Just thoughts from a new rev

Just thoughts from a new rev

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Posted by: Loading.4503

Loading.4503

Just wanted to share my thoughts on rev after finally deciding to try it out, and I’m just bored at work surfing though the forums.

I’ve been playing since the start, mostly warrior and thief, I’ve tried the other professions out to learn them but never a rev, so my experience with them was just from fighting them in wvw and picking up on what the skills did as I was fighting them and learning what “rotations” people usually did.

So the other day I finally decided to actually make one go through the traits try different weapon sets and builds and when I settled one on, it was pretty similar to the meta build. Then I started reading the rev forums and reading all this stuff people complained about that I realized just from 2 days of playing.

All I can say is if I can notice all of the same stuff , bugs and things that are just plain out bleh,and come up with the meta build in just 2 days of playing a rev seriously, then SMH…. I hope anet improves on rev.

But either way I’m having fun still, loving that hammer dmg btw. Just wanted to share my thoughts and impression from someone trying out rev

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Posted by: Its Nerfing Time.1495

Its Nerfing Time.1495

In all honesty, a lot of the complaints about Rev come from the PVP/WVW scene. It’s no where near as bad as everybody makes it out to be. It’s a fun class and if you’re enjoying it then go for it.

I mained Guardian pre-hot, changed to Rev and never looked back.

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Posted by: Dinsy.2491

Dinsy.2491

Been mainly Rev since HoT came out, played warrior/guardian and ele before but can’t go back to them for long. I don’t pvp so idk how it is there but rev is fine everywhere else. There’s a lot of room for improvement but all this drama recently like the “deleted rev today” thread all seems blown well out of proportion.

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Posted by: Malchior.5732

Malchior.5732

Been mainly Rev since HoT came out, played warrior/guardian and ele before but can’t go back to them for long. I don’t pvp so idk how it is there but rev is fine everywhere else. There’s a lot of room for improvement but all this drama recently like the “deleted rev today” thread all seems blown well out of proportion.

Rev is not fine everywhere else. It’s almost completely unwanted in raids.

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Posted by: Its Nerfing Time.1495

Its Nerfing Time.1495

Been mainly Rev since HoT came out, played warrior/guardian and ele before but can’t go back to them for long. I don’t pvp so idk how it is there but rev is fine everywhere else. There’s a lot of room for improvement but all this drama recently like the “deleted rev today” thread all seems blown well out of proportion.

Rev is not fine everywhere else. It’s almost completely unwanted in raids.

Just because a class is “almost completely unwanted” in raids does not mean it’s not fine. To correct your statement, it’s “almost completely unwanted when running 100% QT bible meta runs”. Revs can do perfectly well in raids (I’ve used mine with 0 issues) if your party isn’t looking to be meta and speedclear.

I’d agree with the first guy, it’s definitely blown out of proportion.

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Posted by: Malchior.5732

Malchior.5732

Been mainly Rev since HoT came out, played warrior/guardian and ele before but can’t go back to them for long. I don’t pvp so idk how it is there but rev is fine everywhere else. There’s a lot of room for improvement but all this drama recently like the “deleted rev today” thread all seems blown well out of proportion.

Rev is not fine everywhere else. It’s almost completely unwanted in raids.

Just because a class is “almost completely unwanted” in raids does not mean it’s not fine. To correct your statement, it’s “almost completely unwanted when running 100% QT bible meta runs”. Revs can do perfectly well in raids (I’ve used mine with 0 issues) if your party isn’t looking to be meta and speedclear.

I’d agree with the first guy, it’s definitely blown out of proportion.

To correct your statement, it’s almost completely unnecessary to ever use a Revenant in raids. Using one is usually a detriment to the group. Can you complete it? Sure, but you’re almost assuredly gimping the group. You’re also making it harder on yourself to get into a squad as most people don’t even want them.

That’s not fine at all. Revenant doesn’t bring anything to the table that isn’t covered better by other classes.

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Posted by: Rashagar.8349

Rashagar.8349

Been mainly Rev since HoT came out, played warrior/guardian and ele before but can’t go back to them for long. I don’t pvp so idk how it is there but rev is fine everywhere else. There’s a lot of room for improvement but all this drama recently like the “deleted rev today” thread all seems blown well out of proportion.

Rev is not fine everywhere else. It’s almost completely unwanted in raids.

Just because a class is “almost completely unwanted” in raids does not mean it’s not fine. To correct your statement, it’s “almost completely unwanted when running 100% QT bible meta runs”. Revs can do perfectly well in raids (I’ve used mine with 0 issues) if your party isn’t looking to be meta and speedclear.

I’d agree with the first guy, it’s definitely blown out of proportion.

To correct your statement, it’s almost completely unnecessary to ever use a Revenant in raids. Using one is usually a detriment to the group. Can you complete it? Sure, but you’re almost assuredly gimping the group. You’re also making it harder on yourself to get into a squad as most people don’t even want them.

That’s not fine at all. Revenant doesn’t bring anything to the table that isn’t covered better by other classes.

Still sounds like more of an attitude problem than a revenant problem tbh.
“Gimping the group”? Please.

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Posted by: Its Nerfing Time.1495

Its Nerfing Time.1495

Been mainly Rev since HoT came out, played warrior/guardian and ele before but can’t go back to them for long. I don’t pvp so idk how it is there but rev is fine everywhere else. There’s a lot of room for improvement but all this drama recently like the “deleted rev today” thread all seems blown well out of proportion.

Rev is not fine everywhere else. It’s almost completely unwanted in raids.

Just because a class is “almost completely unwanted” in raids does not mean it’s not fine. To correct your statement, it’s “almost completely unwanted when running 100% QT bible meta runs”. Revs can do perfectly well in raids (I’ve used mine with 0 issues) if your party isn’t looking to be meta and speedclear.

