Guild Wars 2

What is “bearbow” and why do people hate it?

Also, why do i do such bad dps compared to other classes even though I have full exotic zerker gear and weapons?

Running nothing but bears and longbow (and maybe even shortbow) in dungeons. Not only are you doing kittenty damage, you’re also not supporting your teammates nor receiving support from them.

Sarision.6347:

Running nothing but bears and longbow (and maybe even shortbow) in dungeons. Not only are you doing kittenty damage, you’re also not supporting your teammate nor receiving support from them.

Pretty much this. It’s running something “safe”, not caring about or attempting to boost the effectiveness of the party as a whole. It’d be akin to a warrior only running a rifle and never moving in to melee.

I never understood why bear was so popular. Bow I get, but bear? Honestly if I was going for a pet that wouldn’t die I’d go for the ranged one with heavy armor, i.e. the devourer. Or if I was expecting my pet to tank for me I’d go for the one that could heal, i.e. the moa.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

I never understood why bear was so popular. Bow I get, but bear? Honestly if I was going for a pet that wouldn’t die I’d go for the ranged one with heavy armor, i.e. the devourer. Or if I was expecting my pet to tank for me I’d go for the one that could heal, i.e. the moa.

Some do for appearance. Some do because the bear can take far more hits than a devourer and can deal with conditions better to boot. Some do for the F2 skill.

It a failure to adapt or understand the game’s mechanics. Solo play is different from group play, and landscape play is different from dungeons.

Soloing on the landscape ANY class chugs along just fine even in really crappy builds. The solo bearbow ranger is thus misled into thinking “Hey, I’ve figured this game out. Look at how good I am!” Fluffy the bear tanks, not because it has extra threat or does great damage – it tanks because the game massively prioritizes attacking the target you can reach now rather than the one you can hit in 2-3 seconds if you walk over to it. The ranger is plinking away gloriously unaware that he’s suffering the double whammy of the ranged attack damage coefficient (ranged attacks just plain old do less base DPS than their melee equivalents) AND the -25% to -40% that is the tax for having Fluffy as a class mechanic. A.k.a. his damage is as bad as it can possibly get, and so he rarely pulls things off the bear. The standard vision of the great Hunter+Pet Archetype is upheld and all seems right with the world.

And then they get into a group. The bear’s incredibly bad damage means than an ill tempered melee-Mesmer will pull agro off of it in one rotation, and let’s not even get into the laugh riot that is how fast a warrior seizes aggro from Fluffy.

Here’s one of the dark secrets of tanking – there is no prize for second place. You either have control of the mob or you’re just coincidentally in melee… and probably should be standing behind it to avoid cleaves (yet another thing the pet AI is blissfully oblivious to…).

The bear is WORTHLESS as a tank in most group play, and yet the Ranger, seeing that he’s not pulling agro (double de-buffed by range and class mechanic, remember) thinks Fluffy is doing a great job. And he thinks he’s doing a great job dishing the worst DPS in the game. But by-golly, it sure looks like he’s avoiding damage, dishing steady DPS, and Fluffy is a tank to be admired, all in accordance to the great Hunter+Pet Archetype learned in some other game where threat and face-tanking are the tools of the trade.

I love my Ranger, but even out on the landscape solo, if I can’t pull agro off my pet I’m not doing enough damage. And in a dungeon, you can bet I’m rolling Spotter, I’m dropping springs in close where they reinforce the wounded, and I’m constantly moving to make sure that while my shortbow damage may not be the best there is, I’m leveraging every button on the tool bar and keeping my health solid so I can get in and take a few hits while standing back up any teammate that catches a bad break on a dodge.

This is probably just echoing what others have already said, but, bear is the most common tank choice for beginner rangers, and longbow is the first bow every beginner ranger wants to use.

Because of guild wars 2’s vastly easy open world content, the player never truly gets forced out of this playstyle, so that when it comes time for them to expand their horizons and try WvW or a dungeon, or even some PvP, most bearbow rangers don’t even have a semblance of an ability to dodge key attacks.

More over, it seems they still expect their pet to tank everything, and they still think their bow is doing worthwhile damage from just autoattacking, when in reality, it isn’t, but they think that rapid fire is doing 50k damage, and not the actual 5k damage, because the game never takes the time and says directly to the player “hey, you’re base healthpool is 15k. Do you really think you are doing 50k damage to somebody else and not even scratching them?”

In short, they aren’t the most hated, but out of all the classes, they are the easiest “new” or in less polite terms that people use “bad” player to point out in the game, with dopey the bear at their side and a big old longbow that never gets weapon swapped to a different weapon.

Sarision.6347:

Running nothing but bears and longbow (and maybe even shortbow) in dungeons. Not only are you doing kittenty damage, you’re also not supporting your teammates nor receiving support from them.

