Guild Wars 2

PotatoVeg(Floppy) – shout melee ranger – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hp5R1taNIk

FOX – survival/signet melee ranger – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vxMXx63pWxk

Josh Glad – regen melee ranger – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=my2hQ57vuhU

WIZZO – hybrid melee ranger ? – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMaweKeLg6c

Really like the variety of builds and different play styles. I don’t think such versatility exist in any other profession( I might be wrong).

I’ll be using this one, 2k power, 20k hp, 3.8k armor, 220% crit dmg. What I love about it the most is that you get those tanky stats, yet also 4 guaranteed crits in a row each time you swap weapons, the 1st being an OS with Leeching.

I really like potatoveg;s build but the lack of condi removal is concerning.

FrownyClown.8402:

I really like potatoveg;s build but the lack of condi removal is concerning.

To be fair, every skill on his utility bar removes conditions (Lightning Reflexes being a technical exception, but it breaks stun so I’ll count it). Given that each skill also provides regen, I’d imagine it can outpace the few damage conditions that manage to stick. Beyond that, there are a few solid mobility skills, so the slows aren’t going to do a whole lot.

Essentially, it has a fair amount of condition removal/ignore, its just woven into the build-something I’m finding more and more ranger builds operating like.

FrownyClown.8402:

I really like potatoveg;s build but the lack of condi removal is concerning.

With trooper rune, potatoveg condi removal is almost as good as the average WK build.
Guard is on 12 sec CD(as good as MT) , we heal as one is 16 sec CD(good as LR)

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

I’ll be using this one, 2k power, 20k hp, 3.8k armor, 220% crit dmg. What I love about it the most is that you get those tanky stats, yet also 4 guaranteed crits in a row each time you swap weapons, the 1st being an OS with Leeching.

I theory crafted a build which a mix of your melee build and eura pvp build, waiting for some one to use it(my melee ranger skills sux) its the build with the highest skill “skill ceiling” I could think of but if palyed right, you can 2 shot almost everything.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vNAQNAR8XjMqQLLWuCGsAXLG+Dq91zgAg/g8dD+j/HG+C2UB-T1BHwARVCOW3wf1fMq8DwTAYwFBY2+DkCoKtWA-w

LughLongArm.5460:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

I’ll be using this one, 2k power, 20k hp, 3.8k armor, 220% crit dmg. What I love about it the most is that you get those tanky stats, yet also 4 guaranteed crits in a row each time you swap weapons, the 1st being an OS with Leeching.

I theory crafted a build which a mix of your melee build and eura pvp build, waiting for some one to use it(my melee ranger skills sux) its the build with the highest skill “skill ceiling” I could think of but if palyed right, you can 2 shot almost everything.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vNAQNAR8XjMqQLLWuCGsAXLG+Dq91zgAg/g8dD+j/HG+C2UB-T1BHwARVCOW3wf1fMq8DwTAYwFBY2+DkCoKtWA-w

Looks pretty nice. The valk/wurm is definitely a big damage combo. 240% crit is pretty hard hitting, although I’m willing to drop that 18% with 100 power and 2k health for the extra 900 toughness. Best I have been able to get, crit damage wise, is 288% on a guard build I’m playing with hehe, that would hurt.

Only way to take advantage of that food is no Natural Vigor too I used to run it with my melee cavalier setup all the time.

The main reason I went with signets as utilities is they are simple to play and you can focus on the field and your weapon skills, the shouts and other sources of swiftness are great too imo, I like having a lot so no matter what I do, I’m always getting it. I would like to take MoC, but the signet trait is pretty nice too.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

LughLongArm.5460:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

I’ll be using this one, 2k power, 20k hp, 3.8k armor, 220% crit dmg. What I love about it the most is that you get those tanky stats, yet also 4 guaranteed crits in a row each time you swap weapons, the 1st being an OS with Leeching.

I theory crafted a build which a mix of your melee build and eura pvp build, waiting for some one to use it(my melee ranger skills sux) its the build with the highest skill “skill ceiling” I could think of but if palyed right, you can 2 shot almost everything.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vNAQNAR8XjMqQLLWuCGsAXLG+Dq91zgAg/g8dD+j/HG+C2UB-T1BHwARVCOW3wf1fMq8DwTAYwFBY2+DkCoKtWA-w

Looks pretty nice. The valk/wurm is definitely a big damage combo. 240% crit is pretty hard hitting, although I’m willing to drop that 18% with 100 power and 2k health for the extra 900 toughness. Best I have been able to get, crit damage wise, is 288% on a guard build I’m playing with hehe, that would hurt.

Only way to take advantage of that food is no Natural Vigor too I used to run it with my melee cavalier setup all the time.

The main reason I went with signets as utilities is they are simple to play and you can focus on the field and your weapon skills, the shouts and other sources of swiftness are great too imo, I like having a lot so no matter what I do, I’m always getting it. I would like to take MoC, but the signet trait is pretty nice too.

No natural vigor in this build ^^ and ya, your build is much more suited for group fights than the one I suggested.

LughLongArm.5460:

…No natural vigor in this build…

Yup, that’s why I commented on it. Since they do not stack, the food is kinda wasted if you take the WS line. Although, it plays nice with Primal Reflexes and would with LoYF too if it wasn’t rubbish. I just wish the might was a bit longer so you could get 2 stacks out of it.

Having several entire styles of play nerfed to uselessness (spirit, ranged) is not a golden age for rangers. x_x

Nice videos, though… but it’s nothing any other melee class isn’t able of doing.

Golden age lol … These builds are good against wvw bads who have little to no experience fighting actually good players, but you will not come close to a top tier player in tPvP with any of these builds.

They’re good though for low to mid tier play in WvW , nice videos!

