Guild Wars 2

Just as the title says i am trying to get a feeler on what and where people think the revenant will fit into groups.

I plan on playing a revenant as my second main after my guardian and i just want to know what other people think the revenant will fit in as such as Tank/dps etc.

Revs right now are one of the top dps/support/tanky class in the entire game mainly because their dps rotation can largely nail down to auto attack which means Heralds can generate support boons without any hinderance. Infuse light is pretty much an invul, shield 5 is a block and sword 3 as full frame evade means they are incredibly hard to kill as well.

Honestly at this point I kind of wish they would nerf AA and move the damage to other skills like off hand sword a bit so the dps rotation is not just AA AA AA.

Warscythes.9307:

Revs right now are one of the top dps/support/tanky class in the entire game mainly because their dps rotation can largely nail down to auto attack which means Heralds can generate support boons without any hinderance. Infuse light is pretty much an invul, shield 5 is a block and sword 3 as full frame evade means they are incredibly hard to kill as well.

Honestly at this point I kind of wish they would nerf AA and move the damage to other skills like off hand sword a bit so the dps rotation is not just AA AA AA.

How about the weapons then how do they fare?

I know for a fact sword/staff/shield/hammer are really really good.

Not sure about axe/mace but that is a condi set I believe and I am not very familiar with condi rev, somebody has to fill that out for me.

I think sword/axe is has the most dps of any weapon set up

Warscythes.9307:

Revs right now are one of the top dps/support/tanky class in the entire game

No, definitely not.
Big Revenant supporter here and I will be maining the class as well, but we have to stay realistic here. DPS is high but still below Elementalists. We have a strong projectile destruction, but unfortunately that is sub-par compared to reflects. We don’t buff as much might as a Phalanx Warrior. We don’t provide stealth, and little weakness and blinds. Even vulnerability which is one of the Revenant’s strongest points isn’t actually worth taking a Revenant over something else.

For fractals and dungeons I don’t see Revenants taking a core slot. Raids are a different story, but we only know 1 boss so far so I don’t know how much point there is discussing that. Then again, we don’t know how the level 51+ fractals will look either.

Revenant is a very strong and versatile class however. But we don’t really bring anything unique other classes can’t bring on top of even more stuff.

DPS is below ele and sin engies? True, but is not that far off especially with ice bow being trashed. Staff ele truly shines when the boss is huge and doesn’t require much movement which is why you don’t see them in Vale guardian. Sin engie is really the only one that rev can’t honestly really beat but honestly, both staff ele and sin engie are outliers in the dps metrics. Rev is top tier dps without a doubt.

You are right on the might stacking, but I think I was able to stack to 14? might stacks as rev but keep up also a 80~90% protection coverage. PS is only 18~20ish stacks I think? I am pretty sure people would give up those few stacks for almost constant protection. True on projectile reflects and debuffs but with things are going with breakbars everything, debuffs is looking weaker and weaker.

I will definitely agree Rev is probably not going to be as mandatory as the ele/war/guard trinity but it can easily fit the bill for any of them in fractals. But really with Raids being the “true” end game content, that is what I am mostly looking at. Herald in general provide great might stacking + perma fury, very very high protection uptime with dps that is only below two of the top best dps spec in the game while being incredibly tanky.

They are really good in general because the things they bring will always be good almost no matter what the content is. Unless they make some raid that requires a huge amount of niche usage of reflects/weakness/blind etc, I am pretty sure you will see 2-3 rev in every single raid composition.

Mesmer here.

Guardians were taken for reflect and because they out dps mesmers. However with alacrity our community hypothesized the new meta would be 2 ele, 1 chronomancer, 1 warrior, 1 revenant.

The uptime on quickness and alacrity makes for a group that out dps the current meta.

Revenant becomes a half warrior, half guard. Taken for niche stat increases.

The mesmer would be half guard, half thief.

Bovan.9481:

Warscythes.9307:

Revs right now are one of the top dps/support/tanky class in the entire game

No, definitely not.
Big Revenant supporter here and I will be maining the class as well, but we have to stay realistic here. DPS is high but still below Elementalists. We have a strong projectile destruction, but unfortunately that is sub-par compared to reflects. We don’t buff as much might as a Phalanx Warrior. We don’t provide stealth, and little weakness and blinds. Even vulnerability which is one of the Revenant’s strongest points isn’t actually worth taking a Revenant over something else.

For fractals and dungeons I don’t see Revenants taking a core slot. Raids are a different story, but we only know 1 boss so far so I don’t know how much point there is discussing that. Then again, we don’t know how the level 51+ fractals will look either.

