14/05 doom day of thief?

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Posted by: JUN YANG.4328

JUN YANG.4328

hi guys

what do you think of new update 14/05 anti- stealth trap.. 30s… i think thats too much..

until yesterday . i am levelling my thief… getting already for her weapon, armor. traits build . big hope on her to get ready to get in to WvW..

after today.. i am gona stop levelling. selling the gear.

how possible to be a thief survive in WvW without stealth… any suggestion? i am so disappointing…

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Posted by: RedSpectrum.1975

RedSpectrum.1975

As much as I hate these new traps, it’s not as bad as it seems. I’ll admit we are acting like there is a trap every 2 feet but they are most likely used in keep and around camps. So you just need to be wary when around major areas that are called out in map chat a lot. And if you are suddenly stripped from stealth out of nowhere…..run, dont look back just run.

Shawtell, Zen Verani, Rayshia Howen, Iyado, Colace Nzoir, Arteel Fyrien [Teef]

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Posted by: BlackBeard.2873

BlackBeard.2873

Survival when you step on the odd trap?
-Shadow-step
-Infiltrator’s arrow
-Signet of shadows
-Infiltrator’s strike (no target), return after pursuant passes to juke
-Heart-seeker w/ no target (leap finisher)
-Shadow-shot an ambient
-Caltrops

All of these skills will, in fact, allow you to survive almost any chase. There are also builds that use your built-in evasions and shadow-steps to fight someone while they can see you. Don’t worry, your class isn’t broke. In fact, as seen in other threads, you are buffed in that you can stack your invisibility and drop a supply trap right in the middle of a zerg and get out!

The sky isn’t falling, the sun will come up tomorrow, and everything will be all right.

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Posted by: JUN YANG.4328

JUN YANG.4328

as we all know thief its not a fast runner.. without stealth how possible to escape? meaning once you trap it.. u will die hard.. :-(

before i had save all the money to buy a T3 gear. tramsution stone. and i even ran arah to get token for her as well.

lucky my character only lvl30. having do crafting yet.. I am gona spending my money to the others . theif only become my storage. until they change the trap time again..

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Posted by: RedSpectrum.1975

RedSpectrum.1975

as we all know thief its not a fast runner.. without stealth how possible to escape? meaning once you trap it.. u will die hard.. :-(

before i had save all the money to buy a T3 gear. tramsution stone. and i even ran arah to get token for her as well.

lucky my character only lvl30. having do crafting yet.. I am gona spending my money to the others . theif only become my storage. until they change the trap time again..

OOC Signet of Shadows makes you faster, but use infiltrator’s arrow, shadow step, and a ton of heartseekers until that revealed wears off.

Shawtell, Zen Verani, Rayshia Howen, Iyado, Colace Nzoir, Arteel Fyrien [Teef]

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Posted by: JUN YANG.4328

JUN YANG.4328

na.. 30s guardian can kill you easily, 4 swiftness , 2 teleport skill. without stealth there is no way u can escape. power, armor, health non of it can compare.

na.. 30s guardian can kill you easily, 4 swiftness , 2 teleport skill. without stealth there is no way u can escape. power, armor, health non of it can compare.i rader use back my mesmer for WvW

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Posted by: Doggie.3184

Doggie.3184

I was doin’ WvW most of the night today, I hadn’t ran into any of them yet.

| Fort Aspenwood (NA): Sylvari Daredevil Thief Main: All Classes 80. |
Please Remove/Fix Thief Trait: “Last Refuge.”
“Hard to Catch” is a Horrible and Useless Trait. Fixed 6/23/15. Praise Dwayna.

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Posted by: JUN YANG.4328

JUN YANG.4328

u will… new updated just few hours ago.. 500 karma everyone can buy its easily.. lol

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Posted by: Travlane.5948

Travlane.5948

you have to choose the only preset build anet wants you to play. evade spam :P its annoying and boring in my opinion.

