Guild Wars 2

Legends are locked into certain predesigned roles and each legend’s doesn’t seem to sync with other legends and their roles. Legend swap also seem to be the go to design for regenerating energy when fully low as well.

This to me seem to be a flaw in the design of the Revenant’s Legend and Energy system.

Because let’s say, I am a Ventari Support Revenant in full cleric gear and Centaur Legend for support.
I run low on energy. Now what Legend will benefit my role and gear choice now? Centaur has the only heal support of any legend besides Herald.
Should I switch to a condition legend? Or Dwarf legend, or Assassin legend with my cleric gear to get that energy boost?
What benefit would I have in doing so, if I will be locked out of the Centaur Legend when I do swap?

IMO the better solution to this flaw, is by giving each legend an additional set of skills that can be switched in place of the stock skills, that may potentially fit the role of the build I may be building around at the time. This way all stats would still fit the legend I swap to, as well as the role I can continue to play.

Well it’s not a flaw, is just what it is.
Rev is dynamic class like engi. Legends DO cover different roles that do not overlap BY CHOICE.
Meaning you should combine them trying to compliment each other not extending one or another.
If you want to stay sorta “clean” pair anything with glint which is very grey and can compliment just any other role with his boon support.

About energy, recovery by swapping is not always thr best call: swap recharges in 10s and in this time you can recover the same amount of energy (50) camping actual legend. Swap ONLY if you need to (like for an heal or a specific utility).
Lastly, you shouldnt let your energy deplete always to zero to spam skills. That’s not how revenant is designed ;-)

Cheers!

Ok, I’ll bite. What’s wrong with Legendary Dragon stance?

Misguided.5139:

Ok, I’ll bite. What’s wrong with Legendary Dragon stance?

It’s an elite spec legend, only available to people that use Herald specialization as mentioned in the OP.

The class by itself is designed around this mechanic of hard role swapping. Every Legend offers radically different skills compared to the others. So in the example of OP, if he leaves Ventari no other Legend will be able to cover the role that the centaur offers. Gaaroth’s suggestion is on point in regards to finding Legends that compliment each other rather than find a pair of Legends that can do the same thing. The closest thing to sharing roles is done through traits selection.

If your initial complaint/suggestion is based on because you run out of energy so often I would recommend better resource management. There’s nothing that states you can’t sit in a Legend and wait for your energy to recover. Though if you elect for the easier Legend swapping for regaining energy, you’ll need consider the trade-off of what skills you lose by doing so. Personally, Ventari is one of those Legends that I camp in and wait for my energy to recover unless I know I have a solid 10 seconds where none of the tablet skills will be needed.

Knighthonor.4061:

Misguided.5139:

Ok, I’ll bite. What’s wrong with Legendary Dragon stance?

It’s an elite spec legend, only available to people that use Herald specialization as mentioned in the OP.

Actually, the OP doesn’t say that. Moreover, how is that a problem?

savacli.8172:

The class by itself is designed around this mechanic of hard role swapping.

Right. This is why I paired Glint with Jalis. If you plan to spend much of your time in one legend, the thing to consider is why you would want/need to leave it. I might leave Glint because I need more healing, condition clear, or the party is taking too much damage, so Jalis makes perfect sense.

One might leave Ventari because they don’t need healing at the moment and want an offensive focus (Shiro? Though perhaps this might be more because you want mobility) or because they want to provide other types of support (Glint).

For me I generally ran two setups. Well, three, but the last one was for lolz rather than usefulness (won’t list that). Important note being, I mostly play PvE.

Glint/Ventari
Prestack boons and attack with Glint but placing priority on camping Ventari as the fight more or less needed the utility from the Centaur skills.

Glint/Shiro
Spent most of my time in Glint watching out for boons and using Active Facet attacks. Switched to Shiro for increased damage potential, high evasion requirement, or shadowstep shenanigans.

Did each Legend cover the roles of the other? Not at all. Did I have to do some planning ahead and energy management. Absolutely. Though, that’s what intrigues me to the profession if I’m being honest. Otherwise, if there was a blending or mixing of Legend skills/roles you’d end up with Ele v2.

I have personally been camping Shiro all day long swapping to Glint if i needed extra heal (that didnt really happened often unless i was 1vX). Each legend is supposed to change our playstyle and i think they did good job here.

I focus on avoiding damage and bursting people down in Shiro while in Glint i tank and support people. Does it hurt me losing mobility, evades, stunbreaks and cc when i swap out of Shiro? Yes it does. But that how this professions was supposed to work in the first place.

What i miss is that there is olny one condi, one dps, one “tank”, and 2 support legends for now. Hopefully next elite spec is also dps oriented with red theme (hail blood legion) and gs as i actually wish to pick 2 legends with the same roles but still playing different from each of them (just no more ipads please)

He is correct in a way with ventari. The legend is built around being camped. 10 seconds without having the tablet up is a price that none of the other legends seem to make up for. I’ve sometime wondered if they could allow you to swap between the same legend in the way that you can equip p/d on both weapon sets for a thief.

However revenant might just be that way. Staff elementalist has to deal with a 10 second dps loss everytime they leave fire.

Daniel Handler.4816:

He is correct in a way with ventari. The legend is built around being camped. 10 seconds without having the tablet up is a price that none of the other legends seem to make up for. I’ve sometime wondered if they could allow you to swap between the same legend in the way that you can equip p/d on both weapon sets for a thief.

However revenant might just be that way. Staff elementalist has to deal with a 10 second dps loss everytime they leave fire.

Err, not quite. This goes back to what I said about Rev’s hard lockout distinguishing them from being Ele v2.

Fire, thematically, is supposed to be the “Shiro” of the Ele. Yet, I can deal heavy amounts of damage in Water due to damage modifiers. Lightning Storm (Air) is one of the strongest area attacks, and it’s secondary effect of applying vulnerability passively adds to the damage count.

It’s more of a soft lockout when comes to Ele skills since some of their “roles” can still be accessed out of the primarily attunement for that role. The challenge in Ele is keeping up the momentum when challenged by cooldowns and learning how attunements can meld with one another to excel at one role at the cost of another E.G. I can use Water for extra damage, but I lose out on the healing/recovery potential of that attunement. Though after some seconds I can access Water for recovery purposes or once again use it for offensive purposes.

With Rev, I can’t do that. When I choose a legend I am committed to that role. I can kinda cheat and slot in traits and key weapons to slightly multi-role, but ultimately my potential boils down to the two figures I decided to take into battle.

savacli.8172:

Daniel Handler.4816:

He is correct in a way with ventari. The legend is built around being camped. 10 seconds without having the tablet up is a price that none of the other legends seem to make up for. I’ve sometime wondered if they could allow you to swap between the same legend in the way that you can equip p/d on both weapon sets for a thief.

However revenant might just be that way. Staff elementalist has to deal with a 10 second dps loss everytime they leave fire.

Err, not quite. This goes back to what I said about Rev’s hard lockout distinguishing them from being Ele v2.

Fire, thematically, is supposed to be the “Shiro” of the Ele. Yet, I can deal heavy amounts of damage in Water due to damage modifiers. Lightning Storm (Air) is one of the strongest area attacks, and it’s secondary effect of applying vulnerability passively adds to the damage count.

It’s more of a soft lockout when comes to Ele skills since some of their “roles” can still be accessed out of the primarily attunement for that role. The challenge in Ele is keeping up the momentum when challenged by cooldowns and learning how attunements can meld with one another to excel at one role at the cost of another E.G. I can use Water for extra damage, but I lose out on the healing/recovery potential of that attunement. Though after some seconds I can access Water for recovery purposes or once again use it for offensive purposes.

With Rev, I can’t do that. When I choose a legend I am committed to that role. I can kinda cheat and slot in traits and key weapons to slightly multi-role, but ultimately my potential boils down to the two figures I decided to take into battle.

This is true. There are no lingering benefits to revenant as their are to ele. Which makes revenant a pickle. We are encouraged to swap yet swapping is usually an issue to whatever role we are trying to perform.

Hmm, I look at it as that we have the option to want/need to swap rather than are encouraged/discouraged. For example, some Legends lend themselves to a camping of sorts, Ventari and Glint for instance. However, the mechanics are there if you need to swap, for energy gain, or several traits, especially Invocation, that encourage swapping.

The design really gives you a feel of personalization of your own wants/needs that make this class really shine. The mode-switch feel to it is what attracts me the most to this class. You don’t have to swap Legends continously on CD to be effective, unlike Elementalists, where really need to switch attunements on CD.

Really, there’s a give or take to the swapping, rather than a have to.

Heck, I plan on using every single Legend during my gameplay, but I also have a Legend-neutral build in mind.

Lonewolf Kai.3682:

Hmm, I look at it as that we have the option to want/need to swap rather than are encouraged/discouraged. For example, some Legends lend themselves to a camping of sorts, Ventari and Glint for instance. However, the mechanics are there if you need to swap, for energy gain, or several traits, especially Invocation, that encourage swapping.

The design really gives you a feel of personalization of your own wants/needs that make this class really shine. The mode-switch feel to it is what attracts me the most to this class. You don’t have to swap Legends continously on CD to be effective, unlike Elementalists, where really need to switch attunements on CD.

Really, there’s a give or take to the swapping, rather than a have to.

Heck, I plan on using every single Legend during my gameplay, but I also have a Legend-neutral build in mind.

But the problem is a lot of the mechanics is around Legend swap. The Invocation specialization has just that. Problem is, the secondary legend may not provide me with tools I need, and now would be locked out the skills I actually need.

Also lets not forget my stat combo. If I gear cleric, what use would I gain from switching from Centaur legend to any non-Elite Specialization legend? I would be screwed.

None of the other legends fit my role and have no choices in their skill set. Each legend has a role predesigned for it, which I have no control over.

Like I said, this is a design flaw. Legends need to be more customizable, or the legend swap benefits need to be revamped to not require abandoning the legend that you spec for.

Knighthonor.4061:

Like I said, this is a design flaw. Legends need to be more customizable, or the legend swap benefits need to be revamped to not require abandoning the legend that you spec for.

This isn’t a flaw and they don’t need to be more customizable. People think that because they become fixated on the revenant working like other professions. Instead, we, as players, need to think about playing the profession in a different way.

Again I ask you to imagine the scenario where you don’t want Ventari. Figure out what those scenarios might be (I already made some suggestions) then you can decide what legend will fit with what you want to do.

The thing I like about the legends is that they are situational. No one legend can or should be ideal in every situation.

Misguided.5139:

Knighthonor.4061:

Like I said, this is a design flaw. Legends need to be more customizable, or the legend swap benefits need to be revamped to not require abandoning the legend that you spec for.

This isn’t a flaw and they don’t need to be more customizable. People think that because they become fixated on the revenant working like other professions. Instead, we, as players, need to think about playing the profession in a different way.

Again I ask you to imagine the scenario where you don’t want Ventari. Figure out what those scenarios might be (I already made some suggestions) then you can decide what legend will fit with what you want to do.

The thing I like about the legends is that they are situational. No one legend can or should be ideal in every situation.

Situational to what? They each have a role. My traits and stats dont suddenly change when my Legend changes. Th is not a PvE only thing were you can just switch out everything for each and every pull.

pvp comes to mind here. Most legends besides ES dont match up well with each other. Swapping will lock you out.

why swap for a Stun break if I will be locked out my needed skills for 10 seconds?

