Guild Wars 2

As the title says, I have a few things that I really wanted to bring up and see if anyone else feels the same way.

#1: Brutal Blade – Sword Auto-Attack Chain 2: While I find this skill personally fun, I’m concerned about Perma-Reflect Mobs and Reflects in general. An Example of this would be the Jade Golems in the Jade Sea Fractal.

Not only does a reflect cause you to rip your own face off, but it also prevent the Chain from completing. While I can’t think of many places this outright cripples the Sword, As a Guardian for the last 3 years, I know the outright pain of having a projectile skill on a melee weapon and how it decides to work only when it wants too. Please reconsider how this skill work!

Possible Changes:
Make the attack shoot out a Cone of mist for 1 to 1.5 times the damage of the current projectile.

Have the skill cause Cripple too, but remove the projectile.

#2: Sword Auto Attack Animations: Anyone else feel kind of clumsy when it comes to swinging the sword around?

Personally, I get that we are trying to make the Rev not feel like a Guard or a Warr, but… I’d prefer to not feel like a wild beast swinging my sword around. I’d also love to get some of the less used melee attack animations in there.

Possible Changes:
First: Standard Sword Swing
Second: the Thrust
Third: Dual Strike from off-hand Ax 4 Warrior

Ok, I know the overhead swing is kind of out of the box and all, but here is my reasoning.
1: Ripping an hole into the Mist can’t be easy.
2: The animation itself is underused.
3: It would be amazing with any of the off hand weapons! (Look over some of the shield’s, they are almost weapons!)

This also works well with Brutal Blade as mentioned above, a thrust can both throw the blade (if it stays the same) or push out mist energy (if it was to change).

#3: Herald – Profession Mechanic not feeling like a new functionality.
One of the biggest concerns with the class has been variety, given how the legend skill sets are limited so much more than anyone else. The lack of new functionality in Herald worries me.

I am making this post after the Druid Live Stream, and it got me thinking… Our “new profession mechanic” doesn’t really feel… Elite… New… or otherwise. Before other form-goers begin to protest, I understand that the Boon Duration Buff is awesome, but this just doesn’t feel… like a new mechanic or functionality.

In review, the New Profession Mechanics are:
Facet of Nature (Boon Duration upkeep, Mini Save your Self buff)
Physical Virtues (Spear, Wings, Barrier)
Primal Rage (Condi/Range Burst skills req. 1/3 normal Ada to use.)
Tool-belt (Changes Functionality with new Utilities)
Daredevil’s 3rd Dodge Bar
Celestial Form (Druids Trans)
Overloads (Attunement Tool-belt Skills)
Continuum Split/Unique Boon (Save State Mechanic, and Alacrity)
Reaper Shroud Skills (Melee Focused Shroud Skill)

In each case, Aside from Facet of Nature, The New Mechanics provided a different functionality. Our beloved Facet doesn’t. It’s just an Upkeep Skill, something we already use liberally in our base mechanics. The other thing is, the Facet barely plays well with the other Legends. It feels like it is mostly there to buff the other Facet skills.

I understand the Revenant is the new kid on the block and is already sitting so far outside the typical class mechanics, but if it’s not given the same treatment as the other classes, I fear we will be playing catch up for years. (Here is looking at you Condition Countering Gameplay).

Possible Changes:
Honestly, I have been thinking about this for days now and I…

Got nothing.

Yep, I got nothing. Most of the ideas I have had are just rehashing things from other classes. I’m worried that future Elite Specs won’t allow for room for new functionality outside of their specific legend, and if that was the plan all along, I’d at least like to hear Roy say so.

In closing, these are clearly minor issues, but it would be nice to know other people’s thoughts! … especially Roys’

Brutal blade

Its not olny a problem with deflect/reflect (how to prevent other rev from daming you? Use hammer 4 or ventari buble..) but also slow projectile with tiny radius that prevent us from properly flanking around, obstructed projectile due uneven terrain, walls etc. Its even worse than projectile on sword guardian in this case as 50% daamge comes back from returning projectile which most of the time simply wont happen.

The projectile part also makes no sense on a melee weapon in a melee autoattack. Honestly that “feature” has to be deleted and replaced with normal attack.

The sword aa chain is also a mess. Im not sure where 3rd strike animation comes from, but first one is final thrust while brutal blade uses pummel bash – both are from warrior. It would be better if they replaced it with mesmer sword animations.

As for Herald we got a new unique playstyle – boonbot. Something base rev doesnt have so its all alright. We always could end like daredevil or tempest. The problem rev feels quite weak without Glint and Herald on it own feels like it should be in base class.