@doggie i tried one on a thief i met in TC. dropped it while in stealth….was an insta win…. had 100% hp when he died.

ok ill admit its not going to happen every 5 mins ur in wvw. but when it does….its insta win button.

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Posted by: Samoleth.5012

Samoleth.5012

how possible to be a thief survive in WvW without stealth

Blinds and evades.
Since i balanced my thief gear around some precise stats, changed the way i play and focused on something else than OMG backstabz!!!!111!!1 i can stay in stealth or without stealth with no consequences.
Drop a trap for 1v1? No problems, i can stay in the 1v1 fight as long as i want to, and in the end it’s always the enemy to flee.
I’m much, much, much worried about the other trap.
3 in a row, claculate the right distance between each of them, place those traps at certain points and you can steal all the supplies.

(3 is just a number, didn’t test anything, maybe it will require more, maybe less)

a random derpling

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Posted by: Karolis.4261

Karolis.4261

how possible to be a thief survive in WvW without stealth

Blinds and evades.
Since i balanced my thief gear around some precise stats, changed the way i play and focused on something else than OMG backstabz!!!!111!!1 i can stay in stealth or without stealth with no consequences.
Drop a trap for 1v1? No problems, i can stay in the 1v1 fight as long as i want to, and in the end it’s always the enemy to flee.
I’m much, much, much worried about the other trap.
3 in a row, claculate the right distance between each of them, place those traps at certain points and you can steal all the supplies.

(3 is just a number, didn’t test anything, maybe it will require more, maybe less)

When revealed thief gets blinds only with D/P, the most stealth heavy weapon set in game. So u saying that every thief should run d/p or s/d evade spam just to have a chance to stay in fight instead running like a kitten for 30s? Oh right, after last update 90% of thief community runs D/P and S/D troll dedicated builds with perma stealth from black powder/hs combos and infiltrators strike abuse which actually didnt change at all, but somehow became new meta after flanking strike buff ( yea me too dont see any logics in that).

PvP hero Valentin in action!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-HiYUlhsO_M
cough*keyboardturningclicker*cough

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Posted by: Samoleth.5012

Samoleth.5012

When revealed thief gets blinds only with D/P, the most stealth heavy weapon set in game. So u saying that every thief should run d/p or s/d evade spam just to have a chance to stay in fight instead running like a kitten for 30s? Oh right, after last update 90% of thief community runs D/P and S/D troll dedicated builds with perma stealth from black powder/hs combos and infiltrators strike abuse which actually didnt change at all, but somehow became new meta after flanking strike buff ( yea me too dont see any logics in that).

I’m actually saying to all the QQers out there that there actually is a way to build a thief without heavy stealth usage.
And that it can still be effective, if not more effective, has some good staying power while maintaining a relatively good power (attack\crit\crit damage).
Usually i end up in worst cases (worst being those cases where i don’t screw up something, like doubletapping the black powder key and wasting all my init in 2s, like when i got some skill lag) in a draw 1v1, where we compliment eachother etc etc
But i don’t want to brag about, i’m not that kind of player, i was only answering to the op QQ about 30s revealed.
About the “new meta”: if the majority of thieves follow a preset build\weponset\gear they simply can’t be effective and will be stomped by someone with a bit of knowledge of the thief class.
I’m saying this because i was one of them, then found a build where i felt comfortable and started to tweak that build\gear and finally changed playstyle.
What i’m suggesting to the OP and all the others is to wait and see what happens..in the end it’s a 600×90 trap, if a guy is standing in there just shortbow spam or stealth and /laugh at him while he can’t do nothing because of his “precious” trap.

EDIT: i wrote quickly so i don’t know if there’s any typo or error, if there’s some i’m sorry for that i’ll edit my post when i got some spare time

a random derpling

(edited by Samoleth.5012)

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Posted by: Deathspike.1870

Deathspike.1870

To everyone continuously saying non-stealth builds are viable, please share them! I have tried building one that doesn’t rely on stealth and I get absolutely nowhere, so I went for a Ranger instead (lol). Please, share.

