Guild Wars 2

• Ventari .

1. Tablet summons automatically upon swapping to this legend on revenant position
2. Cast times to control tablet are removed. They no longer will disrupt revenant in combat with exception of Ventari will
3. Increase radius of skills to 360 with exception of protective solace
4 Energy Expulsion – also creates water field for 5 seconds and no longer destroy the tablet

• Jalis

1. Soothing Stone – Will block incoming attacks (2sec) to give this legend that tanky feeling
2. Inspiring Reinforcement – Apply 5 stacks of stability right away for 5 seconds. Road will pulse weakness on enemies standing in. Increase energy cost to 35, 10cd.
3. Forced Engagement – Increase taunt duration to 3 seconds, make projectile homing target, unblockable. Reduce energy to 40.

Change it to pbaoe like jade winds. 600 radius unblockable, 2sec taunt, 2sec slow, 2 sec weakness, 50 energy cost. Gain 2 seconds of resistance and retaliation for each struck foe

4. Rite of the Great Dwarf – reduce energy cost to 40.

Thoughts?

Jalis would be perfect if they’d just reduce the cost of Forced Engagement to 30-40. No other changes to him needed. Soothing Stone is a great healing skill. Inspiring Reinforcement, even nerfed, is highly viable. We haven’t even had time to test the faster-casting Rite of the Great Dwarf, which will likely be pretty viable.

Ventari could certainly use a blast finisher on Energy Expulsion and a Light Field on Protective Solace. The absence of these is baffling. I don’t think I agree with a removal of the cast time on tablet moving however; I suspect they want to encourage moving the tablet to be a significant decision.

skowcia.8257:

• Ventari .

1. Tablet summons automatically upon swapping to this legend on revenant position
2. Cast times to control tablet are removed. They no longer will disrupt revenant in combat
3. Increase radius of skills to 360 with exception of protective solace
4 Energy Expulsion – also creates water field for 5 seconds and no longer destroy the tablet

I agree with all of those. I don’t see Energy Expulsion not destroying the tablet. I agree
it would be better for gameplay, I just don’t think it will ever be done because of how they want Ventari’s tablet mechanic. Like the auto follow stuff.

skowcia.8257:

• Jalis

1. Soothing Stone – Will block incoming attacks (2sec) to give this legend that tanky feeling
2. Inspiring Reinforcement – Apply 5 stacks of stability right away for 5 seconds. Road will pulse weakness on enemies standing in. Increase energy cost to 35, 10cd.
3. Forced Engagement – Increase taunt duration to 3 seconds, make projectile homing target, unblockable. Reduce energy to 40.
4. Rite of the Great Dwarf – reduce energy cost to 40.

Thoughts?

Uhm.. Soothing Stone is already good. If they add the 2s block (basically like Guardian’s) they’d have to lower the heal and get rid of the 3 condi cleanse, and I won’t like it.

Inspiring Reinforcement just needs to give first pulse sooner, and be an average between how it was before and how it is now. Now you’re forced to stand inside the road all the time, so not really good for wvw, before it was just too good.

Forced Engagement should cost less then 50, come on. It can be reflected, lol.

I agree with all the rest however. Rite should give more seconds of buff, even for 50 energy, I don’t care to pay more if it’s good.

skowcia.8257:

• Ventari .

1. Tablet summons automatically upon swapping to this legend on revenant position
2. Cast times to control tablet are removed. They no longer will disrupt revenant in combat
3. Increase radius of skills to 360 with exception of protective solace
4 Energy Expulsion – also creates water field for 5 seconds and no longer destroy the tablet

Great changes. The elite would be the best place to put a water field on Ventari.

My problem isn’t with the legends, it’s with their really lackluster traitlines of salvation/retribution.

There’s nothing remotely useful in those traitlines for PvE. Making Salvation healing power centric, especially a non-optional minor is going to kill that traitline in PvE as healing power is a garbage stat that costs too much offensive potential in the stat budget.

Nobody will ever take healing power into PvE, and as a result nobody will ever use Ventari’s traitline.

Same goes for the staff, it’s gonna be like the guardian’s staff in PvE. It will only be good in pvp if it keeps that terrible autoattack damage and meager healing.

Zenith.7301:

My problem isn’t with the legends, it’s with their really lackluster traitlines of salvation/retribution.

