Guild Wars 2

Its Nerfing Time.1495:

Whether you like it or not, their opinions don’t matter anymore than yours does. Why? Simple – it doesn’t matter how fast you run something. Can you kill a boss? Yes? Then it’s irrelevant if a different group does it differently or faster.

Contrary to your statements, their ‘opinions’ actually do matter. And at this point due to the amount of testing and proof they have qt metas are basically facts. Your lackadaisical approach to pve is why so many people are giving you flak. Why do something less efficiently when there is a more efficient way to do it? It’s like a manufacturing company refusing to implement and adopt state of the art technology that all of its competitors are using to make stuff faster- “Can I make stuff? Yes? Then it’s irrelevant if my competitors make things faster and I make things slower.”

To the vast majority of pve players, qt metas are basically the bible. Go stand in any zone and ask in map chat what the best build for a class is. Everyone is going to tell you to go check out qt’s website. It doesn’t matter if YOU think revs are good. Your wishful thinking isn’t going to break the meta. You are giving OP bad information just based on your personal bias, because once OP hits end game pve content such as t4 fractals, he WILL get flak a lot for being on a class that a lot of people deem as not good.

Daedraz.1650:

Its Nerfing Time.1495:

Whether you like it or not, their opinions don’t matter anymore than yours does. Why? Simple – it doesn’t matter how fast you run something. Can you kill a boss? Yes? Then it’s irrelevant if a different group does it differently or faster.

Contrary to your statements, their ‘opinions’ actually do matter. And at this point due to the amount of testing and proof they have qt metas are basically facts. Your lackadaisical approach to pve is why so many people are giving you flak. Why do something less efficiently when there is a more efficient way to do it? It’s like a manufacturing company refusing to implement and adopt state of the art technology that all of its competitors are using to make stuff faster- “Can I make stuff? Yes? Then it’s irrelevant if my competitors make things faster and I make things slower.”

To the vast majority of pve players, qt metas are basically the bible. Go stand in any zone and ask in map chat what the best build for a class is. Everyone is going to tell you to go check out qt’s website. It doesn’t matter if YOU think revs are good. Your wishful thinking isn’t going to break the meta. You are giving OP bad information just based on your personal bias, because once OP hits end game pve content such as t4 fractals, he WILL get flak a lot for being on a class that a lot of people deem as not good.

No, opinion is never fact. As it stands on their own word, they actually state this. They state not to take what they do as a standard and only abide by it. Of course, if you bothered reading past the spreadsheets, you’d know this.

There is nothing lackadaisical to my approach – I appear to be one of the few actually bothering to do something with a class so many write off because of their own bias and inability to think. I get flack because many of you simply cannot handle being proven wrong about your own biased opinions.

There is nothing wrong with not running meta-speedrun-spreadsheet approach. You are not an e-sports pro gamer, very few here are and it doesn’t matter if we do not kill something at the same speed. This is something you’re going to have to accept and get over. PVE content – does not matter if somebody kills something 5 minutes faster.

To “the vast majority” – you mean total majority of spreadsheet warriors which is not the vast majority of PVE players. It might be in the circles you run in, but that is not the community as a whole. I’ve watched people ask for best builds, do you know what the most popular website is? It’s not QT – it’s metabattle (which is just as bad mind you).

I gave the OP actually useful, good information. I told him to ignore everything people like you say, and actually try things out. Not to accept your biased opinions no matter what because you can’t look past a spreadsheet or PVP.

If people give him flack for what he uses, they are not good enough. They are the problem, not him nor his choice.

It doesn’t matter if YOU or any spreadsheet warrior hates the Rev or thinks it’s bad because QT/meta says so. Your opinions are irrelevant.

Metas are facts when they are backed up by extensive testing, numbers, and hard evidence such as recorded footage. Not sure what part of that you’re having a tough time understanding. I don’t think I can explain that in any plainer way. If you think that quantitative analytics based on extensive testing against training golems = biased opinions… Boy, that is some climate change denial level of reasoning right there. You should go work for Oklahoma Senator Jim Inhofe. I’m sure he’d be glad to have someone like you on his staff.

Whether killing something 5 minutes quicker or slower is a problem or not is not up to you. The meta dictates that efficiency is the name of the game. “B-b-but most people don’t care about metas!” Surely this must be some kind of joke. Ever since the game came out, the meta has always been kill things asap. Even during dungeon eras there was the full zerk meta- if you didn’t ping full zerk on join then you were kicked from a lot of groups. During the pre-raid fractals era the meta was full zerk. I thought you were just really misinformed, but clearly you have no idea what you are talking about at all.

And no you’re not giving OP good info at all. “No no no just ignore everyone. You are perfect the way you are. Everyone is wrong.” What is this, some kind of fat acceptance club?

Daedraz.1650:

Metas are facts when they are backed up by extensive testing, numbers, and hard evidence such as recorded footage.

… that aren’t relevant to Solo PVE or fractals outside of engineered team compositions; the things the OP was asking about.

I can’t stand to watch people abuse others with meta for elements of the game where it’s completely irrelevant. If the OP was asking if Rev’s were any good for optimized Raids compositions, then SURE … spouting meta rhetoric to say Rev isn’t that good there would be met with no problem. That’s not the case here.

And just to be clear on the history … metas were NOT extensively tested at all; it was some dude estimating damage in a spreadsheet, then claiming that the spreadsheet was some ultimate approach in calculating ingame damage … completely ignoring the fact that ingame damage was a measurable quantity.

Daedraz.1650:

Metas are facts when they are backed up by extensive testing, numbers, and hard evidence such as recorded footage. Not sure what part of that you’re having a tough time understanding. I don’t think I can explain that in any plainer way. If you think that quantitative analytics based on extensive testing against training golems = biased opinions… Boy, that is some climate change denial level of reasoning right there. You should go work for Oklahoma Senator Jim Inhofe. I’m sure he’d be glad to have someone like you on his staff.

Whether killing something 5 minutes quicker or slower is a problem or not is not up to you. The meta dictates that efficiency is the name of the game. “B-b-but most people don’t care about metas!” Surely this must be some kind of joke. Ever since the game came out, the meta has always been kill things asap. Even during dungeon eras there was the full zerk meta- if you didn’t ping full zerk on join then you were kicked from a lot of groups. During the pre-raid fractals era the meta was full zerk. I thought you were just really misinformed, but clearly you have no idea what you are talking about at all.

And no you’re not giving OP good info at all. “No no no just ignore everyone. You are perfect the way you are. Everyone is wrong.” What is this, some kind of fat acceptance club?

No boy, metas exist when somebody figures out the fastest way to do something, and every spreadsheet warrior jumps on the bandwagon – this is whats happened here.

You seem to be misunderstanding here. QTs opinion and your opinions are irrelevant for the simple reason of this – it does not matter how fast you do something in PVE if there is no hard-wipe failure condition. Even then, still doesn’t matter as much if you’re good enough.
Your own hatred for anything Rev, and anything non-spreadsheet related shows quite heavy. If QT said bark, you’d start barking pretty hard and fast. Their testing in a controlled environment is fine, and they test hard – nothing wrong there. The problem comes, when people take that (like you) and say “nothing else matters but this”, “everything else is wrong”. That boy, is the problem. Your attitude.

As stated before QT have said themselves “don’t just take what we do at face value at bible truth”.

Killing 5 minutes slow/fast is not up to you either. Spreadsheet warriors looking for meta like you, don’t either. Anybody who is like that, is not worth playing with because the moment something new crops up – you are no good. You can’t think beyond what the spreadsheet says. Hell had QT not shown the “meta speedrun” or “fastest way” to kill raid bosses, people like you would never be able to do raids at all.

Only those obsessed with speed running care about the meta. Surround yourself with enough like-minded people and you get confirmation bias. This is what you have. Not everybody cares about the meta – people just want the rewards, to have fun, to get something done, to enjoy the game and the journey.

I was there for the full zerk meta, I laughed at anybody who whined for full zerk because they were incapable of doing anything else, assuming and insisting it was the best yet always on the floor.

Fractals were full zerk? Now you have to be trolling. Conditions > Zerk simply because of the armour (toughness) ignore that they had. Shows the limits of your knowledge entirely.

I’ll sum this up with what Obtena has been pointing out. OP wanted to know for solo PVE. Not Raids, not Fractals or PVP. Solo PVE. Your opinion and that of QT is irrelevant. Learn to deal with it.

Obtena.7952:

Daedraz.1650:

Metas are facts when they are backed up by extensive testing, numbers, and hard evidence such as recorded footage.

… that aren’t relevant to Solo PVE or fractals outside of engineered team compositions; the things the OP was asking about.

I can’t stand to watch people abuse others with meta for elements of the game where it’s completely irrelevant. If the OP was asking if Rev’s were any good for Raids or optimized teams for fractals, then SURE … spouting meta rhetoric to say Rev isn’t that good there would be met with no problem. That’s not the case here.

No one is denying rev can be used for solo pve. You can use anything for solo pve. And as mentioned, if he just wants to do tier 1 and 2 fractals until the end of time then sure he can roll with a rev. No one cares at that level of fractals. You could probably run a rev in t3 as well. Once you get to t4 is when pug groups really start adhering to metas. Of course, not ALL t4 parties are gonna follow a meta party comp, but a LOT of them will. Most t4 parties you see on lfg aren’t running for fun. Fractals has been out for years and at this point, people just run it for dailies. This means that people gravitate towards meta builds and party comps so they can breeze through dailies and get their rewards. Really getting confused where you people are getting the “metas don’t matter for t4 fractals” rhetoric from. Most pugs I run with are not only using meta builds and party comps, but are also running dps meters. I’m simply disputing anyone who says revenant is a good class, because that is just flat out wrong. You guys are giving OP bad advice based on personal bias. My sentiment is clearly shared by the majority, as evident in this thread and numerous other threads in the revenant section of the forums. Protip: when you think something and the majority tells you otherwise, there usually is merit to what the majority is saying.

