Guild Wars 2

I find it impossbile to kill a well played d/p thief.
smoke field leap finishers (which can be done with 5 skill followed by heartseeker with no cd) pretty much offer infinite invisibility (over exagerated, but 3 or 4 more). Traited properly for initiative they can enter and exit combat whenever they want…
I find it unfair that this stealth build is the only defensive mechanic in the game that does not require any trade offs… A thief can technically be built 100% serker, deal a ton of dmg and so long as they are not stupid to walk into a swinging sword they can outplay any class…

there should be a way to track a stealthed person… or at the very least let our entangle not be able to be blinked out of so we can at least hold them for a few seconds….

can anyone share thier thoughts on how a ranger can play against an invis thief…

Traps and Rapid Fire from Longbow work well. RF tracks through stealth. Ranged pets help, or Canines with knockdown or fear. Being highly evade-capable helps as well.

thx for advice! ill give that a go… but the only thing is LB is so hard to use well… cuz a thief can just steal behind u and it stops working… the 1 skill hits very little too and takes a long time to cast

If the thief is worth their salt you wont kill him.

Just ignore it, if they don’t have the lolstomp faceroll build.

Puandro.3245:

If the thief is worth their salt you wont kill him.

This. Honestly this is currently the problem with Thieves in WvW. They can simply not die due to how much disengage they have. Even if they don’t kill you.

ProxyDamage.9826:

Puandro.3245:

If the thief is worth their salt you wont kill him.

This. Honestly this is currently the problem with Thieves in WvW. They can simply not die due to how much disengage they have. Even if they don’t kill you.

If you stick around they will kilk you eventually.

Are you talking about spvp or wvw? Because in spvp, thieves are not contesting points while they are stealthed, meaning that in my opinion it works pretty much as intended. No, you won’t be able to kill them 1v1 unless you get lucky/they are not good, but while they are stealthed you an cap points etc. I don’t really play wvw though, which is probably what you are talking about.

greatsword’s #4 skill is a great counter for stealth thief, the rest is nothing special, moving around and getting your SB’s #3 ready for when you see him, followed by #5 to interrupt his next step and confuse him.

you cant win. What you can do is not die sometimes . Good thieves are imposibruuu

ProxyDamage.9826:

Puandro.3245:

If the thief is worth their salt you wont kill him.

This. Honestly this is currently the problem with Thieves in WvW. They can simply not die due to how much disengage they have. Even if they don’t kill you.

I have had a real cold spell trying to beat thieves recently. Stealth over and over and over. They just whittle me down. Some spam heart seeker and some spam C/D. Either way I’m having a tough time.

Puandro.3245:

ProxyDamage.9826:

Puandro.3245:

If the thief is worth their salt you wont kill him.

This. Honestly this is currently the problem with Thieves in WvW. They can simply not die due to how much disengage they have. Even if they don’t kill you.

If you stick around they will kilk you eventually.

Depends on your build. If you’re a more glassy build, yes. If you’re a regen/bunker no. He’ll never kill you. But you’ll never kill him either.

Longbow 4→ 2. GS 4. Raven F2.

ProxyDamage.9826:

Puandro.3245:

ProxyDamage.9826:

Puandro.3245:

If the thief is worth their salt you wont kill him.

This. Honestly this is currently the problem with Thieves in WvW. They can simply not die due to how much disengage they have. Even if they don’t kill you.

If you stick around they will kilk you eventually.

Depends on your build. If you’re a more glassy build, yes. If you’re a regen/bunker no. He’ll never kill you. But you’ll never kill him either.

I am D/P and S/D, i will kill any bunked ranger given enough time.

Sword+dagger and a hungry jaguar works pretty well on most thieves burst them back and poison them up while evading, being aggressive in general helps I think and don’t stop swinging your sword just cause he disappered in front of you he’s probably still there your sword’s 3 step chain will tell you if you’re hitting him even if you can’t see him just be careful it doesn’t send you flying over a cliff (of course that never happened to me I’m just saying) and remember to command your pet to attack him cause then it will be a homing missile for him everytime he leaves stealth.

ProxyDamage.9826:

Puandro.3245:

ProxyDamage.9826:

Puandro.3245:

If the thief is worth their salt you wont kill him.

This. Honestly this is currently the problem with Thieves in WvW. They can simply not die due to how much disengage they have. Even if they don’t kill you.

If you stick around they will kilk you eventually.

