Guild Wars 2

Ok, this happens to me everyday in PvP and it’s stupid. The point of the RANGER is to be good using ranged attacks. Better than everyone else. So why is it that a warrior, someone who is supposed to excel in melee and nothing else, can easily destroy ranger in pvp using RANGED weapons? If the rangers main weapon is better used by a nonranger, I might as well not play ranger. Every now and then you can kill a warrior as a ranger (if literally all of their cooldowns are up), but if they know anything about themselves it’ll take all of 5 seconds to down you. And then Anet went ahead and changed the attack speed of the shortbow’s autoattack by ‘0.04’ seconds.

With how squishy rangers are, the only thing we have going for us is the distance between us and them, and how much damage we can do before they reach us. When that warrior pulls out a rifle or a longbow, consider thyself dead.

/discuss

moderator edit: this post has been edited to remove a violation of the forum code of conduct.

Take solace in the fact that direct damage is the only thing warriors can actually do right. DPS aside they’re a complacently useless class. Still, you raise a vary good point, one that i hope will be addressed.

No class in this game is limited to melee or ranged. Warrior or any class for that matter is NOT supposed to excel in any particular range except the one you enjoy most.

Where does it say that a ranger has to be better at ranged attacks than other classes? I see the ranger more as a beastmaster, combining pet damage with whatever weapon you have.
The word “ranger” in fantasy universe is simply a wanderer. It doesn’t mean ranged specialist, like a lot of people think.

Btw if you loose to a rifle warrior, you’re not dodging the right attacks. In bow-ranger vs. rifle-warrior, the ranger has the clear advantage, since he can always dodge the only two noteworthy damage skills: Flurry and kill shot. While constantly dishing out sustained damage, the ranger should win that 1 on 1 match-up without much effort.

Here https://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/professions/ranger/
Developers told about it themselves. What many people do not get tired to link.
“Rangers rely on a keen eye, a steady hand, and the power of nature itself. Unparalleled archers, rangers are capable of bringing down foes from a distance with their bows.With traps, nature spirits, and a stable of loyal pets at their command, rangers can adapt to any situation.”

The fact that the developers have said that rangers are such but they are NOT, literally mean that rangers are overnerfed.

An archer uses bow and arrow, not a rifle. Just because it sais that they can bring foes down from a distance, it doesn’t mean that it’s the only thing they can do.

Still, compared to the other professions, I still think that they are the best ranged class. I would much rather have a ranger in my group than a ranged warrior. A rifle/bow warrior brings squat to the table besides damage. And since this isn’t WoW, I can’t use that guy for anything. Banners have horrible range and they have nothing noteworthy in utility. Where a ranger can bring spirits (especially nature and stone are great) and a good number of snares.
Plus barrage is, arguably, one of the best WvWvW abilities in the game.

After the words “best ranged class” there is no more reason to read.
1)- Spirits and flags are incomparable. Banners have a permanent(!) buff, and spirits have only CHANSE to buff, banners invulnerable, and spirits (even with trait up) die with 2 hits. Ow.. and they have same range. To do so that they will went for a ranger, you must be deep in the natural magic, and then you will have zero damage. Many traps and spirits? Two traps and one spirit. Or two spirits and one trap.
2) In terms of the trap thief is 100 times better than ranger. Plus has 3 times more damage. 3) Want a good support with a ranged damage? This is anyone but not ranger. Elementalist. Engineer. Guardian. Necromancer. Mesmer. Not ranger. And yes, all these classes have more ranged damage and more damage and survival in close combat.

By the way, necromancer has much more a good ability than barrage on scepter.

Who is ranger after that? useless crap.

the fact that warriors can outdps most of the other classes melee or ranged while still keeping a good mitigation and a good self healing has really nothing to do with the common misconception about Rangers and the meaning of their name.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/ranger
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/ranger

MrNobody.4357:

the fact that warriors can outdps most of the other classes melee or ranged while still keeping a good mitigation and a good self healing has really nothing to do with the common misconception about Rangers and the meaning of their name.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/ranger
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/ranger

I don’t think you can keep bringing this agrument up and maintain any self respect after MeGaZlo points out a couple of posts above that the devs envision “ranger” to mean:

“Rangers rely on a keen eye, a steady hand, and the power of nature itself. Unparalleled archers, rangers are capable of bringing down foes from a distance with their bows.With traps, nature spirits, and a stable of loyal pets at their command, rangers can adapt to any situation.”

then rename your favourite class to “Archers” and win to the devs, i do not care, but rangers are the ones who do ranges, not the one who dps at range.

