Guild Wars 2

Why make a whole legend for racials? Plus you’d have to do it for each race.. terribly time consuming idea. Just convert mistfire wolf and the racial elites over to 50 energy with a 30-60 cd. Let them be swap-able and wammo its done.

I mean they are severely underpowered how are they ever gonna put the rev ahead of other classes by using a racial skill? The only way that could happen is put very low energy and no cd on the summon skills.

Summons are another issue though with the mechanic of the class. The Legend swap is a full commit, so any on-going skills get immediately cancelled when swapping to another Legend. Racial summons should then also play by that similar rule such as making them an upkeep of sort else they would need to be destroyed upon swapping away from the utility bar they were slotted into.

seems a lot of people don’t like to be not able to use racials

how about including a “not invoking any legend” -Legend….that can use racial skills/mistfire wolf but don’t has any more skills.

from a Lore point i guess also a Revenant want some alone time and not always summon the power of some legend. Also it would give the option of not glowing hands legend…my personal rant….

Guys I’d like racials as much as anyone else but they really are problematic, particularl for ventari. Some races have racial healing skills. If you slotted Prayer to Dwayna on ventari’s heal you wouldn’t even be able to use the tablet at all

Vennyhedgie.5369:

Guys I’d like racials as much as anyone else but they really are problematic, particularl for ventari. Some races have racial healing skills. If you slotted Prayer to Dwayna on ventari’s heal you wouldn’t even be able to use the tablet at all

Well then that would be kind of dumb for you to do wouldnt it :P

Vennyhedgie.5369:

Guys I’d like racials as much as anyone else but they really are problematic, particularl for ventari. Some races have racial healing skills. If you slotted Prayer to Dwayna on ventari’s heal you wouldn’t even be able to use the tablet at all

Dwayna shall offer herself as your tablet O.O

Why is this thread still being discussed? This from Roy pretty much closed the topic:

The problem is that they are balanced around having 1 skill bar and not 2 for the right half of your bar. They are also not made with energy in mind and would need to be changed to work with revenant, but would muddy the purity of each legends skill set playstyle. I thought I had mentioned it before on one of the initial streams, but racial skills won’t be usable on revenant.

/thread

Lonewolf Kai.3682:

Why is this thread still being discussed? This from Roy pretty much closed the topic:

The problem is that they are balanced around having 1 skill bar and not 2 for the right half of your bar. They are also not made with energy in mind and would need to be changed to work with revenant, but would muddy the purity of each legends skill set playstyle. I thought I had mentioned it before on one of the initial streams, but racial skills won’t be usable on revenant.

/thread

because we dont agree with it not being able to work, especially since we dont have any other customizable utilities. Revenant is getting totally screwed in the utility department

no racials(understandable, but just feel like laziness not to include them in a way)

like 8 LESS utilites than EVERY other class, sure we can use 6 in a fight, but other classes can use way more skills in a fight than us.

Zev.3407:

Lonewolf Kai.3682:

Why is this thread still being discussed? This from Roy pretty much closed the topic:

The problem is that they are balanced around having 1 skill bar and not 2 for the right half of your bar. They are also not made with energy in mind and would need to be changed to work with revenant, but would muddy the purity of each legends skill set playstyle. I thought I had mentioned it before on one of the initial streams, but racial skills won’t be usable on revenant.

/thread

because we dont agree with it not being able to work, especially since we dont have any other customizable utilities. Revenant is getting totally screwed in the utility department

no racials(understandable, but just feel like laziness not to include them in a way)

like 8 LESS utilites than EVERY other class, sure we can use 6 in a fight, but other classes can use way more skills in a fight than us.

Agree with it or not, Roy sounded pretty final in that statement.

Also, Revenants are THE only class that can use 6 utilties in a fight. ALL other classes can only use 3. I’m not sure where you’re getting your idea from because it’s flat out false.

Finally, I disagree with you and anyone else that says there’s no customization to skills. You have 5 sets of utilties you can use.

Lonewolf Kai.3682:

Zev.3407:

Lonewolf Kai.3682:

Why is this thread still being discussed? This from Roy pretty much closed the topic:

The problem is that they are balanced around having 1 skill bar and not 2 for the right half of your bar. They are also not made with energy in mind and would need to be changed to work with revenant, but would muddy the purity of each legends skill set playstyle. I thought I had mentioned it before on one of the initial streams, but racial skills won’t be usable on revenant.