Revenant is a very strong and versatile class however. But we don’t really bring anything unique other classes can’t bring on top of even more stuff.

Boon duration is quite a lot. Boon on demand is also very interesting. And no, Revenant has the highest DPS in the game versus single targets, but the more support the rev gives, the less is the DPS.

Besides, there is much more than DPS to a meta composition, which is why after the ice bow nerf 2 eles is not going to be meta anymore for old content.

Warscythes.9307:

Honestly at this point I kind of wish they would nerf AA and move the damage to other skills like off hand sword a bit so the dps rotation is not just AA AA AA.

Absolutely not. This is what allows you to have energy costs on weapon skills, situational non-damaging skills on legends, and lets you make a defensive pick like shield without sacrificing major DPS. It’s a core aspect of the profession design and one of my favorite things about it. Instead of trying to think of Revenant like other professions, try to look at it from a different perspective. This is a profession that abounds with situational abilities rather than complex rotations where everything is used on cooldown (e.g. elementalist or engineer).

As to where revenant fits, that’s up to the player. DPS, support, and tanking or combinations thereof are all viable options.

Zeroth.7046:

Bovan.9481:

Warscythes.9307:

Revs right now are one of the top dps/support/tanky class in the entire game

No, definitely not.
Big Revenant supporter here and I will be maining the class as well, but we have to stay realistic here. DPS is high but still below Elementalists. We have a strong projectile destruction, but unfortunately that is sub-par compared to reflects. We don’t buff as much might as a Phalanx Warrior. We don’t provide stealth, and little weakness and blinds. Even vulnerability which is one of the Revenant’s strongest points isn’t actually worth taking a Revenant over something else.

For fractals and dungeons I don’t see Revenants taking a core slot. Raids are a different story, but we only know 1 boss so far so I don’t know how much point there is discussing that. Then again, we don’t know how the level 51+ fractals will look either.

Revenant is a very strong and versatile class however. But we don’t really bring anything unique other classes can’t bring on top of even more stuff.

Boon duration is quite a lot. Boon on demand is also very interesting. And no, Revenant has the highest DPS in the game versus single targets, but the more support the rev gives, the less is the DPS.

Besides, there is much more than DPS to a meta composition, which is why after the ice bow nerf 2 eles is not going to be meta anymore for old content.

2 eles don’t bring just icebow. They bring fireball +lava font. The nerf hurt thieves more than eles. They won’t be taken anymore because their stealth can be given by a mesmer or an engie.

Daniel Handler.4816:

2 eles don’t bring just icebow. They bring fireball +lava font. The nerf hurt thieves more than eles. They won’t be taken anymore because their stealth can be given by a mesmer or an engie.

They don’t bring solely that, but the ability to stack that much damage thanks to Ice Bow was very important in the composition. The second staff ele brings nothing but DPS at this point, and in that sense there are other classes which can fill its niche giving more utility to the team.

Zeroth.7046:

Daniel Handler.4816:

2 eles don’t bring just icebow. They bring fireball +lava font. The nerf hurt thieves more than eles. They won’t be taken anymore because their stealth can be given by a mesmer or an engie.

They don’t bring solely that, but the ability to stack that much damage thanks to Ice Bow was very important in the composition. The second staff ele brings nothing but DPS at this point, and in that sense there are other classes which can fill its niche giving more utility to the team.

That’s would require a class with similar dps to an ele.

I could see ele, scrapper, herald, chrono, berserker.
The niche things thieves brought can be replaced. The things guardians brought can be brought by the other classes . And mesmer alacrity would make this setup out perform the old meta.

Rev is definitely one of the best dps options behind sinister engineer and staff ele, they are definitely going to be in the new meta.

I honestly dont understand how people can expect Rev to not shake up the meta in some way. Its a new class. Its going to happen. Would you rather have Rev be in the state it was in during the first beta weekend??

Daniel Handler.4816:

Mesmer here.

Guardians were taken for reflect and because they out dps mesmers. However with alacrity our community hypothesized the new meta would be 2 ele, 1 chronomancer, 1 warrior, 1 revenant.

The uptime on quickness and alacrity makes for a group that out dps the current meta.

Revenant becomes a half warrior, half guard. Taken for niche stat increases.

The mesmer would be half guard, half thief.

theres no reason to take Rev over Guard for fractals/dungeons. Raids, maybe because its unknown territory, but as if now, Guardian is still a boss hog due to reflects

Azure.8670:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Mesmer here.

Guardians were taken for reflect and because they out dps mesmers. However with alacrity our community hypothesized the new meta would be 2 ele, 1 chronomancer, 1 warrior, 1 revenant.