@Nerfing OP clearly says solo pve AND fractals. Jesus you can’t even read son. Pre-raid fractal meta was zerk because viper gear, or for that matter any gear with expertise traits, did not exist back then. Even with the condition system revamp, zerk builds were pulling ahead. It was only after the introduction of heart of thorns where condition builds started becoming more prevalent. This is a telltale sign that you really have no idea what you are talking about.

I honestly do not see the problem with following qt metas. If someone wants to dump a whole lot of hours into finding a much more efficient way of doing things, I have absolutely no qualms about following their advice. It makes runs go quicker. Refusing that and insisting on doing things in an inefficient way does nothing but make runs go slower. I mean, if you like inefficiency, then that’s a you thing. Do what you want on your own time. But don’t go around trying to convince people that there is no point in doing things more efficiently. “Guys.. Guys… I know there’s this thing called the chainsaw, but that is irrelevant and just too mainstream. A real independent thinking man chops down wood with his trusty hatchet.”

At this point I’m convinced that you were that one guy who always kept on trying to join dungeon parties on a rampager staff necro and got angry with metas because you kept on getting kicked from groups.

Unfortunately for you son, whether you like it or not, metas are everywhere. And they’re here to say. You have metas on EVERY mmo game. You just can’t avoid them. Gw2 in particular is VERY meta heavy. And most of us people here who actually know what they are talking about don’t want to see OP investing time into a character that is considered ineffective in the current meta. Times change and metas come and go. Deal with it.

Daedraz.1650:

Obtena.7952:

Daedraz.1650:

Metas are facts when they are backed up by extensive testing, numbers, and hard evidence such as recorded footage.

… that aren’t relevant to Solo PVE or fractals outside of engineered team compositions; the things the OP was asking about.

I can’t stand to watch people abuse others with meta for elements of the game where it’s completely irrelevant. If the OP was asking if Rev’s were any good for Raids or optimized teams for fractals, then SURE … spouting meta rhetoric to say Rev isn’t that good there would be met with no problem. That’s not the case here.

No one is denying rev can be used for solo pve. You can use anything for solo pve. And as mentioned, if he just wants to do tier 1 and 2 fractals until the end of time then sure he can roll with a rev. No one cares at that level of fractals. You could probably run a rev in t3 as well. Once you get to t4 is when pug groups really start adhering to metas. Of course, not ALL t4 parties are gonna follow a meta party comp, but a LOT of them will. Most t4 parties you see on lfg aren’t running for fun. Fractals has been out for years and at this point, people just run it for dailies. This means that people gravitate towards meta builds and party comps so they can breeze through dailies and get their rewards. Really getting confused where you people are getting the “metas don’t matter for t4 fractals” rhetoric from. Most pugs I run with are not only using meta builds and party comps, but are also running dps meters. I’m simply disputing anyone who says revenant is a good class, because that is just flat out wrong. You guys are giving OP bad advice based on personal bias. My sentiment is clearly shared by the majority, as evident in this thread and numerous other threads in the revenant section of the forums. Protip: when you think something and the majority tells you otherwise, there usually is merit to what the majority is saying.

The “pugs” you’re running with are just exactly the same as you, because they’re the type you go running with.
You dispute saying Rev is good with opinion, because you like others cannot think past a spreadsheet to save your life. The “majority” of the forum are spreadsheet warriors thus confirmation bias. In actual fact, your opinions are irrelevant.
The argument from majority is also irrelevant, it doesn’t matter how many of you spreadsheet warriors bleat the same sheep tone – Rev is actually a good class, you people are the problem.

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Daedraz.1650:

@Nerfing OP clearly says solo pve AND fractals. Jesus you can’t even read son. Pre-raid fractal meta was zerk because viper gear, or for that matter any gear with expertise traits, did not exist back then. Even with the condition system revamp, zerk builds were pulling ahead. It was only after the introduction of heart of thorns where condition builds started becoming more prevalent. This is a telltale sign that you really have no idea what you are talking about.

I honestly do not see the problem with following qt metas. If someone wants to dump a whole lot of hours into finding a much more efficient way of doing things, I have absolutely no qualms about following their advice. It makes runs go quicker. Refusing that and insisting on doing things in an inefficient way does nothing but make runs go slower. I mean, if you like inefficiency, then that’s a you thing. Do what you want on your own time. But don’t go around trying to convince people that there is no point in doing things more efficiently. “Guys.. Guys… I know there’s this thing called the chainsaw, but that is irrelevant and just too mainstream. A real independent thinking man chops down wood with his trusty hatchet.”

At this point I’m convinced that you were that one guy who always kept on trying to join dungeon parties on a rampager staff necro and got angry with metas because you kept on getting kicked from groups.

Unfortunately for you son, whether you like it or not, metas are everywhere. And they’re here to say. You have metas on EVERY mmo game. You just can’t avoid them. Gw2 in particular is VERY meta heavy. And most of us people here who actually know what they are talking about don’t want to see OP investing time into a character that is considered ineffective in the current meta. Times change and metas come and go. Deal with it.

Sounds like you can’t read if you’re bleating on and on about raids. He said he does fractals, not asking how Rev DOES at fractals. It can be seen either way but regardless, Rev is great at both.

Pre-HoT Fractals were still run with Condi gear, Vipers didn’t exist true but that didn’t stop Condi domination because of the aforementioned toughness ignore. Did you even play Fractals back then? It’s looking more and more likely like you’re just talking straight up BS.

You don’t see the problem of being an unthinking sheep following what somebody else says. That’s fine, you do that – but do not then foist that opinion on others saying “this is right and everything else is wrong”. You are looking for speedruns, not everybody else is – this is something you should recognize and realise.

There is nothing remotely inefficient about taking a Rev if the player knows what they are doing – this goes for any class. Note I say class and not build. Nice try with the chainsaw thing, but no, that’s not how it works kid. Revs are no less efficient than any other class.

If you bothered reading other posts I made, I’ve made it clear I mained Guardian pre-HoT, so again by all means continue to look dumb.

Whether you like it or not boy, meta’s are irrelevant unless you want a meta group. I suggest you learn to deal with it and learn opinions are irrelevant. I don’t care how much it irritates you, you need to deal with it.

The majority of you here don’t want to see somebody enjoy and have success on a class you write off because you don’t want to look past a spreadsheet, based on somebody elses opinion.

Deal with it, Revs are fine.

I only mentioned pre-raid era fractals. Never made any mention about the suitability of a rev in a raid or whatever. Did I trigger you so hard that you’re starting to see things that aren’t there? It is true about the toughness ignore, but because condi specs couldn’t really stack enough conditions to the point where they’d be dealing competitive amounts of dmg, most players ran zerk builds. But then again I am not surprised since efficiency is clearly not a priority for you. As that Arthur Dent guy mentioned, this is an indicator of how inept the people you’ve been playing with are.

Ah the good old “unthinking sheeple” argument. Stay redpilled m’friend and may your fedora tip on forever. The majority of us don’t want OP wasting his time on a lackluster class simply because you just happen to really like it. You can prattle on about how good rev is, but at the end of the day OP will see that the majority of people are saying revs are lackluster and you desperately trying to defend revs because you main it. I’m sure OP won’t have trouble making the right decision.

Contrary to your statement, I am not bothered nor irritated by what you are saying at all. As is the case with most people here, I stopped taking you seriously the moment you said metas are irrelevant. At this point I am only replying to you because I don’t want to see OP invest time and money on a class that frankly needs a huge fix/fundamental rework. You’re the one who is giving OP inaccurate information because you have severe tunnel vision.

Holy kitten this joke

Daedraz.1650:

I only mentioned pre-raid era fractals. Never made any mention about the suitability of a rev in a raid or whatever. Did I trigger you so hard that you’re starting to see things that aren’t there? It is true about the toughness ignore, but because condi specs couldn’t really stack enough conditions to the point where they’d be dealing competitive amounts of dmg, most players ran zerk builds. But then again I am not surprised since efficiency is clearly not a priority for you. As that Arthur Dent guy mentioned, this is an indicator of how inept the people you’ve been playing with are.

Ah the good old “unthinking sheeple” argument. Stay redpilled m’friend and may your fedora tip on forever. The majority of us don’t want OP wasting his time on a lackluster class simply because you just happen to really like it. You can prattle on about how good rev is, but at the end of the day OP will see that the majority of people are saying revs are lackluster and you desperately trying to defend revs because you main it. I’m sure OP won’t have trouble making the right decision.

Contrary to your statement, I am not bothered nor irritated by what you are saying at all. As is the case with most people here, I stopped taking you seriously the moment you said metas are irrelevant. At this point I am only replying to you because I don’t want to see OP invest time and money on a class that frankly needs a huge fix/fundamental rework. You’re the one who is giving OP inaccurate information because you have severe tunnel vision.

Nice try kid, but it’s in your own posts. You’ve made plenty of them stating Rev isn’t worth it anywhere. The only one being triggered here is you, because you’re being called exactly what you are – a spreadsheet warrior blindly following what somebody else says is viable.

Condi builds could easily stack the damage high enough, in fact condi damage was toned down somewhere just after Scarlett, or just before her final battle.

There’s nothing inept about the people I play with, we just don’t require spreadsheet sheep in our teams because they’re nothing but dead weight. Inability to think or adapt in a fight, expecting things to go one way or else. Dead. Weight.

The majority argument has already been debunked kid, and as shown repeatedly your arguments are no more than failed opinions because you can’t handle anyone proving the Rev is a great choice.
By all means, run with your tail between your legs after not being able to stand being called out on your BS.

