Guild Wars 2

This is from a pvp perspective (Condi Bunker)

Problem:
ETD during BWE2 had a role which was to transfer condis. With that taken away it just applies torment. However you can apply the same amount of condition pressure without ever using this skill. Not giving ETD a defined role as an elite

Infact just by pressing UA and Banish Enchanment is way better then using this elite for most situations. UA will snare ppl with chill and apply torment, better then ETD because of the range. Banish Enchantment is God like when your 2 v 1ing tanky builds on point. You can just sit back and spam this skill to strip all their boons while your team member rekts them.

UA has Snare and Condi Application

BE has boon removal and Confusion Application

Both have much better range

while…

ETD just has torment on a VERY short range with the coast of -8 energy upkeep, but I can use that energy to apply better condition application with my other skills.

During BWE3 why would you ever use ETD then?

-Only for the extra cleave pressure when the other team is in downstate
- To proc Elite passives that are on a ICD (yay cause we all love passive traits with icd in this game) like Burning.
-For the stat boost but its a -8 energy upkeep, its hard to make use of the stat boost with that energy cost.
--————————————————————————————————

It needs something extra or a combination of stuff, suggestions.

1. Since we already do good condi pressure with our other utilities. Revert it back to the old function for the condi transfer. With the good condi pressure with using our utilties we can still work well with builds that cleanse condis often.

The condi transfer was the role of ETD in BWE2

2. Give it a Snare. The range on it is terrible and its hard to stick on to targets with its high energy upkeep. Using UA to chill people then ETD eats up way too much energy and in most cases not worth it when your being pressured.

3. Give it better Counter Pressure. Retal perhaps?

4. Allows you to use Range condi pressure. Every time you attack you apply a range condition on your target.

5. Healing. Gain passive Sustain depending on how many conditions you have on yourself.

Suggestions are from the top of my head, feel free to add to the list ^^;

I think it’s biggest issue is that it costs too much to have any real effect. The old EtD could be used for a few seconds and then it could do it’s job and be turned off quickly. This new one is designed to be camped in and it just doesn’t work well with Mallyx’s high cost utilities or even the semi-high cost of our off-hand weapons.

It needs to either be reverted or have a functionality change.
Maybe make it so it increases all current stacks of an opponent’s conditions by 1 per pulse or make it so it gives your opponent a debuff that doesn’t allow the opponent to cleanse(this especially would make Condi a bit more viable in sPvP, but might be too powerful) or make it so you Corrupt all of your own Boons(and Mallyx with Mace can naturally produce Might and Resistance, so it can sorta work) and then pulse those out.
Something that isn’t covered entirely by UA + BE.

While I agree Embrace the Darkness needs something to spice it up, Have you ever consider just how powerful that 10% Stat buff is?

That is not just power, it’s healing, health, armor, Condi Damage, Crit rate and damage…

Also, comparing one skill, even an Elite to Two skills working in concert is kinda unfair to the elite.

I remember a recommendation on here a while ago which was to make Mallyx less
Dependent on the condi stat itself and far more into condi manipulation or boon disruption. As every other legend (bar Ventari) is viable with near any stat combination, I feel this would put Mallyx in a Better place overall.

Embrace really needs a direction in its role and viability the rest of Mallyx to fall into place. Right now, because it lacks copies, Pain Absortion feels a bit too high risk, low reward, the confusion on the strip feels like a random add on, and the torment on UA just feels like more unnecessary torment.

It would be REALLY cool if they could make BE or Pain Absorption as a new utility somehow react to the torment stacks or boon+torment stacks. Maybe deal damage based on how much torment they have? That would be an awesomely unique burst mechanic that would reward high torment in general. X damage for each stack of torment.

Vergil.3970:

It would be REALLY cool if they could make BE or Pain Absorption as a new utility somehow react to the torment stacks or boon+torment stacks. Maybe deal damage based on how much torment they have? That would be an awesomely unique burst mechanic that would reward high torment in general. X damage for each stack of torment.

This is actually a really good idea, and is something that’s not really been done before. I mean maybe Fire Grab to some extent but…

Maybe it makes all existing Torment on an enemy tick as if that enemy was moving for a few seconds? And if they were already moving, then it doubles the tick rate for the duration of BE’s new effect?

I want FEAR.

Please?

Vergil.3970:

It would be REALLY cool if they could make BE or Pain Absorption as a new utility somehow react to the torment stacks or boon+torment stacks. Maybe deal damage based on how much torment they have? That would be an awesomely unique burst mechanic that would reward high torment in general. X damage for each stack of torment.

And now you would have a Necro Scepter issue, where you have a Power-based skill on a Condi-based set(it would also be really garbage in team fights where people cleanse our few conditions quickly).
Boon Stripping is good enough for any build to consider and the +10% stats will help out for DPS while UA can Chill them. The issue is that a Power Build probably wont use Mallyx because Shiro and Glint are just better built for it: more mobility, more boons, more CC, and actual stun-breakers.

