Guild Wars 2

UA; 50% damage reduction on a skill that can largely be evaded through a dodge seems excessive.

There we have it folks. A skill is not op as long as it could be dodged.

/facepalm

I don’t know how often I’ve read kittened stuff like this when people found an op class and are desperately defending it with ridiculous points like “it could be dodged”. Because these folks really think that the class is actually balanced and it’s their super-ninja skills that let them dominate pvp. This is why you cannot expect a serious balancing discussion in the corresponding class subforum, you need to post it in the “pvp” subforum.

cursE.1794:

UA; 50% damage reduction on a skill that can largely be evaded through a dodge seems excessive.

There we have it folks. A skill is not op as long as it could be dodged.

/facepalm

I don’t know how often I’ve read kittened stuff like this when folks found an op class and are desperately defending it with ridiculous points like “it could be dodged”. Because these folks really think that the class is actually balanced and it’s their super-ninja skills that let them dominate pvp. This is why you cannot expect a serious balancing discussion in the corresponding subforum, you need to post it in the “pvp” subforum.

With your logic an Engineer/Guardian/Warrior can block the whole duration of sword 3, should I go to their forum and say their block skills are OP.

When I play any of these class and I play against Rev, I know that sword 3 will come at some point and I have those things for that, problem solved.

cursE.1794:

you need to post it in the “pvp” subforum.

In pvp subforum where people complains about anything, even rapid fire to this day? Okay. I wonder what about your ele and reaper (most broken thing 1v1) then.

With your logic an Engineer/Guardian/Warrior can block the whole duration of sword 3, should I go to their forum and say their block skills are OP.

From what you just posted, you’re the last person ever that should talk about logic.

cursE.1794:

With your logic an Engineer/Guardian/Warrior can block the whole duration of sword 3, should I go to their forum and say their block skills are OP.

From what you just posted, you’re the last person ever that should talk about logic.

…Well given your lack of knowledge about the skill are you sure you want to criticize people?

Dodging isn’t the only way to counter UA.
In fact it has multiple counter’s
Even an obvious start up animation.

If at this point a Rev is giving you trouble in a 1 v 1 you may want to reconsider your build choices.
Or accept the fact you may not be that great.

But since we are nerfing skills that have an evade to them we need to nerf the damage by 50% on

Vualt
Blurred Frenzy
Whirlwind attack
Flanking Strike
Burning speed
Pistol whip &
Rocket Charge

Because those skills also do a lot of damage while having an evade on them.
It’s too much for players to think about dodging, or blocking.

P.S
Aren’t you that same player who kept trying to say D/D Cele Ele was fine before all classes got a power creep?

If at this point a Rev is giving you trouble in a 1 v 1 you may want to reconsider your build choices.
Or accept the fact you may not be that great.

Another classic in discussions like this: “You just suck”.#

Aren’t you that same player who kept trying to say D/D Cele Ele was fine before all classes got a power creep?

I was amongst the first people to demand a burning nerf for d/d cele ele. While the class was my main. Criticial considerations of the class you’re playing yourself, maybe you should try it.

cursE.1794:

If at this point a Rev is giving you trouble in a 1 v 1 you may want to reconsider your build choices.
Or accept the fact you may not be that great.

Another classic in discussions like this: “You just suck”.

Mad cause it’s true?

I have one word to describe people like you !

TROLL !!

Versepelles.1972:

Thanks to all those who have contributed constructive feedback! I’m glad this thread has sparked such interest, even with much of it being the unfortunately typical criticism without solutions. I’ll update the original post to reflect some of the community viewpoints.

cursE.1794:

UA; 50% damage reduction on a skill that can largely be evaded through a dodge seems excessive.

There we have it folks. A skill is not op as long as it could be dodged.

/facepalm

I don’t know how often I’ve read kittened stuff like this when people found an op class and are desperately defending it with ridiculous points like “it could be dodged”. Because these folks really think that the class is actually balanced and it’s their super-ninja skills that let them dominate pvp. This is why you cannot expect a serious balancing discussion in the corresponding class subforum, you need to post it in the “pvp” subforum.

I don’t think I have enough steak for this much salt.

Versepelles.1972:

Balance is hard, and PvP metas change over time. However, from what we’ve seen so far, The Power Shiro-Glint build is by far dominant in PvP, with Mallyx-Glint a distant second. Here are some suggestions that can help balance the class with minimal design change, given that most current bugs are fixed as well.

As always, many people will have different opinions , so please leave constructive comments only, which of course can include criticisms or proposed changes. EDIT: Some community suggestions have been taken into account in italics.

