petless option please
1 2
“back in the day” they nerfed pet damage, around that time they nerfed alot of other things which have previously been unnerfed, notably Ele’s signet healing, and ele seem fairly balanced.
IMHO they should unnerf the pet damage,
or give the ranger the ability to stow pet and gain a buff of some form, maybe even depending on pet.
like stowing a bear would give the ranger a bonus to vitality, healing and toughness,
stowing a cat would give power, precision, ferocity etc.
No, we understand you want it to be optional. We disagree that it should be an option.
Ranger is the pet profession. You made your ranger aware of this fact.
Once more if it was optional and the player was compensated with say, a 30% damage boost, then one of the two options would inevitably become superior to the other. More than likely the stowing of the pet will be the optimal choice as it removes the difficulty of dealing with the AI completely, and so will always be the better choice.
This would result in those of us who rolled the pet profession for the pet being sub-optimal players. We’d be looked down on much as bearbow players are looked down on now, but not for being bad players. For simply wanting to use the class mechanic that we signed up for when making our rangers.
“LOL scrub why u take stupid AI cheese over the straight damage buff? LOOKIT LOSER OVER HERE. LOLOLOL!”
If you don’t want a pet there are other options available. Thief if you wanted to be a fast moving burst damage dealer or warrior if you wanted to be a sturdy fighter type.
Against having an option? this is new to me. It’s like saying "mom, i want you to tell me to go straight to bed, i hate it when you give me the option to do something else’. Why? you get to play pet if you want , why would be against other people having the option not the play the same style you do?
It’s common amongst MMO players for some reason, to be against options. I have no clue why; it clearly doesn’t make any sense. It’s like they aren’t bright enough to realize that making it an option means it’s optional – like they’d somehow be affected by it if they didn’t want to be affected by it.
I strongly agree. I was just thinking earlier how much I’d love to put my pet away and get a % buff. I love everything about the ranger except the pet. Maybe if the pet always worked that’s one thing. But it doesn’t, we should have the option. Those who like the pet ok fine your not effected by this.
Clearly you don’t play an elementalist.
Elementalists sacrifice a LOT more than rangers do for the sake of their class mechanic. They do less damage per skill, their skills have higher cooldowns, and if they are using a shorter range weapon like daggers they are stuck at that range and cannot swap to a more advantageous weapon. Such is the price for the versatility of attunements. Funny you mention cooldowns because an elementalist without 6 in arcane is running a big risk of getting stuck in an element if they aren’t extremely careful with their rotation, which can be a whole lot more fatal than a downed pet.
The risk of cooldowns and being stuck in an attunement is entirely 100% within the control of the player, it’s not slaved to a kitten-poor AI. When some of the elementalist skills are on their excessive cooldown, the base damage of the elementalist remains 100% with the elementalist. Ranger base damage is split 70/30 with the pet. Any time the pet isn’t actively damaging an opponent, the ranger is essentially debuffed to -30% of their base damage. If Ele cooldowns were attached to an AI which has HP but no ability to dodge, you might have an argument.
But they’re not. So you don’t.
Oh and I have an ele, in fact I’ve been through several.
I’m sure there are thieves who’d love to give up the initiative system in favor of normal cooldowns. At the very least it’d mean their skills wouldn’t be under so much scrutiny because of their spammy nature. A thief can choose not to use steal but can’t play without the initiative mechanic, love it or hate it.
A thief can control the rate at which they use ini, running low on ini is 100% within the control of the player, it’s not affected by an AI with HP and no damage mitigation. Base damage of the thief remains at 100% even while ini is being used.
I also have a Thief.
I’m positive there are necromancers who’d love to not rely on Deathshroud for their primary defense. Unfortunately the class is built around it, and so necromancers aren’t allowed to have the mobility that other classes enjoy because of it. A necromancer might be able to not activate Deathshroud, but they still have to suffer from the lack of mobility no matter what they choose, and failure to use Deathshroud in combat would just be a massive handicap.
Death shroud usage is 100% in control of the necro, it isn’t tied to an AI secondary character with HP and no active defense. When death shroud is on cooldown, necro base damage isn’t reduced by 30%, it remains at 100% of normal. When and where the necro uses death shroud is entirely in the hands of the player. They can use it when it’s advantagous and not use it when it isn’t. If Necros were forced by an AI to use deathshroud, if they didn’t have a button to activate when they wanted, then you might have an argument.
