Guild Wars 2

Hi,

I have a necro and ranger as two classes I enjoy the most and want insight on what Ranger brings to WvW?

This is a link to a necro WvW video and I can instantly see Necro brings some really cool stuff, but not sure what Ranger brings?

lol, we don’t have anything amazing aoe like necros….

I actually was zerging on my Ranger earlier this morning…I was using the clerics armor… but this is how bad it was..

I’d basically pop my heal and rampage as one and just run in swinging my great sword number 1 key..

like nothing else…required like zero skill..

Then again nothing was better then yesterday while playing, I managed to build a Superior Ballista and AR zerg came rolling up, to fight our zerg, I hit their entire zerg with it…I never seen so many bags in my life.

It’s IMO like this with ranger in wvw, the more people are involved (both sides) the less usefull we become. On the other hand, small-scale battles and solo is fine.

ranger are good badge farmers =)

gotta catch them all!

Grayback.7148:

It’s IMO like this with ranger in wvw, the more people are involved (both sides) the less usefull we become. On the other hand, small-scale battles and solo is fine.

Where did this notion originate?

Chopps.5047:

Grayback.7148:

It’s IMO like this with ranger in wvw, the more people are involved (both sides) the less usefull we become. On the other hand, small-scale battles and solo is fine.

Where did this notion originate?

Which of my two statements do you mean?

Anyway, It’s my experience until now, because of the following things:
- pets are more likely to be dead the bigger the fight is
- we do have limited aoe attacks, so it’s really ok in smaller fights, but if the battle grows we’re getting outshined more and more at this point
- sharing boons with the crowd isn’t one of our strenghts either

I’d really like to be proven otherwise, but I think that our strenght is more shining in small-scale or 1vsX fights.

Additionally, I suck at zerging :P

@Grayback – when zerging ranger could have a problems if they’ll make frontall atack with all the guardians and warriors that are inteded to do just it.
and that’s Why they should now make frontal charge but with some other classes with similar issue flank (or even atack from rear) enemy zerg and make massive destruction on suprised enemy
Front of charging zerg is killing zone where all the AoE goes… even with You as a ranger have 3k armor (as me) It’s suicide to follow all those heavy plated guys into the moddle of this….
but when flanking and making destruction on the very flank of enemy where enemy isn’t so “compressed” I make it as ranger in zerg fighting very well (once when defending garri we have a situation where commander ordered to charge and push back enemies for the gate.
as many I followed.
We killed some guys – i killed at least four of them (and looted in the meanwhile :P)
Commander died, all the ppl following them died
I made it safely back to the gate and into the gari.

i run a hybrid beast master build. in WvW i’ve found that i’m very good at solo or duoing camps.

also quaggen island is a pretty important target that the ranger is capable of soloing.

grayback is correct when he says that rangers really shine in small man groups. if you are going to be roaming i would almost always prefer to have my roaming buddy be a ranger.

yak slapping is pretty easy on a ranger as well, you can set your pet to attack, while keeping watch for ganks from a distance, a little bit of short bow support and you can drop a yak as fast as a warrior. the difference is that unlike face tanking the yak like a warrior or thief does you can remain a little more aloof and avoid getting ganked if its protected. or you can set your pet to distract the guards and kill the yak yourself.

Maybe it’s not big thing, but ranger has some nice possibilities with traited LB range:
- can hit inner cannon on garri watergate when team is raming outer WG (this cannon can hit rams).
- can nicely clear siege from top of lake tower – enemies often place it out of range of “normal” ranged attacks, forgetting that LB ranger can hit 2000+ range from above.
- barrage has good radious and with traited range it can sometimes be used to clear siege in places other classes have problems or need lots of positioning.

