Guild Wars 2

Is it just me or does this thing have a gap closer/homing strike on it now? Was that a fix or?

it always had it

It’s always honed. It was a better flanking strike in terms of hitting a target. It always made Serpent Strike look really, really bad.

And quite frankly I don’t get the point why serpent strike and stalker strike have to be the same function, except one is better.

One of the reasons ranger does so poorly in pve as well is because of all the focus on the poison condition, which is useless in PvE, and in roaming most opponents have a heal that removes poison before the heal kicks in anyways (warrior, necro, thief, mesmer with inspiration trait, engineer turret, ele ether renewal; I think the guardian is the only class without a heal that actively removes poison before it heals).

Its a shame Dag#4 isnt more like the theif’s S/D#3.

They are the same animation and essentially the same attack, only the thieves verson will move you much further forward to strike your target if needs be, we’re talking like 300-400 range forward

Cufufalating.8479:

Its a shame Dag#4 isnt more like the theif’s S/D#3.

They are the same animation and essentially the same attack, only the thieves verson will move you much further forward to strike your target if needs be, we’re talking like 300-400 range forward

That’s what I’m saying, my dagger 4 has a thief like sword Animation that resembles larcenous strike, I’l literally spinning around and moving several units towards my target, I don’t have to be close to them at all. when I hit it, all of a sudden I’m advancing very far towards my target, not just spinning around. Been playing Ranger since Nov, It’s different.

Looks like it’s just different in spvp?

Ahh yeah thats different looks like they changed it to the flanking strike animation, which is weird because I thought it was fine, serpent strike is the one that needs changing imo. Didn’t flanking strike use to have the same animation as serpent strike?

Also I just tested this and it only works with the offhand training version, normal version is the same as before.

Ya, but the fact remains, the spvp version here covers more distance, I don’t see why they can’t be the same, the second part off the spin literally lunges at your target.

Furajir.3815:

Ya, but the fact remains, the spvp version here covers more distance, I don’t see why they can’t be the same, the second part off the spin literally lunges at your target.

Isn’t it just that you have offhand training in spvp and not otherwise? if that is what makes the diffrence now like he said.

Nope, I run the same in both

i hope you guys realize that this ability now – at least in spvp is worse off then before.
furthermore they reduced the dodge from 1 1/4 seconds to 1/2 a second.

Zenith.7301:

One of the reasons ranger does so poorly in pve as well is because of all the focus on the poison condition, which is useless in PvE, and in roaming most opponents have a heal that removes poison before the heal kicks in anyways (warrior, necro, thief, mesmer with inspiration trait, engineer turret, ele ether renewal; I think the guardian is the only class without a heal that actively removes poison before it heals).

i have to disagree here. i cant count how many times a day in wvw or spvp poison has been a key reason i won a fight. people in wvw simply are not running good condition removal, because the amount of condition based enemies makes it hard to justify, even for roamers (or because lol-zerg mentality).

• warriors hardly ever run that heal because all builds now are based on saving adren.
• engi turret only cleanses on the burst heal, and many engis are running HGH with the elixir heal.
• rangers have a pretty good split across each heal, so 2/3 chance hes not running spring, especially with the recent TU popularity.
• thieves, sure. but 30sec CD and is almost always their only condi removal because lol-wvw, especially since infusion of shadow competes with shadows embrace.
• most eles i meet are running d/d with signet or staff with glyph. poison will get them to blow their water attunement cd before they heal (and thus, almost all their condi removal).
• guardians have to eat it, and lets face it, it seems like half the wvw players are guardians.
• no one takes the mesmer trait because its 1 random removal, and better options exist.

which really just leaves necros as the only opponent who doesnt seem to be fazed by poison. sure, many of these classes have “every 10 sec, cure a condi…” but that still works out to an average of 5 seconds of them delaying a heal that they really need just for the auto-cleanse, and thats very useful too.

as far as pve, poison really doesnt come to mind as a short-coming. the problem has always been pet survivability is crap. and now, many groups insist on mesmers, guardians and warrriors. greatsword for warriors and guardians does much more damage in a dungeon than anything we have. even mesmers are only invited for their quickness to buff the plate wearing greatsword downies.

Just to get the right information out there, there are lots of mobs in dungeons that heal and poison works very well against them. Just off the top of my head from Arah: Giganticus Lupicus, the Crusher, and mages. Mages in particular get an extremely powerful regeneration and heal mobs around them. I don’t usually use dagger in dungeons but I do use sword.

