Guild Wars 2

I’ve been theory crafting like crazy recently, trying to come up with as many rev builds as I can for the weekend and noticed some traits that are either useless or poorly placed or just inferior/awkward.

Corruption
Venom Enhancement: increase poison duration by 50%.
This is a strong trait except for the fact that only one Revenant skill poisons (for 6s and the only other ways is Embrace the Darkness by chance or Sigil of Doom). So its extremely situational and is obviously for a condi build but there’s Demonic Defiance sinceif your going condi you’re bringing Mallyx and Demonic Defiance turns Mallyx into a condi immune monster so why would you ever take Venom Enhancement?
Proposed change: chance on crit to deal poison (with internal cooldown). It fits the theme of crits and conditions that the specialisation has.

Pulsating Pestulance: 15% chance to copy conditions that last 3s with a 15s CD. I just don’t like the low chance on hit and the CD. The CD needs to stay though since it would be permanent embrace the darkness but the 15% hit chance is too inconsistent to be taken over the burn trait. 50% would be preferable.

Devastation
Jade Echo: deal 25% more DMG when downed, cast Jade Wind when downed (90s CD). I just don’t like this trait. Its fairly useless and if your going a power build with staff/hammer jalis/glint it is the only option if your speccing into devastation. I have no proposed change. Note: idk why you’d do that and spec devastation but its possible.

Herald
No specific trait issues. There’s a lack of condition defence abilities, but everyone knows that/it’s been said a lot. I’d prefer swift gale to remove a condition instead of superspeed but that’s not going to happen.

Invocation
Empty Vessel: this trait is essentially required and I can’t see making a build without it making the invocation line essentially meta. Every profession had this though so there’s no point changing it.

Retribution
Redeeming Protection: gain protection when disabled for 3s (5s CD).
Eye for an Eye: taunt foe when disabled (45s CD)
Improvised aggression: taunted foes deal 20% less damage to you.
Both redeeming protection and eye for an eye are majors so you can’t take both and they both are when disabled traits. Redeeming protection is useless since eye for an eye and improvised aggression synergize well. Its more reliable but really boring.
Proposed change: Improvised aggression now grants protection when hit by a taunted foe for 3s (5s CD). Make Redeeming protection GM, move Steadfast rejuvination to major, and change it to- taunt foes when you use a heal skill (60s CD). Now there’s no longer an awkward trait, there’s a defensive trait option, a taunt option and a retaliation option.

Salvation
Eluding Nullification: remove a condition from you and allies when dodging (10s CD). The only issue is the cooldown. I get revs are supposed to be weak to conditions but this trait is just weak.
Proposed change: Cast purifying essence when dodging (15s-30s CD) OR lower the cooldown to 5s. The first option may be too strong or too inconvenient but would be more thematic. I’d prefer the 5s cooldown.

Momentary Pacification: daze when you use an elite skill (10s CD). Good trait, not in the right place. Why? 3/5 stances do cc already, including ventari. It feels like it should be in retribution or corruption since it doesn’t work with Ventari and doesn’t fit the theme.
Proposed change: new trait Greater Knowledge (or something) heal near by allies when you use an elite skill. Now it synergizes with Ventari and matches the salvation theme.
Other replacement: daze when you use a heal skill (increase the CD to 30s). This one makes it more practical and fits the pacification theme but might be too strong.

Redeeming protection is useless since eye for an eye and improvised aggression synergize well.

uhm, no, I don’t think that’s correct. Sure Eye for an Eye has good synergy with Improved Aggression but just because there’s synergy, doesn’t make it any good, and here’s why:

a) Eye for an Eye is on a 45 second CD and only lasts ~4 seconds when traited (only on monsters)
b) You only get 20% damage reduction

whereas Redeeming Protection has a 33% damage reduction on a 5 second CD and lasts 3 seconds (on all opponents). I found Redeeming Protection to be more useful because it has a higher protection up-time and a bigger damage reduction, and I don’t think taunt is a such a big control effect that merits it being on a 45 second cooldown, especially since rangers can taunt up to every 15 seconds.

Now unless your goal is to redirect the aggro of a hammer warrior (or any other CC-heavy profession) and a big boss towards yourself, then I see it being on par with Redeeming Protection, but in every other situation, I think Redeeming Protection is a bit OP purely because of its up-time and that Eye for an Eye can use a shorter CD.