Depends on your build. If you’re a more glassy build, yes. If you’re a regen/bunker no. He’ll never kill you. But you’ll never kill him either.

For some Thieves that is true. The better ones eventually get through the heals.

Ya I’ve been trying to kill a thief all day… Discovered its impossible …well time to make a thief like everyone else lol..

Eurantien.4632:

Longbow 4-2. GS 4. Raven F2.

This^^^^

If you’re gc you’ll still lose, but if you have decent toughness and do the above, it’s even money.

those saying traps, traps do nothing against a thief who knows sup. place all your traps you want he’ll just roll on them for them to trigger and all traps wasted. You will lose against a good d/p.

D/P builds generally don’t have Condition Removal in their spec.

But to answer your question, entangle right after they leap from Blinding Powder at you.

They’ll land rooted in place, Unload on them with whatever you got.

I prefer Jaguar or Drake to the face.

Nuka Cola.8520:

those saying traps, traps do nothing against a thief who knows sup. place all your traps you want he’ll just roll on them for them to trigger and all traps wasted. You will lose against a good d/p.

Trap Build is actually really powerful against D/P

When he blinding powders, throw Spike Trap and Flame Trap on top of it, He’ll get rooted and won’t be able to leap and stealth, and he’ll waste Init that way.

Xsorus i really wonder what kind of people play on your server. No condi removal on stealth with D/P is pretty fail. Also imobolize dont stop thieves from using heartseeker for stealth so it doesnt counter them.

Most of the D/P Thieves i’ve seen don’t run it.

I mean if you’re D/P you basically run Patience and Infusion of Shadow if you’re 20 points, and if you go 30 points you can run the Condition Removal or Shadow Rejuv.

I suppose you can get by without Infusion of Shadow but that kind of goes against the D/P Build.

I should of been more clear about the Leap and Stealth, what I mean is most use Heart Seeker to Leap to you to hit ya and then do Backstab.

If you throw Spike Trap onto them, They waste that Leap, and that Black Powder, that’s a lot of init to use to get nothing out of it.

I have 2 videos of me fighting a D/P thief with the Condition Removal (looks like he’s using it over the Heal)

I won both fights, i’ll post if you want, or you can wait till I make my new video.

Xsorus.2507:

Most of the D/P Thieves i’ve seen don’t run it.

I mean if you’re D/P you basically run Patience and Infusion of Shadow if you’re 20 points, and if you go 30 points you can run the Condition Removal or Shadow Rejuv.

I suppose you can get by without Infusion of Shadow but that kind of goes against the D/P Build.

I should of been more clear about the Leap and Stealth, what I mean is most use Heart Seeker to Leap to you to hit ya and then do Backstab.

If you throw Spike Trap onto them, They waste that Leap, and that Black Powder, that’s a lot of init to use to get nothing out of it.

Those thieves are making pretty dumb decisions then.
First 10 pointa for D/P is Infusion of Shadow, this is pretty much a must.
2nd 20 goes into shadows embrace. 1 condi removed when you stealth and another 3 secs in. With 15 points you stealth lasts 4 secs so if you time it well its 2 condis removed per stealth before you backstab.
3rd 10 points usually go into shadows rejuvination.

Patience is garbage, its 1 initiative every 3 seconds but it only ticks after you are in stealth for 3 seconds so it doesnt work like shadows embrace where it can do a double tick.

Shadow protector regen does not stack with itself or other regen so its pretty bad.

I can perma stealth with D/P chaining BP and HS so i will regen and wait out timers if i need to.

Also aa for your imobolize. Yes you will avoid the HS but a good thief will do 2 more HS and gain 4 more stacks of might then go BS you.

Edit: sure post them ill watch it when im home.

Puandro.3245:

Xsorus.2507:

Most of the D/P Thieves i’ve seen don’t run it.

I mean if you’re D/P you basically run Patience and Infusion of Shadow if you’re 20 points, and if you go 30 points you can run the Condition Removal or Shadow Rejuv.

I suppose you can get by without Infusion of Shadow but that kind of goes against the D/P Build.

I should of been more clear about the Leap and Stealth, what I mean is most use Heart Seeker to Leap to you to hit ya and then do Backstab.

If you throw Spike Trap onto them, They waste that Leap, and that Black Powder, that’s a lot of init to use to get nothing out of it.