In my opinion a shortbow ranger with spotter & frost spirit being near the team is perfectly fine. Just because it has a range of 900 it doesn’t mean you cannot use it near point blank, to give & receive buffs. (if the boss doesn’t require wall-pushed full meleeing that is) Sometimes being in a range of 200 rather than in melee makes all the difference when it comes to dying from random cleaves.
The bear is obviously a problem, but in high level fractals the bear can have some uses. (melee can hide behind it on Old Tom for example) I think currently the best pet a ranger can take is the jungle stalker, it does great dmg (no surprise from a cat) & the extreme might buff is very useful even with the short duration.

What most bearbow rangers don’t understand, that the current meta in explorables is full-meleeing all bosses pushed into corners, or to walls. In that environment you only have 2 options to do decent dmg: point blank flanking shortbow with max bleed stacks at all times(full zerk build still), or short sword. Flanking is something that’s very random, so it comes down to the Sword very quickly. The greatsword dmg is soo ridiculously low that there is no excuse in using it in a decent organized group.

As someone pointed out in a recent sword topic, the sword ranger is one the hardest things to play in pve. You need to predict your dodges, kill your 1 button on your keyboard, dance around a bit with your qe keys, face the fact that if you are not careful you will fall off platforms in almost any situation, the best yet leaps are only working reliably on a level open surface. What else, oh yes the “backflip” dodge on sword 2 doesn’t work when your back is against the wall.

Personally, I use sword/axe in dungeons, though i do switch them out for barrage on my longbow occasionally.

The problem with my sword/axe is that I die pretty fast due to poor armor…

Lilius.9850:

Personally, I use sword/axe in dungeons, though i do switch them out for barrage on my longbow occasionally.

The problem with my sword/axe is that I die pretty fast due to poor armor…

Yeah. All it takes is one missed dodge due to the sticky attack and you’re downed. Why-oh-why does our best weapon have the largest drawback of any weapon in the game?

Lilius.9850:

Personally, I use sword/axe in dungeons, though i do switch them out for barrage on my longbow occasionally.

The problem with my sword/axe is that I die pretty fast due to poor armor…

Imo currently the warhorn is the better option, I too use an axe offhand for some aoe situations though. Bear in mind that the warhorn skill 5 is a blast finisher, so even if we ignore the fairly long fury it provides your team, the utility of having a blast finisher cannot be overlooked. (might stacks, or aoe healing are the main uses) Not to mention the bigest drawback of the axe offhand: when your usual elitist zerk warrior sees a ranger without a warhorn the whining always starts

I feel bad for “bearbows” because I understand the theoretical problem with bears but there shouldn’t be any kittenumptions made on someone using this or that pet.

Ironically, I’ve come to use Sword/Warhorn more with time, but accidentally and with much experimentation, and not by watching any videos or caring about metas-ditto for Spotter and Frost Spirit, which I was using before it was (apparently) meta to bring to a Dungeon. But I still resent that people demand one build just to do things ASAP-I don’t think it is appropriate to complain about “play the way you want” Rangers if you are doing the same by requiring them to play the way “the team” (I.E. YOU) wants, as you are basically not being any less “selfish”, and for players to enjoy their gaming experience as they please is not selfish at the core.

Also, many of these so-called “bearbows” are not (intentionally) trolling anyone. Sure they may ignore certain facts, but it doesn’t mean they are going out of their way to offend speed-runners with a build they hate for its own sake.

In short, it is obvious that bears won’t do as much damage as felines, because if bears did the same damage as them there wouldn’t be any point to the vitality difference. It doesn’t mean, whoever, that the bear is ALWAYS a wrong choice, since many of these pets have their usefulness, and there’s much to bears than just the brown bear (which I feel pretty badly about it, as it’s being seen as an iconic “baddie” pet by Dungeon elitists, and that is a shame.)

Same with Longbow, etc. My really main weapon is melee sword + something else, and a ranged backup (usually one of the two bows, according to the situation) but I see no reason to judge others according to the weapons they are using-it is not my job in this game to call other “bads” for not playing the way I want or how I would play their character, but rather to be effective at what I do and care about what I bring, rather than pretending to be better by putting others down because they are not as knowledgeable of “meta play” as I am (which is what it all boils down to in this particular case.)

In short, looking down on others because they don’t necessarily adhere to metas to a T is not the best attitude-just make a note of the kind of player you are looking for so I and many others avoid you (never understood why elitists don’t just play together instead of complaining all day long in forums about the way other people play “the way they want.”)

No offense meant at all-discriminate all you want, but understand the consequences of your actions, especially if you come off as a jerk (which of course not all speed runners do.)

bowbear is a tipical bot farmer general pve setup and everything what above sad

Sarision.6347:

Sina.9208:

-snip-

The problem is that most Bearbows don’t even carry Spotter and Frost Spirit.

