I was trying to setup a condi build for my revenant in both pve/spvp and I realized that a condi build on a revenant is totally unplayable.
There is no synergy between specializations line and even between traits from the Corruption trait line.
There are traits that heal or enpower our Rev based on the number of conditions on, we have a way to transfer conditions to the foes but we don’t have a way to put some conditions on us just like Necro’s corruptions skills.
Condi Rev has never been aviable ingame from HoT lauch, never. Not a single buff, a single fix, a single weapon revamp, not a single trait buff. And my question is just why?
Right, but I don’t understand why I can transfer conditions from me to the enemy, I get heal from condition on me and I get a buff but I have no way to apply conditions on me.
We also have a lot of resistance, it makes no sense.
I think there needs to be some changes to them, like the poison trait that only laughably applies every 20 seconds; the burn application from the GM trait could add another stack or two; and get the promised Torment damage increase from Beta 3 results that never made it.
And most of all, we need a ranged condi weapon.
But, I think the rest are fine given that. I think saying its unviable isn’t quite right.
I agree you can pick the condi soul and mace axe but your second soul and second weapon are worthless in a condi damage build if you do. Honestly i want heavy access to torment.
I agree you can pick the condi soul and mace axe but your second soul and second weapon are worthless in a condi damage build if you do. Honestly i want heavy access to torment.
Glint has Elemental Blast which deals 3 different condis including fire.
Sw/Shield is good for damage dealing and heals, though you could replace the shield with axe.
I’ve had a lot of success with the build, and I’m not even that good of a revenant to be honest.
I agree you can pick the condi soul and mace axe but your second soul and second weapon are worthless in a condi damage build if you do. Honestly i want heavy access to torment.
Don’t forget, you can use Mace/X and Mace/Y for your two weapon sets. Mace cooldowns are short enough that this is completely feasible. No need to use sword, for example, if your condi build has no power in it. I’ve also made the point before that, as far as off-hands go, Shield and Sword are perfectly viable with a condi build. Sure, they don’t do condi damage…but they don’t really do power damage either. They are for support, sustain, or CC. I usually play power, but when I do condi, I use Mace/Shield and Mace/Sword or Axe.
Of course, I still agree that Rev is sorely lacking in weapon options, including a ranged condi option.
I agree you can pick the condi soul and mace axe but your second soul and second weapon are worthless in a condi damage build if you do. Honestly i want heavy access to torment.
Glint has Elemental Blast which deals 3 different condis including fire.
Sw/Shield is good for damage dealing and heals, though you could replace the shield with axe.
I’ve had a lot of success with the build, and I’m not even that good of a revenant to be honest.
That spec doesn’t work past gold/low platinum, and its condis are weaker than other condi specs and easier to avoid.
After a certain skill level you will not be landing many if any hits at all with mace. Since it has no snare or gap closer
Mace does not work vs competent opponents. The few hits that it does land are not drastic enough either.
I agree you can pick the condi soul and mace axe but your second soul and second weapon are worthless in a condi damage build if you do. Honestly i want heavy access to torment.
Glint has Elemental Blast which deals 3 different condis including fire.
Sw/Shield is good for damage dealing and heals, though you could replace the shield with axe.
I’ve had a lot of success with the build, and I’m not even that good of a revenant to be honest.
That spec doesn’t work past gold/low platinum, and its condis are weaker than other condi specs and easier to avoid.
After a certain skill level you will not be landing many if any hits at all with mace. Since it has no snare or gap closer
Mace does not work vs competent opponents. The few hits that it does land are not drastic enough either.
Well Jay you’re thinking small. Rev hasn’t been good at 1v1s for a long time, and if you look at Dragon stance, it was clearly meant to be a DPS/utility role. Mallyx adds resistance onto the list of boons, which massively increases its usefulness to teams.