There is nothing about the Rev that requires a fundamental rework. Some things could change yes, not fundamental however. You are simply replying because somebody is actually telling the OP Rev is good, which you can’t handle. That is why you reply.

I gave the OP actually useful information, and told him to test it out for himself. Not rely on opinion and spreadsheet sheep telling him otherwise.

Daedraz.1650:

Obtena.7952:

Daedraz.1650:

Metas are facts when they are backed up by extensive testing, numbers, and hard evidence such as recorded footage.

… that aren’t relevant to Solo PVE or fractals outside of engineered team compositions; the things the OP was asking about.

I can’t stand to watch people abuse others with meta for elements of the game where it’s completely irrelevant. If the OP was asking if Rev’s were any good for Raids or optimized teams for fractals, then SURE … spouting meta rhetoric to say Rev isn’t that good there would be met with no problem. That’s not the case here.

No one is denying rev can be used for solo pve. You can use anything for solo pve.

Again, that’s not what the OP is asking for … I can also use anything for dungeons, fractals, raids, etc…. but I don’t see anyone providing that advice to players either. I get that many people have contempt for anyone that wants to talk about OW because it’s trivial, but make no mistake, I can STILL optimize a build for it, just like anything else. That’s valuable information. If you are of the opinion that Revenant isn’t good for OW content, I doubt you have put any thought into to beyond someone handing you the meta build … See how that works?

Why is it a problem to simply provide a knowledgeable information related to the ask? I mean, meta should have never even come up based on what the OP wanted to know. If you don’t know if Rev is good in OW content … why are you posting other than to garner more “Rev hate cred” in the hopes devs tune in? Not happening.

Apart from all these arguments, dear OP, as a semi noob rev I can confirm that solo pve is way better than my other solo experiences. With Jalis and Glint you can lay back and just auto attack everything to tag. It is fun, really. And if you find yourself a friend or two, they would be glad to have you in their team. You can duo temple of balthazar in auric basin (it was hell for me but we did it, and I really suck at pve. Not joking, my biggest accomplishment was defeating lvl 1 molten brothers with solo elementalist)

So if you like it, learn it and play it. But remember that revenant, no matter how good in pve, is an unfinished profession. It has bugs, problems and it will make you furious from time to time. Dragon symbol is helluva cool though

@Nerfing This right here is the quintessential anthology of every scrub quote ever. Yea no wonder your t4 parties need lots of thinking or adapting when things go wrong- very inept players. That much has been evident from the moment you said it makes no difference if a fight lasts 5 minutes longer, seeing how competent groups complete most t4 fractals in under the 10 minute mark with some of them only taking 5 minutes. Competent groups melt bosses so fast even in t4 that fights never last long enough/go wrong to the point where you need to adapt or change strategies.

And my argument has been debunked because…. You said so? Are we regressing into elementary school logic now? I mean I get you’re salty, but come on man. I haven’t seen a single shred of evidence from you backing your claims- all I’ve seen is salty rants and tears. I don’t need to be able to ‘handle’ anything you say, because I don’t care at all. After having played rev, and witnessed first hand how mediocre it is, my mind is made, along with those of the majority of people telling OP rev is bad. Anything you say is coming through one ear, and straight out the other. Good luck convincing OP.

Obtena.7952:

Daedraz.1650:

Obtena.7952:

Daedraz.1650:

Metas are facts when they are backed up by extensive testing, numbers, and hard evidence such as recorded footage.

… that aren’t relevant to Solo PVE or fractals outside of engineered team compositions; the things the OP was asking about.

I can’t stand to watch people abuse others with meta for elements of the game where it’s completely irrelevant. If the OP was asking if Rev’s were any good for Raids or optimized teams for fractals, then SURE … spouting meta rhetoric to say Rev isn’t that good there would be met with no problem. That’s not the case here.

No one is denying rev can be used for solo pve. You can use anything for solo pve.

Again, that’s not what the OP is asking for … I can also use anything for dungeons, fractals, raids, etc…. but I don’t see anyone providing that advice to players either. I get that many people have contempt for anyone that wants to talk about OW because it’s trivial, but make no mistake, I can STILL optimize a build for it, just like anything else. That’s valuable information. If you are of the opinion that Revenant isn’t good for OW content, I doubt you have put any thought into to beyond someone handing you the meta build … See how that works?

Why is it a problem to simply provide a knowledgeable information related to the ask? I mean, meta should have never even come up based on what the OP wanted to know. If you don’t know if Rev is good in OW content … why are you posting other than to garner more “Rev hate cred” in the hopes devs tune in? Not happening.

Because sooner or later, one way or other, when OP has sunk enough hours into the game, he will move on from low and mid tier fractals into high tier fractals. He can play a rev if he wants, but he will have a lot of snarky players giving him crap. And I am also assuming he will have to pug at some point- if he has a static premade with guildies or friends all the time, then great. But if OP is ever going to pug t4 fractals, it is inevitable that he will come across people who will give him flak. Elitism is not only prevalent in raids, but also in t4 fractals. That has gotten worse since the devs greenlit the usage of dps meters. Don’t get me wrong. I don’t ‘hate’ revs. When I get revs in my t4s or raids, I don’t say anything to them, because I know 26K dps is good enough for t4. But that’s not what the meta obsessed wider pve population thinks. This is undeniable because you NEVER see this kind of grumbling towards any other class in any of the sub-forums or in game. I think its unfair that revs are considered mediocre classes and I want to see them reworked so they are genuinely desirable in every form of pve. I had a lot of fun with mine when i used to main it, but that fun quickly goes away if every 3rd fractal group you join asks you to switch to a “more useful class.” That crap led to me deleting my rev. The fact of the matter is, in their current state, sure they may not be as god awful as a lot of people make them out to be, but there is a general consensus that there are better class picks than rev at the moment. It is genuinely bad advice to tell OP that everything is perfectly fine with rev and all is dandy. He NEEDS to know what is up with the class.

So you’re making the decision to lie to him about how good REv is in OW PVE and non-engineered fractal teams to shelter him from the negative opinions he will experience in the future from meta pushers in high end fractals … that’s awesome. Pretty sure people don’t want to be lied to just because other people think they are delicate snowflakes. Personally, I don’t believe that’s your motive but whatever.

I mean, the OP didn’t ask you what classes were better than Rev for content he didn’t ask about. He was pretty specific. I get you have an axe to grind because you felt you wasted your time with Rev … but I think that’s dirty play to to answer someone falsely because of it. I would like to think at a minimum, being honest when answering people’s questions is simply a given.

Revenant is very good for OW PVE; the only element they really suffer from is easy fight closure so they aren’t saddled with longterm conditions slowing them down. Otherwise, they have great damage, the RS buff and the good opening moves needed for OW goodness.

There is nothing wrong with letting him know ’what’s up’ with the class, but lying to him about how Revs perform in OW PVE isn’t the way to do it now is it?

Obtena.7952:

So you’re making the decision to lie to him about how good REv is in OW PVE and non-engineered fractal teams to shelter him from the negative opinions he will experience in the future from meta pushers in high end fractals … that’s awesome. Pretty sure people don’t want to be lied to just because other people think they are delicate snowflakes. Personally, I don’t believe that’s your motive but whatever.

I mean, the OP didn’t ask you what classes were better than Rev for content he didn’t ask about. He was pretty specific. I get you have an axe to grind because you felt you wasted your time with Rev … but I think that’s dirty play to to answer someone falsely because of it. I would like to think at a minimum, being honest when answering people’s questions is simply a given.

Revenant is very good for OW PVE; the only element they really suffer from is easy fight closure so they aren’t saddled with longterm conditions slowing them down. Otherwise, they have great damage, the RS buff and the good opening moves needed for OW goodness.

OP asked how are revs, because he noticed people saying a lot of negative things about it on forums. He’s clearly read these threads and has a general idea of what state rev is in, but wants some more clarity.

And don’t think I’m lying at all. Not sure how else I can rephrase that anything works/is good in OW. He can play whatever he wants to in OW. Nobody cares since OW is largely solo or a massive zergfest. If rev works for OP, then go ahead by all means. But the problem is when he dips into t3 and higher fractals. The casual atmosphere of t1 and 2 disappears since now you’re dealing with multiple instabilities and things generally hit harder. When things get serious/harder, people like to bring in metas. Even in non-engineered teams there will always be 1 PS warrior because of might and banners. And since revs are generally perceived as being buff bots, groups will rather prefer a hard hitting dps instead of having both a PS and rev in the group. And this is the part where I DO agree with Nerfing. I follow metas because I’ve done extensive testing against golems and concluded that the qt metas are indeed a way more efficient way of playing a class/spec. I personally don’t mind doing t4s or raids with revs. But a lot of people follow these metas very blindly/zealously and WILL give rev players crap because surprise, people you meet on the internet are not always nice people. I have never said revs are such a horrible class where you can’t get anything done. Multiple times, I have said that they aren’t as bad as people make them out to be, but they definitely aren’t as good as some of the top pve class/spec choices that are generally in much higher demand. And that is what I want OP to know 100% before he decides to go off and invest time and gold on building up a rev. It would be a blatant lie to tell him that all in the world is good and dandy with revs. Just take a look at the subforum for revs. Do you ever see that kind of grumbling in any other class subforum?

Yes, and you aren’t being truthful here because Rev performance in solo PVE and non-engineered team environments is pretty good; ‘Anything works’ in OW PVE is not a sensible answer to the question of how Revs perform there, so I don’t get why you keep saying it like it closes the question. It’s a nonsense answer. I’m not saying it’s not true, it’s simply not answering the question and I think you’re doing it to skirt the question. Why? because acknowledging Rev is good at something isn’t part of the Rev hate agenda.

