Guild Wars 2

This is the question.

Because i don’t see great escape capability, at least not great like other professions have.

No blocks.
No stealth
No inv.
Not really great gap closer
No really good mobility
No second life

This is the key to be a meta build, without these characteristics you are only food for mesmer & C.

Especially in a Meta where armor and toughness don’t make a real difference.

How you think to survive to an extreme heavy burst?

The result will be this:

Did you watch the PoI today? Revenant has a block on offhand sword, an evade (without a cooldown mind you) that makes you jump backwards and regain endurance, shadowstep(s) towards your target and frequent chill application. Granted all of this is just from Shiro’s stance and dual swords but it certainly does have a lot of ways to stay on target and avoid damage.

I’m sure the new skills and stuff will be on Dulfy or some other place either right now or soon so I encourage you check those out.

I agree with Bovan but still low survivability, expecially on Jalis that is supposed to be tank. No protection? No swiftness?

Bovan.9481:

Did you watch the PoI today? Revenant has a block on offhand sword, an evade (without a cooldown mind you) that makes you jump backwards and regain endurance, shadowstep(s) towards your target and frequent chill application. Granted all of this is just from Shiro’s stance and dual swords but it certainly does have a lot of ways to stay on target and avoid damage.

I’m sure the new skills and stuff will be on Dulfy or some other place either right now or soon so I encourage you check those out.

You right about the sword block, i forgot this, but there is a general problem linked to energy management because everything costs energy.

So you can’t really spam evade with your utility.

Phil.8901:

You right about the sword block, i forgot this, but there is a general problem linked to energy management because everything costs energy.

So you can’t really spam evade with your utility.

That’s true, but neither can a Mesmer with for example Blurred Frenzy, or a Thief with… well just about anything. You can look at the evade utility as a 7 second cooldown. Granted you won’t be able to really cast anything else but you don’t need to use the evade when there is nothing to evade. And it gives you a ton of endurance after using it as well so you can evade another attack.

Jalis could use some defensive love though. Weakness application is great but I would like to see Vengeful Hammers applying protection while it’s on and the elite’s cast time reduced a little. The big topic with changes really shows we are being listened to so maybe we’ll see something on Jalis’ defense at some point.

Play some S/D thief, you’ll learn to deal without Blocks, invulns, no stealth (well, not that much stealth is needed) of you toss in P/P on the switch you also get used to poor mobility…

Really, there’s classes that deal with those lacking mechanics rather comfortably…
And no, S/D thief isn’t meta anymore, I know… It certainly fares well though, despite the ridiculous nerfs that force you to outplay every single other class/build heavily.

Anyhow, it worked in the past despite lacking the majority of your list… I don’t see what the fuss is about.

Sword #4 block

Sword #5 can be used semi defensively (hit someone and shadowstep 600 range back) although you then pull them too you.

Shiro #7 to evade back

Shiro #8 to port to enemy that outside the burst area (takes a little more skill mind you)

..
That just ways to use todays released information to avoid burst. Shame it hasn’t got a smoke field though to blast for a bit of stealth. That would have been nice to have on Shiro

edit:
I do feel they need a little bit more in terms of defensive abilities or some access to protection, even if it is something as simple as trait that gives different boons when changing too the legends

protection – Jalis
Swiftness – Centuer
Resistance – Mallyx
Fury – Shiro
xxx – “Glint” (based on what they aiming glints style at)

Your answer is Glint. Reason in pic. Hopefully thats not healing skill as it would ruin this legend completely.

Meanwhile i would like to know if i can use Shiro mobility skill without target and if sword 4 block can be used while moving?

Yeah i think we need to wait for the revenant specialization.

But i think for now it’s not much more than warrior survivability and it doesn’t have 2 endure pain.

Well..I pretty much wanted to run mostly sword/sword Shiro+Glint and it looks like thats what i and everyone else will run either way. Right now i dont even know what to run. Outside of Shiro everything is bad. Mallyx doesnt count as it is condi legend. And there is still that problem with condi removal…unless you pick joke Ventari ……………..never.

As for weapons probably staff for that block and condi removal on 4. Maybe hammer if it actually any good with impossible odds which im gonna spam in/out for 25 ez might. Or just sword/sword, sword/shield..

Lmao I love how suddenly people are beginning to understand what its like being a necro without realising it.

skowcia.8257:

Your answer is Glint. Reason in pic. Hopefully thats not healing skill as it would ruin this legend completely.

