chain probably think it’s cool because it feels that way (and nothing else).

I mean come on – when we actually finally make the bloody weapon work the way we intended to fight – it’s so awesome that we can’t contain ourselves. Because we are just so used to the horrible mechanics that when we finally actually manage to do something correctly the joy we feel is thousandfold.

It’s the same of just how people say that sword 2>2 is a good gap closer / disengage. While in reality it gives like 150 range advantage in comparison to casual running with skill cap higher than any other class in this entire game. Even less so under Swiftness / Super Speed; while the risk of the ability is way too high for practical use (roots you in place for a brief moment making you vulnerable to CC that often leads to death).

Dojo.1867:

Honestly people are overrating the importance of the “gap closing” element of the leap. Often this could actually make you jump in a wrong direction. If enemies want to create distance they just use their own teleports/leaps/stealths anyway.

The skill already cripples. I am really curious what the new version does. Before we know the exact details threads like this one are pointless. I get that a small minority liked the old chain and you kept this change from happening years earlier. This is your win. Now accept Arenanets decision to finally change it.

There is some truth here. The leap that occurs on the 3rd stage of a chain on a melee weapon has highly questionable utility and takes control away from the player.

I hope the leap is removed, or better yet rethought as a teleport with limited range? That seems to be a much more reasonable realization of the skill IMO.

Ok peeps, being stuck in animations when you need to move is not good.

Randomly leaping in directions at times is not good.

Tracking targets was the only good thing about the skill, the rest wasn’t good.

This is a good change so let’s test it out to see how the sword performs. If it’s not a good change then I’m sure the devs are working with us now and will make adjustments.

Given all that, I wish the devs would ask for specific input first before changes, much like the recent sky hammer thread in the spvp section looking for community ideas.

UmbraNoctis.1907:

How should “zerg surfing” work with sword auto? It offers nothing which would prevent the zerg from just killing you.

Cmon man, you’re better than that. Don’t just make ridiculous posts to prove your point. No one is claiming the sword auto is what keeps you alive as you attack their backlines.

I mean if people didn’t know how to do this, we wouldn’t even be discussing it. Just popping RaO and SoS is enough to get to the eles.

It was my default way of playing in zerg v zerg, and I know tons of other rangers play this type of role as well. We’re very good as “thieves” to attack backlines.

Again, all of this is irrelevant, all this discussions is doing is kittening off both sides. The non-sword likers won and this is all moot.

Fluffball.8307:

No, it was good because you could use it to kill people. But like tragic said, the unskilled masses and Substance E couldn’t make use of it. :P

As far as me not using to “zerg surf”, ya kind of hard in T1 when an average fight has half a dozen necro fears, DH gates, and static fields all over the place. If you think RaO and SoS (which doesn’t even block condi damage) is seriously going to let you walk through the bomb of 40-50 people then all I can say is that you have never even tried it.

Best case scenario is you make it to the back with all stab stripped and half your health gone from condi Reapers. The back line focuses you and you die from 3 ele’kittenting you with fireball autos while stuck in CC.

Excuse me for running pewpew/healbot. I rather enjoy playing the class to it’s strengths rather than as some off brand sword thief.

Substance E.4852:

Fluffball.8307:

No, it was good because you could use it to kill people. But like tragic said, the unskilled masses and Substance E couldn’t make use of it. :P

As far as me not using to “zerg surf”, ya kind of hard in T1 when an average fight has half a dozen necro fears, DH gates, and static fields all over the place. If you think RaO and SoS (which doesn’t even block condi damage) is seriously going to let you walk through the bomb of 40-50 people then all I can say is that you have never even tried it.

Best case scenario is you make it to the back with all stab stripped and half your health gone from condi Reapers. The back line focuses you and you die from 3 ele’kittenting you with fireball autos while stuck in CC.

Excuse me for running pewpew/healbot. I rather enjoy playing the class to it’s strengths rather than as some off brand sword thief.