I get that’s it’s better for you to complain about Revs if you don’t care to acknowledge where they are good, but that’s not an honest or objective approach to what the OP is asking. I guess you just conveniently decided to not mention those areas so you could complain about Revs performance ranking in optimized team play.

I have not mentioned how revs do in OW because I just don’t care about OW. I haven’t said they’re bad at OW either. I am focusing on the part of OP’s question where he asks how revs are for fractals. I keep on saying “anything works” because saying rev, for that matter any class, is good at OW is such a blanket statement. Everyone has different standards for what is good or not when it comes to OW because the nature of OW content is not as one dimensional as fractals or for that matter raids. In fractals, people just want dps because your group has a singular objective- kill things. The same cannot be said for OW. Some people want mobility to get from point A to B quicker; some people want survivability; some people just want raw damage to kill things faster; some people want lots of condi cleanses to get rid of mobility impeding conditions. This is why there are no meta builds for OW. There are a lot of ways to spec any class to fit your OW world needs. I honestly don’t see why you are so hung up on this.

If you want to be pedantic, sure. I do agree there are things that rev can do well when it comes to open world. Mobility is sure one of them. I imagine guardian players would kill to get perma swiftness. They’re definitely not super squishy like elementalists and won’t get 3 shotted by pocket raptors. When you run into a group of people doing OW events, you can buff them. Aside OW, revs are amazing in wvw. There are few things scarier than a bunch of revs running after you and having a bunch of revs in a zerg amplies its strength so much. But OP is also asking how good revs are in fractals. And it is a flat out lie to tell him that he’ll always be welcome in all high tier fractal parties. A lot of times people won’t mind. But a lot of times, OP will run into people who will tell him to switch classes because they already have a PS warrior in the group and need a class like elementalist that can outdps a rev by 2 times. I personally don’t mind at all. I’ve seen videos of revs soloing fractal 100 CM so I know for a fact that they can get stuff done just as well as any other class. But a lot of other people don’t want revs in their parties simply because qt said they’re bad. If you don’t think this ever happens then you are disconnected with reality. I’m not trying to antagonize you, but that is the plainest way I can describe it as. OP will never ever have a problem like that if he decides to roll a guardian. Everyone loves guards in pve. The same can’t be said for revs.

Herald main (atm) here.

Rev is OK for solo world pve/dungeons without balanced groups.

Good self healing (if not the best), easy 25 stacks of might (10 permanent stacks with runes/sigils of strenght and zerk stats) in melee and about 18-20 stacks with ranged weapon. Btw ranged hammer is pretty strong, still can outdamage power rangers (tons of sarcasm here). So some solo bossfights can be done w/o much effort.

Pretty comfortable for world completion due permanent swiftness, still not as fast as thief/mesmer and not that good at soloing champions as ranger/necro.

When it comes for good groups/raids/fractals still better take another class (if u can stay alive with them) in terms of damage. Elem can do about 50% more dps. All other classes except mesmers can do about 15-40% more dps. But rev is pretty easy to survive with. More time you can stay alive – more damage you can deal.

Daedraz.1650:

@Nerfing This right here is the quintessential anthology of every scrub quote ever. Yea no wonder your t4 parties need lots of thinking or adapting when things go wrong- very inept players. That much has been evident from the moment you said it makes no difference if a fight lasts 5 minutes longer, seeing how competent groups complete most t4 fractals in under the 10 minute mark with some of them only taking 5 minutes. Competent groups melt bosses so fast even in t4 that fights never last long enough/go wrong to the point where you need to adapt or change strategies.

And my argument has been debunked because…. You said so? Are we regressing into elementary school logic now? I mean I get you’re salty, but come on man. I haven’t seen a single shred of evidence from you backing your claims- all I’ve seen is salty rants and tears. I don’t need to be able to ‘handle’ anything you say, because I don’t care at all. After having played rev, and witnessed first hand how mediocre it is, my mind is made, along with those of the majority of people telling OP rev is bad. Anything you say is coming through one ear, and straight out the other. Good luck convincing OP.

No boy, they don’t. Because unlike your parties, ours don’t contain spreadsheet warriors who go down every 5 seconds because they don’t know what they’re doing. My Rev builds can adapt to any situation very quickly, whereas whenever you played Rev I’m pretty sure you just went power Shiro and when it failed because you can’t handle it, you raged.

“competant”, so you mean speed running morons who wouldn’t be able to handle anything going wrong. If they couldn’t do it in 5 minutes, they’d consider it a failure, which is hilarious. There is no difference between a 5 or 10 minute group – none. None whatsoever boy. It’s a failed argument to try and say otherwise.

Your argument was debunked the moment you started raging about how meta groups are the best and thats that. When you blindly follow somebody elses opinion and insist it’s the best no matter what – thats when it was debunked. The only one getting salty tears here is you, because you are being put in your place and can’t handle somebody actually saying how and why the Rev is actually a great class.
I’ve provided no evidence? I’ve discussed and shown my own builds, my own experiences and why the Rev is a great c lass. What have you shown? Nothing except the spreadsheet warrior mindset “Rev is bad no matter what”. You’re the one showing nothing.

Your majority is non-existent boy, I suggest you learn that already. You failed at Rev because you yourself were not good enough.

Daedraz.1650:

I have not mentioned how revs do in OW because I just don’t care about OW. I haven’t said they’re bad at OW either. I am focusing on the part of OP’s question where he asks how revs are for fractals. I keep on saying “anything works” because saying rev, for that matter any class, is good at OW is such a blanket statement. Everyone has different standards for what is good or not when it comes to OW because the nature of OW content is not as one dimensional as fractals or for that matter raids. In fractals, people just want dps because your group has a singular objective- kill things. The same cannot be said for OW. Some people want mobility to get from point A to B quicker; some people want survivability; some people just want raw damage to kill things faster; some people want lots of condi cleanses to get rid of mobility impeding conditions. This is why there are no meta builds for OW. There are a lot of ways to spec any class to fit your OW world needs. I honestly don’t see why you are so hung up on this.

If you want to be pedantic, sure. I do agree there are things that rev can do well when it comes to open world. Mobility is sure one of them. I imagine guardian players would kill to get perma swiftness. They’re definitely not super squishy like elementalists and won’t get 3 shotted by pocket raptors. When you run into a group of people doing OW events, you can buff them. Aside OW, revs are amazing in wvw. There are few things scarier than a bunch of revs running after you and having a bunch of revs in a zerg amplies its strength so much. But OP is also asking how good revs are in fractals. And it is a flat out lie to tell him that he’ll always be welcome in all high tier fractal parties. A lot of times people won’t mind. But a lot of times, OP will run into people who will tell him to switch classes because they already have a PS warrior in the group and need a class like elementalist that can outdps a rev by 2 times. I personally don’t mind at all. I’ve seen videos of revs soloing fractal 100 CM so I know for a fact that they can get stuff done just as well as any other class. But a lot of other people don’t want revs in their parties simply because qt said they’re bad. If you don’t think this ever happens then you are disconnected with reality. I’m not trying to antagonize you, but that is the plainest way I can describe it as. OP will never ever have a problem like that if he decides to roll a guardian. Everyone loves guards in pve. The same can’t be said for revs.

The only lies made here have been yours. Fractal parties as a whole do not care if you have a Rev or not. The only ones who do are spreadsheet warriors, the ones who go down every 5 seconds because they can’t adapt or learn their failures. They are the parties not worth the time for anyone other than spreadsheet warriors.

And now to further prove my point, you said and I quote directly here:

“people don’t want because qt said so”.

Blind, spreadsheet, sheep.

You then say you’ve seen vids of Rev’s soloing 100 Fractal, thereby proving they are not only capable, but good. This goes against everything you’ve said thus far.
Congratulations on tearing apart your own argument in two sentences boy.

Oh and the reason why he sees all the negativity is from people like you. From PVP’ers and spreadsheet warriors who hate Rev because they were not good enough to master it, and because PVP has it’s own issues. That’s why I began posting in the Rev forum, so new players can see it’s just a load of BS coming from incapable salty players and the Rev is actually worth it.

With all that’s been said, doing world boss trains + T1-T2 fractals would be fine on my Rev, yes? That’s essentially what I’m getting out of this.

I have no plans on fitting in with the meta as I did it with another MMO for 11 years. Also, as someone with a 9-5 job I also just want to enjoy time with my family.

I’ll end up leveling a (Not even sure what) casually. Currently have my Thief at 80 but I find soloing content quite daunting on it and running around grabbing Waypoints for WB trains seems like it’d take forever -.-

Suntzukid.5602:

With all that’s been said, doing world boss trains + T1-T2 fractals would be fine on my Rev, yes? That’s essentially what I’m getting out of this.

I have no plans on fitting in with the meta as I did it with another MMO for 11 years. Also, as someone with a 9-5 job I also just want to enjoy time with my family.

I’ll end up leveling a (Not even sure what) casually. Currently have my Thief at 80 but I find soloing content quite daunting on it and running around grabbing Waypoints for WB trains seems like it’d take forever -.-

You’ll be fine for all content with Rev yes. T1-4 Fratcals, Open World, Dungeons, Raids.

If you’re not looking to be a meta-sheep then even better. If you play on Europe servers feel free to add me

Its Nerfing Time.1495:

The only lies made here have been yours. Fractal parties as a whole do not care if you have a Rev or not. The only ones who do are spreadsheet warriors, the ones who go down every 5 seconds because they can’t adapt or learn their failures. They are the parties not worth the time for anyone other than spreadsheet warriors.

And now to further prove my point, you said and I quote directly here:

“people don’t want because qt said so”.

Blind, spreadsheet, sheep.