Mace certainly isn’t a great 1v1 weapon, but if you land the glint elite, you can easily follow that with mace 2 -> mace 3 for heavy condi application and some aoe might stacking. Mace is a bad 1v1 weapon (unless you’re defending a node) but it’s a great node fight weapon. It’s just situational, certainly not an all-around good weapon but it has its use cases like any weapon. Mace 3 aint bad at all but mace 1 & 2 are very difficult to land against anyone who’s paying attention, not including guards, who are forced to eat it.
I agree you can pick the condi soul and mace axe but your second soul and second weapon are worthless in a condi damage build if you do. Honestly i want heavy access to torment.
Glint has Elemental Blast which deals 3 different condis including fire.
Sw/Shield is good for damage dealing and heals, though you could replace the shield with axe.
I’ve had a lot of success with the build, and I’m not even that good of a revenant to be honest.
That spec doesn’t work past gold/low platinum, and its condis are weaker than other condi specs and easier to avoid.
After a certain skill level you will not be landing many if any hits at all with mace. Since it has no snare or gap closer
Mace does not work vs competent opponents. The few hits that it does land are not drastic enough either.
Well Jay you’re thinking small. Rev hasn’t been good at 1v1s for a long time, and if you look at Dragon stance, it was clearly meant to be a DPS/utility role. Mallyx adds resistance onto the list of boons, which massively increases its usefulness to teams.
Mace certainly isn’t a great 1v1 weapon, but if you land the glint elite, you can easily follow that with mace 2 -> mace 3 for heavy condi application and some aoe might stacking. Mace is a bad 1v1 weapon (unless you’re defending a node) but it’s a great node fight weapon. It’s just situational, certainly not an all-around good weapon but it has its use cases like any weapon. Mace 3 aint bad at all but mace 1 & 2 are very difficult to land against anyone who’s paying attention, not including guards, who are forced to eat it.
I played that spec to rank 130 ish. Trust me, it is sub optimal.
I’ve tested many specs this season dropping in and out of top 250 and have figured out what works and what doesn’t.
Yes in low level play you can get a few hits and land kills. In higher level pvp no.
Rev condis do much less damage the other condi specs and their application is harder/worse.
If you are having any success with that build I promise you it is not because the build is great but because you are mechanically placing yourself in good positions/getting lucky and/or the enemy is not aware of what you are doing.
Actually the one time I climbed with that spec to low 100s, by the time I got to that rank most of the individuals who had seen the spec more than twice at that time were no longer dying to it, and its effectiveness plummeted.
Oh and staff is better than sword/shield as an off hand for that spec.
Everything works in pve. This games AI is not that complex.
Working doesn’t mean good … and I think that’s the meaning of the question.
Frankly, Condi Rev in solo PVE is not too inspiring, the nature of torment ensures that. The only real bonus is the frequency you can apply conditions and the resistance spam you can achieve. I think it would be better to put Mace #2 on auto attack … it’s almost spammable and much better damage.
I found with teams, it’s a little better if you aren’t aggroed by the mob you fight. Doubling your spammable torment damage and sticking to your moving target works, but it’s more conditional than I would prefer.
Now, if we just had torment on hammer in some way.
Everything works in pve. This games AI is not that complex.
Working doesn’t mean good … and I think that’s the meaning of the question.
Frankly, Condi Rev in solo PVE is not too inspiring, the nature of torment ensures that. The only real bonus is the frequency you can apply conditions and the resistance spam you can achieve. I think it would be better to put Mace #2 on auto attack … it’s almost spammable and much better damage.
I found with teams, it’s a little better if you aren’t aggroed by the mob you fight. Doubling your spammable torment damage and sticking to your moving target works, but it’s more conditional than I would prefer.
Now, if we just had torment on hammer in some way.
Or just make mace 2 an auto in a circle and make current aa ranged one for 2 like spear. Burning at melee range, torment at long range. Mace improved by 459849964396839683% and problem with long range wep solved a bit as well.
Salt, salt, moar salt. So salty like fries from McDonald!
Playing Smite since mid s2, f broken gw2.