I’d agree with the first guy, it’s definitely blown out of proportion.

To correct your statement, it’s almost completely unnecessary to ever use a Revenant in raids. Using one is usually a detriment to the group. Can you complete it? Sure, but you’re almost assuredly gimping the group. You’re also making it harder on yourself to get into a squad as most people don’t even want them.

That’s not fine at all. Revenant doesn’t bring anything to the table that isn’t covered better by other classes.

You forgot the words “in my opinion”. Using a Rev has never been and will never be a detriment.
As stated before, only those interested in “meta speed run” tactics, do not want xyz class/build including Rev. There is literally nothing detrimental by bringing a Rev. If you base this claim on “oh other classes can do that”. Yes, and?

Other classes can boon share, great, Rev can do it and leave the other classes free to go more DPS or heals.

Other classes can DPS more – you don’t need to speed run it, just complete it. Nobody really cares about getting it down in 5 minutes.

Rev can fill a void in any scenario, healing/condi/power as well as offer boons without sacrificing too far in either direction (unless healing as that’s all in).

So other than the above, what reason can you come up with why you think Rev shouldn’t be in the group?

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Posted by: Malchior.5732

Malchior.5732

So other than the above, what reason can you come up with why you think Rev shouldn’t be in the group?

Simple.

Want Might? Take a PS Warrior. It has better DPS, better Might, it has Banners, Empower Allies, and it still has good CC.

Want Fury? Druid covers it alongside Mesmer.

Want Protection? Druid can bring some and Hammer Guard is higher DPS with perma-protection.

Want Healing? You don’t really need the extra healing that Ventari brings, but the buffs that a Druid brings are ridiculously good.

Want Alacrity? Don’t even bother with Ventari; just take a Chrono that also supplies Quickness.

Want Power Damage? Every other class aside from Necro deals more.

Want Condi damage? Don’t even bother with Revenant.

Next you’ll say that Revenant does a lot of things so therefore it’s good, but I’ll argue that there’s literally no reason for it because I’d rather have a class that does its job well instead of one class that does a lot of jobs badly.

In essence, you ARE a detriment to your team in most cases. Why take that Rev over anything else? There’s no reason. You’re almost always better off just taking the class the Rev is trying to replace anyway. This isn’t even about “speed run” tactics, it’s just about completing it. If my goal is to complete the raid (let alone get into the raid as most people wont accept a Revenant to begin with), I have better chances with something that’s proven to work very well than something that has proven to be sub-par at almost every job.

Tell me, why should you take a Revenant over anything else? Aside from kiting the hands on Deimos, I don’t see much of a reason except that you just want to have fun.
Can Revenant complete it? Of course, but you can also 4-man Gorseval. That doesn’t mean it’s the optimal strategy. Do I need to be optimal? Technically not, but I don’t want to be “that guy” that is being less useful that I can be just so I can use a Revenant.

Also, you guys haven’t really proven me wrong. Revenant IS unwanted. I never said it’s unviable.

(edited by Malchior.5732)

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Posted by: Its Nerfing Time.1495

Its Nerfing Time.1495

So other than the above, what reason can you come up with why you think Rev shouldn’t be in the group?

Simple.

Want Might? Take a PS Warrior. It has better DPS, better Might, it has Banners, Empower Allies, and it still has good CC.

Want Fury? Druid covers it alongside Mesmer.

Want Protection? Druid can bring some and Hammer Guard is higher DPS with perma-protection.

Want Healing? You don’t really need the extra healing that Ventari brings, but the buffs that a Druid brings are ridiculously good.

Want Alacrity? Don’t even bother with Ventari; just take a Chrono that also supplies Quickness.

Want Power Damage? Every other class aside from Necro deals more.

Want Condi damage? Don’t even bother with Revenant.

Next you’ll say that Revenant does a lot of things so therefore it’s good, but I’ll argue that there’s literally no reason for it because I’d rather have a class that does its job well instead of one class that does a lot of jobs badly.

In essence, you ARE a detriment to your team in most cases. Why take that Rev over anything else? There’s no reason. You’re almost always better off just taking the class the Rev is trying to replace anyway. This isn’t even about “speed run” tactics, it’s just about completing it. If my goal is to complete the raid (let alone get into the raid as most people wont accept a Revenant to begin with), I have better chances with something that’s proven to work very well than something that has proven to be sub-par at almost every job.

Tell me, why should you take a Revenant over anything else? Aside from kiting the hands on Deimos, I don’t see much of a reason except that you just want to have fun.
Can Revenant complete it? Of course, but you can also 4-man Gorseval. That doesn’t mean it’s the optimal strategy. Do I need to be optimal? Technically not, but I don’t want to be “that guy” that is being less useful that I can be just so I can use a Revenant.

Also, you guys haven’t really proven me wrong. Revenant IS unwanted. I never said it’s unviable.

Burden of proof, you have to prove yourself right rather than us you wrong. So far, you haven’t done that. So far all you’ve done is show the “meta must do as I say” style.

PS Warrior – Warrior can focus less on Banners with a Rev and more on DPS. CC Rev has better CC with Staff, Elite and Hammer, and can raise crit via Assassins Presence

Fury can be stacked by multiple classes, but Rev can allow for others to not have to worry about it and again, focus on DPS

Protection and healing – Rev can handle it in one, rather than splitting it out into two classes (Guardian and Druid) and for a bonus now provide Alacrity (it’s not great and I honestly thought that was a pretty dumb decision, but hey Anets ability to balance properly leaves much to be desired)

Power and Condi – Rev can deal good damage on both, and you absolutely should not write off the condi of a Rev. Burning and Torment can work nice together, very nice. You’d be surprised how fast it can rip through things when properly built, like anything else in the game.

