Guild Wars 2

MattyP.6954:

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Wait… Mortar Autos hit faster than Longbow? BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Boy you must be crazy.

Also, comparing an [elite] AoE weapon kit to a single-target weapon is beyond silly.

Go home. You’re Drunk. :-)

I had a friend test things beside me the moment patch hits. They do hit faster even if we trait Lead the Wind, and their cast point is as far as our barrage. Their autos also hit harder even after the damage nerf.

I’m also not comparing just an elite kit with a single target weapon, it is about what a class can do in a wvw zerg. The comparison of the full potential of a class vs another.

If you don’t know kitten, don’t post. Stop embarrassing yourself.

Eval.2371:

Chiming in here. Yes we lost 20% modifiers we also gained quick draw. Zerg for the most part are not a sustained fight, at least if your living thorough the entire fight. Your in and your out. Then back in. It is the only way to live in this current meta with all of its damage.

This is especially true if you play front line, you go in you burst your target you get out. Remorseless and quick draw let us do that.

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Totally agree with you longbow is in a bad spot.
Your comparing an elite kit to a a subpar weapon. What ever.

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A lot of people say, X class does Y better than ranger so why run ranger. I totally get this view point I mean

• mesmer has more burst
• War has more utility and sustain
• Engi has more condi
• Ele does more with ice bow than entire kit.
• etc the list goes on

Which is all true. However, ranger is the only class that has package of sustain, survivability, burst, utility and fun. When I die playing my ranger it’s because of personal mistakes rather than not having a tool to deal with what ever opponent. Every other class has something they can’t/struggle to deal with. Ranger has some form of counter to everything. That’s why I play ranger.

1) Quick Draw is a really fun trait to have. It can be used offensively or defensively (mostly defensively in zerg), but can’t we keep the damage? Like come on, every class gained something extra, why do we have to settle for a trade?

2) All a ranger can do is pew pew in a zerg, 2nd weapon set is usually for escape, utilities are defensive mechanisms. My point is engi can do a whole lot more than that, while having similar sustained range pressure.

3) You described the very reason why I like playing a Ranger in a zerg But still, the damage nerf is just too huge. We already contribute very little to a zerg and that just got worse.

I almost feel as if this was a QOL patch for ranger, and not a balance patch.

TU going survival, RAO going 60s, baked in Loud Whistle and pet stats..these things seem like they should have been there from the beginning.

The problem is everyone else got balance updates. So we are where we should have been prior to the patch…making us still one step behind.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

MattyP.6954:

• Rangers are so weak!

This is hilarious considering how many “Rangers are OP!” threads there are in the WvW subforum. It can’t be both! Is it safe to assume that we’re somewhere in the middle?

Actually, I think it can be both. Ranger is extremely powerful against poor players and they are the ones that are always crying OP on the forums. Against a good player, the Ranger is fairly weak, comparatively. Some really good players play Ranger though and they make the rest of us look better.

^ This

Make a thread on the WvW forum asking if the Ranger is a good Zerg pick and you will either get crickets, or a sea of “No” in varying levels of politeness.

Make a thread mentioning zerk LB or just use the words Rapid Fire and you will get people almost exclusively using mathematically impossible damage amounts, at impossible ranges, claiming there was “no way I could counter it”. According to them we are walking orbital laser strike platforms. We’ll kittening 360 noscope your noob butt from the Moon and there’s no where to hide!

One group says we’re not a great pick and the other says we’re uber OP.

We do make solid pin sniping teams but everyone hates that and every server pretends they don’t do it so it never really get’s mentioned.

Regen/condi ranger is a whole different animal though and is quite feasible in the BL ruins but is pointless in a zerg and doesn’t attract the ire of baddies so it’s really more of a different discussion.

Malchior.1928:

As for mesmer, they need their burst toned down because everyone can agree they are a bit too strong at the moment.

They need their insane burst toned down … a LOT!
They need a stealth nerf. They already have blink, invis, snares, endless clones etc and now endless stealth as well? sigh….
They need their reflects nerfed … big time! The Longbow ‘piercing arrow’ trait should negate reflects.

Malchior.1928:

But right now ranger is in a pretty good spot.