A heavy class should have stealth (Mesmer, Light Armor; Thief, Medium Armor, Engineer, Medium Armor; Druid, Medium Armor; Heavy, none). This is the best place to put it and even fits the name already.

Embrace the Darkness
Summon the power of the legendary demon to transform into a powerful avatar unseen by the mortals of this plane.

1s cast time
5 energy initial cast
7-10? energy per second upkeep (no other upkeep allowed)
Stealth 1s
Interval 1s

Two ways to play this. Load up opponent with conditions, stealth to delay while conditions tick. Or if energy is available, an actual escape option for Revenant (there isn’t one of any substance right now). It’s far more balanced (read, weaker) than the other stealth options of other classes because it is much shorter duration interval and requires the use of a very limited to Revenant resource.

Support it. You know it’d be used then.

Sarif.1827:

While I agree Embrace the Darkness needs something to spice it up, Have you ever consider just how powerful that 10% Stat buff is?

That is not just power, it’s healing, health, armor, Condi Damage, Crit rate and damage…

Also, comparing one skill, even an Elite to Two skills working in concert is kinda unfair to the elite.

From what I have seen, the bonus is negligible. Damage, healing, and armor were all pretty much the same in pvp.

I think the elite can be compared to the mace auto attack alone lol. The mace auto attack applies torment twice as fast with only a two second shorter duration than etd; it also has physical damage, poison application, and no upkeep cost.

Hiki.9310:

Sarif.1827:

While I agree Embrace the Darkness needs something to spice it up, Have you ever consider just how powerful that 10% Stat buff is?

That is not just power, it’s healing, health, armor, Condi Damage, Crit rate and damage…

Also, comparing one skill, even an Elite to Two skills working in concert is kinda unfair to the elite.

From what I have seen, the bonus is negligible. Damage, healing, and armor were all pretty much the same in pvp.

I think the elite can be compared to the mace auto attack alone lol. The mace auto attack applies torment twice as fast with only a two second shorter duration than etd; it also has physical damage, poison application, and no upkeep cost.

The only reason to use it right now is the synergy with Diabolic Inferno. IMO, an Elite requiring a grandmaster trait to be better than a autoattack chain (although technically it is PBAoE) = not working as intended.

The other main issue with it is the upkeep energy cost is crazy expensive and the cast time doesn’t help either (stat increase is nice but bland inspiration compared to where it was before with copying conditions).

Another thought is maybe it can refresh/add more conditions stacks for pre-existing conditions already on target so it starts having synergy with other condition classes.

Malchior.5732:

Vergil.3970:

It would be REALLY cool if they could make BE or Pain Absorption as a new utility somehow react to the torment stacks or boon+torment stacks. Maybe deal damage based on how much torment they have? That would be an awesomely unique burst mechanic that would reward high torment in general. X damage for each stack of torment.

And now you would have a Necro Scepter issue, where you have a Power-based skill on a Condi-based set(it would also be really garbage in team fights where people cleanse our few conditions quickly).
Boon Stripping is good enough for any build to consider and the +10% stats will help out for DPS while UA can Chill them. The issue is that a Power Build probably wont use Mallyx because Shiro and Glint are just better built for it: more mobility, more boons, more CC, and actual stun-breakers.

I definitely agree it creates a weird situation. I generally agree that Mallyx should be less about condi application to give it more variety in roles and more about condi control, I just wouldn’t know how to go about it.

BE is great for the boon rip but then it would need a replacement to confusion. Absorb Pain is a great start but one boon strip causes it to be the biggest scuicidal button and the heal trait and the heal itself on Mallyx don’t offer enough benefit. Embrace the darkness is a mess and right now is just an overly expensive torment applicator. Unyielding Anguish is honestly fine with just the chill. The torment is a nice touch.

My interest in Mallyx has completely disappeared with the change. Now I could very easily run Shiro/Glint with mace/axe and be just as effective with running a condition build, if not moreso thanks to Impossible Odds.

Yes, the old Mallyx didn’t work well with allies that would cleanse conditions for you, but that’s a bit of a moot point when you think about the fact that it was designed as counterplay from the start. What do you do when you don’t need to resort to your counterplay? You just use the base skills you were planning on using from the beginning.

A single pulsing torment stack is simply not worth the upkeep, and Pain Absorption without the copy from the elite is completely pointless. Mallyx was already very niche as it was. Now there’s not really any sort of incentive to run with it at all.

Black Box.9312:

My interest in Mallyx has completely disappeared with the change. Now I could very easily run Shiro/Glint with mace/axe and be just as effective with running a condition build, if not moreso thanks to Impossible Odds.

Yes, the old Mallyx didn’t work well with allies that would cleanse conditions for you, but that’s a bit of a moot point when you think about the fact that it was designed as counterplay from the start. What do you do when you don’t need to resort to your counterplay? You just use the base skills you were planning on using from the beginning.