Why swap for energy is I will be locked out the very skills I needed the energy for?

Thats a design flaw.

If your stats don’t fit with the second legend you choose, then choose different stats or a different legend.

If you don’t want to swap for a stun break, don’t. if you are running out of energy, stop mismanaging energy.

Misguided.5139:

If your stats don’t fit with the second legend you choose, then choose different stats or a different legend.

If you don’t want to swap for a stun break, don’t. if you are running out of energy, stop mismanaging energy.

You still not getting the point. If I spec for Cleric gear and Tablet, what non Elite Spec legend would go with that gear?

answer me that.

Knighthonor.4061:

Misguided.5139:

If your stats don’t fit with the second legend you choose, then choose different stats or a different legend.

If you don’t want to swap for a stun break, don’t. if you are running out of energy, stop mismanaging energy.

You still not getting the point. If I spec for Cleric gear and Tablet, what non Elite Spec legend would go with that gear?

answer me that.

Assuming you absolutely cannot camp Ventari and absolutely refuse to use Glint for whatever reason, you can drop on Jalis for continued group support(group damage mitigation is pretty nice).
You’re still able to heal team mates with X/Shield and Staff, so I don’t see an issue.

I get the point just fine. You set up a straw man to make a point I don’t agree with.

But to answer yet again, if it were me, I’d use Glint. It is simply too good not to use (which is a different problem). Cleric’s has power, which would be useful. You can run regen and even protection to keep your group alive while locked out of Ventari. Barring that, Jalis makes a certain amount of sense. Again, I think it comes down to why you would leave Ventari.

And if that doesn’t work for you, you could always follow the advice you gave on the Druid forum: if you don’t like it, don’t play it.

Knighthonor.4061:

Misguided.5139:

If your stats don’t fit with the second legend you choose, then choose different stats or a different legend.

If you don’t want to swap for a stun break, don’t. if you are running out of energy, stop mismanaging energy.

You still not getting the point. If I spec for Cleric gear and Tablet, what non Elite Spec legend would go with that gear?

answer me that.

Jalis or glint. Which can provide healing from the hammers (jalis) or from the regen (glint) But I see your point, swapping becomes more of a chore.

The person you responded to made the weird statement that you could just not swap for a stunbreak.

This is blatantly false because ventari has no stunbreakers.

Daniel Handler.4816:

The person you responded to made the weird statement that you could just not swap for a stunbreak.

This is blatantly false because ventari has no stunbreakers.

Mea culpa on that one. Thank you for pointing it out. Seems like a weird oversight for a support legend. The flip side of having the distinct roles is that they should be somewhat self-sufficient within certain limits. Even so, I would make the case that this is an issue (a big one) with the design of the legend, rather than the profession as a whole.

Knighthonor.4061:

Misguided.5139:

If your stats don’t fit with the second legend you choose, then choose different stats or a different legend.

If you don’t want to swap for a stun break, don’t. if you are running out of energy, stop mismanaging energy.

You still not getting the point. If I spec for Cleric gear and Tablet, what non Elite Spec legend would go with that gear?

answer me that.

Congratulations, you just discovered the learning curve of the profession. If you spec specifically for Tablet using Cleric’s and nothing but that, well, that’s your own fault.

As Misguided mentioned, both Shield and Staff have healing skills that can be used regardless of Legend. Beyond that you would need to choose a ‘secondary’ role is you take Invocation for the “on swap” traits. Glint and Jalis both make for great team support and compliment (not cover) Ventari well.

I realize that you are rewarded with free energy upon Legend swap by default as a Rev, but as mentioned before you still have to decided if the swap for the insta-refill is worth the loss of using certain utilities for 10 seconds. Again, that’s not a defect, that a learning curve to the class mechanic of being hard locked into your roles. If you’re wanting to juggle multiple simultaneous roles and want more freedom in your utilities I would recommend playing Ele or Engi who were designed for that sort of gameplay.

Knighthonor.4061:

Legends are locked into certain predesigned roles and each legend’s doesn’t seem to sync with other legends and their roles. Legend swap also seem to be the go to design for regenerating energy when fully low as well.

This to me seem to be a flaw in the design of the Revenant’s Legend and Energy system.

Because let’s say, I am a Ventari Support Revenant in full cleric gear and Centaur Legend for support.
I run low on energy. Now what Legend will benefit my role and gear choice now? Centaur has the only heal support of any legend besides Herald.
Should I switch to a condition legend? Or Dwarf legend, or Assassin legend with my cleric gear to get that energy boost?
What benefit would I have in doing so, if I will be locked out of the Centaur Legend when I do swap?

IMO the better solution to this flaw, is by giving each legend an additional set of skills that can be switched in place of the stock skills, that may potentially fit the role of the build I may be building around at the time. This way all stats would still fit the legend I swap to, as well as the role I can continue to play.

The legends do sync.

Taking Ventari for Support is just one form of support. You can take Jalis for damage reduction on the Elite (and now condi damage reduction) OR you can take Mallyx to pull condis off of your teammates.

The most interesting part about the Revenant is the skills and how you can play around with them. That is really not an area where the Rev has issues. If you had gripes with the traits themselves, then I’d be more inclined to agree.

Dirame.8521:

Knighthonor.4061:

Legends are locked into certain predesigned roles and each legend’s doesn’t seem to sync with other legends and their roles. Legend swap also seem to be the go to design for regenerating energy when fully low as well.

This to me seem to be a flaw in the design of the Revenant’s Legend and Energy system.

Because let’s say, I am a Ventari Support Revenant in full cleric gear and Centaur Legend for support.
I run low on energy. Now what Legend will benefit my role and gear choice now? Centaur has the only heal support of any legend besides Herald.
Should I switch to a condition legend? Or Dwarf legend, or Assassin legend with my cleric gear to get that energy boost?
What benefit would I have in doing so, if I will be locked out of the Centaur Legend when I do swap?

IMO the better solution to this flaw, is by giving each legend an additional set of skills that can be switched in place of the stock skills, that may potentially fit the role of the build I may be building around at the time. This way all stats would still fit the legend I swap to, as well as the role I can continue to play.

The legends do sync.

Taking Ventari for Support is just one form of support. You can take Jalis for damage reduction on the Elite (and now condi damage reduction) OR you can take Mallyx to pull condis off of your teammates.

The most interesting part about the Revenant is the skills and how you can play around with them. That is really not an area where the Rev has issues. If you had gripes with the traits themselves, then I’d be more inclined to agree.

They do not sync. The weapons are the only thing that can be made to sync.

When I swap from ventari to Glint I go from 2000hps to 600. The only benefit being maintaining regeneration. A swap to malyx is pointless because ventari has condi removal. A swap to jalis is pointless because ventari can already give protection and any further damage reduction loss is made up for by healing.

The roles are separated. There is no sync like elementalists.

Dirame.8521:

Knighthonor.4061:

Legends are locked into certain predesigned roles and each legend’s doesn’t seem to sync with other legends and their roles. Legend swap also seem to be the go to design for regenerating energy when fully low as well.

This to me seem to be a flaw in the design of the Revenant’s Legend and Energy system.

Because let’s say, I am a Ventari Support Revenant in full cleric gear and Centaur Legend for support.
I run low on energy. Now what Legend will benefit my role and gear choice now? Centaur has the only heal support of any legend besides Herald.
Should I switch to a condition legend? Or Dwarf legend, or Assassin legend with my cleric gear to get that energy boost?
What benefit would I have in doing so, if I will be locked out of the Centaur Legend when I do swap?

IMO the better solution to this flaw, is by giving each legend an additional set of skills that can be switched in place of the stock skills, that may potentially fit the role of the build I may be building around at the time. This way all stats would still fit the legend I swap to, as well as the role I can continue to play.

The legends do sync.

Taking Ventari for Support is just one form of support. You can take Jalis for damage reduction on the Elite (and now condi damage reduction) OR you can take Mallyx to pull condis off of your teammates.

The most interesting part about the Revenant is the skills and how you can play around with them. That is really not an area where the Rev has issues. If you had gripes with the traits themselves, then I’d be more inclined to agree.

I agree. I do not think it is sufficient to call a Revenant a ‘Ventari’ Revenant’ or a ‘Jalis Revenant’ because you will not have the energy to use all of the utility skills on a given legend on a regular basis. Taking Jalis as an example, a player could prioritize Vengeful Hammers as either an offensive or defensive strategy by increasing their healing power stat or taking devastation traits to allow the hammers to cause life siphon on vulnerable foes. Or you could focus on Rite of the Great Dwarf for group support (presumably by taking the upcoming redesigned GM trait Roy mentioned). Or perhaps there are builds that focus on CC which benefit from Forced Engagement. And in each of these example roles, you can find another legend which has a complementary function. For example, group protection using Jalis elite can be supplemented with Ventari for more group protection with Protective Solace. A crowd-control oriented build using Forced Engagement can be supplemented with Shiro for more crowd control with Jade Winds. A tanky build using Vengeful Hammers can supplement with Mallyx’s Pain Absorption for resistance (more tankiness).

The most important contributor to this build diversity is the fact that you do not have enough energy to use all of the utility skills within a legend all the time. So you can pick a build that specialized around one or two utility skills, or use them all equally but sparingly.

I suppose that was a bit off topic, but as others have said, swapping legends is not necessarily a requirement on Revenant like swapping attunements is on Ele (or atleast if it is a requirement, it should be rebalanced so that it is not). Swapping legends is a choice that has consequences both positive (energy) and negative (10 second utility skill lockout). But if the legends are designed well (and whether or not they are is still up for debate), then each legend won’t have a singular, narrow role which is incompatible with other legends.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Dirame.8521:

Knighthonor.4061:

Legends are locked into certain predesigned roles and each legend’s doesn’t seem to sync with other legends and their roles. Legend swap also seem to be the go to design for regenerating energy when fully low as well.

This to me seem to be a flaw in the design of the Revenant’s Legend and Energy system.

Because let’s say, I am a Ventari Support Revenant in full cleric gear and Centaur Legend for support.
I run low on energy. Now what Legend will benefit my role and gear choice now? Centaur has the only heal support of any legend besides Herald.
Should I switch to a condition legend? Or Dwarf legend, or Assassin legend with my cleric gear to get that energy boost?
What benefit would I have in doing so, if I will be locked out of the Centaur Legend when I do swap?

IMO the better solution to this flaw, is by giving each legend an additional set of skills that can be switched in place of the stock skills, that may potentially fit the role of the build I may be building around at the time. This way all stats would still fit the legend I swap to, as well as the role I can continue to play.

The legends do sync.

Taking Ventari for Support is just one form of support. You can take Jalis for damage reduction on the Elite (and now condi damage reduction) OR you can take Mallyx to pull condis off of your teammates.

The most interesting part about the Revenant is the skills and how you can play around with them. That is really not an area where the Rev has issues. If you had gripes with the traits themselves, then I’d be more inclined to agree.

They do not sync. The weapons are the only thing that can be made to sync.

When I swap from ventari to Glint I go from 2000hps to 600. The only benefit being maintaining regeneration. A swap to malyx is pointless because ventari has condi removal. A swap to jalis is pointless because ventari can already give protection and any further damage reduction loss is made up for by healing.

The roles are separated. There is no sync like elementalists.