Um no, Ranger WAS an ‘ok’ spot at best with the recent patch. But now that you nerfed our ONLY might stack skill (Carion Bond) we’re useless ….. again.

Yeah rangers are very weak now. Throw torch with 2 stacks is ridicolous!

Rangers are fine. Several other classes not so much as it relates to bugged traits and game play. Look at Guardians and Engineers for example. Guardians will have a trait removed and Engineers get to enjoy pew pew for a few more days if not months (until Mag runs a all Engineer group destroying WvW – then we will see change).

How or why we are in the state we can all debate until the cows come home but it really doesn’t matter. Play to have fun and escape reality. If that isn’t the reward you get after logging in then it is time to take a break. No money lost and you can pick up later if you so desire.

Rangers may not be as good as other class but… but… I still enjoy ranger alot. I don’t know why. Whenever I see good players on rangers, they make me not to give up.

• Perma Fury
• Perma Swiftness
• Perma Regen
• Perma Might (minimum 5 stacks 30s, Nature Magic with Jungle Stalker)
• 150 Team Wide + Precision (Spotter)
• A Crapload of Immob for some control
• The only profession to access Taunt PRE-HoT, and on a low Cooldown (again more CC)
• Potentially heal for 14K health every minute (Invigorating Bond + Fernhound)

Yes Spirits need a lot of tweaking
Yes Shouts could get more love
Traps are actually real solid (if you actually test them out)
Yes some traits need some tweaking

But rangers don’t exactly suck even now

Here is my two cents on my favorite class in WvW (as a new to game player).

Ranger can bring a great deal to the table by providing cover for the team from wall attacks as they set up and operate the rams. However often you’ll have a “out of range” or “obstructed” when firing at an enemy on top of the wall when you actually have a clear LOS.

Now from the defensive role I find it incredibility nuts that barrage can’t be fired down on the enemy from the top of the walls while arrow carts can now fire around walls.

If your out of supply it sure would be nice if that rangers barrage could act like a portable arrow cart, be it defending or storming the castle. It is already a limited special because it locks you into place in order to use it or it cancels.

Seriously? that is one of the two specials that are the most effective offensively (which is why every ranger uses them) and one locks you down or cancels out the attack while the majority of defense for the class is based on mobility and speed.

Point blank and hunters shot are actually defensive skills on the the attack bar. I play other classes, and defensive stuff is usually on the utility bar (in most cases). So ranger has one really good attack with a LB but if you don’t equip and stack your traits just right for that one special you’ll be way pointing alot in WvW after you’ve been spiked.

Spirits? Utterly usless. I’m a mid weight class that has to stay mobile to survive. I don’t have time to play ring around the spirit that gives me a useless 3 second boon that may or may not deliver depending on if it decides to proc. Who thought that was a good idea?

Short bow? Huge disappointment. I actually find it to be more of a utility bar with sub-par attacks.

Greatsword? Who is the developer that is such a fanboy of the kitten greatsword? Light and medium classes shouldn’t be going toe to toe with warriors. In fact you might survive if you don’t allow them to close on you.

Pets have one attack with a long cool-down? My guardian aside from having an attack and utility bar has something similar to the extra bar that rangers have for pets, but the guardian gets three specials out of their third bar.

If I could ask for anything for ranger it would be that its run speed boost be removed from signet of the hunt and put somewhere on the survival tree, and that "all condi cleansing was tied to a dodge roll. leaving the utility bar open for evades and traps.

Then it might be nice to have some more useful attacks instead of one really really good attack.

Kamara.4187:

…Greatsword? Who is the developer that is such a fanboy of the kitten greatsword? Light and medium classes shouldn’t be going toe to toe with warriors. In fact you might survive if you don’t allow them to close on you…

You should be able to go toe-to-toe with a Warrior and beat them with your GS, it is a rather fantastic weapon and you should really try it. Warriors are no problem. So many evades with block and stun.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Kamara.4187:

…Greatsword? Who is the developer that is such a fanboy of the kitten greatsword? Light and medium classes shouldn’t be going toe to toe with warriors. In fact you might survive if you don’t allow them to close on you…

You should be able to go toe-to-toe with a Warrior and beat them with your GS, it is a rather fantastic weapon and you should really try it. Warriors are no problem. So many evades with block and stun.