I agree you can pick the condi soul and mace axe but your second soul and second weapon are worthless in a condi damage build if you do. Honestly i want heavy access to torment.
Glint has Elemental Blast which deals 3 different condis including fire.
Sw/Shield is good for damage dealing and heals, though you could replace the shield with axe.
I’ve had a lot of success with the build, and I’m not even that good of a revenant to be honest.
That spec doesn’t work past gold/low platinum, and its condis are weaker than other condi specs and easier to avoid.
After a certain skill level you will not be landing many if any hits at all with mace. Since it has no snare or gap closer
Mace does not work vs competent opponents. The few hits that it does land are not drastic enough either.
Well Jay you’re thinking small. Rev hasn’t been good at 1v1s for a long time, and if you look at Dragon stance, it was clearly meant to be a DPS/utility role. Mallyx adds resistance onto the list of boons, which massively increases its usefulness to teams.
Mace certainly isn’t a great 1v1 weapon, but if you land the glint elite, you can easily follow that with mace 2 -> mace 3 for heavy condi application and some aoe might stacking. Mace is a bad 1v1 weapon (unless you’re defending a node) but it’s a great node fight weapon. It’s just situational, certainly not an all-around good weapon but it has its use cases like any weapon. Mace 3 aint bad at all but mace 1 & 2 are very difficult to land against anyone who’s paying attention, not including guards, who are forced to eat it.
I played that spec to rank 130 ish. Trust me, it is sub optimal.
I’ve tested many specs this season dropping in and out of top 250 and have figured out what works and what doesn’t.
Yes in low level play you can get a few hits and land kills. In higher level pvp no.
Rev condis do much less damage the other condi specs and their application is harder/worse.
If you are having any success with that build I promise you it is not because the build is great but because you are mechanically placing yourself in good positions/getting lucky and/or the enemy is not aware of what you are doing.
Actually the one time I climbed with that spec to low 100s, by the time I got to that rank most of the individuals who had seen the spec more than twice at that time were no longer dying to it, and its effectiveness plummeted.
Oh and staff is better than sword/shield as an off hand for that spec.
Mallyx/Glint Sword/Shield Staff with Destroyer Amulet is pretty fun, I’d suggest it. Overall it’s a bit slower than power rev, but has much more survivability, better team utility, and is useful in certain +1 situations against certain non-squishies like guard and magi/mender’s ele. The boonstrip matters more than the confusion but together it’s pretty deadly.
Everything works in pve. This games AI is not that complex.
Working doesn’t mean good … and I think that’s the meaning of the question.
Frankly, Condi Rev in solo PVE is not too inspiring, the nature of torment ensures that. The only real bonus is the frequency you can apply conditions and the resistance spam you can achieve. I think it would be better to put Mace #2 on auto attack … it’s almost spammable and much better damage.
I found with teams, it’s a little better if you aren’t aggroed by the mob you fight. Doubling your spammable torment damage and sticking to your moving target works, but it’s more conditional than I would prefer.
Now, if we just had torment on hammer in some way.
Or just make mace 2 an auto in a circle and make current aa ranged one for 2 like spear. Burning at melee range, torment at long range. Mace improved by 459849964396839683% and problem with long range wep solved a bit as well.
Yup, that’s sort of what I think to. As it is, I’ve already set Mace 2 as my auto attack.
Imo, put mace #2 on auto-attack is not a solution. Mallyx and condi Rev in generale need a global revamp:
Increase Torment damage (Torment do it’s best when foes are moving but at melee range it is weaker than other conditions).
Poison applied throught Torment now has 20sec cooldown, reduce it at least at 10sec.
The original Mallyx concept was about self-apply torment when using Demon Stance utilities, this, with condi transfer/copy to foes, resistance and damage/heal buff per condition will make Mallyx at least more viable. Without this, you must wait for an allie that have conditions to transfer them to you.
Every damage modifier in the others Rev. trait lines only modifies direct damage and/or power so no osynergy with Mallyx trait line and conditions in general.