I often run in organized zergs, so sooner or later I have to charge enemies in melee train. Ranger isn’t as sueful as guardians there, coz it doesn’t provide buffs or blast finishers, but it isn’t that bad – GS build-in evade works great with all kitten flying around in middle of enemy zerg.
Also, we have Healing Spring. Its weakness is that it’s our heal skill, so sometimes we have it on CD when we’d like to pop it for others to blast. On the other hand, even if we use it in middle of combat, when ppl aren’t ready to blast, it lasts 15 sec, so someone will use it anyway. It also removes condi every 3 sec (first one on use), so it’s good even if used “randomly”.
Entagle, spike trap and muddy terrain are useful too. Usual way to stop zerg are Lines of Warding, but good enemies use stability for it. Adding immobilize forces them to use condi removal, leaving them easier target for necro condi bombers.

I think main thing that makes ranger feel “meh” in meta WvW is our lack of good team support and that our 4-legged (or 8 ) class mechanic dies too fast there.

I’m still thinking ppl underestimate projectile finishers. They aren’t game changers like blasts, but they still give some edge that ppl usually don’t notice.

TW trolling the ranger forums again. Please stop. We all know that rangers don’t have a place in your guilds meta strategies. Why bring a ranger when an ele/guardian/warrior/nerco can do it better. :’(

AydenStar.4216:

TW trolling the ranger forums again. Please stop. We all know that rangers don’t have a place in your guilds meta strategies. Why bring a ranger when an ele/guardian/warrior/nerco can do it better. :’(

who/what is that TW?
and what You are talking about?
PS. in 1v1 with my ranger those “ele/guardian/warrior/necro” is dying… (unless necro is minion master…)
my guild’s “guid meta strategy” have wery good place for rangers….
(maybe because leader’s main is ranger)

Lord Trejgon.2809:

AydenStar.4216:

TW trolling the ranger forums again. Please stop. We all know that rangers don’t have a place in your guilds meta strategies. Why bring a ranger when an ele/guardian/warrior/nerco can do it better. :’(

who/what is that TW?
and what You are talking about?
PS. in 1v1 with my ranger those “ele/guardian/warrior/necro” is dying… (unless necro is minion master…)
my guild’s “guid meta strategy” have wery good place for rangers….
(maybe because leader’s main is ranger)

What I am talking about is in large group (zerging) in WvW. This has nothing to do with 1v1 because in that regard, rangers do very well. What I am talking about is rangers place in a 25+ group fighting groups of equal size.

ATM, all zerg groups are made up with are Warrior/Guardian hammer train and DPS/CC/Fields from nercos and elementalist. Mesmer are only useful for veil and portals when needed. The mediums armor class (thieves/rangers/engineers) have no place in a lot of guilds zerging strategy because:

A. they are mainly too squishy to stay with the front line (except the ranger IMHO) and don’t provide much in the back line either.

B. The synergy that comes out of the Warrior/Guardian/Elementalist/Necromancers is easy for commander to use when it comes to fields, blast finishers and CC.

C. Most commanders don’t see any benefits to bring (Ranger/Thieves/Engineer) and become the scapegoat when things are going bad for a group.

My opinion: Rangers are one the best bunker professions in the game. If spec and played right the ranger can stay with the front line and provide fire (bonfire)/water (healing spring) fields when needed. and CC from muddy terrian and entangle. It would take me hours of explaining the benefits a ranger can bring to a zerg but its not loot bag machine like nercos or guardians.

I find that spamming the number 1 Great sword button is also nice cause of the evades..

But you’re not going to see a Ranger in an organized Guild Zerg because those classes listed Warrior/guardian/Elementalist/Necro are better that sort of thing.

I watched a bunch of Guild vs Guild duels (by the way, the whole 25vs25 thing is about the most unskillful thing i’ve seen in an MMO to date….it needs to go the way of the dodo bird….Group vs Group is far far better to watch and requires far far more skill) and honestly it was just silly….It was nothing but those Classes Listed.. and people running spamming buttons…

For general zerging though, either grab a longbow, or slap on some clerics gear and a greatsword and dive head first in the zerg