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

LughLongArm.5460:

…No natural vigor in this build…

Yup, that’s why I commented on it. Since they do not stack, the food is kinda wasted if you take the WS line. Although, it plays nice with Primal Reflexes and would with LoYF too if it wasn’t rubbish. I just wish the might was a bit longer so you could get 2 stacks out of it.

Actually, now that vigor is nerfed to 50% and still doesnt stack with other bonuses, I c this food as 80% vigor up time, no need for Primal Reflexes. Also, this build need the trap trait for the HS and spike trap.

Alice.5360:

Having several entire styles of play nerfed to uselessness (spirit, ranged) is not a golden age for rangers. x_x

Nice videos, though… but it’s nothing any other melee class isn’t able of doing.

Wll, I did say golden age for roaming melee ranger.

LughLongArm.5460:

Alice.5360:

Having several entire styles of play nerfed to uselessness (spirit, ranged) is not a golden age for rangers. x_x

Nice videos, though… but it’s nothing any other melee class isn’t able of doing.

Wll, I did say golden age for roaming melee ranger.

This is true. I am bad at staying exactly on topic.

Sorry.

Alice.5360:

LughLongArm.5460:

Alice.5360:

Having several entire styles of play nerfed to uselessness (spirit, ranged) is not a golden age for rangers. x_x

Nice videos, though… but it’s nothing any other melee class isn’t able of doing.

Wll, I did say golden age for roaming melee ranger.

This is true. I am bad at staying exactly on topic.

Sorry.

Heheh

blitzkrieg.2451:

Golden age lol … These builds are good against wvw bads who have little to no experience fighting actually good players, but you will not come close to a top tier player in tPvP with any of these builds.

They’re good though for low to mid tier play in WvW , nice videos!

Title says “roaming”, you come in & start talking about tPvP. Must take real skill to run cele engi, cele d/d ele or mantra shatter because everyone knows how hard meta builds are to run.

Cool to see some variety & just in melee ranger alone. It’s a shame that no video really tackles the issue of condi removal though. All builds seem to have some, but no dedicated footage of build v condi player. Flopy’s vid is meh, mostly random 1v1 engagements & some didn’t even have food/guard buffs when he did though the fight with [Scnd] mesmer was nice, didn’t expect him to melt so quick. Fox’s was impressive though again, would like to see more play v condi. Josh sounds high af though he explains & demonstrates the build well and wtf at that 9.4k pet crit at 4:33 lolwut, will likely give his build a go. Finally Wizzo, happy to see a melee build demonstrated in a group post-patch & some other cooky ideas from him, keep on theorycrafting!

blitzkrieg.2451:

Golden age lol … These builds are good against wvw bads who have little to no experience fighting actually good players, but you will not come close to a top tier player in tPvP with any of these builds.

They’re good though for low to mid tier play in WvW , nice videos!

top tier players aren’t gods. Individually they are really good but so are alot of people. They work really well in teams and that is where top tier players shine. Melee ranger builds actually do provide a decent amount of interupts and could be useful in a team setting. The stats available don’t seem quite right to make a decent build though.

LughLongArm.5460:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

I’ll be using this one, 2k power, 20k hp, 3.8k armor, 220% crit dmg. What I love about it the most is that you get those tanky stats, yet also 4 guaranteed crits in a row each time you swap weapons, the 1st being an OS with Leeching.

I theory crafted a build which a mix of your melee build and eura pvp build, waiting for some one to use it(my melee ranger skills sux) its the build with the highest skill “skill ceiling” I could think of but if palyed right, you can 2 shot almost everything.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vNAQNAR8XjMqQLLWuCGsAXLG+Dq91zgAg/g8dD+j/HG+C2UB-T1BHwARVCOW3wf1fMq8DwTAYwFBY2+DkCoKtWA-w

I tried something very similar in PvP. The ability to get guaranteed crits on the pets is huge.. Unfortunately, imagining weapon swapping to get the guaranteed crit on the pet only to combo it with PoS or a maul seems really clunky to me. No player should be still enough to eat that burst…

Eurantien.4632:

LughLongArm.5460:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

I’ll be using this one, 2k power, 20k hp, 3.8k armor, 220% crit dmg. What I love about it the most is that you get those tanky stats, yet also 4 guaranteed crits in a row each time you swap weapons, the 1st being an OS with Leeching.

I theory crafted a build which a mix of your melee build and eura pvp build, waiting for some one to use it(my melee ranger skills sux) its the build with the highest skill “skill ceiling” I could think of but if palyed right, you can 2 shot almost everything.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vNAQNAR8XjMqQLLWuCGsAXLG+Dq91zgAg/g8dD+j/HG+C2UB-T1BHwARVCOW3wf1fMq8DwTAYwFBY2+DkCoKtWA-w

I tried something very similar in PvP. The ability to get guaranteed crits on the pets is huge.. Unfortunately, imagining weapon swapping to get the guaranteed crit on the pet only to combo it with PoS or a maul seems really clunky to me. No player should be still enough to eat that burst…

they will if you taunt them before it.

FrownyClown.8402:

Eurantien.4632:

LughLongArm.5460:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

I’ll be using this one, 2k power, 20k hp, 3.8k armor, 220% crit dmg. What I love about it the most is that you get those tanky stats, yet also 4 guaranteed crits in a row each time you swap weapons, the 1st being an OS with Leeching.

I theory crafted a build which a mix of your melee build and eura pvp build, waiting for some one to use it(my melee ranger skills sux) its the build with the highest skill “skill ceiling” I could think of but if palyed right, you can 2 shot almost everything.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vNAQNAR8XjMqQLLWuCGsAXLG+Dq91zgAg/g8dD+j/HG+C2UB-T1BHwARVCOW3wf1fMq8DwTAYwFBY2+DkCoKtWA-w

I tried something very similar in PvP. The ability to get guaranteed crits on the pets is huge.. Unfortunately, imagining weapon swapping to get the guaranteed crit on the pet only to combo it with PoS or a maul seems really clunky to me. No player should be still enough to eat that burst…

they will if you taunt them before it.