The Rev does nothing badly, it does multiple things well – provided you know what you’re doing. It certainly is not a detriment ever to any content, which if you are unable to prove (which you currently aren’t) then your claim is bunk. If you base this solely on “what’s meta” then I’ll stop you right there – the meta is simply speed clearing, and speed clearing is not 100% bible. Game is not built around speed clears and meta builds. The meta also changes over time.

Being “that guy who is less useful because Rev” means they don’t know what they’re doing on Rev.

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Posted by: Rym.1469

Rym.1469

I always liked the theme and concept of Revenant. So far, it’s the only profession in Guild Wars 2 that inhabited real resource management in a form of Energy, which I’m a huge advocate of and personally disagree with suggestions of removing resource costs from weapon skills.

I still think that, with creativity, listening to good feedback, communication (not eternal silence) Revenant can be fixed. More emphasis on resource management, traits and mechanics related to Energy that impact and shape the gameplay (Equilibrium, Charged Mists style), moving away from auto-attack reliance.

Revenant is not perfect now. It suffered great hits over the years, band-aid changes that didn’t make sense (destruction of old Mallyx “because it had anti-synergy”, but keeping the trait that increases damage for every condition on Revenant…), was incredibly rushed and released in a state in which more than half of it’s toolkit was already outdated and outright inferior.
The outrageous silence and lack of Dev interest that started right after HoT launch, as well as mind-boggling changes such as Momentary Pacification are things to keep in mind, but (hopefully) the big re-designs are coming with the next expansion/DLC.
This will be basically the moment of truth and ArenaNet’s approach is going to set the tone for the Revenant players, so they better make sure it’s good.

[rude]Antagonistka – Revenant, EU.
[SALT]Natchniony – Necromancer, EU.
Streams: http://www.twitch.tv/rym144

(edited by Rym.1469)

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Posted by: Malchior.5732

Malchior.5732

Burden of proof, you have to prove yourself right rather than us you wrong. So far, you haven’t done that. So far all you’ve done is show the “meta must do as I say” style.

Oh god, dude. I’m not saying you have to run meta, I’m saying that if you want to contribute as much as you can and want your best chances of beating the raids, you will NOT end up with a Revenant in most cases. Also, you’re the one trying to “debunk” the popular opinion on Revenant, so the burden of proof is on you.

PS Warrior – Warrior can focus less on Banners with a Rev and more on DPS. CC Rev has better CC with Staff, Elite and Hammer, and can raise crit via Assassins Presence

You can’t do that though. You still want banners even if there’s a Rev around.
In fact, it’s better now than it was before to run 2x PS Warrior because they can both just bring 1 banner each and take a different utility skill.
Not to mention that a Condi PS already out-classes Revenant DPS, but also brings more Might to the team (and the unique buffs that overshadow Rev’s by a landslide).
Also, Rev swapping to Staff is a considerable DPS loss. It’s not like Headbutt is bad CC either and with the Banner change they can swap in Wild Blow if they need more CC (about 600 break bar damage total without losing much DPS).

Fury can be stacked by multiple classes, but Rev can allow for others to not have to worry about it and again, focus on DPS

Druid doesn’t lose much by taking Tiger and a Chrono is already going to spread it around. Fury is already crazy easy to keep up without a Revenant.

Protection and healing – Rev can handle it in one, rather than splitting it out into two classes (Guardian and Druid) and for a bonus now provide Alacrity (it’s not great and I honestly thought that was a pretty dumb decision, but hey Anets ability to balance properly leaves much to be desired)

The Druids already give decent Protection uptime and already heal while providing other unique buffs.
If you want more and also don’t want the Druid to run Stone Spirit, a Hammer DH has better DPS and also gives permanent Protection.
I will say that a healing Rev pumping out perma-Protection with huge heals is pretty nice, but I’ll mention that it’s mostly not necessary.

Power and Condi – Rev can deal good damage on both, and you absolutely should not write off the condi of a Rev. Burning and Torment can work nice together, very nice. You’d be surprised how fast it can rip through things when properly built, like anything else in the game.

Power Rev gets out-damaged by literally every class except Necro.
Condi Rev relies mostly on Torment which is awful in most cases and still unreliable in the bosses that move around the most.
I don’t think I’ve ever seen a Condi Rev even come close to rivaling any other condi DPS build.

The Rev does nothing badly, it does multiple things well – provided you know what you’re doing. It certainly is not a detriment ever to any content, which if you are unable to prove (which you currently aren’t) then your claim is bunk. If you base this solely on “what’s meta” then I’ll stop you right there – the meta is simply speed clearing, and speed clearing is not 100% bible. Game is not built around speed clears and meta builds. The meta also changes over time.

It does all of those jobs worse than other classes. If there were only 5 slots in raids, I might agree with you, but there are 10. There’s enough space to cover everything without the mediocre DPS the Revenant brings.
You are, by definition, a detriment to the team when you pick a Revenant in most cases because in those cases, your team was almost always better off with something else (i.e. you specifically took something that was a worse option; it harmed your run more than it helped).

I don’t care if you want to go against the meta; use whatever, but don’t claim that Revenant is wanted and don’t claim that it’s unwanted because people are bad. The class is just overshadowed in almost every aspect.

Being “that guy who is less useful because Rev” means they don’t know what they’re doing on Rev.

I see people act like this in a lot of games. Just because you use a worse option doesn’t mean you know better or that others just don’t know what they’re doing. It generally means it’s simply a worse option that you enjoy using, but can’t accept. It simply MUST be that everyone else sucks, right?

(edited by Malchior.5732)

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Posted by: Its Nerfing Time.1495

Its Nerfing Time.1495

But you are saying it, and have been since the start. You claimed that Rev was unwanted in content, and that the best chance is without a Rev. You can clear all of the raid bosses with a Rev – there is no issue with Rev. You can clear all Fractals, dungeons, PVE content with Rev. The only time you don’t bring one, is if you want meta-speedclear-becausesomeguild/guysaidso mentality.