But they do. So you don’t.
Yes I have a Necro, too.
I could keep going but I’m sure you get the idea. Every profession in the game is built around their class mechanic. None of them can completely ignore said mechanic and still perform optimally. And ranger isn’t the only profession who loses damage/utility/mobility in favor of balancing those mechanics.
No, but it’s the only class who can’t decide WHEN to use their class mechanic. It’s the only class which splits it’s base damage with a secondary AI which is insufficient in too many encounters. Comparing ranger pet to other class mechanics is an excercise in futility because no other class mechanic takes control away from the player.
I’m not against the ability to turn off your pet during situations where it’s disadvantageous to have the pet out, but I don’t think the ranger should get a stat boost for it. No more so than a necromancer should get super speed when not using Deathshroud or a thief should get increased damage on their skills to compensate for the spammy initiative system not being used.
Necromancers aren’t debuffed by 30% when they don’t use death shroud. All we’re talking about is shifting the pet’s split of the damage back to the ranger.
We should keep focusing our attention on getting our profession mechanic improved, not trying to get it removed.
Removed? Nice strawman, no one is talking about removing the pet, as well you know, they’re talking about having the option to turn it off in bad sitatuations which are entirely outside of the players control and return the split base damage. No other class mechanic is outside the control of the player. Only ranger has to suffer shared base damage. The ranger pet is the only class mechanic which steals damage output and can be turned off by NPCs or other players. It’s the only class mechanic whose usage is decided by the game, instead of the player. It’s the only classs mechanic which can be killed by AoE or focused down by someone else.
As for improved, we’ve been trying to do that since launch. Ranger players have offered countless ways to try redress the balance and fix the pets. ANET basically told us, that they can’t fix the AI and it’s the AI which affects how the pets fail to attack, fail to mitigate damage and ultimately die out of the player’s control. So if they can’t fix the AI, they should fix the encouters, right? You see any plans to alter the games content lying around lately? No? Me neither. So if they’re not going to fix the AI and they’re not going to change the encounters, the only thing left to do is give player control of when they use the pet, then rebalance the missing damage output.
Hey if you can think of a different way to fix the pet, one that doesn’t involve changing it’s AI, then please, go ahead and start a thread about it.
Til then, petless option please.
All of those professions can choose when to activate their skill but they can’t go without using it and expect to remain 100% effective. That is the point I am making. And they are balanced around having that mechanic as a part of the profession.
I am fine with us being able to toggle the pet on and off. I am not fine with us getting a stat bonus to compensate when we actively choose not to use the pet, in the same way that other professions don’t get compensated when they want to not use their mechanics.
An elementalist staying in one attunement doesn’t get their cooldowns reduced to be in line with other professions. A thief doesn’t get to replace the initiative system with standard cooldowns. A necromancer doesn’t get improved mobility skills to compensate for not using Deathshroud.
As you’ve said, plenty of people have offered suggestions on how to improve the pet’s ability in combat. I’ve made a fair few suggestions myself, ranging from more cleave on bears and porcines for PVE to special pet food for WvWvW that improves a pet’s defensive stats based on the number of enemy players in the area. Lots of people have suggested adding dodge frames at the start of “Return to Me” so we can keep the pet alive long enough for it to step out of AoE circles. I’ve seen suggestions of giving us control of a second pet skill so each pet has even more utility which I strongly am in favor of.
As for pets not hitting moving targets in PVP, we do have some of the best cripple and chill up times available. But even then I agree, pets have a hard time landing their damage. So how can we fix that? Giving pets a simple, constant speed boost would do wonders, as would increasing the range on pet melee attacks so they are more likely to hit a fleeing target.
Or we could just introduce more ranged pets, which I would personally love. We could tame wind riders that shoot bolts of lightning from afar. Make them high damage pets like birds that have ranged attacks with decent projectile speed and suddenly you have slightly below bird/feline damage that can hit reliably. We already have spiders and devourers. We could also make drakes have the option to toggle between melee and ranged auto attacks, giving us even more variety in PVP capable pets. Maybe even a special toggle for moas that replaces auto attack with a weak pulse heal? That might be going a bit far, but seeing as moas are built to be support pets that might be just what a back liner in WvWvW needs. A heavy support pet that will remain at your side and provide you with buffs on demand and passive, periodic heals.