There’s nothing remotely useful in those traitlines for PvE. Making Salvation healing power centric, especially a non-optional minor is going to kill that traitline in PvE as healing power is a garbage stat that costs too much offensive potential in the stat budget.

Nobody will ever take healing power into PvE, and as a result nobody will ever use Ventari’s traitline.

Same goes for the staff, it’s gonna be like the guardian’s staff in PvE. It will only be good in pvp if it keeps that terrible autoattack damage and meager healing.

If the challenging group content is actually “challenging” we might see a complete change of the meta.

K, ill give up about block :< still tho..we have inferior healing ability of consume conditions so why not have better shelter? ;o

Protective solace actually has light field i believe, its just not listened in the tooltip, maybe its not intended and someone forgot to remove it hehe. Youre right about moving the part, it could keep it animation, cus after all its healing skill but everything else should become insta imo.

Taunt is far from being good when it can be reflected and strafed without any problems..theres nothing force than tauning ourself. Rite is our olny stunbreak on Jalis and while it casttime been ruduced by 50% it doesnt change the fact that it cost too much for the short duration. On another note..what if it were reducing condition damage taken as well?

Ps..while some traitlines are lackluster in retribution/salvation they have their focus and retribution really offers some good sustain. Not everything has to be focused on damage.

Griffith.7238:

Zenith.7301:

My problem isn’t with the legends, it’s with their really lackluster traitlines of salvation/retribution.

There’s nothing remotely useful in those traitlines for PvE. Making Salvation healing power centric, especially a non-optional minor is going to kill that traitline in PvE as healing power is a garbage stat that costs too much offensive potential in the stat budget.

Nobody will ever take healing power into PvE, and as a result nobody will ever use Ventari’s traitline.

Same goes for the staff, it’s gonna be like the guardian’s staff in PvE. It will only be good in pvp if it keeps that terrible autoattack damage and meager healing.

If the challenging group content is actually “challenging” we might see a complete change of the meta.

Not really.

It will never be worth it to have healing power centric build. You do less than one third of the damage for a small benefit to infrquent heals, it’s never worth it. The boost from healing power stacking doesn’t even outheal a single autoattack from a mob.

Most of your healing actually comes from blasting water fields multiple times, which can easily be done by zerkers, and the most effective mitigation methods — blind, aegis, blocks/invulnerability, and protection are also usable by zerkers.

At best you might see a move to rabid condi builds if some extra toughness is necessary, but Clerict/PVT/Shaman builds will never be a thing under their current combat system.

Healing Power is a terrible stat that should be merged with vitality, or make it so you merge vitality with boon duration and healing power with toughness.

Zenith.7301:

Griffith.7238:

Zenith.7301:

My problem isn’t with the legends, it’s with their really lackluster traitlines of salvation/retribution.

There’s nothing remotely useful in those traitlines for PvE. Making Salvation healing power centric, especially a non-optional minor is going to kill that traitline in PvE as healing power is a garbage stat that costs too much offensive potential in the stat budget.

Nobody will ever take healing power into PvE, and as a result nobody will ever use Ventari’s traitline.

Same goes for the staff, it’s gonna be like the guardian’s staff in PvE. It will only be good in pvp if it keeps that terrible autoattack damage and meager healing.

If the challenging group content is actually “challenging” we might see a complete change of the meta.

Not really.

It will never be worth it to have healing power centric build. You do less than one third of the damage for a small benefit to infrquent heals, it’s never worth it. The boost from healing power stacking doesn’t even outheal a single autoattack from a mob.

Most of your healing actually comes from blasting water fields multiple times, which can easily be done by zerkers, and the most effective mitigation methods — blind, aegis, blocks/invulnerability, and protection are also usable by zerkers.

At best you might see a move to rabid condi builds if some extra toughness is necessary, but Clerict/PVT/Shaman builds will never be a thing under their current combat system.

Healing Power is a terrible stat that should be merged with vitality, or make it so you merge vitality with boon duration and healing power with toughness.