If one can’t stomache sword auto, then use GS instead. It may does less damage, but it’s easier to use, and you still surpass longbow in damage by stacking.

The GS dmg is just so low that it’s a worse thing to do in my opinion than using a Bear. Not wanting to use the sword is understandable, but meleeing with the Shortbow is better than using the GS.

Sina.9208:

The GS dmg is just so low that it’s a worse thing to do in my opinion than using a Bear. Not wanting to use the sword is understandable, but meleeing with the Shortbow is better than using the GS.

Played right, the GS is still superior to the shortbow for a damage build. Don’t underestimate the power of the weapon or forget that it’s auto chain cleaves. I believe that it’s also due for a buff to Maul, the one skill keeping it from being even more powerful.

While the GS may not be in sword damage territory, it’s a higher damage melee weapon for power builds than the SB is along with being far more survivable between the auto-attack evade, the block, and the stun.

Sina.9208:

Sarision.6347:

Sina.9208:

-snip-

The problem is that most Bearbows don’t even carry Spotter and Frost Spirit.

If one can’t stomache sword auto, then use GS instead. It may does less damage, but it’s easier to use, and you still surpass longbow in damage by stacking.

The GS dmg is just so low that it’s a worse thing to do in my opinion than using a Bear. Not wanting to use the sword is understandable, but meleeing with the Shortbow is better than using the GS.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/ranger/Ranger-Shortbow-vs-Greatsword-DPS-Tests/first

Lilius.9850:

What is “bearbow” and why do people hate it?

Also, why do i do such bad dps compared to other classes even though I have full exotic zerker gear and weapons?

A paradoxical type of handheld catapult that projects an ursine entity from its location and then the user goes AFK without ever finding out out that everyone else in the party actually carried them.

Sarision.6347:

Sina.9208:

Sarision.6347:

Sina.9208:

-snip-

The problem is that most Bearbows don’t even carry Spotter and Frost Spirit.

If one can’t stomache sword auto, then use GS instead. It may does less damage, but it’s easier to use, and you still surpass longbow in damage by stacking.

The GS dmg is just so low that it’s a worse thing to do in my opinion than using a Bear. Not wanting to use the sword is understandable, but meleeing with the Shortbow is better than using the GS.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/ranger/Ranger-Shortbow-vs-Greatsword-DPS-Tests/first

“SB Back: 16s 625 DPS (Bleed: 174 DPS, or 28% of DPS) (13 % more DPS than GS)”

And this test is not even taking into account the might stacks on your pet.

Sina.9208:

“SB Back: 16s 625 DPS (Bleed: 174 DPS, or 28% of DPS) (13 % more DPS than GS)”

And this test is not even taking into account the might stacks on your pet.

You missed the part where the tester noted that crit damage is capped in PvP, where this was tested. He continued to state that without the caps, aka how it acts in PvE, the GS should outdamage the SB. So in PvE and zerker gear the GS should outdamage the SB even if you can somehow manage to be flanking 100% of the time, which is practically impossible.

SynfulChaot.3169:

Sina.9208:

“SB Back: 16s 625 DPS (Bleed: 174 DPS, or 28% of DPS) (13 % more DPS than GS)”

And this test is not even taking into account the might stacks on your pet.

You missed the part where the tester noted that crit damage is capped in PvP, where this was tested. He continued to state that without the caps, aka how it acts in PvE, the GS should outdamage the SB. So in PvE and zerker gear the GS should outdamage the SB even if you can somehow manage to be flanking 100% of the time, which is practically impossible.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/ranger/Ranger-Weapon-DPS-Calculations/first

Check out this topic. This is more in line with my own experiences. (I could be wrong ofc, but anyhow we can probably agree that the GS is crappy weapon right now)

Sina.9208:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/ranger/Ranger-Weapon-DPS-Calculations/first

Check out this topic. This is more in line with my own experiences. (I could be wrong ofc, but anyhow we can probably agree that the GS is crappy weapon right now)

I followed that thread. Good premise, but the tester had a few testing fallacies such as only auto-attacking. Auto-attacking is the SBs strength, where the GS takes more benefit from skill rotation. He also didn’t take into account any conditions of any type, nor did he test the LB at anything but medium range (a good ranger will be at max damage range a majority of the time they use the auto).

The GS isn’t crappy but it isn’t where it should be either.

SynfulChaot.3169:

I believe that it’s also due for a buff to Maul, the one skill keeping it from being even more powerful.

GS has terrible flow between its skills that could be drastically improved. A needed damage buff on Maul will not solve all the problems it has as a weapon; not even close.

SynfulChaot.3169:

I followed that thread. Good premise, but the tester had a few testing fallacies such as only auto-attacking. Auto-attacking is the SBs strength, where the GS takes more benefit from skill rotation. He also didn’t take into account any conditions of any type, nor did he test the LB at anything but medium range (a good ranger will be at max damage range a majority of the time they use the auto).

