Guild Wars 2

Buran.3796:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Or you know you can use your short cooldown Aoe Reveal but meh I gues Revs have no counter to Stealth…..

You mean Gaze of Darkness, that garbage with a range of 360 units? GoD will only help you if the thief/mesmer/ranger you have in front is a tool.

Most of builds that burst out from stealth are specialist in poking at range, and no way (if they are competent) they will attack a Herald inside the 450 unit radius of your Unrentling Assault. Gaze of Darkness only redeeming quality is being a breakstun, and not that useful because the essential mechanics of the Revenant resource: you need to change legends to get energy, more and more often since the HoT release because the cost of skills is being raised patch after patch.

And this is one of the reasons due I think that cleansing coinditions and doing breakstuns through Invocation is pointless: you need to change legends due in combat your energy is depleted fast (you have no traits to enhance that recovery as thieves do with Initiative), so you can chose: change your legends to being able to use skills and then lack cleanses and so, or save the change to break stuns or cleanse and then slow down you skill cast to glacial speed.

So you say you don’t effectively utilize the tools given to you, GoD fills two roles either reveal the stealthed foe or Stun break the CC put on you. Looks like you are moving the goal posts and sounds like you don’t know how to time your skills properly. Your build has all the tools need to combat Stealth and Ccs but it seems like inefficient resource management is your big downfall. Also the Initiative Regen traits are all in highly underused/underwhelming trait lines that don’t see play.

Thieves also have to manage a resource the decent ones learn quickly how to manage their resources they don’t Stealth spam since it does no damage and provides very little in the way of Defenses outside of stopping your UA, which still eats over 1/3 of their available Initiative.

The reveal is like 249 range and is one of the few stun break skills rev has that’s reliable. I’m not going to waste that on a chance to reveal a stealth target unless it’s in shadow refuge, and you say all of this assuming stealth targets hug you all the time.

CutesySylveon.8290:

The reveal is like 249 range and is one of the few stun break skills rev has that’s reliable. I’m not going to waste that on a chance to reveal a stealth target unless it’s in shadow refuge, and you say all of this assuming stealth targets hug you all the time.

If you have stun break saved then Cc is less of a worry and have to time dodges to actively avoid the attack/Cc, I was never the one to bring stealth into the equation Burnac was, I showed Revs have a tool against Stealth since that’s his big concern, it’s also a strong tool against Cc which what he was complaining about in the first place. Just saying you use what is needed in the moment your choices decide the outcome you have all the necessary tools.

That can be said about the whole class, having the tools; a heal and support legend, defense one etc, and yet look at the state of the class.

Having the tools needed to do something is nice, but when you have one skill serving multiple purposes, then even though you had the tools for multiple situations, it won’t matter if you rely on one so much to do so many things because then when do you use it?

CutesySylveon.8290:

That can be said about the whole class, having the tools; a heal and support legend, defense one etc, and yet look at the state of the class.

The state of the class is due to it being overtuned since conception and nerfed after they got the sales from the spike in sales. Also a poor direction in balance from the Devs, I still play Rev it fills very viable roles, it just doesn’t do everything strongly which no class does. They are forced further and further into the Meta builds and get pigeonholed till they are over nerfed and the cycle begins again.

It tries to do too much and falls short of what so many others can do so much better in most situations. So yeah, it may have the tools for something, but that doesn’t mean they’re viable tools.

Guys, the change to the stab on dodge may have in fact been a buff. Dodged once, evaded 4 attacks, got 8 stacks of stab.

RyuDragnier.9476:

Guys, the change to the stab on dodge may have in fact been a buff. Dodged once, evaded 4 attacks, got 8 stacks of stab.

That’s a bug… There is a 8 sec ICD.

In before the fix to this bug makes retaliatory evasion make retaliation affect you when hit with the boon.

Meanwhile take a look at the Ranger:

“Quick Shot: Rangers will now gain swiftness REGARDLESS of whether they’ve hit their target. The recharge time of this skill has been reduced to 8 seconds.”

So, you can play a condi ranger with rune of the trapper, shoot Concussion Shoot from stealth at 900 range for a nice 2 seconds daze, then fire Quick Shoot to put a gap and even if you miss, you still gain swiftness to kite the kitten of the stupid Herald with no stab access.

The ArenaNet balancing team needs some internal coherence…

I think the nerf to Unwavering Avoidance went too far with both the ICD and evade requirement. I play Mallyx/Glint with only one stun-breaker and it was nice to be able to dodge and follow the frontline when pushing another zerg in WvW. It seems like staying at range with the hammer is the better option now…

I just clobbered some people in ranked, not the cream of the crop but I can say that with a high-level playstyle the Shiro nerf, while uncalled for, doesn’t kill Invo Power Shiro whatsoever. Buran if you’re looking for some help on how to play the class, check out Aka Cryptic’s channel on Youtube.