Ranger is in a pretty decent state.
All they need to do is nerf some blatantly OP stuff, say some warrior burst, some guardian/engi/ele burning, some mesmer stunner.

once the nerfbat whacks engi/guard/mesmer/burning dmg the playing field will be a whole lot more level. on the sPVP side I could see ranger being used more. In WvW we’ll still fill the same roles we always have as snipers, in the zerg or roamers.

the one area of the current metagame that we have been lacking in and still do is in the dungeon meta. Clarion Bond would have made us more valuable but that got nerfed. Spirits are really the area that need to be improved to make us part of the meta, mobile or immobile if they gave decent buffs that the team could use the ranger would be valuable.

i dont know why, i love those kind of threads, they always make me smile and my day brighter.
ok so to clear some stuff, im a wvw roamer and an spvper.
can you tell me how ranger counts weak? i am playing a full melee POWER ranger with only 3 parts as zerker, now please, tell me how they are weak?
your argument is invalid in so many levels.
i have played LB before rapidfire buff and owned ppl, i played before this patch with my melee build and owned ppl, i am playing now with my melee build and own ppl.
its either you dont know how to use your pets and skills or you are just not fit-table to play a ranger.
i have proved that you can play ranger in many ways and not turning to condi or meta in the past 8 months and im determine to do it in expansion with the druid where everybody else say will suck.

i respect your opinion that you think rangers are weak, but my tip is… keep trying and you will find your way into it, if not, then play some other proffession.

Cheers.
Bob The Potato

I think it is still a little too early to tell but, in this current iteration, we can stack conditions to a nearly insane degree. Don’t take my word for it, though. Try it yourself.

Put every single trait, utility, sigil, and rune into conditions. Focus of fire first, poison and bleed second, and see how it goes. Sure, thieves and other professions can hit hard, but you can melt a whole group of helpless targets in a few seconds. Our condition abilities are designed around constantly reapplying and stacking conditions.

I don’t believe we suck, but I do believe it can be very difficult to win some fights. Is it too hard to win sometimes? I don’t know.

Why are people in this thread even talking about zerg fights as something worth wasting words on? Whatever you bring there, as long as it’s not a “GvG”, won’t matter if you don’t outnumber the other team (or have some other advantage like siege).

Elorna.5329:

Why are people in this thread even talking about zerg fights as something worth wasting words on? Whatever you bring there, as long as it’s not a “GvG”, won’t matter if you don’t outnumber the other team (or have some other advantage like siege).

I see BG zergs run over larger TC and JQ zergs constantly because of good comp and people who know what they are doing. Numbers only comes into play when its grossly disproportionate or the teams are about even in ability.

So, ya. It matters.

Substance E.4852:

Elorna.5329:

Why are people in this thread even talking about zerg fights as something worth wasting words on? Whatever you bring there, as long as it’s not a “GvG”, won’t matter if you don’t outnumber the other team (or have some other advantage like siege).

I see BG zergs run over larger TC and JQ zergs constantly because of good comp and people who know what they are doing. Numbers only comes into play when its grossly disproportionate or the teams are about even in ability.

So, ya. It matters.

Smart play does usually win the day such as knowing when to disengage or use the map to your advantage. However, there are times when even that overcome numbers. We also know the past week or so the patch hasn’t helped any so that also goes out the window

Rangers are fine. I run both zerker and condition/traps and having fun. Even spirits come in handy I’m finding which is really odd.

If I can find the patch somewhat successful and rangers being ok has an average player I’d say Rangers are down right OP in the hands of skilled players.

Crapgame.6519:

Smart play does usually win the day such as knowing when to disengage or use the map to your advantage. However, there are times when even that overcome numbers. We also know the past week or so the patch hasn’t helped any so that also goes out the window

Certainly. It just gets tiresome to see people kitten on zerg combat while holding 3-5v1 roaming up as the golden standard.

Substance E.4852:

Crapgame.6519:

Smart play does usually win the day such as knowing when to disengage or use the map to your advantage. However, there are times when even that overcome numbers. We also know the past week or so the patch hasn’t helped any so that also goes out the window

Certainly. It just gets tiresome to see people kitten on zerg combat while holding 3-5v1 roaming up as the golden standard.