The GS isn’t crappy but it isn’t where it should be either.

The GS’s actual numerical increase in damage when using rotations is pretty minimal as-is, and I’m being generous by only counting 1 and 2 in the rotation. This is another situation that will be assisted by the Maul buff, but not even come close to being solved. The problem is that every skill in the weapon set besides 1 and 2 make you lose dps due to activation time/lack of effective punishment inflicted on your target. Swoop is a gap-closer, so I wouldn’t expect it to do as much damage as maul, but it doesn’t even out-damage auto attacks. Block/counter is too slow/clunky to be competitive, and Hilt Bash not only doesn’t increase your weapon damage, it also has redundant synergy with the only trait it has any clear benefit from. (Moment of Clarity)

Leuca.5732:

SynfulChaot.3169:

I believe that it’s also due for a buff to Maul, the one skill keeping it from being even more powerful.

GS has terrible flow between its skills that could be drastically improved. A needed damage buff on Maul will not solve all the problems it has as a weapon; not even close.

I actually find use for all the other skills on the GS. One of the best gap closers with a very short cooldown, a block/counter for melee or long block for ranged, and a daze/stun. Good for survivability.

The real damage from GS should come from the auto-attack and from Maul. Just like those defending the sword’s auto-attack oddities, I’ll be one defending the greatsword’s 3, 4, and 5 as I find them to be great skills. At most, the block could use a bit of protection/evade while actually doing the counter. Other than that, though, those skills are good.

SynfulChaot.3169:

Leuca.5732:

SynfulChaot.3169:

I believe that it’s also due for a buff to Maul, the one skill keeping it from being even more powerful.

GS has terrible flow between its skills that could be drastically improved. A needed damage buff on Maul will not solve all the problems it has as a weapon; not even close.

I actually find use for all the other skills on the GS. One of the best gap closers with a very short cooldown, a block/counter for melee or long block for ranged, and a daze/stun. Good for survivability.

The real damage from GS should come from the auto-attack and from Maul. Just like those defending the sword’s auto-attack oddities, I’ll be one defending the greatsword’s 3, 4, and 5 as I find them to be great skills. At most, the block could use a bit of protection/evade while actually doing the counter. Other than that, though, those skills are good.

I did edit my previous post, so please read that before this.

Even GS auto attack has conceptual problems, like focusing on the evade rather than the damage, when it should have been the other way around. It’s subtleties like this that really make/break a weapon

I can see how defending Swoop would be reasonable, but block/counter would be blatantly inefficient even if you avoided damage while performing the counter, and the throw option, while receiving its on-the-move buff, is still pathetic in execution due to its speed/damage. It also doesn’t do either of the things a knockback should do, which would be to get your opponent far enough away to be safe for a moment, or to optimally position it for a follow up skill. The only redeeming factor is the cripple. Is cripple helpful? Yes, but it’s not really solving a lot of problems for the weapon. After all, Swoop is just such a fantastic gap-closer, right?

I’m honestly not sure how you can defend Hilt Bash, aside from it having a decent cooldown. If our pets could reliably hit even stunned targets before having to completely reposition themselves, I might be more forgiving. If it provided the 50% damage buff to both you and your pet, it would both immensely help the weapon while giving your opponent a clear picture of what to avoid, because you’d only logically want to use it with Maul and chances are your pet isn’t going to use the skill that has the best synergy with a % increase unless it’s linked to f2. Even as an operative daze/stun though, it’s pretty lackluster. If it wasn’t for the decent hitbox, you’d lose ground chasing targets because it actually hurts your movement speed.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

I never understood why bear was so popular. Bow I get, but bear? Honestly if I was going for a pet that wouldn’t die I’d go for the ranged one with heavy armor, i.e. the devourer. Or if I was expecting my pet to tank for me I’d go for the one that could heal, i.e. the moa.

Bear has one use right now: body block Old Tom bolts using the troll unguent and signet of the wild. That’s about it. There’s a similar attack sparkie does in the new dungeon that a bear is useful against.

By the way, I’m a fan of red moa and lashtail devourer for sure.

• you might use a bear and protect me or a bear and search and rescue if things go badly and you need some help. Usually don’t have to though.

What if we were able to train bears to do the below attack? Maybe that would make them more viable.

That bear still seems like he has poor AI. Reason being there are much more efficient ways to light a cigar besides tommy gun. To each his own, I suppose.

Nike.2631:

It a failure to adapt or understand the game’s mechanics. Solo play is different from group play, and landscape play is different from dungeons.