Meanwhile i would like to know if i can use Shiro mobility skill without target and if sword 4 block can be used while moving?

Sounds like this Glint skill.
http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Crystal_Hibernation

keep in mind, Signets.
Passive could convert damage to healing, and the active heals.

Phil.8901:

Yeah i think we need to wait for the revenant specialization.

But i think for now it’s not much more than warrior survivability and it doesn’t have 2 endure pain.

Nowhere close to warrior. War can auto revive and heal with shouts lol

If anything, maybe increase distance you evade back on Riposting Shadows but aside from that, I think Revenant has plenty of tools to survive. You need to consider the various traits Revenant has. Life steal, resistance, incoming conditions heal you, getting attacked heals you, swapping legends breaks stun, super speed on Shiro and Staff 5 for mobility and escaping, aoe stun with Jade Winds combined with Runes of Lyssa for condition cleanse,. And that’s just the stuff off the top of my head. There are many options for increasing your survivability with Shiro. Just because there isn’t a skill that automatically saves you like shadow refuge or endure pain doesn’t mean you are a sitting target. Like how Zetsumei said, necro players know how to survive without stealth or tons of mobility so the fact that Revenant gets decent mobility similar to thief plus life steal similar to necro and tons of stuns and spammable stun breaks means you should have just enough methods of surviving.

Thread is talking about burst. You can’t survive that with life steal.

And I suppose you can survive burst on a thief or a necro without death shroud? Thief can shadowstep and necro can maybe get a fear off. What does Revenant get? Spammable roll for initiative on Shiro, aoe teleport with Mallyx, potential to pop two heal skills to recover, block on sword, knockback and rush on staff 5, resistance on Mallyx for condi burst. Trust me, you have what you need to live a burst if you’re specced right and if you’re quick enough to react. Not to mention idk… maybe anticipating and dodging the burst? And if you’re talking about in an outnumbered fight, well then can’t really blame someone for getting nuked in a 2+ v 1.

Rain.9213:

Ohhh yeaaaaah that awesome 6/6/6/6/6/6 build. 2 heals? Do you even played beta to understand how terrible these 2 heals are? That is actually the main reason why it will prevent camping one legend. Spammable rolls? Dude..as a revenant i will barely have any energy for weapon skills, let alone utility ones LOL how i am supposed to spam it? By autoattacking 24/7? It will be a miracle if i get a chance to use it even once as i will need energy for wep skills and mobility.

skowcia.8257:

Do you even played beta to understand how terrible these 2 heals are? That is actually the main reason why it will prevent camping one legend. Spammable rolls? Dude..as a revenant i will barely have any energy for weapon skills, let alone utility ones LOL how i am supposed to spam it? By autoattacking 24/7?

I find it ironic you comment on the guy having played beta or not and proceed to prove that you have no clue on the energy you gain and how much you spend through weapon skills.

Implying you have to trait into more than three lines if you want life steal, resistance, and heal when attacked. If you get attacked when you have 0 energy, well then simply swap legends and bam 50 energy. You act as though you should be compensated for not being able to properly dodge an incoming burst. Warriors need invuln because their best heal skill ticks slow. As a Revenant, you have way more tricks up your sleeve. If anything, I do agree Jalis needs a bit more tankyness and Riposting Shadows could have a bit longer distance evade but aside from that, saying Revenant can’t survive a burst is just not knowing how to play.

Bovan.9481:

skowcia.8257:

Do you even played beta to understand how terrible these 2 heals are? That is actually the main reason why it will prevent camping one legend. Spammable rolls? Dude..as a revenant i will barely have any energy for weapon skills, let alone utility ones LOL how i am supposed to spam it? By autoattacking 24/7?

I find it ironic you comment on the guy having played beta or not and proceed to prove that you have no clue on the energy you gain and how much you spend through weapon skills.

If you use wep skills, you hardly have any energy left right after a swap. You have to decide..use utility or weapon skill? And have you even seen cost on sword skills?

Rain.9213:

Implying you have to trait into more than three lines if you want life steal, resistance, and heal when attacked. If you get attacked when you have 0 energy, well then simply swap legends and bam 50 energy. You act as though you should be compensated for not being able to properly dodge an incoming burst. Warriors need invuln because their best heal skill ticks slow. As a Revenant, you have way more tricks up your sleeve. If anything, I do agree Jalis needs a bit more tankyness and Riposting Shadows could have a bit longer distance evade but aside from that, saying Revenant can’t survive a burst is just not knowing how to play.