Varezenem.2813:

RyuDragnier.9476:

Guys, the change to the stab on dodge may have in fact been a buff. Dodged once, evaded 4 attacks, got 8 stacks of stab.

That’s a bug… There is a 8 sec ICD.

Great, they aren’t even testing the skills and traits that they changed. Could you to figure how long could them take to fix traits and skills bugged that didn’t even saw since the HoT release? I guess that could be measured in tree rings…

Huskyboy.1053:

Buran if you’re looking for some help on how to play the class, check out Aka Cryptic’s channel on Youtube.

I do love Cryptic’s gameplay, I’m from the same server (Gandara) and my raid leader oftenly plays with their guild in both scrims and WvW events. But Cryptic plays power Herald and I do prefer hybrid Mallyx builds, which was very viable before the patch against most of classes (except Mesmer). I do DH when I want to play power; no need to kill the only Herald build which I was having fun with. The stability changes had no reason to be.

Unwavering Avoidance is near death of Rev in PvP. Was it over tuned? Yes, but with this nerf it is near obsolete and Rev has no source for stability aside from Jails, which is for all purposes in PvP a dud. Considering that PvP now is a CC and stability wars, having a melee class with no reliable source of stability is not going to work.

The sad part is there is no kittening way that condi, hammer, Jails, Mallyx, Ventari are balanced. So the effective built is now being neutralized while the non-effective skills/weapons are probably even worse off. I seriously question the credibility of the Rev devs.

Great efforts to bring mallyx, jalis and ventari into play throughout the game. Oh wait, just more kittening around patching shiro and glint.

These revenant changes suck. We’d be better off if they just made f3 Phase Traversal and f4 be Riposting Shadows scrap the line.

I have still yet to see bug fixes on mace, hammer, sword, or axe offhand.
We still dont have attractive trait linens other than hearld.
We still don’t have usable stun breaks each legend.

Will all these nerfs, we have glint and what ever gimmick your choice from base rev. It’s really sad to see this class go where it’s gone, it’s weapons actually supper fun to play. That’s about the only thing they nailed.

Buran.3796:

Meanwhile take a look at the Ranger…
The ArenaNet balancing team needs some internal coherence…

I get that your frustrated and need something to attack, but to be frank, shortbow is still useless outside of pve. Anything you can do with short bow, is much easier with longbow. Longbow is still the better hybrid weapon. Ranger also took a slew of nerfs in druid, anet tried to make up for it with random shortbow buffs and buff to maul. I wish they had of taken that direction with rev as well.

In fact Nerf is much deeper – other classes got improvements, and we got only nerfs. So, overall we fall more than just some skill nerfs.

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Huskyboy.1053:

Krysard.1364:

PadreNike.1803:

mrauls.6519:

So, Glint/Shiro power Rev is pretty much the same, right?

No, unless you missed it in the OP the heal was nerfed on shiro and retribution stab on dodge was nerfed too, I’d imagine invocation rev is still pretty decent although nerfed

Invo rev hasnt been nerfed, glint buff kinda keeps up with shiro nerf (which was needed as a qol change)

Can you explain why you mean by QoL change? Usually QoL means that the game has in some way been made easier to play or more enjoyable, usually with things like bug fixes or miscellaneous changes to the interface. For example, changing the thief’s Shortbow sound effects was a QoL change, although that particular one has become sort of a joke. It’s probably just me but I’m not seeing how the sole nerf to Shiro is a QoL change, especially not for Revs. All it’s done is lower Rev’s self-healing abilities to an unprecedented low.

Imo it was a bug that it didn’t work like other similar skills that had Charges and would be consumed if they were Evaded,blocked or Invulned, I.e Basi Venom. Also Thief Shortbow noise was no QoL it was the strongest buff in the games history, now I can strike terror in my foes as I Infiltrator Away!!!!

Pretty much this. ED was given dmg as you couldnt dodge, block, blind, etc… When u casted it, u had free 5k dmg. Thats why its a QoL change imo.

Eval.2371:

Buran.3796:

Meanwhile take a look at the Ranger…
The ArenaNet balancing team needs some internal coherence…

I get that your frustrated and need something to attack, but to be frank, shortbow is still useless outside of pve. Anything you can do with short bow, is much easier with longbow

I mean that the change gives them swiftness regadless the skill (which needs a target) hits or not, whereas Unwavering Avoidance (which doesn’t need a target) now demands to actively evade an attack in order to gracefully grant stability. In the same patch.

Previously we can call stability before performing a valuable task (reviving, finishing, starting a slow and powerful attack which we want to protect against interrupts as happens with Chaotic Release or Jade Winds, etc.). Now we have to relegate our inititative, we need to let the enemy to attack first, to command the pulse of the fight if we want to get stability. It’s not viable, doesn’t let me play aggrressively, leading the way in wich we start a fight, and is utterly useless if you face classes with broad access to stealth.

