Guild Wars 2

I’m done playing Rev and the game until the class is fixed PVP wise. Anyone who says the class is in a good spot can hug my….

….. teddy bear?

Are you mad because you think they are underpowered or overpowered? Because if you think rev is underpowered all i can tell you is to get good and learn the class better. In this weeks Pro League all the teams had a combined 8 revenats, more than any other class. Scrapper was second with 6. So its definitely not the class thats underpowered.

Git Gud
/15characterinos

Really its just a learn to play issue from what I see here, the class is top notch, usually doing 800k-900k dmg usually, most professions don’t deal that amount of dmg easily in the whole duration of a match.

what was nerfed? can anybody sum this up for me?

What build are you playing and what are you fighting?

I think part of the problem is that lots of pub players use condi builds, which rev is stupidly weak to unless you kitten yourself with Mallyx. Most of the ESL groups don’t use condi much at all because there are too many counters as a whole. So ESL players can kitten out revs all over the place, but as a pub player you run into all the condi classes which just DoT you down. Quite quickly in the case of any of the major burners.

SolarDragon.7063:

I think part of the problem is that lots of pub players use condi builds, which rev is stupidly weak to unless you kitten yourself with Mallyx. Most of the ESL groups don’t use condi much at all because there are too many counters as a whole. So ESL players can kitten out revs all over the place, but as a pub player you run into all the condi classes which just DoT you down. Quite quickly in the case of any of the major burners.

Stil Mallyx even only deals with it for so long, and never removes any condis so as soon as that res drops with 20k dps of condis on you, gnight.. God forbid you need to swap out of it to deal with other things..

dank.3680:

Stil Mallyx even only deals with it for so long, and never removes any condis so as soon as that res drops with 20k dps of condis on you, gnight.. God forbid you need to swap out of it to deal with other things..

Hence why I referred to it in the negative. Rev needs condition transferral on either a mallyx skill or a weapon, and it should be reasonably good cooldowns.
The optimal way to deal with conditions currently is staff/shiro/UA and never get hit by them, but that becomes exponentially harder the larger the fight.

Why is negating all the condis not an option? FoN + Pain Absorption soaks all condis from around you and the Resistance you get is greater than the duration of the condis on you.

General speaking we trash every class 1v1 though condis give us an insanely hard time.

Adjust.6903:

General speaking we trash every class 1v1 though condis give us an insanely hard time.

For the most part yea but condi reaper can crush revs without much effort tbh

LMAO.. You must be doing something wrong.

Revenant has some of the highest burst in game, in addition to many tools to negate burst. The 10 CD stun-break and on demand quickness is a nice bonus too.

Playing my rev just doesn’t feel right. 1v1 i do okay in the arenas, but in sPvP I either deal good damage and die all the time, or survive but whip people with a feather. I can’t find a happy medium.

I rerolled from a warrior main who had that happy medium. I went back to playing it tonight and actually enjoyed playing it more than rev…

I’m not finding rev good in pvp either, i guess im doing something really wrong here…… Anybody have any build suggestions? and or how to use it in pvp combat?

SolarDragon.7063:

I think part of the problem is that lots of pub players use condi builds, which rev is stupidly weak to unless you kitten yourself with Mallyx. Most of the ESL groups don’t use condi much at all because there are too many counters as a whole. So ESL players can kitten out revs all over the place, but as a pub player you run into all the condi classes which just DoT you down. Quite quickly in the case of any of the major burners.

This….

To answer some of the questions I am running your standard Herald / Shiro build. Have tried many different variations and runes / sigils.

condi ranger / druid build / Mesmer / Guardians are the major classes that literally face roll me. And yes, I may not know the class as well as some players or know how to counter them as well, But I have a fairly good understanding of how they’re played and have no problem beating them on my other toons. Its only a matter of time before I’m simply over whelmed. Or even melted down in a matter of seconds by some…

AehAZE.1867:

SolarDragon.7063:

I think part of the problem is that lots of pub players use condi builds, which rev is stupidly weak to unless you kitten yourself with Mallyx. Most of the ESL groups don’t use condi much at all because there are too many counters as a whole. So ESL players can kitten out revs all over the place, but as a pub player you run into all the condi classes which just DoT you down. Quite quickly in the case of any of the major burners.

This….