Maybe I will make a thread for more ranged pets. Thinking of ideas is pretty fun.
I can see the point here. Ranger pets have a a magical ability to draw all foe and upset specific builds..whoever, this can be micro managed with how you control your pet. I can see why some players may want to opt out of having a pet, but this also makes 50% of traits useless now and 40% of your utilities have no purpose.
Unless the GM trait that removed the pet made it so that any trait or effect that would be applied to your pet applied to you instead.
Solved.
Best would be to lower the amount of damage your pet does across the board. I think right now its like 70/30 or something but w/e the number may be reduce the amount to something like 85/15 and have the beastmastery trait line in addition to pet stats change that ratio in favor of the pet. That way you either have you doing the heavy lifting and have the pet for utility (for those who don’t want the pet) or you invest into your pet and have it do the heavy lifting and you focus on surviving.
Lastly merge “return to me” and “attack” to function depending on what the pet is doing at the time and allow F3 to control another pet skill. Micro managing the pet would do wonders in effective BM specs.
“I’m waiting for the staff to get off their lunch
break. I feel like they should be back by now..”
break. I feel like they should be back by now..”
I would really love to be able to turn off my pet when fighting a thief. pets are ridiculously easy to cloak and dagger off of.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
LGN
reality is about ALL class should use their mechanics.
A thief who doesnt use steal is somewhat a bad player because steal is a free teleport move usefull for closing gap and using various OP move.
A mesmer who doesnt shatter just lost about 50% of its effectiveness as it wont gain the free 4 second invuln or else
A ele who doesnt switch atune has very slow cooldown between moves if not subpar dps
A guardian who forego its Class mechanic may kind of lack a free access to a quick heal block and might stack especialy if using the renewed focus elite to -.-’
A enginer loose a lot when simply not using the toolbelt since TB has a lot of instant attack wich also have a variety of usefull effect
A warrior witheout burst is no warrior to begin with and a build like HB wich runs on perma staying on 100% adrena is outright stupid
A Necro witheout death shroud? So squishy!
Why of all thing now should ranger NOT run a mechanic go and tell me! if anything pet is one of the stronguest mechanic in the game due to its damage rate combined with the various ability pet provide (knockdown fear regen protection might cripple immobilized poison and even a lot of bleed stacks!). Sure the whole class shouldnt be 100% designed around the mechanics either but there of course needs to be a tree of it dedicated to the mechanic (im still clueless as to why the beastmaster tree doesnt have all the benefit reserved to pet or as to why some of the best pet trait such as crit damage and might on crit are in the skirmish line worse yet some trait are totaly useless and shoulve been granted to pet by default such as the increased condition damage crit damage and Healing!)
Trait such as the beastmaster bond wich grant the player might when pet falls below X hp or grant pet enlarge when player is Under 50% hp should be merged togueter with a trait such as for exemple the bloodlust pet stacking trait. And im not talking about stupid stuff like that trait that grants pet health on crit (shouldve been merged with the pet crit increase trait) and the pet condition draw (shouldve been merged with the pet Healing final trait from BM or something else seriously what is a pet related trait doing in survival in the first place especialy as grandmaster!)
So many of these pet trait shouldve been merged back togueter in the beastmastery line with other trait but where are they? in totaly random lines wich either have no link to it or just force the player into specific niches.
If a player wants to run weaker class mechanics at the benefit of more powerfull non mechanic ability they have the right to but the mechanic itself should be a most viable build on its own.
Crystal Desert, The Darknest Community P.E.T.A.
BM: I want to present you my lovely jingle bear mia
If pet had voices: Mommy, I did it! :3
BM: I want to present you my lovely jingle bear mia
If pet had voices: Mommy, I did it! :3
(edited by kyubi.3620)
reality is about ALL class should use their mechanics.
A thief who doesnt use steal is somewhat a bad player because steal is a free teleport move usefull for closing gap and using various OP move.