The uptime on quickness and alacrity makes for a group that out dps the current meta.

Revenant becomes a half warrior, half guard. Taken for niche stat increases.

The mesmer would be half guard, half thief.

theres no reason to take Rev over Guard for fractals/dungeons. Raids, maybe because its unknown territory, but as if now, Guardian is still a boss hog due to reflects

Chronomancer puts out better reflection than guardians. Chronomancer and revenant allow for near perma uptime on alacrity and quickness. That dps wise out performs the current meta.

Azure.8670:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Mesmer here.

Guardians were taken for reflect and because they out dps mesmers. However with alacrity our community hypothesized the new meta would be 2 ele, 1 chronomancer, 1 warrior, 1 revenant.

The uptime on quickness and alacrity makes for a group that out dps the current meta.

Revenant becomes a half warrior, half guard. Taken for niche stat increases.

The mesmer would be half guard, half thief.

theres no reason to take Rev over Guard for fractals/dungeons. Raids, maybe because its unknown territory, but as if now, Guardian is still a boss hog due to reflects

Projectile control is why guardians are needed, along the the utilities in terms of boons and etc. Revenant is capable of covering that role thanks to having a reliable shield of the avenger that can be up for a long time, which complements whenever mesmer lacks projectile reflection uptime.

Both are fine for fractals, doing different things, but they are also capable of controlling enemy projectiles with great efficiency.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Azure.8670:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Mesmer here.

Guardians were taken for reflect and because they out dps mesmers. However with alacrity our community hypothesized the new meta would be 2 ele, 1 chronomancer, 1 warrior, 1 revenant.

The uptime on quickness and alacrity makes for a group that out dps the current meta.

Revenant becomes a half warrior, half guard. Taken for niche stat increases.

The mesmer would be half guard, half thief.

theres no reason to take Rev over Guard for fractals/dungeons. Raids, maybe because its unknown territory, but as if now, Guardian is still a boss hog due to reflects

Chronomancer puts out better reflection than guardians. Chronomancer and revenant allow for near perma uptime on alacrity and quickness. That dps wise out performs the current meta.

I dont know about this. What utilities and set up would you use to have feedback and such on your bar, and still maintain aoe quickness might and alac?

Azure.8670:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Azure.8670:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Mesmer here.

Guardians were taken for reflect and because they out dps mesmers. However with alacrity our community hypothesized the new meta would be 2 ele, 1 chronomancer, 1 warrior, 1 revenant.

The uptime on quickness and alacrity makes for a group that out dps the current meta.

Revenant becomes a half warrior, half guard. Taken for niche stat increases.

The mesmer would be half guard, half thief.

theres no reason to take Rev over Guard for fractals/dungeons. Raids, maybe because its unknown territory, but as if now, Guardian is still a boss hog due to reflects

Chronomancer puts out better reflection than guardians. Chronomancer and revenant allow for near perma uptime on alacrity and quickness. That dps wise out performs the current meta.

I dont know about this. What utilities and set up would you use to have feedback and such on your bar, and still maintain aoe quickness might and alac?

All of these arguments about rev or mesmer being able to dominate but like… How would rev be able to do better? With ventari? What are you giving up for that? Guardian will still be in the meta and mesmer will have to give something else up to take its place outright.

Again, meta is going to change. Its to be expected. Get over it.

Also slightly off topic, dont forget that shiro does not play friendly with other sources of quickness. Hopefully that is being fixed.

The reflects for rev I believe is actually a hammer skill. 6 seconds of reflect on a 12 second cooldown Guards are 10 sec reflect on 40 sec cooldown, revs on average have 8 more seconds of reflect uptime than guardians do, you can do all this with a shiro/glint build. Not to mention you can give the team permanent fury+ might stacks( though i admit thats not wonderful with ps warriors around) you could also choose to give permanent protection instead.

Azure.8670:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Azure.8670:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Mesmer here.

Guardians were taken for reflect and because they out dps mesmers. However with alacrity our community hypothesized the new meta would be 2 ele, 1 chronomancer, 1 warrior, 1 revenant.

The uptime on quickness and alacrity makes for a group that out dps the current meta.

Revenant becomes a half warrior, half guard. Taken for niche stat increases.

The mesmer would be half guard, half thief.

theres no reason to take Rev over Guard for fractals/dungeons. Raids, maybe because its unknown territory, but as if now, Guardian is still a boss hog due to reflects

Chronomancer puts out better reflection than guardians. Chronomancer and revenant allow for near perma uptime on alacrity and quickness. That dps wise out performs the current meta.

I dont know about this. What utilities and set up would you use to have feedback and such on your bar, and still maintain aoe quickness might and alac?