As for “popular opinion” – opinion at the end of the day is still opinion, majority ruled by meta speedclear mentality. That isn’t playing the game, nor is it even trying to. Instead its being bogged down because somebody elses opinion has been thrown around as fact and nobody else should go against it.
You right here, in this topic, claimed that Rev is detrimental – prove it. I’ve shown you why it isn’t.

You can though, because if the warrior has to worry less about constantly spreading and keeping up might, they can focus more on the DPS. Can they still banner? Yes. Do they need to? No.
What unique buff does Warrior provide exactly? Condi Rev can spew out might via #2 and #3. They have heavy Burning and Torment, along with some Poison.
Staff is most certainly not ever a “considerable” DPS loss. It is a slight DPS loss compared to Sword, but never has it been considerable.
My point was Rev has better CC > this still stands. So again, it allows Warrior to focus more on DPS.

Correct Druid doesn’t lose much with Tiger, however you’d want to switch to Moa for the CC and you can’t repeatedly switch pets with the cooldown. Rev can Fury AND CC, thus easing up what the others have to do.
Druid can provide GOTL and other DPS boosts, but better off not using Stone Spirit (Frost Spirit helps for Might and CC when needed).
Hammer Guard is very nice, but the DPS is slow(er) without Quickness. You can combo the two for Protection to a full 10 targets that I will say, but Rev allows for damage reduction as well as heals and cooldown reductions in one build, one spot.

In all the content and teams I’ve ever been in, can’t say I’ve ever had a DPS issue or race with others, and in all honesty – it doesn’t matter. Do things die? Yes. Do they die quickly enough? Yes. Raids and high level Fracs are about team work and balance, something a Rev really supplements and supports very well. Again, unless you’re running meta-dps-to-the-bottom-race you don’t need over-DPS or to simply boot out a class (or several).

This is my Condi build, and I regularly tear through enemies of all levels with it:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vlUQJApnn3geNSuQvJRboHlsR0kS4H6SJ4EtrkFNFKtDfoEtLIANwugJshA-TBCBQB+TPA6WYYL7DQTlgP7EAAgHAgDV/xjK/IFAELrA-e

Added on the extra tankiness from being a heavy class, the Glint heal and I can stay alive longer than other Condi’s thus to deal more DPS.

Rev does no job worse than any other class, it allows other classes to focus more on what they’re doing rather than team boon sharing or support. It takes the pressure off and makes the job smoother – that’s the point of the class.
You still haven’t shown why it’s a detriment outside of the meta-speedrun. Bringing a Rev is no harm at all as explained by all of my above. It has never been outshadowed ever, to say so is absolutely laughable. It’s most certainly not unwanted outside of meta building for content, exclude that and it’s wanted.

I never stated people sucked, I stated people don’t know what they’re doing with it. How often do you see a Rev? Or better yet, somebody who mains a Rev 24/7? What I’ve regularly seen from PVP’ers when it comes to Rev is, it can be used at high level by somebody who is very, very good at it. The same applies to PVE. If you don’t know what you’re doing with something, it will reflect that.

My main intention is to shove off a lot of the negativity around Revs that I’ve seen here, which is almost appalling. The class is not bad, nor a detriment. It is a very rewarding, fun class to play with an enormous level of flexibility.

I built up three entire sets of Ascended and did a Legendary journey just for my Rev to be able to switch between roles at a moments notice regardless of what content I’m doing and where I am. I main Rev and have a fully built Druid and Guardian as my second and thirds. I’ve played every class bar Chrono (because I simply can’t find a build I’m happy with) and have never felt the freedom or flexibility that I have with Rev. To me, that seems like a class done right

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Posted by: Buran.3796

Buran.3796

Added on the extra tankiness from being a heavy class, the Glint heal and I can stay alive longer than other Condi’s thus to deal more DPS.

I just want to remark that the concept of heavy armor classes being “tankiest” than other classes is a bit overrated and certainly outdated. There’s less than 300 toughness points of difference between a full set of light and heavy armor which means that if a Warriors goes full zerker and a Mesmer goes full zerk minus the amulet and rings (chosing knight stats in them) the Mesmer toughness is higher. Passives (traits), skill selection and even the food has more impact in the tankiness of a character that the mere fact of being a clothes, leather or metal armor user.

In GW2 “armor” means just the kind of skins and looks that your character can display (and now even less, since the outfits introduction).

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Posted by: Norjena.5172

Norjena.5172

Nerfing Time is a troll isn´t he?
Condirev is worse then every other class in pve. And power is not much better.

I was so hyped with HoT and played 300hours on my rev in 2 month without playing any other class in that time.
But today? I complete the map with her cause she is close to 100%, for everything else the other classes are so much better….Power dps? I play engi, condi? ranger. Easy fractals? Guard….and so on.

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Posted by: Its Nerfing Time.1495

Its Nerfing Time.1495

Added on the extra tankiness from being a heavy class, the Glint heal and I can stay alive longer than other Condi’s thus to deal more DPS.

I just want to remark that the concept of heavy armor classes being “tankiest” than other classes is a bit overrated and certainly outdated. There’s less than 300 toughness points of difference between a full set of light and heavy armor which means that if a Warriors goes full zerker and a Mesmer goes full zerk minus the amulet and rings (chosing knight stats in them) the Mesmer toughness is higher. Passives (traits), skill selection and even the food has more impact in the tankiness of a character that the mere fact of being a clothes, leather or metal armor user.

In GW2 “armor” means just the kind of skins and looks that your character can display (and now even less, since the outfits introduction).

Whilst this is true, I’ve certainly had an easier time being Condi on Rev rather than my Engie or Ele.