Even worse: before we have the choice to get stability and tank attacks and exchange hits against, lets say, a Berserker with mace + shield + Head Butt if we want, and it was arguably a better option than rely on breakstuns, because we have no access to 3 breakstuns in short term. Now you can’t and if you miss one single evade you will eat a chainstun while having at most a couple of breakstuns. Is even more funny because as a Herald our viable ranged weapons are 0.

Buran.3796:

Eval.2371:

Buran.3796:

Meanwhile take a look at the Ranger…
The ArenaNet balancing team needs some internal coherence…

I get that your frustrated and need something to attack, but to be frank, shortbow is still useless outside of pve. Anything you can do with short bow, is much easier with longbow

I mean that the change gives them swiftness regadless the skill (which needs a target) hits or not, whereas Unwavering Avoidance (which doesn’t need a target) now demands to actively evade an attack in order to gracefully grant stability. In the same patch.

Previously we can call stability before performing a valuable task (reviving, finishing, starting a slow and powerful attack which we want to protect against interrupts as happens with Chaotic Release or Jade Winds, etc.). Now we have to relegate our inititative, we need to let the enemy to attack first, to command the pulse of the fight if we want to get stability. It’s not viable, doesn’t let me play aggrressively, leading the way in wich we start a fight, and is utterly useless if you face classes with broad access to stealth.

Even worse: before we have the choice to get stability and tank attacks and exchange hits against, lets say, a Berserker with mace + shield + Head Butt if we want, and it was arguably a better option than rely on breakstuns, because we have no access to 3 breakstuns in short term. Now you can’t and if you miss one single evade you will eat a chainstun while having at most a couple of breakstuns. Is even more funny because as a Herald our viable ranged weapons are 0.

Look at traits that are actually similar instead of looking at a weapon skill that’s no where near the same. The exact same trait almost is the best example Perfectly Weighted does the exact same thing needs and Evade to grant stability, Escapist absolution must successfully evade an attack to remove a condition, Evasive Mirror needs to Evade, ineptitude needs to evade and so on all traits that give something on Evade, and there are quiet a few more, not on dodge, all they did was make Unwavering Avoidance consistent with similar traits.

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Buran.3796:

Eval.2371:

Buran.3796:

Meanwhile take a look at the Ranger…
The ArenaNet balancing team needs some internal coherence…

I get that your frustrated and need something to attack, but to be frank, shortbow is still useless outside of pve. Anything you can do with short bow, is much easier with longbow

I mean that the change gives them swiftness regadless the skill (which needs a target) hits or not, whereas Unwavering Avoidance (which doesn’t need a target) now demands to actively evade an attack in order to gracefully grant stability. In the same patch.

Previously we can call stability before performing a valuable task (reviving, finishing, starting a slow and powerful attack which we want to protect against interrupts as happens with Chaotic Release or Jade Winds, etc.). Now we have to relegate our inititative, we need to let the enemy to attack first, to command the pulse of the fight if we want to get stability. It’s not viable, doesn’t let me play aggrressively, leading the way in wich we start a fight, and is utterly useless if you face classes with broad access to stealth.

Even worse: before we have the choice to get stability and tank attacks and exchange hits against, lets say, a Berserker with mace + shield + Head Butt if we want, and it was arguably a better option than rely on breakstuns, because we have no access to 3 breakstuns in short term. Now you can’t and if you miss one single evade you will eat a chainstun while having at most a couple of breakstuns. Is even more funny because as a Herald our viable ranged weapons are 0.

Look at traits that are actually similar instead of looking at a weapon skill that’s no where near the same. The exact same trait almost is the best example Perfectly Weighted does the exact same thing needs and Evade to grant stability, Escapist absolution must successfully evade an attack to remove a condition, Evasive Mirror needs to Evade, ineptitude needs to evade and so on all traits that give something on Evade, and there are quiet a few more, not on dodge, all they did was make Unwavering Avoidance consistent with similar traits.

This consistency is reasonable, however there is a big inconsistency in stun break availability to Revenant compared to other professions which placed perhaps undesirably high value on Unwavering Avoidance. Just a quick glance at the GW2 wiki tells me that the following number of stunbreaks are available to different professions through utility skills (including elite specializations):

Guardian – 7
Revenant – 3
Warrior – 8
Engineer – 7
Ranger – 5
Thief – 6
Elementalist – 6
Mesmer – 7
Necromancer – 6

There are also traits which cause more actions to break stuns, and some of these are on short cooldowns similar to Invocation’s Empty Vessel – e.g. Druidic Clarity on Druid and Savage Instinct on Berserker.