To answer some of the questions I am running your standard Herald / Shiro build. Have tried many different variations and runes / sigils.

condi ranger / druid build / Mesmer / Guardians are the major classes that literally face roll me. And yes, I may not know the class as well as some players or know how to counter them as well, But I have a fairly good understanding of how they’re played and have no problem beating them on my other toons. Its only a matter of time before I’m simply over whelmed. Or even melted down in a matter of seconds by some…

Or you may stop playing the “Meta Build” and try hammer and some tweaks and find your happy medium. Hammer counters those shiny Ranger/DH roaming around the unorganized pvp scene.

Btw, I think it’s mostly because of how new the class is that some people find it hard to utilizae Revenant. Revenant has actually quite a high skill-floor because it requires you to control your energy source and click skills /swap stances very quickly. Most of their defenses are active defense rather than passive, so you have to time it right for your numerous evade/block/heal.

The thing is Rev in not Team Fighter but it can win any 1vs1 in the game.

Go away from the main fight you will be much happier….

If you’re having trouble as a Revenant, you need to get good.

If only staff 4 would be fixed… Happiest day of my life xd
It works only in half cases. And maybe reduce casttime.

if revenant is in a bad spot, I don’t dare to imagine in which spot is the warrior…

posthumecaver.6473:

The thing is Rev in not Team Fighter but it can win any 1vs1 in the game.

Go away from the main fight you will be much happier….

Not a team fighter when Hammer 2 can easily hit 5 people around 8k?
Not a team fighter when the cleave damage is insanely high?
Ik the lack of high stability skill may hurt, but it still have on deamand stun-break, evade, and block. There’re multiple ways for Rev to negate burst. It’d be perfect if someone else cover up Revenant’s condition weakness by bringing AOE cleanse.

if you’re having trouble playing rev it really is a l2p issue. swap from hammer to staff and get better at it

problem solved.

the mitigation from staff and shiro is borderline asinine, 10 sec CD channel block on staff, dodge/evade+gain endurance/dodge againx2 on shiro, KD on staff 5 and block skill back off CD again… rinse repeat.

oh and in case that isn’t enough, swap over to glint for 3 secs of immunity+heal of all damage, not to mention sprinkling in a couple of shield 5 skills from trait and the actual skill.

Oh my god…. I’d never thought I’d see the day when someone is saying a Rev is weak i. pvp. If you are getting face rolled by DH’s then it’s definately a L2P issue.

LOL rev was the most represented class in the pro league……git gud!

Every team with a DH lost….Think about that and re-evaluate your skill level.

Aomine.5012:

posthumecaver.6473:

The thing is Rev in not Team Fighter but it can win any 1vs1 in the game.

Go away from the main fight you will be much happier….

Not a team fighter when Hammer 2 can easily hit 5 people around 8k?
Not a team fighter when the cleave damage is insanely high?
Ik the lack of high stability skill may hurt, but it still have on deamand stun-break, evade, and block. There’re multiple ways for Rev to negate burst. It’d be perfect if someone else cover up Revenant’s condition weakness by bringing AOE cleanse.

Ne Hammer is to slow for my taste for PVP….

Even in PVE, mobs walk away from the hit zone, forget about hitting human players…

posthumecaver.6473:

Aomine.5012:

posthumecaver.6473:

The thing is Rev in not Team Fighter but it can win any 1vs1 in the game.

Go away from the main fight you will be much happier….

Not a team fighter when Hammer 2 can easily hit 5 people around 8k?
Not a team fighter when the cleave damage is insanely high?
Ik the lack of high stability skill may hurt, but it still have on deamand stun-break, evade, and block. There’re multiple ways for Rev to negate burst. It’d be perfect if someone else cover up Revenant’s condition weakness by bringing AOE cleanse.

Ne Hammer is to slow for my taste for PVP….

Even in PVE, mobs walk away from the hit zone, forget about hitting human players…

Except that ya know in pvp, players tend to stand in a small circle to keep the point. So an off point hammer rev assisting a teammate can land those hits vs non pro players.

It’s strong but doesn’t mean it’s not still incomplete. Isn’t enough reason to not play it though. Better than being incomplete and useless like Thief.

SolarDragon.7063:

I think part of the problem is that lots of pub players use condi builds, which rev is stupidly weak to unless you kitten yourself with Mallyx. Most of the ESL groups don’t use condi much at all because there are too many counters as a whole. So ESL players can kitten out revs all over the place, but as a pub player you run into all the condi classes which just DoT you down. Quite quickly in the case of any of the major burners.

thats wrong. condi-chill reaper is very highly represented amongst the EU scene at the moment and a bit on NA, and so is condi-rev to a lesser extent.