Nerfing Time is a troll isn´t he?
Condirev is worse then every other class in pve. And power is not much better.

I was so hyped with HoT and played 300hours on my rev in 2 month without playing any other class in that time.
But today? I complete the map with her cause she is close to 100%, for everything else the other classes are so much better….Power dps? I play engi, condi? ranger. Easy fractals? Guard….and so on.

So because you don’t actually have a legitimate answer, you have to claim I’m a troll? Looks like you don’t know how to build a Rev, let alone use one. Rev’s are perfectly fine, they work as power, condi or healing.
Unless you can actually answer a point, don’t bother responding or calling somebody a troll because you can’t answer.

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Posted by: XxsdgxX.8109

XxsdgxX.8109

Added on the extra tankiness from being a heavy class, the Glint heal and I can stay alive longer than other Condi’s thus to deal more DPS.

I just want to remark that the concept of heavy armor classes being “tankiest” than other classes is a bit overrated and certainly outdated. There’s less than 300 toughness points of difference between a full set of light and heavy armor which means that if a Warriors goes full zerker and a Mesmer goes full zerk minus the amulet and rings (chosing knight stats in them) the Mesmer toughness is higher. Passives (traits), skill selection and even the food has more impact in the tankiness of a character that the mere fact of being a clothes, leather or metal armor user.

In GW2 “armor” means just the kind of skins and looks that your character can display (and now even less, since the outfits introduction).

Whilst this is true, I’ve certainly had an easier time being Condi on Rev rather than my Engie or Ele.

Nerfing Time is a troll isn´t he?
Condirev is worse then every other class in pve. And power is not much better.

I was so hyped with HoT and played 300hours on my rev in 2 month without playing any other class in that time.
But today? I complete the map with her cause she is close to 100%, for everything else the other classes are so much better….Power dps? I play engi, condi? ranger. Easy fractals? Guard….and so on.

So because you don’t actually have a legitimate answer, you have to claim I’m a troll? Looks like you don’t know how to build a Rev, let alone use one. Rev’s are perfectly fine, they work as power, condi or healing.
Unless you can actually answer a point, don’t bother responding or calling somebody a troll because you can’t answer.

Stop already please, we have already noticed what you are trying to do so you are not helping the class in the slightest.

Stella Truth Seeker

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Posted by: Its Nerfing Time.1495

Its Nerfing Time.1495

Added on the extra tankiness from being a heavy class, the Glint heal and I can stay alive longer than other Condi’s thus to deal more DPS.

I just want to remark that the concept of heavy armor classes being “tankiest” than other classes is a bit overrated and certainly outdated. There’s less than 300 toughness points of difference between a full set of light and heavy armor which means that if a Warriors goes full zerker and a Mesmer goes full zerk minus the amulet and rings (chosing knight stats in them) the Mesmer toughness is higher. Passives (traits), skill selection and even the food has more impact in the tankiness of a character that the mere fact of being a clothes, leather or metal armor user.

In GW2 “armor” means just the kind of skins and looks that your character can display (and now even less, since the outfits introduction).

Whilst this is true, I’ve certainly had an easier time being Condi on Rev rather than my Engie or Ele.

Nerfing Time is a troll isn´t he?
Condirev is worse then every other class in pve. And power is not much better.

I was so hyped with HoT and played 300hours on my rev in 2 month without playing any other class in that time.
But today? I complete the map with her cause she is close to 100%, for everything else the other classes are so much better….Power dps? I play engi, condi? ranger. Easy fractals? Guard….and so on.

So because you don’t actually have a legitimate answer, you have to claim I’m a troll? Looks like you don’t know how to build a Rev, let alone use one. Rev’s are perfectly fine, they work as power, condi or healing.
Unless you can actually answer a point, don’t bother responding or calling somebody a troll because you can’t answer.

Stop already please, we have already noticed what you are trying to do so you are not helping the class in the slightest.

And what exactly is it you think I’m trying to do? Bring in some positivity to the Rev forum which appears to be 98% “rev is bad in pvp/pve so don’t play it”? Force people to actually think and play the class? Maybe not have new players come in and get bombarded by “~class is kitten and junk tier lols”?

I’m helping it more than a lot of other people here. I don’t prejudge anybody’s gear, class or ability.

Just thoughts from a new rev

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Posted by: Malchior.5732

Malchior.5732

I’m sorry, but get informed first.

“What unique buff does Warrior provide exactly? Condi Rev can spew out might via #2 and #3.”

Dude, seriously?
Condi PS Warr has Banner of Strength, Banner of Discipline, and Empower Allies and generates 20+ Might super easily and doesn’t rely so much on combo fields which can be overwritten.

What does your Rev bring? Assassin’s Presence. Pretty much the same DPS increase as Empower Allies, but the Warrior brings so much more, with better consistency AND higher DPS.

Don’t even talk about Condi Rev like it’s good. Show me a DPS rotation that is even comparable to any other DPS spec and I’ll retract my statement, but I really doubt you can.

You’re not helping anyone like this by essentially overselling the Rev on everything. You’re just spreading misinformation.

If a new player wants the truth:

Revenant is NOT wanted in raids. You will be more successful and invited into many more groups if you DO NOT play a Revenant.

You also clearly don’t understand what I meant by Rev being a detriment.
Lets say group A is a normal raid group and group B is exactly the same but uses a Revenant. Neither group is that good; they’re just trying to kill the boss.
Now lets say that group A takes 7 minutes and 30 seconds to kill a boss and group B takes 8 minutes and hits the enrage timer, greatly risking a wipe.
Which group would you prefer to be in? It’s only a 30 second difference after all.
When there’s a clearly superior option readily available, why pick the lesser one?
You are hurting your team.