Those thieves are making pretty dumb decisions then.
First 10 pointa for D/P is Infusion of Shadow, this is pretty much a must.
2nd 20 goes into shadows embrace. 1 condi removed when you stealth and another 3 secs in. With 15 points you stealth lasts 4 secs so if you time it well its 2 condis removed per stealth before you backstab.
3rd 10 points usually go into shadows rejuvination.

Patience is garbage, its 1 initiative every 3 seconds but it only ticks after you are in stealth for 3 seconds so it doesnt work like shadows embrace where it can do a double tick.

Shadow protector regen does not stack with itself or other regen so its pretty bad.

I can perma stealth with D/P chaining BP and HS so i will regen and wait out timers if i need to.

Also aa for your imobolize. Yes you will avoid the HS but a good thief will do 2 more HS and gain 4 more stacks of might then go BS you.

Edit: sure post them ill watch it when im home.

You sure about Patience? I just tested it out, and it seems like it Regens a lot more then that.

Most Thieves can try and heart seeker 2 more times and then backstab..But it won’t work to well cause then they don’t have any thing to follow that BS up with to actually kill me.

Just looked it up, yea Patience is only 1 init every 3 seconds like you said, it however is incredibly noticeable when using it. Wonder if there is some kind of bug going on.

Its easy to test but im not home atm. Ive tested it to confirm before when i used to play P/D Condi and it was bad.

As for the damage. Depends how glassy thieves are. Im at 15K HP and 2,600 armor with 0/20/30/20/0 build. Also i am D/P and S/D. 3 sec daze is pretty dumb.

I run D/P S/D also, and its very noticeable (I run similar build to you)

I never used it with P/D condi cause really, You don’t use Init much except for C/D

P/D just plays differently from D/P

But I was just trying it out, I was init starved with D/P without it, with it, I could maintain almost a Full Bar fairly easy.

You can see me fighting a D/P thief in this video

Well if you are staying 3 secs in stealth with it then the extra initiative will help you. I run infiltrator signet and it makez a difference and thats 1 every 10 seconds. I can see how an average of 2 initiative every 10 secs will be useful assuming you are staying 3 secs in stealth for it. Ill have to test it tonight. I did test the regen trait few days ago and its still not stacking regen.

Also has a fight at the end, but its no long really usable since I don’t have PI anymore to screw em

Puandro.3245:

Well if you are staying 3 secs in stealth with it then the extra initiative will help you. I run infiltrator signet and it makez a difference and thats 1 every 10 seconds. I can see how an average of 2 initiative every 10 secs will be useful assuming you are staying 3 secs in stealth for it. Ill have to test it tonight. I did test the regen trait few days ago and its still not stacking regen.

Yea the Regen never did stack, I’d only recommend using that talent if you run Healing Power (Then it becomes a 5 Second Regen everytime you stealth that heals for 300+ and stacks with Shadow Rejuv)

I actually ran it with my old Condition Build that used Condition/Vit/HP, the amount of health you can get from that build doing that is silly.

Anyway I think the way the Regen works is it only activates when you actually stealth someone, staying in stealth won’t give you the regen, You actually have to stealth someone.

I don’t run Infil Signet in my build I opted for Shadow Refuge/BP/The Speed one…

How are you beating bunker rangers as a thief? The backstabs at best crit for 4k on a proper bunker ranger, and all the ranger needs to do, because if your stealth only lasts 4 seconds is to circle strafe to deny his back initially and then just use his eveades even when you are stealthed so you’ll be forced out of stealth or use another black powder to HS again, in which case he just uses the wolf fear or entangle to delay your backstab to the point it happens or you can’t get enough backstabs in to outdamage his healing.

And a necro with terror build will screw a thief over pretty badly. All he needs to do is lay the mark, to know when the thief has approached, because even if the thief dodges through the mark you can see it trigger and go into DS or dodge.

All the condition removal won’t matter if you can mess up his momentum with some spike and a muddy terrain or entangle. Hell, go spirit elite and he just blew all his cooldowns to kill you just for you to get back up.

The only thief you can’t kill is a thief with /d offhand because your kitten pet won’t dodge cloak and dagger, so he can regen all he wants.

Xsorus.2507:

Puandro.3245:

Well if you are staying 3 secs in stealth with it then the extra initiative will help you. I run infiltrator signet and it makez a difference and thats 1 every 10 seconds. I can see how an average of 2 initiative every 10 secs will be useful assuming you are staying 3 secs in stealth for it. Ill have to test it tonight. I did test the regen trait few days ago and its still not stacking regen.