Shoutbow doesn’t exist and people are still using aurashare instead of celansing water tempest so most people arent running builds that spam AoE condi clear anymore.

Yeah I went into PvP on a Rev after having played a combined 3 matches since 2012. I managed to handle myself just fine in any 1v1 situation, and in group situations I either hammer spammed at range or bunkered with the sword and shield, and honestly I didn’t even have a lot of trouble with Condi builds because I could drop them so quickly.

If anything, Rev probably needs a nerf. I think our friend the OP just needs some practice time, a guide or three, and take a much needed chill pill.

The more I read this topic, the more I think that OP was just a troll. He didn’t even bother to take part in the debate he created…

Main thing wrong about revenant is dependancy on stupid herald spec.
I rly hate it when they force you in to trait line:(

Well that’s warrior all over again… But you Revs should be grateful for you are forced into only one traitline. We, warriors, were born forced into two traitlines.

But hey, that’s off topic (I don’t know what isn’t though).

FatRaKoon.1782:

Well that’s warrior all over again… But you Revs should be grateful for you are forced into only one traitline. We, warriors, were born forced into two traitlines.

But hey, that’s off topic (I don’t know what isn’t though).

As soon they fix sword offhand and Jalis that wont be true anymore.

FatRaKoon.1782:

Well that’s warrior all over again… But you Revs should be grateful for you are forced into only one traitline. We, warriors, were born forced into two traitlines.

But hey, that’s off topic (I don’t know what isn’t though).

Not quite true. Rev is also forced into two traitlines on regular dps build. (which represent of 90% of current Revenants) I’d even argue that dps Rev is forced into THREEE traitlines.

Without Invocation and Herald, the dps spec has too many weaknesses that CANNOT be resolved by any of the utilities. Without Invocation, Rev’s condition removal is extremely limited, and stun-breaker is extremely limited, almost tied to Shiro since Jiro’s stun-breaker is way too costly. You also lose 20% crit chance and 7% damage.

Without Herald, you pretty much lose everything. So this one is no brainer.

Without Devastation, the impact is not as great as the above 2 because it’s only a straight dps lost. But it can still “function” properly without Devastation though, just alot lower dps. So one would argue this line is mandatory too for dps Herald.

Lol, no, rev doesnt depend on herald line.
if you really say “depend”, then it’s just as dependent as other classes to their elite specialization

@above Invocation isn’t even part of the meta build how can it be required in anyway, meta power build uses retribution..

lighter.2708:

Lol, no, rev doesnt depend on herald line.
if you really say “depend”, then it’s just as dependent as other classes to their elite specialization

@above Invocation isn’t even part of the meta build how can it be required in anyway, meta power build uses retribution..

You seem to be indicating PVP only.

If you take Retribution in PVE, it’s a huge dps and utility lost.
I were once taking Retribution over Invocation, but once I switch it, I can never go back.
The utility and dps difference is just too significant.

Oh btw, as for Meta, the Meta PVE Berserker raid build no longer pick up discipline, so your theory of warrior depending on disp is flawed too.

Aomine.5012:

lighter.2708:

Lol, no, rev doesnt depend on herald line.
if you really say “depend”, then it’s just as dependent as other classes to their elite specialization

@above Invocation isn’t even part of the meta build how can it be required in anyway, meta power build uses retribution..

You seem to be indicating PVP only.

If you take Retribution in PVE, it’s a huge dps and utility lost.
I were once taking Retribution over Invocation, but once I switch it, I can never go back.
The utility and dps difference is just too significant.

Oh btw, as for Meta, the Meta PVE Berserker raid build no longer pick up discipline, so your theory of warrior depending on disp is flawed too.

So you are talking about PvE then?
Then tell me which class isn’t forced to take DPS lines when building for DPS, or we can trait for defense still asking for DPS now or something? like which class isn’t forced to take defense line if they want to tank, which class isn’t forced to take healing line if they want to be a healer.
Your logic is just flawed, do you even understand what we talking about as dependency of a class on specific trait line?
like seriously, PVE shouldn’t even be in this kind of conversation, like seriously, i’m able to function properly even traitless in pve, except that DPS lost.

lighter.2708:

Aomine.5012:

lighter.2708:

Lol, no, rev doesnt depend on herald line.
if you really say “depend”, then it’s just as dependent as other classes to their elite specialization

@above Invocation isn’t even part of the meta build how can it be required in anyway, meta power build uses retribution..

You seem to be indicating PVP only.

