Guild Wars 2

I just preordered the game and so I was wondering if it’s worth maining over guardian or warrior

I guess I was just wondering where do you think revenant will end up on the dps scale in comparison with everything else in terms of pve content.

Mid tier. Definitely not top nor bottom. Similar to an engi in that you can fill a fair amount of rolls but not all at once.

With icebow4 nerf though (and necro getting boosted with reaper etc) you have to keep in mind DPS tiers are a lot closer than they’ve ever been too…so its not really any good way to look at a class unless you are really into dungeon speedrun records.

Things will be shifting away from dungeons as the PvE go to as well. Fractals will be changing. Raids are coming. Really hard to say where revs will fall.

I think the general pug will see them as a replacement for a guard or war but not quite as good as either.

But stuff may change by live so who knows.

In a vacuum situation Rev’s are able to maintain high quantities of Might, Fury, and Vulnerability. They also have regular access to quickness, and their attacks do a great deal of raw damage. So I would say Revs are towards the top of the personal DPS chart if we’re looking at it isolated from everything else.

The numbers get a little iffy when validating against external factors such as banners, buffs, encouter variability (dodging, key skill usage, and such), hitboxes, etc. In that aspect they still remain fairly high tier.

Depending how you build very high. Downside though is going with one of the full out dps builds you have to at all times maintain fury, and if it drops you’ll see a huge decrease. I liked sword damage and hammer damage a lot overall though. Plus I can finally use a shield with sword on heavy armor class!

I believe someone calculated dps of rev to be on 19k pretty close to staff ele.

Something between warrior and guardian but closer to guardian i guess.

BlitzX.4039:

Something between warrior and guardian but closer to guardian i guess.

I compared to my guardian and crushed it kinda badly.

rev is top dps in PvE.

NoTrigger.8396:

rev is top dps in PvE.

But from what people write on forums at the moment about rev’s dps I guess numbers will be tuned down by like 20%(random number but maybe won’t happen) to keep it in mid-top dps tier.

Rev is top dps? you mean it beats ele and sinister engi? i doubt that.

i had 10k + autoattacks in the raid, 39k sword 3 and about 17.5k axe 4 (second hit). you can do like 2 autoattacks per second (without quickness). now think about the rift damage from the autoattack and the burning from the glint skill and add it on top.

DnT calculated like always the best PvE DPS which was a Shiro/Mallyx build (shiro for IO, Mallyx for EtD) and was comparable with staff ele and sinister condi.
This was before Glint. Dunno now.

Anyway, top tier. But it’s not sure that such build will be meta ;-)
If you want the graph i need to find it somewhere burried on reddit…lemme search

Gaaroth.2567:

DnT calculated like always the best PvE DPS which was a Shiro/Mallyx build (shiro for IO, Mallyx for EtD) and was comparable with staff ele and sinister condi.
This was before Glint. Dunno now.

Anyway, top tier. But it’s not sure that such build will be meta ;-)
If you want the graph i need to find it somewhere burried on reddit…lemme search

shiro mallyx is not the best anymore

Mightybird.6034:

Mid tier. Definitely not top nor bottom. Similar to an engi in that you can fill a fair amount of rolls but not all at once.

With icebow4 nerf though (and necro getting boosted with reaper etc) you have to keep in mind DPS tiers are a lot closer than they’ve ever been too…so its not really any good way to look at a class unless you are really into dungeon speedrun records.

Things will be shifting away from dungeons as the PvE go to as well. Fractals will be changing. Raids are coming. Really hard to say where revs will fall.

I think the general pug will see them as a replacement for a guard or war but not quite as good as either.

But stuff may change by live so who knows.

Not sure where you get your information from ,but Rev is definitely top tier atm. You think they took 3 Revs for the first Vale Guardian kill just for their buffs? If all they wanted was buffs they could’ve just brought Warrior/Ele. Not only is Revs damage extremely high ,but several of the buffing alternatives have poor means to deal with heavy movement in raids. Staff Ele and Warrior both lose DPS when forced to move. When the tank has to move the boss mid Hundred Blades there goes a solid 20k damage down the drain. The Rev on the other hand has no such handicap his damage is not nerfed by movement and can even move with the boss with UA for a free 7 might and 40k damage.

NoTrigger.8396:

shiro mallyx is not the best anymore

You said shiro/glint is also not the best in another thread. How about you give some explanations or suggestions on what is better instead of posting one liners all the time?