A mesmer who doesnt shatter just lost about 50% of its effectiveness as it wont gain the free 4 second invuln or else
A ele who doesnt switch atune has very slow cooldown between moves if not subpar dps
A guardian who forego its Class mechanic may kind of lack a free access to a quick heal block and might stack especialy if using the renewed focus elite to -.-’
A enginer loose a lot when simply not using the toolbelt since TB has a lot of instant attack wich also have a variety of usefull effect
A warrior witheout burst is no warrior to begin with and a build like HB wich runs on perma staying on 100% adrena is outright stupid
A Necro witheout death shroud? So squishy!
Why of all thing now should ranger NOT run a mechanic go and tell me! if anything pet is one of the stronguest mechanic in the game due to its damage rate combined with the various ability pet provide (knockdown fear regen protection might cripple immobilized poison and even a lot of bleed stacks!). Sure the whole class shouldnt be 100% designed around the mechanics either but there of course needs to be a tree of it dedicated to the mechanic (im still clueless as to why the beastmaster tree doesnt have all the benefit reserved to pet or as to why some of the best pet trait such as crit damage and might on crit are in the skirmish line worse yet some trait are totaly useless and shoulve been granted to pet by default such as the increased condition damage crit damage and Healing!)
Trait such as the beastmaster bond wich grant the player might when pet falls below X hp or grant pet enlarge when player is Under 50% hp should be merged togueter with a trait such as for exemple the bloodlust pet stacking trait. And im not talking about stupid stuff like that trait that grants pet health on crit (shouldve been merged with the pet crit increase trait) and the pet condition draw (shouldve been merged with the pet Healing final trait from BM or something else seriously what is a pet related trait doing in survival in the first place especialy as grandmaster!)
So many of these pet trait shouldve been merged back togueter in the beastmastery line with other trait but where are they? in totaly random lines wich either have no link to it or just force the player into specific niches.
If a player wants to run weaker class mechanics at the benefit of more powerfull non mechanic ability they have the right to but the mechanic itself should be a most viable build on its own.
steal isnt their main proffession mechanic, intiative is
shatter isnt prof mechanic, illusions are
etc
Honest, hard to argue with these folks and their strawman logics. Look up what “strawman” logic is .
“Option”, must I repeat. “OPTION”. There ! No one talking about forcibly taking pets away for everyone. If you love your pets and think they are awesome , fine, you can toggle it and keep it out as an OPTION. And of course, those that think they are better off would like to permanently tow their pet to focus on sniping target from afar, they should also have the OPTION to do it. And those that feel like to try both style will have the option to do both. That’s “OPTION” is all about. If you think rangers without pets suck , the problem is yours but don’t expect other people to have to be forced to play with a playstyle of your opinion. I’m sure you can find arguments against petless style, but again, that’s your opinion, your style. With all that rant about how AWESOME pets are, you are demanding people to respect your favorred pet playstyle, but have you done your part in respect other’s option?
If ya no longer see me after this post,
it means THEY got me for " neg criticism in clever disguise".
Know that it has been fun and I love ya all.
it means THEY got me for " neg criticism in clever disguise".
Know that it has been fun and I love ya all.
(edited by quaniesan.8497)
Again option brings elitism and elitism brings the death of option
If by any means running petless ended up behing better then running with pet before long all if any ranger running his pet out would get the party kick! I didnt pick up ranger so i could could shoot prety daisy arrows but so i could run a killing machine called the pet.
While giving option to the player not to run the pet could be possible running the pet should also remain a viable if not more viable option (pet cost time control and sacrifice to play correctly those who are eager to makes those sacrifice and live the wedding with the AI should be rewarded as such properly! Difficulty should always be rewarded somehow)
You petless freaks all thinks ranger is better off witheout pet but did you realise the work and dedication it takes a pure pet user to work his/her build trought with effectiveness? Just because a minion master runs on AI doesnt mean the AI doesnt bug or act stupid at time, the micromanagement is ridiculus and its a full time job to keep track of both you and all of your pets if you got any else either you or the pet end up dead, im litteraly managing two character at the same time so why by all means should a build wich runs on a single character be more effective then mine.
Crystal Desert, The Darknest Community P.E.T.A.
BM: I want to present you my lovely jingle bear mia
If pet had voices: Mommy, I did it! :3
BM: I want to present you my lovely jingle bear mia
If pet had voices: Mommy, I did it! :3
Again option brings elitism and elitism brings the death of option
If by any means running petless ended up behing better then running with pet before long all if any ranger running his pet out would get the party kick! I didnt pick up ranger so i could could shoot prety daisy arrows but so i could run a killing machine called the pet.