You then say you’ve seen vids of Rev’s soloing 100 Fractal, thereby proving they are not only capable, but good. This goes against everything you’ve said thus far.
Congratulations on tearing apart your own argument in two sentences boy.

Oh and the reason why he sees all the negativity is from people like you. From PVP’ers and spreadsheet warriors who hate Rev because they were not good enough to master it, and because PVP has it’s own issues. That’s why I began posting in the Rev forum, so new players can see it’s just a load of BS coming from incapable salty players and the Rev is actually worth it.

Ah good for you to chime in my redpilled fedora tipping friend. Spreadsheet warriors go down every 5 seconds? Not sure where you’re getting that from. Is that so just because you say so? That is just a load of crap coming out of your wazoo because you are desperate to defend revs. I can just as easily say people like you who are anti-meta are inept players who go down every 5 seconds because you people don’t know how to play the game competently. And since I said it, it must be true right? The smoothest t4 runs are always the ones with these so called ‘spreadsheet warriors’ because they actually know how to do end game pve efficiently.

I have said several times that revs are not as bad as people make them out to be. And I have never mentioned that they are so bad that they cannot get things done. The fact that rev can solo fractal 100 cm is not an indicator that revs are good in any way, seeing how chronomancers with absolute potato dps can also solo it as well. It just means revs can get things done in the right hands.

Regarding qt metas, sure some people follow them simply because the best pve players in the entire game said that is the best way to play classes/specs. But a lot of people also follow them because after extensive testing, they’ve found that qt metas are an improvement over their prior builds. You can call that “blindly following a trend” but whether you like it or not, meta followers are everywhere because surprise! It turns out a lot of people like doing good damage! Mind blowing right? I mean, isn’t it so mind boggling that a lot of players prefer a class like elementalist that can outdps a rev by 2 times or a condi ranger that can do 10K more dps than it with a sloppy rotation?

The only salty person here is you. I frankly don’t care at all. Jesus I don’t play rev. I could care absolutely less about revs. You play rev. It’s your class that’s getting crapped on by people who share my sentiments towards the class. You can wrap a sweat rag on your forehead and prattle on like you’re winning some online debate about a game all you want. Crowning achievement of the year! Looks like mommy will be giving you lots of good boi points and chicken tendies. I am absolutely content because OP will be able to look at this thread, and any other similar thread in this subforum and realize that “Oh gee… 2 people are saying revs are good and everyone else is saying there are better picks when it comes to pve. Let me check some other threads on this subforum… Oh boy here are more people who are saying rev needs a serious rework.”

Revs provide quite powerful CC on low cooldown with Staff 5 and Glint. Plus fractal bosses have low HP so their lower DPS ceiling isn’t really an issue in good T4 parties. In many cases, the CC is worth adding on an extra minute or two onto an Ensolyss kill rather than having say an Ele or Thief with limited access to consistent hard CC.

I’d actually argue that Revenants are quite strong in a pug environment where you cannot control the composition or the skill of the players, but poor in any kind of static group where you have control over comp and idea of skill level. There is a reason why Rev isn’t looked at too kindly, though. Simply has to do with it’s low damage ceiling with not enough utility to make up for it. And that’s why it’s poorer in organised groups. Anything the Revenant can do, another class can do better.

To further complicate impressions, I find a lot of Revs in fractal pugs are not that good, as most people who would be good enough to excel on Rev would just play another class instead. Then again, I am AU so maybe it’s just a timezone thing. Revenants are weaker than equivalent classes in similar roles assuming equal skill. That said, I think people would be kitten silly to discriminate against Revs in fractals since it’s not a game type where you need to have an optimised comp to still melt bosses and encounters.

It’s just that Revenant is not in a great place at the moment and I hope it gets re-worked and/or buffed in the next balance patch or expac.

Or I don’t know, someone figure out a Revenant build that exceeds expectations in the way the tri-build Necromancer has somewhat revised it’s place in the meta. Now that build is a heap of fun to play in fractals, actually.

Mind you, I’m in the middle of making an ascended Zealot set for my Ventari Rev since I love it’s burst healing and regen capabilities in fractals. It’s not going to be part of any kind of speedclear group, but again, you don’t need to be fully optimised to do well in fractals. It’ll just be a little slower, that’s all.

This guy is still trolling? Oh boy, he must be really bored.

Burtnik.5218:

This guy is still trolling? Oh boy, he must be really bored.

If the guy genuinely believes Revs are good, he genuinely believes that. There’s absolutely nothing wrong with it and I don’t know why you’re accusing him of trolling. It’s like you’re purposely coming back to this thread just for that simple fact.

Does it really bother you that much that you just keep coming back? We get it, Revs aren’t great in Raids and the Meta kitten aren’t going to bring them with. We kittenING GET IT.

Suntzukid.5602:

Burtnik.5218:

This guy is still trolling? Oh boy, he must be really bored.

If the guy genuinely believes Revs are good, he genuinely believes that. There’s absolutely nothing wrong with it and I don’t know why you’re accusing him of trolling. It’s like you’re purposely coming back to this thread just for that simple fact.

Does it really bother you that much that you just keep coming back? We get it, Revs aren’t great in Raids and the Meta kitten aren’t going to bring them with. We kittenING GET IT.

Nobody gives a flying crap about whether the guy likes revs or not. If he really likes it and it works for him? All the power to him. The problem is when he’s trying to convince OP that rev is a good class that is perfectly welcome in the meta on all levels of pve, because that is a flat out lie. OP is asking whether he should build a rev or a guard. If OP only wants to do open world and low tier fractals only, then sure a rev is a great choice. It does enough damage and since low tier fractal comps are unorganized, they won’t always have a PS warrior. But if he ever wants to join the big boy club and do high tier fractals, then a guard will be a superior choice simply because it is in higher demand than rev. People in high tier fractals are obviously more experienced and have a better idea of what they are doing to make fights go quicker/smoother. This results in a high probability that a party you join will have a PS warrior, druid, and a chrono. Which means a lot of groups will look for elementalists, condi rangers, engineers, guardians, or any other solid dps class/spec that can easily surpass 32K dps compared to a rev’s 26K. And you can really thank raids for this. Ever since people figured out that it is amazing to have perma 25 might, str and disc banners, empower allies, spotter, frost and sun spirits, grace of the land, perma quickness and alacrity, they brought that straight into fractals.

Daedraz.1650:

Its Nerfing Time.1495:

The only lies made here have been yours. Fractal parties as a whole do not care if you have a Rev or not. The only ones who do are spreadsheet warriors, the ones who go down every 5 seconds because they can’t adapt or learn their failures. They are the parties not worth the time for anyone other than spreadsheet warriors.

And now to further prove my point, you said and I quote directly here:

“people don’t want because qt said so”.

Blind, spreadsheet, sheep.

You then say you’ve seen vids of Rev’s soloing 100 Fractal, thereby proving they are not only capable, but good. This goes against everything you’ve said thus far.
Congratulations on tearing apart your own argument in two sentences boy.

Oh and the reason why he sees all the negativity is from people like you. From PVP’ers and spreadsheet warriors who hate Rev because they were not good enough to master it, and because PVP has it’s own issues. That’s why I began posting in the Rev forum, so new players can see it’s just a load of BS coming from incapable salty players and the Rev is actually worth it.

Ah good for you to chime in my redpilled fedora tipping friend. Spreadsheet warriors go down every 5 seconds? Not sure where you’re getting that from. Is that so just because you say so? That is just a load of crap coming out of your wazoo because you are desperate to defend revs. I can just as easily say people like you who are anti-meta are inept players who go down every 5 seconds because you people don’t know how to play the game competently. And since I said it, it must be true right? The smoothest t4 runs are always the ones with these so called ‘spreadsheet warriors’ because they actually know how to do end game pve efficiently.

I have said several times that revs are not as bad as people make them out to be. And I have never mentioned that they are so bad that they cannot get things done. The fact that rev can solo fractal 100 cm is not an indicator that revs are good in any way, seeing how chronomancers with absolute potato dps can also solo it as well. It just means revs can get things done in the right hands.

Regarding qt metas, sure some people follow them simply because the best pve players in the entire game said that is the best way to play classes/specs. But a lot of people also follow them because after extensive testing, they’ve found that qt metas are an improvement over their prior builds. You can call that “blindly following a trend” but whether you like it or not, meta followers are everywhere because surprise! It turns out a lot of people like doing good damage! Mind blowing right? I mean, isn’t it so mind boggling that a lot of players prefer a class like elementalist that can outdps a rev by 2 times or a condi ranger that can do 10K more dps than it with a sloppy rotation?

The only salty person here is you. I frankly don’t care at all. Jesus I don’t play rev. I could care absolutely less about revs. You play rev. It’s your class that’s getting crapped on by people who share my sentiments towards the class. You can wrap a sweat rag on your forehead and prattle on like you’re winning some online debate about a game all you want. Crowning achievement of the year! Looks like mommy will be giving you lots of good boi points and chicken tendies. I am absolutely content because OP will be able to look at this thread, and any other similar thread in this subforum and realize that “Oh gee… 2 people are saying revs are good and everyone else is saying there are better picks when it comes to pve. Let me check some other threads on this subforum… Oh boy here are more people who are saying rev needs a serious rework.”

And I see you still can’t handle being called out on your BS, you just have to keep on returning so you don’t look dumb. Yes, you spreadsheet warriors do go down in 5 seconds because you don’t know what you’re doing outside of the spreadsheets, thus failure to adapt makes you squishy. The only ones who don’t play the game properly are players like you, the ones who wait for new spreadsheets to be available rather than actually get your hands dirty and do some work.
The smoothest runs, don’t make me laugh. I’ve been in more than my fair share of parties with players like you, certainly not the smoothest. No matter how much you cry for “meta only” or “xyz rotation + build + class”, it’s never a smooth run because the rest of us waste time picking you up.