NoTrigger.8396:

Gaaroth.2567:

DnT calculated like always the best PvE DPS which was a Shiro/Mallyx build (shiro for IO, Mallyx for EtD) and was comparable with staff ele and sinister condi.
This was before Glint. Dunno now.

Anyway, top tier. But it’s not sure that such build will be meta ;-)
If you want the graph i need to find it somewhere burried on reddit…lemme search

shiro mallyx is not the best anymore

Can’t run the numbers but yeah sword with glint buffs seems to be superior (as i said the calc was before glint announce). Mallyx build used EtD but the mere 10% stat doesnt hold against fury with double effect and might

Mallyx never looked that great tbh, I like the Shiro+glint combo and that’s probably what i’d use

Mallyx looked great as an anti-condi build, but that was deemed too unfriendly to teams, sadly. I don’t really see a reason to run it at all anymore over Shiro/Glint, even on condi builds.

I was quite pleased with the Revs dps. It’s easily middle of the pack. My main is a thief but with the huge nerf to thief I most likely will play rev. The evasiveness of the rev was great on the legendary boss fights in beta. The huge weak point I noticed in the rev was lack of range which the thief has in the shortbow. But in a lot of hard fractal and raid bosses having a lack of ranged ability could drastically hurt the rev class on some fights. Course it will excel in some boss fights. Overall I have enjoyed the class while playing it in the beta.

Lack of Range?? We have a Hammer that hits like a truck, provides evasion, projectile control, and an AoE knockdown! Granted it’s best suited for Power based builds.

BlitzX.4039:

Something between warrior and guardian but closer to guardian i guess.

Warrior dps is only around 3rd~4th though. I believe it’s lower than Engi if he runs Phanlanx Strength build.

Also I do think Reaper will potentially outdamage Warrior too, making Warrior’s dps in the 5th position. Add Revenant in and it becomes 6th position.

Revenant’s dps is higher than Warrior’s Phanlanx Strength build (because GS actually has mediocre damage, if we use the situation of everyone having 25 mights and fury on them already)

savacli.8172:

Lack of Range?? We have a Hammer that hits like a truck, provides evasion, projectile control, and an AoE knockdown! Granted it’s best suited for Power based builds.

Yes, hammer damage has been buffed to the degree of outdamaging Ranger’s LB . (Ofc RF does higher burst damage, but consider RF has a CD of 10 secs while Rev’s hammer 2 has a CD of 2, hammer’s dps should outdamage LB. Ofc, this is excluding the factor of Quickdraw → RF combo)

Sword revenant is the highest direct (power based) damage in the game, and outperforms everything except a Sinister engineer played near-perfectly in long fights. Revenant has next to no ramp up time on its DPS and will outperform everything else by a wide margin. For dungeon speed clears, it seems obvious that the optimal group set-up is 4 revenants and a warrior; in a raid, if condition damage were not needed, 6-7 revenants would form the core of an efficient raid build.

There are no substitutes, they are that much better than everything else.

I would bet against it being changed before release – it has been the top DPS class ever since Herald was revealed, and since then it has only been tweaked upward. It seems that A.Net is planning on releasing the class in an overpowered state to hype up the xpack and get people on board the revenant train. In addition A.Net has been loathe to change anything for the sake of PvE balance (it took years to get a legitimate ice bow nerf); I would not bet on them moving quickly here.

Don’t forget Revenant provides buffs at 600 range. With raids requiring more movement, Ele/Warriors won’t be able to keep 5 players with 25 might and perma fury.

I’m wondering if we will even see much of ele’s in raids tbh

People used it as their primary source of direct damage (and break bar breaking with staff, though I want this gone to make room for Hammer) in the Raid beta. There wasn’t really time to put much thought into it then, but people had enough time to realize staff ele just didn’t work with that much movement and raid damage. A meta staff ele couldn’t even stand in the aoe’s you have to have people in because just the damage they received in it (not to mention if people DIDN’T stand in it) was faaaar too much for them to take, so one use they could have is completely gone, and JUST being good at damage isn’t enough to cut it anymore. A rev on the other hand doesn’t loose damage for equipping shield over sword, and maintains a huge amount of defensive utility without losing anything in the damage department. They also have a 1200 range high dps weapon that works reliably on a moving target and truly rivals the combination of Lava Font and Fire AA that makes Ele so powerful on a stationary target. Hammer is really quite similar to Ele Staff, except you can fit your second attack in once between every 2 AAs instead of every 3 like an Ele, you don’t have to aim it, and you don’t have to push 5 unless you see a break bar. All the while they’re giving you hella buffs without really losing any dps, while if an ele wanted to give you a bit of support they could, but they aren’t going to be doing any damage for 10 seconds and that support is much more limited.