Wat
Elementalist doesn’t sync like that either.
You swap from Fire and your DPS goes down the drain if you’re using Staff. MH Dagger has no sustained damage in Fire, but little burst in Air, then there’s no Healing on any Element outside of Water. They get locked out of most of their Healing, DPS, Control, Mobility, etc. by swapping while Revenant can swap between two roles that can actually sync up either via weapons, traits, or similar ideas.

Also, Jalis isn’t pointless at all because giving team mates damage reductions outside of Protection is pretty powerful and unique. Arguably, 2k hp/s isn’t necessary if they’re taking like 80% less damage and 5 seconds later you’ll be able to swap back to Ventari anyway.

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Dirame.8521:

Knighthonor.4061:

Legends are locked into certain predesigned roles and each legend’s doesn’t seem to sync with other legends and their roles. Legend swap also seem to be the go to design for regenerating energy when fully low as well.

This to me seem to be a flaw in the design of the Revenant’s Legend and Energy system.

Because let’s say, I am a Ventari Support Revenant in full cleric gear and Centaur Legend for support.
I run low on energy. Now what Legend will benefit my role and gear choice now? Centaur has the only heal support of any legend besides Herald.
Should I switch to a condition legend? Or Dwarf legend, or Assassin legend with my cleric gear to get that energy boost?
What benefit would I have in doing so, if I will be locked out of the Centaur Legend when I do swap?

IMO the better solution to this flaw, is by giving each legend an additional set of skills that can be switched in place of the stock skills, that may potentially fit the role of the build I may be building around at the time. This way all stats would still fit the legend I swap to, as well as the role I can continue to play.

The legends do sync.

Taking Ventari for Support is just one form of support. You can take Jalis for damage reduction on the Elite (and now condi damage reduction) OR you can take Mallyx to pull condis off of your teammates.

The most interesting part about the Revenant is the skills and how you can play around with them. That is really not an area where the Rev has issues. If you had gripes with the traits themselves, then I’d be more inclined to agree.

They do not sync. The weapons are the only thing that can be made to sync.

When I swap from ventari to Glint I go from 2000hps to 600. The only benefit being maintaining regeneration. A swap to malyx is pointless because ventari has condi removal. A swap to jalis is pointless because ventari can already give protection and any further damage reduction loss is made up for by healing.

The roles are separated. There is no sync like elementalists.

Wat
Elementalist doesn’t sync like that either.
You swap from Fire and your DPS goes down the drain if you’re using Staff. MH Dagger has no sustained damage in Fire, but little burst in Air, then there’s no Healing on any Element outside of Water. They get locked out of most of their Healing, DPS, Control, Mobility, etc. by swapping while Revenant can swap between two roles that can actually sync up either via weapons, traits, or similar ideas.

Also, Jalis isn’t pointless at all because giving team mates damage reductions outside of Protection is pretty powerful and unique. Arguably, 2k hp/s isn’t necessary if they’re taking like 80% less damage and 5 seconds later you’ll be able to swap back to Ventari anyway.

They would never have that much damage reduction in jalis and your condi removal goes away.

There is every bit more synergy in elementalist as they have functioning combos between their four roles. Not only that effects of one can meaningfully persist In the others.

Please come up with a build for me that is Shiro and Ventari.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Dirame.8521:

Knighthonor.4061:

Legends are locked into certain predesigned roles and each legend’s doesn’t seem to sync with other legends and their roles. Legend swap also seem to be the go to design for regenerating energy when fully low as well.

This to me seem to be a flaw in the design of the Revenant’s Legend and Energy system.

Because let’s say, I am a Ventari Support Revenant in full cleric gear and Centaur Legend for support.
I run low on energy. Now what Legend will benefit my role and gear choice now? Centaur has the only heal support of any legend besides Herald.
Should I switch to a condition legend? Or Dwarf legend, or Assassin legend with my cleric gear to get that energy boost?
What benefit would I have in doing so, if I will be locked out of the Centaur Legend when I do swap?

IMO the better solution to this flaw, is by giving each legend an additional set of skills that can be switched in place of the stock skills, that may potentially fit the role of the build I may be building around at the time. This way all stats would still fit the legend I swap to, as well as the role I can continue to play.

The legends do sync.

Taking Ventari for Support is just one form of support. You can take Jalis for damage reduction on the Elite (and now condi damage reduction) OR you can take Mallyx to pull condis off of your teammates.

The most interesting part about the Revenant is the skills and how you can play around with them. That is really not an area where the Rev has issues. If you had gripes with the traits themselves, then I’d be more inclined to agree.

They do not sync. The weapons are the only thing that can be made to sync.

When I swap from ventari to Glint I go from 2000hps to 600. The only benefit being maintaining regeneration. A swap to malyx is pointless because ventari has condi removal. A swap to jalis is pointless because ventari can already give protection and any further damage reduction loss is made up for by healing.

The roles are separated. There is no sync like elementalists.

Wat
Elementalist doesn’t sync like that either.
You swap from Fire and your DPS goes down the drain if you’re using Staff. MH Dagger has no sustained damage in Fire, but little burst in Air, then there’s no Healing on any Element outside of Water. They get locked out of most of their Healing, DPS, Control, Mobility, etc. by swapping while Revenant can swap between two roles that can actually sync up either via weapons, traits, or similar ideas.

Also, Jalis isn’t pointless at all because giving team mates damage reductions outside of Protection is pretty powerful and unique. Arguably, 2k hp/s isn’t necessary if they’re taking like 80% less damage and 5 seconds later you’ll be able to swap back to Ventari anyway.

They would never have that much damage reduction in jalis and your condi removal goes away.

There is every bit more synergy in elementalist as they have functioning combos between their four roles. Not only that effects of one can meaningfully persist In the others.

Please come up with a build for me that is Shiro and Ventari.

RotGD + protection is pretty high and your Condi Removal? Really? It’s designed as our biggest weakness afterall, but if it REALLY bothers you to lose group condi cleansing for 10 seconds, then Mallxy can still deal with them for your team somewhat.

The Elementalist has combos, but that’s kinda the point of their mechanic. They tend to have weak spells with high cooldowns to “balance” their 4 attunements. Even then, the combos you’re talking about are completely possible on Revenant too.
Axe 5 into Glint’s Breath move where they’re being pulled into Staff 5
Be creative.

Oh, and you want a Shiro/Ventari build? Try going for a Control/Support role.
Ventari can do his thing while Shiro provides insane mobility between fights(especially in PvP), strong Control in Jade Winds and allows Quickness Stomps/Rezzes(or even auto-attacking with Staff for orbs).
For PvE you’ll probably want Glint over Shiro, but since you’re hellbent on complaining, Shiro still allows for DPS while Ventari can provide crazy up-time on projectile destruction.

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Dirame.8521:

Knighthonor.4061:

Legends are locked into certain predesigned roles and each legend’s doesn’t seem to sync with other legends and their roles. Legend swap also seem to be the go to design for regenerating energy when fully low as well.

This to me seem to be a flaw in the design of the Revenant’s Legend and Energy system.

Because let’s say, I am a Ventari Support Revenant in full cleric gear and Centaur Legend for support.
I run low on energy. Now what Legend will benefit my role and gear choice now? Centaur has the only heal support of any legend besides Herald.
Should I switch to a condition legend? Or Dwarf legend, or Assassin legend with my cleric gear to get that energy boost?
What benefit would I have in doing so, if I will be locked out of the Centaur Legend when I do swap?

IMO the better solution to this flaw, is by giving each legend an additional set of skills that can be switched in place of the stock skills, that may potentially fit the role of the build I may be building around at the time. This way all stats would still fit the legend I swap to, as well as the role I can continue to play.

The legends do sync.

Taking Ventari for Support is just one form of support. You can take Jalis for damage reduction on the Elite (and now condi damage reduction) OR you can take Mallyx to pull condis off of your teammates.

The most interesting part about the Revenant is the skills and how you can play around with them. That is really not an area where the Rev has issues. If you had gripes with the traits themselves, then I’d be more inclined to agree.

They do not sync. The weapons are the only thing that can be made to sync.

When I swap from ventari to Glint I go from 2000hps to 600. The only benefit being maintaining regeneration. A swap to malyx is pointless because ventari has condi removal. A swap to jalis is pointless because ventari can already give protection and any further damage reduction loss is made up for by healing.

The roles are separated. There is no sync like elementalists.

Wat
Elementalist doesn’t sync like that either.
You swap from Fire and your DPS goes down the drain if you’re using Staff. MH Dagger has no sustained damage in Fire, but little burst in Air, then there’s no Healing on any Element outside of Water. They get locked out of most of their Healing, DPS, Control, Mobility, etc. by swapping while Revenant can swap between two roles that can actually sync up either via weapons, traits, or similar ideas.

Also, Jalis isn’t pointless at all because giving team mates damage reductions outside of Protection is pretty powerful and unique. Arguably, 2k hp/s isn’t necessary if they’re taking like 80% less damage and 5 seconds later you’ll be able to swap back to Ventari anyway.

They would never have that much damage reduction in jalis and your condi removal goes away.

There is every bit more synergy in elementalist as they have functioning combos between their four roles. Not only that effects of one can meaningfully persist In the others.

Please come up with a build for me that is Shiro and Ventari.

RotGD + protection is pretty high and your Condi Removal? Really? It’s designed as our biggest weakness afterall, but if it REALLY bothers you to lose group condi cleansing for 10 seconds, then Mallxy can still deal with them for your team somewhat.

The Elementalist has combos, but that’s kinda the point of their mechanic. They tend to have weak spells with high cooldowns to “balance” their 4 attunements. Even then, the combos you’re talking about are completely possible on Revenant too.
Axe 5 into Glint’s Breath move where they’re being pulled into Staff 5
Be creative.

Oh, and you want a Shiro/Ventari build? Try going for a Control/Support role.
Ventari can do his thing while Shiro provides insane mobility between fights(especially in PvP), strong Control in Jade Winds and allows Quickness Stomps/Rezzes(or even auto-attacking with Staff for orbs).
For PvE you’ll probably want Glint over Shiro, but since you’re hellbent on complaining, Shiro still allows for DPS while Ventari can provide crazy up-time on projectile destruction.

I meant cross stance combos not cross weapon. And when you are ventari leaving to either of the two specs stills makes you deal with either damage reduction or condis poorly.

The point of this mechanic is not to swap. Unless you need to switch roles. Or are too low on energy. What ends up happening is staying in one spec and being any class that had five utility and two weapons. The difference is that you lack any of the great self syngery or the classes you emote.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Unless you need to switch roles.

I believe that’s the whole point of the class. When you swap you have to assume a new stance, not replace “1” for “one”. The way you say seems like you want to play as Ventari, not Revenant.

FLiP.7680:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Unless you need to switch roles.

I believe that’s the whole point of the class. When you swap you have to assume a new stance, not replace “1” for “one”. The way you say seems like you want to play as Ventari, not Revenant.

It’s just weird. The only one that seems to sync is Glint.

Malyx jalis Shiro ventari.

When you spec with them you don’t want to swap out of them.
They all follow very specific stats.

But yes you can harmonize.
Malyx ventari would only ever be apothecary or settlers. But there is no condition precision healing power set.
So you rely on maniacal persistence to make them mesh. And now you have to use invocation. Which means tada you made a build. Because nothing else fits.

Applying this 10 builds exist.