Maybe your group is good enough that it doesn’t matter, but I personally think everyone should be bringing their best unless they’re just going in with different stuff for fun with their guildies.

With that said, I’m not going to respond to Its Nerfing Time again. It’s more like a waste of time…

Just thoughts from a new rev

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Posted by: Its Nerfing Time.1495

Its Nerfing Time.1495

I asked you what unique buff, which is what you stated. Might is not unique to Warriors ergo what buff exactly? If you’re talking about Empower Allies then that’s fine, but your post looks like you’re claiming Might only. Revs have Assassin’s Presence. My point was again which you fail to understand, is that Rev allows Warrior to focus less on Might generation and more on DPS.

Warrior brings more in what way exactly?

Condi Rev IS good, however my point stands proven – you are only interested in meta-speedrun and nothing else.

I haven’t oversold the Rev in any capacity, I’m stating what the Rev CAN actually do. You are underselling it because of your own prejudice towards meta builds and nothing else. There’s a big difference.

Corrected statement below:

Revenant is NOT wanted in raids when using meta-speedrun QT parties or guilds.

Your example of hurting the team is out and out a fallacy, if you aren’t interested in a speed run. Both parties get the kill, both parties move forward. If you are that obsessed by 30 seconds, PVE is not the place for you.

You can refuse to respond to me, it only shows you have nothing to discredit my claim with – that you are only interested in meta-speedrun tactics (despite you claiming otherwise). You do not need this to get ahead in the game, you do not need this to do or complete the game.

If your’e happy with cookie cutter builds and no imagination – be my guest.

If a new player wants actual input, they should ignore 98% of the Rev forum whining and actually try out the class, rather than reading all of the “mule class lols” comments and how it’s not wanted anywhere from posts like yours, because speed running and meta builds are not how the game was made nor intended. Player specific wants are not relevant.

(edited by Its Nerfing Time.1495)

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Posted by: ArthurDent.9538

ArthurDent.9538

They are the worst class in the game for raids because they lack a niche. With the sole exception of kiting hands at deimos, every raid comp could be improved by replacing rev with a better class. This makes rev bad in the sense it is bad relative to all the other classes, not in the sense it is so bad it can’t complete content. However since there is always a better option to rev, it does make completing raids harder since most groups will not accept you using one in the first place. Typically they will ask you to reroll, or just find someone else because why run with a decisively sub par class when there are plenty of pugs to choose from?

14 Dungeon paths soloed
Lupi solos on 9/9 professions
Wost Engi NA

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Posted by: Its Nerfing Time.1495

Its Nerfing Time.1495

They are the worst class in the game for raids because they lack a niche. With the sole exception of kiting hands at deimos, every raid comp could be improved by replacing rev with a better class. This makes rev bad in the sense it is bad relative to all the other classes, not in the sense it is so bad it can’t complete content. However since there is always a better option to rev, it does make completing raids harder since most groups will not accept you using one in the first place. Typically they will ask you to reroll, or just find someone else because why run with a decisively sub par class when there are plenty of pugs to choose from?

In what way does a class that can fill any role, lack a niche?

If the Rev can supplement and help other classes focus more on support or DPS, why is it a bad pick (we’re assuming no meta-speedrun mentality)?

I personally have never encountered this whole “groups will make you re-pick” and if I did, would not waste my time with them. The Rev is definitely not “sub par” in terms of a class.

Just thoughts from a new rev

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Posted by: ArthurDent.9538

ArthurDent.9538

They are the worst class in the game for raids because they lack a niche. With the sole exception of kiting hands at deimos, every raid comp could be improved by replacing rev with a better class. This makes rev bad in the sense it is bad relative to all the other classes, not in the sense it is so bad it can’t complete content. However since there is always a better option to rev, it does make completing raids harder since most groups will not accept you using one in the first place. Typically they will ask you to reroll, or just find someone else because why run with a decisively sub par class when there are plenty of pugs to choose from?

In what way does a class that can fill any role, lack a niche?

If the Rev can supplement and help other classes focus more on support or DPS, why is it a bad pick (we’re assuming no meta-speedrun mentality)?

I personally have never encountered this whole “groups will make you re-pick” and if I did, would not waste my time with them. The Rev is definitely not “sub par” in terms of a class.

It can fill any role and is mediocre at all of them. It can dps both condi and power are out classed in general before factoring in rev actually loses a lot more damage in a real raid scenario. The qt benchmark rotation uses a selfish rotation meant to maximize personal DPS at the expense of nearly all utility. With such a rotation you get fury, a few might stacks, assassin’s presence and naturalistic resonance. Ap is the only noteworthy addition to a group as everything else is easily made redundant. So with selfish and minimal support, your DPS is still out classed by ele, engine, ranger, thief, guard, war, and situationally necro, mes. This means to justify using a rev over something else, they need to utilize their utility, as raw DPS is not competitive. So want protection and good cc? Swapping to staff guts your DPS for 10 seconds, while pulsing reasonable amounts of protection costs too much energy for equalibrium damage procs. Want stability, projectile defense, or resistance? Bye bye Jalis hammers, now DPS is abysmal, and a hammer guard can do all of that baring resistance with way more DPS. Then there are the bugs, Jalis hammers turning them selves off, precision strike splitting damage with adds or targeting the sky. You find despite a simple rotation on paper, rev generally loses a lot more DPS in a real raid scenario compared to other classes.

Then there is healing. It can heal a lot but has 2 things making it non competitive. It doesn’t bring the op buffs druid brings, and the small radius of tablet heals cripples it on bosses where players are regularly spreading out which really hurts on Matthias. Then out side of Matthias, healing requirements are so low druid can easily handle them while boosting group DPS massively.

The big issue isn’t that there is no reason to take a rev, they can give some nice things. The problem is there is no reason to take a rev over one of classes that can either do its job better, or do its job adequately and also do more things better.