Active: Mesmer, Warrior
Inactive: Guardian, Elementalist, Ranger, Thief (ex-main)
Leveling: Engineer, Necromancer

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

The irony when other classes complain about thieves using this trap on them … hahaha -_-

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

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Posted by: Nyctimus.4109

Nyctimus.4109

To everyone else saying non-stealth builds are viable please STFU.

People want to play in different ways. If you’re a low-damage bunker thief, you probably don’t care, but for the high-damage stealth-reliant thieves, this kittens us over big time.

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Posted by: Samoleth.5012

Samoleth.5012

To everyone continuously saying non-stealth builds are viable, please share them! I have tried building one that doesn’t rely on stealth and I get absolutely nowhere, so I went for a Ranger instead (lol). Please, share.

http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/thief/?7.0|8.1g.h17.a.1g.h1|c.1g.h14.8.1g.h2|1n.7e.1g.7e.1n.7e.1g.7e.1n.7e.1g.7e|2t.d13.1g.61.1g.61.1n.64.1n.64.1i.64|0.a3.u45b.u39a.0|3t.1|59.5a.5f.5h.0|e

Mind that i fight with 25 bloodlust and an average of 8 might stacks.

a random derpling

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

To everyone continuously saying non-stealth builds are viable, please share them! I have tried building one that doesn’t rely on stealth and I get absolutely nowhere, so I went for a Ranger instead (lol). Please, share.

http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/thief/?7.0|8.1g.h17.a.1g.h1|c.1g.h14.8.1g.h2|1n.7e.1g.7e.1n.7e.1g.7e.1n.7e.1g.7e|2t.d13.1g.61.1g.61.1n.64.1n.64.1i.64|0.a3.u45b.u39a.0|3t.1|59.5a.5f.5h.0|e

Mind that i fight with 25 bloodlust and an average of 8 might stacks.

You have 3 traits totally relying on stealth

Shadow’s Embrace Remove one condition every 3 seconds while in stealth
Infusion of Shadow Gain 2 initiative when using a skill that stealths you
Shadow’s Rejuvenation Regenerate health while in stealth

How exactly is this a non-stealth build? All you did was kitten yourself with so much toughness with respect to the amount of critical damage you got.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

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Posted by: Samoleth.5012

Samoleth.5012

You have 3 traits totally relying on stealth

Shadow’s Embrace Remove one condition every 3 seconds while in stealth
Infusion of Shadow Gain 2 initiative when using a skill that stealths you
Shadow’s Rejuvenation Regenerate health while in stealth

How exactly is this a non-stealth build? All you did was kitten yourself with so much toughness with respect to the amount of critical damage you got.

I didn’t say that i don’t rely on stealth. I don’t stealth to lend the damage.
The best condition remover we have is in stealth, same as the health regen, i would be an idiot to not pick up those traits and go into stealth when i need it.
And yes, please, continue to build up for crit damage and crit chance, i’ll be glad to own you thief power users everytime.
Clearly, if you (no harsh intended) don’t see the point in this build and the sinergy between some traits, i can’t do much to explain.
I also got some videos up on my twitch and youtube channel, feel free to watch them and see how i manage to handle situations.
Ofc if you pretend that this is a burst build you’ll be clearly disappointed

Here’s the link http://www.twitch.tv/samoleth/videos videos are a bit dated due to the fact that i’ve been doing some guild wvw runs and i usually record solo play.

EDIT: about crit damage. You really want to make me believe that 97-109% crit damage is absolutely necessary? Or that a high vitality will save your BP+HS combo from a well timed Headshot? That you can C&D while permablinded by Shadowshot? Come on mate, i’ve tried every build out there, i’m not the casual thief player and i laugh everytime i find a dd burst or valkirye thief. Remember: d\p is more than that over used combo. I’m not talking about a build, that’s easy to figure and to modify if you feel more comfortable with less thoughness and more power, i’m talking about changing playstyle, the way most people play thief.

