Guild Wars 2

Heya everyone,

I have been away for really long time now and would like to move from my warrior as I’ve played it far too long.

When HoT launched, revenant was bug sack, so what changed?

Hello sir! i will give you a tour of the revenant building, please come in. Alright on this side you see a massive pile of weights, these are nerfs, notice how much they hinder the the revenant, poor thing can hardly move! Alright moving on to our right we have..what was that? feels like we are walking in a circle? oh yeah this place has some rooms that feel out of place and seem like they have no place to be here…anyways moving on. Hm? what is it oh that? that is..oh crap ah run my friend! what? those those are bugs, yes there is a metric **** ton of them, don’t stop run!! Sadly we have to stop the tour because the bugs have have overrun the building. What? why am i placing this mask over the door? oh it’s make people want to walk into the building, yeah the mask looks fun doesn’t? but behind the mask is a overnerfed and bug ridden place indeed. Oh one last thing, see that massive creature? that’s anet better run its about to vomit more nerf weights on the building. Anyways have a good day sir!

tl;dr: Try guardian instead.

well, seems like I won’t be coming back for several years, if ever :/

Thanks for the update!

TokyoGhost.6492:

Heya everyone,

I have been away for really long time now and would like to move from my warrior as I’ve played it far too long.

When HoT launched, revenant was bug sack, so what changed?

Currently Warrior is better at power damage, condi damage, condition cleansing, access to stunbreaks and stability, self sustain, mobility, flexibility (number of builds and weapons viable) and disengaging.

Rev is currently bottom tier + is hard to play. But has Impossible Odds so is better at gathering logs and mining ore ;)

TokyoGhost.6492:

well, seems like I won’t be coming back for several years, if ever :/

Thanks for the update!

Look up pantheon rise of the fallen, currently waiting for that to come out.

Buran.3796:

TokyoGhost.6492:

Heya everyone,

I have been away for really long time now and would like to move from my warrior as I’ve played it far too long.

When HoT launched, revenant was bug sack, so what changed?

Currently Warrior is better at power damage, condi damage, condition cleansing, access to stunbreaks and stability, self sustain, mobility, flexibility (number of builds and weapons viable) and disengaging.

Rev is currently bottom tier + is hard to play. But has Impossible Odds so is better at gathering logs and mining ore

Nike warrior is faster at getting to the logs/ore in the first place making it overall the more efficient gatherer. It can even use frenzy every so often tighten the difference in gathering speed once the node is reached.

ArthurDent.9538:

Nike warrior is faster at getting to the logs/ore in the first place making it overall the more efficient gatherer. It can even use frenzy every so often tighten the difference in gathering speed once the node is reached.

Is true if you need to travel in the maps, but if your Rev just camps in a rich ore or near the Dwayna statues in Orr to chop the trees every hour then Rev is faster (and makes the character slighly better tan an empty slot).

Someone ask for state of rev and people discuss which class s better at harvesting nodes. Thats should sum it rev state.

I recently returned to the game after a long break, bought HoT, and just started a Rev a few days ago. The comments here are discouraging, I must say.

All I can think, however, is… Yeah, but those melee staff attacks! :-D

Reminds me so much of my (long ago) highly beloved Chanter in Aion.

I like her. I’ll keep her and level her up and see how things go.

Don’t base your opinion on other subjectives players’ ones….
Revenant & especially Herald is a GREAT support class which offers tons of boons ; you can build it damage oriented but it won’t be as efficient as other zerk class

It’s kinda of the Chanter in Aion indeed. Buffer / Damage dealer with decent damage output

Hyo Jin.5630:

Don’t base your opinion on other subjectives players’ ones….
Revenant & especially Herald is a GREAT support class which offers tons of boons Buffer / Damage dealer with decent damage output

Not sure if trolling at this point. All the boons can be covered much better by other classes that can do better DPS and have better utilities for the group. Fury ? Druid with tiger. Power stack ? PS warriors do that so much better. And so on.

The damage isn’t that great either, especially on staff, there’s nothing crazy about it.

If you plan on camping world maps and low level content, then yea sure it’s ok, but like any other class you can play pretty much anything and be fine.
Now, start fractals and raids. You’ll quickly understand the problem of having such weak and buggy class.

Scar.1793:

If you plan on camping world maps and low level content, then yea sure it’s ok, but like any other class you can play pretty much anything and be fine.