Soloing on the landscape ANY class chugs along just fine even in really crappy builds. The solo bearbow ranger is thus misled into thinking “Hey, I’ve figured this game out. Look at how good I am!” Fluffy the bear tanks, not because it has extra threat or does great damage – it tanks because the game massively prioritizes attacking the target you can reach now rather than the one you can hit in 2-3 seconds if you walk over to it. The ranger is plinking away gloriously unaware that he’s suffering the double whammy of the ranged attack damage coefficient (ranged attacks just plain old do less base DPS than their melee equivalents) AND the -25% to -40% that is the tax for having Fluffy as a class mechanic. A.k.a. his damage is as bad as it can possibly get, and so he rarely pulls things off the bear. The standard vision of the great Hunter+Pet Archetype is upheld and all seems right with the world.

And then they get into a group. The bear’s incredibly bad damage means than an ill tempered melee-Mesmer will pull agro off of it in one rotation, and let’s not even get into the laugh riot that is how fast a warrior seizes aggro from Fluffy.

Here’s one of the dark secrets of tanking – there is no prize for second place. You either have control of the mob or you’re just coincidentally in melee… and probably should be standing behind it to avoid cleaves (yet another thing the pet AI is blissfully oblivious to…).

The bear is WORTHLESS as a tank in most group play, and yet the Ranger, seeing that he’s not pulling agro (double de-buffed by range and class mechanic, remember) thinks Fluffy is doing a great job. And he thinks he’s doing a great job dishing the worst DPS in the game. But by-golly, it sure looks like he’s avoiding damage, dishing steady DPS, and Fluffy is a tank to be admired, all in accordance to the great Hunter+Pet Archetype learned in some other game where threat and face-tanking are the tools of the trade.

I love my Ranger, but even out on the landscape solo, if I can’t pull agro off my pet I’m not doing enough damage. And in a dungeon, you can bet I’m rolling Spotter, I’m dropping springs in close where they reinforce the wounded, and I’m constantly moving to make sure that while my shortbow damage may not be the best there is, I’m leveraging every button on the tool bar and keeping my health solid so I can get in and take a few hits while standing back up any teammate that catches a bad break on a dodge.

I feel like this post was written last year as there are several assertions that don’t actually coincide with game mechanics.

One, agro is not based on closeness of the target. The biggest concideration, in my experience, is toughness. This is one of the reasons that even at max range I can draw agro with my poorly damaging bow because I have entirely too much toughness and mobs will chance me down. I am almost always the target of choice for open world champions like the Ulgoth, despite the rest of the zerg that is almost certainly doing much more damage. The reason the bear draws agro is because it too has massive toughness.

In a dungeon situation, especially a zerker situation it doesn’t matter how hard the warrior or Mesmer hits the boss it will want to play with the bear because the bear has toughness and no one else does. Unfortunately, that is actually the problem. You don’t want your pet to tank in the dungeon because even the bear will take two shots and drop and now you’re lost that 25-40% of your damage that wasn’t doing very good damage in the first place. Worse, because it was your pet when it dies it may transfer its agro to you and cause the boss to move away from where it was supposed to go. Also, because the bear is such an agro magnet it may cause the boss to not move when you want it to since you can’t really make the bear move around when you want.

If the bear does lose agro, though, it doesn’t just stand there getting smacked. It’s AI immediately sends it behind its target to flank.

1) Toughness doesn’t affect aggro either. Proximity seems to be the strongest factor. The rest seems mostly up in the air.

2) GS is better DPS than shortbow.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

1) Toughness doesn’t affect aggro either. Proximity seems to be the strongest factor. The rest seems mostly up in the air.

2) GS is better DPS than shortbow.

If toughness doesn’t effect agro, then why is my longbow ranger in cleric armor an agro magnet. I’m at 1000-1200 distance. I do crap damage. I use bird which absolutely does more damage than me. But my Toughness is over 2000, my armor is over 3000. So what is attracting these mobs every time if not that?

Sarision.6347:

Running nothing but bears and longbow (and maybe even shortbow) in dungeons. Not only are you doing kittenty damage, you’re also not supporting your teammates nor receiving support from them.

False, except for the kittenty damage, that is true, having an AoE condi cleanse and AoE weakness + a damage sponge (bears can tank bosses like a mofo), not to mention it’s not hard to run in and out of long range to drop healing spring for your melee allies, you’ve got 10 vuln you can maintain by yourself, and an AoE cripple and a KB, not to mention your other weapon. You can also run spirits if you want (i run the elite spirit for the AoE rez, condi cleanse and heal), and then if you take Healers Clarity and Mercy Runes you rez people extremely fast, rez them to half health, and then gain swiftness so you can get back to where you need to be (or to another dead person) quickly, that and S&R and you’re a one man rezzing team.

Not to mention you yourself are tanky as hell if you’re going supporty….

Kal Spiro.9745:

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

1) Toughness doesn’t affect aggro either. Proximity seems to be the strongest factor. The rest seems mostly up in the air.

2) GS is better DPS than shortbow.