But then you have to use almost every cd to do damage. Sit in s/a, taunt, PoS, swap pets, swap weps, maul… It’s just clunky… Nothing like it was back when pets could hit for 10k

Eurantien.4632:

LughLongArm.5460:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

I’ll be using this one, 2k power, 20k hp, 3.8k armor, 220% crit dmg. What I love about it the most is that you get those tanky stats, yet also 4 guaranteed crits in a row each time you swap weapons, the 1st being an OS with Leeching.

I theory crafted a build which a mix of your melee build and eura pvp build, waiting for some one to use it(my melee ranger skills sux) its the build with the highest skill “skill ceiling” I could think of but if palyed right, you can 2 shot almost everything.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vNAQNAR8XjMqQLLWuCGsAXLG+Dq91zgAg/g8dD+j/HG+C2UB-T1BHwARVCOW3wf1fMq8DwTAYwFBY2+DkCoKtWA-w

I tried something very similar in PvP. The ability to get guaranteed crits on the pets is huge.. Unfortunately, imagining weapon swapping to get the guaranteed crit on the pet only to combo it with PoS or a maul seems really clunky to me. No player should be still enough to eat that burst…

Ya, the spvp version should be somthing like this.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vNAQNAR8XjMqQLLWuCOsAXLG+Dq91zgAg/g8dD+j/HG+C2UB-TJBHwAMLDA4JAM4iAMb/BA

The taunt and the spike trap do help with the landing of your big combos. Also spike trap will trigger MOC, so u dont need the “hit bash” for your opening maul. It is clunky, but you can 1-2 shot your target sometime whike being somewhat tanky. Is it usable in the top tier scene? I have no clue

I feel Melee just isn’t viable for PvP.

Too hard to connect with Maul & PoS, and you have to spend too much time off point waiting for your chance to burst.

And even with valk ammy, or any other “tankish” one you’ll still be dead in 2 hits in this meta.

FrownyClown.8402:

blitzkrieg.2451:

Golden age lol … These builds are good against wvw bads who have little to no experience fighting actually good players, but you will not come close to a top tier player in tPvP with any of these builds.

They’re good though for low to mid tier play in WvW , nice videos!

top tier players aren’t gods. Individually they are really good but so are alot of people. They work really well in teams and that is where top tier players shine. Melee ranger builds actually do provide a decent amount of interupts and could be useful in a team setting. The stats available don’t seem quite right to make a decent build though.

Nobody said top tier players were gods, but they’re better than 95% of the players in WvW. Most WvW players are just really bad, even the ‘good duelers’. OP Stats , ascended gear, food , etc etc doesn’t always equate to skill. Roamers and duelers doesn’t make you good since most just rely on stats in their build to do 80% of the work for them. A bunch of thieves and mesmers and d/d cele eles and sometimes a condi d/d ele (aka +40% condi duration food reliance ) who act good but really just aren’t… I’ve dueled just about everybody good in WvW and don’t come even close to top tier players technically in both 1on1s and team play combined.

No offense to WvW players but the reason why you’re not as good as pvp players is because they practice technical strategies, the first thought in a top tier player is the utility of the build, not the stats , food, ascended jewelry, etc….

It’s amazing how much easier it is to fight in WvW because of stats than it is in PvP as a ranger. This doesn’t make me a better player, rather just being carried by stats and fighting against much less quality players in general. Defender runes alone, perplexity alone, etc… There’s many reason mid-top tier pvp players are just better fundamentally than WvW players will ever be.

blitzkrieg.2451:

FrownyClown.8402:

blitzkrieg.2451:

Golden age lol … These builds are good against wvw bads who have little to no experience fighting actually good players, but you will not come close to a top tier player in tPvP with any of these builds.

They’re good though for low to mid tier play in WvW , nice videos!

top tier players aren’t gods. Individually they are really good but so are alot of people. They work really well in teams and that is where top tier players shine. Melee ranger builds actually do provide a decent amount of interupts and could be useful in a team setting. The stats available don’t seem quite right to make a decent build though.

Nobody said top tier players were gods, but they’re better than 95% of the players in WvW. Most WvW players are just really bad, even the ‘good duelers’. OP Stats , ascended gear, food , etc etc doesn’t always equate to skill. Roamers and duelers doesn’t make you good since most just rely on stats in their build to do 80% of the work for them. A bunch of thieves and mesmers and d/d cele eles and sometimes a condi d/d ele (aka +40% condi duration food reliance ) who act good but really just aren’t… I’ve dueled just about everybody good in WvW and don’t come even close to top tier players technically in both 1on1s and team play combined.

No offense to WvW players but the reason why you’re not as good as pvp players is because they practice technical strategies, the first thought in a top tier player is the utility of the build, not the stats , food, ascended jewelry, etc….

It’s amazing how much easier it is to fight in WvW because of stats than it is in PvP as a ranger. This doesn’t make me a better player, rather just being carried by stats and fighting against much less quality players in general. Defender runes alone, perplexity alone, etc… There’s many reason mid-top tier pvp players are just better fundamentally than WvW players will ever be.

Who cares?

At least 95% of players will never experience playing against a top tier PvP player, so they essentially do not exist as a part of the game and therefore their skills are completely irrelevant.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

blitzkrieg.2451:

FrownyClown.8402:

blitzkrieg.2451:

Golden age lol … These builds are good against wvw bads who have little to no experience fighting actually good players, but you will not come close to a top tier player in tPvP with any of these builds.

They’re good though for low to mid tier play in WvW , nice videos!

top tier players aren’t gods. Individually they are really good but so are alot of people. They work really well in teams and that is where top tier players shine. Melee ranger builds actually do provide a decent amount of interupts and could be useful in a team setting. The stats available don’t seem quite right to make a decent build though.