With the +Outgoing Healing that Rev’s get in the Salvation line I could see healing power being very beneficial if the need for having an actual healer in future content arises. I will say it again this time more thoroughly. If you haven’t noticed yet I’m sure you will by the end of this week when they release the Warrior Berserker spec. A lot of the Elite specs have been centered around support and even tank esque play sytles. They have now added taunt into the game. Revs got one and Warriors will be getting an AoE one if the data mined skills were accurate. We could see a complete turn around of difficulty in PvE content with HoT. We might even be forced to bring dedicated “healers” and tank built classes with taunt on hand. Bringing 5 zerkers to a PvE dungeon group could end up being a thing of the past. You are welcome to your doubts I share them ,but if the kits they are handing out to the elite specs are any indication we are going to see a major change in group PvE content. We are also only about a week away from hearing about it.

“2. Inspiring Reinforcement – Apply 5 stacks of stability right away for 5 seconds. Road will pulse weakness on enemies standing in. Increase energy cost to 35, 10cd.”

Above is so bad it hurts my eyes. No, we don’t need another Energy cost increase on top of 10s CD. CD is already stupid as is seeing as the core of revenant was energy management and no-to-little cooldowns. it should be either 10s and 15-20e cost or 5s CD and 30-35 cost.

I also don’t like this change. Quite frankly I prefer longer weakness than have it pulsing.

Rite of the Great Dwarf – reduce energy cost to 40.

Maybe or maybe not. Will have to see how does it fare with 1,5s cast.

3. Forced Engagement – Increase taunt duration to 3 seconds, make projectile homing target, unblockable. Reduce energy to 40.

This would be ok but imo I’d rather have it at 1-2 seconds and have cost reduced to 20. Still an interrupt then. But my #1 choiuce would be scrapping the skill and giving us something different entirely.

Ventari

Don’t care, not my style really so I will leave it to others to mindstorm this

skowcia.8257:

K, ill give up about block :< still tho..we have inferior healing ability of consume conditions so why not have better shelter? ;o

Because we have 2 heals :P They aren’t inferior to other heals too.

Well i doubt road will ever come back to 5cd..or no cd at all. Getting all stacks at once would be better than standing in the field.. Overall road was overnerfed..cost, cd, duration. Thats a bit too much. And i like that taunt, but its not really viable in current state.

And who said cleric builds arent viable btw?
http://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Guardian_-_Bunker

Remember that revenant is supposed to suck in condi cleanse

Nothing i proposed cleans condi, just curious if rite could reduce condi damage by 50% (counter to condi bomb to prevent melding from 5k burn) just like hammers reduces it by 20%. Or you speaking about lack of condi cleanse for bunker builds in which case you pick up Ventari to clean them?

At some point i think revenant should get unique way to deal with condi tho, not directly cleanse them. That makes them too close to guardians. Reduced inc duration, damage, resistance, transfers are the way to go imho.

skowcia.8257:

Well i doubt road will ever come back to 5cd..or no cd at all. Getting all stacks at once would be better than standing in the field.. Overall road was overnerfed..cost, cd, duration. Thats a bit too much. And i like that taunt, but its not really viable in current state.

And who said cleric builds arent viable btw?
http://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Guardian_-_Bunker

That’s a pvp link…..this is a PvE discussion. If you bring a cleric staff guard to pve you deserve the kick.

Well..too bad i dont run dungs nor i am pve oriented..

And which class doesnt have sustain lines? Everyone in pve goes for the highest possible damage ignoring the most important aspect of this game – fun. Retribution and salvation are not created for dps boost. Retri is for self sustain and salv for some sustain+support like every other line.

For dps you have devastation, invocation and herald.

skowcia.8257:

Well..too bad i dont run dungs nor i am pve oriented..

And which class doesnt have sustain lines? Everyone in pve goes for the highest possible damage ignoring the most important aspect of this game – fun. Retribution and salvation are not created for dps boost. Retri is for self sustain and salv for some sustain+support like every other line.

For dps you have devastation, invocation and herald.

Which are the lines I mentioned revs in pve taking ;p

Look at a sustain line such as the mesmer’s Inspiration. It actually brings great utility — more reflects, aoe condi cleanse, superspeed/resistance on glamours.

Ventari’s line should be more like Inspiration or Ele’s Water/Arcana. Hell, even guardian’s lines are better.

But whatever you do, just remove those useless healing power/retaliation traits.

Switch healing power for vitality and I’d even be happy. Jalis could grant protection/blind/aegis/resistance instead of useless retaliation.

Or they could take my suggestion and merge healing power with vitality and boon duration with toughness.