MrNobody

then rename your favourite class to “Archers” and win to the devs, i do not care, but rangers are the ones who do ranges, not the one who dps at range.

What does “do ranges” mean, especially in the context of game mechanics?

You’re also entirely side-stepping the fact that we do worse damage whether at range or melee than the Warrior while having less survivability and less reliable utility.

MrNobody.4357:

then rename your favourite class to “Archers” and win to the devs, i do not care, but rangers are the ones who do ranges, not the one who dps at range.

The devs can call them whatever they want. It could be “beastmaster” but if the game describes them as:

“Beastmasters rely on a keen eye, a steady hand, and the power of nature itself. Unparalleled archers, Beastmasters are capable of bringing down foes from a distance with their bows.With traps, nature spirits, and a stable of loyal pets at their command, Beastmasters can adapt to any situation.”

Then it is irrelevant what the dictionary “definition” of beastmaster is, you expect a “beastmaster” to have the attributes identified in the games’ description.

I am not convinced that warrior is a better ranged class than the ranger, but people do have a point that they should be given the devs themselves say that rangers are “unparalled archers”.

no you see ranger is fine.

Yes they like to avoid melee and have a taste ranged weapons, because they are not fighters, but rather scouts, explorers, survivalist.
Therefore aside bows, to avoid melee they use many other tricks, like traps, deep knowledge of wilderness, and rely on animal companions being on their ranges mostly alone.

Only with all this arsenal he might be unrivalled at range, but not only with a bow like you understand the matter.
That would be a marksman, an archer, a crossbowman….. but none of these would have an animal companion, would use traps or be in touch with wild spirits or have the least insight of the properties of the herbs.

And also a marksman, archer or whatever would be tottaly kittened once he would miss the range between him and his target, but we are lucky and we have Rangers, who can deal with that too.

There is so much stupid in this thread is unbeleivable

Warriors are the best bar none for combo finishers. Banners are some of the best support in the game. Warriors can do much more then just dps and if you would rather bring a Ranger then a Warrior then you know nothing about either class.

It does not matter where the word Ranger originated from or means, Rangers have the worst ranged in the game now, even Guardians are better then them at range, and all the melee weapons are crap too. In this game everybody is supposed to be able to fight at Ranged and Melee, Ranger can do neither.

Think about this, Engineers can put out more AoE dps at the same range as us then we can on a single target, how does that make sense to any of you? They also have much better cc and support at any range too.

Levetty.1279:

There is so much stupid in this thread is unbeleivable

Warriors are the best bar none for combo finishers. Banners are some of the best support in the game. Warriors can do much more then just dps and if you would rather bring a Ranger then a Warrior then you know nothing about either class.

It does not matter where the word Ranger originated from or means, Rangers have the worst ranged in the game now, even Guardians are better then them at range, and all the melee weapons are crap too. In this game everybody is supposed to be able to fight at Ranged and Melee, Ranger can do neither.

Think about this, Engineers can put out more AoE dps at the same range as us then we can on a single target, how does that make sense to any of you? They also have much better cc and support at any range too.

lol that was my concern too, but they kept minding the range thinghy :/

MrNobody.4357:

the fact that warriors can outdps most of the other classes melee or ranged while still keeping a good mitigation and a good self healing has really nothing to do …

@Levitty
B/c that Engineer AoE dps is slow as molasses to get there and puts a big ole red ring on the ground letting our targets know to gtfo. It’s the price we pay for excellent AoE dps.

Consider this: Mesmers can do better ranged damage with a greatsword.

/trollface

Banjax.6573:

@Levitty
B/c that Engineer AoE dps is slow as molasses to get there and puts a big ole red ring on the ground letting our targets know to gtfo. It’s the price we pay for excellent AoE dps.

Granades spam is in no way slow, especially compared to longbow. It also gets to where they were thrown at faster and longbow can be avoided be just general movement.

What is your point?

The logic of gamers hilariously defies logic. Some of these comments would defend re-designing the Necromancer class as a greatsword melee class with no pets and no poison/disease by claiming that, “Necro just refers to death, and you’re killing mobs, what’s the problem!?”