If toughness doesn’t effect agro, then why is my longbow ranger in cleric armor an agro magnet. I’m at 1000-1200 distance. I do crap damage. I use bird which absolutely does more damage than me. But my Toughness is over 2000, my armor is over 3000. So what is attracting these mobs every time if not that?

Some bosses and mobs have a routine to attack ranged. They’re all a little different. Gw2 aggro is a “black box” per se.

Durzlla.6295:

Sarision.6347:

Running nothing but bears and longbow (and maybe even shortbow) in dungeons. Not only are you doing kittenty damage, you’re also not supporting your teammates nor receiving support from them.

False, except for the kittenty damage, that is true, having an AoE condi cleanse and AoE weakness + a damage sponge (bears can tank bosses like a mofo), not to mention it’s not hard to run in and out of long range to drop healing spring for your melee allies, you’ve got 10 vuln you can maintain by yourself, and an AoE cripple and a KB, not to mention your other weapon. You can also run spirits if you want (i run the elite spirit for the AoE rez, condi cleanse and heal), and then if you take Healers Clarity and Mercy Runes you rez people extremely fast, rez them to half health, and then gain swiftness so you can get back to where you need to be (or to another dead person) quickly, that and S&R and you’re a one man rezzing team.

Not to mention you yourself are tanky as hell if you’re going supporty….

But… but… but you’re doing dungeons. You’re not supposed to be supporty and ressing people, you’re supposed to be zerker and murdering everything you see in half a second or GTFO… Bearbows can’t do that.

I was totally melee until I saw how a long bow can melt stuff with the right spec (+10% damage for endurance & flanking, +5% for trait, “quickdraw” for lots of rapidfire), and at range where dps isnt interrupted by cc. Now I dont see why there would be any complaint about a ranger with a longbow in the group.

Durzlla.6295:

Sarision.6347:

Running nothing but bears and longbow (and maybe even shortbow) in dungeons. Not only are you doing kittenty damage, you’re also not supporting your teammates nor receiving support from them.

False, except for the kittenty damage, that is true, having an AoE condi cleanse and AoE weakness + a damage sponge (bears can tank bosses like a mofo), not to mention it’s not hard to run in and out of long range to drop healing spring for your melee allies, you’ve got 10 vuln you can maintain by yourself, and an AoE cripple and a KB, not to mention your other weapon. You can also run spirits if you want (i run the elite spirit for the AoE rez, condi cleanse and heal), and then if you take Healers Clarity and Mercy Runes you rez people extremely fast, rez them to half health, and then gain swiftness so you can get back to where you need to be (or to another dead person) quickly, that and S&R and you’re a one man rezzing team.

Not to mention you yourself are tanky as hell if you’re going supporty….

The problem is, do Bearbows do this? Do they even take some of their time to run up to the melee to drop a Healing Spring or hell, even run up halfway to drop Frost Spirit (that is, if they even carry it in the first place). And sitting at 600+ doesn’t grant the rest of the party Spotter (again, if they even bring it in the first place).

Or hell, do they even do a single thing of what you mentioned?

Sarision.6347:

Durzlla.6295:

Sarision.6347:

Running nothing but bears and longbow (and maybe even shortbow) in dungeons. Not only are you doing kittenty damage, you’re also not supporting your teammates nor receiving support from them.

False, except for the kittenty damage, that is true, having an AoE condi cleanse and AoE weakness + a damage sponge (bears can tank bosses like a mofo), not to mention it’s not hard to run in and out of long range to drop healing spring for your melee allies, you’ve got 10 vuln you can maintain by yourself, and an AoE cripple and a KB, not to mention your other weapon. You can also run spirits if you want (i run the elite spirit for the AoE rez, condi cleanse and heal), and then if you take Healers Clarity and Mercy Runes you rez people extremely fast, rez them to half health, and then gain swiftness so you can get back to where you need to be (or to another dead person) quickly, that and S&R and you’re a one man rezzing team.

Not to mention you yourself are tanky as hell if you’re going supporty….

The problem is, do Bearbows do this? Do they even take some of their time to run up to the melee to drop a Healing Spring or hell, even run up halfway to drop Frost Spirit (that is, if they even carry it in the first place). And sitting at 600+ doesn’t grant the rest of the party Spotter (again, if they even bring it in the first place).

Or hell, do they even do a single thing of what you mentioned?

Well i don’t use spotter because i see piercing arrows as much more viable than that… and i normally don’t use frost spirit because i think it’s over ratted… that and i value surviving longer over doing more damage…

As for the other stuff.. yes, yes i do run up to drop my healing spring because 95% of the time i don’t actually need the heal, and if i do i don’t need the condi removal more than a few ticks (which i can dance around in melee range to get) or regen because of how far i stand in the back…

You can ask any of my groups though, i’m ontop of rezzing people, i have no reason NOT to rez people, i mean kitten rezzing puts my armor at ~3.5k armor while rezzing, which makes me tanky enough to eat a lot of damage and not even be phased… like lupicus and his kittening Chi Barrage Dragon kitten kitten.