I believe that ANet should re-think about condi Rev just because, until the last Rev nerf, power rev was amazing and noone cared about condi. After those nerf, I think that ANet should, at least, try to fix condi rev to give Rev players another way to play it.
I really don’t understand why I have a condi trait line and condi weapons/skills but I can’t play it because it isn’t good in every game mode.
I believe that ANet should re-think about condi Rev just because, until the last Rev nerf, power rev was amazing and noone cared about condi. After those nerf, I think that ANet should, at least, try to fix condi rev to give Rev players another way to play it.
I really don’t understand why I have a condi trait line and condi weapons/skills but I can’t play it because it isn’t good in every game mode.
IIRC, Condi Rev WAS meta in PvP for a while. It had permanent Stability with Retribution + Herald and could also have permanent or near-permanent Resistance with certain Runes. That was promptly nerfed of course, but Condi Rev didn’t really receive anything afterwards to help out the loss. A few changes here and there that ultimately didn’t do much (like Pulsating Pestilence, which used to only spread a SINGLE stack of Torment for months after the initial Mallyx elite change).
Anyway, yea, Anet should definitely rethink Condi Rev. Right now it’s pretty unusable in PvE and only a handful of people claim that it’s usable in PvP.
One idea would be to give Mallyx an entirely new system. Like taking a certain GM would give him “demon” stacks when using Mallyx skills which have a self-DoT, but you could spread them around with the elite which could transform each stack into a damaging condition when placed on enemies. I don’t know, something fun and in-theme while increasing the Condi DPS would be nice (if Mallyx Rev is going to self-harm and be pretty vulnerable, it should at least do a decent chunk of damage).
Imo, put mace #2 on auto-attack is not a solution. Mallyx and condi Rev in generale need a global revamp:
No it’s not, and I didn’t try to give the indication it was … it’s just how I play the build because frankly, Mace 2 is a better auto attack than Mace 1 is. That’s pretty much how badly conceived the condi Rev is.
It seems to me there is a little bit too much emphasis on Torment as a main condition, which the Rev can’t really take advantage of since it’s on a melee weapon. I think a solution is to swap torment on Mace 1 for some bleed. How many stacks is open to debate. Perhaps Anet wouldn’t consider that to avoid it because it plays too much like Necro Scepter.
i see a lot of discussion for PVP value but personally i prefer WvW builds and i want to torment zergs a second round of elite specs could help this game a lot revenant could get one that focuses on bows that do torment and chill and a legend that goes for poison and bleeds. would grant access to a greater range of conditions while also granting ranged condition application without wasted weapon slots and legend.
Keep in mind that Mallyx as a whole was bandaid changed a few weeks before release of the expansion and the current version was meant to be a temporary one. That’s the reason for many inconsistencies, lacks of synergy and in gameplay.
Keep in mind that Mallyx as a whole was bandaid changed a few weeks before release of the expansion and the current version was meant to be a temporary one. That’s the reason for many inconsistencies, lacks of synergy and in gameplay.
anet has some serious lack of progression any news what they are working so hard on since hot that they have ignored class tweaks ever since? the only thing i could justify ignoring classes is if they were working on more elite specs
You clearly haven’t seen the ESL 1v1 tournaments. There was 1 player that successfully beat every other class put against it with a rev, including very good mesmers, DH and warriors. This was about 2 weeks and 1 week ago, so after the nerfs as well. And others playing rev haven’t been doing badly either. Tbh, the bad rep rev has been getting lately isn’t entirely deserved.
Yannir for males. (guard,thief,war,ele)
Sonya for females. (necro,rev,ranger,mes,engi)
All classes lvl 80.
You clearly haven’t seen the ESL 1v1 tournaments. There was 1 player that successfully beat every other class put against it with a rev, including very good mesmers, DH and warriors. This was about 2 weeks and 1 week ago, so after the nerfs as well. And others playing rev haven’t been doing badly either. Tbh, the bad rep rev has been getting lately isn’t entirely deserved.