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/PvE-The-New-Chronomancer-Dungeon-Rotation/first#post5517768

When feedback is needed simply switch the utilities to well heal + feedback+ mimic+ well of recall+ time warp.

With facet of nature mesmers and elementalists and ps warriors are boosted in function. And revenants bring a combat boost to ferocity, much more useful than a guardians boost to toughness.

which yes, guardians will continue to shine in fractals, but in raids I have to wonder if they will be useful at all.

The one to Rule.2593:

The reflects for rev I believe is actually a hammer skill. 6 seconds of reflect on a 12 second cooldown Guards are 10 sec reflect on 40 sec cooldown, revs on average have 8 more seconds of reflect uptime than guardians do, you can do all this with a shiro/glint build. Not to mention you can give the team permanent fury+ might stacks( though i admit thats not wonderful with ps warriors around) you could also choose to give permanent protection instead.

Its not a reflect. revenant does not have a reflect. Projectile destroyer is inferior to reflects.

Nickthemoonwolf.1485:

The one to Rule.2593:

The reflects for rev I believe is actually a hammer skill. 6 seconds of reflect on a 12 second cooldown Guards are 10 sec reflect on 40 sec cooldown, revs on average have 8 more seconds of reflect uptime than guardians do, you can do all this with a shiro/glint build. Not to mention you can give the team permanent fury+ might stacks( though i admit thats not wonderful with ps warriors around) you could also choose to give permanent protection instead.

Its not a reflect. revenant does not have a reflect. Projectile destroyer is inferior to reflects.

Ah my mistake, you’re right. even so, so far from what we’ve seen neither are useful in raids so far, and I already stated guardians will still be useful in fractals. We’ll wait and see, but from what i’ve seen so far it seems like rev is bringing more to a team than a guardian in any other situation where reflects and stability is not really needed.

Nickthemoonwolf.1485:

Its not a reflect. revenant does not have a reflect. Projectile destroyer is inferior to reflects.

This is true. But why do people insist guardian/rev is either/or? They go together like peanut butter and jelly. Take both.

Misguided.5139:

Nickthemoonwolf.1485:

Its not a reflect. revenant does not have a reflect. Projectile destroyer is inferior to reflects.

This is true. But why do people insist guardian/rev is either/or? They go together like peanut butter and jelly. Take both.

This is exactly what I’m saying. You cant argue about revenant taking guardians place in meta because of reflects and then backpeddal to an argument about reflects not being useful in raids. How do you know that? We havent even seen the full first wing of the raid, just the first encounter!
Even if reflects DONT end up being useful in the raids, they’re still superior to straight up projectile destruction skills regardless, and will ALWAYS have a place in dungeons/fractals. Revenant can not maintain perma protection, just has very high uptime on it. Guardian does too.
So mesmer can swap out utilities, so can every other class. This is not something unique. Revenant is in a place that it maintains very good mobile DPS and thats not a bad thing. Its not a bad thing that engineer has very high targetable condition damage.
Revenant can pump out boons OR it can max dps with shiro’s quickness up. Facet of nature being on keeps revenant from being able to pop and maintain protection. Any other source of quickness causes UA to bug out.
Its not a perfect world, no class can run every utility at once, no class can be absolutely perfect at every job at the exact same time. Sacrifices are made. The meta changes, and things are being added to the game. Revenant is an entire class, it is going to have SOME place in the meta. Every class steps on each others toes a little bit. This is what Anet wants. This is intentional.

Misguided.5139:

Nickthemoonwolf.1485:

Its not a reflect. revenant does not have a reflect. Projectile destroyer is inferior to reflects.

This is true. But why do people insist guardian/rev is either/or? They go together like peanut butter and jelly. Take both.

With a Herald.

Mesmers with alacrity can replace guard for reflection.
Ps warrior can run scholar runes.
Eles don’t need to blast for fury uptime as much.
Etc.

Revenant will be meta because with the multitude of roles they can mimic other classes can focus on offense rather than fulfilling those roles.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Misguided.5139:

Nickthemoonwolf.1485:

Its not a reflect. revenant does not have a reflect. Projectile destroyer is inferior to reflects.

This is true. But why do people insist guardian/rev is either/or? They go together like peanut butter and jelly. Take both.

With a Herald.

Mesmers with alacrity can replace guard for reflection. You need the warrior for might and banners but they can run more offensive.
Eles are less needed for group fury
Etc.