@ OP:
I’ll bite at this post…

In zerg warfare, players need to take the ‘Range’ out of the Ranger and think of themselves as an evasive melee range class with limited long range options. Most of the ranger’s damage mitigation comes from the protection buff from Companion’s Defense, the evasion from the Greatsword 1 skill and block from GS 4 skill. Specing into Signets of the Beastmaster and use Signet of Stone (6 sec damage immunity) and Signet of the Wild (Stability) as defensive cool downs allow the ranger to stay in the front line with the hammer train when needed. That is why I made a Muddy Terrian/Entangle build for Ranger zerging: 30/0/20/20/0 (http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/ranger/?6.0|1.1c.hy|7.1c.h6.f.1c.hy|1c.b1h.1c.b1h.1c.71h.1c.71h.1c.71g.1c.71g|1c.68.1c.68.1c.68.1c.68.1c.68.1c.68|u14b.0.k17.k63.0|0.0|4i.4x.4p.4r.54|e) . It’s not a loot bag machine build but it provides the support skills needed to help the zerg out as a whole and with full P/V/T (Soldier/Invaders) or a mix of P/V/T or Clerics gear, the ranger is hard to kill in general.

Sometimes I take 5 points out of Nature’s Magic and put them in Beast Mastery for Zephyr’s Speed if I am roaming and/or using the longbow. Also, I switch my gear around (30/0/20/15/5) (http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/ranger/?6.0|1.1g.hy|3.1g.h2|1n.a7.1n.a7.1n.a7.1n.a7.1n.a7.1n.a7|1p.61.2v.e14.3t.e16.1p.61.1g.67.1c.67|u14b.0.k1a.f6.5|0.0|4i.4x.4p.4r.54|e) so I can switch from zerging to roaming/small teams without having to respec (but that is my playstyle) but if I was in a zerg fighting 2 other large zergs, I would switch the gear setup to P/V/T or P/V/T and Clerics so I can increase my survivability.

Also, I play a hybrid Condition (Rabid) & P/V/T Trap spec as well: 0/30/20/20/0 (http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/ranger/?6.0|7.1h.hy.f.1h.h1k|1.1c.hy|1b.719.1b.719.1b.719.1b.719.1b.719.1b.719|1c.67.1c.67.1c.67.1c.67.1c.67.1c.67|0.u28b.k17.k65.0|0.0|4i.52.51.53.54|e). This spec has a different style because of the lack of stability and damage immunity but it’s great to finish off fallen enemies, Combo fields (Bonfire, Frost Trap, and Healing Spring), CC (Spike/Frost Trap) and front line DPS. This spec is a better loot bag machine but the ranger loses a bit of survivability. With this spec, Entangle becomes harder to use because there is no stability to get the ranger into those nice pockets of stacked players to use it on but if the ranger has a shout guardian with them providing that needed stability from “Stand your Ground” wow the havoc you can cause to the enemy’s backline

Pets:
In a zerg they are almost useless. I run Wolf and Drakehound for their CCs but I keep them on passive all the time unless I am roaming or in small teams. I use the pets more for Zephyr’s Speed when I need faster Barrages, rapid fire and finishing off downed players.

In conclusion, rangers are good in the zerg but its just harder to play because of the synergy the 4 classes I mention above have with less rewards when it comes to loot bags and WXP. For many players, this play style might not be fun but it provides the support that a large group can work with. When the zerging meta starts to change, I think commander will start to see the uses of the 3 medium armor classes for they do provide tools needed in any zerg but their skills just don’t synergy well with the current meta ATM.

The current zerg meta requires good aoes, boon sharing, and offense ability that can show during following commander pin and huge skill lags(aka #1 skill ftw). The only weapon that ranger suit in is great sword, longbow is kinda good compare to other ranger weapons when defending, but when it comes to stay close to pin and attack with a group constantly moving, longbow dont really do that much, shortbow with piercing arrow is better and actually works great if not count the lag factor; with the lag factor the attack rate on shortbow just terrible so it leads to super low damage output so great sword is still better choice. If power build with signet of stone/wild and protect me with bear, ranger do have good ability to stay in a zerg fight, but warrior and guardian still have better front line ability than rangers do, dont even have to mention rangers’ little to none boon share ability in a zerg fight. Compare to top4 zerg combat classes(guard war necro ele)(and mesmers as fifth which can provide mess invisibility, teleport and tricky cc skills but mesmers are not required in large numbers so I put it on fifth) ranger dont really have anything that outshine them.