There is definitely such a thing as being ‘too tanky’; especially when you’re outranging most AoE to start with. I don’t worry about it since two of my three stats are damage and I’m usually close, but I’d start to worry if it were just one used for damage, and the other two self-defense.

Rutee.1058:

There is definitely such a thing as being ‘too tanky’; especially when you’re outranging most AoE to start with. I don’t worry about it since two of my three stats are damage and I’m usually close, but I’d start to worry if it were just one used for damage, and the other two self-defense.

I use clerics because the healing power helps my allies as well as myself (not that much granted), that or if i go with a more offensive build i’ll take magi and just make a build that boosts my pet up when i crit, and i do have zerker sitting there when/if i wanna use it…

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

I never understood why bear was so popular. Bow I get, but bear? Honestly if I was going for a pet that wouldn’t die I’d go for the ranged one with heavy armor, i.e. the devourer. Or if I was expecting my pet to tank for me I’d go for the one that could heal, i.e. the moa.

The bear is the only pet that works quite reliably in combination with “Protect Me”. If you’re going full berserker, you are very squishy, so Protect Me comes in really handy when you don’t want to trait for Signet of Stone.

Signet of Stone has a great passive, but it also comes with a longer cooldown, no stun break, and it requires a grandmaster trait that could be replaced with Spotter, Eagle Eye or Piercing arrows.

The longbow doesn’t do low damage when running super grasscannon. 10k Rapid Fire every 8 seconds isn’t THAT bad. You’re also pretty safe at range and the auto-attack requires you to be at 1000+ range.

Holland, we’re talking about in dungeons, not overworld.

Leuca.5732:

— snip —

I think the biggest problem with the ranger GS is that it’s role and the sword’s role are reversed. For most classes the GS is the heavy damage weapon with the sword (or other one-hander of choice) being the more mobile, ‘safer’ weapon. For us, as rangers, the sword is our heavy damage weapon. That leaves the GS as still a good weapon, but one for which people expect different of it than it’s design.

As for Hilt Bash? Stun/daze are always useful to stop an incoming attack if you see the telegraph. Just because it isn’t a damage increase doesn’t mean that the skill is useless. The block/counter is the same. It’s about active defense, not offense. It’s about survivability.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

I never understood why bear was so popular. Bow I get, but bear?

If you look at the stats in the wiki, the bear seems great.
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Pet_attributes#Attribute_distribution

Same power and precision as most of the other pets, average toughness, stellar vit. It looks like there’s no downside. So bear it is!

It wasn’t until a month later (when I learned about the Mists) that I ran some tests and found out the bear’s attack rate is horribly slow, which kills its DPS despite its average power rating.

Honestly if I was going for a pet that wouldn’t die I’d go for the ranged one with heavy armor, i.e. the devourer.

Toughness vs vit doesn’t matter when your pet is instantly healed when you swap. All that matters is how many hits they can take before you’re forced to swap. For the bear, this is 6*14 = 84. For the devourer this is 8*6 = 48. So the bear can take almost twice as many hits as the devourer.

Where the devourer’s toughness helps is if you can drop a heal onto them. But all the heal cooldowns are the same as or longer than the pet swap cooldowns, making this mostly a moot point.

I think I found this elusive creature you all speak of.

SynfulChaot.3169:

As for Hilt Bash? Stun/daze are always useful to stop an incoming attack if you see the telegraph. Just because it isn’t a damage increase doesn’t mean that the skill is useless. The block/counter is the same. It’s about active defense, not offense. It’s about survivability.

The problem is that using it to interrupt an offensive skill (when most go on interrupt CD instead of full CD) buys you at most a second or two. In this case you’d actually accomplish more by dodging the telegraphed skill, putting it on full CD (unless it’s a Burst skill from a warrior) and saving your meager pet damage boost for when you actually need it.

If you were properly rewarded for interrupting a skill, that would be a different story, but we already have Moment of Redundancy for that.

Durzlla.6295:

Rutee.1058:

There is definitely such a thing as being ‘too tanky’; especially when you’re outranging most AoE to start with. I don’t worry about it since two of my three stats are damage and I’m usually close, but I’d start to worry if it were just one used for damage, and the other two self-defense.

I use clerics because the healing power helps my allies as well as myself (not that much granted), that or if i go with a more offensive build i’ll take magi and just make a build that boosts my pet up when i crit, and i do have zerker sitting there when/if i wanna use it…

This post makes me cry. Magi is less offensive than clerics. Both of those have the worst DPS of any sets in the game and are not worthy of discussion when we’re talking about damage output. Save that for some kind of ranger support build thread.