Actually, that’s exactly what you and others have said this entire topic AND in many other topics, that people should never pick Rev no matter what. Hell, the only thing I actually agree on with you, is that in the right hands Rev can do anything. This applies to any class and almost any build. This however, does not mean Rev is not worth it otherwise.

post 1 / x

That is blindly following a spreadsheet approach, especially if QT don’t even test everything themselves AND they blatantly point out not to follow their every word for obvious reasons. Too many people just want an easy ride, see what somebody else does, if it looks like it works – do it. The word, cookie cutter, comes to mind.

If you didn’t care, you wouldn’t be here trying to make up crap about the Rev just to suit your own needs. You played Rev, you failed at it. That’s fine, not everybody can play it.

You came in, tried to make crap up about how Rev isn’t good and got proven wrong. That’s what bothers you the most. So many people here call for Rev re-works, and do you know what the majority (and by majority, I’m talking about 98% here) play? PVP. PVP is irrelevant because for one – PVE game. For two, it’s a whole different animal when it comes to balance. So no, lots of people spouting the same crap is irrelevant as I said earlier.

Burtnik.5218:

This guy is still trolling? Oh boy, he must be really bored.

You still exist? Biggest troll on the forum right here folks. Burtnik can’t handle anything being said about Rev that’s positive. Another Rev failure right here.

Daedraz.1650:

Suntzukid.5602:

Burtnik.5218:

This guy is still trolling? Oh boy, he must be really bored.

If the guy genuinely believes Revs are good, he genuinely believes that. There’s absolutely nothing wrong with it and I don’t know why you’re accusing him of trolling. It’s like you’re purposely coming back to this thread just for that simple fact.

Does it really bother you that much that you just keep coming back? We get it, Revs aren’t great in Raids and the Meta kitten aren’t going to bring them with. We kittenING GET IT.

Nobody gives a flying crap about whether the guy likes revs or not. If he really likes it and it works for him? All the power to him. The problem is when he’s trying to convince OP that rev is a good class that is perfectly welcome in the meta on all levels of pve, because that is a flat out lie. OP is asking whether he should build a rev or a guard. If OP only wants to do open world and low tier fractals only, then sure a rev is a great choice. It does enough damage and since low tier fractal comps are unorganized, they won’t always have a PS warrior. But if he ever wants to join the big boy club and do high tier fractals, then a guard will be a superior choice simply because it is in higher demand than rev. People in high tier fractals are obviously more experienced and have a better idea of what they are doing to make fights go quicker/smoother. This results in a high probability that a party you join will have a PS warrior, druid, and a chrono. Which means a lot of groups will look for elementalists, condi rangers, engineers, guardians, or any other solid dps class/spec that can easily surpass 32K dps compared to a rev’s 26K. And you can really thank raids for this. Ever since people figured out that it is amazing to have perma 25 might, str and disc banners, empower allies, spotter, frost and sun spirits, grace of the land, perma quickness and alacrity, they brought that straight into fractals.

I never said Rev was welcome in the meta, I said the meta is irrelevant because it is. The Rev is perfectly viable and fine for all tiers of play, which it is. If he wants to play raids or T4s, Revs are not discriminated against on a whole, unless you run into a bunch of spreadsheet warrior sheep. If he does, he’s way better off ignoring them and finding an actually competent group.

Daedraz.1650:

Suntzukid.5602:

Burtnik.5218:

This guy is still trolling? Oh boy, he must be really bored.

If the guy genuinely believes Revs are good, he genuinely believes that. There’s absolutely nothing wrong with it and I don’t know why you’re accusing him of trolling. It’s like you’re purposely coming back to this thread just for that simple fact.

Does it really bother you that much that you just keep coming back? We get it, Revs aren’t great in Raids and the Meta kitten aren’t going to bring them with. We kittenING GET IT.

Nobody gives a flying crap about whether the guy likes revs or not. If he really likes it and it works for him? All the power to him. The problem is when he’s trying to convince OP that rev is a good class that is perfectly welcome in the meta on all levels of pve, because that is a flat out lie. OP is asking whether he should build a rev or a guard. If OP only wants to do open world and low tier fractals only, then sure a rev is a great choice. It does enough damage and since low tier fractal comps are unorganized, they won’t always have a PS warrior. But if he ever wants to join the big boy club and do high tier fractals, then a guard will be a superior choice simply because it is in higher demand than rev. People in high tier fractals are obviously more experienced and have a better idea of what they are doing to make fights go quicker/smoother. This results in a high probability that a party you join will have a PS warrior, druid, and a chrono. Which means a lot of groups will look for elementalists, condi rangers, engineers, guardians, or any other solid dps class/spec that can easily surpass 32K dps compared to a rev’s 26K. And you can really thank raids for this. Ever since people figured out that it is amazing to have perma 25 might, str and disc banners, empower allies, spotter, frost and sun spirits, grace of the land, perma quickness and alacrity, they brought that straight into fractals.

Precisely this

@Nerfing Once again. Spreadsheet warriors go down every 5 seconds because you said so? Starting to sound like a broken record. Son, these spreadsheet warriors are the best pvers in the game. People spouting your “meta doesn’t matter” nonsense are the ones who try to drag a rampager necro into t4 fractals expecting to be carried. I’ve heard your drivel so many times during dungeon eras. “Boo hoo zerk meta doesn’t matter. My rabid necro is better because all zerk players do is die.” Players like you are what made early dungeon days absolutely cancerous since you guys were nothing but dead weight.

Wow that is a whole lot of whining. We get it. We hurt your little snowflake feelings by pointing out that there is a problem with your main class. You are making a joke out of yourself because you can’t handle the reality that there are better picks than rev. It’s okay though. Most of us who are disagreeing with you are used to this. We see delusional salty players wallowing in denial desperately trying to defend their classes in mmo games when they get nerfed or the proper balance hasn’t been given. Doesn’t matter to us one bit because we just laugh at players like you. We’re not the ones playing revs. We’re playing classes that are actually good and have demand. It just cracks me up when you say metas are irrelevant. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0

Stay woke my redpilled fedora tipping friend.

Daedraz.1650:

I have not mentioned how revs do in OW because I just don’t care about OW.

So basically, you are just pushing answers you want. I mean, I never once saw you say “Oh, but I don’t know OW PVE, so you will have to take these other guys word for it”. You simply dismissed it as irrelevant with “You can do what you want” which had nothing to do with how Rev’s perform in PVE to make it sound like Revs are just bad, period.

Well I got news for you. IF you decide to try Revs in OW PVE, you will find them very effective in that role. So perhaps the next time someone asks about it and clearly you don’t care, you can answer with “I heard they are pretty good, but I don’t have any experience with it”, instead of broadly painting the whole class as poor because “meta”.

Obtena.7952:

Daedraz.1650:

I have not mentioned how revs do in OW because I just don’t care about OW.

So basically, you are just pushing answers you want. I mean, I never once saw you say “Oh, but I don’t know OW PVE, so you will have to take these other guys word for it”. You simply dismissed it as irrelevant with “You can do what you want” which had nothing to do with how Rev’s perform in PVE to make it sound like Revs are just bad, period.

Well I got news for you. IF you decide to try Revs in OW PVE, you will find them very effective in that role. So perhaps the next time someone asks about it and clearly you don’t care, you can answer with “I heard they are pretty good, but I don’t have any experience with it”, instead of broadly painting the whole class as poor because “meta”.

Once again that is such a blanket statement because every class can be built to be effective in OW based on a person’s needs. Every class, if running the right traits and gear, WILL be good. You are really making it sound like OW is harder/more complicated than it really is to the point where a particular class is better at some aspect of OW that another class isn’t. Whatever one class can do well at in OW, every other class can do just as well. You just need to be able to get from point A to point B quickly; you need enough dmg to kill OW mobs; you need enough sustain to survive OW mobs. Rev can do all of that really well. So can a warrior. So can an elementalist, albeit being more fragile. An engineer, a normally slow and cumbersome class can take streamlined kit traits and become a superb class to do OW on. A guardian, while slower than revs for sure, is also good at OW because its insane burst damage shreds through any OW enemy in seconds. Etc etc.

No, that’s not a blanket statement … there is a clear ranking of class performance in OW PVE, just like there is for raids, etc… you can not build every class to be equally effective in OW PVE. That’s just as ignorant as someone saying every class can be built to be effective in high end fractals or raids …. I’m pretty sure we can agree on at least that much.

THIS is why I’m hammering on you … you are offering untrue information to the OP based on something you already admit you don’t care (and likely don’t know) enough about.

Daedraz.1650:

@Nerfing Once again. Spreadsheet warriors go down every 5 seconds because you said so? Starting to sound like a broken record. Son, these spreadsheet warriors are the best pvers in the game. People spouting your “meta doesn’t matter” nonsense are the ones who try to drag a rampager necro into t4 fractals expecting to be carried. I’ve heard your drivel so many times during dungeon eras. “Boo hoo zerk meta doesn’t matter. My rabid necro is better because all zerk players do is die.” Players like you are what made early dungeon days absolutely cancerous since you guys were nothing but dead weight.

Wow that is a whole lot of whining. We get it. We hurt your little snowflake feelings by pointing out that there is a problem with your main class. You are making a joke out of yourself because you can’t handle the reality that there are better picks than rev. It’s okay though. Most of us who are disagreeing with you are used to this. We see delusional salty players wallowing in denial desperately trying to defend their classes in mmo games when they get nerfed or the proper balance hasn’t been given. Doesn’t matter to us one bit because we just laugh at players like you. We’re not the ones playing revs. We’re playing classes that are actually good and have demand. It just cracks me up when you say metas are irrelevant. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0

Stay woke my redpilled fedora tipping friend.