In case that’s what you think my unsaid intention with the previous post was, it’s not. I actually have a very low opinion of any and all forms of MMO PvP, GW2 included, just that zerg is an extra category below that considering the amount of players required and lower impact of individuals. Overall, I’m surprised at Anet striving so hard to balance this game based on SPvP (even though they’re not doing a good job of it). PvE is the main strength of GW2, and where the majority of players spend their time. When I feel like playing PvP I chose a different genre.

Elorna.5329:

Substance E.4852:

Crapgame.6519:

Smart play does usually win the day such as knowing when to disengage or use the map to your advantage. However, there are times when even that overcome numbers. We also know the past week or so the patch hasn’t helped any so that also goes out the window

Certainly. It just gets tiresome to see people kitten on zerg combat while holding 3-5v1 roaming up as the golden standard.

In case that’s what you think my unsaid intention with the previous post was, it’s not. I actually have a very low opinion of any and all forms of MMO PvP, GW2 included, just that zerg is an extra category below that considering the amount of players required and lower impact of individuals. Overall, I’m surprised at Anet striving so hard to balance this game based on SPvP (even though they’re not doing a good job of it). PvE is the main strength of GW2, and where the majority of players spend their time. When I feel like playing PvP I chose a different genre.

Then why bother to even post in a thread talking about pvp?

“considering the amount of players required and lower impact of individuals” odd that you hate WvW for this reason yet you like GW2 PvE which is 100% this kind of content for overworld.

Elorna.5329:

Substance E.4852:

Crapgame.6519:

Smart play does usually win the day such as knowing when to disengage or use the map to your advantage. However, there are times when even that overcome numbers. We also know the past week or so the patch hasn’t helped any so that also goes out the window

Certainly. It just gets tiresome to see people kitten on zerg combat while holding 3-5v1 roaming up as the golden standard.

In case that’s what you think my unsaid intention with the previous post was, it’s not. I actually have a very low opinion of any and all forms of MMO PvP, GW2 included, just that zerg is an extra category below that considering the amount of players required and lower impact of individuals. Overall, I’m surprised at Anet striving so hard to balance this game based on SPvP (even though they’re not doing a good job of it). PvE is the main strength of GW2, and where the majority of players spend their time. When I feel like playing PvP I chose a different genre.

Well, if that is true then the really missed the mark because this so called PvE is pretty simple in the grand scheme of things. You want PvE then the standard has already been set by the 10 ton heavy thing that beings with a W. Most would even argue that sPvP is also better over there due to their 2, 3’s, and 5 group arena play format. Sure, it has flaws and balance issues just like any other multiplayer game but it is what it is.

WvW, a format they borrowed from DaOC, to include the original relics that are no longer functioning, is what sets it apart from the game that starts with a W. Max battle is 40×40 and lasts 30 minutes. Here we go for a week and only queue until side capacity is reached.

Anyway – back to rangers and sucking. It is an opinion and I’d doubt the OP would agree with those that think otherwise. There is a lot going on with the patch that makes some classes look better than others. Some things have been fixed, others not.

I think it would be wise to hold off on the sucking part until a few more tweaks are made. Just my opinion anyway.

Substance E.4852:

Then why bother to even post in a thread talking about pvp?

“considering the amount of players required and lower impact of individuals” odd that you hate WvW for this reason yet you like GW2 PvE which is 100% this kind of content for overworld.

As to your first point – because the genre itself is not a good “breeding ground” for class balance, which many people seem to forget in these endless debates. That’s something worth pointing out. Basically take my yammering as a “chill, and enjoy the game, don’t expect it to be balanced”. Especially not in an inherently uneven playing ground such as WvW.

As to your second point – I mostly play solo or with one or two other people in open world PvE and do the massive events sparingly. Not that it requires skill even then, but any success or failure is mostly on me. Plus I enjoyed the lore of Tyria in GW1 and still do to an extent in GW2, and I get to have more time and opportunity to do so in PvE compared to WvW.