M’eh… high end content has always been a bit of a pain for me. I’m an absent minded old fart, so PvE is about all I do. Unfogging maps, farming for loot, and grinding achievements is pretty much my thing.

Sounds like I wasted my llv 80boost on rev kitten lol and I also have a ranger which I hate cause I don’t like support but I didn’t know they were both support ranger jus t looked cool at the time. I should go kill myself, or maybe go play on my lvl 18 elemental is how is ele In wvw?

Scar.1793:

Hyo Jin.5630:

Don’t base your opinion on other subjectives players’ ones….
Revenant & especially Herald is a GREAT support class which offers tons of boons Buffer / Damage dealer with decent damage output

Not sure if trolling at this point. All the boons can be covered much better by other classes that can do better DPS and have better utilities for the group. Fury ? Druid with tiger. Power stack ? PS warriors do that so much better. And so on.

The damage isn’t that great either, especially on staff, there’s nothing crazy about it.

If you plan on camping world maps and low level content, then yea sure it’s ok, but like any other class you can play pretty much anything and be fine.
Now, start fractals and raids. You’ll quickly understand the problem of having such weak and buggy class.

I have a Herald that has 3 full Ascended sets for Support, Condi and Power/Boons (mix of Zerk/Valk, Commanders and Assassins that give me 100% Crit and Boon rate). I have zero issues in Raids or Fractals. It is a little tiring to constantly see comments like this from people who think that Herald is just good for a mule or “low level content”. I have all of the weapons, regularly use staff and see no DPS issues at all (I absolutely love the breakbar destruction #5 can do).

Prior to HoT I mained a Guardian, once I got Rev/Herald I never looked back because I had so much fun with it (still do).

Herald IS a great class, sure it can take a little bit of learning to get used to the class and master it, but in my own opinion and experience – once you do, you’re nigh unstoppable. For 5 man content, the Herald gives you boons that allow other classes to not focus on boons and instead damage or support, which is sort of the point.

Are there bugs for the class? Yes (I haven’t personally experienced any of these other than that bug which used to stop you during the Sword bladestorm).

Could it use some buffs? Yes, especially 100% skill splits for PVE and PVP where there are obvious differences.

tl;dr build a Rev, play it, if you enjoy it go with it and ignore anything you see from anyone else.

TokyoGhost.6492:

Current state of revenant?

Depends who you ask.
Ask a person was here before rev nerf they will probably tell you its broken and worthless.
Ask someone post nerf they probably tell you its a fun and a good class lol.

Personally, i love rev as is could use some slight energy tweaks on weapon skills I feel But for the most part I’m content and able to work well with it and have become good with energy management. But I’m also a post nerf rev user, I never seen or played rev before that huge nerf of things took place.
So my opinion completely different then a majority of the pre-nerf users.

All I can say test it and see. If you don’t like it, then ya don’t. Just skip it until it’s in line more with what you are seeking.

There is only 1 class that holds all the weaknesses of other classes, and that is the rev.

Also, thiefs are the fastest at gathering. They also got quickness and Shortbow 5 allows you to jump right on top of walls or other stuff at times.

Its Nerfing Time.1495:

It is a little tiring to constantly see comments like this from people who think that Herald is just good for a mule or “low level content”. I have all of the weapons, regularly use staff and see no DPS issues at all (I absolutely love the breakbar destruction #5 can do).

Most of the criticism about the current state of the Rev turns around how performs in PvP, not PvE.

In PvE you can solo most of the contest with any class, and if the class is a Rev you can soloing using sword #1 ~90% of the time (that includes a few champions).

There’s still certain problems in PvE (i.e.: conditions, due condi Rev is mainly a mele fighter with torment as main source of damage, which means that you must either stay close to the target to stack condis and do half of damage or fight at range which means no condition stacks at all). But PvE isn’t problematic because as was said PvE is easy, “facerrolling your keyboard” content.

PvP instead is a whole different animal: there’s certain roles, and your class can either fit at least one of them with a certain degree of success or find himself between a roack and a hard place. Currently Revenant is subpar in those roles and on top of that is hard to manage, because you need to arrange both cooldowns and energy, you have low access to cleansing, expensive stunbreakers, not reliable sources of stability, poor weapon variety and no flexibility at all chosing skills for you utility bar. Revenant was always hard to use (and along the time the subsequent nerfs made Him even harder), but at least there were rewards (mostly: the damage). Currently has no rewards: is a high risk – low reward class.

The current state is bad, no need to sugar it.