Nobody said top tier players were gods, but they’re better than 95% of the players in WvW. Most WvW players are just really bad, even the ‘good duelers’. OP Stats , ascended gear, food , etc etc doesn’t always equate to skill. Roamers and duelers doesn’t make you good since most just rely on stats in their build to do 80% of the work for them. A bunch of thieves and mesmers and d/d cele eles and sometimes a condi d/d ele (aka +40% condi duration food reliance ) who act good but really just aren’t… I’ve dueled just about everybody good in WvW and don’t come even close to top tier players technically in both 1on1s and team play combined.

No offense to WvW players but the reason why you’re not as good as pvp players is because they practice technical strategies, the first thought in a top tier player is the utility of the build, not the stats , food, ascended jewelry, etc….

It’s amazing how much easier it is to fight in WvW because of stats than it is in PvP as a ranger. This doesn’t make me a better player, rather just being carried by stats and fighting against much less quality players in general. Defender runes alone, perplexity alone, etc… There’s many reason mid-top tier pvp players are just better fundamentally than WvW players will ever be.

Who cares?

At least 95% of players will never experience playing against a top tier PvP player, so they essentially do not exist as a part of the game and therefore their skills are completely irrelevant.

ironically this is true

@blitzkrieg and FrownyClown:
You cannot compare PvP and WvW. There is much more freedom and variety in the open world. That is why there are different demands to a good WvW build than to a good PvP build.
Skillwise there is no difference. The percentage of good players will be about the same in WvW and PvP. The best roamers will beat the best PvP-players in roaming and vice versa. Being prejudiced in this topic is stupid.

@Topic
The melee also works great in a zerg. Damage + Support + Tankyness.

I love the new possibilities for frontline ranger. I’ve been playing ranger as frontline support now for a long time and the damage of my build was buffed by a huge amount.

It is great to see how good a melee ranger build works while boarding the enemy pirate ship. With a good build you can kill an enemy berserker ele with one maul while being tanky at the same time.

Oak da Vite.9054:

@blitzkrieg and FrownyClown:
You cannot compare PvP and WvW. There is much more freedom and variety in the open world. That is why there are different demands to a good WvW build than to a good PvP build.
Skillwise there is no difference. The percentage of good players will be about the same in WvW and PvP. The best roamers will beat the best PvP-players in roaming and vice versa. Being prejudiced in this topic is stupid.

@Topic
The melee also works great in a zerg. Damage + Support + Tankyness.

I love the new possibilities for frontline ranger. I’ve been playing ranger as frontline support now for a long time and the damage of my build was buffed by a huge amount.

It is great to see how good a melee ranger build works while boarding the enemy pirate ship. With a good build you can kill an enemy berserker ele with one maul while being tanky at the same time.

I actually like the idea of a frontline melee ranger. I think it is possible with this changes now.

FrownyClown.8402:

Oak da Vite.9054:

@blitzkrieg and FrownyClown:
You cannot compare PvP and WvW. There is much more freedom and variety in the open world. That is why there are different demands to a good WvW build than to a good PvP build.
Skillwise there is no difference. The percentage of good players will be about the same in WvW and PvP. The best roamers will beat the best PvP-players in roaming and vice versa. Being prejudiced in this topic is stupid.

@Topic
The melee also works great in a zerg. Damage + Support + Tankyness.

I love the new possibilities for frontline ranger. I’ve been playing ranger as frontline support now for a long time and the damage of my build was buffed by a huge amount.

It is great to see how good a melee ranger build works while boarding the enemy pirate ship. With a good build you can kill an enemy berserker ele with one maul while being tanky at the same time.

I actually like the idea of a frontline melee ranger. I think it is possible with this changes now.

Me 2, been thinking about something like this:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vNAQNAR3XjUqQFL2wC+rAXLG+DqtIWgA4TjfoB8dvHC+Mu7mYPA-TFiFABG8QAo+IAgkyPFV/xKlg5s/AAXAA70NIKozC-w

Food – https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Fried_Golden_Dumpling

This won’t be the golden age for melee rangers until they fix healing spring and the offhand range/radius. The new traits are good but for me personally, they don’t make up for breaking these other things.

FrownyClown.8402:

I actually like the idea of a frontline melee ranger. I think it is possible with this changes now.

It was more than doable even before the patch, so yeah.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

blitzkrieg.2451:

FrownyClown.8402:

blitzkrieg.2451:

Golden age lol … These builds are good against wvw bads who have little to no experience fighting actually good players, but you will not come close to a top tier player in tPvP with any of these builds.

They’re good though for low to mid tier play in WvW , nice videos!

top tier players aren’t gods. Individually they are really good but so are alot of people. They work really well in teams and that is where top tier players shine. Melee ranger builds actually do provide a decent amount of interupts and could be useful in a team setting. The stats available don’t seem quite right to make a decent build though.

Nobody said top tier players were gods, but they’re better than 95% of the players in WvW. Most WvW players are just really bad, even the ‘good duelers’. OP Stats , ascended gear, food , etc etc doesn’t always equate to skill. Roamers and duelers doesn’t make you good since most just rely on stats in their build to do 80% of the work for them. A bunch of thieves and mesmers and d/d cele eles and sometimes a condi d/d ele (aka +40% condi duration food reliance ) who act good but really just aren’t… I’ve dueled just about everybody good in WvW and don’t come even close to top tier players technically in both 1on1s and team play combined.

No offense to WvW players but the reason why you’re not as good as pvp players is because they practice technical strategies, the first thought in a top tier player is the utility of the build, not the stats , food, ascended jewelry, etc….

It’s amazing how much easier it is to fight in WvW because of stats than it is in PvP as a ranger. This doesn’t make me a better player, rather just being carried by stats and fighting against much less quality players in general. Defender runes alone, perplexity alone, etc… There’s many reason mid-top tier pvp players are just better fundamentally than WvW players will ever be.

Who cares?