10 builds that can do two roles. That is powerful in itself.

Metaphorical I just wish I didn’t have to swap gear to swap legends.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Dirame.8521:

Knighthonor.4061:

Legends are locked into certain predesigned roles and each legend’s doesn’t seem to sync with other legends and their roles. Legend swap also seem to be the go to design for regenerating energy when fully low as well.

This to me seem to be a flaw in the design of the Revenant’s Legend and Energy system.

Because let’s say, I am a Ventari Support Revenant in full cleric gear and Centaur Legend for support.
I run low on energy. Now what Legend will benefit my role and gear choice now? Centaur has the only heal support of any legend besides Herald.
Should I switch to a condition legend? Or Dwarf legend, or Assassin legend with my cleric gear to get that energy boost?
What benefit would I have in doing so, if I will be locked out of the Centaur Legend when I do swap?

IMO the better solution to this flaw, is by giving each legend an additional set of skills that can be switched in place of the stock skills, that may potentially fit the role of the build I may be building around at the time. This way all stats would still fit the legend I swap to, as well as the role I can continue to play.

The legends do sync.

Taking Ventari for Support is just one form of support. You can take Jalis for damage reduction on the Elite (and now condi damage reduction) OR you can take Mallyx to pull condis off of your teammates.

The most interesting part about the Revenant is the skills and how you can play around with them. That is really not an area where the Rev has issues. If you had gripes with the traits themselves, then I’d be more inclined to agree.

They do not sync. The weapons are the only thing that can be made to sync.

When I swap from ventari to Glint I go from 2000hps to 600. The only benefit being maintaining regeneration. A swap to malyx is pointless because ventari has condi removal. A swap to jalis is pointless because ventari can already give protection and any further damage reduction loss is made up for by healing.

The roles are separated. There is no sync like elementalists.

Wat
Elementalist doesn’t sync like that either.
You swap from Fire and your DPS goes down the drain if you’re using Staff. MH Dagger has no sustained damage in Fire, but little burst in Air, then there’s no Healing on any Element outside of Water. They get locked out of most of their Healing, DPS, Control, Mobility, etc. by swapping while Revenant can swap between two roles that can actually sync up either via weapons, traits, or similar ideas.

Also, Jalis isn’t pointless at all because giving team mates damage reductions outside of Protection is pretty powerful and unique. Arguably, 2k hp/s isn’t necessary if they’re taking like 80% less damage and 5 seconds later you’ll be able to swap back to Ventari anyway.

They would never have that much damage reduction in jalis and your condi removal goes away.

There is every bit more synergy in elementalist as they have functioning combos between their four roles. Not only that effects of one can meaningfully persist In the others.

Please come up with a build for me that is Shiro and Ventari.

RotGD + protection is pretty high and your Condi Removal? Really? It’s designed as our biggest weakness afterall, but if it REALLY bothers you to lose group condi cleansing for 10 seconds, then Mallxy can still deal with them for your team somewhat.

The Elementalist has combos, but that’s kinda the point of their mechanic. They tend to have weak spells with high cooldowns to “balance” their 4 attunements. Even then, the combos you’re talking about are completely possible on Revenant too.
Axe 5 into Glint’s Breath move where they’re being pulled into Staff 5
Be creative.

Oh, and you want a Shiro/Ventari build? Try going for a Control/Support role.
Ventari can do his thing while Shiro provides insane mobility between fights(especially in PvP), strong Control in Jade Winds and allows Quickness Stomps/Rezzes(or even auto-attacking with Staff for orbs).
For PvE you’ll probably want Glint over Shiro, but since you’re hellbent on complaining, Shiro still allows for DPS while Ventari can provide crazy up-time on projectile destruction.

I meant cross stance combos not cross weapon. And when you are ventari leaving to either of the two specs stills makes you deal with either damage reduction or condis poorly.

The point of this mechanic is not to swap. Unless you need to switch roles. Or are too low on energy. What ends up happening is staying in one spec and being any class that had five utility and two weapons. The difference is that you lack any of the great self syngery or the classes you emote.

If we look at the utilities in a vacuum, then sure, I’d agree with you, but this class is obviously designed for you to have to manage your energy and what you need in the current situation and the utilities are for just that, utility. They don’t need to be combo’d between stances(even though there’s nothing stopping you from pulling chain-CCs or Phase traversal into EtD or whatever).

There’s not much wrong in camping Ventari if you want, but you can also swap to Jalis/Mallyx/Whatever for whatever they bring and some energy at the cost of being locked out of Ventari for a bit.
That being said, the only Legend that absolutely demands certain stats to be useful is Mallyx right now.
Jalis, Shiro, Ventari, and Glint all work fine with any stat combo.

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Dirame.8521:

Knighthonor.4061:

Legends are locked into certain predesigned roles and each legend’s doesn’t seem to sync with other legends and their roles. Legend swap also seem to be the go to design for regenerating energy when fully low as well.

This to me seem to be a flaw in the design of the Revenant’s Legend and Energy system.

Because let’s say, I am a Ventari Support Revenant in full cleric gear and Centaur Legend for support.
I run low on energy. Now what Legend will benefit my role and gear choice now? Centaur has the only heal support of any legend besides Herald.
Should I switch to a condition legend? Or Dwarf legend, or Assassin legend with my cleric gear to get that energy boost?
What benefit would I have in doing so, if I will be locked out of the Centaur Legend when I do swap?

IMO the better solution to this flaw, is by giving each legend an additional set of skills that can be switched in place of the stock skills, that may potentially fit the role of the build I may be building around at the time. This way all stats would still fit the legend I swap to, as well as the role I can continue to play.

The legends do sync.

Taking Ventari for Support is just one form of support. You can take Jalis for damage reduction on the Elite (and now condi damage reduction) OR you can take Mallyx to pull condis off of your teammates.

The most interesting part about the Revenant is the skills and how you can play around with them. That is really not an area where the Rev has issues. If you had gripes with the traits themselves, then I’d be more inclined to agree.

They do not sync. The weapons are the only thing that can be made to sync.

When I swap from ventari to Glint I go from 2000hps to 600. The only benefit being maintaining regeneration. A swap to malyx is pointless because ventari has condi removal. A swap to jalis is pointless because ventari can already give protection and any further damage reduction loss is made up for by healing.

The roles are separated. There is no sync like elementalists.

Wat
Elementalist doesn’t sync like that either.
You swap from Fire and your DPS goes down the drain if you’re using Staff. MH Dagger has no sustained damage in Fire, but little burst in Air, then there’s no Healing on any Element outside of Water. They get locked out of most of their Healing, DPS, Control, Mobility, etc. by swapping while Revenant can swap between two roles that can actually sync up either via weapons, traits, or similar ideas.

Also, Jalis isn’t pointless at all because giving team mates damage reductions outside of Protection is pretty powerful and unique. Arguably, 2k hp/s isn’t necessary if they’re taking like 80% less damage and 5 seconds later you’ll be able to swap back to Ventari anyway.

They would never have that much damage reduction in jalis and your condi removal goes away.

There is every bit more synergy in elementalist as they have functioning combos between their four roles. Not only that effects of one can meaningfully persist In the others.

Please come up with a build for me that is Shiro and Ventari.

RotGD + protection is pretty high and your Condi Removal? Really? It’s designed as our biggest weakness afterall, but if it REALLY bothers you to lose group condi cleansing for 10 seconds, then Mallxy can still deal with them for your team somewhat.

The Elementalist has combos, but that’s kinda the point of their mechanic. They tend to have weak spells with high cooldowns to “balance” their 4 attunements. Even then, the combos you’re talking about are completely possible on Revenant too.
Axe 5 into Glint’s Breath move where they’re being pulled into Staff 5
Be creative.

Oh, and you want a Shiro/Ventari build? Try going for a Control/Support role.
Ventari can do his thing while Shiro provides insane mobility between fights(especially in PvP), strong Control in Jade Winds and allows Quickness Stomps/Rezzes(or even auto-attacking with Staff for orbs).
For PvE you’ll probably want Glint over Shiro, but since you’re hellbent on complaining, Shiro still allows for DPS while Ventari can provide crazy up-time on projectile destruction.

I meant cross stance combos not cross weapon. And when you are ventari leaving to either of the two specs stills makes you deal with either damage reduction or condis poorly.

The point of this mechanic is not to swap. Unless you need to switch roles. Or are too low on energy. What ends up happening is staying in one spec and being any class that had five utility and two weapons. The difference is that you lack any of the great self syngery or the classes you emote.

If we look at the utilities in a vacuum, then sure, I’d agree with you, but this class is obviously designed for you to have to manage your energy and what you need in the current situation and the utilities are for just that, utility. They don’t need to be combo’d between stances(even though there’s nothing stopping you from pulling chain-CCs or Phase traversal into EtD or whatever).

There’s not much wrong in camping Ventari if you want, but you can also swap to Jalis/Mallyx/Whatever for whatever they bring and some energy at the cost of being locked out of Ventari for a bit.
That being said, the only Legend that absolutely demands certain stats to be useful is Mallyx right now.
Jalis, Shiro, Ventari, and Glint all work fine with any stat combo.

Ventari wants healing power. Shiro wants power. Glint is synergy and wants nothing. Jalis is defensive so stats don’t even matter but it seems to want boon duration.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Dirame.8521:

Knighthonor.4061:

Legends are locked into certain predesigned roles and each legend’s doesn’t seem to sync with other legends and their roles. Legend swap also seem to be the go to design for regenerating energy when fully low as well.

This to me seem to be a flaw in the design of the Revenant’s Legend and Energy system.

Because let’s say, I am a Ventari Support Revenant in full cleric gear and Centaur Legend for support.
I run low on energy. Now what Legend will benefit my role and gear choice now? Centaur has the only heal support of any legend besides Herald.
Should I switch to a condition legend? Or Dwarf legend, or Assassin legend with my cleric gear to get that energy boost?
What benefit would I have in doing so, if I will be locked out of the Centaur Legend when I do swap?

IMO the better solution to this flaw, is by giving each legend an additional set of skills that can be switched in place of the stock skills, that may potentially fit the role of the build I may be building around at the time. This way all stats would still fit the legend I swap to, as well as the role I can continue to play.

The legends do sync.

Taking Ventari for Support is just one form of support. You can take Jalis for damage reduction on the Elite (and now condi damage reduction) OR you can take Mallyx to pull condis off of your teammates.

The most interesting part about the Revenant is the skills and how you can play around with them. That is really not an area where the Rev has issues. If you had gripes with the traits themselves, then I’d be more inclined to agree.

They do not sync. The weapons are the only thing that can be made to sync.

When I swap from ventari to Glint I go from 2000hps to 600. The only benefit being maintaining regeneration. A swap to malyx is pointless because ventari has condi removal. A swap to jalis is pointless because ventari can already give protection and any further damage reduction loss is made up for by healing.

The roles are separated. There is no sync like elementalists.

Wat
Elementalist doesn’t sync like that either.
You swap from Fire and your DPS goes down the drain if you’re using Staff. MH Dagger has no sustained damage in Fire, but little burst in Air, then there’s no Healing on any Element outside of Water. They get locked out of most of their Healing, DPS, Control, Mobility, etc. by swapping while Revenant can swap between two roles that can actually sync up either via weapons, traits, or similar ideas.

