Guild Wars 2

Can anyone shed some light on this matter? I’m having some doubts to whether 6 Divinity are worth having.

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I have read on a forum that 1 Divinity + 5 Scholar (although gives only 10% crit dmg as compared to 6Div’s 12%) gives about the same or more crit damage.

6 ruby orbs= 120 power/84 precision/12%crit damage
much much better, AND cheap

divinity= condition damage…lol ? i definetly don’t need
healing ? …..stil no
vit/toughness ? i get from weapons and other sources

much too expensive those runes, and overall not good !

if you were planning on getting 5 schollar instead of 6 then I just don’t know how to answer to this post… why would anybody opt against having +10% damage…

Not sure about PvE or WvW, but in sPvP Ogre runes are generally considered the optimal runes for burst. The 4% dmg increase scales up your crit dmg as well. So if your crit dmg is over 50, that it is essentially 8%+ crit dmg.

Most burst builds tend to prefer the 4% dmg increase on non crits + 11%+ crit dmg + 165 power + rock dog (good distraction lol) over what’s offered by Scholar + Divinity.

Although if you’re always going to be opening with your full burst combo, then a full set of scholars will be optimal. But you’re just asking to get pummeled if you try that in high level play.

6 Divinity = 60 all stats + 12% critical damage

5 Scholar + 1 Divinity = 175 Power + 10% critical damage.

You get more than double the power from the Scholar runes at the cost of 2% critical damage and 60 of other stats (60 precision, 60 toughness, 60 vitality, 60 Condition damage, 60 Healing Power)

When including that in a damage equation for pure DPS gain:

1000 * 2060 * (1 * 1.62) / 1800 = 1854 – Basic damage equation for 6 Divinity

1000 * 2175 * (1 * 1.6) / 1800 = 1933 – Basic damage equation for 5 Scholar 1 Divinity

This shows that the additional power outweighs the additional crit damage.

This doesn’t mean 6 Divinity isn’t viable, as it does increase survivability slightly and also increases crit chance.

Taril.8619:

6 Divinity = 60 all stats + 12% critical damage

5 Scholar + 1 Divinity = 175 Power + 10% critical damage.

You get more than double the power from the Scholar runes at the cost of 2% critical damage and 60 of other stats (60 precision, 60 toughness, 60 vitality, 60 Condition damage, 60 Healing Power)

When including that in a damage equation for pure DPS gain:

1000 * 2060 * (1 * 1.62) / 1800 = 1854 – Basic damage equation for 6 Divinity

1000 * 2175 * (1 * 1.6) / 1800 = 1933 – Basic damage equation for 5 Scholar 1 Divinity

This shows that the additional power outweighs the additional crit damage.

This doesn’t mean 6 Divinity isn’t viable, as it does increase survivability slightly and also increases crit chance.

Can you please do the calculation with Strength runes please?

Authority.6145:

Can you please do the calculation with Strength runes please?

6 Strength Runes = 155 Power
6 Strength Runes + Might bonus = 155 Power (+35 per Might stack) + 5% damage

1000 + 2155 * (1 * 1.5) / 1800 = 1795 Basic damage calculation with no Might
1000 + 2155 * (1 * 1.5) * 1.05 / 1800 = 1885 Basic damage calculation for Might bonus, with no Might stacks
1000 + 2190 * (1 * 1.5) * 1.05 / 1800 = 1916 Basic damage calculation for 1 Might stack

Bearing in mind the 20% additional Might duration will increase the amount of stacks of Might you can keep up and also Might and the 5% damage increase will increase non-critical damage aswell.

randomfightfan.4091:

if you were planning on getting 5 schollar instead of 6 then I just don’t know how to answer to this post… why would anybody opt against having +10% damage…

Uhmm.. its (1 divinity + 5 Scholars) vs 6 Divinity.

the 1 divinity probably isnt as good as a 6th scholar is the point they were trying to make.

Though thats debatable as it takes very little to drop a thief below 90% hp

If you’re playing a high burst damage build in pvp or any kind of direct damage build in pve i would go with 6 scholar. Getting 1 divinity rune instead just gives you +10 to all stats and +2% crit damage, which doesn’t make much difference really while opening with the backstab combo with +10% damage can make a big difference. In pve i find i’m at full health most of the time in a group.

If you deal more sustained damage then maybe ogre would be better but generally divinity runes are very overpriced for what they actually give.

DanH.5879:

6 ruby orbs= 120 power/84 precision/12%crit damage
much much better, AND cheap

divinity= condition damage…lol ? i definetly don’t need
healing ? …..stil no
vit/toughness ? i get from weapons and other sources

much too expensive those runes, and overall not good !

6 ruby orbs = 120 power – 84 precision/12% critical damage
6 dinivitiy = 60 power -60 precision /12% critical damage
Considering you got over 3000 power without runes -ruby orbs add maximum 2% more damage , 1.25 % critical chance
you lose
- 600 hp (3-5 )
60 defence (2.4-3%)
60 healing power – 3 extra hp /target hit from signet of malice // 100 hp / hide in shadows // 6hp/sec (shadow rejuveration)
60 condition damage -3 damage /bleed tick
Any direct damage build except glas cannon will benefit more from divinity overall

Taril.8619:

6 Divinity = 60 all stats + 12% critical damage

5 Scholar + 1 Divinity = 175 Power + 10% critical damage.

You get more than double the power from the Scholar runes at the cost of 2% critical damage and 60 of other stats (60 precision, 60 toughness, 60 vitality, 60 Condition damage, 60 Healing Power)

When including that in a damage equation for pure DPS gain:

1000 * 2060 * (1 * 1.62) / 1800 = 1854 – Basic damage equation for 6 Divinity

1000 * 2175 * (1 * 1.6) / 1800 = 1933 – Basic damage equation for 5 Scholar 1 Divinity

This shows that the additional power outweighs the additional crit damage.