EDIT 2: Anyway, let’s cut this. Everyone got his own opinions, i’ll limit myself to do as i usually did since today: reading the forums.

a random derpling

(edited by Samoleth.5012)

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Posted by: BlackBeard.2873

BlackBeard.2873

Why does everyone here refuse to accept that we have great mobility with or without stealth? Thieves are not a slow fast, they are one of the fastest (definitely the most slippery with the displacement abilities and ports). I am able to get away from other people on my ele (sometimes even after RtL nerf), on my Ranger, and on my warrior just fine without stealth, and it works on my thief too! What it requires is proper stun-breaking and use of your displacement ability (HS, Shadow-shot, shadow-step). I know that requires more skill than just going stealth and being in the free-and-clear, but it is VERY VERY doable on a theif. Even if you are built to heavily abuse stealth,you still have tons of movement displacement abilities. Get used to breaking-stun, healing, and using your abilities to get outta dodge like every other class that can’t just disappear and be free. Also, don’t complain about being squishy. If you choose GC and rely on stealth to overcome defensive weaknesses, then there is a penalty of not being able to take a few hits. If you actually have to stack up toughness like every other class, then you will be fine.

Plus, this patch actually buffs thieves as you can use your stealth-stacking to drop traps right in the middle of a zerg.

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Posted by: Deathspike.1870

Deathspike.1870

Mind that i fight with 25 bloodlust and an average of 8 might stacks.

Those stats are amazing. I intend to give this a whirl. Thanks for sharing :-)

Active: Mesmer, Warrior
Inactive: Guardian, Elementalist, Ranger, Thief (ex-main)
Leveling: Engineer, Necromancer

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

You have 3 traits totally relying on stealth

Shadow’s Embrace Remove one condition every 3 seconds while in stealth
Infusion of Shadow Gain 2 initiative when using a skill that stealths you
Shadow’s Rejuvenation Regenerate health while in stealth

How exactly is this a non-stealth build? All you did was kitten yourself with so much toughness with respect to the amount of critical damage you got.

I didn’t say that i don’t rely on stealth. I don’t stealth to lend the damage.
The best condition remover we have is in stealth, same as the health regen, i would be an idiot to not pick up those traits and go into stealth when i need it.
And yes, please, continue to build up for crit damage and crit chance, i’ll be glad to own you thief power users everytime.
Clearly, if you (no harsh intended) don’t see the point in this build and the sinergy between some traits, i can’t do much to explain.
I also got some videos up on my twitch and youtube channel, feel free to watch them and see how i manage to handle situations.
Ofc if you pretend that this is a burst build you’ll be clearly disappointed

Here’s the link http://www.twitch.tv/samoleth/videos videos are a bit dated due to the fact that i’ve been doing some guild wvw runs and i usually record solo play.

EDIT: about crit damage. You really want to make me believe that 97-109% crit damage is absolutely necessary? Or that a high vitality will save your BP+HS combo from a well timed Headshot? That you can C&D while permablinded by Shadowshot? Come on mate, i’ve tried every build out there, i’m not the casual thief player and i laugh everytime i find a dd burst or valkirye thief. Remember: d\p is more than that over used combo. I’m not talking about a build, that’s easy to figure and to modify if you feel more comfortable with less thoughness and more power, i’m talking about changing playstyle, the way most people play thief.

EDIT 2: Anyway, let’s cut this. Everyone got his own opinions, i’ll limit myself to do as i usually did since today: reading the forums.

I’m against running 100% cannon glass, especially that I enjoy doing dungeons. On my thief, I have 1350 toughness, and I agree that the remove condition in stealth is amazing, as I always use that. I actually run a build close to Yishi, but with few twists to suit me better. But my point was that you have 3 major traits that rely on stealth, so you aren’t exactly a “non-stealth” build, maybe i took it too literary?