Revenant needs more access to stun breaks. Unwavering Avoidance was used so heavily only because Rev has few options to break stuns. I am not opposed this change to Unwavering Avoidance for consistency, but it needs to be coupled with increased access to stability or stun breaks somewhere else – ideally on Mallyx and Ventari, and at reduced energy cost on Jalis.

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Buran.3796:

Eval.2371:

Buran.3796:

Meanwhile take a look at the Ranger…
The ArenaNet balancing team needs some internal coherence…

I get that your frustrated and need something to attack, but to be frank, shortbow is still useless outside of pve. Anything you can do with short bow, is much easier with longbow

I mean that the change gives them swiftness regadless the skill (which needs a target) hits or not, whereas Unwavering Avoidance (which doesn’t need a target) now demands to actively evade an attack in order to gracefully grant stability. In the same patch.

Previously we can call stability before performing a valuable task (reviving, finishing, starting a slow and powerful attack which we want to protect against interrupts as happens with Chaotic Release or Jade Winds, etc.). Now we have to relegate our inititative, we need to let the enemy to attack first, to command the pulse of the fight if we want to get stability. It’s not viable, doesn’t let me play aggrressively, leading the way in wich we start a fight, and is utterly useless if you face classes with broad access to stealth.

Even worse: before we have the choice to get stability and tank attacks and exchange hits against, lets say, a Berserker with mace + shield + Head Butt if we want, and it was arguably a better option than rely on breakstuns, because we have no access to 3 breakstuns in short term. Now you can’t and if you miss one single evade you will eat a chainstun while having at most a couple of breakstuns. Is even more funny because as a Herald our viable ranged weapons are 0.

Look at traits that are actually similar instead of looking at a weapon skill that’s no where near the same. The exact same trait almost is the best example Perfectly Weighted does the exact same thing needs and Evade to grant stability, Escapist absolution must successfully evade an attack to remove a condition, Evasive Mirror needs to Evade, ineptitude needs to evade and so on all traits that give something on Evade, and there are quiet a few more, not on dodge, all they did was make Unwavering Avoidance consistent with similar traits.

While this is correct, you are giving stability equal importance to removing one condition and blocking a ranged attack, which are not remotely as important. However there is a key issue unique to Rev, since you do not get to choose utilities as you are stuck with what each legend offers. So if I need stability I have to take exclusively one legend; Jails, 3 utilities + heal + elite that have limited uses outside of one skill (even the stability skill sucks).

Unwavering Avoidance gave all legends accessibility to stability. Now in order to get it, you have to rely on gimicky mechanics, that do not allow you to access it on demand or when CCed and is on longer CD. Compare Rev with other classes that play the melee dps role in sPvP: warrior, guard and eng all have easy access to stability either through traits or one utility. Considering the number of CCs you eat in an sPvP, Rev in sPvP will probably be left out for more reliable classes to fulfill its role, unless that being a boon bot, which is not worth it in sPvP.

^ This man gets it. I have no problem playing without stability with DH due I can tailor my entire utility bar to fill it up with stunbreaks, condition cleanses and/or blocks, whereas Herald lacks flexibility and has weakness in EVERY deffensive department of the game. Herald is bad at condition cleansing, is bad at stunbreaking and now is bad at getting stability. Even HoT PvE is crappy for us now, since the new maps are full of mobs with cc skills.

With the Shiro sustain and condi stability both botched this class will fall outside the Pro League meta in no time.

I’ve condi rev’d my way to legend+ quickly and easily for four pvp seasons now, not that glint/mally condi rev is all that great or heavily played, but I made it work for me against some of the most known players in pvp. 3k games of making it work since rev came out actually.

Why on earth they would nerf condi rev into the ground is beyond me. Less stab, less resistance uptime. In no way was it even OP.
Most power revs run invo to begin with. Shiro/Glint Invo/Dev/Herald is the only build for pvp now.

I’ve always said that I wished there was another access to stab on rev besides the stab on dodge, but the new stab just isn’t enough to keep condi rev alive in team fights, especially with only the GoD stun break.

RIP any hope for diversity, rip the underdogs.

-Rev of Boa

Still strongest class atm

Obindo.6802:

Still strongest class atm

Nerfnant is definitely the “strongest class” with the least amount of stunbreaks ingame, 0 condi cleanse, 0 reliable access to stability, 0 reliable heal cus anyone with brain can prevent it by blocking/evading the daggers and not attacking during Glint heal. Yeah totally the strongest class kappa

Nerf has worse sustain than a freakin thief right now on top of much lower mobility and lack of stealth. Balance woo hoo.

Burtnik.5218:

Obindo.6802:

Still strongest class atm

Nerfnant is definitely the “strongest class” with the least amount of stunbreaks ingame, 0 condi cleanse, 0 reliable access to stability, 0 reliable heal cus anyone with brain can prevent it by blocking/evading the daggers and not attacking during Glint heal. Yeah totally the strongest class kappa

Yes, if you’re implying it’s bad, prove it in esl. Any good player knows rev is yet the strongest as it’s always been.