I hear ya man. Three years of Sword Wave nonsense tends to make one a little… touchy around projectile melee attacks.

Please Roy! Save us!

I agree with number 2. Melee attacks on a sword such as guardians 3rd auto attack don’t work well often in certain situations and cause misses which can be rather annoying. Also starting with a stab feels rather odd.

I think the sword on revenant animation wise was fine. But I also agree a projectile on melee attack is just bad. Haven’t you learned from guard that it’s no good? Same with jalis hammers on uneven terrain… projectile aoe and melee while looking cool are just bad… You shouldn’t be punished with only dealing partial damage just because the ground isn’t even. Just saying…

Glad to know I’m not the only one that feels this way!

Sarif.1827:

Glad to know I’m not the only one that feels this way!

Definitely not, I’ve been having sleepless nights over this as well. I used sword on my Guardian when it was part of the meta but I’m happy that’s not the case anymore.

For what it’s worth, in my Arah path 2 solo on Revenant the first boss was incredibly annoying because she puts up a reflect half the time. Even reflects and projectile destruction aside, the thing seems to just vanish if it hits a wall.

The animation looked fine to me.

I can’t recall how many times I have been attacking a object in the game world (Like a Gate, Door or some other object that isn’t a NPC), and I get to watch my Guardian do Sword Wave three times, each time hitting nothing because… Glitched projectile skill is glitched.

I hope we don’t have to suffer the same thing on Revenant… Hell, I kinda wish they’d go back and fix it on Guardian too, but I’m not getting my hopes up.

Please! Don’t Let Revenant suffer from this issue!

I agree with #1, #2 is direct conseguence.
About #3 i’m really happy, is not a massive new professional mechanic but we are the only class aside thieves to be able to use a mechanic like that.

Gaaroth.2567:

I agree with #1, #2 is direct conseguence.
About #3 i’m really happy, is not a massive new professional mechanic but we are the only class aside thieves to be able to use a mechanic like that.

What Part of Facet of Nature does a Thief do? o,0

Sarif.1827:

Gaaroth.2567:

I agree with #1, #2 is direct conseguence.
About #3 i’m really happy, is not a massive new professional mechanic but we are the only class aside thieves to be able to use a mechanic like that.

What Part of Facet of Nature does a Thief do? o,0

I meant that we are the only class aside thieves that have enery mechanic and that can have an “upkeep” mechanic attached to it ;-)

My fellow Mistwalkers! Rally and become Legion!

Ok, well.. maybe not that much but still, Projectile Attacks on melee attacks are a huge pain in the kitten

Other examples of Reflects being a massive pain in the kitten are:

Thermanova Reactor Fractal, When the Boss spins.

Grawl Fractal, First boss after knock back.

Apparently, I run a lot of fractals.

Well i dont even know why they made it projectile based in the first place when we all know how terrible sword on guard is. That is a clear issue which will be troublesome everywhere. I have feeling that if Roy wont address it we will end up running staff as sword wont be usable for anything else than spamming 3 which actually many people did last beta.

Absolutely +1 for you OP. Roy, please consider the points made in this topic!

As a Guardian main since launch… I know the pain of getting your melee attack reflected because it has melee range projectiles… it’s dumb. What’s worse is that it makes the attack repeat because it didn’t actually connect, and it just gets reflected again. It’s counter intuitive as well.

At least create some kind of flag that makes those projectiles non-reflectable.

But I think the elite spec mechanic is fine; it’s unique in that it can be used while attuned to any legend; it’s a 4th utility. I’d argue that Engineer got the shortest end of the stick in this regard, but toolbelt skills were already really flexible.

For the record, Revenant’s Sword AA 2 still goes through the AA sequence even if it’s reflected. There are two hits in the attack: First one ensures a hit because it’s a direct hit with the blade, second one is the projectile coming back. I tested it with a friend of mine in PvP and even inside a WoR, your enemy won’t make you reset the AA chain with reflects, like it happens with Guardian Sword AA 3. That said, I do agree that the first hit, by being a thrust, has less cleave potential so I would like to see it changed too.

I did notice in last beta a few times that I was missing a lot of attacks with sword. I thought I just wasn’t paying attention but apparently it was uneven ground. I love the sword and skill 3 is fun but if the ranged auto attack doesn’t change I’ll probably be forced back to mace…

Did anyone else notice occasionally the rift on sword skill 1 part 3 wouldn’t work? I’ll have to test it better this next weekend, but I recall my first hit would work second would hit ground and third would make a rift and just sit there. (Happened a couple times but most of the time was fine).