If you take Retribution in PVE, it’s a huge dps and utility lost.
I were once taking Retribution over Invocation, but once I switch it, I can never go back.
The utility and dps difference is just too significant.

Oh btw, as for Meta, the Meta PVE Berserker raid build no longer pick up discipline, so your theory of warrior depending on disp is flawed too.

So you are talking about PvE then?
Then tell me which class isn’t forced to take DPS lines when building for DPS, or we can trait for defense still asking for DPS now or something? like which class isn’t forced to take defense line if they want to tank, which class isn’t forced to take healing line if they want to be a healer.
Your logic is just flawed, do you even understand what we talking about as dependency of a class on specific trait line?
like seriously, PVE shouldn’t even be in this kind of conversation, like seriously, i’m able to function properly even traitless in pve, except that DPS lost.

Try taking Herald off any Power build and see how it goes.

It loses dps, utility, mobility, everything.

Even Condition spec need Herald line for the F2.

So Revenant is DEPENDING on Herald to be functional.

Aomine.5012:

Without Devastation

Devastation is underwhelming in pvp. I rolled invocation over it and never looked back. ALl day long crits, stunbreak+condi cleanse on swap, some little healing from using energy skill. Paired with retribution and herald (enh bulwark) thats some really good stuff there. Deva line cant keep up in current state. Going dev/retri/herald over invo/retri/herald in pvp is a massive dps loss.

Also generally speaking if you want to build up for maximum dps output its obvious that you pick traitline that boost it. You dont pick up retribution to increase dps but to increase your sustain.

Aomine.5012:

Try taking Herald off any Power build and see how it goes.

It loses dps, utility, mobility, everything.

Even Condition spec need Herald line for the F2.

So Revenant is DEPENDING on Herald to be functional.

While i dont completely disagree the reason why condi rev takes herald is shield and shield trait to increase survival. Give that two things to base rev and nobody will spec condi rev into herald anymore. Power rev is kittented tho as Jalis is not fuctional so he needs Glint. Then theres also lack of 25% movement speed tho..

Herald is absolutely necessary, as Herald is one of the best professions in this game. Core Rev sucks for the most part, as one traitline is borderline worthless and another was gutted and never saw repair

SoulstitchMMO.1396:

Why is negating all the condis not an option? FoN + Pain Absorption soaks all condis from around you and the Resistance you get is greater than the duration of the condis on you.

Not really. At least not for me. On paper Mallyx looks solid against condi builds, but in practice you don’t get enough energy to maintain the resistance and attack at the same time. So I either die from condis because I’m trying to attack or die from direct hits because I chose to have resistance.

Personal experience at least from playing against several necros.

MakubeC.3026:

SoulstitchMMO.1396:

Why is negating all the condis not an option? FoN + Pain Absorption soaks all condis from around you and the Resistance you get is greater than the duration of the condis on you.

Not really. At least not for me. On paper Mallyx looks solid against condi builds, but in practice you don’t get enough energy to maintain the resistance and attack at the same time. So I either die from condis because I’m trying to attack or die from direct hits because I chose to have resistance.

Personal experience at least from playing against several necros.

Demonic Defiance is pretty effective

Personally, I’ve been having more success in PvP with Jalis than Shiro. Relatively small sample size thus far, and it may be a matter of playstyle, but it does have the following advantages:

1) CC resistance. RotGD is more expensive than Shiro’s stunbreak, true. However, if you get the RotGD to complete, that’s a benefit that’s almost always worth having, even if you might not have chosen to use your energy that way if it wasn’t being used to break a stun. Riposting Shadows is great if you just want to escape, but if you want to get back into melee afterwards, once you’ve used a gapcloser you’re close to having used 50 energy anyway. On top of that, Jalis can pre-empt through Stability (either through the road, although that probably is overnerfed, or the dodge roll) – particularly useful for securing stomps.

2) Condition removal. The Jalis heal gives you an option to get rid of multiple conditions quickly.

3) Vengeful Hammers. I didn’t like the change to this initially, but I’m definitely warming to it. It doesn’t deal the damage that Impossible Odds does, of course, but if you’re contesting a point, the damage reduction and healing can help a bit (particularly if you’re facing a MM necro or otherwise have large numbers of AI mooks to feed on).

4) Allows other build choices to be more aggressive. While Shiro is probably always going to be better from a pure DPS perspective, the typical Shiro/Glint build tends to rely on a shield to achieve the right balance between offence and defence. A Jalis/Glint build has the inherent survivability that means it can (and possibly should) replace the shield with something more aggressive like an axe (regaining some of the mobility that you lost from not taking Shiro).