While giving option to the player not to run the pet could be possible running the pet should also remain a viable if not more viable option (pet cost time control and sacrifice to play correctly those who are eager to makes those sacrifice and live the wedding with the AI should be rewarded as such properly! Difficulty should always be rewarded somehow)
You petless freaks all thinks ranger is better off witheout pet but did you realise the work and dedication it takes a pure pet user to work his/her build trought with effectiveness? Just because a minion master runs on AI doesnt mean the AI doesnt bug or act stupid at time, the micromanagement is ridiculus and its a full time job to keep track of both you and all of your pets if you got any else either you or the pet end up dead, im litteraly managing two character at the same time so why by all means should a build wich runs on a single character be more effective then mine.
See folks, this is a classic example of strawman arguments. These folks created a fake and wrong presentation of idea they don’t like (but they themselves are not forced to adhere to) and argue against it as if that idea will be imposed on them.
No one said ranger is better off without pets. I am saying some people, including me, are better off without pet. If YOU think you are better off with your pets, DO IT, by all means, I’m gona be a civil good sport by not calling you a “pet freak” like you did to me. Choices bring elitism? so should GW2 has only one single profession then because the evil 8 choices would bring elitism? talking about making rules on your own. And you can rant all days about how you think petless is bad, but that’s my problem, my choice , so stay out. You would still have your choice of running pet, then be on your way! and why the need to trash other people’s taste? So much time in the hand aint we.
If ya no longer see me after this post,
it means THEY got me for " neg criticism in clever disguise".
Know that it has been fun and I love ya all.
it means THEY got me for " neg criticism in clever disguise".
Know that it has been fun and I love ya all.
(edited by quaniesan.8497)
All of those professions can choose when to activate their skill but they can’t go without using it and expect to remain 100% effective. That is the point I am making. And they are balanced around having that mechanic as a part of the profession.
Yes, but they don’t have those mechanics tied to an AI which is, in too many situations, unavoidably removed through badly designed mechanics which are out of the control of the player. Those classes don’t have 30% of their base damage tied to the class mechanic and don’t get debuffed when it’s on cooldown, which is exactly what happens to the ranger for ever second that the pet isn’t actively dealing damage. If you want all classes to be equal, then you should demand a 30% damage output debuff for everysingle class when their mechanic is on cooldown.
I am fine with us being able to toggle the pet on and off. I am not fine with us getting a stat bonus to compensate when we actively choose not to use the pet, in the same way that other professions don’t get compensated when they want to not use their mechanics.
The stat bonus is to redress the balance, the lost base damage that comes from not having the pet. Right now, every time the pet is dead, or failing to attack, the ranger loses a third of their base damage. This is unique to the ranger and is out of the ranger’s control far too often, which is also a problem unique to the ranger. Comparing to other class mechanics is apples and oranges.
<snip because this is bit’s of the post are basically copypasta>
As you’ve said, plenty of people have offered suggestions on how to improve the pet’s ability in combat. I’ve made a fair few suggestions myself, ranging from more cleave on bears and porcines for PVE to special pet food for WvWvW that improves a pet’s defensive stats based on the number of enemy players in the area.
Lots of people have suggested adding dodge frames at the start of “Return to Me” so we can keep the pet alive long enough for it to step out of AoE circles. I’ve seen suggestions of giving us control of a second pet skill so each pet has even more utility which I strongly am in favor of.
All of which sounds great, but doesn’t change the encounters where jumping is the only defense against some attacks. These are steps i nthe right direction, but take far more work than simply adding a a buff and permastow. It would be a great short term option until these balance changes and evades, or whatever were introduced. But I mean seriously, this is ANet. Can you honestly see such large changes being made? They can’t even make time to just fix engineer hobosacks.
Frankly, the pet system in GW2 is one of the worst I’ve ever seen, but I’d like to see it improved because I prefer GW2 overall to other games. I’d love to stick with Ranger but pets have been this bad since closed beta, the devs knew it and did nothing. They still haven’t and I don’t expect them to.
As for pets not hitting moving targets in PVP, we do have some of the best cripple and chill up times available. But even then I agree, pets have a hard time landing their damage. So how can we fix that? Giving pets a simple, constant speed boost would do wonders, as would increasing the range on pet melee attacks so they are more likely to hit a fleeing target.