For resistance i have to use condition legend which doesnt work with power builds at all. Resistance can also be stripped and at this point what will save you from condi burst? If i happen to get 0 energy with Shiro, i have to swap and baam..my defensive rolls are gone for a good 10 seconds. Surviving a burst is not as much of a problem as getting out alive from team focus.

skowcia.8257:

For resistance i have to use condition legend which doesnt work with power builds at all. Resistance can also be stripped and at this point what will save you from condi burst? If i happen to get 0 energy with Shiro, i have to swap and baam..my defensive rolls are gone for a good 10 seconds. Surviving a burst is not as much of a problem as getting out alive from team focus.

Mallyx is probably the best in terms of condition defense though which is why I suggested using him for defense against condies. You can still be hitting hard with dual swords while using Mallyx as well so your damage isn’t completely gone. Furthermore, say you do get hit with 0 energy while on Shiro and switch to either Jarlis or Mallyx. Depending what trait lines you’re running, you can either stun break with Jarlis, dodge, switch to staff and skill 5 away towards your team and heal or stun break on legend swap, leap with Mallyx towards your team and displace any nearby enemies and get some distance. I know it would be tough but trust me, Necros deal with this kinda thing all the time. Like I said, it depends on how you’re specced and what weapon sets you’re running. Me, personally, I’m gonna be running staff for that skill 5. I admit, it would be cool to have an invuln or stealth on Revenant too but with Shiro, honestly, this class looks like it might be too strong if it wasn’t played with caution in a team fight. Let’s not forget the buffs to all the Revenant’s weapons we just got too. You can’t expect to survive everything and still have the offensive presence that we’re hoping to get with Shiro+recent weapon buffs. If in the next beta, Revs are still getting hopelessly rekt though, I will gladly admit I was wrong but as a Thief main and regular power Necro player, I think I can live just fine with the current Revenant abilities granted they increase Riposting Shadows length.

Rain.9213:

cut

Double heals? Terrible.
Spam rolls? Impossible with energy cost. And if you do it then basically the only thing you can do after is slowly run away (no swiftness)

A thief just has to go invisible to survive burst and has probably the best mobility and escapes out there.

I’m telling you that as Thief I have WAY more survivability then Revenant has.
Even to cure condis Revenants have to use some weird gimmicks or equip a legend just for that..

A thief can still get hit while they’re invisible. Not to mention shadows embrace doesnt cure immob anymore so have fun trying to get out of that one. Furthermore, Shadows Refuge isn’t fullproof either if the team can get the proper cleave going and being a squishy thief, you probably wont be able to take the extra damage a heavy armor Revenant can take and the double heals+spam rolls I mentioned are assuming you have legend swap ready or more than 50 energy on Shiro. Also, you should really only need to use Riposting Shadows once and then either use your actual dodges or sword block after that.

Impossible odds should remove condi every 1sec instead pulsing that useless super speed. That thing is not needed with gap closer.

skowcia.8257:

Impossible odds should remove condi every 1sec instead pulsing that useless super speed. That thing is not needed with gap closer.

Now that is a more sensible idea I can get behind. Super speed is kinda weird and original impossible odds was a condi cleanse so it would make perfect sense.

skowcia.8257:

Impossible odds should remove condi every 1sec instead pulsing that useless super speed. That thing is not needed with gap closer.

Shhhh. That 4 seconds of super speed is the closest thing we have to a standing swiftness for exploration and puzzles.

We also have mallyx upkeep that removes condi.

Corran.4957:

Sword #4 block

Sword #5 can be used semi defensively (hit someone and shadowstep 600 range back) although you then pull them too you.

Shiro #7 to evade back

Shiro #8 to port to enemy that outside the burst area (takes a little more skill mind you)

..
That just ways to use todays released information to avoid burst. Shame it hasn’t got a smoke field though to blast for a bit of stealth. That would have been nice to have on Shiro

edit:
I do feel they need a little bit more in terms of defensive abilities or some access to protection, even if it is something as simple as trait that gives different boons when changing too the legends

protection – Jalis
Swiftness – Centuer
Resistance – Mallyx
Fury – Shiro
xxx – “Glint” (based on what they aiming glints style at)

My main problem with sword #4 is that it seems that you are locked into place while blocking and maybe moving will interrupt the block.

Rain.9213:

Like how Zetsumei said, necro players know how to survive without stealth or tons of mobility

The trick is Necro-stealth XD. Stand very still off to the side and people will forget you exist. Seriously, I’ve escaped zergs with this.