ProtoMarcus.7649:

But rangers don’t exactly suck even now

They do in PvE because the only trait that finally gave us our own little might stacking, was nerfed!

DarkFlopy.8197:

i dont know why, i love those kind of threads, they always make me smile and my day brighter.
ok so to clear some stuff, im a wvw roamer and an spvper.
can you tell me how ranger counts weak? i am playing a full melee POWER ranger with only 3 parts as zerker, now please, tell me how they are weak?
your argument is invalid in so many levels.
i have played LB before rapidfire buff and owned ppl, i played before this patch with my melee build and owned ppl, i am playing now with my melee build and own ppl.
its either you dont know how to use your pets and skills or you are just not fit-table to play a ranger.
i have proved that you can play ranger in many ways and not turning to condi or meta in the past 8 months and im determine to do it in expansion with the druid where everybody else say will suck.

i respect your opinion that you think rangers are weak, but my tip is… keep trying and you will find your way into it, if not, then play some other proffession.

Cheers.
Bob The Potato

You are a much better Ranger than 90% of us mate Especially those that cannot see builds in this current trait setup.

It’s a decent troll profession in WvW roaming.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

DarkFlopy.8197:

i dont know why, i love those kind of threads, they always make me smile and my day brighter.
ok so to clear some stuff, im a wvw roamer and an spvper.
can you tell me how ranger counts weak? i am playing a full melee POWER ranger with only 3 parts as zerker, now please, tell me how they are weak?
your argument is invalid in so many levels.
i have played LB before rapidfire buff and owned ppl, i played before this patch with my melee build and owned ppl, i am playing now with my melee build and own ppl.
its either you dont know how to use your pets and skills or you are just not fit-table to play a ranger.
i have proved that you can play ranger in many ways and not turning to condi or meta in the past 8 months and im determine to do it in expansion with the druid where everybody else say will suck.

i respect your opinion that you think rangers are weak, but my tip is… keep trying and you will find your way into it, if not, then play some other proffession.

Cheers.
Bob The Potato

You are a much better Ranger than 90% of us mate Especially those that cannot see builds in this current trait setup.

definitely i based my exuberant Cav/valk ranger off your first Saimoth build with LB,sword+dagger, these new traits just make my build stronger now.
im working on Maximising it by swapping some Vit into a Healing stat and trying to get the most out of instinctive reactions.

my favourite set up , is a bark tank .

though right now im running one of these two for tests/testing
MDG hunter
http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-J;4wEFx-v2NDV-0;9-1W;1_aZ;0148137238;4INW6a;1_MTt_MTt00kq4-siA2;1ZbZ6_b_6ababCsVJV310;4cYDoc2CscYDucYDu;9;9;9;9-VD-6G

alternate Bountiful hunter
http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-J;4wEFx-v2NDV-0;9-1W;1_ab;0248137247;4INW6a;1_MTt_MTt00kq4-siA2;1ZbZ6_b_6ababCsVJV310;4cYDoc2CscYDucYDu;9;9;9;9-VD-6x
this one swaps skirmishing for Beastmastery , reactions > bountiful hunter > and GM Zyphers speed for might and quickness , optimised (maybe Holbrek runes) Sigils as current , both of these builds can stack 8-13 poisons while dealing a great burst damage and applying a decent stack of bleeds.

Gs is condi for the reason to Increase Spike traps performance while stacked with Poison , the Devourer f2 spray instantly increases poisons to 0-5 if at close range f2> hilt bash > spray hits but set up a Plasma consume before the combo to make the poisons stronger.

when the Spray is over swap pets for a Quickness boost and to get 2 new stacks of poison + 6 might on pet.

its all in fine tuning atm but its very powerful for WvW roaming / small scale fighting 8-15 maybe even Zerging since its got a good amount of hp and toughness.

Maybe I was wrong about Sun Spirit.
With Rune of Balthazar, Carrion Amulet, Sigil of Smoldering it has following numbers:

-> 2750 Burning (5s) on proc
-> Solar Flare: 8,250 Burning (8,25s) + Blind on sacrifice

Torch with same setup has:
-> #4 Throw: 6,200 (10s) Burning
-> #5 Bonfire: 12,380 (5s) Burning

So 20k Burning by chaining Bonfire with Solar Flare.