/thread

because we dont agree with it not being able to work, especially since we dont have any other customizable utilities. Revenant is getting totally screwed in the utility department

no racials(understandable, but just feel like laziness not to include them in a way)

like 8 LESS utilites than EVERY other class, sure we can use 6 in a fight, but other classes can use way more skills in a fight than us.

Agree with it or not, Roy sounded pretty final in that statement.

Also, Revenants are THE only class that can use 6 utilties in a fight. ALL other classes can only use 3. I’m not sure where you’re getting your idea from because it’s flat out false.

Finally, I disagree with you and anyone else that says there’s no customization to skills. You have 5 sets of utilties you can use.

Engineer and Elemenatlist have more weapon skills caused by their utilities (kits, summoned weapons , attunments) , which is, to be honest really powerful (looking at ice bow). sure we can use 2 heal and elite skills. but locked in utiliets we can’t change at all and less overall skills we can’t mix and match. not to be able to mix and match is fair as we can have two legends in fight, yet we are still stuck with less overall skills

Enrif.7359:

Lonewolf Kai.3682:

Zev.3407:

Lonewolf Kai.3682:

Why is this thread still being discussed? This from Roy pretty much closed the topic:

The problem is that they are balanced around having 1 skill bar and not 2 for the right half of your bar. They are also not made with energy in mind and would need to be changed to work with revenant, but would muddy the purity of each legends skill set playstyle. I thought I had mentioned it before on one of the initial streams, but racial skills won’t be usable on revenant.

/thread

because we dont agree with it not being able to work, especially since we dont have any other customizable utilities. Revenant is getting totally screwed in the utility department

no racials(understandable, but just feel like laziness not to include them in a way)

like 8 LESS utilites than EVERY other class, sure we can use 6 in a fight, but other classes can use way more skills in a fight than us.

Agree with it or not, Roy sounded pretty final in that statement.

Also, Revenants are THE only class that can use 6 utilties in a fight. ALL other classes can only use 3. I’m not sure where you’re getting your idea from because it’s flat out false.

Finally, I disagree with you and anyone else that says there’s no customization to skills. You have 5 sets of utilties you can use.

Engineer and Elemenatlist have more weapon skills caused by their utilities (kits, summoned weapons , attunments) , which is, to be honest really powerful (looking at ice bow). sure we can use 2 heal and elite skills. but locked in utiliets we can’t change at all and less overall skills we can’t mix and match. not to be able to mix and match is fair as we can have two legends in fight, yet we are still stuck with less overall skills

You want more skills? Take all the filler Ele ones, please. Actually don’t, I want to main Rev now.
I think people keep thinking more = better, when in fact, having quality skills like Jade Winds, Banish Enchantment, all the Glint skills, Impossible Odds, etc. with low or non-existant cooldowns is MUCH better than having useless sets of utilities like Glyphs.

The only argument you could have is that there’s less individual customization, but that’s more of a balancing factor than anything.

I heard someone say it makes us more predictable? A Cele D/D Ele is predictable. That doesn’t make it any less potent.
Actually, since we have a lot of uses for a lot of our skills, our predictability isn’t even that bad. I think the overall design of the Revenant is pretty darn good and now with weapon swap we can make different builds with different ideas.
For example, Shiro/Glint can do Power or Condi depending entirely on what weapons you decide to run. Jalis/Mallyx can work for a Condi Tank too, or Jalis/Ventari, Jalis/Glint, etc.
Just be creative, a lot of stuff can work.

I may do this as a project to create Revenant Racial legends and skills for each of the five races. I may need help on the lore side of it. But will put my creative mind to it.

Zev.3407:

Lonewolf Kai.3682:

Why is this thread still being discussed? This from Roy pretty much closed the topic:

The problem is that they are balanced around having 1 skill bar and not 2 for the right half of your bar. They are also not made with energy in mind and would need to be changed to work with revenant, but would muddy the purity of each legends skill set playstyle. I thought I had mentioned it before on one of the initial streams, but racial skills won’t be usable on revenant.

/thread

because we dont agree with it not being able to work, especially since we dont have any other customizable utilities. Revenant is getting totally screwed in the utility department

no racials(understandable, but just feel like laziness not to include them in a way)

like 8 LESS utilites than EVERY other class, sure we can use 6 in a fight, but other classes can use way more skills in a fight than us.