Ventari:

Dunno what to say here. Probably the only thing that’d get me to consider using it is if the effects mirrored onto me as well as the tablet. No stun breaker is a deal breaker.

Jalis:

I like your ideas, especially Inspiring Reinforcement. I’d be happy with this IR effectiveness even if they increase the recast to 20-30 seconds because ultimately the multiple stacks are more important than total up time.

Taunt just isn’t useful at 2 seconds let alone for 50 energy.

Rite of the Great Dwarf we’ll have to see how it does with lower cast time. I would also be okay if this had 3 stacks of stability for 5 seconds instead of Inspiring Reinforcements and keeping the cost at 50.

Kodiak.3281:

Taunt just isn’t useful at 2 seconds let alone for 50 energy.

And can be reflected/strifed/absorbed

berserker and ranger have aoe taunt that can’t be avoided. I’m not saying that revenant should have it too (it’s a different class), but 50 energy for that crappy skill is bad. Add a cd if you don’t want it to be spammed.

Kidel.2057:

Kodiak.3281:

Taunt just isn’t useful at 2 seconds let alone for 50 energy.

And can be reflected/strifed/absorbed

berserker and ranger have aoe taunt that can’t be avoided. I’m not saying that revenant should have it too (it’s a different class), but 50 energy for that crappy skill is bad. Add a cd if you don’t want it to be spammed.

A cd like this?
http://dulfy.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/gw2-revenant-jalis-skills-3.jpg

That was added in last beta, wasnt mentioned at all in changes. And that was huge let down to me cus if we continue adding these cd’s revenant will lose the main point he was about.. managing our energy at the exchange of no cd.

Overall Jalis skills feels like a trash and that is problematic, as it is our olny one core legend we can pair Shiro with in power builds. Another is healing bot, and condition.

If nothing will change, power builds will be pigeonholed into herald line for Glint.

I meant a long cd, like 20 seconds, not 3, so the skill can be at least made meaningful, like 25 energy and 3 seconds of taunt, also not a projectile.

I rather keep current taunt with 50 energy cost and no cd, than 20cd junk. Main reason i wanted to play this class was no cd utility skills. Whats the point in energy management if i cant use stuff i want in x situation? If i want build up energy and blow away 2 jade winds or 5 phase traversal for lolz in a row then i should be allowed to do so, after all i been saving up energy just to do that.

I understand cd increase on road, but triple nerf was too much imo. Taunt skill needs it cd removed as it is affected by chill/power lock. You can easily get 15cd on taunt right now if a mes rupt you. BS.

Hm..i actually completely change my mind about jalis taunt..added new suggestion to fit him more with his aoe “nature”

Duke Blackrose.4981:

Ventari could certainly use a blast finisher on Energy Expulsion and a Light Field on Protective Solace. The absence of these is baffling. I don’t think I agree with a removal of the cast time on tablet moving however; I suspect they want to encourage moving the tablet to be a significant decision.

Protective Solace does have a light field. >v>

Energy Expulsion needs a shorter cast time. Ventari is full of healing capacity, so the ranged AoE knockback would add some good versatility in the form of CC. But on a 2 sec cast I just don’t see it working well.

Could Inspiring Reinforcement act like wall skills? Allies that run over it get X stacks of stability, and enemies that run over it get X stacks of weakness or something.

skowcia.8257:

• Ventari .

1. Tablet summons automatically upon swapping to this legend on revenant position
2. Cast times to control tablet are removed. They no longer will disrupt revenant in combat with exception of Ventari will
3. Increase radius of skills to 360 with exception of protective solace
4 Energy Expulsion – also creates water field for 5 seconds and no longer destroy the tablet

• Jalis

1. Soothing Stone – Will block incoming attacks (2sec) to give this legend that tanky feeling
2. Inspiring Reinforcement – Apply 5 stacks of stability right away for 5 seconds. Road will pulse weakness on enemies standing in. Increase energy cost to 35, 10cd.
3. Forced Engagement – Increase taunt duration to 3 seconds, make projectile homing target, unblockable. Reduce energy to 40.

Change it to pbaoe like jade winds. 600 radius unblockable, 2sec taunt, 2sec slow, 2 sec weakness, 50 energy cost. Gain 2 seconds of resistance and retaliation for each struck foe

4. Rite of the Great Dwarf – reduce energy cost to 40.

Thoughts?