14 Dungeon paths soloed
Lupi solos on 9/9 professions
Wost Engi NA

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Posted by: Its Nerfing Time.1495

Its Nerfing Time.1495

It’s honestly rather amusing people seem to honestly, for whatever reason, think Rev is mediocre. Rev does not lose anywhere near the amount of DPS you seem to believe it does, and it’s certainly not outclassed.

QT run calculations for meta-speedrun, they do it very well. They even admit in their own posts for people not to take it so seriously though, and to play what they enjoy. It is not, as you have said, to be used as a means to justify anything other than Rev. Hence my point, if you aren’t going on QT meta-speedrun, then you are losing literally nothing bringing Rev, but you are gaining the ability to have multiple things in one raid slot. You are gaining the ability to let the Rev keep up boons longer, and let the DPS focus on DPS, the support on support.

Healing wise, it can bring 3 things. Heals, Protection and Alacrity. Where groups run two healing druids, they often don’t run two full heals. Since GOTL affects 10 now, you could easily run Rev/Druid for heal and protectio (I’ve done this in a group before to great effect).

The biggest issue here, is that everybody seems to be utterly obsessed with whats meta, what’s speedrun, what’s in or out decided by QT. That’s something that needs to change rather urgently.

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Posted by: choovanski.5462

choovanski.5462

It’s honestly rather amusing people seem to honestly, for whatever reason, think Rev is mediocre. Rev does not lose anywhere near the amount of DPS you seem to believe it does, and it’s certainly not outclassed.

QT run calculations for meta-speedrun, they do it very well. They even admit in their own posts for people not to take it so seriously though, and to play what they enjoy. It is not, as you have said, to be used as a means to justify anything other than Rev. Hence my point, if you aren’t going on QT meta-speedrun, then you are losing literally nothing bringing Rev, but you are gaining the ability to have multiple things in one raid slot. You are gaining the ability to let the Rev keep up boons longer, and let the DPS focus on DPS, the support on support.

Healing wise, it can bring 3 things. Heals, Protection and Alacrity. Where groups run two healing druids, they often don’t run two full heals. Since GOTL affects 10 now, you could easily run Rev/Druid for heal and protectio (I’ve done this in a group before to great effect).

The biggest issue here, is that everybody seems to be utterly obsessed with whats meta, what’s speedrun, what’s in or out decided by QT. That’s something that needs to change rather urgently.

well technically you can complete a raid on a character with no traits or gear equipped.

like, if you don’t care about efficiency, time taken or anything like that (which you don’t seem to) a class that does everything worse than the other is fine. but homes not caring about a class beings competitive does not make it competitive.

anyhow, meta will never be gone from mmos, people just like to make informed choices with success as the goal. since all the meta is is the most efficient way to do content as proven by research, people are always going to be interested.

. Engi & Warr . Beta > 2017 Death of PvP
currently a Boyfriend main :P
Waiting To ReRoll Mystic & Forget About Tyria

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Posted by: Its Nerfing Time.1495

Its Nerfing Time.1495

It’s honestly rather amusing people seem to honestly, for whatever reason, think Rev is mediocre. Rev does not lose anywhere near the amount of DPS you seem to believe it does, and it’s certainly not outclassed.

QT run calculations for meta-speedrun, they do it very well. They even admit in their own posts for people not to take it so seriously though, and to play what they enjoy. It is not, as you have said, to be used as a means to justify anything other than Rev. Hence my point, if you aren’t going on QT meta-speedrun, then you are losing literally nothing bringing Rev, but you are gaining the ability to have multiple things in one raid slot. You are gaining the ability to let the Rev keep up boons longer, and let the DPS focus on DPS, the support on support.

Healing wise, it can bring 3 things. Heals, Protection and Alacrity. Where groups run two healing druids, they often don’t run two full heals. Since GOTL affects 10 now, you could easily run Rev/Druid for heal and protectio (I’ve done this in a group before to great effect).

The biggest issue here, is that everybody seems to be utterly obsessed with whats meta, what’s speedrun, what’s in or out decided by QT. That’s something that needs to change rather urgently.

well technically you can complete a raid on a character with no traits or gear equipped.

like, if you don’t care about efficiency, time taken or anything like that (which you don’t seem to) a class that does everything worse than the other is fine. but homes not caring about a class beings competitive does not make it competitive.

anyhow, meta will never be gone from mmos, people just like to make informed choices with success as the goal. since all the meta is is the most efficient way to do content as proven by research, people are always going to be interested.

Oh I more than understand there will always be a meta, and I have no issue with it either. The issue I have, is when people 100% insist on it and nothing else, and refuse to listen otherwise. If people want to play meta, be my guest. But don’t insist on it 100% and claim a class/race/item/insertxhere is useless when it isn’t, just because it doesn’t fit the current meta.

The whole “rev does nothing better” really needs to die off. Here’s a perfect example:

Game has 10 characters
Only 3 are deemed “meta quickrun viable”
Would you say it’s fine to only ever use the 3 “viable” no matter what? No matter what happens, is said or whatever, it’s those 3 or nothing? Even if the other are perfectly fine? They just won’t be accepted, and instead demonized because they aren’t in the three meta characters.

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Posted by: Loading.4503

Loading.4503

Finally got back around to reading up on this thread, just go too serious for me, imma just go back to flinging hammers at people in wvw >.>

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Posted by: Its Nerfing Time.1495

Its Nerfing Time.1495

Finally got back around to reading up on this thread, just go too serious for me, imma just go back to flinging hammers at people in wvw >.>

That was my biggest concern from people just calling the Rev crap and not wanted. Like I’ve said earlier, give it a try out and see what you think of it, ignore the other comments

Just thoughts from a new rev

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Posted by: XxsdgxX.8109

XxsdgxX.8109

Finally got back around to reading up on this thread, just go too serious for me, imma just go back to flinging hammers at people in wvw >.>

Here you got it right with Rev, it’s the only place where you could call it “good”. And that’s the only thing I’ve been doing as well since some of the PvP overnerfs didn’t make it to WvW. The occasional 9k with CoR on glass cannons is fun but most of the time you just keep landing 3k’s (Yes with CoR and while using Zerk/Marauders) because so much people is using tank gear like Minstrels and Trailblazer.