MercenaryNote.8506:

Redeeming protection is useless since eye for an eye and improvised aggression synergize well.

uhm, no, I don’t think that’s correct. Sure Eye for an Eye has good synergy with Improved Aggression but just because there’s synergy, doesn’t make it any good, and here’s why:

a) Eye for an Eye is on a 45 second CD and only lasts ~4 seconds when traited (only on monsters)
b) You only get 20% damage reduction

whereas Redeeming Protection has a 33% damage reduction on a 5 second CD and lasts 3 seconds (on all opponents). I found Redeeming Protection to be more useful because it has a higher protection up-time and a bigger damage reduction, and I don’t think taunt is a such a big control effect that merits it being on a 45 second cooldown, especially since rangers can taunt up to every 15 seconds.

Now unless your goal is to redirect the aggro of a hammer warrior (or any other CC-heavy profession) and a big boss towards yourself, then I see it being on par with Redeeming Protection, but in every other situation, I think Redeeming Protection is a bit OP purely because of its up-time and that Eye for an Eye can use a shorter CD.

I’m not sure if the 20% stacks with protection but if it does that’s a potential 53% less damage which is way stronger. The ranger trait should be nerfed in my opinion but besides the point one of those two should be balanced then. I also don’t play pve but doesn’t taunt still apply against bosses even though the cc is removed? Regardless, I think we can both agree we don’t need both, because ones clearly going to end up being better and since you can’t do both, one of the two is going to be worse fast.

Also I know he protection ones stronger but it is op and will be nerfed. The taunt one is just more interesting and fun to use.

Pulsating Pestilence and Diabolic Inferno in Corruption are both terrible. The former has no gating and its a small PBAoE so its entirely possible the cooldown will be triggered when there is no one in range to copy the conditions to without evening commenting on the RNG nature of it to begin with. The latter is a PBAoE burn when you use an Elite skill, woefully underpowered.

At least with the change to Maniacal Persistance there is one GM Corruption trait that is better than the first minor.

For the Devastation master, how about removing the dual-wield restriction on ferocious strikes? Speaking of which, why on earth is the aoe version with less restrictions (clearly more powerful) an adept trait, while this one is master?

About Venom Enhancement: For going Condi you don’t have to take Mallyx. The only Condition that Mallyx offers is Confusion and a bit of Torment. I Play a Condi/Support Hybrid and don’t take Mallyx. Corruption and Mace is enough for the Condi Side.

NapTooN.6283:

About Venom Enhancement: …

I get that and I’m going to try that but venom enhancement doesn’t feel viable since rev just can’t apply enough poison for that to be better than the heal on incoming condition trait, except in pve, which it’s still pretty weak.

Hooglese.4860:

NapTooN.6283:

About Venom Enhancement: …

I get that and I’m going to try that but venom enhancement doesn’t feel viable since rev just can’t apply enough poison for that to be better than the heal on incoming condition trait, except in pve, which it’s still pretty weak.

Revenant alone can not, that is true, but there are Runes and Sigils for that. I for one use Orr-Runes in PvP +20% Poison Sigil which caps me at 100% already. With the Orr Runes i get a 20s Poison with a 20s cooldown, sure i have to be hit for that, but that will happen sooner or later anyway because we are not DareDevils. You can go Rata Sum instead of Orr for a Radiation Field which will pulse a 6s Poison every second for 15s on top of weakness.

Sigil of Doom gives you another 16s Poison on Weapon/Legendswap with a 9s cooldown. Sure one stack is not much, but it is enough for the -33% Healing and lasts quite Long. If he removes that stack, you can still slap him with your Mace for a 6s Poison.

Redeeming Protection is 10x better than eye for an eye. 5s ICD with 3s prot on disables is a lot of uptime and pretty consistent dmg reduction.

Eye for an eye has kitten ICD and and its usability is really kitten low.

Venom enhancement is indeed terrible. Maybe they made it with Mallyx elite in mind and copying? Who knows.

Killyox.3950:

Redeeming Protection is 10x better than eye for an eye. 5s ICD with 3s prot on disables is a lot of uptime and pretty consistent dmg reduction.

Eye for an eye has kitten ICD and and its usability is really kitten low.

Venom enhancement is indeed terrible. Maybe they made it with Mallyx elite in mind and copying? Who knows.

Eye for an Eye is mostly bad because Improved Aggression only works with NPCs. If it worked with PCs aswell, a 6s Taunt on CC with (fourtyfive)s CD would be much better.

Hooglese.4860:

Momentary Pacification: daze when you use an elite skill (10s CD). Good trait, not in the right place. Why? 3/5 stances do cc already, including ventari. It feels like it should be in retribution or corruption since it doesn’t work with Ventari and doesn’t fit the theme.