At least 95% of players will never experience playing against a top tier PvP player, so they essentially do not exist as a part of the game and therefore their skills are completely irrelevant.

Then you can never say your build is truly viable. This is why ranger doesn’t exist in top tier. But you can ignore good players and keep fighting wvw players and then say your build is good when it truly isn’t against actually good players, doesn’t matter to me.

Oak da Vite.9054:

@blitzkrieg and FrownyClown:
You cannot compare PvP and WvW. There is much more freedom and variety in the open world. That is why there are different demands to a good WvW build than to a good PvP build.
Skillwise there is no difference. The percentage of good players will be about the same in WvW and PvP. The best roamers will beat the best PvP-players in roaming and vice versa. Being prejudiced in this topic is stupid.

@Topic
The melee also works great in a zerg. Damage + Support + Tankyness.

I love the new possibilities for frontline ranger. I’ve been playing ranger as frontline support now for a long time and the damage of my build was buffed by a huge amount.

It is great to see how good a melee ranger build works while boarding the enemy pirate ship. With a good build you can kill an enemy berserker ele with one maul while being tanky at the same time.

" The best roamers will beat the best PvP-players in roaming and vice versa. "

This is so far from the truth and you have no idea what you’re even talking about. Roaming is just a word for running around looking for fights, so essentially you’re referring to fighting in which case the best pvp players would absolutely, 100% demolish the best ‘roamers’.

blitzkrieg.2451:

Roaming is just a word for running around looking for fights, so essentially you’re referring to fighting in which case the best pvp players would absolutely, 100% demolish the best ‘roamers’.

That’s actually only partially true.

A GOOD roamer is about far far far more than fighting. A good roamer also acts as a scout and alerts commanders of enemy zerg locations, engages keeps to prevent porting or distract enemy zergs. Heck, some of the more talented ones can even keep multiple locations in combat which gives the appearance of large scale combat in an area where there’s only one. They can also flip camps and towers, breaking supply lines for enemy siege.

A side effect of all this is that, quite often, you’ll come across small teams or other roamers in the world; remember that you’re behind enemy lines the majority of your time as a roamer and quite often intentionally drawing attention to your actions. So yes, you’ll need to be able be able to handle combat with other players; usually in 1vX battles. Being able to eliminate those players, escape those players, or a little of both is an asset to a roamer, and something a good PvP player can likely do as well. That, however, is only one facet of roaming. A PvP player who is just trolling the countryside looking for fights is a BAD roamer and eating a slot on the map that could be utilized better by someone else.

Worse yet, they’re probably NOT going to be as good at even this one aspect as an experienced roamer. As PvP players are so fond of reminding everyone, there’s no food, gear stats, or levels in PvP. There are also no mobs. So, picking the situations that are good or bad to engage in a roaming situation might elude them.

Example:

You see three players running around not far from an enemy keep; likely running to hop on a Zerg you spotted near there. Engage them, or flee? What you’d want to look at:
Are they close enough to the mobs running around that your cleave will draw extra aggro? Will their cleave let you put the mob aggro on them? Where they moving faster than normal/swiftness perma up? What classes are they? Upleveled? Does their gear look fully fleshed out? How far away was that enemy zerg? What’s their title? Can you use the terrain to your advantage, or will it be there’s?

Yes, an experience PvP player can account for some of those questions. Yes, they can handle the combat itself really well. Yes, they can probably whoop me hard. But a better roamer? Doubtful at best.

The name roaming in the sense of wvw is roaming in small group skirmishes or roaming by yourself because they despise zergs. This is what roamer is considered in this game. What you’re referring to is a ‘scout’ but roamers are much different than that.

Roamers generally HATE zerging, therefore they roam and look for equal fights or duels.

blitzkrieg.2451:

The name roaming in the sense of wvw is roaming in small group skirmishes or roaming by yourself because they despise zergs. This is what roamer is considered in this game. What you’re referring to is a ‘scout’ but roamers are much different than that.

Roamers generally HATE zerging, therefore they roam and look for equal fights or duels.

May I ask where you get that definition from?
Not the part about hating the zerg; that’s subjective and while it likely does play a part in many roamers’ reasoning, neither of us can claim it as an absolute cause.
I mean your definition of a roamer, because that’s never what I or the wiki consider it.
From the Wiki:
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/World_versus_World#Roamer
Roamers are usually individuals or very small groups that go behind enemy lines to achieve objectives that would normally be impractical or impossible for a zerg. They include:

Killing or deterring enemy stragglers and reinforcements
Defending and destroying supply caravans
Capturing enemy camps
Tagging (or tapping) – Attacking an enemy keep sufficiently that it (and its waypoint, if any) becomes contested
Providing intel about enemy zerg size and position
Creating diversion for enemy zerg
Roamers generally require high survivability and escapability.) (emphasis mine)

Scouts are those individuals who tend to look out or babysit one objective. Scouting a objective may vary from, Keeps, Towers, Camps to even some points. Scouts, are useful to a purpose which even sometimes roamers cannot fulfil.

Tend to stay and keep lookout for a specified objective even if there are fights happening in the same map.
Responsible for upgrading and keeping it safe.
Calling for assistance if enemy zerg hits your objective, the response if faster.
Responsible for keeping the siege refreshed in the objective.
Provides precise intel if the objective is tagged or is being attacked.
And in most cases, upgrading the objective and keeping check on the supply.

The roamer, as I depicted above, is a skirmisher. Absolutely. They just also handle a great many other things, to the point skirmishing is only a part of it. Like a grocery store manager is more than just the person who gives discounts to angry customers.

It’s just how roamer has always been considered in WvW across most servers. Roamers never associate themselves with zergs or help zergs out… They just roam in ~5 group, with a few people or by themselves.

Anything above that is considered a havoc or zerg busting group then anything above that is considered a zerg or large group.