• Ventari

1. Absolutely agree. I would add that commanding the Tablet should’ve been instant so we can intervene with it mid-cast and about 33-50% faster.

2. Removing cast times from all tablet commands #7-#0? Disagree. If we make them all instant, there’s nothing to interrupt. I would however reduce the cast time on the Elite by 1s and reduce the response delay of Natural Harmony by 1s.

3. 360 is pretty kitten large. I think 300, max 340 would do it. I’m all for adding some range indicator.

4. Agree, partially. The Water Field spawn is quite nice and I would seriously want to see water field on the Rev. It should destroy the Tablet, though.  Natural Fragments should have +2/3s to their duration added. Remove Knockback from it. It doesn’t work right with Momentary Pacification.

5. One of the suggestions I made was giving Staff AA 1 more Orb which instead spawns behind the Revenant.

6. I also suggested changes to Invigorating Flow which would affect Tranquil Benediction trait (see sticked red post) and make it much more desireable, up to the point where I would reduce the boon durations from each orb to 2s.

7. Ending Upkeep of Protective Solace now has 1/2 cast time and 8s CD and Knockbacks ~200 units. Moved from Elite. This skill currently does absolutely nothing against non-projectile foes and some knockback for such telegraphed skill would’ve been okay I think.

8. Eluding Nullification trait – I suggest that in addition to 1 condition it should also remove Poison, at least from Revenant himself.

That would be it.

• Jalis

1. This skill could give 1 more second of Retaliation.

2. I think it is okay, just un-nerf the Stab duration a bit to 2-3s per tick.

3. Just reduce the energy cost. Agree on unblockable.

4. Agree

Jalis seems pretty solid now.

Rym.1469:

2. Removing cast times from all tablet commands #7-#0? Disagree. If we make them all instant, there’s nothing to interrupt. I would however reduce the cast time on the Elite by 1s and reduce the response delay of Natural Harmony by 1s.

he said Cast times >>>>to control tablet<<<< are removed which means #6 and this change is absolutely needed

Loex.5104:

Rym.1469:

2. Removing cast times from all tablet commands #7-#0? Disagree. If we make them all instant, there’s nothing to interrupt. I would however reduce the cast time on the Elite by 1s and reduce the response delay of Natural Harmony by 1s.

he said Cast times >>>>to control tablet<<<< are removed which means #6 and this change is absolutely needed

Then I stand corrected, I misunderstood. Already agreed with it.

Rym.1469:

7. Ending Upkeep of Protective Solace now has 1/2 cast time and 8s CD and Knockbacks ~200 units. Moved from Elite. This skill currently does absolutely nothing against non-projectile foes and some knockback for such telegraphed skill would’ve been okay I think.

Why you want to nerf protective solace? We dont need cd’s..espesially that long. Isnt energy enough already? Might as well scrap the energy system completely and slap cd’s on everything..make a topic in thief section that they should get cd’s on wep skills on top of ini. My popcorn is ready

Im not sure whats up with that fashion to slap cd’s on revenant skills really..

Rym.1469:

4. Agree, partially. The Water Field spawn is quite nice and I would seriously want to see water field on the Rev. It should destroy the Tablet, though.  Natural Fragments should have +2/3s to their duration added. Remove Knockback from it. It doesn’t work right with Momentary Pacification.

If you want tablet to be destroyed, it should also have it cost reduced to 40. Summing tablet cost 10. Thats 60 energy just for one skill. The daze from trait is delayed by about 3 seconds or so btw. Was curious why it worked this way, but now i know – jade winds.

Rym.1469:

6. I also suggested changes to Invigorating Flow which would affect Tranquil Benediction trait (see sticked red post) and make it much more desireable, up to the point where I would reduce the boon durations from each orb to 2s.

Invigorating flow is fine as it is really.. Am i supposed to chase for orbs now? Is it football or something? Tranquil is fine as well.

I don’t want to nerf Protective Solace, but I want to give it some purpose if there’re no projectiles flying around. And I want to move Knockback from Elite, because it has terrible synergy with Momentary Pacification – you don’t really want double CC on one skill. Agree about the cost.

Invigorating flow’s healing is negligible, scales terribly and one of the complaints is that Specializations don’t synergize with each other well.