Also, Jalis isn’t pointless at all because giving team mates damage reductions outside of Protection is pretty powerful and unique. Arguably, 2k hp/s isn’t necessary if they’re taking like 80% less damage and 5 seconds later you’ll be able to swap back to Ventari anyway.

They would never have that much damage reduction in jalis and your condi removal goes away.

There is every bit more synergy in elementalist as they have functioning combos between their four roles. Not only that effects of one can meaningfully persist In the others.

Please come up with a build for me that is Shiro and Ventari.

RotGD + protection is pretty high and your Condi Removal? Really? It’s designed as our biggest weakness afterall, but if it REALLY bothers you to lose group condi cleansing for 10 seconds, then Mallxy can still deal with them for your team somewhat.

The Elementalist has combos, but that’s kinda the point of their mechanic. They tend to have weak spells with high cooldowns to “balance” their 4 attunements. Even then, the combos you’re talking about are completely possible on Revenant too.
Axe 5 into Glint’s Breath move where they’re being pulled into Staff 5
Be creative.

Oh, and you want a Shiro/Ventari build? Try going for a Control/Support role.
Ventari can do his thing while Shiro provides insane mobility between fights(especially in PvP), strong Control in Jade Winds and allows Quickness Stomps/Rezzes(or even auto-attacking with Staff for orbs).
For PvE you’ll probably want Glint over Shiro, but since you’re hellbent on complaining, Shiro still allows for DPS while Ventari can provide crazy up-time on projectile destruction.

I meant cross stance combos not cross weapon. And when you are ventari leaving to either of the two specs stills makes you deal with either damage reduction or condis poorly.

The point of this mechanic is not to swap. Unless you need to switch roles. Or are too low on energy. What ends up happening is staying in one spec and being any class that had five utility and two weapons. The difference is that you lack any of the great self syngery or the classes you emote.

If we look at the utilities in a vacuum, then sure, I’d agree with you, but this class is obviously designed for you to have to manage your energy and what you need in the current situation and the utilities are for just that, utility. They don’t need to be combo’d between stances(even though there’s nothing stopping you from pulling chain-CCs or Phase traversal into EtD or whatever).

There’s not much wrong in camping Ventari if you want, but you can also swap to Jalis/Mallyx/Whatever for whatever they bring and some energy at the cost of being locked out of Ventari for a bit.
That being said, the only Legend that absolutely demands certain stats to be useful is Mallyx right now.
Jalis, Shiro, Ventari, and Glint all work fine with any stat combo.

Ventari wants healing power. Shiro wants power. Glint is synergy and wants nothing. Jalis is defensive so stats don’t even matter but it seems to want boon duration.

Yet it works without Healing Power just fine(especially the projectile destruction and cleanses) and Shiro works with literally anything.

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Dirame.8521:

Knighthonor.4061:

Legends are locked into certain predesigned roles and each legend’s doesn’t seem to sync with other legends and their roles. Legend swap also seem to be the go to design for regenerating energy when fully low as well.

This to me seem to be a flaw in the design of the Revenant’s Legend and Energy system.

Because let’s say, I am a Ventari Support Revenant in full cleric gear and Centaur Legend for support.
I run low on energy. Now what Legend will benefit my role and gear choice now? Centaur has the only heal support of any legend besides Herald.
Should I switch to a condition legend? Or Dwarf legend, or Assassin legend with my cleric gear to get that energy boost?
What benefit would I have in doing so, if I will be locked out of the Centaur Legend when I do swap?

IMO the better solution to this flaw, is by giving each legend an additional set of skills that can be switched in place of the stock skills, that may potentially fit the role of the build I may be building around at the time. This way all stats would still fit the legend I swap to, as well as the role I can continue to play.

The legends do sync.

Taking Ventari for Support is just one form of support. You can take Jalis for damage reduction on the Elite (and now condi damage reduction) OR you can take Mallyx to pull condis off of your teammates.

The most interesting part about the Revenant is the skills and how you can play around with them. That is really not an area where the Rev has issues. If you had gripes with the traits themselves, then I’d be more inclined to agree.

They do not sync. The weapons are the only thing that can be made to sync.

When I swap from ventari to Glint I go from 2000hps to 600. The only benefit being maintaining regeneration. A swap to malyx is pointless because ventari has condi removal. A swap to jalis is pointless because ventari can already give protection and any further damage reduction loss is made up for by healing.

The roles are separated. There is no sync like elementalists.

Wat
Elementalist doesn’t sync like that either.
You swap from Fire and your DPS goes down the drain if you’re using Staff. MH Dagger has no sustained damage in Fire, but little burst in Air, then there’s no Healing on any Element outside of Water. They get locked out of most of their Healing, DPS, Control, Mobility, etc. by swapping while Revenant can swap between two roles that can actually sync up either via weapons, traits, or similar ideas.

Also, Jalis isn’t pointless at all because giving team mates damage reductions outside of Protection is pretty powerful and unique. Arguably, 2k hp/s isn’t necessary if they’re taking like 80% less damage and 5 seconds later you’ll be able to swap back to Ventari anyway.

They would never have that much damage reduction in jalis and your condi removal goes away.

There is every bit more synergy in elementalist as they have functioning combos between their four roles. Not only that effects of one can meaningfully persist In the others.

Please come up with a build for me that is Shiro and Ventari.

RotGD + protection is pretty high and your Condi Removal? Really? It’s designed as our biggest weakness afterall, but if it REALLY bothers you to lose group condi cleansing for 10 seconds, then Mallxy can still deal with them for your team somewhat.

The Elementalist has combos, but that’s kinda the point of their mechanic. They tend to have weak spells with high cooldowns to “balance” their 4 attunements. Even then, the combos you’re talking about are completely possible on Revenant too.
Axe 5 into Glint’s Breath move where they’re being pulled into Staff 5
Be creative.

Oh, and you want a Shiro/Ventari build? Try going for a Control/Support role.
Ventari can do his thing while Shiro provides insane mobility between fights(especially in PvP), strong Control in Jade Winds and allows Quickness Stomps/Rezzes(or even auto-attacking with Staff for orbs).
For PvE you’ll probably want Glint over Shiro, but since you’re hellbent on complaining, Shiro still allows for DPS while Ventari can provide crazy up-time on projectile destruction.

I meant cross stance combos not cross weapon. And when you are ventari leaving to either of the two specs stills makes you deal with either damage reduction or condis poorly.

The point of this mechanic is not to swap. Unless you need to switch roles. Or are too low on energy. What ends up happening is staying in one spec and being any class that had five utility and two weapons. The difference is that you lack any of the great self syngery or the classes you emote.

If we look at the utilities in a vacuum, then sure, I’d agree with you, but this class is obviously designed for you to have to manage your energy and what you need in the current situation and the utilities are for just that, utility. They don’t need to be combo’d between stances(even though there’s nothing stopping you from pulling chain-CCs or Phase traversal into EtD or whatever).

There’s not much wrong in camping Ventari if you want, but you can also swap to Jalis/Mallyx/Whatever for whatever they bring and some energy at the cost of being locked out of Ventari for a bit.
That being said, the only Legend that absolutely demands certain stats to be useful is Mallyx right now.
Jalis, Shiro, Ventari, and Glint all work fine with any stat combo.

Ventari wants healing power. Shiro wants power. Glint is synergy and wants nothing. Jalis is defensive so stats don’t even matter but it seems to want boon duration.

Yet it works without Healing Power just fine(especially the projectile destruction and cleanses) and Shiro works with literally anything.

I wouldn’t neuter the potential of a spec for just fine. And Shiro has life siphon which is damage affected by power. As well as one elite and utility that also do power damage. Specs either assert their will or fold to the will of the other spec.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Dirame.8521:

Knighthonor.4061:

Legends are locked into certain predesigned roles and each legend’s doesn’t seem to sync with other legends and their roles. Legend swap also seem to be the go to design for regenerating energy when fully low as well.

This to me seem to be a flaw in the design of the Revenant’s Legend and Energy system.

Because let’s say, I am a Ventari Support Revenant in full cleric gear and Centaur Legend for support.
I run low on energy. Now what Legend will benefit my role and gear choice now? Centaur has the only heal support of any legend besides Herald.
Should I switch to a condition legend? Or Dwarf legend, or Assassin legend with my cleric gear to get that energy boost?
What benefit would I have in doing so, if I will be locked out of the Centaur Legend when I do swap?

IMO the better solution to this flaw, is by giving each legend an additional set of skills that can be switched in place of the stock skills, that may potentially fit the role of the build I may be building around at the time. This way all stats would still fit the legend I swap to, as well as the role I can continue to play.

The legends do sync.

Taking Ventari for Support is just one form of support. You can take Jalis for damage reduction on the Elite (and now condi damage reduction) OR you can take Mallyx to pull condis off of your teammates.

The most interesting part about the Revenant is the skills and how you can play around with them. That is really not an area where the Rev has issues. If you had gripes with the traits themselves, then I’d be more inclined to agree.

They do not sync. The weapons are the only thing that can be made to sync.

When I swap from ventari to Glint I go from 2000hps to 600. The only benefit being maintaining regeneration. A swap to malyx is pointless because ventari has condi removal. A swap to jalis is pointless because ventari can already give protection and any further damage reduction loss is made up for by healing.

The roles are separated. There is no sync like elementalists.

Wat
Elementalist doesn’t sync like that either.
You swap from Fire and your DPS goes down the drain if you’re using Staff. MH Dagger has no sustained damage in Fire, but little burst in Air, then there’s no Healing on any Element outside of Water. They get locked out of most of their Healing, DPS, Control, Mobility, etc. by swapping while Revenant can swap between two roles that can actually sync up either via weapons, traits, or similar ideas.

Also, Jalis isn’t pointless at all because giving team mates damage reductions outside of Protection is pretty powerful and unique. Arguably, 2k hp/s isn’t necessary if they’re taking like 80% less damage and 5 seconds later you’ll be able to swap back to Ventari anyway.

They would never have that much damage reduction in jalis and your condi removal goes away.

There is every bit more synergy in elementalist as they have functioning combos between their four roles. Not only that effects of one can meaningfully persist In the others.

Please come up with a build for me that is Shiro and Ventari.

RotGD + protection is pretty high and your Condi Removal? Really? It’s designed as our biggest weakness afterall, but if it REALLY bothers you to lose group condi cleansing for 10 seconds, then Mallxy can still deal with them for your team somewhat.

The Elementalist has combos, but that’s kinda the point of their mechanic. They tend to have weak spells with high cooldowns to “balance” their 4 attunements. Even then, the combos you’re talking about are completely possible on Revenant too.
Axe 5 into Glint’s Breath move where they’re being pulled into Staff 5
Be creative.

Oh, and you want a Shiro/Ventari build? Try going for a Control/Support role.
Ventari can do his thing while Shiro provides insane mobility between fights(especially in PvP), strong Control in Jade Winds and allows Quickness Stomps/Rezzes(or even auto-attacking with Staff for orbs).
For PvE you’ll probably want Glint over Shiro, but since you’re hellbent on complaining, Shiro still allows for DPS while Ventari can provide crazy up-time on projectile destruction.

I meant cross stance combos not cross weapon. And when you are ventari leaving to either of the two specs stills makes you deal with either damage reduction or condis poorly.

The point of this mechanic is not to swap. Unless you need to switch roles. Or are too low on energy. What ends up happening is staying in one spec and being any class that had five utility and two weapons. The difference is that you lack any of the great self syngery or the classes you emote.