I could make up stories about how you play as well. All I know is the style worked for me really well and now it’s gone.

Fluffball.8307:

I could make up stories about how you play as well. All I know is the style worked for me really well and now it’s gone.

that bug had to go, it wasnt the intended behaviour for the sword, just a residuary and undesirable effect of the early stages of development of the ranger, like many broken things with this class.

just i hope the sword has been reworked, just not only the AA, so we can keep the mobility.
lets see if Anet listen any of the feedback they have in this forums and changed\fixed more than the sword AA

Fluffball.8307:

Cmon man, you’re better than that. Don’t just make ridiculous posts to prove your point. No one is claiming the sword auto is what keeps you alive as you attack their backlines.

“she was bouncing around in a 1v5 or something and no one could kill her”

This looked to me as if the bouncing around was the reason why she couldn’t be killed, which doesn’t make much sense. Guess i just misunderstood you there.
But i still don’t get what makes the current sword autoattack so important for you, especially against multiple enemys/zergs. Yes, it can be nice to finish of a single target which tries to run away, but in this case you often don’t need the leaps and could kill your target with “normal” autoattacks too.
Is it because jumping around between different targets is fun and looks cool? That’s a point i can understand. However, this isn’t a very efficient way to kill stuff, right?
And maybe the new autoattack allows you to do some cool stuff you couldn’t do now?

I think that better control over the charakter’s movement at any time during the autoattack chain instead of only between the individual parts is more valuable than those (imo) small benefits you get from short leaps at the cost of “freedom”.

I’m still sceptical though and really hope, anet doesn’t somehow mess it up, because generally i like the sword, use it a lot, and want to keep it up in the future.

UmbraNoctis.1907:

“she was bouncing around in a 1v5 or something and no one could kill her”

This looked to me as if the bouncing around was the reason why she couldn’t be killed, which doesn’t make much sense. Guess i just misunderstood you there.

It was. It was a funny video, she was evading left and right and using the untargeted auto to make people unable to hit her in melee range or with aoe. It’s one of my all time favorite GW2 videos, I think the favorite being the poster (can’t recall his name immediately) that had about 6 people chase him from Wildcreek all the way to Quentin, again using sword to stay alive.

I sadly don’t think we’re getting compensated for this overall nerf, I mean sure, i do like that i wont have the risk of throwing myself off of a cliff anymore, and that’s great, but in every other scenario I liked sticking to my target like glue/ being able to throw myself away from a fight from the auto chain alone, and then come back.

I just hope we got some compensation for our lack of sticking power…

Fluffball.8307:

It was. It was a funny video, she was evading left and right and using the untargeted auto to make people unable to hit her in melee range or with aoe. It’s one of my all time favorite GW2 videos, I think the favorite being the poster (can’t recall his name immediately) that had about 6 people chase him from Wildcreek all the way to Quentin, again using sword to stay alive.

Can you link the video?

I don’t know which one it was since she has like a thousand videos up.

https://www.youtube.com/user/Froudactyl/videos

If you go back a couple years though she uses s/d + gs in all the videos, and there is a lot of fun stuff. Maybe she’ll see this post and can recommend some videos.

I wish I had any idea what the EBG video was called, I’d like to rewatch that one. If you’re the poster that made the video and read this post, let me know!

You meant this video? Haven’t checked all, but in those i watched, she almost never used sword autoattack (only very few times for dmg) – for good reasons i guess.

Sword autoattack offered no defense. Yes, the third part could be used to creat some distance, however you had to use the first attacks of the chain too, which means you had to be in melee range, unable to dodge, which usually isn’t something you want to do under heavy pressure.

Oh ok my bad, I haven’t seen the video in a couple years so I misremembered if she doesn’t actually do the bouncing in that one. I’ve watch probably a dozen of her videos over the years, at least some of them have the fun bouncy style of creating distance in them; I know she and I have talked about how we both have a similar style in that manner. She had a real knack for staying alive in outnumbered situations.