You clearly haven’t seen the ESL 1v1 tournaments. There was 1 player that successfully beat every other class put against it with a rev, including very good mesmers, DH and warriors. This was about 2 weeks and 1 week ago, so after the nerfs as well. And others playing rev haven’t been doing badly either. Tbh, the bad rep rev has been getting lately isn’t entirely deserved.
>1 player
>Lul Rev is fine
>1 player
>Lul Rev is bad
Works both ways. Frankly, it’s nice there are some classes in this game with a high threshold for performance. Rev isn’t a bad class, you just need to be much better with it than many other classes. I don’t doubt that’s desirable though perhaps not intended by Anet. Variety isn’t something that should be avoided.
You clearly haven’t seen the ESL 1v1 tournaments. There was 1 player that successfully beat every other class put against it with a rev, including very good mesmers, DH and warriors. This was about 2 weeks and 1 week ago, so after the nerfs as well. And others playing rev haven’t been doing badly either. Tbh, the bad rep rev has been getting lately isn’t entirely deserved.
>1 player
>Lul Rev is fine
>1 player
>Lul Rev is bad
Works both ways. Frankly, it’s nice there are some classes in this game with a high threshold for performance. Rev isn’t a bad class, you just need to be much better with it than many other classes. I don’t doubt that’s desirable though perhaps not intended by Anet. Variety isn’t something that should be avoided.
What?
You just don’t get it, there is no point in playing a harder class but to feel a special snowflake, cause me original anti-meta special boy!. You could be playing any other easier class and still even outperform Rev.
Condi rev is clunky no true synergy between traits and the actual legend. No special interaction with its main condition being torment. No condition damage modifiers, weak resistance unless you’re in a team fight with ok boon duration.
You clearly haven’t seen the ESL 1v1 tournaments. There was 1 player that successfully beat every other class put against it with a rev, including very good mesmers, DH and warriors. This was about 2 weeks and 1 week ago, so after the nerfs as well. And others playing rev haven’t been doing badly either. Tbh, the bad rep rev has been getting lately isn’t entirely deserved.
>1 player
>Lul Rev is fine
That’s not exactly what I was suggesting… Nicely done.
Yannir for males. (guard,thief,war,ele)
Sonya for females. (necro,rev,ranger,mes,engi)
All classes lvl 80.
Keep in mind that Mallyx as a whole was bandaid changed a few weeks before release of the expansion and the current version was meant to be a temporary one. That’s the reason for many inconsistencies, lacks of synergy and in gameplay.
I read about those changes during BWE3. Devs basically said that mallyx mechanics’ designs works against other’s possible mechanics.
For example, during a raid Rev must have a certain number of conditions on himself to properly work and create “frustration and tensions” with condi-clean builds.
So the facts are that Devs chosed the easiest way to avoid this problem: remove the self-applied conditions. No skills buff or rework, no traits buff or rework, no rework on Mallyx mechanics.
This, at least for me, is unacceptable. I think that maybe, one morning, a Devs wake up and undertand that the time they put in Mallyx development is wasted time. Rev have no condi game style so they better totally remove Mallyx.
You clearly haven’t seen the ESL 1v1 tournaments. There was 1 player that successfully beat every other class put against it with a rev, including very good mesmers, DH and warriors. This was about 2 weeks and 1 week ago, so after the nerfs as well. And others playing rev haven’t been doing badly either. Tbh, the bad rep rev has been getting lately isn’t entirely deserved.
>1 player
>Lul Rev is fine
>1 player
>Lul Rev is bad
Works both ways. Frankly, it’s nice there are some classes in this game with a high threshold for performance. Rev isn’t a bad class, you just need to be much better with it than many other classes. I don’t doubt that’s desirable though perhaps not intended by Anet. Variety isn’t something that should be avoided.
What?
You just don’t get it, there is no point in playing a harder class but to feel a special snowflake, cause me original anti-meta special boy!. You could be playing any other easier class and still even outperform Rev.