Raven.9603:

Zenith.7301:

One of the reasons ranger does so poorly in pve as well is because of all the focus on the poison condition, which is useless in PvE, and in roaming most opponents have a heal that removes poison before the heal kicks in anyways (warrior, necro, thief, mesmer with inspiration trait, engineer turret, ele ether renewal; I think the guardian is the only class without a heal that actively removes poison before it heals).

i have to disagree here. i cant count how many times a day in wvw or spvp poison has been a key reason i won a fight. people in wvw simply are not running good condition removal, because the amount of condition based enemies makes it hard to justify, even for roamers (or because lol-zerg mentality).

• warriors hardly ever run that heal because all builds now are based on saving adren.
• engi turret only cleanses on the burst heal, and many engis are running HGH with the elixir heal.
• rangers have a pretty good split across each heal, so 2/3 chance hes not running spring, especially with the recent TU popularity.
• thieves, sure. but 30sec CD and is almost always their only condi removal because lol-wvw, especially since infusion of shadow competes with shadows embrace.
• most eles i meet are running d/d with signet or staff with glyph. poison will get them to blow their water attunement cd before they heal (and thus, almost all their condi removal).
• guardians have to eat it, and lets face it, it seems like half the wvw players are guardians.
• no one takes the mesmer trait because its 1 random removal, and better options exist.

which really just leaves necros as the only opponent who doesnt seem to be fazed by poison. sure, many of these classes have “every 10 sec, cure a condi…” but that still works out to an average of 5 seconds of them delaying a heal that they really need just for the auto-cleanse, and thats very useful too.

as far as pve, poison really doesnt come to mind as a short-coming. the problem has always been pet survivability is crap. and now, many groups insist on mesmers, guardians and warrriors. greatsword for warriors and guardians does much more damage in a dungeon than anything we have. even mesmers are only invited for their quickness to buff the plate wearing greatsword downies.

I take the mesmer trait, because I run mantra for 2 removals, on a measly 10 sec cd, and null field.

And I don’t know of any thief that doesn’t run condi removal on stealth for wvw considering most spec for roaming, and that trait is mandatory for roaming successfully against condition specs.

Raven.9603:

Zenith.7301:

One of the reasons ranger does so poorly in pve as well is because of all the focus on the poison condition, which is useless in PvE, and in roaming most opponents have a heal that removes poison before the heal kicks in anyways (warrior, necro, thief, mesmer with inspiration trait, engineer turret, ele ether renewal; I think the guardian is the only class without a heal that actively removes poison before it heals).

i have to disagree here. i cant count how many times a day in wvw or spvp poison has been a key reason i won a fight. people in wvw simply are not running good condition removal, because the amount of condition based enemies makes it hard to justify, even for roamers (or because lol-zerg mentality).

• warriors hardly ever run that heal because all builds now are based on saving adren.
• engi turret only cleanses on the burst heal, and many engis are running HGH with the elixir heal.
• rangers have a pretty good split across each heal, so 2/3 chance hes not running spring, especially with the recent TU popularity.
• thieves, sure. but 30sec CD and is almost always their only condi removal because lol-wvw, especially since infusion of shadow competes with shadows embrace.
• most eles i meet are running d/d with signet or staff with glyph. poison will get them to blow their water attunement cd before they heal (and thus, almost all their condi removal).
• guardians have to eat it, and lets face it, it seems like half the wvw players are guardians.
• no one takes the mesmer trait because its 1 random removal, and better options exist.

which really just leaves necros as the only opponent who doesnt seem to be fazed by poison. sure, many of these classes have “every 10 sec, cure a condi…” but that still works out to an average of 5 seconds of them delaying a heal that they really need just for the auto-cleanse, and thats very useful too.

as far as pve, poison really doesnt come to mind as a short-coming. the problem has always been pet survivability is crap. and now, many groups insist on mesmers, guardians and warrriors. greatsword for warriors and guardians does much more damage in a dungeon than anything we have. even mesmers are only invited for their quickness to buff the plate wearing greatsword downies.

Do you even WvW? Your analysis is wrong on quite a few topics. Tons of thieves take shadow’s embrace. An ele will not have any problem with cleansing poison. They are top 3 in condition cleansing. A HGH engi will probably not have a problem because elixirs remove a condition. Other style engis will remove the poison during the healing turret burst, right before the heal. Guardian generally have no trouble as well with that poison since most run a shout build and they remove conditions using shouts and they have that passive trait as well.

Not saying that your poison will get cleansed since it depends on other factor too but most classes will not just take it everytime…

Battosai.5620:

i hope you guys realize that this ability now – at least in spvp is worse off then before.
furthermore they reduced the dodge from 1 1/4 seconds to 1/2 a second.

you’re right, they did flat out nerf the ability in spvp…WTF..

and they didn’t even put it in the patch notes..