I also agree that sword aa shouldnt be a ranged atk, its more of a hinderance

The AA sequence should be Slash to the left, Stab with the projectile, then a Slash to the right with Rift attack; though I’d love to see a spin slash on the 3rd attack.

Just my humble opinion.

The Stab with the projectile would be a nice throw back to the old NES Zelda days.

Malthurius.6870:

As a Guardian main since launch… I know the pain of getting your melee attack reflected because it has melee range projectiles… it’s dumb. What’s worse is that it makes the attack repeat because it didn’t actually connect, and it just gets reflected again. It’s counter intuitive as well.

At least create some kind of flag that makes those projectiles non-reflectable.

That’s the reason I made this post, or atleast the major reason, I don’t want to have to suffer though this anymore.

Holds up a protest sign No Melee Projectiles! No Melee Projectiles!

Zeroth.7046:

For the record, Revenant’s Sword AA 2 still goes through the AA sequence even if it’s reflected. There are two hits in the attack: First one ensures a hit because it’s a direct hit with the blade, second one is the projectile coming back. I tested it with a friend of mine in PvP and even inside a WoR, your enemy won’t make you reset the AA chain with reflects, like it happens with Guardian Sword AA 3. That said, I do agree that the first hit, by being a thrust, has less cleave potential so I would like to see it changed too.

Wow that’s great know! Thanks for testing that!

However, as you stated, We don’t want Melee Projectiles that are reflect-able!

I’d rather the attack cause stack 3 more vulnerability or 2 secs of weakness then have the projectile. That’s not to say I’m ungrateful for the work that went into it, mind you, but the functionality of the attack is cause for concern.

Holds up a protest sign No Melee Projectiles! No Melee Projectiles!

Lonewolf Kai.3682:

The AA sequence should be Slash to the left, Stab with the projectile, then a Slash to the right with Rift attack; though I’d love to see a spin slash on the 3rd attack.

Just my humble opinion.

The Stab with the projectile would be a nice throw back to the old NES Zelda days.

I could see that too! Hell of a nice toss back!

This is our most desperate hour (not really). Help us, Obi-Wan Roy. You’re our only hope.

Holds up a protest sign No Melee Projectiles! No Melee Projectiles! Rar! Rar! Rar!

I also must say its not nice having to cancel your sword auto as a guardian when you get to the 3rd skill because that mob reflects. At least the guardian has mace and greatsword to use instead which scale well with power.

Revenant has mace mainhand which isn’t as good as sword for power, hammer which is a ranged weapon and again projectile, staff doesn’t scale well with power either.

Essentially for power builds revenant has no power melee weapon that can deal with reflecting mobs without taking a serious hit in damage. Making the projectiles unblockable would solve this issue but then would cause other problems. Alternatively bumping the coefficient of staff is another option but would lose its pacifist nature. Could adjust the coefficient on mace so it’s a truly hybrid weapon which would be good.

Either way I would like to see a change to the auto, though it is unique and good in its own way it will suck really hard in fractals like solid ocean.

Zeroth.7046:

For the record, Revenant’s Sword AA 2 still goes through the AA sequence even if it’s reflected. There are two hits in the attack: First one ensures a hit because it’s a direct hit with the blade, second one is the projectile coming back. I tested it with a friend of mine in PvP and even inside a WoR, your enemy won’t make you reset the AA chain with reflects, like it happens with Guardian Sword AA 3. That said, I do agree that the first hit, by being a thrust, has less cleave potential so I would like to see it changed too.

Im not sure about that, but i will test it in upcoming beta for sure. As far i rebember when i was soloing one camp in wvw i was stuck at repeating brutal blade over and over with no damage due to projectile obstruction. Once i moved from that spot this problem was gone. Howered it still doesnt change the fact that we losing 50% damage from this attack if we face walls, small stones etc or we when we just trying to take down objects in pve. We also hurting ourself when we try attack anything with reflect which is a bad desing considering that its our autoattack which we dont have any real control over.

While I do like the extra coverage from the sword auto projectile, I do agree with OP that projectile on sword auto can be a problem.

It is punishing players to hold a sword when monsters have permanent reflect(example jade maw fractal – crystal thingies) and definitely not a good experience to play with when every auto attack will be damage you in its 3rd chain.

Hope it can have a bit of revamp before the profession gets pushes out.
-fingers crossed-

And brutal blade repeat over and over against obstacle/projectile reflect

After some more testing, I have to say again, I’d really like Brutal Blade to be turned into a AoE effect and not a projectile.

Terrain issues are brutal to projectile coded skills, and there is no difference here.
Please?