Buran.3796:

Its Nerfing Time.1495:

It is a little tiring to constantly see comments like this from people who think that Herald is just good for a mule or “low level content”. I have all of the weapons, regularly use staff and see no DPS issues at all (I absolutely love the breakbar destruction #5 can do).

Most of the criticism about the current state of the Rev turns around how performs in PvP, not PvE.

In PvE you can solo most of the contest with any class, and if the class is a Rev you can soloing using sword #1 ~90% of the time (that includes a few champions).

There’s still certain problems in PvE (i.e.: conditions, due condi Rev is mainly a mele fighter with torment as main source of damage, which means that you must either stay close to the target to stack condis and do half of damage or fight at range which means no condition stacks at all). But PvE isn’t problematic because as was said PvE is easy, “facerrolling your keyboard” content.

PvP instead is a whole different animal: there’s certain roles, and your class can either fit at least one of them with a certain degree of success or find himself between a roack and a hard place. Currently Revenant is subpar in those roles and on top of that is hard to manage, because you need to arrange both cooldowns and energy, you have low access to cleansing, expensive stunbreakers, not reliable sources of stability, poor weapon variety and no flexibility at all chosing skills for you utility bar. Revenant was always hard to use (and along the time the subsequent nerfs made Him even harder), but at least there were rewards (mostly: the damage). Currently has no rewards: is a high risk – low reward class.

The current state is bad, no need to sugar it.

I’m aware of the issues around PVP, however PVP is not the main focus of the game nor the post. It wasn’t actually specified which, I only addressed the PVE side as I do not PVP.

You don’t have to solo with just Sword (although it is a viable option) and I certainly wouldn’t recommend it as it can be a little bit boring.

Condi Rev has pretty good access towards Burning as well as Torment – you can make a target move around within your burning field easily enough, and if built with full Vipers + food it’s pretty quick to ramp up.

The current state in PVP might be bad – again I don’t address (nor much care) for PVP. The state of Rev however, is not anywhere near as bad as people here certainly put it. People put “oh pve is faceroll, play whatever”, then also mention “rev can’t do xyz”. The two don’t quite add up (with xyz usually being higher Fractals or Raids). Rev is in a moderate place in PVE, not amazingly overpowered or underpowered.

As stated before it could do with some buffs and a full PVE/PVP split (which would help alleviate balance concerns on both sides of board)

It’s… meh. Best word I can describe.

Buran.3796:

Its Nerfing Time.1495:

It is a little tiring to constantly see comments like this from people who think that Herald is just good for a mule or “low level content”. I have all of the weapons, regularly use staff and see no DPS issues at all (I absolutely love the breakbar destruction #5 can do).

Most of the criticism about the current state of the Rev turns around how performs in PvP, not PvE.

In PvE you can solo most of the contest with any class, and if the class is a Rev you can soloing using sword #1 ~90% of the time (that includes a few champions).

There’s still certain problems in PvE (i.e.: conditions, due condi Rev is mainly a mele fighter with torment as main source of damage, which means that you must either stay close to the target to stack condis and do half of damage or fight at range which means no condition stacks at all). But PvE isn’t problematic because as was said PvE is easy, “facerrolling your keyboard” content.

Actually no, most of Revenant’s problems are in PvE. It’s completely outclassed in every single role in raids except MAYBE kiting the last boss in wing 4.

Its Nerfing Time.1495:

I’m aware of the issues around PVP, however PVP is not the main focus of the game nor the post. It wasn’t actually specified which, I only addressed the PVE side as I do not PVP.

Good that wasn’t specified in the post due for sure for each thread about PvE which is open in the Rev forum ther’s at least 2-3 about PvP. PvErs barely touch the class forums.

@Malchior: when you say “PvE” you really mean “PvE raids” which are a niche mostly played by a minority (as PvP) and in which most of the matches are inside PvE guilds, which have no problems lining almost any team composition, because they are crushing raids playing 9, playing 8, 7… playing all exotics and carrying hard any hobo from their guild with 0 problems.

If a player has hard time entering in public raids as a Rev due the crapiness of the class He can easily fix it entering in a guild, because most of them are prone to help their own members no matter the class and race your main is.

Meanwhile, being in a PvP guild doesn’t help too much playing a Rev, because frailty to condis, ccs and clunkyness can be solved just being carried (and less in a solo/duo matches).

Thing about rev is outside of the herald what does it bring? The main problem while the class was in development it…from what i see anyways…was built around herald…you take away the herald you get a weak mess of a class.