Yea the Regen never did stack, I’d only recommend using that talent if you run Healing Power (Then it becomes a 5 Second Regen everytime you stealth that heals for 300+ and stacks with Shadow Rejuv)

I actually ran it with my old Condition Build that used Condition/Vit/HP, the amount of health you can get from that build doing that is silly.

Anyway I think the way the Regen works is it only activates when you actually stealth someone, staying in stealth won’t give you the regen, You actually have to stealth someone.

I don’t run Infil Signet in my build I opted for Shadow Refuge/BP/The Speed one…

Yah i scrapped my Shaman gear Thief when they announced the culling fix and 4 sec reveal debuff, good thing j did too. The regen indeed only procs when you gain stealth regardless if you are in stealth or not unless you have regen….

Speed signet/infil signet/ Shadow Refuge here.

Zenith.7301:

How are you beating bunker rangers as a thief? The backstabs at best crit for 4k on a proper bunker ranger, and all the ranger needs to do, because if your stealth only lasts 4 seconds is to circle strafe to deny his back initially and then just use his eveades even when you are stealthed so you’ll be forced out of stealth or use another black powder to HS again, in which case he just uses the wolf fear or entangle to delay your backstab to the point it happens or you can’t get enough backstabs in to outdamage his healing.

And a necro with terror build will screw a thief over pretty badly. All he needs to do is lay the mark, to know when the thief has approached, because even if the thief dodges through the mark you can see it trigger and go into DS or dodge.

All the condition removal won’t matter if you can mess up his momentum with some spike and a muddy terrain or entangle. Hell, go spirit elite and he just blew all his cooldowns to kill you just for you to get back up.

The only thief you can’t kill is a thief with /d offhand because your kitten pet won’t dodge cloak and dagger, so he can regen all he wants.

Your fighting thieves who you somehow are making them run out of initiative too quickly. Marks/traps ect can be triggered on purpose walking/dodging in stealth and with D/P you have perma stealth and remove all the condis then start the fight with 12 stacks of might. Really to kill a thief you have to blind side him and burst very very quickly 1v1. As long as the thief is patient and knows when to pressure and when to back off you wont win. Stalemate is your best bet or die.

The only reason a thief dies is if he stays and fight.

D/P thief could escape every fight he wants.

Unless you have some kind of BM or trapper build, you won’t be killing the competent stealth thieves. Even with those builds you won’t do the DPS to take them out before they stealth and reset. Just ignore them, they have too much sustain, too many escapes, too many cleanses and near 100% control over the conditions of the fight.

Less experienced thieves can be predictable and you can exploit mistakes in their judgement, but a good thief is a waste of your time.

Puandro.3245:

Zenith.7301:

How are you beating bunker rangers as a thief? The backstabs at best crit for 4k on a proper bunker ranger, and all the ranger needs to do, because if your stealth only lasts 4 seconds is to circle strafe to deny his back initially and then just use his eveades even when you are stealthed so you’ll be forced out of stealth or use another black powder to HS again, in which case he just uses the wolf fear or entangle to delay your backstab to the point it happens or you can’t get enough backstabs in to outdamage his healing.

And a necro with terror build will screw a thief over pretty badly. All he needs to do is lay the mark, to know when the thief has approached, because even if the thief dodges through the mark you can see it trigger and go into DS or dodge.

All the condition removal won’t matter if you can mess up his momentum with some spike and a muddy terrain or entangle. Hell, go spirit elite and he just blew all his cooldowns to kill you just for you to get back up.

The only thief you can’t kill is a thief with /d offhand because your kitten pet won’t dodge cloak and dagger, so he can regen all he wants.

Your fighting thieves who you somehow are making them run out of initiative too quickly. Marks/traps ect can be triggered on purpose walking/dodging in stealth and with D/P you have perma stealth and remove all the condis then start the fight with 12 stacks of might. Really to kill a thief you have to blind side him and burst very very quickly 1v1. As long as the thief is patient and knows when to pressure and when to back off you wont win. Stalemate is your best bet or die.

Stealth doesn’t make them immune to damage. In stealth you will remove a condition every 3 secs. If they can hit a condition more often than that the thief will still take significant damage, enough that when he does come out of stealth, you can burst him to put fearon him and make him back off again or die.