Castaliea.3156:

- Rangers are also a great group addition and boast one of the best water fields in the game which can be traited to also pulse vigor. Apart from that their weapon skills as well as their utilities really drop the ball when it comes to larger group play and many traits are useless. Traps are helpful but take up valuable utility slots and are much less useful if not traited for while still not being spam-able enough to make up for sub-par weapon and pet abilities even while traited. Some pets have very useful buffs and support skills for the group which is often overlooked. Ranger is good in groups, but in moderation.

AydenStar.4216:

Lord Trejgon.2809:

AydenStar.4216:

TW trolling the ranger forums again. Please stop. We all know that rangers don’t have a place in your guilds meta strategies. Why bring a ranger when an ele/guardian/warrior/nerco can do it better. :’(

who/what is that TW?
and what You are talking about?
PS. in 1v1 with my ranger those “ele/guardian/warrior/necro” is dying… (unless necro is minion master…)
my guild’s “guid meta strategy” have very good place for rangers….
(maybe because leader’s main is ranger)

What I am talking about is in large group (zerging) in WvW. This has nothing to do with 1v1 because in that regard, rangers do very well. What I am talking about is rangers place in a 25+ group fighting groups of equal size.

ATM, all zerg groups are made up with are Warrior/Guardian hammer train and DPS/CC/Fields from nercos and elementalist. Mesmer are only useful for veil and portals when needed. The mediums armor class (thieves/rangers/engineers) have no place in a lot of guilds zerging strategy because:

A. they are mainly too squishy to stay with the front line (except the ranger IMHO) and don’t provide much in the back line either.

B. The synergy that comes out of the Warrior/Guardian/Elementalist/Necromancers is easy for commander to use when it comes to fields, blast finishers and CC.

C. Most commanders don’t see any benefits to bring (Ranger/Thieves/Engineer) and become the scapegoat when things are going bad for a group.

My opinion: Rangers are one the best bunker professions in the game. If spec and played right the ranger can stay with the front line and provide fire (bonfire)/water (healing spring) fields when needed. and CC from muddy terrian and entangle. It would take me hours of explaining the benefits a ranger can bring to a zerg but its not loot bag machine like nercos or guardians.

we one Blacktide starts to organize one big guild and nobody are really nobody cares if I’m a ranger or whatever – last time we are training flanking manuveurs (we are in 25+) and only thing that I took my guardian alt was that I as a ranger feeels bad in zerg (and always ends alone in the sea of enemies) and wanted to finally lvl up a little my buffing machine (which is built to zerg fight but that isn’t topic here) and lastly we are training mostly zerg manuveurs – but I hope that somewhen we will find enough ppl to have strong zerg and have some scouting/skirmishing/diversion groups…

Playing a condition damage / trap build in wvw. So far it’s really enjoyable and seems to help with killing people in blobs. The traps are useful (cripple, condition damage) and help do good damage while still moving away from the AoEs.
As others stated, you also have other ways to cripple or damage foes in a big group, use them ! Don’t try to do massive damage, consider condition damage and AoEs, and also AoE cripple/chill or immobilize. They help a lot with the fight as people get trapped in the damage zones. Also the fact that our heal is a zone heal that removes condition does help as well.
This is my current build:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fMAQNAnfVjEV11xVSWo2BimCNZe2DD5oH5UgK/fyoeSD-jkzA4shoh1ApAA0CQiAUKcQr5wEWwiWJLIV4wqZw0oDRVlC7QKiWNA-w

Another option, which is my old build, is to go heal/support with a prec mix. I had good crit which i needed to not do 0 damage but had really good healing and used spirits a lot. They bring buffs to people around you, you can rez people with the spirit of nature and they have a second effect (if you try spirits, don’t forget to use their effects !!). I changed build because i felt i wasn’t doing enough damage but i was really resilient with this build.
My old build:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fMAQNBHhVakoKxusyrC0OAsKkH7hhFyo7Rpme6F39QD-jUzAYLI0GIeTIjaASbAICQpxioxW3CS1Nal3wqaw0qER1ukioVDA-w

Obviously these aren’t the best around, i’m still learning a lot as i go, but i think to be really useful in wvw, we must step away from the classic view of the ranger and try to bring usefulness more than raw damage…there are other class which are much better fitted for this.
It would work if we could run around in berserker’s gear but believe me, with a ranger it’s not a good idea ^^ i do with my thief and it’s funny to backstab people for 6 or 7k damage but thieves have good ways to get away from heat. Rangers don’t.