Levetty.1279:

Banjax.6573:

@Levitty
B/c that Engineer AoE dps is slow as molasses to get there and puts a big ole red ring on the ground letting our targets know to gtfo. It’s the price we pay for excellent AoE dps.

Granades spam is in no way slow, especially compared to longbow. It also gets to where they were thrown at faster and longbow can be avoided be just general movement.

What is your point?

At max range, it feels pretty slow to me. It’s certainly plenty of time for the enemy move out of the ring (which most do). On walls though it’s great, you can keep a constant barrage up and keep people off walls easy enough.

My point?

Back to your other post saying it didn’t make sense that Engi’s had better AoE dps than your single target dps. I was simply pointing out the con’s attached to that AoE dps which people often overlook.

Aiishe.3240:

The point of the RANGER is to be good using ranged attacks.

Disagree.

I really wish they would not have chosen the name Ranger for this class.

Banjax.6573

At max range, it feels pretty slow to me. It’s certainly plenty of time for the enemy move out of the ring (which most do). On walls though it’s great, you can keep a constant barrage up and keep people off walls easy enough.
My point?
Back to your other post saying it didn’t make sense that Engi’s had better AoE dps than your single target dps. I was simply pointing out the con’s attached to that AoE dps which people often overlook.

But those cons apply even more so to the Longbow…

capnflummox.3082:

Aiishe.3240:

The point of the RANGER is to be good using ranged attacks.

Disagree.

I really wish they would not have chosen the name Ranger for this class.

Pathfinder, Skirmisher, Scout, Warden, Forester…

That was easy, someone hire me!

So here’s my viewpoint (WvW disc):
I don’t think rangers were EVER meant to be top of range DPS. Sorry, but there is just no correlation between typical range-nuke archers in other MMO’s and rangers in GW2. The ranger is not Legolas, was never meant to be Legolas, will never be Legolas. Instead, we get the vastly inferior Aragorn prototype
So it doesn’t bother me that warrior, engineer, or whatever can do more range damage than us. What does bother me is that the key to our class is supposed to be versatility, and we don’t seem to be effective at anything except for shooting up at and down from walls in gate combat.
I think adding more CC would be a great way to go with the class. We already have some with sword (please, fix the rooting bug!), however axe, GS, and LB could all use a lot of work. That way, who cares if we do less damage than warrior rifle spec if we can snare, cripple, and poison or way to a kill?

For those who say that would be too much like Necro, big deal… There is by necessity a lot of overlap between professions given how flexible each one is, and since ANet seems to believe that philosophically aesthetics matter as much as function, have 2 functionally similar profs or at least overlapping builds for those profs that look completely different seems a pretty valid way to go.

to the OP – take some break stun abilities (signet/lit reflex) and it’s easy to kite a warrior.

“I think adding more CC would be a great way to go with the class. We already have some with sword (please, fix the rooting bug!), however axe, GS, and LB could all use a lot of work. That way, who cares if we do less damage than warrior rifle spec if we can snare, cripple, and poison or way to a kill?”

What? Axe has a chill, GS has a stun, LB has a cripple and a knockback, SB has an evade back, a stun, and snare.

You should also be running wolf-type pets – they have amazing CC.

moderator edit: This post has been edited to remove a violation of the forum code of conduct.

docMed.7692:

“I think adding more CC would be a great way to go with the class. We already have some with sword (please, fix the rooting bug!), however axe, GS, and LB could all use a lot of work. That way, who cares if we do less damage than warrior rifle spec if we can snare, cripple, and poison or way to a kill?”

What? Axe has a chill, GS has a stun, LB has a cripple and a knockback, SB has an evade back, a stun, and snare.

You should also be running wolf-type pets – they have amazing CC.

I did not say that we did not have any cc, I said that the cc for those weapons could be improved.
My main point was that folks should not expect for ranger to be top-tier dps ranged, that was never the focus of the class.

Why the hate? LTP is such a tiresome, uninformative response…

I’m not a fan of uninformed posts – and my post actually explains my reasoning & insults your uninformed claims. I simply do not like comments from individuals that frankly have no idea what they’re talking about.

“…if we can snare, cripple, and poison or way to a kill” – This post alone implies you are saying we can’t snare, cripple, etc, which obviously the weapons I listed alone allow you to do that and more.