I have to disagree with you here. As a pacifist, it makes a lot of sense for Ventari’s favourite trait line to have Daze in it since it’s a pacifying effect. However the problem is that -like you said – you don’t need the Daze with the mostly CC based Revenant Elites. Shiro’s Elite stuns, Daze isn’t necessary here. Jalis’s ult is supposed to make people hit you for less, which will be wasted because they’re not going to be hitting you when they’re Dazed. The same thing goes with Ventari and Glints’ elites. Mallyx doesn’t have that problem though. This trait can stay, but needs to be changed so the Daze is applied after the initial effect. So the Daze will start AFTER the knock back, stun, superprotection. You know, just so you can make use of it. It would probably work the same for Mallyx though.

Hooglese.4860:

Proposed change: new trait Greater Knowledge (or something) heal near by allies when you use an elite skill. Now it synergizes with Ventari and matches the salvation theme.
Other replacement: daze when you use a heal skill (increase the CD to 30s). This one makes it more practical and fits the pacification theme

1. A heal of some form would definitely allow the use of Salvation’s healing modifiers across your legend sets, but Salvation isn’t entirely about healing. It’s also got a fair bit of damage prevention in there too. Plus we already have Natural Abundance as a healing injection elite. Maybe they should make Natural Abundance also cause EVERY legend’s Elite to drop a handful of healing packs like Ventari’s does. That would add some use for the modifiers outside of Staff/Shield/Ventari. It would also pretty much make every Elite even more of a ‘save your bacon skill.’ Are you getting wrecked in Shiro? Pop your ult to stun the fools and get your party and yourself healed up while they can’t do nuttin’. Give massive protection AND healing with Jalis? YES PLEASE? Ignore that self tormenting with Mallyx too!

2. It makes more sense for it to be on an elite skill rather than a heal. Revenant Elites don’t have cooldowns, meaning you could double cast your ult to keep someone Dazed. In my mind at least it fits better as a skill that has no high ICD associated with its strength, only your own ability to manage your energy.

Treetoptrickster.4205:

Hooglese.4860:

Momentary Pacification: daze when you use an elite skill (10s CD). Good trait, not in the right place. Why? 3/5 stances do cc already, including ventari. It feels like it should be in retribution or corruption since it doesn’t work with Ventari and doesn’t fit the theme.

I have to disagree with you here. As a pacifist, it makes a lot of sense for Ventari’s favourite trait line to have Daze in it since it’s a pacifying effect. However the problem is that -like you said – you don’t need the Daze with the mostly CC based Revenant Elites. Shiro’s Elite stuns, Daze isn’t necessary here. Jalis’s ult is supposed to make people hit you for less, which will be wasted because they’re not going to be hitting you when they’re Dazed. The same thing goes with Ventari and Glints’ elites. Mallyx doesn’t have that problem though. This trait can stay, but needs to be changed so the Daze is applied after the initial effect. So the Daze will start AFTER the knock back, stun, superprotection. You know, just so you can make use of it. It would probably work the same for Mallyx though.

It sounds like it would be unusual to program Momentary Pacification to daze after the effect ends. For example, this would be a 3 second delay on Jade Winds (3 sec stun), but what would happen if you moved away? Would an AoE daze still erupt from your current or former position three seconds later?

I recall someone recommended in another post that the daze occur at the start of the elite cast rather than the finish. Yes, this means you would have an instant-cast AoE daze (10 sec ICD, but maybe it could be increased a bit for balance), that would combo into making Jade Winds, for example, even harder to escape from. It would also give you a great boost in mitigating damage while CC’ed. But it would come at a pretty big cost in an aggressive build because you would need to take the Salvation traitline, which is otherwise completely terrible for aggressive builds. So, I argue that it would not necessarily be OP. What does everyone think?

I think many of the Rev traits still need work, and I think you’ve captured a lot of that in this post. Kudos.

I will not add to this thread before the flood of feedback starts tomorrow, but after the weekend I would like to also give feedback specifically about the traits as I feel like it is the last thing missing from making the Rev feel right.

fluidmonolith.3584:

I recall someone recommended in another post that the daze occur at the start of the elite cast rather than the finish. Yes, this means you would have an instant-cast AoE daze (10 sec ICD, but maybe it could be increased a bit for balance), that would combo into making Jade Winds, for example, even harder to escape from. It would also give you a great boost in mitigating damage while CC’ed. But it would come at a pretty big cost in an aggressive build because you would need to take the Salvation traitline, which is otherwise completely terrible for aggressive builds. So, I argue that it would not necessarily be OP. What does everyone think?

Im totally okay with that. Just right now its just good for Jalis and Mallyx otherwise it’s not useful

I like the idea of Elluding Nullification casting Purifying Essence on dodge. Removing one condition is really weak and having it cast Purifying Essence would further add to the supportive nature of the trait line.