If we look at the utilities in a vacuum, then sure, I’d agree with you, but this class is obviously designed for you to have to manage your energy and what you need in the current situation and the utilities are for just that, utility. They don’t need to be combo’d between stances(even though there’s nothing stopping you from pulling chain-CCs or Phase traversal into EtD or whatever).

There’s not much wrong in camping Ventari if you want, but you can also swap to Jalis/Mallyx/Whatever for whatever they bring and some energy at the cost of being locked out of Ventari for a bit.
That being said, the only Legend that absolutely demands certain stats to be useful is Mallyx right now.
Jalis, Shiro, Ventari, and Glint all work fine with any stat combo.

Ventari wants healing power. Shiro wants power. Glint is synergy and wants nothing. Jalis is defensive so stats don’t even matter but it seems to want boon duration.

Yet it works without Healing Power just fine(especially the projectile destruction and cleanses) and Shiro works with literally anything.

I wouldn’t neuter the potential of a spec for just fine. And Shiro has life siphon which is damage affected by power. As well as one elite and utility that also do power damage. Specs either assert their will or fold to the will of the other spec.

wat
The spec still performs well without a ton of Healing Power. It even has several useful skills you can pull off still, like projectile destruction and cleansing. How is this neutering anything? You get some group heals and utility without sacrificing any damage or anything else you want. Sure, it’s not AS powerful as a Cleric’s Rev, but that wasn’t the intended goal was it?

Then, Shiro doesn’t need any power boost for his siphons to be useful as it’s a supplementary heal anyway(and the #6 still heals fine since it scales kinda poorly), you can take the GM that eats another stack of Stability to push that Control aspect harder and the Elite’s main use is Control rather than damage.

You’re really pushing this non-existant issue a lot.
All of them have a role they cover, but they can still sync up and do their jobs fine.
Even Ventari in a DPS build can work out(mostly in PvE) due to his huge up-time in projectile destruction. Really, the only one you can complain about is Mallyx since he’s all about Conditions and doesn’t help Power/Support builds very much.

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Dirame.8521:

Knighthonor.4061:

Legends are locked into certain predesigned roles and each legend’s doesn’t seem to sync with other legends and their roles. Legend swap also seem to be the go to design for regenerating energy when fully low as well.

This to me seem to be a flaw in the design of the Revenant’s Legend and Energy system.

Because let’s say, I am a Ventari Support Revenant in full cleric gear and Centaur Legend for support.
I run low on energy. Now what Legend will benefit my role and gear choice now? Centaur has the only heal support of any legend besides Herald.
Should I switch to a condition legend? Or Dwarf legend, or Assassin legend with my cleric gear to get that energy boost?
What benefit would I have in doing so, if I will be locked out of the Centaur Legend when I do swap?

IMO the better solution to this flaw, is by giving each legend an additional set of skills that can be switched in place of the stock skills, that may potentially fit the role of the build I may be building around at the time. This way all stats would still fit the legend I swap to, as well as the role I can continue to play.

The legends do sync.

Taking Ventari for Support is just one form of support. You can take Jalis for damage reduction on the Elite (and now condi damage reduction) OR you can take Mallyx to pull condis off of your teammates.

The most interesting part about the Revenant is the skills and how you can play around with them. That is really not an area where the Rev has issues. If you had gripes with the traits themselves, then I’d be more inclined to agree.

They do not sync. The weapons are the only thing that can be made to sync.

When I swap from ventari to Glint I go from 2000hps to 600. The only benefit being maintaining regeneration. A swap to malyx is pointless because ventari has condi removal. A swap to jalis is pointless because ventari can already give protection and any further damage reduction loss is made up for by healing.

The roles are separated. There is no sync like elementalists.

Wat
Elementalist doesn’t sync like that either.
You swap from Fire and your DPS goes down the drain if you’re using Staff. MH Dagger has no sustained damage in Fire, but little burst in Air, then there’s no Healing on any Element outside of Water. They get locked out of most of their Healing, DPS, Control, Mobility, etc. by swapping while Revenant can swap between two roles that can actually sync up either via weapons, traits, or similar ideas.

Also, Jalis isn’t pointless at all because giving team mates damage reductions outside of Protection is pretty powerful and unique. Arguably, 2k hp/s isn’t necessary if they’re taking like 80% less damage and 5 seconds later you’ll be able to swap back to Ventari anyway.

They would never have that much damage reduction in jalis and your condi removal goes away.

There is every bit more synergy in elementalist as they have functioning combos between their four roles. Not only that effects of one can meaningfully persist In the others.

Please come up with a build for me that is Shiro and Ventari.

RotGD + protection is pretty high and your Condi Removal? Really? It’s designed as our biggest weakness afterall, but if it REALLY bothers you to lose group condi cleansing for 10 seconds, then Mallxy can still deal with them for your team somewhat.

The Elementalist has combos, but that’s kinda the point of their mechanic. They tend to have weak spells with high cooldowns to “balance” their 4 attunements. Even then, the combos you’re talking about are completely possible on Revenant too.
Axe 5 into Glint’s Breath move where they’re being pulled into Staff 5
Be creative.

Oh, and you want a Shiro/Ventari build? Try going for a Control/Support role.
Ventari can do his thing while Shiro provides insane mobility between fights(especially in PvP), strong Control in Jade Winds and allows Quickness Stomps/Rezzes(or even auto-attacking with Staff for orbs).
For PvE you’ll probably want Glint over Shiro, but since you’re hellbent on complaining, Shiro still allows for DPS while Ventari can provide crazy up-time on projectile destruction.

I meant cross stance combos not cross weapon. And when you are ventari leaving to either of the two specs stills makes you deal with either damage reduction or condis poorly.

The point of this mechanic is not to swap. Unless you need to switch roles. Or are too low on energy. What ends up happening is staying in one spec and being any class that had five utility and two weapons. The difference is that you lack any of the great self syngery or the classes you emote.

If we look at the utilities in a vacuum, then sure, I’d agree with you, but this class is obviously designed for you to have to manage your energy and what you need in the current situation and the utilities are for just that, utility. They don’t need to be combo’d between stances(even though there’s nothing stopping you from pulling chain-CCs or Phase traversal into EtD or whatever).

There’s not much wrong in camping Ventari if you want, but you can also swap to Jalis/Mallyx/Whatever for whatever they bring and some energy at the cost of being locked out of Ventari for a bit.
That being said, the only Legend that absolutely demands certain stats to be useful is Mallyx right now.
Jalis, Shiro, Ventari, and Glint all work fine with any stat combo.

Ventari wants healing power. Shiro wants power. Glint is synergy and wants nothing. Jalis is defensive so stats don’t even matter but it seems to want boon duration.

Yet it works without Healing Power just fine(especially the projectile destruction and cleanses) and Shiro works with literally anything.

I wouldn’t neuter the potential of a spec for just fine. And Shiro has life siphon which is damage affected by power. As well as one elite and utility that also do power damage. Specs either assert their will or fold to the will of the other spec.

wat
The spec still performs well without a ton of Healing Power. It even has several useful skills you can pull off still, like projectile destruction and cleansing. How is this neutering anything? You get some group heals and utility without sacrificing any damage or anything else you want. Sure, it’s not AS powerful as a Cleric’s Rev, but that wasn’t the intended goal was it?

Then, Shiro doesn’t need any power boost for his siphons to be useful as it’s a supplementary heal anyway(and the #6 still heals fine since it scales kinda poorly), you can take the GM that eats another stack of Stability to push that Control aspect harder and the Elite’s main use is Control rather than damage.

You’re really pushing this non-existant issue a lot.
All of them have a role they cover, but they can still sync up and do their jobs fine.
Even Ventari in a DPS build can work out(mostly in PvE) due to his huge up-time in projectile destruction. Really, the only one you can complain about is Mallyx since he’s all about Conditions and doesn’t help Power/Support builds very much.

You trying real hard to justify this flaw. The argument you are using can apply to any class. What you pretty much saying, is the same as somebody trying to argue that Necro Scepter and Dagger OH is perfectly find to have as off hand when spec into Power, because, hey they still do damage or some other role…

Or like arguing a Power Ranger is perfectly find with Torch Axe because hey it still does damage,,,

That argument just doesn’t make much sense. If I spec for Cleric tablet legend, none of my stats will improve the other legends besides ES, which shouldn’t count in this discussion since it’s not core part of the design.

Swapping legends will lock me out my skills that are useful, and put me into skills that I may not need, and for what? Stun break and energy?

Legends should have more choices to their skill make up, to make legend swap more useful.

Right now, it’s basically Engineer kits on long Cooldown with no other options.
That’s bad design.
Simple as that.

They could also reduce swap lockout but that has other issues. The best solution is adding more skills to Legends.

Knighthonor.4061:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Dirame.8521:

Knighthonor.4061:

Legends are locked into certain predesigned roles and each legend’s doesn’t seem to sync with other legends and their roles. Legend swap also seem to be the go to design for regenerating energy when fully low as well.

This to me seem to be a flaw in the design of the Revenant’s Legend and Energy system.

Because let’s say, I am a Ventari Support Revenant in full cleric gear and Centaur Legend for support.
I run low on energy. Now what Legend will benefit my role and gear choice now? Centaur has the only heal support of any legend besides Herald.
Should I switch to a condition legend? Or Dwarf legend, or Assassin legend with my cleric gear to get that energy boost?
What benefit would I have in doing so, if I will be locked out of the Centaur Legend when I do swap?

IMO the better solution to this flaw, is by giving each legend an additional set of skills that can be switched in place of the stock skills, that may potentially fit the role of the build I may be building around at the time. This way all stats would still fit the legend I swap to, as well as the role I can continue to play.

The legends do sync.

Taking Ventari for Support is just one form of support. You can take Jalis for damage reduction on the Elite (and now condi damage reduction) OR you can take Mallyx to pull condis off of your teammates.

The most interesting part about the Revenant is the skills and how you can play around with them. That is really not an area where the Rev has issues. If you had gripes with the traits themselves, then I’d be more inclined to agree.

They do not sync. The weapons are the only thing that can be made to sync.

When I swap from ventari to Glint I go from 2000hps to 600. The only benefit being maintaining regeneration. A swap to malyx is pointless because ventari has condi removal. A swap to jalis is pointless because ventari can already give protection and any further damage reduction loss is made up for by healing.

The roles are separated. There is no sync like elementalists.

Wat
Elementalist doesn’t sync like that either.
You swap from Fire and your DPS goes down the drain if you’re using Staff. MH Dagger has no sustained damage in Fire, but little burst in Air, then there’s no Healing on any Element outside of Water. They get locked out of most of their Healing, DPS, Control, Mobility, etc. by swapping while Revenant can swap between two roles that can actually sync up either via weapons, traits, or similar ideas.

Also, Jalis isn’t pointless at all because giving team mates damage reductions outside of Protection is pretty powerful and unique. Arguably, 2k hp/s isn’t necessary if they’re taking like 80% less damage and 5 seconds later you’ll be able to swap back to Ventari anyway.

They would never have that much damage reduction in jalis and your condi removal goes away.

There is every bit more synergy in elementalist as they have functioning combos between their four roles. Not only that effects of one can meaningfully persist In the others.

Please come up with a build for me that is Shiro and Ventari.