In that scenario, where you can stall enough, you can retreat and recover or he can keep resetting but someone will interfere and kill him.

Patience doesn’t matter because the ranger’s survival is on a low cd. If a thief doesn’t want to die, he won’t, but neither will the ranger.

It’s not about purposely walking through the mark with the necro either. The fact that you triggered it and you have a 4 sec period of stealth to land a backstab, which he can delay with smart positioning and layer with death shroud or dodging means you will rarely be getting off backstabs. Any smart necro or ranger knows to save all his dodges for the stealth period.

The necro will know you have triggered the mark, and he has more aoe abilities than you have total dodges, so you will eat some aoe regardless, and if the necro wants to be cute and also bring well of darkness to foil black powder spam. He’s got 3 fears at his disposal with traits, aoe weakness and bleeding to reduce endurance regen, and a cripple. A good necro even with all your stealth condi clear will not let you stay condition free when he knows you’ve approached him.

A single terror will take out 1/4 of your thief’s HP bar. You can do a reset all you want but time is not on your side as it increases the odds of someone passing by in wvw or in the case of spvp you’re just going to get screwed by reinforcements.

D/P is very effective at gibbing distracted people, but it’s always predictable because like any stealth build you know their period of effectiveness is confined to 4 seconds which you can stall or burden. Once they’re out of stealth they are easily pressured.

The moment you see a black powder go down it’s also very obvious to interrupt what’s gonna come next. All you need is to place a CC on top of it and they’re gonna waste a portion of their newly acquired stealth.

Everytime I see a new thread with this question there are 3 answers:
1. Use a longbow
2. Use traps
3. Run away

Since I use GS/SB and do not trait for traps, I guess the best skill to use against Theives is GS #3 —> M —> double click nearest WP.

Zenith.7301:

Puandro.3245:

Zenith.7301:

How are you beating bunker rangers as a thief? The backstabs at best crit for 4k on a proper bunker ranger, and all the ranger needs to do, because if your stealth only lasts 4 seconds is to circle strafe to deny his back initially and then just use his eveades even when you are stealthed so you’ll be forced out of stealth or use another black powder to HS again, in which case he just uses the wolf fear or entangle to delay your backstab to the point it happens or you can’t get enough backstabs in to outdamage his healing.

And a necro with terror build will screw a thief over pretty badly. All he needs to do is lay the mark, to know when the thief has approached, because even if the thief dodges through the mark you can see it trigger and go into DS or dodge.

All the condition removal won’t matter if you can mess up his momentum with some spike and a muddy terrain or entangle. Hell, go spirit elite and he just blew all his cooldowns to kill you just for you to get back up.

The only thief you can’t kill is a thief with /d offhand because your kitten pet won’t dodge cloak and dagger, so he can regen all he wants.

Your fighting thieves who you somehow are making them run out of initiative too quickly. Marks/traps ect can be triggered on purpose walking/dodging in stealth and with D/P you have perma stealth and remove all the condis then start the fight with 12 stacks of might. Really to kill a thief you have to blind side him and burst very very quickly 1v1. As long as the thief is patient and knows when to pressure and when to back off you wont win. Stalemate is your best bet or die.

Stealth doesn’t make them immune to damage. In stealth you will remove a condition every 3 secs. If they can hit a condition more often than that the thief will still take significant damage, enough that when he does come out of stealth, you can burst him to put fearon him and make him back off again or die.

In that scenario, where you can stall enough, you can retreat and recover or he can keep resetting but someone will interfere and kill him.

Patience doesn’t matter because the ranger’s survival is on a low cd. If a thief doesn’t want to die, he won’t, but neither will the ranger.

It’s not about purposely walking through the mark with the necro either. The fact that you triggered it and you have a 4 sec period of stealth to land a backstab, which he can delay with smart positioning and layer with death shroud or dodging means you will rarely be getting off backstabs. Any smart necro or ranger knows to save all his dodges for the stealth period.

The necro will know you have triggered the mark, and he has more aoe abilities than you have total dodges, so you will eat some aoe regardless, and if the necro wants to be cute and also bring well of darkness to foil black powder spam. He’s got 3 fears at his disposal with traits, aoe weakness and bleeding to reduce endurance regen, and a cripple. A good necro even with all your stealth condi clear will not let you stay condition free when he knows you’ve approached him.