Wait…wtf its the same in wvw, if you have off hand training..WtH is with the massive nerf

farewell offhand training i guess.

That nerf is unacceptable, not only is it undocumented, it shows a complete lack of disrespect on the part of Anet for not coming in here and having the balls to tell us about this sort of thing first hand.

LOL Anet strikes again, kittening clueless devs. Camelot Unchained where are you!!!!!

Anet kitten es me off more then anything..

Mainly because they drop crap like they did in the State of the Game where they’re going to nerf our class…and then they don’t have the balls to come into the Ranger Forums and tell us what they’re going to do..

Now we get undocumented nerf’s like this… and again..No Developer comes in the forums to let us know what the hell is going on.

vinceftw.5086:

Do you even WvW? Your analysis is wrong on quite a few topics. Tons of thieves take shadow’s embrace. An ele will not have any problem with cleansing poison. They are top 3 in condition cleansing. A HGH engi will probably not have a problem because elixirs remove a condition. Other style engis will remove the poison during the healing turret burst, right before the heal. Guardian generally have no trouble as well with that poison since most run a shout build and they remove conditions using shouts and they have that passive trait as well.

Not saying that your poison will get cleansed since it depends on other factor too but most classes will not just take it everytime…

perhaps you misunderstood the conversation?

we were specifically talking about heals that autocleanse. many thieves do take shadows embrace, but many do not. Shadows embrace is sort of a sidebar to the whole thing anyway considering its not the mechanic we were discussing, but remember, people are bad and bad is normal.

I think you need to re-read what I wrote about eles. If they didn’t take ether renewal, which is most of the ones i meet (anecdotal evidence ftw), they will use water form before their heal to cleanse the poison (without poison, they are simply going to heal in w/e attunement they are in). No one is going to blow a cantrip on poison removal. Making them blow water form early means you can go heavy as soon as they pop out of it.

I said exactly what you said about healing turret: the cleanse is on the burst. That means the initial drop of the turret (50% of the heal) is still impacted. HGH engies will autoclean if they have 409, but many do not run 409. Fast Acting Elixirs and HGH are mandatory for that spec, and most opt for Potent Elixirs over 409 because they get they took Elixir C. If they want to blow Elixir C, thats fine. Like the ele, the sooner you can get someone to put their cleanse on cd, the better.

Guardians are hugely susceptible to conditions. Waiting on purity/signet passive was already addressed. There are reasons trappers dominate guardian bunkers. Shouts only remove one condition (which may or may not be poison) and are on fairly long cooldowns (as are meditations and CoP, the latter of which no one takes). Also, poor health pools. But again, this is a huge tangent from the initial conversation, which was auto-cleansing heals.

All Rangers need to go to this thread in the Game Bugs forum

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/Undocumented-Ranger-Nerf-in-patch/first#post2202849

Also go under support option in game options and report this bug as well.

Yup, this is kittening dumb, I knew something was off, nothing was documented as far as a change to the skill so I didn’t even look at the evade. Wow.

I didn’t notice it because I was doing Great Sword this patch with Clerics Armor.

but yea… bloody stupid.

To be honest I didn’t notice any change, only found out from this thread. However I have been using a tunneling service since the patch to lower my kittenty aus latency that’s probably why. Everything is so much more responsive now compared to before it almost feels like I’m cheating lol.

haha nice…
2 days not in pvp, doing this happy, funny all is good event.

and then i see this topic, at first i just was think “wtf why this animation,
there is for sure something wrong with it. well ranger into ground nerf is just comming end june”

then scrolled down and see battosais message and i was sure, yes thats ANET,
because ranger nerfs are always just animation bug fixes, or dont need to be in patch notes

then joined pvp server and looked to my dagger 4 description,
OH WONDER, there is only 1/2 dodge time… nice joke.
its a hard nerf from 1 1/4 to 1/2

Havent played my ranger since the patch but this is pretty BS, probably a nerf that slipped through the crack that they were testing. Kind of like how the Burst ability for GS Warriors once said it gave Might instead of Fury because they were testing and didn’t change it back before the patch.

Okay i just did a quick test in the mists against my friends mesmer, he summoned 3 Phantasmal Duelist (Pistol one) and then i recorded how long the Evade Lasted under fraps then viewed it frame by frame.

Without Offhand Training
Evade lasts 1 1/4 seconds.

With Offhand Training
Evade lasts 1/2 second.

That sure sounds like a bug rather than a deliberate nerf. Either way it ought to be reverted, though.