Weapons

Sword

• Unrelenting Assault: Reduce damage by 50%. This skill should be an evade and teleport, but the damage is too high. EDIT: Some in the community do not want to give up this damage + evade that has very little counterplay. I disagree with this on a fundamental skill design level. Another viable solution could be that the damage remains the same, but if the initial skill cast is dodged, the skill is evaded, like nearly every other skill in the game.
• Grasping Shadow: Reduce cast time to 1/4 second (-50%). Sword off-hand can be just as viable as shield if Grasping Shadow is buffed, adding a layer of complexity, skill, and variety. EDIT: Increase range to 300 (+130%). This skill is too difficult to land in it’s current form.

Hammer

• Coalescence of Ruin: Reduce damage by 33%. Just a moderately overtuned skill, like True Shot. EDIT: A better solution might be to simply increase the cooldown to 8s (+300%).
• Drop the Hammer: Reduce cast time to 1.25s (-29%). This skill is fairly useless in mid to high tier PvP, but could be more interesting with decreased cast time. EDIT: Another option might be to make this a fire and forget skill rather than a channeled skill.

Mace

• Misery Swipe (chain): Increase range to somewhere between 300 and 480. This weapon would see much more use in condi builds with some range on the auto attacks.

Axe

• Temporal Rift: Add a chain skill to detonate the rift, like mesmer’s focus 4 (Temporal Curtain). Decrease the range to 600 (-33%). This alone could make axe a viable choice.

Utilities

Mallyx

• Pain Absorption: Transfer 2 conditions from each ally and youself to the target. Increase cast time to 3/4s (+50%). This allows active counterplay to conditions, and gives revenants meaningful condition removal. This change alone makes Mallyx competitive with Shiro.
• Banish Enchantment: Corrupt 2 boons instead of removing them. Increase cast time to 3/4s (+50%). This allows for active counterplay to some boonful classes.

Ventari

• Remove from the game. (I kid, but this would need a major overhaul to be viable in PvP, it seems). EDIT: This line could be good in some situations, but requires more work than the scope of this article.

Jalis

• See Ventari.

Herald

• All facets: Add 1/4s cast time to initial cast. This forces Revenants to think when to activate the signets, rather than spamming them during Unrelenting Assault or Crystal Hibernation. (Leave Infuse Light and Gaze of Darkness chain skills as instant cast!) EDIT: Many in the community like the freedom of these instacast abilities. However, a small increase to cast time could bring the necessity of Herald in line with the other trait lines.
• Infuse Light: Make this skill about 5 times more visible (+400%). This is a great active mechanic but is currently not visible enough except in the buff bar.

Traits

Devastation

• Malicious Reprisal: Remove the hidden ICD from this trait. This allows active counter to bunker builds which rely on blocking. EDIT: The cooldown is 30s. Remove this cooldown to promote an active threat to bunkers.

Corruption

• Opportune Extraction: Reduce ICD to 6s (-40%). Optionally corrupt boon rather than remove. This allows condition-specced revs to be a threat to boonful classes.

Invocation

• Roiling Mists: Reduce critical chance while under fury increase from 20% to 10%. This is not vital, but it might be a good place to balance overall Revenant damage.

Herald

• Shared Empowerment: Reduce might duration to 5s baseline (-38%). Currently, this trait alone overpowers Revenant raw damage output. A fair reduction will put Revenant damage in line with other classes. EDIT: Many in the community are against a balance in damage. This suggestion would only remove around 12% damage. Please note that there are some significant buffs in Sword off-hand and Malicious Reprisal which would raise skill ceiling to the class even with this small reduction in damage.

You can simply say the following:

“Hello Anet, please nerf revenants so they can be completely useless”

See, wasn’t it easy to say instead of typing all of that? I made it easier for you.

With your current awful so-called balancing, go and try to 1v1 the following: Mesmers, DH, Druids, Reapers, and Tempests. Let me know if your amazing balances can beat any of that.

Razarei.2809:

This this thread pains me to read.

+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1

Potato Slayer.3107:

Razarei.2809:

This this thread pains me to read.

+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1

These changes are ridiculous.
Try again.

If by balancing, you mean make the class subpar to almost every other class on the game, maybe with the exception of thief, then the op has the answers. Really, massive damage reductions on two skills that are very easily avoided, UA can be dodged and mitigated just by being near someone else, and just walk to the side of coalescence of ruin since it’s hugely telegraphed.

“Balance is hard”

Evidentially monumentally too hard for OP. I quit a few lines in.