Obindo.6802:

Burtnik.5218:

Obindo.6802:

Still strongest class atm

Nerfnant is definitely the “strongest class” with the least amount of stunbreaks ingame, 0 condi cleanse, 0 reliable access to stability, 0 reliable heal cus anyone with brain can prevent it by blocking/evading the daggers and not attacking during Glint heal. Yeah totally the strongest class kappa

Yes, if you’re implying it’s bad, prove it in esl. Any good player knows rev is yet the strongest as it’s always been.

Sadly i cant prove it, reason: i left the game in mid of S2. And dont act like a pro when i have soloed you and Vaans many times in ranked so please give me a break about your so called “esl” cus nobody gives a kitten about it anyway.

Burtnik.5218:

Obindo.6802:

Burtnik.5218:

Obindo.6802:

Still strongest class atm

Nerfnant is definitely the “strongest class” with the least amount of stunbreaks ingame, 0 condi cleanse, 0 reliable access to stability, 0 reliable heal cus anyone with brain can prevent it by blocking/evading the daggers and not attacking during Glint heal. Yeah totally the strongest class kappa

Yes, if you’re implying it’s bad, prove it in esl. Any good player knows rev is yet the strongest as it’s always been.

Sadly i cant prove it, reason: i left the game in mid of S2. And dont act like a pro when i have soloed you and Vaans many times in ranked so please give me a break about your so called “esl” cus nobody gives a kitten about it anyway.

Ofc you have, like every other no name, who make up their kitten. You say you don’t play anymore yet go on the forums claiming authority over esl players about balance. Next lvl stupidity

Yes, the strongest class in the game that falls face first against condi Mesmer, condi warrior, condi thief, condi… anything. It’s certainly not the strongest class by any means.

CutesySylveon.8290:

Yes, the strongest class in the game that falls face first against condi Mesmer, condi warrior, condi thief, condi… anything. It’s certainly not the strongest class by any means.

It wins against condi warrior, if the enemy team played condi thief, then you’d win the game anyways, it’s also an unexplored matchup, but rev should win. Rev is not even a 1v1’er.

It most certainly does not win against condi warrior if it gets hit with one good burst. The enemy -team- having a condi thief doesn’t matter when the topic is thief vs rev, which rev loses because it cannot cleanse or sustain itself, not even with its healing skills. You failed to mention condi Mesmer, likely because your ‘best’ class starts to look worse the more bad matchups you give. All the revs in ESL relied on someone else sustaining them against pressure, like an ele, so stick your nose elsewhere, please.

CutesySylveon.8290:

It most certainly does not win against condi warrior if it gets hit with one good burst. The enemy -team- having a condi thief doesn’t matter when the topic is thief vs rev, which rev loses because it cannot cleanse or sustain itself, not even with its healing skills. You failed to mention condi Mesmer, likely because your ‘best’ class starts to look worse the more bad matchups you give. All the revs in ESL relied on someone else sustaining them against pressure, like an ele, so stick your nose elsewhere, please.

It does win against condi warrior, and if the enemy throws the game just to beat the rev 1v1 it’s irrelevant, you already win. Rev does indeed die if it tanks everything, but it shouldn’t get hit by an f1 or randomly eat thief dodge spamm to begin with. Ofc mesmer kills rev. Everything has a counter and has something it counters. The game is rock paper scissors, play around it…
Rev has good 1v1 matchups, which isn’t even what makes it essential. It dominates in teamfight and it’s mobility and it’s +1 capabilities is what makes it strongest class in game and essential.

Out of all the bugs they could have fixed, they fixed the only one that was actually benefiting us—well played…

Obindo.6802:

Rev has good 1v1 matchups, which isn’t even what makes it essential. It dominates in teamfight and it’s mobility and it’s +1 capabilities is what makes it strongest class in game and essential.

I would believe that when the next season of the Pro League starts; people claimed that changes in june did made the DH viable but it failed in every major competition. The current patch trounces the power Herald sustain and most of the Pro League teams do chose rosters based on the overall survability of the team, which is why DH and DD were outside the meta the whole year.

Winning the match is what’s completely irrelevant when the topic is how a class does against another, so even if you win the match, it doesn’t matter one bit if the conversation is about something else. Stay on topic.

Saying rev shouldn’t get hit with things to begin with puts you in the same line of reasoning that says thief should never die because it has so many evades. You are going to get hit with things no matter how hard you try not to, so that point is a waste. And I wasn’t referring to not being hit with evading attacks, I mean now thief can evade a revs and negate it’s healing, which is just terrible design, so again, missed the point.