Anyways, interesting to know you got a new playstyle going on there, can’t argue about that as I haven’t tried it.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

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Posted by: Frosty and Frosty Law Firm.4981

Frosty and Frosty Law Firm.4981

A good thief won’t let traps stop him. Hell, a good thief rarely even dies. All the whining about other players finally having something to stand up to the power of thieves is pathetic.

Grind Wars 2: Heart of Tears

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Posted by: Franklin Fhenrir.4962

Franklin Fhenrir.4962

I have played thief once, before i deleted it ( thief wasn’t really my style ). And although i like traps that reveal foes that are invisible, i can’t help it but to think that they really handicapped the thief.

revealing thief’s with traps = fine.
30 seconds unable to stealth = wth.

I’ll admit from here i really hate it when a thief goes instant invisible when they hit me while i can ‘barly’ do a thing as a ranger. I got my as kicked allot of times. You know what forced me to do instead of complaining? ADAPTING. I trained with my ranger in pvp to learn thief’s attacks and what to do most of the times. traps, fear howl, melee attack. I still get defeated by good thief’s but beginners and average thief’s are not always a challenge for me anymore.

Thief’s are able to overcome these traps ( for most players who play thief’s these traps are nothing threatening ). you just need to adapt as a player to these changes. scan around first, make allot of distant when you see them placing traps, let other non thief’s go ahead and trigger traps while you stay on a distance and if you do get caught you got tons of skill to escape again.

I wish you guys good luck with these new changes and hopefully they at least reduce the timer a little.

You either die a underpowered class or you live long enough to be the overpowered one.

(edited by Franklin Fhenrir.4962)

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Posted by: Karolis.4261

Karolis.4261

To everyone continuously saying non-stealth builds are viable, please share them! I have tried building one that doesn’t rely on stealth and I get absolutely nowhere, so I went for a Ranger instead (lol). Please, share.

Full PVT S/D and Shortbow 10/0/0/30/30. Mug for that op heal, vigor on heal, cripple/chilled remove on dodge, pain response or healing on initiative spent w/e, dodgetrops, initiative on heal, thrill of the crime or bontiful theft. Withdraw for heal. As for utilities – shadowstep, signet of shadows, maybe signet of agility for extra condition cleaning. Tactics would be 3333333333 and repeat. Oh and unbind cloak and dagger because we dont want to use stealth with no stealth build by accident do we ? As for elite – thieves guild… because… You rly expect to do damage with no stealth build while using full pvt gear that lets you come to survivability of full berserk warrior? Seriously?

PvP hero Valentin in action!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-HiYUlhsO_M
cough*keyboardturningclicker*cough

(edited by Karolis.4261)

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Posted by: Samoleth.5012

Samoleth.5012

you aren’t exactly a “non-stealth” build, maybe i took it too literary?

That’s my fault.
Every thief relies on stealth, that’s obvious since the best traits and benefits comes from there.
But, as i stated before, i try to use stealth as a tool, and not just spam it mindlessly.
I won’t give away all my tricks here but for example the BP+HS combo is a huge waste of init vs an experienced ele; initiative that could be used elsewhere, for example a timed Headshot during the water switch or Ether Renewal, or a quick Shadowshot spam to quickly close the gap.
That’s just a mere example of what you can do with d\p but people just don’t realize the potential of the weponset and instead just spam the combo because they saw it in a video.

a random derpling

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Posted by: Sentinel VX.1392

Sentinel VX.1392

I’m running a non-stealth s/d build and comfortable with it. It’s true that you can’t burst as good as d/d or d/p build but if it’s being used correctly you are just fine. Also it’s not like you are gonna step on a trap every 3 steps or something…. so running stealth build is still viable as long you don’t get hit by the trap.

Sea of Sorrow since BWE.