Buran.3796:

@Malchior: when you say “PvE” you really mean “PvE raids” which are a niche mostly played by a minority (as PvP) and in which most of the matches are inside PvE guilds, which have no problems lining almost any team composition, because they are crushing raids playing 9, playing 8, 7… playing all exotics and carrying hard any hobo from their guild with 0 problems.

If a player has hard time entering in public raids as a Rev due the crapiness of the class He can easily fix it entering in a guild, because most of them are prone to help their own members no matter the class and race your main is.

Uhh, raids are actually pugged quite often and I can only think of a few guilds that are actually good enough to low-man them.

It’s also not “just simply join any raid guild” to play your garbage Rev. The average guild will expect 100% meta compositions and they might let you run Rev after you prove yourself, but you’re directly harming the group’s time in most cases when you do that.
Assuming you can join a guild that will even let you play non-meta in raids in the first place. Yes, some will help you, but not so you can stay on your trash class or so you can use your bad build, it’s so you can learn to play meta and actually contribute.

Have you tried to raid on a Revenant yourself? It’s not easy.
If you don’t raid with a guild, then you’re just gonna have to suck it up and basically never use it because most groups will just deny you or ask you to swap.

In PvP, you frequently see people getting to the higher ranks with Revenant at the very least and I hear that some organized groups do well with them.
Compare in PvE, where Revenant literally has no desired role except arguably on a single boss. It’s almost completely unwanted in the end-game.

Malchior.5732:

Buran.3796:

@Malchior: when you say “PvE” you really mean “PvE raids” which are a niche mostly played by a minority (as PvP) and in which most of the matches are inside PvE guilds, which have no problems lining almost any team composition, because they are crushing raids playing 9, playing 8, 7… playing all exotics and carrying hard any hobo from their guild with 0 problems.

If a player has hard time entering in public raids as a Rev due the crapiness of the class He can easily fix it entering in a guild, because most of them are prone to help their own members no matter the class and race your main is.

Uhh, raids are actually pugged quite often and I can only think of a few guilds that are actually good enough to low-man them.

It’s also not “just simply join any raid guild” to play your garbage Rev. The average guild will expect 100% meta compositions and they might let you run Rev after you prove yourself, but you’re directly harming the group’s time in most cases when you do that.
Assuming you can join a guild that will even let you play non-meta in raids in the first place. Yes, some will help you, but not so you can stay on your trash class or so you can use your bad build, it’s so you can learn to play meta and actually contribute.

Have you tried to raid on a Revenant yourself? It’s not easy.
If you don’t raid with a guild, then you’re just gonna have to suck it up and basically never use it because most groups will just deny you or ask you to swap.

In PvP, you frequently see people getting to the higher ranks with Revenant at the very least and I hear that some organized groups do well with them.
Compare in PvE, where Revenant literally has no desired role except arguably on a single boss. It’s almost completely unwanted in the end-game.

This.

Every single raid guild I’ve joined has required you to play meta. I’ve gone through about 4 or 5 raid guilds now pre-Rev nerf and post-Rev nerf.

Pre-nerf, I had to constantly either drop out of the group because they already had a Revenant slot filled or we wiped because we had 2 to 3 Revenants taking up DPS slots.

Post-nerf, no one wanted to play with me despite being an experienced player with full ascended and previous Raid experience on this and other MMO’s.

Revenant just doesn’t bring anything notable to Raids that other classes don’t have. That and they sometimes even bring what Revenant offers and more. With Elementalist running Warhorn, your boon sharing isn’t even as desirable as Chronos, Eles, and Warriors can pump out boons and outdamage Revenant plus Ele can even choose to extend their boon duration with Earth 4 on Warhorn or their passive which automatically casts the skill every so often.

Rain.9213:

Malchior.5732:

Buran.3796:

@Malchior: when you say “PvE” you really mean “PvE raids” which are a niche mostly played by a minority (as PvP) and in which most of the matches are inside PvE guilds, which have no problems lining almost any team composition, because they are crushing raids playing 9, playing 8, 7… playing all exotics and carrying hard any hobo from their guild with 0 problems.

If a player has hard time entering in public raids as a Rev due the crapiness of the class He can easily fix it entering in a guild, because most of them are prone to help their own members no matter the class and race your main is.

Uhh, raids are actually pugged quite often and I can only think of a few guilds that are actually good enough to low-man them.