Anything dominates in team fights if you ignore it and let it have its way, as well as +1 situations. Rev is dangerous if you leave it be, but has clear and easily readable tactics and counters that range from simply conditions to exploiting broken aspects of the class.

Absolutely nothing rev has is essential that another class can’t do, and sometimes do better. So no, it is not the strongest class in the game.

CutesySylveon.8290:

Winning the match is what’s completely irrelevant when the topic is how a class does against another, so even if you win the match, it doesn’t matter one bit if the conversation is about something else. Stay on topic.

Saying rev shouldn’t get hit with things to begin with puts you in the same line of reasoning that says thief should never die because it has so many evades. You are going to get hit with things no matter how hard you try not to, so that point is a waste. And I wasn’t referring to not being hit with evading attacks, I mean now thief can evade a revs and negate it’s healing, which is just terrible design, so again, missed the point.

Anything dominates in team fights if you ignore it and let it have its way, as well as +1 situations. Rev is dangerous if you leave it be, but has clear and easily readable tactics and counters that range from simply conditions to exploiting broken aspects of the class.

Absolutely nothing rev has is essential that another class can’t do, and sometimes do better. So no, it is not the strongest class in the game.

Ok, so if I make a build that will have us loose just to win a 1v1 vs a rev with an already counter class to rev, which he won’t even take, that means rev isn’t strong? Makes sense. Once again, this game is rock paper scissors.

No, a good rev won’t get hit by warrior f1, of course you’ll get hit by other stuff like auto attack, but if you say a condi warrior’s 200 dmg autoattacks counters rev then go ahead.

According to your logic, even banner warrior “can dominate a teamfight” so, good point, I guess banner warr is as good as revenant.

It is indeed essential, no team would ever run without a rev, and without class stacking, most would use more than 1. It is the strongest class in the game and if your logic as a random is superior to those of esl team and respective players, go ahead and prove it in esl.

Krysard.1364:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Huskyboy.1053:

Krysard.1364:

PadreNike.1803:

mrauls.6519:

So, Glint/Shiro power Rev is pretty much the same, right?

No, unless you missed it in the OP the heal was nerfed on shiro and retribution stab on dodge was nerfed too, I’d imagine invocation rev is still pretty decent although nerfed

Invo rev hasnt been nerfed, glint buff kinda keeps up with shiro nerf (which was needed as a qol change)

Can you explain why you mean by QoL change? Usually QoL means that the game has in some way been made easier to play or more enjoyable, usually with things like bug fixes or miscellaneous changes to the interface. For example, changing the thief’s Shortbow sound effects was a QoL change, although that particular one has become sort of a joke. It’s probably just me but I’m not seeing how the sole nerf to Shiro is a QoL change, especially not for Revs. All it’s done is lower Rev’s self-healing abilities to an unprecedented low.

Imo it was a bug that it didn’t work like other similar skills that had Charges and would be consumed if they were Evaded,blocked or Invulned, I.e Basi Venom. Also Thief Shortbow noise was no QoL it was the strongest buff in the games history, now I can strike terror in my foes as I Infiltrator Away!!!!

Pretty much this. ED was given dmg as you couldnt dodge, block, blind, etc… When u casted it, u had free 5k dmg. Thats why its a QoL change imo.

“Skill I don’t like gets nerfed, QoL change for me.” That’s not what it means bro, by that logic, nerfing Purification is a QoL change for everyone who doesn’t main DH. QoL means that it’s a positive change for everyone, or at least not a negative for anybody. Balancing the professions =/= Qol.

Buran.3796:

Obindo.6802:

Rev has good 1v1 matchups, which isn’t even what makes it essential. It dominates in teamfight and it’s mobility and it’s +1 capabilities is what makes it strongest class in game and essential.

I would believe that when the next season of the Pro League starts; people claimed that changes in june did made the DH viable but it failed in every major competition. The current patch trounces the power Herald sustain and most of the Pro League teams do chose rosters based on the overall survability of the team, which is why DH and DD were outside the meta the whole year.

DH was viable.

Obindo.6802:

Burtnik.5218:

Obindo.6802:

Burtnik.5218:

Obindo.6802:

Still strongest class atm

Nerfnant is definitely the “strongest class” with the least amount of stunbreaks ingame, 0 condi cleanse, 0 reliable access to stability, 0 reliable heal cus anyone with brain can prevent it by blocking/evading the daggers and not attacking during Glint heal. Yeah totally the strongest class kappa

Yes, if you’re implying it’s bad, prove it in esl. Any good player knows rev is yet the strongest as it’s always been.

Sadly i cant prove it, reason: i left the game in mid of S2. And dont act like a pro when i have soloed you and Vaans many times in ranked so please give me a break about your so called “esl” cus nobody gives a kitten about it anyway.