Stella Truth Seeker

(edited by XxsdgxX.8109)

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Posted by: Its Nerfing Time.1495

Its Nerfing Time.1495

Finally got back around to reading up on this thread, just go too serious for me, imma just go back to flinging hammers at people in wvw >.>

Here you got it right with Rev, it’s the only place where you could call it “good”. And that’s the only thing I’ve been doing as well since some of the PvP overnerfs didn’t make it to WvW. The occasional 9k with CoR on glass cannons is fun but most of the time you just keep landing 3k’s (Yes with CoR and while using Zerk/Marauders) because so much people is using tank gear like Minstrels and Trailblazer.

Please see above posts as to why Rev is “good” in places other than PVP (Yes WVW is PVP)

Just thoughts from a new rev

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Posted by: Burtnik.5218

Burtnik.5218

Finally got back around to reading up on this thread, just go too serious for me, imma just go back to flinging hammers at people in wvw >.>

Here you got it right with Rev, it’s the only place where you could call it “good”. And that’s the only thing I’ve been doing as well since some of the PvP overnerfs didn’t make it to WvW. The occasional 9k with CoR on glass cannons is fun but most of the time you just keep landing 3k’s (Yes with CoR and while using Zerk/Marauders) because so much people is using tank gear like Minstrels and Trailblazer.

Please see above posts as to why Rev is “good” in places other than PVP (Yes WVW is PVP)

Revenant is outclassed in any role. The only reason why anyone would play rev nowdays is either they are being a masochist, some tryhard or some yolo full zerk spamming cor in wvw for lulz big nambars. Thats it, now stop spreading misinformation and go somewhere else.

Salt, salt, moar salt. So salty like fries from McDonald!
Playing Smite since mid s2, f broken gw2.

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Posted by: Its Nerfing Time.1495

Its Nerfing Time.1495

Finally got back around to reading up on this thread, just go too serious for me, imma just go back to flinging hammers at people in wvw >.>

Here you got it right with Rev, it’s the only place where you could call it “good”. And that’s the only thing I’ve been doing as well since some of the PvP overnerfs didn’t make it to WvW. The occasional 9k with CoR on glass cannons is fun but most of the time you just keep landing 3k’s (Yes with CoR and while using Zerk/Marauders) because so much people is using tank gear like Minstrels and Trailblazer.

Please see above posts as to why Rev is “good” in places other than PVP (Yes WVW is PVP)

Revenant is outclassed in any role. The only reason why anyone would play rev nowdays is either they are being a masochist, some tryhard or some yolo full zerk spamming cor in wvw for lulz big nambars. Thats it, now stop spreading misinformation and go somewhere else.

Except it isn’t, and the only one spreading misinformation is you. I’ve seen you plenty of times in the Rev forum just flat out whining about how “rev is useless pls delete”.

Rev is perfectly fine outside of PVP. If you just aren’t good enough or willing to spend the time, that is your problem Burt. It has never been outclassed in it’s role because it’s role is so diverse.

Just thoughts from a new rev

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Posted by: Muy.3170

Muy.3170

Revenant feels like it’s missing stuff still, should get a core set of skills that follow everything between dmg mitigation, condi cleanses, stun break and you could swap these 3 utilities between your existing legend. Mostly I think revenants just missing fun PvE rotations anyways it’s always spam auto attack or staff 5 on break bar and goes back to spamming auto. You never use the weapons to their full extent. That’s what players want when they say revenants boring or simple and lackluster. Heck improve the traits so a condition spec would actually work is another improvement of life feature revenant needs.

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Posted by: Its Nerfing Time.1495

Its Nerfing Time.1495

Revenant feels like it’s missing stuff still, should get a core set of skills that follow everything between dmg mitigation, condi cleanses, stun break and you could swap these 3 utilities between your existing legend. Mostly I think revenants just missing fun PvE rotations anyways it’s always spam auto attack or staff 5 on break bar and goes back to spamming auto. You never use the weapons to their full extent. That’s what players want when they say revenants boring or simple and lackluster. Heck improve the traits so a condition spec would actually work is another improvement of life feature revenant needs.

In a sense, Rev already has this. Staff 4 has Condi cleanse, Ventari has it, Jalis heal has it, you can trait it on legend switch.

Stun break I think other than maybe Ventari all of the legends have it, and again you can train stun break on legend switch.

Damage mitigation can be done through Shield, Sword, Staff and Hammer. To a degree Axe if you’re fast enough.

I personally main the staff and very rarely use the Sword because I find it a hell of a lot more fun. I constantly adapt my Rev to the situation around me (Do I switch to Ventari and use it’s Projectile absorb if I know there’s going to be heavy ranged damage? Do I switch to Mallynx for constant boon strip, which can also be traited (but requires 2+ boons to active), do I have Jalis ready for heal, damage resistance and condi clear?). I love that it’s such a flexible class, if you can pull out the utmost from it, it responds in kind.

Just thoughts from a new rev

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Posted by: Buran.3796

Buran.3796

Phase Traversal souldn’t ever have been nerfed: without range damage and gap closers Revs are free biscuits for thieves and condi mesmers in WvW. Both these classes have permanent pressure due condition damage and range and still retain access to stealth and better mobility in terms of disengaging/resetting the fight as many times as they want.