Scouts generally are called people who roam and look for #‘s of zergs/enemy locations or goto a keep and scout for #’s of enemy forces.

I’m not sure there’s really a definition of it anywhere, it’s just how it’s kind of always been lol

I literally just posted a link to the definition, as written and maintained by the community. It’s the same definition I’ve always understood, though admittedly I just came back after a few extended breaks so I’m willing to admit the definition might have changed. Heck, a quick google search of GW2 roamer is filled with threads, videos, and articles on how roamers can impact WvW, or how the term works in other games with similar systems (which is how I understood it when I played ESO and DaoC as well).

While it is true that many/most ‘roamers’ are actually just out for the dailies or dueling, a true roamer is working to have an impact as an advanced skirmisher.

Yea but that’s not how any roamer is in reality , almost all roamers are just roaming to fight people, and hate zerging and almost never give intel. I’m just saying this as a roamer who has been on about 10 servers ranging from tier 1 to tier 4 and grouping with other roamers from those very servers.

Just like dungeons, PvP, World Bosses, Fractals, and every other game mode in every game invented 95% of the player base is bads. I thought we were talking upper crust against upper crust? Sure, a PvP pro will crush roamers just trolling for duels; just like a dedicated WvW roamer who is actually GOOD will crush PvP bads. The statement you disagreed with was (paraphrased) “Good PvP wins PvP, good roamer wins WvW”. We’re talking upper crust against upper crust, in their environments.

Also, bear in mind that unless you’re commanding the Zerg, the roamers probably aren’t calling to you to give positions and plans. I know when I roamed more, and once I get more heavy into WvW again I’ll be picking up a few specific players to keep contact with who can use the information I provide and give good direction on where I need to be to make the most impact. There’s probably more good roamers than you think; they just are’t spamming map chat.

My argument isn’t whether or not a good player will beat a bad player whether it’s on either end of the spectrum, it’s more so the mentality of what you practice with what you’re given in pvp as opposed to what you’re given in wvw.

Most wvw players can’t roam without equipping food or some unrealistic stat setup with ascended jewelry mixtures to achieve a supremely optimal build, which is alright but this is exactly why pvp players are technically better usually in 90% of the cases between equal skilled ww and pvp players. mid to top tier players have most likely played every class and know everything about each class , they count dodges , they don’t random dodge, they don’t double dodge. You can afford to do those mistakes in wvw. You don’t get -40%/40% (50% with toxic crystals) condition duration passives or leeching food to carry you while you’re fighting in PvP. This is all I’m saying, for this reason generally and in most cases, seasoned pvp players are wayyyy better than a seasoned wvw player.

The mentalities are just different. It’s really not a diss actually to wvw players, your goal really isn’t to fight players, it’s to blob and fight massive numbers and fight for keeps so it’s not a surprise wvw players aren’t technically as good as a pvp player of equal caliber, but that’s kind of the thing. Only those ‘5%’ (there’s much more than that anyway in pvp) exist ONLY in pvp for a reason and not WvW.

blitzkrieg.2451:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

blitzkrieg.2451:

FrownyClown.8402:

blitzkrieg.2451:

Golden age lol … These builds are good against wvw bads who have little to no experience fighting actually good players, but you will not come close to a top tier player in tPvP with any of these builds.

They’re good though for low to mid tier play in WvW , nice videos!

top tier players aren’t gods. Individually they are really good but so are alot of people. They work really well in teams and that is where top tier players shine. Melee ranger builds actually do provide a decent amount of interupts and could be useful in a team setting. The stats available don’t seem quite right to make a decent build though.

Nobody said top tier players were gods, but they’re better than 95% of the players in WvW. Most WvW players are just really bad, even the ‘good duelers’. OP Stats , ascended gear, food , etc etc doesn’t always equate to skill. Roamers and duelers doesn’t make you good since most just rely on stats in their build to do 80% of the work for them. A bunch of thieves and mesmers and d/d cele eles and sometimes a condi d/d ele (aka +40% condi duration food reliance ) who act good but really just aren’t… I’ve dueled just about everybody good in WvW and don’t come even close to top tier players technically in both 1on1s and team play combined.

No offense to WvW players but the reason why you’re not as good as pvp players is because they practice technical strategies, the first thought in a top tier player is the utility of the build, not the stats , food, ascended jewelry, etc….

It’s amazing how much easier it is to fight in WvW because of stats than it is in PvP as a ranger. This doesn’t make me a better player, rather just being carried by stats and fighting against much less quality players in general. Defender runes alone, perplexity alone, etc… There’s many reason mid-top tier pvp players are just better fundamentally than WvW players will ever be.

Who cares?

At least 95% of players will never experience playing against a top tier PvP player, so they essentially do not exist as a part of the game and therefore their skills are completely irrelevant.

Then you can never say your build is truly viable. This is why ranger doesn’t exist in top tier. But you can ignore good players and keep fighting wvw players and then say your build is good when it truly isn’t against actually good players, doesn’t matter to me.

That is like saying that my 150cc Kart is not viable in Formula 1 or that because I’m only winning races in state events, that I’m ignoring Michael Schumacher. They are totally different game modes.

Since no top PvPers ever come to WvW and a vast majority of people cannot possibly spend the amount of time they do training etc, there is no reason to ever even make the comparison. Like I said, they essentially do not exist in the game. You will never see one while roaming in WvW, so if you win every fight you come across? Fine. Are you Michael Schumacher? No, you have a life outside the game.

Nobody cares what top tier PvP players do.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

blitzkrieg.2451:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

blitzkrieg.2451:

FrownyClown.8402:

blitzkrieg.2451:

Golden age lol … These builds are good against wvw bads who have little to no experience fighting actually good players, but you will not come close to a top tier player in tPvP with any of these builds.

They’re good though for low to mid tier play in WvW , nice videos!

top tier players aren’t gods. Individually they are really good but so are alot of people. They work really well in teams and that is where top tier players shine. Melee ranger builds actually do provide a decent amount of interupts and could be useful in a team setting. The stats available don’t seem quite right to make a decent build though.