Ofc you have, like every other no name, who make up their kitten. You say you don’t play anymore yet go on the forums claiming authority over esl players about balance. Next lvl stupidity

Except you are noname yourself. You aint skillful whatsoever, every monkey can record some vids in wvw where they 1v10 enemies but when you get your kitten kicked you dont post it – normal.

And yes i did, just like i beated your esl “pro” players when they played rev. Since beta i havent lost any 1v1 fair matchup vs another rev. I mean i even won a match vs Rom and Frost with Ventari bunker rev..rofl (they havent killed me even once) but for sure you know better. Right.

And just bc i stopped playing doesnt mean i stopped understanding how this game works. Solo rev will be a horrible experience for anyone now.

Burtnik.5218:

Obindo.6802:

Burtnik.5218:

Obindo.6802:

Burtnik.5218:

Obindo.6802:

Still strongest class atm

Nerfnant is definitely the “strongest class” with the least amount of stunbreaks ingame, 0 condi cleanse, 0 reliable access to stability, 0 reliable heal cus anyone with brain can prevent it by blocking/evading the daggers and not attacking during Glint heal. Yeah totally the strongest class kappa

Yes, if you’re implying it’s bad, prove it in esl. Any good player knows rev is yet the strongest as it’s always been.

Sadly i cant prove it, reason: i left the game in mid of S2. And dont act like a pro when i have soloed you and Vaans many times in ranked so please give me a break about your so called “esl” cus nobody gives a kitten about it anyway.

Ofc you have, like every other no name, who make up their kitten. You say you don’t play anymore yet go on the forums claiming authority over esl players about balance. Next lvl stupidity

Except you are noname yourself. You aint skillful whatsoever, every monkey can record some vids in wvw where they 1v10 enemies but when you get your kitten kicked you dont post it – normal.

And yes i did, just like i beated your esl “pro” players when they played rev. Since beta i havent lost any 1v1 fair matchup vs another rev. I mean i even won a match vs Rom and Frost with Ventari bunker rev..rofl (they havent killed me even once) but for sure you know better. Right.

And just bc i stopped playing doesnt mean i stopped understanding how this game works. Solo rev will be a horrible experience for anyone now.

Ladies, please, you’re both pretty.

Never once did I say that rev isn’t strong. No one with any sense would say that it doesn’t have strong points, but to say it’s the strongest class in the game, as a random no less, is just willful ignorance.

If you leave any class that’s capable of doing something like support or dps, then yes, they can shift a fight. That axe power necro won’t do much if you pressure him, but if you ignore him, then yes, he will cause you issues and can possibly sway the fight.

Try to stop pointing to els players to drive your point home when you offer no argument to defend your point. Saying it’s the strongest class with the evidence of ‘just because I said so’ or ‘esl’ doesn’t mean a thing. Other people who play the game are capable of just as much understanding of it as any ‘pro’ player, so stand on your own, instead of kneeling to them.

And btw, just saying DH was viable doesn’t mean that it was viable.

Burtnik.5218:

Obindo.6802:

Burtnik.5218:

Obindo.6802:

Burtnik.5218:

Obindo.6802:

Still strongest class atm

Nerfnant is definitely the “strongest class” with the least amount of stunbreaks ingame, 0 condi cleanse, 0 reliable access to stability, 0 reliable heal cus anyone with brain can prevent it by blocking/evading the daggers and not attacking during Glint heal. Yeah totally the strongest class kappa

Yes, if you’re implying it’s bad, prove it in esl. Any good player knows rev is yet the strongest as it’s always been.

Sadly i cant prove it, reason: i left the game in mid of S2. And dont act like a pro when i have soloed you and Vaans many times in ranked so please give me a break about your so called “esl” cus nobody gives a kitten about it anyway.

Ofc you have, like every other no name, who make up their kitten. You say you don’t play anymore yet go on the forums claiming authority over esl players about balance. Next lvl stupidity

Except you are noname yourself. You aint skillful whatsoever, every monkey can record some vids in wvw where they 1v10 enemies but when you get your kitten kicked you dont post it – normal.

And yes i did, just like i beated your esl “pro” players when they played rev. Since beta i havent lost any 1v1 fair matchup vs another rev. I mean i even won a match vs Rom and Frost with Ventari bunker rev..rofl (they havent killed me even once) but for sure you know better. Right.

And just bc i stopped playing doesnt mean i stopped understanding how this game works. Solo rev will be a horrible experience for anyone now.

But I’m not a no name tho. And I as well as other top tier teams consider myself a top tier player.

Any forum hero can sit and say they beat everyone to grow their kitten, when really they can’t do anything, saying they’re better than all esl players yet can’t compete.

I don’t post when I get my kitten kicked because I havent gotten my kitten kicked. Maybe when I had only played 2 months, don’t know.