Lauriewonnacott.9841:

People used it as their primary source of direct damage (and break bar breaking with staff, though I want this gone to make room for Hammer) in the Raid beta. There wasn’t really time to put much thought into it then, but people had enough time to realize staff ele just didn’t work with that much movement and raid damage. A meta staff ele couldn’t even stand in the aoe’s you have to have people in because just the damage they received in it (not to mention if people DIDN’T stand in it) was faaaar too much for them to take, so one use they could have is completely gone, and JUST being good at damage isn’t enough to cut it anymore. A rev on the other hand doesn’t loose damage for equipping shield over sword, and maintains a huge amount of defensive utility without losing anything in the damage department. They also have a 1200 range high dps weapon that works reliably on a moving target and truly rivals the combination of Lava Font and Fire AA that makes Ele so powerful on a stationary target. Hammer is really quite similar to Ele Staff, except you can fit your second attack in once between every 2 AAs instead of every 3 like an Ele, you don’t have to aim it, and you don’t have to push 5 unless you see a break bar. All the while they’re giving you hella buffs without really losing any dps, while if an ele wanted to give you a bit of support they could, but they aren’t going to be doing any damage for 10 seconds and that support is much more limited.

Back to scepter focus? I like that wep set
Anyway i repeat, power rev IS de facto top tier dps ;-)

Ensign.2189:

Sword revenant is the highest direct (power based) damage in the game, and outperforms everything except a Sinister engineer played near-perfectly in long fights. Revenant has next to no ramp up time on its DPS and will outperform everything else by a wide margin. For dungeon speed clears, it seems obvious that the optimal group set-up is 4 revenants and a warrior; in a raid, if condition damage were not needed, 6-7 revenants would form the core of an efficient raid build.

There are no substitutes, they are that much better than everything else.

I would bet against it being changed before release – it has been the top DPS class ever since Herald was revealed, and since then it has only been tweaked upward. It seems that A.Net is planning on releasing the class in an overpowered state to hype up the xpack and get people on board the revenant train. In addition A.Net has been loathe to change anything for the sake of PvE balance (it took years to get a legitimate ice bow nerf); I would not bet on them moving quickly here.

This is all true and the reason is Rev dps comes from 45% quickness uptime because of Shiro combined with the high sword damage coefficients – scrap the quickness and they’re mid tier.

The only thing to add here, that most people forget, is sword 1 usually only hits 1 target unless your enemies are stacked together. And sword 2 has really low dps compared to the rest of the chain. Only 3 hits 3 targets with a lot of force.

As such, versus multiple enemies, Rev dps will take a major hit. I think that’s one of the reason’s Rev have such high coefficients.

Lauriewonnacott.9841:

People used it as their primary source of direct damage (and break bar breaking with staff, though I want this gone to make room for Hammer) in the Raid beta. There wasn’t really time to put much thought into it then, but people had enough time to realize staff ele just didn’t work with that much movement and raid damage. A meta staff ele couldn’t even stand in the aoe’s you have to have people in because just the damage they received in it (not to mention if people DIDN’T stand in it) was faaaar too much for them to take, so one use they could have is completely gone, and JUST being good at damage isn’t enough to cut it anymore. A rev on the other hand doesn’t loose damage for equipping shield over sword, and maintains a huge amount of defensive utility without losing anything in the damage department. They also have a 1200 range high dps weapon that works reliably on a moving target and truly rivals the combination of Lava Font and Fire AA that makes Ele so powerful on a stationary target. Hammer is really quite similar to Ele Staff, except you can fit your second attack in once between every 2 AAs instead of every 3 like an Ele, you don’t have to aim it, and you don’t have to push 5 unless you see a break bar. All the while they’re giving you hella buffs without really losing any dps, while if an ele wanted to give you a bit of support they could, but they aren’t going to be doing any damage for 10 seconds and that support is much more limited.

Off hand axe, not sword if you were looking to maximise dps. And swapping the axe for the shield is a noticeable dps loss. I could get 18k crits with axe 4 which will probably be 5-10% dps loss over an 8 min fight.

I don;t think Rev’s will take a hammer as a second weapon set because the dps compared to a sword is much much lower. If you want a second set it’s staff for the break bars (unless they nerf that), otherwise it’s shield or sword depending on your playstyle.