Kilger.5490:

I was totally melee until I saw how a long bow can melt stuff with the right spec (+10% damage for endurance & flanking, +5% for trait, “quickdraw” for lots of rapidfire), and at range where dps isnt interrupted by cc. Now I dont see why there would be any complaint about a ranger with a longbow in the group.

Because you still do less damage than another equally unbuffed melee. In addition, that melee player is getting buffs and providing buffs for the other players that will dramatically increase their damage relative to yours.

Yaki.9563:

Durzlla.6295:

Rutee.1058:

There is definitely such a thing as being ‘too tanky’; especially when you’re outranging most AoE to start with. I don’t worry about it since two of my three stats are damage and I’m usually close, but I’d start to worry if it were just one used for damage, and the other two self-defense.

I use clerics because the healing power helps my allies as well as myself (not that much granted), that or if i go with a more offensive build i’ll take magi and just make a build that boosts my pet up when i crit, and i do have zerker sitting there when/if i wanna use it…

This post makes me cry. Magi is less offensive than clerics. Both of those have the worst DPS of any sets in the game and are not worthy of discussion when we’re talking about damage output. Save that for some kind of ranger support build thread.

It’s more offensive than clerics if you run companions might and a jaguar and/or drake right? And I didn’t say it was running for the most damage possible I just said it does MORE damage, as in more damage than my clerics build….

God posts like yours make me cry…

run ice and flame drake. they both have blast finishers. longbow is fine if you can stay at max range and deal max dps and the occasional CC knockback if needed.

Durzlla.6295:

Sarision.6347:

Durzlla.6295:

Sarision.6347:

Running nothing but bears and longbow (and maybe even shortbow) in dungeons. Not only are you doing kittenty damage, you’re also not supporting your teammates nor receiving support from them.

False, except for the kittenty damage, that is true, having an AoE condi cleanse and AoE weakness + a damage sponge (bears can tank bosses like a mofo), not to mention it’s not hard to run in and out of long range to drop healing spring for your melee allies, you’ve got 10 vuln you can maintain by yourself, and an AoE cripple and a KB, not to mention your other weapon. You can also run spirits if you want (i run the elite spirit for the AoE rez, condi cleanse and heal), and then if you take Healers Clarity and Mercy Runes you rez people extremely fast, rez them to half health, and then gain swiftness so you can get back to where you need to be (or to another dead person) quickly, that and S&R and you’re a one man rezzing team.

Not to mention you yourself are tanky as hell if you’re going supporty….

The problem is, do Bearbows do this? Do they even take some of their time to run up to the melee to drop a Healing Spring or hell, even run up halfway to drop Frost Spirit (that is, if they even carry it in the first place). And sitting at 600+ doesn’t grant the rest of the party Spotter (again, if they even bring it in the first place).

Or hell, do they even do a single thing of what you mentioned?

Well i don’t use spotter because i see piercing arrows as much more viable than that… and i normally don’t use frost spirit because i think it’s over ratted… that and i value surviving longer over doing more damage…

As for the other stuff.. yes, yes i do run up to drop my healing spring because 95% of the time i don’t actually need the heal, and if i do i don’t need the condi removal more than a few ticks (which i can dance around in melee range to get) or regen because of how far i stand in the back…

You can ask any of my groups though, i’m ontop of rezzing people, i have no reason NOT to rez people, i mean kitten rezzing puts my armor at ~3.5k armor while rezzing, which makes me tanky enough to eat a lot of damage and not even be phased… like lupicus and his kittening Chi Barrage Dragon kitten kitten.

lol, THIS is why people hate bearbow Rangers, because people like you use a build that contributes neither DPS nor support and yet INSISTS that your build is viable. It’s not viable, it’s an absolute joke.

1) You don’t use Spotter because you’d rather use piercing arrows? Yeah you’re right, +150 precision to everyone in the group isn’t worthwhile at all. It’s a much bigger contribution for your weak DPS to hit 2-3 things instead of 1.

2) Frost Spirit is overrated? Lol. +10% damage to everyone in the party is overrated? Lol.

Honestly, if I was trying to troll the OP I would have written your post exactly. I’d be like, “Hey, Bearbow is actually really good, here’s why!” and then I’d list all of the reasons why people HATE bearbow users. That’s exactly what you did here.

If this was a troll post, then +1 excellent job sir. Otherwise, you have explained in precise detail everything that is wrong with bearbow users and their mentality.

Durzlla.6295:

Rutee.1058:

There is definitely such a thing as being ‘too tanky’; especially when you’re outranging most AoE to start with. I don’t worry about it since two of my three stats are damage and I’m usually close, but I’d start to worry if it were just one used for damage, and the other two self-defense.

I use clerics because the healing power helps my allies as well as myself (not that much granted), that or if i go with a more offensive build i’ll take magi and just make a build that boosts my pet up when i crit, and i do have zerker sitting there when/if i wanna use it…

Oh my god. Please be trolling. This is too much