Your mentality is completely degenerate, and the community suffers from the very same mentality, people think that if you win 1 single duel vs someone you are much better than them, regardless of hard counter (nobody seems to realize this game is rock paper scissors, not a 1v1 game, yet people value themselves based of a single 1v1), in a yolo ranked q where nobody gives a kitten, could’ve might as well been talking to ppl irl, or talked to/read chat (streamers), not given a kitten? And then say they farm them ez coz they won 1 duel despite said conditions.

I got something for you btw:

Obindo.6802:

It dominates in teamfight and it’s mobility and it’s +1 capabilities is what makes it strongest class in game and essential.

OK, so you meant not “strongest class” but “strongest class in a very special part (called Pro League match) of the game”.

Neither in Roaming nor in Solo Q Revenant is strong. It’s mediocre at best.

Btw. I doubt it dominates in teamfights focused by 2 condi warrs, 2 DHs, 2 mesmers or 2 condi reapers or simply when no heal- / cleanse bot like ele or druid is around. It is dependant on babysitting like e.g. the meta reaper.

CutesySylveon.8290:

Never once did I say that rev isn’t strong. No one with any sense would say that it doesn’t have strong points, but to say it’s the strongest class in the game, as a random no less, is just willful ignorance.

If you leave any class that’s capable of doing something like support or dps, then yes, they can shift a fight. That axe power necro won’t do much if you pressure him, but if you ignore him, then yes, he will cause you issues and can possibly sway the fight.

Try to stop pointing to els players to drive your point home when you offer no argument to defend your point. Saying it’s the strongest class with the evidence of ‘just because I said so’ or ‘esl’ doesn’t mean a thing. Other people who play the game are capable of just as much understanding of it as any ‘pro’ player, so stand on your own, instead of kneeling to them.

And btw, just saying DH was viable doesn’t mean that it was viable.

I know it doesn’t mean that it is viable, but it is viable, I’m informing, not arguing.

What other evidence is there about what is strong or not strong, than competetive play? Everything can be distorted into “your opinion” “completely subjective” as an escape for being an idiot.
“Kneeling to them”? I refer to esl as us, I play in esl myself.

I asked some friends btw:

Obindo.6802:

DH was viable.

You saw the last World Tournament? One DH in six teams (30 slots), and was destroyed.

I wouldn’t call them viable. And I wouldn’t call current patch Herald viable, also.

Obindo.6802:

CutesySylveon.8290:

Never once did I say that rev isn’t strong. No one with any sense would say that it doesn’t have strong points, but to say it’s the strongest class in the game, as a random no less, is just willful ignorance.

If you leave any class that’s capable of doing something like support or dps, then yes, they can shift a fight. That axe power necro won’t do much if you pressure him, but if you ignore him, then yes, he will cause you issues and can possibly sway the fight.

Try to stop pointing to els players to drive your point home when you offer no argument to defend your point. Saying it’s the strongest class with the evidence of ‘just because I said so’ or ‘esl’ doesn’t mean a thing. Other people who play the game are capable of just as much understanding of it as any ‘pro’ player, so stand on your own, instead of kneeling to them.

And btw, just saying DH was viable doesn’t mean that it was viable.

I know it doesn’t mean that it is viable, but it is viable, I’m informing, not arguing.

What other evidence is there about what is strong or not strong, than competetive play? Everything can be distorted into “your opinion” “completely subjective” as an escape for being an idiot.
“Kneeling to them”? I refer to esl as us, I play in esl myself.

I asked some friends btw:

Difficult to trust that honestly, no date, no nothing, for all we know those screens are pre patch, Ill take your word for it when i see a video from them discussing this, plus reasoning.

KrHome.1920:

Obindo.6802:

It dominates in teamfight and it’s mobility and it’s +1 capabilities is what makes it strongest class in game and essential.

OK, so you meant not “strongest class” but “strongest class in a very special part (called Pro League match) of the game”.

Neither in Roaming nor in Solo Q Revenant is strong. It’s mediocre at best.

Btw. I doubt it dominates in teamfights focused by 2 condi warrs, 2 DHs, 2 mesmers or 2 condi reapers or simply when no heal- / cleanse bot like ele or druid is around. It is dependant on babysitting like e.g. the meta reaper.

There’s no class stacking btw, but yes it does dominate teamfights. To have a rev in a teamfight is a huge advantage. If 1 team has a rev in a teamfight and the other doesn’t, then that team has an advantage except in certain cases of full counter comp. Simply put: any mirror matchup, where 1 team has 1 class swapped out for a rev, then they’re at an advantage (x + y + rev > x + y + z). That’s just an example, doesn’t have to be a mirror, applies for almost any teamfight apart from exceptions of counter comps.

Ahhh, good old ANET! Sidestepping core balance issues as always I see!