A single terror will take out 1/4 of your thief’s HP bar. You can do a reset all you want but time is not on your side as it increases the odds of someone passing by in wvw or in the case of spvp you’re just going to get screwed by reinforcements.

D/P is very effective at gibbing distracted people, but it’s always predictable because like any stealth build you know their period of effectiveness is confined to 4 seconds which you can stall or burden. Once they’re out of stealth they are easily pressured.

The moment you see a black powder go down it’s also very obvious to interrupt what’s gonna come next. All you need is to place a CC on top of it and they’re gonna waste a portion of their newly acquired stealth.

Once again you keep assuming a thief can’t chain D/P for infinite stealth, yes he will take damage but its not significant from a necro to cause any worry.

Tested patience, used initiative until i was at 0, then i waited for my initiative to tic then use Blinding Powder. My initiative didnt go up by 1 instantly unlike when you use Infusion of Shadow where you gain 2 Initiative instantly. 3 Secs into your stealth i see myself gain an extra initiative very quickly, thats the Trait Patience ticking.

I’ve got to say it definitely is funny reading an 8-paragraph treatise from a thief player about how his class totally has a hard time 1v1 against necromancers.

I’m sure there are some really good necromancer duelists out there who can do what a bunker ranger does 1v1 against a D/P thief (stall them out for a while and hope they stick around and make a mistake before you do) but overall seeing that much rationalization about necromancers countering thieves 1v1 is just sad and nobody with a decent amount of experience is buying it.

Xsorus.2507:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6s7YW3EZvUA

You can see me fighting a D/P thief in this video

Thief played really bad. He chased you then BP + HS instantly instead of BP as soon as coming out of stealth to force you out of melee then HS for stealth.
Also he kept using Shadow Shot waaay too much from stealth to get a BS off on you causing him to waste too much initiative.

Puandro.3245:

Once again you keep assuming a thief can’t chain D/P for infinite stealth, yes he will take damage but its not significant from a necro to cause any worry.

And you don’t seem to understand that he can chain all he wants, because that BP is an indicator of creating a stealth window and most importantly an indicator of where to bomb aoe into (you can’t dodge while using HS).

And a single stack of 3 bleeding at base 1300 condi damage is not “negligible” as you say. 3 stacks by themselves will eat about 1/4 any berserker geared thief’s HP in a few seconds.

It’s not about killing you while in stealth. It’s about detecting your movements and denying you the backstab because the moment you push hard for backstabs is the moment you get killed.

You’ve got shadowstep and the signet as utilities to close in on your target without having to spend initiative and that’s it.

I don’t know how you think a 4k backstab is going to kill a bunker ranger. My ranger has 17-18k HP even if you landed 3 in a row without pressure I’ll heal it back up. My spirit elite and passive regen will heal it back up. And I will self-rez with spirit elite if you pop all cd’s and manage a lucky streak.

Zenith.7301:

Puandro.3245:

Once again you keep assuming a thief can’t chain D/P for infinite stealth, yes he will take damage but its not significant from a necro to cause any worry.

And you don’t seem to understand that he can chain all he wants, because that BP is an indicator of creating a stealth window and most importantly an indicator of where to bomb aoe into (you can’t dodge while using HS).

And a single stack of 3 bleeding at base 1300 condi damage is not “negligible” as you say. 3 stacks by themselves will eat about 1/4 any berserker geared thief’s HP in a few seconds.

It’s not about killing you while in stealth. It’s about detecting your movements and denying you the backstab because the moment you push hard for backstabs is the moment you get killed.

You’ve got shadowstep and the signet as utilities to close in on your target without having to spend initiative and that’s it.

I don’t know how you think a 4k backstab is going to kill a bunker ranger. My ranger has 17-18k HP even if you landed 3 in a row without pressure I’ll heal it back up. My spirit elite and passive regen will heal it back up. And I will self-rez with spirit elite if you pop all cd’s and manage a lucky streak.

Bleed isn’t going to do anything when it will be removed as i enter stealth. Also why do you think i am full berserker. 15K HP and 2,600 armor is not full zerk. I play a BM Bunker Ranger and know how sturdy they can be but they can still die to pressure damage. If the thief is good you die to him or its a stalemate at best no good thief will die. Also ive been talking from a D/P + S/D PoV, 3 sec daze when you get low will mess you up try to heal and you regen will get stolen.