Or we could just introduce more ranged pets, which I would personally love. <snipping good ideas for brevity>
Maybe I will make a thread for more ranged pets. Thinking of ideas is pretty fun.
You should, the game desperately needs more pets and more pet control.
The problem is that most of these ideas make pets more complicated, which in the past, Devs have expressly rejected. What was basically said, in not so many words is that, you see, we’re gamers, which means we’re all too stupid to control more than a few pet skills at a time. Never mind the fact that even WoW, even that lowest common denominator targeting, ever-simplified, over-simplified PoS that WoW has become, still credits players with enough intelligence to use more than a few keys to control their pets. Anet…not so much.
Welcome to GW2.
In the meantime, adding a stow+ buff is simple and would be effective. I wouldn’t even mind if it was on a timer with cooldown. Mind you, even just stow would be fantastic at certain times.
My ranger has tasted a full year of pet hate I think any beast master worth its salt who has truly tried to run 100% on a pet build would be angry by now with all those ‘’NO pet please remove it make it optional’’ guys who by the way might just end up being the first people to kick you out of a team if you run one especialy if you build revolve 100% around it with little personal damage and heavy pet dps. If BM is to be optional they better make it so able to compete on damage with a ranger who runs without if not actually do better to compensate the management wich itself would now be optional and promote the lazy choice of just not running one.
It would be highly ridiculus for a guy fighting alone to deal more damage then a duo. While I don’t disagree it could open the way for some sort of tanking spec using condition damage and running on aspect more similar to a animist shaman barbarian then a pet user I really don’t think a pure sniper should deal more damage then a pair of character fighting together to bring the target down (one arrow < a bite and an axe toss I mean honestly what do you think logically would cause a bigger wound?)
Crystal Desert, The Darknest Community P.E.T.A.
BM: I want to present you my lovely jingle bear mia
If pet had voices: Mommy, I did it! :3
BM: I want to present you my lovely jingle bear mia
If pet had voices: Mommy, I did it! :3
(edited by kyubi.3620)
These folks created a fake and wrong presentation of idea they don’t like (but they themselves are not forced to adhere to) and argue against it as if that idea will be imposed on them.
No one said ranger is better off without pets. I am saying some people, including me, are better off without pet. If YOU think you are better off with your pets, DO IT, by all means.
No, he just stated an hypothesis, IF the petless option was better in dungeons for example, then it wouldn’t be a matter of personal preference, you would need to go petless in the dungeon, it is just like the current zerker set with sword, this combo IS the best option, if you don’t like it and prefer other set and weapon, well too bad you are out of the meta.
Charter Vanguard [CV] – HoD
Bardy Belzebuson – Ranger Sir Belzebu – Herald
(and the other 8 elite specs maxed too)
(and the other 8 elite specs maxed too)
I am confused about this petless option stuff… In what situation does the pet cause a problem? Running dungeons with beginners who don’t know how the game works? The pet only “gets in the way” when it is told to do something silly. The petless option is to equip a bird and put it on passive. Problem solved.
Jade Quarry – Esparie
Illustrious Exhausted Primordial Legendary Druid, and Mesmer for fun
PvE | PvP (1500)| WvW | Fractals | Dungeons
Illustrious Exhausted Primordial Legendary Druid, and Mesmer for fun
PvE | PvP (1500)| WvW | Fractals | Dungeons
I am confused about this petless option stuff… In what situation does the pet cause a problem? Running dungeons with beginners who don’t know how the game works? The pet only “gets in the way” when it is told to do something silly. The petless option is to equip a bird and put it on passive. Problem solved.
Ranger base damage is reduced by 30% to compensate for the damage output of the pet. Ranger and pet together have the same base damage output as other classes. In other words, anytime that your pet is in transition, dead or on passive you are 30% weaker. If your pet is not connecting with hits, you are 30% weaker. This is why rangers have only a few cooldown skills (eg. SotW, QZ) which have to be blown simultaneously in order to reach competitive burst damage.