On the whole, I’d probably say that Shiro/Glint is the better “roamer”, and will probably move from location to location, win 1v1s, and escape from 1vXs better than the Jalis/Glint setup does. Jalis/Glint, on the other hand, seems to work better in teamfight situations, where you can continue to support your team in both legends, and you have the survivability to withstand the often greater firepower that gets thrown around in a teamfight.

draxynnic.3719:

Personally, I’ve been having more success in PvP with Jalis than Shiro. Relatively small sample size thus far, and it may be a matter of playstyle, but it does have the following advantages:

1) CC resistance. RotGD is more expensive than Shiro’s stunbreak, true. However, if you get the RotGD to complete, that’s a benefit that’s almost always worth having, even if you might not have chosen to use your energy that way if it wasn’t being used to break a stun. Riposting Shadows is great if you just want to escape, but if you want to get back into melee afterwards, once you’ve used a gapcloser you’re close to having used 50 energy anyway. On top of that, Jalis can pre-empt through Stability (either through the road, although that probably is overnerfed, or the dodge roll) – particularly useful for securing stomps.

2) Condition removal. The Jalis heal gives you an option to get rid of multiple conditions quickly.

3) Vengeful Hammers. I didn’t like the change to this initially, but I’m definitely warming to it. It doesn’t deal the damage that Impossible Odds does, of course, but if you’re contesting a point, the damage reduction and healing can help a bit (particularly if you’re facing a MM necro or otherwise have large numbers of AI mooks to feed on).

4) Allows other build choices to be more aggressive. While Shiro is probably always going to be better from a pure DPS perspective, the typical Shiro/Glint build tends to rely on a shield to achieve the right balance between offence and defence. A Jalis/Glint build has the inherent survivability that means it can (and possibly should) replace the shield with something more aggressive like an axe (regaining some of the mobility that you lost from not taking Shiro).

On the whole, I’d probably say that Shiro/Glint is the better “roamer”, and will probably move from location to location, win 1v1s, and escape from 1vXs better than the Jalis/Glint setup does. Jalis/Glint, on the other hand, seems to work better in teamfight situations, where you can continue to support your team in both legends, and you have the survivability to withstand the often greater firepower that gets thrown around in a teamfight.

Well actually shiro was guted with the cd on phase travel. Shiro is supposed to be mobility. I’m okay with the fact that spamm phase travel was too strong. But 5 sec cd is too much too and it’s more annoying when you actually see that phase travel bug one time on three… The only interest remaining in shiro for now it’s impossible odds.
I’m running Jalis too now. Sure he is not as tanky as he must do but at last i have 3 condi removal and a bit tanky skill with vengefull hammers. Others skills are situationnal or useless.
I don’t know why the class is actually called revenant. She must be called Herald. Coz herald is just the core class. Others legends are useless compared to Glint and Glint and revenant traitline (for the shield too, best offhand weapon we have) must be used 90% of the time.
Maybe with the grace of the six gods we are going to see changes making core revenant legends and traitline(corruption,redemption and a little retribution) viable. But before one year i really don’t think it’s going to happen. Enjoy Glint guys!

Burtnik.5218:

FatRaKoon.1782:

Revs […] forced into only one traitline.

As soon they fix sword offhand and Jalis that wont be true anymore.

and mallyx. and ventari.

agree that glint is pretty much mandatory, because the other legends don’t really synergise well enough, and except for shiro, are a little weak.

revenants needs to be nerfed as they are sustainable as hell!
and thats coming from a main revenant player

scerevisiae.1972:

agree that glint is pretty much mandatory, because the other legends don’t really synergise well enough, and except for shiro, are a little weak.

I think about Glint in a different way. The overall synergy between legends is good assuming they work as intended. Glint kills the spirit of legends due to boon stacking. Just for example as Shiro youre not supposed to stay in fight too long. Jump in, do few quick strikes and jump ou. Swap to Jalis and go ahead in melee facetanking opponents. Thats how in theory it should work. In practice howered due to the amount of protection we can get+400 toughness from trait during IO we completely change how Shiro plays allowing him to facetank stuff as well. Thats just one example.

Rich Fuel.7253:

revenants needs to be nerfed as they are sustainable as hell!
and thats coming from a main revenant player

Theres two things that need to be gutten olny. Shield trait and Glint might stacking. Both should be in the same tier. Revenant sustain is actually a poop if you dont take damage during Glint heal.