It’s also not “just simply join any raid guild” to play your garbage Rev. The average guild will expect 100% meta compositions and they might let you run Rev after you prove yourself, but you’re directly harming the group’s time in most cases when you do that.
Assuming you can join a guild that will even let you play non-meta in raids in the first place. Yes, some will help you, but not so you can stay on your trash class or so you can use your bad build, it’s so you can learn to play meta and actually contribute.

Have you tried to raid on a Revenant yourself? It’s not easy.
If you don’t raid with a guild, then you’re just gonna have to suck it up and basically never use it because most groups will just deny you or ask you to swap.

In PvP, you frequently see people getting to the higher ranks with Revenant at the very least and I hear that some organized groups do well with them.
Compare in PvE, where Revenant literally has no desired role except arguably on a single boss. It’s almost completely unwanted in the end-game.

This.

Every single raid guild I’ve joined has required you to play meta. I’ve gone through about 4 or 5 raid guilds now pre-Rev nerf and post-Rev nerf.

Pre-nerf, I had to constantly either drop out of the group because they already had a Revenant slot filled or we wiped because we had 2 to 3 Revenants taking up DPS slots.

Post-nerf, no one wanted to play with me despite being an experienced player with full ascended and previous Raid experience on this and other MMO’s.

Revenant just doesn’t bring anything notable to Raids that other classes don’t have. That and they sometimes even bring what Revenant offers and more. With Elementalist running Warhorn, your boon sharing isn’t even as desirable as Chronos, Eles, and Warriors can pump out boons and outdamage Revenant plus Ele can even choose to extend their boon duration with Earth 4 on Warhorn or their passive which automatically casts the skill every so often.

Most people sadly tend to want to run the “meta” because they don’t know/understand any different and think that’s the only way to play. I’ve done both Power and Condi Rev in Raids with zero issues so I understand your pain.

As to the “what do they offer that others don’t” I believe I mentioned in an earlier post – if you have a Rev to give you boons, other classes can focus more on damage/cc if needed, and less on boons.

I’m the only “main” Rev player in my guild, there’s probably 2 other people who play it, they know my capabilities in Raid/Fractals/x content so no issues there. I have to say though, whilst I’ve never “pugged” a Raid in the truest sense (our guild has pugged a few extras before), I have pugged T4 Fractals and have never been asked to switch off Rev which I’ve seen a few people say in these forums before. I guess my point is that I really don’t understand the whole “Rev is useless/not wanted at endgame”. Maybe I’ve been lucky that I’ve never ran into such people, but I tend to judge on capability and skill rather than class when doing any content.

Malchior.5732:

Have you tried to raid on a Revenant yourself? It’s not easy.
If you don’t raid with a guild, then you’re just gonna have to su

Yes, I tried. I did the first wing with my guild teammates a few times, but then I stopped playing that gamemode (as did with fractals) because I found both utterly unrewarding. Raids require to expent a lot of time in exchange to low earnings/not gold at all, and a lot of planification which prevents you to do more rewarding things. On top of that the guild in which I play is (was) mostly WvW oriented, so to me doing raids were a waste of time. Doesn’t matter too much now due the guild is mostly dead (the WvW stagnation and lack of rewards/improvements made most of players to stop playing the game for weeks and then months).

@Rain: if as Revenant you find hard to get a spot in guild raids then at least you can pay gold to be carried by a “pro” PvE guild. Yo can’t do the same in PvP to reach some milestone.

Yesterday I started S6; as expected some matches were close but I lost every one, but at least I had fun. PvP Revenant is a dead horse -intended pun-.

Pay gold to get carried? That’s one of the worst positions for a class to be in lol.
Also, in NA, I frequently see 200g+ per boss which is crazy expensive.

I did start Season 5 PvP playing power DH in the classification matches, scoring a 8/2 win ratio and being placed in tier 2 gold (~14xx). Then played burn DH for a month ending in gold tier 1 and getting all the chest. Then started to play power Rev just to see my w/l ratio falling below 50% and ending at silver tier 2.

This season I started the classification matches playing power Rev. No matter how much enemies killed, damage provided, points decapped or times scored as “best of”: I ended with 2 wins and 8 defeats placed in brass tier 2 with an initial score of 914:

[img]http://i.imgur.com/4Y8ETUm.jpg[/img]

[img]http://i.imgur.com/DxOmhif.jpg[/img]

I’m currently better playing Rev than DH, is just that the class is mostly a dead weight in PvP: you’re bad at bursting because your damage is mostly AA, you’re bad at sustain due lack of cleansing and vulnerability to condis and cc; you’re even bad at finishing enemies because the lack of stability, albeit Rev is good canceling revives from enemies.