Look this is all speculation on what the meta is going to end up as. We know ahead of time that major balance changes will be regular now. Its really pointless to be making such ultimate calls at this point.

actually you can have permanant protection, protection is -5 energy per sec, you restore energy at 5 per sec, this gives you permanent protection as long as you have no other facets up. And I never did backpedal to anything, I acknowledged that you were right about reflects vs blocks on projectiles. Learn to take that small victory.

Also, I said FROM WHAT WE HAVE SEEN SO FAR, Nowhere did I say that reflects were never going to be useful, just not in what we’ve seen. Revenants are still a massive teamwide dps boost due to 150 ferocity traits to the entire team, guardians give toughness, which….is not wonderful to say the least.

Revenants simply bring more to the table.

Nickthemoonwolf.1485:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Misguided.5139:

Nickthemoonwolf.1485:

Its not a reflect. revenant does not have a reflect. Projectile destroyer is inferior to reflects.

This is true. But why do people insist guardian/rev is either/or? They go together like peanut butter and jelly. Take both.

With a Herald.

Mesmers with alacrity can replace guard for reflection. You need the warrior for might and banners but they can run more offensive.
Eles are less needed for group fury
Etc.

Look this is all speculation on what the meta is going to end up as. We know ahead of time that major balance changes will be regular now. Its really pointless to be making such ultimate calls at this point.

Well we had the beta to test it. Mesmer, revenant, warrior, ele, ele came out ahead.

It isn’t that hard to do mathematically. With full alacrity ele, ele, warrior has a dps equal to the current meta. Revenant buffs mesmer to allow this alacrity role but also provides dps to boost damage over currently meta. Not only that, it enhances the roles of the other meta staples so they can concentrate on dps more. It’s simple math.

The reason we are speculating is because OP asked us to.

Azure.8670:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Mesmer here.

Guardians were taken for reflect and because they out dps mesmers. However with alacrity our community hypothesized the new meta would be 2 ele, 1 chronomancer, 1 warrior, 1 revenant.

The uptime on quickness and alacrity makes for a group that out dps the current meta.

Revenant becomes a half warrior, half guard. Taken for niche stat increases.

The mesmer would be half guard, half thief.

theres no reason to take Rev over Guard for fractals/dungeons. Raids, maybe because its unknown territory, but as if now, Guardian is still a boss hog due to reflects

I am not the most knowledgeable in this game but i have to ask why you wouldn’t take a rev into a fractal over a guardian. I know guardians are good but with the way revs bring weakness and conditions and projectile blocks i dont see how you couldnt bring one.

evnw.9324:

I think sword/axe is has the most dps of any weapon set up

During the test weekends i was actually really enjoying sword/axe. I really loved the mace however and mace/axe has so much synergy its incredibly. Dual sword was alright but offhand sword to me felt weak.

Staff i didn’t get to use too much as i don’t like the animations considering its held like a hammer but twirled like a stick and has some blah animations. I am interested on the hammer feedback though. Is it going to be a good secondary or even a primary? How does it fare with each legend and such?

Aside from terrain issues, hammer is terrific. Great damage with 1200 range on a piercing, 100% projectile finisher AA. A skill that can hit 15 targets and does strong damage. Two blasts, one with an evade, the other with nice CC. A dark field with projectile destruction. What’s not to love?

Oshelotae.4176:

Azure.8670:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Mesmer here.

Guardians were taken for reflect and because they out dps mesmers. However with alacrity our community hypothesized the new meta would be 2 ele, 1 chronomancer, 1 warrior, 1 revenant.

The uptime on quickness and alacrity makes for a group that out dps the current meta.

Revenant becomes a half warrior, half guard. Taken for niche stat increases.

The mesmer would be half guard, half thief.

theres no reason to take Rev over Guard for fractals/dungeons. Raids, maybe because its unknown territory, but as if now, Guardian is still a boss hog due to reflects

I am not the most knowledgeable in this game but i have to ask why you wouldn’t take a rev into a fractal over a guardian. I know guardians are good but with the way revs bring weakness and conditions and projectile blocks i dont see how you couldnt bring one.

Guardians have reflects which is arguably more useful in the lava shaman boss fractal. they also provide a ton of stability. They will both be used in fractals but I think fractals are the one place where a guardian will remain a staple. Not saying rev isn’t a good replacement, but guardians are still really useful for those.

It is not that Rev is replacing guardians. It’s that with alacrity mesmer replaces guardian. Revenant replaced thief for single target dps and engie can replace one staff elementalist after the conjure nerf. The stealth role can be handled by mesmer and engie together, so can the reflect role.

With this composition you do more than the current meta in damage. After all ele/engie/warrior with constant alacrity equals the damage of the old meta. Revenant is there to make the boon process smoother and provide the additional damage to boost this comp over the old one.