No, you don’t get it … some people actually like to be challenged in the game, so yes, there are people just like you describe here where Rev would appeal to them. Just because you aren’t one of those people doesn’t mean variety in difficulty shouldn’t exist.
You clearly haven’t seen the ESL 1v1 tournaments. There was 1 player that successfully beat every other class put against it with a rev, including very good mesmers, DH and warriors. This was about 2 weeks and 1 week ago, so after the nerfs as well. And others playing rev haven’t been doing badly either. Tbh, the bad rep rev has been getting lately isn’t entirely deserved.
>1 player
>Lul Rev is fine
>1 player
>Lul Rev is bad
Works both ways. Frankly, it’s nice there are some classes in this game with a high threshold for performance. Rev isn’t a bad class, you just need to be much better with it than many other classes. I don’t doubt that’s desirable though perhaps not intended by Anet. Variety isn’t something that should be avoided.
What?
You just don’t get it, there is no point in playing a harder class but to feel a special snowflake, cause me original anti-meta special boy!. You could be playing any other easier class and still even outperform Rev.
No, you don’t get it … some people actually like to be challenged in the game, so yes, there are people just like you describe here where Rev would appeal to them. Just because you aren’t one of those people doesn’t mean variety in difficulty shouldn’t exist.
Dude, I generally like to use the more complicated classes or playstyles in games and find it rewarding. The difference here is that it’s complicated to play because it isn’t that good and there isn’t much room for error. It’s not like with ele or engi where there is a technical aspect that makes it difficult, but once mastered it pays off and can compete with the best.
You have to look at it for the reasons it’s challenging to play. Is it the playstyle or the balance of the class? I think the majority of it’s challenge is due to the balance. I also think the design of the class is weak, so if the things that work with rev are unbalanced, the class has no other aspects of it to lean on.
No doubt that Rev has balancing issues and to be fair … it is 2-3 years behind any other class in this game in terms of playtesting.
I think there is something to be said for the performance of the class in the hands of highly capable people though. You can’t make up for class deficiencies simply through skills and knowledge if they are all balance ones; that’s why I think we have some fraction of this due to difficulty. I think it’s an equal amount of both difficulty and unbalance. Highly skilled players can overcome difficulty.
Condi rev’s two biggest vices are it has terrible condition application as far as condi builds go and terrible sustain. Which saddens me because I really enjoy mace on rev.
If I remember correctly, out of the entire kit there is 9 total sources that all apply low stacks of conditions. In addition, is there is almost 0 support for conditions at all throughout the trait lines. The only two being poison, which is redundant with one measly stack and source of application from auto attack chain and the torment duration increase.
The sustain problem that people are talking about in here is a reveanant problem as a whole. Every rev build struggles with access to meaningful stability and being able to deal with conditions across the board.
I have outlined all this in a post that is over 10months old. Despite it being of my higher upvoted posts, very little came of it. The only thing that has changed is mallyx now has a stunbreak.
[Cya] TC Roamer/Scout
I Play WvW to have fun. I don’t find it fun anymore. Therefore I don’t play.
Despite being completely irrelevant in all PVE content, and utter trash for end game, I still stick to it for one simple fact: It is far more fun than Power Shiro/Jalis/Glint.
Despite being completely irrelevant in all PVE content, and utter trash for end game, I still stick to it for one simple fact: It is far more fun than Power Shiro/Jalis/Glint.
And I still find it way less fun than the Beta version which I feel was way more flavorful. The current Mallyx feels like any other condi spam build, but weaker.
Despite being completely irrelevant in all PVE content, and utter trash for end game, I still stick to it for one simple fact: It is far more fun than Power Shiro/Jalis/Glint.
And I still find it way less fun than the Beta version which I feel was way more flavorful. The current Mallyx feels like any other condi spam build, but weaker.
This. The only thing that actually needed a change was Unyielding Anguish, but not to the the watered-down version of generic AoE it is now.