Like many people in this thread , it has tortured me to read the suggestions . I however will bite , just to add my to cents to skill handicapped people like OP and cursE. If you think UA is too strong well , you are silly . Not only is it an actually less of a threat that AA most of the time , it has MULTIPlE counter plays – double dodge will fully negate it , a block stops it , if you go into stealth UA stops , if you dash away whilst the recant is performing the flip the skills will not trigger but will go on cd – how much more counter play do you want ? Just cause you can’t overcome it , doesn’t mean decent players can’t . If you are having a hard time against UA, I’m guessing you’ll never even touch a chrono with sword 2 evade , well of precognition, shield 4 , f4,f5 , stealth and etc – and you can take them down too .
So moral of the story get better , instead of starting "balance " threads which would ruin the class if considered .

cursE.1794:

Because these folks really think that the class is actually balanced and it’s their super-ninja skills that let them dominate pvp.

Ahaha! Good one! Dominate—ahahahaha! How about.. no. Revenant/Herald does not dominate the slightest. They are not weak, but they do not dominate either.

Absconditus.6804:

cursE.1794:

Because these folks really think that the class is actually balanced and it’s their super-ninja skills that let them dominate pvp.

Ahaha! Good one! Dominate—ahahahaha! How about.. no. Revenant/Herald does not dominate the slightest. They are not weak, but they do not dominate either.

Maybe it’s actually the opposite. Maybe the people that do lose to Revenants think that there’s no way they could lose to them with their super-ninja skills, so Revenant must be broken.

It’s funny, because I think Revenant is a class that (in a 1v1 scenario) feeds itself on the mistakes of your opponent. On contraposition, it also wrecks itself if your opponent does not make mistakes (not hitting heal of stupid, nullifying Shiro heal, interrupting UA etc.).

Ritt.3069:

Absconditus.6804:

cursE.1794:

Because these folks really think that the class is actually balanced and it’s their super-ninja skills that let them dominate pvp.

Ahaha! Good one! Dominate—ahahahaha! How about.. no. Revenant/Herald does not dominate the slightest. They are not weak, but they do not dominate either.

Maybe it’s actually the opposite. Maybe the people that do lose to Revenants think that there’s no way they could lose to them with their super-ninja skills, so Revenant must be broken.

It’s funny, because I think Revenant is a class that (in a 1v1 scenario) feeds itself on the mistakes of your opponent. On contraposition, it also wrecks itself if your opponent does not make mistakes (not hitting heal of stupid, nullifying Shiro heal, interrupting UA etc.).

I couldn’t have said it better.

Did not read the thread? I have a TL;DR, Evasion OP, nerf Thieves, the end.

50% reduction on US? 33% reduction on CoR? Thank God you do not work for ANet! Class would be gutted.

I really like the idea of Mallyx corrupting boons rather than removing them. Can anybody explain me why this is a bad idea?
Aside from that, OP needs some direction.

50% reduction on US jup that looks like somebody lost a 1v1 and now thinks he should whine about it on the forums. To not point it out that much he thought 10 minutes about what else killed him.

Yes the dmg from CoR looks high but the hammer is not a good choice for pvp because of the same reasons long bow ranger was never viable.

I don’t know why some people don’t want to get it but I tell you again. This game is not balanced around 1v1 and that’s good so. Why, well first of all there is no 1v1 game mode so why should it be balanced around it….
People who try winning a fight somewhere on far for 10 minutes not holding the point are the worst and the most useless team members you can imagine and most of the time they start flaming the rest of the team when it results in a fail.

+ Most funny argument I saw in a long time: who on earth thinks that how high your dmg output was is a viable argument if a class is good or not. Could mean you insta kill your oponents with the mesmer always only doing 20k dmg or so and you need 1 minute to kill someone with the rev dealing more dmg in that time….rly that’s just not a argument at all. It somehow says to me you are one of those 1v1 guys in the match who annoy the rest of the team. Calling out: “Who are you guys after you died somewhere offpoint and then rage quit.”

P.s. I know that I didn’t give any solutions to your suggestions. That is because they are so ridiculous to beginn with. I would even change back the heal because it was clearly only a LTP issu. Did what it was supposted to do punish button mashing “plebos.” This skill healed for 2k-6k if you kept an eye on the rev while giving him some more survivability against condis….Anet just changed it because even one plebo in the opponent team can give the rev a full heal every time he uses it…
The other skill they already nerved PT was kinda okay although I would have changed the energy instead of a clunky feeling cooldown.