TokyoGhost, if you’re still interested in the Rev as character and you enjoy PvP I would suggest you to keep away from the class from a while, because is frustrating.

I got to plat 3 just playing rev last season in pvp. Was it easy? Hell no. I honestly I think would have had an easier time playing warrior or guardian. But I played it simply because I enjoyed the class. I also still use rev to do most of all content. Haven’t done raids in a while tho.

Where they are most useful? Honestly, WvW zergs. Mainly for their ability to pile on group resistance, and hammer dps when your not getting focused still does a lot of damage.

Don’t quit on it completely just yet. Wait for future balance patches or next expansion. Some of the other classes have also gone through this phase where they are completely useless in some content, but they were buffed and now viable almost everywhere.

IMO it’s at the core a very fun class let down by a game around it which is absolutely not compatible with any of its more modern or more advanced design.

Among other things, GW2 has no proper support for combat roles (even with the Druid, Ventari and the Aura Ele around), has no support for multi-role setups and can’t even support someone wanting to tank on purpose.

And that’s PvE. PvP just makes you realize why MOBAs have become successful. Not having PvP combat like GW2 does.

I think that if not for the game it is placed in, the concept and elements of the Revenant are good. It could work amazingly well in WoW for example, being something akin to a Druid used to be when they were leaning more towards hopping into other roles.

I cannot speak for PVE/Raids. But if your looking for a high DPS power/condi character you should probably look at other classes. However if you enjoy playing a group support character in modes such as WvW its pretty fun to play. Healing changes have been nice, and Rev’s can produce a lot of boons for front line support.

So I’ve been living in Fractals and WvW for a period of time now and after finishing 100 Nightmare CM on a Power Jalis/ Glint build I think I can place Rev as the “necromancer” of the heavy classes.
They don’t have the raw might stacking potential of a warrior nor aegis or symbol uptime of a guard, but their inbuilt survivability in that setup along with the nerfed boon dispense is still invaluable to the team. I daresay this class is EASY to play in T4.
Near instant breakbars with staff 5 + Jalis Pull alone is invaluable.
I haven’t had a single complaint about this class option in T4’s.

I sincerely hope that this class eventually gets a place in raids again as I feel that their current state is like a missed opportunity. I haven’t played Revenant in Pre-nerf scenario so it may be why I’m enjoying this class as is.
WvW, no complaints.

I made it to gold 3 with this class playing on and off but I think that would be a bad indicator due to the fact that literally anyone could do it with a little effort. I tried again in S5 but until a better substitute for Shiro is found, I can’t really justify a proper role for the class at the moment.

Everything that was fun or interesting about the class has been taken away.

no CD phase traversal, mallyx, sword auto damage, stability on dodge.

honestly, this game is so bland & boring now.

They killed the condition revenant when they changed mallyx elite from copying conditions to apply torment.

It was fun, strong but fun.

It needed counterplay in the form of applying resistance to the team and staying away from the revenant.

They had build a complex mechanic that they couldn’t bother to balance, so instead they decided to scrap it away.

You could apply yourself conditions with your skills like how a necromancer can do, then spread them around with your avatar form, it wasn’t a simple passive that you pop on and forget until energy is about to end, you needed to manage to get as many conditions and resistance on you as possible to be effective, while pressuring on the enemy.

Pve side, revenant is just another autoattack dps like thief has been forever, while in pvp has still his role of being that armored chaser, overly crippled by all the post launch cd’s, nerfs and energy costs increase.

The whole copy-conditions (or copy-boons, also recently nerfed) is only a problem because they decided to go with a “weak but spammable” approach to everything.

If conditions were very very rare, but individually crippling and powerful, then there would be much less threat in it. Yes, still a lot, granted, but far less.

Example:

Torment
Torment a target enemy for X seconds, making them lose 2% of their maximum health every second. The damage ramps up for every second that they’re moving, up to 10% per second. The condition will not end if the target is still moving when it expires.
They have to stop for ~1s to let it drop at the end.

Condition Damage has an interesting role here: It increase the maximum cap on what 2%/10% can be. So in PvE you can do a lot of damage to a moving enemy but only if your condition damage is high.

And, as I said, this condition would be rare. Really rare. Getting hit by it is evil, but in turn, getting through it means you can rely on not getting it again for a certain amount of time at least.