What’s worse, for people who actually want to use the pet or spec into BM there are more than a few dungeon encounters where the pet’s inability to, jump, dodge or otherwise mitigate damage, means constant pet swapping and more time for pets in transit. Whenever you spec for pet damage / survival, you lower your character damage output further , inorder to disproportionately buff the pet to a lower degree. An overall damage reduction. Added to the fact that a pet which isn’t actively attacking is lost DPS and you have a sitatuation where all the Ranger Class is weaker in it’s default state than every other class and a pet specced ranger is weaker still than non bm builds, due to a pet that is capable of dealing more damage than a non BM but still doesn’t really hit and therfor doesn’t actually deal that extra damage. The pet’s 30% damage plus any buff to that damage is lost due to mechanics which are entirely out of the ranger’s control. 70-30 becomes 70 – 0. In the case of a BM build 70 – 30+10 becomes 70 – 0. Meanwhile other classes have base 100. No split.
A passive pet is worthless and is little more than an extra utility button, with a passive damage debuff to your ranger. That being the case, why bother with the pet at all? A utility button with it’s own sprite is hardly worthy of being called a pet. Especially for a “pet class”.
(edited by wolfyrik.2017)
Simple truth… in guild wars 1 my jingle bear 16-14 ranger build with a spear/shield soloed Duncan the black from slaver exiles out of pure damage and raw tanking. Ill just mention that unlike here the guild wars 1 pet was a 600 hp killing machine with the constant option of a 30 point damage reduction, hasted attack and movement antiblock, 6 self regen heal on hit, 7 degen and over 120+ damage hit spamming (aka dervlike damage). Guild Wars 1 pet was in all mather actualy superior to a player unit as it also could be resurrected to full health every 8 second via heal as one and NEVER had a death penalty wich also made it the ultimate tanking weapon for taking initial nukes, whats more ranger didn’t even ned to participate himself he could just sit in a corner and run around while pet wrecked everything.
Pets here neither do the insane damage they did in GW 1 (altrought at time they are more then able to score crazy critical hits) Or possess their sturdiness (as I said all pet in GW1 had ridiculously high hp could be resurrected at will via heal as one every 8 second and tanked like trucks effectively behing able to even solo other player in battle!) Such a composition sacrificed the ranger ability to deal damage entirely as the build relyed totally on shouts and pet buff wich in the best scenario affected both the character and the pet.
The issue here is ranger pet not only have ridiculus respawn cooldown but also just stands and takes all the hit. If a spell like heal as one wich is currently in our list did resurrect the pet on each use with full health and maybe granted the life steal on hit to pet per attack for pet and master (HAO healed the ranger for about 30 hp per pet hit for a while) then likely BM would be easier to play
Crystal Desert, The Darknest Community P.E.T.A.
BM: I want to present you my lovely jingle bear mia
If pet had voices: Mommy, I did it! :3
BM: I want to present you my lovely jingle bear mia
If pet had voices: Mommy, I did it! :3
(edited by kyubi.3620)
If they improved the pet AI and gave us full controll over their abilities then yes pets would be a very viable option, but at the stage it’s now I just put them into passive mode and just use the F2 ability, wich I could just aswell not have with me at all. I just don’t see any reason why I can’t stove it permanently. If there is drawbacks to dps or survival then I’m the one getting hurt for it, right? Just give me the freedom to choose.
I am confused about this petless option stuff… In what situation does the pet cause a problem? Running dungeons with beginners who don’t know how the game works? The pet only “gets in the way” when it is told to do something silly. The petless option is to equip a bird and put it on passive. Problem solved.
Ever fight an offhand dagger thief? Or a necro that has the intelligence to use epidemic on your pet since most of our “condition removal” is really just transferring the condi’s to our pet? The pet becomes a huge liability in quite a number of situations.
I would much rather the pets be fixed but if they are too lazy to do that then there should be a stow option with some kind of boost.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
LGN
Ranger CDI
If you’ve seen my posts on ele’s sticking to a single element and engineers and their kits
The rangers are on my hit list for an in depth look into traits and skills and the potential of how the ‘spirit of animal x’ will work both passive and actively
-Phyrak
I would also play a ranger if I did not have to deal with the perma pet situation. I do not enjoy micromanaging a poorly designed AI pet. I have been thinking the same thing as a solution as you have apparently. Stowing the pet granting the ranger an “aspect of the pet” type bonus. This would solve 90% of my issues with the ranger profession.