It is hardly an uninformative response of simply “L2P”.

First of all a Ranger is not a master of range just because it has ‘range’ in its name. Maybe if our class was called Archer you could argue that.

I will admit warriors are like more resilient, harder hitting, rangers without an annoying NPC pet weighing them down but I feel like rangers are complaining about shortbows too much. Every time a damage build comes up, shortbow is the only real option. So the vast majority of rangers take advantage of shortbow and when ANet nerfs it, everyone freaks out.

I agree ranger weapons are kitten for the most part, but shortbow was by far the best and everyone bandwagonned over to shortbow. We should be pressing them to buff the kitteny weapons not crying when they nerf the only strong one.

MeGaZlo.9516:

After the words “best ranged class” there is no more reason to read.
1)- Spirits and flags are incomparable. Banners have a permanent(!) buff, and spirits have only CHANSE to buff, banners invulnerable, and spirits (even with trait up) die with 2 hits. Ow.. and they have same range. To do so that they will went for a ranger, you must be deep in the natural magic, and then you will have zero damage. Many traps and spirits? Two traps and one spirit. Or two spirits and one trap.
2) In terms of the trap thief is 100 times better than ranger. Plus has 3 times more damage. 3) Want a good support with a ranged damage? This is anyone but not ranger. Elementalist. Engineer. Guardian. Necromancer. Mesmer. Not ranger. And yes, all these classes have more ranged damage and more damage and survival in close combat.

By the way, necromancer has much more a good ability than barrage on scepter.

Who is ranger after that? useless crap.

2 spirits and 2 traps. Nature spirit + stone spirit. If you’re using “rampage as one” as your elite skill in dungeons, then you’ve got your priorities wrong. Frost trap and spike trap both have low cooldowns and crippling is a really good way to start a fight and control mobs.
Now look at what banners actually do. At max level: 90 toughness and 90 vitality. You can barely feel that. Stone spirit offers protection which is the best defensive boon in the game. If you place them out of harms way, your spirits won’t die. Mine barely ever do.
And stop thinking about damage. This isn’t WoW. There are things that are more important than damage in this game.
If you think that your ranger is so much worse, why don’t you just choose any of the classes you just listed? The grass isn’t always greener on the other side.

moderator edit: This post has been edited to remove a violation of the forum code of conduct.

Our spirits only proc once every three seconds to a single individual within range.

There are a few things rangers need to understand. I mean… REALLY understand.

1.) Warriors have nigh zero utility. My Rifle/Bow Warrior can absolutely roll face if he’s left alone. Keyword… IF. Crit build, full signets, adrenaline junky… I drop AoEs and Sniper shots as soon as they’re off cooldown. It’s a sight to behold. However if anyone takes interest in me I’m boned.

I can’t escape, I have no utilities, one KB and Root is what stands between me and getting face planted. If I’m ignored I can do some damage. If I’m not I’m basically a free kill.

2.) Traps can completely change the outcome of a fight. Especially large scale ones. That gargantuan point blank KB rangers have is pivotal. Your pets are a godsend vs. Mesmers. You have the longest range in the game. Your DPS is no where near as bad—as some of you claim. Full crit specd Sniper shot lands for 6k on a golem. Same gear with comparable spec on a ranger with #2 is 5k and you get s post ton of utility options in tow.

Rangers can completely change the tide of a battle but the problem is you’re too busy trying to be a warrior instead of a Ranger. FYI, I deleted my Warrior last night and immediately made a Ranger and am loving the switch. So much so that I stayed up until 3 am 2 nights in a row PvPing.

If you think Ranged warrior is so great, go roll one and see for yourself.

Chipster, I want what you are smoking. A good rifle warrior vs a good bow ranger of any kind isnt at a disadvantage at all. If you ever played a rifle warrior you would see, think of a mix of LB and SB and then you get rifle. Except rifle packs more burst, and can stack bleeds better, I literally keep 10 stacks of bleeds up as a power/crit rifle warrior just from critting, yes, you can dodge volley and kill show but they have a 10 sec cd, and its hard to dodge it if frenzy is going.

Ive stomped many good rangers 1v1 because I hit much harder, Ive stomped pretty much all longbow rangers because longbow blows atm. Sometimes shortbow gets the better of me but usually that fight ends with both of us being downed and Ill always win downsy wars.