Nobody said top tier players were gods, but they’re better than 95% of the players in WvW. Most WvW players are just really bad, even the ‘good duelers’. OP Stats , ascended gear, food , etc etc doesn’t always equate to skill. Roamers and duelers doesn’t make you good since most just rely on stats in their build to do 80% of the work for them. A bunch of thieves and mesmers and d/d cele eles and sometimes a condi d/d ele (aka +40% condi duration food reliance ) who act good but really just aren’t… I’ve dueled just about everybody good in WvW and don’t come even close to top tier players technically in both 1on1s and team play combined.

No offense to WvW players but the reason why you’re not as good as pvp players is because they practice technical strategies, the first thought in a top tier player is the utility of the build, not the stats , food, ascended jewelry, etc….

It’s amazing how much easier it is to fight in WvW because of stats than it is in PvP as a ranger. This doesn’t make me a better player, rather just being carried by stats and fighting against much less quality players in general. Defender runes alone, perplexity alone, etc… There’s many reason mid-top tier pvp players are just better fundamentally than WvW players will ever be.

Who cares?

At least 95% of players will never experience playing against a top tier PvP player, so they essentially do not exist as a part of the game and therefore their skills are completely irrelevant.

Then you can never say your build is truly viable. This is why ranger doesn’t exist in top tier. But you can ignore good players and keep fighting wvw players and then say your build is good when it truly isn’t against actually good players, doesn’t matter to me.

That is like saying that my 150cc Kart is not viable in Formula 1 or that because I’m only winning races in state events, that I’m ignoring Michael Schumacher. They are totally different game modes.

Since no top PvPers ever come to WvW and a vast majority of people cannot possibly spend the amount of time they do training etc, there is no reason to ever even make the comparison. Like I said, they essentially do not exist in the game. You will never see one while roaming in WvW, so if you win every fight you come across? Fine. Are you Michael Schumacher? No, you have a life outside the game.

Nobody cares what top tier PvP players do.

Sure, that’s fine but then you can’t say your power build is viable (back to stage 1 of this pointless online debate)

blitzkrieg.2451:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

blitzkrieg.2451:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

blitzkrieg.2451:

FrownyClown.8402:

blitzkrieg.2451:

Golden age lol … These builds are good against wvw bads who have little to no experience fighting actually good players, but you will not come close to a top tier player in tPvP with any of these builds.

They’re good though for low to mid tier play in WvW , nice videos!

top tier players aren’t gods. Individually they are really good but so are alot of people. They work really well in teams and that is where top tier players shine. Melee ranger builds actually do provide a decent amount of interupts and could be useful in a team setting. The stats available don’t seem quite right to make a decent build though.

Nobody said top tier players were gods, but they’re better than 95% of the players in WvW. Most WvW players are just really bad, even the ‘good duelers’. OP Stats , ascended gear, food , etc etc doesn’t always equate to skill. Roamers and duelers doesn’t make you good since most just rely on stats in their build to do 80% of the work for them. A bunch of thieves and mesmers and d/d cele eles and sometimes a condi d/d ele (aka +40% condi duration food reliance ) who act good but really just aren’t… I’ve dueled just about everybody good in WvW and don’t come even close to top tier players technically in both 1on1s and team play combined.

No offense to WvW players but the reason why you’re not as good as pvp players is because they practice technical strategies, the first thought in a top tier player is the utility of the build, not the stats , food, ascended jewelry, etc….

It’s amazing how much easier it is to fight in WvW because of stats than it is in PvP as a ranger. This doesn’t make me a better player, rather just being carried by stats and fighting against much less quality players in general. Defender runes alone, perplexity alone, etc… There’s many reason mid-top tier pvp players are just better fundamentally than WvW players will ever be.

Who cares?

At least 95% of players will never experience playing against a top tier PvP player, so they essentially do not exist as a part of the game and therefore their skills are completely irrelevant.

Then you can never say your build is truly viable. This is why ranger doesn’t exist in top tier. But you can ignore good players and keep fighting wvw players and then say your build is good when it truly isn’t against actually good players, doesn’t matter to me.

That is like saying that my 150cc Kart is not viable in Formula 1 or that because I’m only winning races in state events, that I’m ignoring Michael Schumacher. They are totally different game modes.

Since no top PvPers ever come to WvW and a vast majority of people cannot possibly spend the amount of time they do training etc, there is no reason to ever even make the comparison. Like I said, they essentially do not exist in the game. You will never see one while roaming in WvW, so if you win every fight you come across? Fine. Are you Michael Schumacher? No, you have a life outside the game.

Nobody cares what top tier PvP players do.

Sure, that’s fine but then you can’t say your power build is viable (back to stage 1 of this pointless online debate)

Perfectly viable for everything except top tier PvP,. which is irrelevant, so therefore viable for all game modes it is used in. That is to say, completely viable. This is the case with 95% of the builds in the game, if PvP was the measure of viability, there would only be a dozen builds played game wide. Since the requirements for that game mode are completely different, many more builds are viable for the other modes.

Ranger is balanced the way it is entirely FROM pvp. So your class is being represented and tweaked based on that ‘5%’ (again, much more than that but I’ll go with your mathematics on it) that you speak of so you might want to re-think how you look at ‘95% of the game’.

Look at spirits, they are the way they are because they were being used within that ‘5%’ (again , going from your mathematics of course) that you speak of and then got nerfed, same with BM.. Whether you think it or not , this class is balanced from PvP not WvW, this is why those trait preview change videos were done in heart of the mists, not edge of the mists. So when you talk about PvP vs WvW and viability of builds in general, your builds are literally the way they are as a result of balancing for competitive PvP, again that “5%” that you’re speaking of.