So what will Ranger bring after the pet damage nurf?

Cempa.5619:

So what will Ranger bring after the pet damage nurf?

the same thing he brought before, a dead pet.

Raven.9603:

Cempa.5619:

So what will Ranger bring after the pet damage nurf?

the same thing he brought before, a dead pet.

lol

OK good to know!

I’ve found 1,500 range with a projectile that can go well past that to be very helpful. You can hit siege and other players from a distance no other profession can.

Bri.8354:

I’ve found 1,500 range with a projectile that can go well past that to be very helpful. You can hit siege and other players from a distance no other profession can.

Humph, that’s something that Engi do way better with their grenade kit (and on top of that they add combo field)

No they don’t do it better, because they have only 1500 range. Ranger can easily shoot at 1600-1700 and over 2k when he is on higher ground.

Terkov.4138:

No they don’t do it better, because they have only 1500 range. Ranger can easily shoot at 1600-1700 and over 2k when he is on higher ground.

Engineers throw their grenades at 1500. The actual range they can deal damage (throwing range + damage radius) is between 1620 to 1740.

Terkov.4138:

No they don’t do it better, because they have only 1500 range. Ranger can easily shoot at 1600-1700 and over 2k when he is on higher ground.

I’d only agree this was better if we had a more direct UI interface to aim more precisely without needing a target (and maybe even get a generous damage bonus when we DO hit something we didn’t have targeted).

Devs need to think outside the RPG box here if we’re ever going to find a niche here…

Just compare barrage range with clicking 1. when it’s “red” with enemy targetted. You will see you can’t hit him with barrage, yet arrows from 1, 2 and 3 hit easily.

Terkov.4138:

No they don’t do it better, because they have only 1500 range. Ranger can easily shoot at 1600-1700 and over 2k when he is on higher ground.

Most instances of higher ground are when you are in a tower which means you have to sit on the edge because of stupid line of sight mechanics and that means you die because you will get pulled or nuked with 10 aoe’s. Also, the longer flight distance means longer flight time so unless they are standing perfectly still, good luck actually hitting them even if you can shoot out to 2000+.

Rangers have the best water field in the game hands down.

Draygo.9473:

Rangers have the best water field in the game hands down.

Very true. That alone just isn’t a good enough reason to bring one to organized play. Shout guardians, hammer warriors , support eles and few portal mesmers and well+plague necros for the core.Couple of thiefs for scouting and you’re good to go.

Rangers can stay in base and play with their pets. Or maybe tell jokes in ts while there is a quiet moment between battles.

Rengaru.4730:

Terkov.4138:

No they don’t do it better, because they have only 1500 range. Ranger can easily shoot at 1600-1700 and over 2k when he is on higher ground.

Engineers throw their grenades at 1500. The actual range they can deal damage (throwing range + damage radius) is between 1620 to 1740.

problem with engis grenades with range 1500 is same as problem with barrage at this range. all AoE must be in range so even if You will place that AoE from 1500 range and hit target with just the line of AoE – one step to the side – and there are the end of that dmg – also grenades are much slower than arrows

anyway with that later tower argument – ofc You can have line of sight and not be staying at the ledge (no possibility to be pulled down) – the only thing is that enemy cannot be to close to walls (staying 300 – 400 from wall and no problem tih hit him )
pets dmg never wasn’t our good side at zerging (unless pet was well managed and we where melee flanking) so even with “pet dmg nerf” not very much will change to the “archers” rangers in zerg fights – when I was “archering” i had pets whole battle on passive mode and just every F2 cooldown was “F2(wait until casted) – F3 (because if I’ll not make that f3, pet will go fight and surelly die )” and had pet choiced to have buffs on those F2.