No boy, spreadsheet warriors are not the best in the game. You are all cookie cutters, following what one person is doing all the way down the line. The people bothering to think, test and try out things, those are the ones who can be called the best.
The meta does not matter, the sooner you realise this the better. It does not matter if you kill things 5 minutes faster – why? Why does it actually matter should be the question. As long as people are enjoying the content, trying to do things different ways to not be cookie cutter, getting the job done, time does not matter.

The only people who made early dungeon runs cancerous were your type exactly. Insisting on zerk meta only, insisting on a meta period. You were the dead weight and still are. You insisted on something you didn’t even understand, that’s why you were the dead weight dropping in 5 seconds. You spreadsheet warriors always will be.

The only one whining here, and has been from the start, is you and those like you. Your special snowflake feelings have been hurt because you have been proven wrong repeatedly. You can’t handle this – not my problem and I don’t care.
You are so delusional it’s almost hilarious – why? Because you can’t handle Rev being good, you can’t handle somebody showing it has 0 issues doing content and that toxic cancer players like you, are the issue.

It’s time to grow up boy, and get over yourself. Learn to stop being a sheep following a spreadsheet and actually put some work into a character.

Obtena.7952:

No, that’s not a blanket statement … there is a clear ranking of class performance in OW PVE, just like there is for raids, etc… you can not build every class to be equally effective in OW PVE. That’s just as ignorant as someone saying every class can be built to be effective in high end fractals or raids …. I’m pretty sure we can agree on at least that much.

THIS is why I’m hammering on you … you are offering untrue information to the OP based on something you already admit you don’t care (and likely don’t know) enough about.

I’ve been playing the game since it came out so rest assured, I know every inch of OW. I just don’t do it/care because OW does not provide any engaging end game content to me. And not sure what kind of OW you’ve been playing if you think there’s a ranking of class performance in OW. At this point I’m also expecting you to tell me that there’s class rankings in dungeons as well. Because OW is such trivial content nobody cares about class rankings at all. The majority of OW is either solo play or zerg fests. Nobody cares about class rankings or performance in solo play because well, it’s solo play. Run whatever you want and do whatever the hell you want however the hell you want. In zerg fests, all people care about is having bodies. They don’t care whether you’re a necro, warrior, or druid or whatever.

Its Nerfing Time.1495:

No boy, spreadsheet warriors are not the best in the game. You are all cookie cutters, following what one person is doing all the way down the line. The people bothering to think, test and try out things, those are the ones who can be called the best.
The meta does not matter, the sooner you realise this the better. It does not matter if you kill things 5 minutes faster – why? Why does it actually matter should be the question. As long as people are enjoying the content, trying to do things different ways to not be cookie cutter, getting the job done, time does not matter.

The only people who made early dungeon runs cancerous were your type exactly. Insisting on zerk meta only, insisting on a meta period. You were the dead weight and still are. You insisted on something you didn’t even understand, that’s why you were the dead weight dropping in 5 seconds. You spreadsheet warriors always will be.

The only one whining here, and has been from the start, is you and those like you. Your special snowflake feelings have been hurt because you have been proven wrong repeatedly. You can’t handle this – not my problem and I don’t care.
You are so delusional it’s almost hilarious – why? Because you can’t handle Rev being good, you can’t handle somebody showing it has 0 issues doing content and that toxic cancer players like you, are the issue.

It’s time to grow up boy, and get over yourself. Learn to stop being a sheep following a spreadsheet and actually put some work into a character.

“People who bother to think and test” things… So you mean qt right? The guys who sink a lot of hours trying to find the most optimal build/skill rotation for a given class while bashing their heads against training golems for days and weeks? And also the people who take these qt guidelines and take the time to learn the rotations and test them to see how they compare against what they were doing before? Right-o lad, they sure do sound like the best!

Again with the “time doesn’t matter” drivel. That is the epitome of lazy talk. Unlike you, a lot of people want to finish their fractals quickly because they just want to get the dailies out of the way. They don’t want to waste 20 minutes on 1 fractals because there are scrubs like you in the party who insist on doing everything inefficiently.

People who adhered to the zerk meta during dungeon days were honestly godsends because they helped balance out the clueless inept players like you who would insist on joining dungeons with absolutely horrible gear. Not sure where you are getting the"meta players all drop in 5 seconds" rhetoric from. The ones who drop in 5 seconds are always the clueless noob players like you who don’t know how to play the game properly.

Absolutely hilarious that you think your drivel has hurt my feelings. I don’t care at all. The way I see it, it is you always rushing back desperately defending the honor of your precious main class because you aren’t capable of adapting to changing metas/learning how to play better classes. At the end of the day, I’ll be logging in on the game and I’ll be running fractals and raids on a good class that people seek for raids. No one will ever say anything negative since I’ll be on a class that can actually do dps and has demand- all will be absolutely dandy. I’ll log in tomorrow to forums and no one will say a single negative thing about my main class on the forums. I’ll teeter over to the revenant subforum, and I’ll just see a plethora of threads saying revs need a rework and you just having a salty meltdown like you’ve been doing on every thread that is negative/critical towards rev.

And you have proven absolutely nothing but how inept of a player you are. You can wrap that sweat rag over your head and furiously type “I’m right you’re wrong” all you want, but delusional/wishful thinking isn’t going to change reality. Maybe it is you that needs to grow up after all. Still stuck in that adolescent rebellious attitude where all the grownups are telling you there’s a better way to do things and you are just refusing to follow their advice because “Boo hoo what does mom and dad know. I’m 15 and I know everything!”

Don’t you people arguing see that you are correct with most things said depending on the point of view? If you are concerned about ease of pugs, optimizing things, and adhering to the tried and true then Daedraz’ viewpoint is worth following.

If you are concerned with doing it your own way, not being bothered whether pugs keep you, or simply playing with friends to avoid that conundrum – and apply your best within your own ideology – then nerfing time’s viewpoint works out.

In the end it’s just going to depend on what the player is looking for. Personally I mostly do random things on my Rev, and don’t have time to play much besides. I still like to use research by me and others to polish my gameplay experience, because it’s fun. If I was doing high end raiding, I would certainly strive to inconvenience the group as little as possible (since you have to be a team) with my choices and thus more than likely follow that meta beast, or at least be heavily influenced by the parts that are tested and true in the actual game. More likely I’d be in a team that only cares about fun & casual progression if I were raiding. There’s a whole lot of players with different opinions there, so the trick is just to find the likeminded and understand that others may not be like you.

Daedraz.1650:

Its Nerfing Time.1495:

No boy, spreadsheet warriors are not the best in the game. You are all cookie cutters, following what one person is doing all the way down the line. The people bothering to think, test and try out things, those are the ones who can be called the best.
The meta does not matter, the sooner you realise this the better. It does not matter if you kill things 5 minutes faster – why? Why does it actually matter should be the question. As long as people are enjoying the content, trying to do things different ways to not be cookie cutter, getting the job done, time does not matter.

The only people who made early dungeon runs cancerous were your type exactly. Insisting on zerk meta only, insisting on a meta period. You were the dead weight and still are. You insisted on something you didn’t even understand, that’s why you were the dead weight dropping in 5 seconds. You spreadsheet warriors always will be.

The only one whining here, and has been from the start, is you and those like you. Your special snowflake feelings have been hurt because you have been proven wrong repeatedly. You can’t handle this – not my problem and I don’t care.
You are so delusional it’s almost hilarious – why? Because you can’t handle Rev being good, you can’t handle somebody showing it has 0 issues doing content and that toxic cancer players like you, are the issue.

It’s time to grow up boy, and get over yourself. Learn to stop being a sheep following a spreadsheet and actually put some work into a character.

“People who bother to think and test” things… So you mean qt right? The guys who sink a lot of hours trying to find the most optimal build/skill rotation for a given class while bashing their heads against training golems for days and weeks? Right-o lad, they sure do sound like the best!

Again with the “time doesn’t matter” drivel. That is the epitome of lazy talk. Unlike you, a lot of people want to finish their fractals quickly because they just want to get the dailies out of the way. They don’t want to waste 20 minutes to spend on 1 fractals because there are scrubs like you in the party who insist on doing everything inefficiently.

People who adhered to the zerk meta during dungeon days were honestly godsends because they helped balance out the clueless inept players like you who would insist on joining dungeons with absolutely horrible gear. Not sure where you are getting the"meta players all drop in 5 seconds" rhetoric from. The ones who drop in 5 seconds are always the clueless noob players like you who don’t know how to play the game properly.

Absolutely hilarious that you think your drivel has hurt my feelings. I don’t care at all. At the end of the day, I’ll be logging in on the game and I’ll be running fractals and raids on a good class that people seek for raids. No one will ever say anything negative since I’ll be on a class that can actually do dps and has demand- all will be absolutely dandy. I’ll log in tomorrow to forums and no one will say a single negative thing about my main class on the forums. I’ll teeter over to the revenant subforum, and I’ll just see a plethora of threads saying revs need a rework and you just having a salty meltdown like you’ve been doing on every thread that is negative/critical towards rev.

And you have proven absolutely nothing but how inept of a player you are. You can wrap that sweat rag over your head and furiously type “I’m right you’re wrong” all you want, but delusional/wishful thinking isn’t going to change reality. Maybe it is you that needs to grow up after all. Still stuck in that adolescent rebellious attitude where all the grownups are telling you there’s a better way to do things and you are just refusing to follow their advice because “Boo hoo what does mom and dad know. I’m 15 and I know everything!”