Anyway, I’m stopping this silly argument because it’s getting no where really.

blitzkrieg.2451:

Ranger is balanced the way it is entirely FROM pvp. So your class is being represented and tweaked based on that ‘5%’ (again, much more than that but I’ll go with your mathematics on it) that you speak of so you might want to re-think how you look at ‘95% of the game’.

Look at spirits, they are the way they are because they were being used within that ‘5%’ (again , going from your mathematics of course) that you speak of and then got nerfed, same with BM.. Whether you think it or not , this class is balanced from PvP not WvW, this is why those trait preview change videos were done in heart of the mists, not edge of the mists. So when you talk about PvP vs WvW and viability of builds in general, your builds are literally the way they are as a result of balancing for competitive PvP, again that “5%” that you’re speaking of.

Anyway, I’m stopping this silly argument because it’s getting no where really.

I only picked 95% because you used it in your post when you said

Nobody said top tier players were gods, but they’re better than 95% of the players in WvW.

I get that the game is balanced around PvP as that is supposed to be the mode with a level playing field, but do you really think it is? Imo, that would be an utter failure if being on equal footing was a requirement to call GW2 PvP a success. The fact that Ranger has no real viable builds for top tier PvP is evidence of this, yet they are perfectly fine for WvW roaming where the requirements for skill and playstyle are completely different.

That does not diminish the fact that if a build is viable in WvW, it is a viable build. I was only asserting that after you made out that a build that only works in WvW is non-viable if it also does not work in PvP. The two modes are mutually exclusive. Not a silly argument, per se.

Back in the day i’d say most of the skilled players were wvw roamers. Roaming is filled with these stupid 1 shot builds or condi mesmers so many people are turned off to roaming these days. Are people more skilled in pvp? I don’t think so. Are more people looking for skilled play in pvp? I’d say yes.

That myth is still active I see, that pvp players are better than wvw roamers. They are way better in one thing, that is win pvp matches, that does not make them better against any good wvw roamer.
Also i watched Potatoveg on stream this weekend and I thought he handled himself more than fine. Nice build he has.

aspirine.6852:

That myth is still active I see, that pvp players are better than wvw roamers. They are way better in one thing, that is win pvp matches, that does not make them better against any good wvw roamer.
Also i watched Potatoveg on stream this weekend and I thought he handled himself more than fine. Nice build he has.

Welcome to the digital age of kitten envy….

Basically a few people are debating about what ‘roaming’ means and how it is this on this server and that on that server then it is something totally different in this format of play compared to that. Whatever really but what we do know is that sPvP is confined to a map of set size with objectives and stat constraints. On the other hand WvW is not and allows PvE stat creep along with upscale play. While stats or ascended creep can assist in ones play it does not make or break a fight. But again, see my opening statement and you will see my view on it. All it brings to the table is more kitten waving…

To say either format of player is better is just sheer ignorance.

Crapgame.6519:

aspirine.6852:

That myth is still active I see, that pvp players are better than wvw roamers. They are way better in one thing, that is win pvp matches, that does not make them better against any good wvw roamer.
Also i watched Potatoveg on stream this weekend and I thought he handled himself more than fine. Nice build he has.

Welcome to the digital age of kitten envy….

Basically a few people are debating about what ‘roaming’ means and how it is this on this server and that on that server then it is something totally different in this format of play compared to that. Whatever really but what we do know is that sPvP is confined to a map of set size with objectives and stat constraints. On the other hand WvW is not and allows PvE stat creep along with upscale play. While stats or ascended creep can assist in ones play it does not make or break a fight. But again, see my opening statement and you will see my view on it. All it brings to the table is more kitten waving…

To say either format of player is better is just sheer ignorance.

Yes, ascended stats and individual armor gear and runes not available in pvp that are available in wvw and food makes or breaks a fight easily or else those very pieces of gear and runes and sigils wouldn’t cost so much (generosity being 140g+ isn’t because of pve, it’s for wvw). +40% or -40% food ALONE changes the tide of a fight, especially when you’re talking about warriors.

I’m not saying wvw players are stupid, it’s just most are reliant on the stats before the skill. When you win in a fight wvw it’s usually a case of having an OP build due to the above things I mentioned as opposed to raw player skill like you have in PvP without those things.

aspirine.6852:

That myth is still active I see, that pvp players are better than wvw roamers. They are way better in one thing, that is win pvp matches, that does not make them better against any good wvw roamer.
Also i watched Potatoveg on stream this weekend and I thought he handled himself more than fine. Nice build he has.

Actually, I watched it as well and he was getting wrecked by necros, thieves, mesmers all 1on1 on node and he brought no team support at all. Understandably, mesmers are broken and thieves can just blind spam you and necros have so much LF uptime it’s gotten ridiculous too. He was doing good in team fights but that’s literally because the other team didn’t bother to focus him at all which is just dumb as he didn’t have signet of stone and would have been such an easy kill to focus – one backstab would force a disengage on him and put him out of the fight but they didn’t because he was playing against low MMR players and they were focusing bunker guardians/warriors instead of him and allowed him to just wreck fights – a good team would focus him, kill him and make him a target to ressurect so they could cleave the team as they do it.

He did well though for what the build allows , but the build doesn’t allow much really. Offhand axe is terrible , the pathing on path of scars needs to work alot better , I can simply sidestep the return of axe 4 and do it 75% of the time anyway just by adjusting position constantly in a fight so i dont even need to dodge it. It’s just a silly weapon , the retaliation is a joke on it too , needs to grant protection and retaliation OR make it where you can use it while moving (like they ended up doing with engineer’s shield reflect skill, they use to be standing still for that one).

Props to potatoveg man, just good mesmers , thieves and cele necros and good d/d eles will wreck that build no matter skill level you are with this build.

He did have GS and was able to assist in decapping points but that was about it, and those weren’t even mid to top tier players, they were low tier pug randoms in a low MMR.