RotGD + protection is pretty high and your Condi Removal? Really? It’s designed as our biggest weakness afterall, but if it REALLY bothers you to lose group condi cleansing for 10 seconds, then Mallxy can still deal with them for your team somewhat.

The Elementalist has combos, but that’s kinda the point of their mechanic. They tend to have weak spells with high cooldowns to “balance” their 4 attunements. Even then, the combos you’re talking about are completely possible on Revenant too.
Axe 5 into Glint’s Breath move where they’re being pulled into Staff 5
Be creative.

Oh, and you want a Shiro/Ventari build? Try going for a Control/Support role.
Ventari can do his thing while Shiro provides insane mobility between fights(especially in PvP), strong Control in Jade Winds and allows Quickness Stomps/Rezzes(or even auto-attacking with Staff for orbs).
For PvE you’ll probably want Glint over Shiro, but since you’re hellbent on complaining, Shiro still allows for DPS while Ventari can provide crazy up-time on projectile destruction.

I meant cross stance combos not cross weapon. And when you are ventari leaving to either of the two specs stills makes you deal with either damage reduction or condis poorly.

The point of this mechanic is not to swap. Unless you need to switch roles. Or are too low on energy. What ends up happening is staying in one spec and being any class that had five utility and two weapons. The difference is that you lack any of the great self syngery or the classes you emote.

If we look at the utilities in a vacuum, then sure, I’d agree with you, but this class is obviously designed for you to have to manage your energy and what you need in the current situation and the utilities are for just that, utility. They don’t need to be combo’d between stances(even though there’s nothing stopping you from pulling chain-CCs or Phase traversal into EtD or whatever).

There’s not much wrong in camping Ventari if you want, but you can also swap to Jalis/Mallyx/Whatever for whatever they bring and some energy at the cost of being locked out of Ventari for a bit.
That being said, the only Legend that absolutely demands certain stats to be useful is Mallyx right now.
Jalis, Shiro, Ventari, and Glint all work fine with any stat combo.

Ventari wants healing power. Shiro wants power. Glint is synergy and wants nothing. Jalis is defensive so stats don’t even matter but it seems to want boon duration.

Yet it works without Healing Power just fine(especially the projectile destruction and cleanses) and Shiro works with literally anything.

I wouldn’t neuter the potential of a spec for just fine. And Shiro has life siphon which is damage affected by power. As well as one elite and utility that also do power damage. Specs either assert their will or fold to the will of the other spec.

wat
The spec still performs well without a ton of Healing Power. It even has several useful skills you can pull off still, like projectile destruction and cleansing. How is this neutering anything? You get some group heals and utility without sacrificing any damage or anything else you want. Sure, it’s not AS powerful as a Cleric’s Rev, but that wasn’t the intended goal was it?

Then, Shiro doesn’t need any power boost for his siphons to be useful as it’s a supplementary heal anyway(and the #6 still heals fine since it scales kinda poorly), you can take the GM that eats another stack of Stability to push that Control aspect harder and the Elite’s main use is Control rather than damage.

You’re really pushing this non-existant issue a lot.
All of them have a role they cover, but they can still sync up and do their jobs fine.
Even Ventari in a DPS build can work out(mostly in PvE) due to his huge up-time in projectile destruction. Really, the only one you can complain about is Mallyx since he’s all about Conditions and doesn’t help Power/Support builds very much.

You trying real hard to justify this flaw. The argument you are using can apply to any class. What you pretty much saying, is the same as somebody trying to argue that Necro Scepter and Dagger OH is perfectly find to have as off hand when spec into Power, because, hey they still do damage or some other role…

Or like arguing a Power Ranger is perfectly find with Torch Axe because hey it still does damage,,,

That argument just doesn’t make much sense. If I spec for Cleric tablet legend, none of my stats will improve the other legends besides ES, which shouldn’t count in this discussion since it’s not core part of the design.

Swapping legends will lock me out my skills that are useful, and put me into skills that I may not need, and for what? Stun break and energy?

Legends should have more choices to their skill make up, to make legend swap more useful.

Right now, it’s basically Engineer kits on long Cooldown with no other options.
That’s bad design.
Simple as that.

They could also reduce swap lockout but that has other issues. The best solution is adding more skills to Legends.

while i agree legends need at least 1 more utility skill, you are still talking about swapping when actually you aren’t forced to? like you said, if you do not need, why do? for energy and swap proc? No.

You swap when you need to change the current role, that’s why is not a design flaw. You build cleric w/Ventari? very well, your main role is to heal / support. What to do in the downtimes or easy phase where heavy healing is not needed? you can pair with glint to dish out boons and help your team dps, or if the thing is covered you can pair up with shiro for dps spike with the heal and fight mobility while also switching your probable staff for a sword/ set and starting dps.
Even jalis/hammer is a good chance since you can put damage mitigation with RotGD, taunt to move damage away from your team while DPSing from afar. All those work good in my eyes. There’s no place for mallyx since you are running cleric’s, switch for something condi oriented and you have your pair for condi dps time.

Shiro will never have healing support, like mallyx will never have direct damage support etc etc…each legend has personality and you should pair up those personality to cover weak spots/secondary utilities.
Since “roles” are just 3 with some sub role (condi dps, direct dps, healing support, buff support, debuff support, control) in the future we might have 2 legends on the same role (even, if you see, we lack a control heavy legend is more likely will get that first ;-) ).

This is exactly what i wanted in a class.
Cheers.

Can’t believe what I am reading from you people. Dpsing with Shiro and Demon with cleric gear is ok now….?

Smh

Daniel Handler.4816:

Dirame.8521:

Knighthonor.4061:

Legends are locked into certain predesigned roles and each legend’s doesn’t seem to sync with other legends and their roles. Legend swap also seem to be the go to design for regenerating energy when fully low as well.

This to me seem to be a flaw in the design of the Revenant’s Legend and Energy system.

Because let’s say, I am a Ventari Support Revenant in full cleric gear and Centaur Legend for support.
I run low on energy. Now what Legend will benefit my role and gear choice now? Centaur has the only heal support of any legend besides Herald.
Should I switch to a condition legend? Or Dwarf legend, or Assassin legend with my cleric gear to get that energy boost?
What benefit would I have in doing so, if I will be locked out of the Centaur Legend when I do swap?

IMO the better solution to this flaw, is by giving each legend an additional set of skills that can be switched in place of the stock skills, that may potentially fit the role of the build I may be building around at the time. This way all stats would still fit the legend I swap to, as well as the role I can continue to play.

The legends do sync.

Taking Ventari for Support is just one form of support. You can take Jalis for damage reduction on the Elite (and now condi damage reduction) OR you can take Mallyx to pull condis off of your teammates.

The most interesting part about the Revenant is the skills and how you can play around with them. That is really not an area where the Rev has issues. If you had gripes with the traits themselves, then I’d be more inclined to agree.

They do not sync. The weapons are the only thing that can be made to sync.

When I swap from ventari to Glint I go from 2000hps to 600. The only benefit being maintaining regeneration. A swap to malyx is pointless because ventari has condi removal. A swap to jalis is pointless because ventari can already give protection and any further damage reduction loss is made up for by healing.

The roles are separated. There is no sync like elementalists.

When you go from Ventari to Glint you just decided to go from heal support to boon support! Both of those things help your team. And people want Revenants with Glint in PvE because of that boon support.

Knighthonor.4061:

You trying real hard to justify this flaw. The argument you are using can apply to any class. What you pretty much saying, is the same as somebody trying to argue that Necro Scepter and Dagger OH is perfectly find to have as off hand when spec into Power, because, hey they still do damage or some other role…

You’re too busy complaining about what doesn’t sync when you should be focusing on what does sync!
YES the legends fill different roles, YES different stat sets improve one over the other but that doesn’t stop you from maximizing the use of the skills that are within each of them!

Pull condis from your team with Mallyx, swap to Ventari to remove condis. Give yourself might with Glint, go into Mallyx to apply condis because your condis will now hit hard, Go in Ventari to create the tablet and blow it up to create healing rocks, jump into Jalis to pop the elite so you take less damage whilst healing up.
If certain abilities sync and allow you to do your designated role better, I personally don’t see any bloody reason to complain.

Knighthonor.4061:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Malchior.5732:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Dirame.8521:

Knighthonor.4061:

Legends are locked into certain predesigned roles and each legend’s doesn’t seem to sync with other legends and their roles. Legend swap also seem to be the go to design for regenerating energy when fully low as well.

This to me seem to be a flaw in the design of the Revenant’s Legend and Energy system.

Because let’s say, I am a Ventari Support Revenant in full cleric gear and Centaur Legend for support.
I run low on energy. Now what Legend will benefit my role and gear choice now? Centaur has the only heal support of any legend besides Herald.
Should I switch to a condition legend? Or Dwarf legend, or Assassin legend with my cleric gear to get that energy boost?
What benefit would I have in doing so, if I will be locked out of the Centaur Legend when I do swap?

IMO the better solution to this flaw, is by giving each legend an additional set of skills that can be switched in place of the stock skills, that may potentially fit the role of the build I may be building around at the time. This way all stats would still fit the legend I swap to, as well as the role I can continue to play.

The legends do sync.

Taking Ventari for Support is just one form of support. You can take Jalis for damage reduction on the Elite (and now condi damage reduction) OR you can take Mallyx to pull condis off of your teammates.

The most interesting part about the Revenant is the skills and how you can play around with them. That is really not an area where the Rev has issues. If you had gripes with the traits themselves, then I’d be more inclined to agree.

They do not sync. The weapons are the only thing that can be made to sync.

When I swap from ventari to Glint I go from 2000hps to 600. The only benefit being maintaining regeneration. A swap to malyx is pointless because ventari has condi removal. A swap to jalis is pointless because ventari can already give protection and any further damage reduction loss is made up for by healing.

The roles are separated. There is no sync like elementalists.

Wat
Elementalist doesn’t sync like that either.
You swap from Fire and your DPS goes down the drain if you’re using Staff. MH Dagger has no sustained damage in Fire, but little burst in Air, then there’s no Healing on any Element outside of Water. They get locked out of most of their Healing, DPS, Control, Mobility, etc. by swapping while Revenant can swap between two roles that can actually sync up either via weapons, traits, or similar ideas.

Also, Jalis isn’t pointless at all because giving team mates damage reductions outside of Protection is pretty powerful and unique. Arguably, 2k hp/s isn’t necessary if they’re taking like 80% less damage and 5 seconds later you’ll be able to swap back to Ventari anyway.

They would never have that much damage reduction in jalis and your condi removal goes away.

There is every bit more synergy in elementalist as they have functioning combos between their four roles. Not only that effects of one can meaningfully persist In the others.

Please come up with a build for me that is Shiro and Ventari.

RotGD + protection is pretty high and your Condi Removal? Really? It’s designed as our biggest weakness afterall, but if it REALLY bothers you to lose group condi cleansing for 10 seconds, then Mallxy can still deal with them for your team somewhat.

The Elementalist has combos, but that’s kinda the point of their mechanic. They tend to have weak spells with high cooldowns to “balance” their 4 attunements. Even then, the combos you’re talking about are completely possible on Revenant too.
Axe 5 into Glint’s Breath move where they’re being pulled into Staff 5
Be creative.