It wouldn’t also make you “chase the orbs” as you’d surely pick more than 2 orbs every 5s with your regular movement. Unless you camp some ledge, then you might need to move 1 yard.
Honestly I don’t get why the Orb mechanic gets so much hate. It’s not like those spawn on the other side of the map and I’m sure their placing could be fixed to be more predictable, along with Fragments.

And Tranquil Benediction was never used – I have never seen a Revenant going for it while it has synergy just with Staff AA and competes with cleanse on roll and raw periodic healing increase. Giving it synergy with other traitline would make all three choices equally good, all having different purposes.

All you have to do..is some tweaks on invigorating, nothing else.

One of my suggestion was to swap eluding nullification to minor trait (and get rid of cd all together or reduce it to 5cd) with hardened foundation as right now its a basically useless minor if you have 0 healing power.
Serene rejuvenation affecting also revenant so you gain some sustain by choosing salvation.. to avoid complete rework but had another idea for it as well. This trait is useless without Ventari atm.

These changes alone would improve salvation line as whole, without needing to rework some stuff that inst necessary at all.

In this case tranquil would be picked up by staff user that look for some sustain in salvation line but runs without any power healing. Hardened foundation for bunkers, invoking harmony for support.

The second idea would be to swap serene with invoking harmony and rework harmony itself – to provide aoe healing like healing ripple ele trait, but on legend swap instead.

What else is needed really?

I’m not the fan of Invigorating mostly because it’s not really an interesting or visible trait. Just some added passive healing and we already have that in Retribution GM. I very much prefer more active traits with visible effects. Spawning Orbs would not only help you, but also your allies. And I like their mechanic, it’s fun and engaging. Not to mention if you make effort to collect most of them, it’s pretty nice healing.

Replacing our Master minor in Salvation is something I was also thinking about and doing that with Eluding Nullification is nice idea. My other slight tweak on it was replacing gained Toughness with Vitality as healing specs will take Cleric’s gear in general and probably want some more Vitality to counter bursts/conditions better.

With Serene Rejuvenation you mean that we would get straight +15% healing? I’m not sure if I like it. Something added to that minor, like 5% healing done to allies also heals the caster would’ve been nice, though.

The Ventari runs into the same problem as the Engineer support traits, 240 radius. This is far too small for WvW, in sPvP where people are clustered around points it is probably sufficient. But in open world WvW you have allies all over the place needing healing, some trying to get in range getting cc’d etc etc.

There is a reason Guardian support is so strong, 600 radius on empower, 600(was 1200) radius on virtues. Sure the dodge roll heal is only 240 but it has some of the best scaling from healing power in the game.

This is what you are competing with if you want to play frontline/support as a Rev. Which is what Ventari seems angled towards, and from what i can see Guardian is better hands down, no contest. If these abilities were the same radius as blast finishers(at 360) you might get a look in over a Guard, maybe. Still the stability from shouts for Guard and it’s constant condi clear with PoV-trooper synergy i think will oust the Rev in a support role. Why pick up a Rev when i can get a 2nd or 3rd Guard for this role?

Compare:
-Empower 12 stacks of might ~ 600 radius ~ base healing of 1500 ~ 20sec cd
-Renewing Wave ~ 2 conditions cleared ~ 300 radius ~ base healing 1295 ~ 15sec cd

Why is it half the radius of the Guardians staff 4 ability? What it is providing in the condi removal is comparable to what the Guard provides with might stacks, the Guardian also provides more healing. Should this not be on a 600 radius?

For Jalis there are 2 possible Options considering Forced Engagement:

1. Reduce the Cost
2. Keep the Cost but make the Trait work with it and not only with NPCs

Opposed to CD’s. The reason why I want Rev is because it allows flexibility with energy deciding what’s best at any given moment instead of being limited by CDs. CD’s defeat the purpose of energy in the first place.

Guys at AN seem scared of tuning some of the skills a bit more. I hope they did not forget we can not opt-out from bad skills. We are locked in 5 skills even if there are some bad skills there. That alone is a cost we pay for having what we have. Don’t forget this ArenaNet.

Right now Taunt is bad, like BAD, and I have no way of getting rid of it even if I want to have jalis and rest of his skills.

Between Jalis’ elite which is 40-50e and Taunt for 50 in 99% cases for the team and so on you would use his elite.