The below is not directed to Phyrak, but just to the flavor of other posts so far in this thread:
Its always funny looking at all these other posts telling anyone who doesn’t like it to re-roll though…as if the game design decisions are theirs to make. No one is asking for pets to be removed from the ranger class. No one is asking for any nerf to pets or the play style of other rangers. What is being asked for is an option for a different play style for rangers that choose to build/trait for that specific play style. I’ll never understand how people get so bent out of shape when someone even suggests and option that won’t even affect their own play experience if they choose not to use it themselves. That’s like getting mad about the addition of some random new option in the settings menu that you don’t intend to use anyway.
Devs posted already that perma-stow options won’t happen, rangers are supposed to be the pet class in GW2 (Not that I agree 100%, but that is what was said by a dev).
Search for the Ranger CDI in the profession balance sub-forum, the post is there.
At the same time they don’t improve pets and their utility skills (shouts) and their traitline. Ranger is the one class where the class defining mechanic works by far the least.
Especially in pvp pets have huge issues and a large amount of pets sees nearly no use.
(edited by Dojo.1867)
Honest, hard to argue with these folks and their strawman logics. Look up what “strawman” logic is .
“Option”, must I repeat. “OPTION”. There ! No one talking about forcibly taking pets away for everyone. If you love your pets and think they are awesome , fine, you can toggle it and keep it out as an OPTION. And of course, those that think they are better off would like to permanently tow their pet to focus on sniping target from afar, they should also have the OPTION to do it. And those that feel like to try both style will have the option to do both. That’s “OPTION” is all about. If you think rangers without pets suck , the problem is yours but don’t expect other people to have to be forced to play with a playstyle of your opinion. I’m sure you can find arguments against petless style, but again, that’s your opinion, your style. With all that rant about how AWESOME pets are, you are demanding people to respect your favorred pet playstyle, but have you done your part in respect other’s option?
Honestly even as an “option” you’re really not solving issues outside of pve agro. The pet is a portion of your dps, so even if it takes forever to make a path to your target and hits him for 1k, that’s your dps. The thing most people want is for ranger dps to not suck due to pet behavior, and there are many ways to go about it but removing the pet or making it optional are not a solution.
I’d say the easiest solution to band-aid and eventually fix the pet hate is,
-Change the % of dps the pet is meant to do for the ranger to something almost absent (if its 70/30, make it like 90/10).
-Look over all power related skills and make sure none of them go over the top due to the above change (conditions don’t get effected by pet really, not that I’ve noticed aside from immobilize utility spiders)
-In addition to increasing the stats for pet’s when investing into BM, now it will also change the conversion rate of dps more in favor of your pet (so if it is 90/10, each point will change the percent by 5% to a max of 60(you)/40(pet)).
-look over all utility pets to make them all useable so that rangers who do not go into BM have numerous options to utilize the pet seeing as it will have next to no dps.
-Lastly, merge follow me to attack (selection will depend on what the pet is currently doing), remove stow as an F3, and give the other 2 pet skills the option to make them player control only or leave them as AI selected.
Definitely a lot of work but for me, that would fix my issues with being pet bound to where it feels like an option without removing the pet from the game. Notice I said easiest despite the wall of text, that’s because fixing pet isn’t going to be easy :/
“I’m waiting for the staff to get off their lunch
break. I feel like they should be back by now..”
break. I feel like they should be back by now..”
I just want it at this point to be stowable in combat so I can stop taking double/triple damage on bouncing projectiles and being stealth fodder for thieves…
Formal Thief Elite Spec proposal:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/ES-Suggestion-The-Deadeye-FORMAL/
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/ES-Suggestion-The-Deadeye-FORMAL/
I just want it at this point to be stowable in combat so I can stop taking double/triple damage on bouncing projectiles and being stealth fodder for thieves…
The obvious solution for this problem that should have never been a problem to begin with is to increase the damage ratio to favor the ranger more and to just have an option to stow the pet without any comprehensive overhauls or over the top buffs.
That way you’d generally want to keep the pet for its utility and extra damage, but it wouldn’t be absolutely mandatory in all situations to have it out.
I would like to keep pets too but change it so they get increased survivability in all content but do less base damage the BM traitline could then boost them more than now and rangers themselves could have a small increase in base damage so the end result would mean the exact same total damage as now only the damage is focused more depending on how you build and pets would keep the exact same utility functions as now.
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