Oh, and you want a Shiro/Ventari build? Try going for a Control/Support role.
Ventari can do his thing while Shiro provides insane mobility between fights(especially in PvP), strong Control in Jade Winds and allows Quickness Stomps/Rezzes(or even auto-attacking with Staff for orbs).
For PvE you’ll probably want Glint over Shiro, but since you’re hellbent on complaining, Shiro still allows for DPS while Ventari can provide crazy up-time on projectile destruction.

I meant cross stance combos not cross weapon. And when you are ventari leaving to either of the two specs stills makes you deal with either damage reduction or condis poorly.

The point of this mechanic is not to swap. Unless you need to switch roles. Or are too low on energy. What ends up happening is staying in one spec and being any class that had five utility and two weapons. The difference is that you lack any of the great self syngery or the classes you emote.

If we look at the utilities in a vacuum, then sure, I’d agree with you, but this class is obviously designed for you to have to manage your energy and what you need in the current situation and the utilities are for just that, utility. They don’t need to be combo’d between stances(even though there’s nothing stopping you from pulling chain-CCs or Phase traversal into EtD or whatever).

There’s not much wrong in camping Ventari if you want, but you can also swap to Jalis/Mallyx/Whatever for whatever they bring and some energy at the cost of being locked out of Ventari for a bit.
That being said, the only Legend that absolutely demands certain stats to be useful is Mallyx right now.
Jalis, Shiro, Ventari, and Glint all work fine with any stat combo.

Ventari wants healing power. Shiro wants power. Glint is synergy and wants nothing. Jalis is defensive so stats don’t even matter but it seems to want boon duration.

Yet it works without Healing Power just fine(especially the projectile destruction and cleanses) and Shiro works with literally anything.

I wouldn’t neuter the potential of a spec for just fine. And Shiro has life siphon which is damage affected by power. As well as one elite and utility that also do power damage. Specs either assert their will or fold to the will of the other spec.

wat
The spec still performs well without a ton of Healing Power. It even has several useful skills you can pull off still, like projectile destruction and cleansing. How is this neutering anything? You get some group heals and utility without sacrificing any damage or anything else you want. Sure, it’s not AS powerful as a Cleric’s Rev, but that wasn’t the intended goal was it?

Then, Shiro doesn’t need any power boost for his siphons to be useful as it’s a supplementary heal anyway(and the #6 still heals fine since it scales kinda poorly), you can take the GM that eats another stack of Stability to push that Control aspect harder and the Elite’s main use is Control rather than damage.

You’re really pushing this non-existant issue a lot.
All of them have a role they cover, but they can still sync up and do their jobs fine.
Even Ventari in a DPS build can work out(mostly in PvE) due to his huge up-time in projectile destruction. Really, the only one you can complain about is Mallyx since he’s all about Conditions and doesn’t help Power/Support builds very much.

You trying real hard to justify this flaw. The argument you are using can apply to any class. What you pretty much saying, is the same as somebody trying to argue that Necro Scepter and Dagger OH is perfectly find to have as off hand when spec into Power, because, hey they still do damage or some other role…

Or like arguing a Power Ranger is perfectly find with Torch Axe because hey it still does damage,,,

That argument just doesn’t make much sense. If I spec for Cleric tablet legend, none of my stats will improve the other legends besides ES, which shouldn’t count in this discussion since it’s not core part of the design.

Swapping legends will lock me out my skills that are useful, and put me into skills that I may not need, and for what? Stun break and energy?

Legends should have more choices to their skill make up, to make legend swap more useful.

Right now, it’s basically Engineer kits on long Cooldown with no other options.
That’s bad design.
Simple as that.

They could also reduce swap lockout but that has other issues. The best solution is adding more skills to Legends.

So now we ARE talking about weapon sets?
First you told me that only the weapon sets sync up for Revenant and that the utilities don’t.
Like, I gave you examples that they CAN be used even in Cleric’s builds. Shiro is nothing more than mobility, control, and Quickness which has many applications.
Jalis and Glint are nothing more than Group Support and some Control.
Ventari is nothing but Group Support.
They’re just utilities.

Would Ventari be stronger in Cleric’s? Yes. Would the others? Not as strong since it’ll be more selfish healing, but since Healing Power still beefs up your SHIELD and your STAFF and they can still provide group support in other ways, this complaint doesn’t make much sense. You don’t need different gears to be effective with any Legend other than Mallyx.
If you DESPERATELY want that Stun Break(which you don’t even need because Retribution + Herald lines exist), then there’s a cost due to Ventari’s design.
If anything, Ventari is flawed for not having a Stun Break, not the Legend swap.

It just looks like you’re desperately looking for an issue here even though there’s nothing. If you find yourself weak to CC and you don’t want to swap Legends(which you should anyway since pure Healing isn’t even that useful in the core game) then spec into Retribution. If you still want to heal team mates outside of Ventari, you HAVE OPTIONS.

It’s like complaining that an Elementalist swapping out of Water has a completely useless stat combination too. Like, yea, he can’t properly heal his team mates now, but you wont complain about that will you? I don’t understand why having a downtime in exchange for for versatily is so bad. So one of my stats isn’t being used in every as effectively for 10 seconds, wow. Druid could complain the same when they swap weapons and can’t enter Celestial form.

Knighthonor.4061:

Can’t believe what I am reading from you people. Dpsing with Shiro and Demon with cleric gear is ok now….?

Smh

Last I checked damage is calculated off weapon damage, skill coefficients and offensive stats like power, precision, ferocity and condition damage where applicable. When you swap legend you are not suddenly going to lose out on damage unless utilising a specific utility to enhance your attack speed etc.

There’s a few traits that are legend specific or at least alter mechanics which are only on some legends. However the majority of traits work on whatever legend you use with only a few enhancing specific weapons (Tranquil Benediction, Ferocious Strikes)

Also why is everyone saying mallyx has no use or synergy with a power build? Banish enchantment would be the best way to take down the current bunkers appart from shambow warrior as they all rely on boons to live and getting resistance from pain absorption is nothing to be sniffed at when combined with the heal.

Edit: Yeah dpsing with shiro and mallyx clerics is silly however the point people were making is just because you swap legend it doesn’t mean you’re completely useless or lost out too much on something you had. In the quote you would DPS in zerker gear but all legends can do that mostly.

I am not sure if I would call it a flaw so much as being unflexible. Revenant is flexible in one way when it comes to having two playstyles on hand, and in another very much not. You have to make a judgement call and decide when you can swap, but I also find this seemingly to be the main drawback with the class. If you picture a scenario where you are ‘tanking’ or healing your team and absolutely must have something up to counter a certain mechanic or player skill, then you are very unflexible and have to sit in your legend even if the situation otherwise doesn’t warrant it.

The question then becomes, is it balanced to run only part your class for periods, or not? I’m sure the balance team keeps that in mind though.

Knighthonor.4061:

Can’t believe what I am reading from you people. Dpsing with Shiro and Demon with cleric gear is ok now….?

Smh

be in the context man, DPS won’t be your role and you won’t dish out top DPS, but you’ll be contributing instead of doing nothing sitting in ventari, that was my example. With other group buffs like fury/prec/might even 900 power are noticeable, otherwise builds like sinister wouldnt be that reliant on the power part to be top dps (look at engi).

Sorry but most of you are getting the reventant wrong…
Who says ventary and Shiro cant work? maybe im wrong but who says i cant swap from ventary to shiro and use jade winds to stun all the foes (thats a role in support is called control), and who says i cant use imposible odds and using my staff auto attacks for generating a lot orbs (quickness + autoatacking), i was looking at the Salvation specialization/traitline, and it doesnt say ANYWHERE that when you lose your inerit healing power, so the regens you alreaddy aplied they will still tick the same heal when out of ventary, if you cant live 10 seconds without ventary, SHAME ON YOU, its not a flawed class, is a flawed player, even with cleric stats, you will stay with the weapons you have choosen and those are the ones that you mainly use, so you will be able to still use them when out of your primary legend. i dont know why a lot of people consider it as bad, i consider it good cause it gives me the posibility to add a something else for 10+ seconds to my build. as i said in the case of shiro… use imposible oods and shine :P

Dirame.8521:

You’re too busy complaining about what doesn’t sync when you should be focusing on what does sync!

Yep. This entire thread is a trumped-up attempt to demand more utility skills per legend, which we do not need and are not getting.

cyst.3108:

Who says ventary and Shiro cant work? maybe im wrong but who says i cant swap from ventary to shiro and use jade winds to stun all the foes (thats a role in support is called control), and who says i cant use imposible odds and using my staff auto attacks for generating a lot orbs (quickness + autoatacking)

Now that is some outside the box thinking. I like it!

Misguided.5139:

Now that is some outside the box thinking. I like it!

yeah rev allows many tricks like those if you can think them

There are a lot of good traits to chose, and you may not have room for getting malix trait line, but for a dude in power+healing power+toughness/vitality the grand master tier that gives +10% crit chance per second is absolutely good, so who says you cant go (without having herald) Ventary, Malix and Invocation/Jalis traitlines (Spec – Chose 3) and get the traits in malix that doesnt go straight forward to condition build, like the one that gives +10% crit chance per second. You wont hit like a Zerker spect but at least you wont be a kitten Soraka on the battlefield.

apharma.3741:

Knighthonor.4061:

Can’t believe what I am reading from you people. Dpsing with Shiro and Demon with cleric gear is ok now….?

Smh

Last I checked damage is calculated off weapon damage, skill coefficients and offensive stats like power, precision, ferocity and condition damage where applicable. When you swap legend you are not suddenly going to lose out on damage unless utilising a specific utility to enhance your attack speed etc.

There’s a few traits that are legend specific or at least alter mechanics which are only on some legends. However the majority of traits work on whatever legend you use with only a few enhancing specific weapons (Tranquil Benediction, Ferocious Strikes)

Also why is everyone saying mallyx has no use or synergy with a power build? Banish enchantment would be the best way to take down the current bunkers appart from shambow warrior as they all rely on boons to live and getting resistance from pain absorption is nothing to be sniffed at when combined with the heal.

Edit: Yeah dpsing with shiro and mallyx clerics is silly however the point people were making is just because you swap legend it doesn’t mean you’re completely useless or lost out too much on something you had. In the quote you would DPS in zerker gear but all legends can do that mostly.

Everything is forced. There are certain stat combinations for each stance and when you pair one stance will always exert the will over the other stances.

Shiro is for power, the heal, one utility and the elite all track off of power and performs dps
Malyx tracks of condi damage. and performs condi dps
Jalis doesn’t care and goes with the stat of the other stance.
Ventari wants healing power and performs hps
Glint doesn’t care.

This makes it so almost every spec that does not use herald will use invocation.
So a person who is ventari/malyx/shiro never wants to switch out of their stance.
Jalis/glint only serve as utility stances.

So to make things work you get

ventari/jalis , will have healing power, will use invocation
ventari/malyx , healing power + condition damage, precision as well + invocation tree
ventari/shiro, healing power and power, + invocation tree
ventari/glint, will have healing power
jalis/malyx, will have condition damage + precision, invocation tree
jalis/shiro, will have power, + invocation tree
jalis/glint, no one cares, except probably won’t have condition damage
shiro/glint, will have power, + invocation tree

swap invocation traitline for herald as needed.

Build diversity is limited to 8 builds. To even maximize between two stances you need a specific stat combination.

And the amount of builds that will not use herald or invocation seems very large.