Terra.8571:

This is all true and the reason is Rev dps comes from 45% quickness uptime because of Shiro combined with the high sword damage coefficients – scrap the quickness and they’re mid tier.

It’s closer to 50% – the 15% boon duration trait extends quickness as well. It may even make sense to take more boon duration since you have access to so much base quickness.

You’re right that without the quickness revenant DPS would merely be ‘very good’ (mostly because there are no other good ways to spend energy to get damage); the high quickness uptime is definitely what is pushing revenant DPS completely out of line with everything else though.

Terra.8571:

The only thing to add here, that most people forget, is sword 1 usually only hits 1 target unless your enemies are stacked together. And sword 2 has really low dps compared to the rest of the chain. Only 3 hits 3 targets with a lot of force.

The 2nd attack of the chain (which I think you’re talking about) actually hits quite hard, since the projectile hits both coming and going – it’s a total of 1.05 power ratio for a 0.75s animation, for a 1.4 ratio/second that puts it above every other attack chain in the game. Every single attack in the chain is crazy good, there are no holes.

Ensign.2189:

Sword revenant is the highest direct (power based) damage in the game, and outperforms everything except a Sinister engineer played near-perfectly in long fights. Revenant has next to no ramp up time on its DPS and will outperform everything else by a wide margin. For dungeon speed clears, it seems obvious that the optimal group set-up is 4 revenants and a warrior; in a raid, if condition damage were not needed, 6-7 revenants would form the core of an efficient raid build.

There are no substitutes, they are that much better than everything else.

I would bet against it being changed before release – it has been the top DPS class ever since Herald was revealed, and since then it has only been tweaked upward. It seems that A.Net is planning on releasing the class in an overpowered state to hype up the xpack and get people on board the revenant train. In addition A.Net has been loathe to change anything for the sake of PvE balance (it took years to get a legitimate ice bow nerf); I would not bet on them moving quickly here.

Watching your analysis made me almost laugh out about a guy who argued with me in another thread, saying:
“In all the teams that beat raid, there’s a Druid in it. Their healing is too OP”,
while I argued him back that:
“All those team that beat raids also have dps Revenant and Ele right?”
And he cried that:
“I don’t care, I want Ventari’s heal to be as OP as Druid’s (80% of effectiveness is what he said. He basically want Revenant to be able to easily replace Druid)”

So that guy really want a 10 Revenants team I guess…
What a joke.

Ensign.2189:

Terra.8571:

The only thing to add here, that most people forget, is sword 1 usually only hits 1 target unless your enemies are stacked together. And sword 2 has really low dps compared to the rest of the chain. Only 3 hits 3 targets with a lot of force.

The 2nd attack of the chain (which I think you’re talking about) actually hits quite hard, since the projectile hits both coming and going – it’s a total of 1.05 power ratio for a 0.75s animation, for a 1.4 ratio/second that puts it above every other attack chain in the game. Every single attack in the chain is crazy good, there are no holes.

Brutal Blade is being reworked to be a standard slash attack. So this could really go either way as far as how it affects the DPS, but it will likely cleave now, thankfully.

Black Box.9312:

Ensign.2189:

Terra.8571:

The only thing to add here, that most people forget, is sword 1 usually only hits 1 target unless your enemies are stacked together. And sword 2 has really low dps compared to the rest of the chain. Only 3 hits 3 targets with a lot of force.

The 2nd attack of the chain (which I think you’re talking about) actually hits quite hard, since the projectile hits both coming and going – it’s a total of 1.05 power ratio for a 0.75s animation, for a 1.4 ratio/second that puts it above every other attack chain in the game. Every single attack in the chain is crazy good, there are no holes.

Brutal Blade is being reworked to be a standard slash attack. So this could really go either way as far as how it affects the DPS, but it will likely cleave now, thankfully.

I do think Revenant DPS needs to be toned down a bit. Or at least needing the player to perform a more complex rotation to achieve that DPS.

A heavy armour class which can achieve highest DPS by basically just spamming the autoattack seems a bit wrong to me.

Xae Isareth.1364:

I do think Revenant DPS needs to be toned down a bit. Or at least needing the player to perform a more complex rotation to achieve that DPS.

A heavy armour class which can achieve highest DPS by basically just spamming the autoattack seems a bit wrong to me.

you cant achieve the highest dps just by spamming autoattack, not even close.
and rev is balanced around the energy. you can either support alot and spam autoattack, but you wont deal top dps, or you can use your energy to achieve top dps but you wont be able to support really well.

honestly, both of those options seem fun though

Definitely top tier.