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Posted by: Mathias.9657

Mathias.9657

ANet finally realize they designed the thief horribly and should have went with a more Assassin from GW1 approach, that’s why they are forcing everyone into the S/D dodge meta, with stealth being rarely used. I suspect we won’t even have stealth at some point, what sucks is it’s our only survival vs any decent player and they are doing nothing about certain traits being completely useless with the new anti thief traps.

Best thing to do is just quit this game / class until they make up their minds on what they want to do.

Back to WoW, make GW2 fun please.

(edited by Mathias.9657)

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Posted by: Sentinel VX.1392

Sentinel VX.1392

ANet finally realize they designed the thief horribly and should have went with a more Assassin from GW1 approach, that’s why they are forcing everyone into the S/D dodge meta, with stealth being rarely used. I suspect we won’t even have stealth at some point, what sucks is it’s our only survival vs any decent player and they are doing nothing about certain traits being completely useless with the new anti thief traps.

Best thing to do is just quit this game / class until they make up their minds on what they want to do.

It’s not like you gonna step on the trap every 3 steps or something…
You are still able to run stealth build as long you are be careful about it, also this only affects wvw only not the whole game itself.

Sea of Sorrow since BWE.

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Posted by: Travlane.5948

Travlane.5948

ANet finally realize they designed the thief horribly and should have went with a more Assassin from GW1 approach, that’s why they are forcing everyone into the S/D dodge meta, with stealth being rarely used. I suspect we won’t even have stealth at some point, what sucks is it’s our only survival vs any decent player and they are doing nothing about certain traits being completely useless with the new anti thief traps.

Best thing to do is just quit this game / class until they make up their minds on what they want to do.

yeah i havent really played the last 3 days. i mean its like driving an 8 cylinder muscle car and having the shop keep changing the engine parts every week. u fall in love with so many things and it changes all the time…… id rather them just do something big and make thieves good rather than all these QQers. honestly theives even with the pre mug nerf were fine. they had their spots (roaming, 1 v 1 , blast finishers, scouting, camp capping) thats what they did. did they do 1 v 1 and roaming better than anyone else? YES! however do the best players in spvp and tpvp play thieves? NO ….why? bc guardians and necros and mesmers are so much better at it…not to mention even rangers now. in wvw are thieves great in zergs? no …one of the bottom 2….. but since we are sooooooooooooooo good at roaming we cant have one lil place to play in this big world of gw2…..cant have just roaming? not even 1 thing we are best at? we are the best at roaming… SO WHAT!? lol we dont have the highest dmg….. we dont have the highest mobility (solid 2nd place)….. obv lack of boons hp and defense…… take away stealth and what are we? just a softer(armor)….less hearty (hp) ….less boon’ing….less mobile…..less invulnerable…..less healing……..less damaging version of warriors. who wants to play that.

Ps….plz dont pick apart the fact i said less mobile/dmging (i know its very debatable, but in overall damage over time …aka minutes….warriors win bc we have to hide so much……….and mobile….we are a lil better in combat but they cream us in sprinting. so :P)

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Posted by: Ruggan.4102

Ruggan.4102

Personally, this one nerf was not the nerf that killed the thief for me… it was the last of a long line of nerfs that finally dealt a death blow to the class. Sorry, after having damage nerfed to hell, skills nerfed to below kitten bottoms, and every other conceivable nerf out there with only a single real buff… and that was to one weapon… yea, I am done until Anet decides exactly what they want the thief class to look like and until all the crying whining kittens decide exactly how easy they want a fight against a thief to be.

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Posted by: Devon.9061

Devon.9061

I feel like this last update was a buff for thieves… I mean I have laid over 30 supply traps on zergs and have ran into 2 stealth traps since the update. Im no mathematician but I feel like that leans in my favor. Yes, 30 seconds is an overkill but one death isnt going to be game ruining. They want to waste badges and supply on me by all means go for it.

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