And all those hours you spend testing too….oh wait no, you don’t test. You cookie cutter off somebody elses work and claim you’re good. Spreadsheet warriors are not the best in the game, that’s just fact boy.

The epitome of lazy talk comes from you boy, 100%. Refusing to test and accepting blindly what somebody elses says and completely unwilling to test yourself. That is lazy.

Unlike you, the majority of people prefer to finish their fractals and not have to pick up meta-sheep off the floor every 5 seconds because they don’t know what they’re doing. They don’t want to wait an hour because some sheep-moron has to claim they’re “meta” yet quite clearly are out of their depth.

The zerk meta was laughably bad, because you had all the sheep insisting on the same thing and never being any good at it. Cookie cutter builds everywhere all the same, and very few willing to actually use their brain and think. Godsends to people like you who just wanted the easy way out. Time-wasting dead weights to real players.

1/2

I can tell your snowflake feelings are hurt, because you:

1) entered this topic in the first place
2) still here despite saying you were done because you can’t handle being proven wrong.

You’ll login, and run raids/fractals with the same group of people because you can’t do anything otherwise. If you ran a non-meta group, they’d boot you because they’d get tired of ressing you. They’d get tired of hearing the same old meta-crap about how what you do is right and everything else is wrong.

You don’t main Rev because you failed at it. You weren’t good enough to build or master it, so you went to an easy cookie cutter class. We get it spreadsheet sheep, you just aren’t good enough.

It’s the final nail in the coffin that:

a) you can’t stand my posts
b) I’m right

You know why and how? You have to try and insist on fail personal attacks because you have nothing – literally nothing, against my points. Hell you can’t stop responding so soon after my posts (obviously following it so you can furiously begin typing)
By all means continue to whine, rage and cry because you’ve been called out on your made-up personal vendetta BS against Rev. You failed at the class, go back to your own cookie cutter class and wait for the next update on somebody elses spreadsheet boy

I miss Nemesis.

Anyway, Rev is fun, Rev is easy to play once you learn how to use Legends properly, and Rev won’t hold you back in T4 fractals to any noticeable degree unless you are tryharding. But Rev is suboptimal and the higher your level of play, the more apparent this becomes.

That said maybe it’s because of my timezones but half the people I see in pugs are Necromancers running the Sc/D & Staff build. So I’m not getting sub 25-30 minute T4s regardless. Feels bad man.

Daedraz.1650:

Nobody cares about class rankings or performance in solo play because well, it’s solo play.

Sorry, you can’t say that; now you’re just being obtuse. People care and based on the tone of the OP’s question, he does as well. Just because it’s trivial to you, doesn’t mean people don’t care about their performance in open world. That’s just ridiculous.

The sad part is that you think not acknowledging Rev’s capabilities in OW PVE will help with your Rev Hate Campaign. I can assure you that Anet considers ALL aspects of the game when considering balance. I would advise that if you want to be a more informed campaginer and be more influential with your complaints, you open your mind up a little more about Rev’s performance outside of engineered teams for raids fractals as much as you do inside them.

Rev is a powerhouse in solo open world stuff. You can more or less run any build and still do open world without problems but Rev has a good combination of abilities that make it a very strong farming character. Stun break and condi cleanse on legend swap, stability, Pull, pulsing might and swiftness, strong CC even emergency button healing with Glint heal.

I wouldn’t main a character based on how quickly it can do a berry run or perform in SW but it is undeniably strong at solo open world stuff.

Its Nerfing Time.1495:

I can tell your snowflake feelings are hurt, because you:

1) entered this topic in the first place
2) still here despite saying you were done because you can’t handle being proven wrong.

You’ll login, and run raids/fractals with the same group of people because you can’t do anything otherwise. If you ran a non-meta group, they’d boot you because they’d get tired of ressing you. They’d get tired of hearing the same old meta-crap about how what you do is right and everything else is wrong.

You don’t main Rev because you failed at it. You weren’t good enough to build or master it, so you went to an easy cookie cutter class. We get it spreadsheet sheep, you just aren’t good enough.

It’s the final nail in the coffin that:

a) you can’t stand my posts
b) I’m right

You know why and how? You have to try and insist on fail personal attacks because you have nothing – literally nothing, against my points. Hell you can’t stop responding so soon after my posts (obviously following it so you can furiously begin typing)
By all means continue to whine, rage and cry because you’ve been called out on your made-up personal vendetta BS against Rev. You failed at the class, go back to your own cookie cutter class and wait for the next update on somebody elses spreadsheet boy

Not sure why you keep on hammering away this nonsense at me. I’m not the one you have to convince that rev is a good class. As far as I’m concerned you are just a salty player who can’t tolerate people saying there are better picks than your main class. You’re approaching this whole thing like you’re trying to defend the honor of your family name or some crap haha. Protip: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=urcqQC02YbY And I just hear the same old nonsense every single time about how metas are irrelevant, revs are good classes, and people who say they have problems just don’t know how to play it. Same thing every single time. Starting to sound like Marco Rubio during a debate.

@OP Rev is great for OW and it is no better or worse than any other class. Rev is great for low tier fractals but so is any other class because of how easy low tier fractals are. If you just want to do OW and low tier fractals, then a Rev is a terrific choice. It does enough dmg, it is durable enough, has a good amount of i-frames, reliable CC on low cooldowns, and it can pulse a lot of boons that will help unorganized parties that won’t always have PS warriors. But if you ever want to do high tier fractals, a rev’s usefulness diminishes because the harder content gets, parties start becoming more tailored and engineered to fit a specific comp. You can certainly make it work, but as per your question, a guard is obviously the superior choice because it is considered a really strong class in the current meta and there is a higher demand for it than revs. People like Nerfing are just out of touch with how things are if they think that metas are irrelevant in games. There are metas in every online game. There are metas in LoL, WoW, Tera, DoTA 2, HoTS, FF14, Overwatch, and even fps games like battlefield and CSGO have metas based on what guns perform the best. And a lot of people like following metas because that’s what metas are- a general consensus that a particular game strategy/way to play is the most effective way. As other people have mentioned here, anything a rev can do in a fractal environment, another class can do better. Some of the best pve players in the entire game have tested every class/possible build against testing golems and have concluded that revs in their current state leave a bit to be desired. They back up everything with recorded footage that is accessible on youtube. On the other side of the debate, you have people like Nerfing who are in denial because they main rev and are just ranting “I am right you are wrong end of debate” without any shred of empirical proof that a rev performs on a competitive level compared to other classes.

Daedraz.1650:

Not sure why you keep on hammering away this nonsense at me. I’m not the one you have to convince that rev is a good class. As far as I’m concerned you are just a salty player who can’t tolerate people saying there are better picks than your main class. You’re approaching this whole thing like you’re trying to defend the honor of your family name or some crap haha. Protip: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=urcqQC02YbY And I just hear the same old nonsense every single time about how metas are irrelevant, revs are good classes, and people who say they have problems just don’t know how to play it. Same thing every single time. Starting to sound like Marco Rubio during a debate.

@OP Rev is great for OW and it is no better or worse than any other class. Rev is great for low tier fractals but so is any other class because of how easy low tier fractals are. If you just want to do OW and low tier fractals, then a Rev is a terrific choice. It does enough dmg, it is durable enough, has a good amount of i-frames, reliable CC on low cooldowns, and it can pulse a lot of boons that will help unorganized parties that won’t always have PS warriors. But if you ever want to do high tier fractals, a rev’s usefulness diminishes because the harder content gets, parties start becoming more tailored and engineered to fit a specific comp. You can certainly make it work, but as per your question, a guard is obviously the superior choice because it is considered a really strong class in the current meta and there is a higher demand for it than revs. People like Nerfing are just out of touch with how things are if they think that metas are irrelevant in games. There are metas in every online game. There are metas in LoL, WoW, Tera, DoTA 2, HoTS, FF14, Overwatch, and even fps games like battlefield and CSGO have metas based on what guns perform the best. And a lot of people like following metas because that’s what metas are- a general consensus that a particular game strategy/way to play is the most effective way. As other people have mentioned here, anything a rev can do in a fractal environment, another class can do better. Some of the best pve players in the entire game have tested every class/possible build against testing golems and have concluded that revs in their current state leave a bit to be desired. They back up everything with recorded footage that is accessible on youtube. On the other side of the debate, you have people like Nerfing who are in denial because they main rev and are just ranting “I am right you are wrong end of debate” without any shred of empirical proof that a rev performs on a competitive level compared to other classes.

You can’t convince somebody who is a failure at a class, who cannot play it and prefers easier spreadsheet-simple classes based off somebody elses work, on how good a class is. However what you can do, is make the person look dumb for not knowing what they’re doing, which is what I’ve done with you boy.
You’re nothing more than a salty failure, so bitter you weren’t good enough so you have to try and down talk anybody interested in the Rev or those who prove you wrong.

@OP ignore this moron, Rev can handle any tier of content. Any. Ignore the meta-sheep groups because you’ll spend more time picking them up off the floor then you will progressing through content. You’ll also get the wrong ideas about everything, as they will insist their way is the correct way because their spreadsheet said so.

The only one here in denial boy here is you. You have nothing but your spreadsheets and refusal to accept anything that goes against it. Your utter and complete failure at the class itself speaks volumes about your own abilities. You were not good enough, it’s that simple.

I’ve given my builds and experiences, there are videos of capable, real Rev players, handling any tiers of content, solo or in groups. There is your evidence boy. Coupled with the fact you can’t do Rev – you have nothing but somebody elses work to back up your opinion.

Sit down, you’re done. You have nothing but tears at this point.

Rev is best hand kiter meta. That and a meme.Boy.

zoomborg.9462:

Rev is best hand kiter meta. That and a meme.

Don’t forget meta projectile kiter at Cairn.