Edit: Fixed numbers on Torch, since I had no Sigil of Smoldering with previous numbers >_<’

Morwath.9817:

Maybe I was wrong about Sun Spirit.
With Rune of Balthazar, Carrion Amulet, Sigil of Smoldering it has following numbers:

-> 2750 burning per (5s) on proc
-> Solar Flare: 8,250 Burning (8,25s) + Blind on sacrifice

Torch with same setup has:
-> #4 Throw: 6,200 (10s) Burning
-> #5 Bonfire: 12,380 (5s) Burning

So 20k Burning by chaining Bonfire with Solar Flare.

Edit: Fixed numbers on Torch, since I had no Sigil of Smoldering with previous numbers >_<’

Don’t forget to Quick Draw your Bonfire

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Morwath.9817:

Maybe I was wrong about Sun Spirit.
With Rune of Balthazar, Carrion Amulet, Sigil of Smoldering it has following numbers:

-> 2750 burning per (5s) on proc
-> Solar Flare: 8,250 Burning (8,25s) + Blind on sacrifice

Torch with same setup has:
-> #4 Throw: 6,200 (10s) Burning
-> #5 Bonfire: 12,380 (5s) Burning

So 20k Burning by chaining Bonfire with Solar Flare.

Edit: Fixed numbers on Torch, since I had no Sigil of Smoldering with previous numbers >_<’

Don’t forget to Quick Draw your Bonfire

I’d rather QD my Throw, since Bonfire has a bit too long CD (25s) to use it again fast enough.

Edit: I’d also probably play Torch in both weapon sets to ‘abuse’ QD as much as possible with such Rune/Sigil/Amulet set.

Well, it will recharge in 6.6s (with ambidex), so you can chain them for node burning. Nice area denial.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Well, it will recharge in 6.6s (with ambidex), so you can chain them for node burning. Nice area denial.

Well, I was thinking about SM/BM/NM. With Ambidex you will have even more Burning and more frequent Burning than listed above, however you would have to drop Protective Ward or Beastly Warden.

I was talking more along the lines of maximum burn stacks

The thing is longbow ranger single target burst can’t compare to a warrior with cleaving greatsword/hammer.
Thereferore the best power ranger tpvp build takes utility that brings something to the table that no other class have, like healing spring and spirit of nature, shouts that gives swiftness, and the taunt
For pvp pets like brown bear and red moa or the wolf (but the cooldown sucks and it can be dodged) are great
But that’s just my 2 cents
Because if you go just pure dps zerker scholar strength of the pack you won’t be as useful.

Ah another good old “if I can’t play this and be op then everyone else must suck and hate it” threads.

Another patch, and still no ‘fix’ for the nerfed “Clarion Bond” trait. Sigh…

Maybe we should all roll mesmers or a thief?

Don’t see many changes there in Tuesday’s patch…/rollseyes

Yup leave your ranger alone for a long while til they fix all the stuff that needs to be fixed

RevanCorana.8942:

Yup leave your ranger alone for a long while til they fix all the stuff that needs to be fixed

Been waiting for ANet to fix ranger for 10 years, they don’t play ranger so they never will. Every balance patch that comes out kicks ranger in the teeth, or it would if we had any teeth left, which we don’t.

/pointless thread as ANet doesn’t play ranger, or read this forum. Healing spring fail proves that much

Crapgame.6519:

Maybe we should all roll mesmers or a thief?

Don’t see many changes there in Tuesday’s patch…/rollseyes

I’ve pretty much shelved mine where I used it much before… Only sees action now on the WBT. I’ll be moving my acended gear that I’m missing to my thief from my Ranger when I get home today. The patch notes pretty much solidified that. Just bringing in my Guardian, Warrior, Ele, or Thief into fractals/dungeons now-a-days (and for the foreseeable future).

i love my ranger and her build its what i want and am very close to get her better
am very much tanky build and can help other in dungeons to keep them alive ore ress them faster

am not realy into high damage

i still need to craft more aced gear not done yet and mt LB need to be clerc build
was a drop from TEQ lucky me :p

as long i can help players am very happy and with this build i wont go down that easy