A single pulsing torment stack is simply not worth the upkeep, and Pain Absorption without the copy from the elite is completely pointless. Mallyx was already very niche as it was. Now there’s not really any sort of incentive to run with it at all.

The only real reason to run Mallyx anymore is Banish Enchantment because it just destroys Eles and other boon-reliant classes. The other skills are kinda lacking.

The Heal is more effective when you have no conditions…but I thought the whole point of it was to be strong when you got loaded up kinda like Consume Conditions without the cleanse, so why was this changed? It’s now weaker than before if you have 3 or more Condis.

Pain Absorption is nice to have when you’re condi-bombed, but a single boon strip will destroy you, especially in team fights. Actually, even without Boon Strip, some conditions last long enough that the Resistance isn’t enough even with Facet of Nature activated. It’s also very expensive.

Banish Enchantment is pretty good, but I don’t like how we lost 2 stacks of Confusion.

Unyielding Anguish is better at stacking conditions and has a decent Snare. I think it could use a range increase or a cost reduction though.

EtD is just not worth it. The only time I ever found it useful was when I knew for sure I was going to get CC-chained by a Chronomancer and he would just let the Torment tick through. Otherwise, even auto-attacking is better or you can just use UA to help stick to a target. Plenty of ideas to change it, but we really need Roy’s input.

Artaz.3819:

A heavy class should have stealth (Mesmer, Light Armor; Thief, Medium Armor, Engineer, Medium Armor; Druid, Medium Armor; Heavy, none). This is the best place to put it and even fits the name already.

Embrace the Darkness
Summon the power of the legendary demon to transform into a powerful avatar unseen by the mortals of this plane.

1s cast time
5 energy initial cast
7-10? energy per second upkeep (no other upkeep allowed)
Stealth 1s
Interval 1s

Two ways to play this. Load up opponent with conditions, stealth to delay while conditions tick. Or if energy is available, an actual escape option for Revenant (there isn’t one of any substance right now). It’s far more balanced (read, weaker) than the other stealth options of other classes because it is much shorter duration interval and requires the use of a very limited to Revenant resource.

Support it. You know it’d be used then.

Mallyx was not known for stealth. At all. In fact, he NEVER used stealth. Please don’t throw thematics out of the window just because you want to fill some stupid gap.

Artaz.3819:

A heavy class should have stealth (Mesmer, Light Armor; Thief, Medium Armor, Engineer, Medium Armor; Druid, Medium Armor; Heavy, none). This is the best place to put it and even fits the name already.

Embrace the Darkness
Summon the power of the legendary demon to transform into a powerful avatar unseen by the mortals of this plane.

1s cast time
5 energy initial cast
7-10? energy per second upkeep (no other upkeep allowed)
Stealth 1s
Interval 1s

Two ways to play this. Load up opponent with conditions, stealth to delay while conditions tick. Or if energy is available, an actual escape option for Revenant (there isn’t one of any substance right now). It’s far more balanced (read, weaker) than the other stealth options of other classes because it is much shorter duration interval and requires the use of a very limited to Revenant resource.

Support it. You know it’d be used then.

This is an amazing idea. And with the mallyx grandmaster trait you could even pulse burning while in stealth.

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

Artaz.3819:

A heavy class should have stealth (Mesmer, Light Armor; Thief, Medium Armor, Engineer, Medium Armor; Druid, Medium Armor; Heavy, none). This is the best place to put it and even fits the name already.

Embrace the Darkness
Summon the power of the legendary demon to transform into a powerful avatar unseen by the mortals of this plane.

1s cast time
5 energy initial cast
7-10? energy per second upkeep (no other upkeep allowed)
Stealth 1s
Interval 1s

Two ways to play this. Load up opponent with conditions, stealth to delay while conditions tick. Or if energy is available, an actual escape option for Revenant (there isn’t one of any substance right now). It’s far more balanced (read, weaker) than the other stealth options of other classes because it is much shorter duration interval and requires the use of a very limited to Revenant resource.

Support it. You know it’d be used then.

This is an amazing idea. And with the mallyx grandmaster trait you could even pulse burning while in stealth.

A little weird to give Mallyx stealth since you’re going to need to re-apply conditions often so this isn’t terribly useful in a fight(gonna be used solely to disengage) and EtD doesn’t pulse Burning at all. It only applies once until you deactivate EtD and then re-activate it after the ICD is over.

Agreed that Mallyx didn’t seem quite as appealing during BWE3. EtD needs some kind of tweak to make it worth the upkeep cost. The stats bonus is nice, but not nice enough to warrant the cost. Some ideas are below. I don’t want to imply all these should be added at once, but just some ideas that could be used piecemeal to make EtD worth it to use.

• Include stealth as suggested above
• Make Torment more damaging while in this avatar form as suggested above
• Transfer any conditions on the player to the target upon pulse
• Lower the upkeep cost

bwe3 kinda killed mallyx for me as well. I really want to like it. Was even dreaming of a gemstore Abaddon or margonite outfit as a cherry on top