Yeah it just feels unfair and makes revenants even less customizable than they already. They even gave engineers extra toolbelt skills for all racials, they could have worked them into revenant too…

Roy Cronacher.1576:

Bitoku Kishi.8346:

I’m guessing they might be able to be slotted into any Legend, which could be pretty convenient to replace some of the less useful Legend skills…

The problem is that they are balanced around having 1 skill bar and not 2 for the right half of your bar. They are also not made with energy in mind and would need to be changed to work with revenant, but would muddy the purity of each legends skill set playstyle. I thought I had mentioned it before on one of the initial streams, but racial skills won’t be usable on revenant.

Then you need to bar the class to Norns… because a Norn that can’t shift to spirit-totem form is an abomination. We’ve had an entire expansion centered around this fact.

This thread still going on ?:P

Why shouldn’t it still go on? It’s pretty lame that racials and, more importantly, Utility Customization are obviously a major concern to many players yet Roy doesn’t appear to be allowed to comment on it.

Explaining that Racials and Neutral skills won’t be available is the closest they’ve come, despite the broader issue having been brought up for months now.

Once the hype wears off and players realize how stale having so few customization options is maybe they’ll finally address it.

I’m not happy at all about racials, but it’s kinda easy to see where this decision comes from.
Sure, they could give them greater CDs or make them weaker to balance the double utility bar but that wouldn’t work that great.

If we could come up with a feasible solution all together I’m sure Roy and the crew would take that in consideration. They did for a lot of things, after all.

Dastion.3106:

Why shouldn’t it still go on? It’s pretty lame that racials and, more importantly, Utility Customization are obviously a major concern to many players yet Roy doesn’t appear to be allowed to comment on it.

Explaining that Racials and Neutral skills won’t be available is the closest they’ve come, despite the broader issue having been brought up for months now.

Once the hype wears off and players realize how stale having so few customization options is maybe they’ll finally address it.

I 1000% agree with this. Denying a whole profession of racial skills is pretty kitten, and utility customisation is definitely something that needs to be addressed.

Roy Cronacher.1576:

Bitoku Kishi.8346:

I’m guessing they might be able to be slotted into any Legend, which could be pretty convenient to replace some of the less useful Legend skills…

The problem is that they are balanced around having 1 skill bar and not 2 for the right half of your bar. They are also not made with energy in mind and would need to be changed to work with revenant, but would muddy the purity of each legends skill set playstyle. I thought I had mentioned it before on one of the initial streams, but racial skills won’t be usable on revenant.

Thanks for the reply Roy, I appreciate it.
I have to say I’m still siding with the others in this thread who feel it is unnecessary and even detrimental to deny Revenant racial skills though. I don’t really see any racial skills as being more powerful than the Revenant’s regular skills, and can’t really imagine how it could imbalance them in any way. The other classes all have access to them anyway. What it would do is add in some potential variability though, that I think could be fun to play around with even if I don’t really see it significantly benefiting the Revenant at all in a technical sense.
I also similarly agree with others in thinking Mistfire Wolf should be usable as well in place of any of their elites. Even though it’s a useless skill, it would again give another small degree of variability that could feel fun, without really hurting the class at all that I can see.
In the end, I’m sure I will love playing the Revenant class regardless of what happens with this issue. But I just wanted to throw out this suggestion anyway. Thanks for listening.

While i understand people wanting them, in the overall scheme is just a waste of time..but that’s just my humble opinion

Very disappointing news indeed. I understand it’s a frustrating situation but to outright dismiss them pretty much sucks. I hope that they change their stance on it and revisit them for balancing later. Plenty of good ideas have been tossed out in this thread for making them work. And for the point someone mentioned about using a racial heal with Ventari, simply put an icon over the heal like for underwater noting that it will not work if you slot Ventari. That could apply to any legend that conflicts with a racial skill. All the rest just need flat energy consumption added and the cooldown be universal so you can’t flip legends and use them again.

I really appreciate the flavor that racial skills give. I wouldn’t really care if they were woefully underpowered for the revenant. I just want that racial flavor there for my character to tap into.

If someone chooses to slot the same racial on both bars, why not just make it share the same cooldown on swap? If they use it and swap, the cooldown would continue from the previous legend. It wouldn’t make them any more powerful, and if someone would slot it on both bars it would just waste space if it was used. It adds some customizability and flavor to a class that has very limited changeability. It’s not like any of the skills are really game breaking. But it is a fun piece to have.