Whenever there is two versions of a skill anet always screw up when they try to change it, like longbow with the range trait and path of scars. They probably intended to change it but just screwed it up again.

I don’t understand why they touched it in the first place, there isn’t a problem with it..

Unless the intern they have making changes confused it with the Thief Version.

Xsorus.2507:

I don’t understand why they touched it in the first place, there isn’t a problem with it..

Unless the intern they have making changes confused it with the Thief Version.

Prob planning to lower the evade length to nerf bunkers, Ranger Bunkers are OP man!!!

i hope its a bug!
because this nerf destroys also
dps rangers without so much survive like the bm ranger…

they should better buff the trapper ranger or some dps ranger builds in pvp, instead stupid nerfs on rangers…
this stupid dagger nerf… dagger 4 is so important vs shatter mesmers
and immobilize bursts.
and at old trapper ranger times it was rly important skill, because trapper ranger was always first target.
if its a nerf, then anet is nerfing again without brain, just thinking about bm ranger and not other builds.

yes bm rangers so op man…
but bm time run out end june, thats so sure.
then we just have to wait for end july patch, maybe anet see then the fails of the end june patch… and buff rangers again
always same rotation when a ranger have a viable tourny build

and that’s why normally I don’t read official forums
I didn’t played trap bunker but long time ago (begining of may maybe?) I heard that in state of the game that “trap bunker is little OP and they carefully plan to nerf it – carefully because they want to make it balanced not ruin like spirit build” also I heard about “little buff the rangers greatsword” and “rebuild longbow because even if they can be really good as a power build weapon they’re lacking defensive options – and utility skills are not enough to keep this alive for long without swaping weapons” (or something like that) and as for now only gs buff became a truth.
so…….

I just tried this after the update, now even with off-hand training and no off-hand training, the evade is 1/2s.

Wow.

This is kittening bullkitten.

Yeap, Undocumented BS from them as usual..

ppl what are Your sickness with that kittens? I nearly only see here “kitten, kitten”
(btw kittens are so sweet and furry )

Lord Trejgon.2809:

ppl what are Your sickness with that kittens? I nearly only see here “kitten, kitten”
(btw kittens are so sweet and furry )

Kitten is what Anet Boards change censored words to.

ok…..
so in every place I’ll se those “kittens” I need to know that was some very bad words :P (from lack of another better description of those)

still….
as for me they are just raging because “they now better that was intended and it cannot be just a bug”
that’s making me a little sick…

There is something odd. I see the 1/2 evade when I have offhand training equipped. But then I do this:
1) enter WvW zone
2)enter combat with a skill other than dagger 4.
3) examine tooltip for dagger 4 WHILE IN COMBAT
4) note it says 1 1/4 second evade
5) leave combat
6) note it says once again 1/2 second evade

This is with the Offhand training trait equipped. Can anyone else verify this?

I know!
god why again….
Bredin from that what did You said seems, that Offhand training trait as many other traits works only while in combat…
but I’m not sure – it require more testing

Yup. I meant to post that in the other thread on the Dagger 4 nerg…reposted it there.

Lord Trejgon.2809:

I know!
god why again….
Bredin from that what did You said seems, that Offhand training trait as many other traits works only while in combat…
but I’m not sure – it require more testing

It worked fine before the last patch..

So they’ve been messing with it, and they obviously broke it.

In spvp offhand training is currently giving 1/2 sec evade in actual combat, its not just a tooltip change.

Yea, you tested that yesterday, so its not just buggy tooltip, they broke the ability

Good thing I’m playing my Phantasm mesmer and S/D+D/P thief now. Same roaming results, quicker kills, half the kitten headache and no stupid nerfs in sight.

I’ve been even playing my scepter/dagger ele ala Phantaram spec with some cavalier items and have had similarly good outcomes.

It’s good to play classes that don’t have a 60/40 damage split ratio with the 60 and all burst capacity going to a crappy, paper thin/AoE hugging AI that can’t hit someone moving with swiftness.

@Zenith this is ranger thread – stop trollin with Your mesmer.

the rest of You – all of you are to easy to accuse ANet to “hidden nerf” or intentional breaking ability – In last patch they have been repairing that trait for axes, so that is possibility that something went wrong and:
1. evade is shorter,
2. trait as many other (like spotter) works only in combat.
and maybe both.
but still when I read this forum if something after patch are little weaker than used to be everybody starts to crying why that bad ANet is hidden nerfing ranger….

Trejgon they broke it in the Dragon Bash patch…not the one where they were messing with the Axe Talents.

It worked just a few days ago just fine..