We can not deal with thieves. Any traps or barrage can not simply do enough in 4 seconds (less if you factor in reaction times, cast times, lag, etc.) to make it worth it for them to leave refuge before it ends. I’d go as far as saying that no single profession can except maybe necro if spec’ed for it. Sure some professions (including necro w/ staff and skill #5) can fear/knock them out of it but all we have is the wolf. Unfortunately I found out the hard way tonight that the wolf will not use F2 when you tell it too unless it has a target. When the thief uses SR, the wolf loses them as a target.

Puandro.3245:

Zenith.7301:

Puandro.3245:

Once again you keep assuming a thief can’t chain D/P for infinite stealth, yes he will take damage but its not significant from a necro to cause any worry.

And you don’t seem to understand that he can chain all he wants, because that BP is an indicator of creating a stealth window and most importantly an indicator of where to bomb aoe into (you can’t dodge while using HS).

And a single stack of 3 bleeding at base 1300 condi damage is not “negligible” as you say. 3 stacks by themselves will eat about 1/4 any berserker geared thief’s HP in a few seconds.

It’s not about killing you while in stealth. It’s about detecting your movements and denying you the backstab because the moment you push hard for backstabs is the moment you get killed.

You’ve got shadowstep and the signet as utilities to close in on your target without having to spend initiative and that’s it.

I don’t know how you think a 4k backstab is going to kill a bunker ranger. My ranger has 17-18k HP even if you landed 3 in a row without pressure I’ll heal it back up. My spirit elite and passive regen will heal it back up. And I will self-rez with spirit elite if you pop all cd’s and manage a lucky streak.

Bleed isn’t going to do anything when it will be removed as i enter stealth. Also why do you think i am full berserker. 15K HP and 2,600 armor is not full zerk. I play a BM Bunker Ranger and know how sturdy they can be but they can still die to pressure damage. If the thief is good you die to him or its a stalemate at best no good thief will die. Also ive been talking from a D/P + S/D PoV, 3 sec daze when you get low will mess you up try to heal and you regen will get stolen.

The bleed is not applied when you enter stealth. It’s applied when you get hit by a mark after entering it, and considering you can cover the bleeds with chilblains for poison and chill good luck with staying completely condition clear.

If you’re not full zerker it just means your backstabs will have less impact and the class can stall for less, and 15000 health is hardly stellar against classes that can spam conditions faster than you can clear them and ignore that armor you posted.

The 3 daze involves switching to sword and hitting with flanking from the stealth skill, and that means you’ll be opening with a weapon that has no subsequent pressure out of stealth as your 1 auto spam is your main source of damage and larcenous strike has such an obvious animation. You’ll be locked by weapon switch cd on that weapon for enough time for the ranger to get a heal through.

In fact since you’re not full zerker those backstabs will be hitting my ranger for less than 4k. I have over 2400 toughness, on top of passive regen and quite frankly you can steal all the regen boons you want because they are so easy to reapply from healing spring (which is an almost instant skill and good luck interrupting that or my blast finishers with high healing power).

I also don’t use that kittenty mainhand axe so I got an evade and a daze from the shortbow to throw off your momentum and heal safely while doing more sustained damage than mainhand axe will ever do.

A good sword/torch-shortbow bunker ranger will not die to a thief. He’s just bad if he’s dying to one. More so if he enters the duel knowing it’s a thief and brings in pets with CC like dogs.

I’m not saying the thief will die because any thief can escape whatever mistake they make. I’m saying in a scenario he stays fighting any number of bunker specs will be able to survive and wear him down eventually.

I should mention, yes DP thieves are annoying as hell, but when we use DD that’s a concern as well :‘(. We LOVE to CnD off of the pets. So perhaps placing traps in their path may work? And we do have condition removal, every three seconds we are in stealth if traited for it. But regardless I’d say bunker have the best chance.

DD thieves are trash why would you ever run DD as opposed to DP, DP is better in every single way.

You run DD thief for pve single target damage cnd backstab rotation and that’s it.

A DP thief is a faceroll thief that doesn’t even need to risk missing a cnd because BP>HS stealth is guaranteed.

Puandro.3245:

Xsorus.2507:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6s7YW3EZvUA

You can see me fighting a D/P thief in this video

Thief played really bad. He chased you then BP + HS instantly instead of BP as soon as coming out of stealth to force you out of melee then HS for stealth.
Also he kept using Shadow Shot waaay too much from stealth to get a BS off on you causing him to waste too much initiative.

standard “Thief played really bad”