Jephiroth.3197:

If someone chooses to slot the same racial on both bars, why not just make it share the same cooldown on swap? If they use it and swap, the cooldown would continue from the previous legend. It wouldn’t make them any more powerful, and if someone would slot it on both bars it would just waste space if it was used. It adds some customizability and flavor to a class that has very limited changeability. It’s not like any of the skills are really game breaking. But it is a fun piece to have.

It’s not just the cooldowns they are concerned about though, racials currently won’t use energy, and if you slotted a healing racial (#6) on some legends, you would negate all of your other utilities. All of these could be fixed if they wanted to though, and like I said, plenty of good ideas have already been thrown out. I’ve accepted they don’t have the resources for it right now and rev won’t ship with them, I just wish they didn’t close the book on them completely and consider revisiting them in the future. I too agree it adds a lot of flavor and personal touch to builds and would take a lot away from the game.

Nay of the Ether.8913:

It’s not just the cooldowns they are concerned about though, racials currently won’t use energy, and if you slotted a healing racial (#6) on some legends, you would negate all of your other utilities.

I really only see this happening with Ventari. But if someone really wants to be stupid and ruin Ventari by slotting a racial healing skill into it, what’s really the problem with that?
The bottom line is I only see racial skills having even less benefit for Revenant than other classes, if anything. And to me the idea that Revenant will somehow become too powerful if they get access to the regular racial skills just seems sort of ridiculous.

Bitoku Kishi.8346:

I really only see this happening with Ventari. But if someone really wants to be stupid and ruin Ventari by slotting a racial healing skill into it, what’s really the problem with that?

GW2 is designed from the ground up to avoid, for as much as possible, situations like the one you mentioned. So if they want to be consistent with their design philosophy, then yes, that’s also a major problem.

DiogoSilva.7089:

GW2 is designed from the ground up to avoid, for as much as possible, situations like the one you mentioned. So if they want to be consistent with their design philosophy, then yes, that’s also a major problem.

Perhaps, but to me it seems equally strange and against design philosophy to exclude the racial skills entirely from Revenant.

Bitoku Kishi.8346:

DiogoSilva.7089:

GW2 is designed from the ground up to avoid, for as much as possible, situations like the one you mentioned. So if they want to be consistent with their design philosophy, then yes, that’s also a major problem.

Perhaps, but to me it seems equally strange and against design philosophy to exclude the racial skills entirely from Revenant.

This would be fixed by actually fixing ventari as well. The tablet should autosummon and autofollow anyway. You choose to give up the ability to move it to get… what? healing seed? Prayer to dwayna?

I’m sure someone can theorycraft a build that could benefit from using those skills. Why can’t we have that opportunity? i’m actually seriously rethinking rolling a revenant because of this.

Nay of the Ether.8913:

Jephiroth.3197:

If someone chooses to slot the same racial on both bars, why not just make it share the same cooldown on swap? If they use it and swap, the cooldown would continue from the previous legend. It wouldn’t make them any more powerful, and if someone would slot it on both bars it would just waste space if it was used. It adds some customizability and flavor to a class that has very limited changeability. It’s not like any of the skills are really game breaking. But it is a fun piece to have.

It’s not just the cooldowns they are concerned about though, racials currently won’t use energy, and if you slotted a healing racial (#6) on some legends, you would negate all of your other utilities. All of these could be fixed if they wanted to though, and like I said, plenty of good ideas have already been thrown out. I’ve accepted they don’t have the resources for it right now and rev won’t ship with them, I just wish they didn’t close the book on them completely and consider revisiting them in the future. I too agree it adds a lot of flavor and personal touch to builds and would take a lot away from the game.

Racial abilities are just that, “Racial”. They shouldn’t have anything to do with Revenant mechanics. They should have an activation and a cooldown, just like they do on every other class. They don’t need an energy cost, they are an ability of that particular character’s race. If someone would choose to slot a healing ability over a Revenant ability, then so be it. They are going to miss out on all of the potential synergies and effects of the Revenant specific heals.

For the most part, they are just weaker versions of spells that already exist. I know that for fun, I will slot all racial abilities (as much as I can anyways) and play PvE and WvW as a pure-ish Sylvari or Human (The only races that I play) with no particular class mechanics other than weapon abilities and racials.

It’ll be a sad time if they don’t include them, I really have fun with them and it gives you something to do when you want a little change.