This doesn’t mean 6 Divinity isn’t viable, as it does increase survivability slightly and also increases crit chance.

I am running on all Divinity with Full Valkyrie Gear and Zerker jewels for WvW. I have been swapping through many kinds of gear and build trying to find something I can settle on. Been wasting alot of many that way due to my indecisiveness.

I feel maybe I should swap for scholars and go ahead with more dmg.

red light november.3521:

I am running on all Divinity with Full Valkyrie Gear and Zerker jewels for WvW. I have been swapping through many kinds of gear and build trying to find something I can settle on. Been wasting alot of many that way due to my indecisiveness.

I feel maybe I should swap for scholars and go ahead with more dmg.

For WvW I’d suggest something like 6x Scholar (For burst builds) or 6x Ruby/Beryl Orbs (Really cheap and very effective)

Ruby Orbs give 20 power, 14 Precision and 2% critical damage each. Totalling 120 Power, 84 Precision and 12% critical damage.
Beryl Orbs give 20 power, 14 Vitality and 2% critical damage each. Totalling 120 Power, 84 Vitality and 12% critical damage.

The same damage equation for these (Not including the additional ~4% crit or 840 health as factors in decisions)

1000 * 2120 * (1 * 1.62) / 1800 = 1908 Basic damage equation.

Considering that Orbs cost about 5-10 silver each (Compared to some runes being over 2 gold each) it’s very cost effective for trying out builds.

That said, going into the Heart of the Mists can allow you to try out various runes in your builds (Since all Runes are Free and you have various dummies and Steady Weapons to help test)

For WvW, how do you guys get toughness? Do you find you just don’t want/need it? I was planning to go full Valk armor, serker weapons, and Cavalier everything else with accuracy on offhand and full rubies to help with the low crit chance.

This will give about 15k hp, 2.5k armor, same power, and 35% crit chance (30 traits) or pretty close to that.

Just trying not to waste my laurels and such if it turns out full serkers is the better option.

Atherakhia.4086:

For WvW, how do you guys get toughness? Do you find you just don’t want/need it? I was planning to go full Valk armor, serker weapons, and Cavalier everything else with accuracy on offhand and full rubies to help with the low crit chance.

This will give about 15k hp, 2.5k armor, same power, and 35% crit chance (30 traits) or pretty close to that.

Just trying not to waste my laurels and such if it turns out full serkers is the better option.

For WvW I go Full Zerker armour and Trinkets with Valk Weapons, Orbs and Jewels. This gives about 14-15k health (Depending on traits) and I go 30 into Shadow Arts for the Toughness giving 2280 Armour.

Generally I just want to have enough health to survive initial bursts, Toughness is not something I actively seek out (I prefer instead to try and maximise Health and Evades)

My current WvW build – http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/thief/?7.0|8.1p.h14.8.1p.h1|5.1p.h17|1g.a1.1g.a1.1g.a1.1g.a1.1g.a1.1g.a1|1g.61.1g.61.1g.61.1g.61.1g.61.1g.61|0.u36c.u356.a2.0|1b.1|0.0.0.0.0|e

I get about 10 Might stack up so have an additional 350 Power when fighting.

Taril.8619:

1000 + 2155 * (1 * 1.5) * 1.05 / 1800 = 1885 Basic damage calculation for Might bonus, with no Might stacks

1000 * 2175 * (1 * 1.6) / 1800 = 1933 – Basic damage equation for 5 Scholar 1 Divinity

So if both of them use 1 might stack what would the result be?

I am trying to understand whether strength runes with 20percent duration and 5 percent damage under might is a better choice for using them when invested on might trait instead of 5 scholar 1 divinity.

So for example if I was hitting someone for i.e a minute would the damage output be higher with strength runes with one might stack for a minute or with the other?

well as 5 scholar + 1 divinity already does more damage than strength with 1 might stack adding a might stack to the 5 scholar would just do even more damage.

Though bear in mind the calculations being used by taril are very basic and are at best a rough estimate of the power (as its not factoring in anything like crit chances and such)

Actually keeping might up constantly for the strength rune to work is also not that easy a task for a thief without doing some really silly things

Full P/V/T set with Ruby Orbs all zerk weapons and jewels FTW!

question: for a burst build, why not use eagle runes? you can generally burst players/regular mobs to 50% hp rather quickly and the extra precision gives a nice boost to crit chance. Does the lack of power plummet dps or something?

also more cit = more chance at weapon sigil procs

comes down to higher chance at critting, or high damage when you do crit.

Dasorine.1964:

comes down to higher chance at critting, or high damage when you do crit.

makes sense; thank you!

Authority.6145:

Taril.8619:

1000 + 2155 * (1 * 1.5) * 1.05 / 1800 = 1885 Basic damage calculation for Might bonus, with no Might stacks

1000 * 2175 * (1 * 1.6) / 1800 = 1933 – Basic damage equation for 5 Scholar 1 Divinity

So if both of them use 1 might stack what would the result be?

I am trying to understand whether strength runes with 20percent duration and 5 percent damage under might is a better choice for using them when invested on might trait instead of 5 scholar 1 divinity.

So for example if I was hitting someone for i.e a minute would the damage output be higher with strength runes with one might stack for a minute or with the other?

If you were to compare the damage dealt by these you’d have to take into consideration crit chance (A crit damage focused rune setup provides little to non-critical hits)

So to compare the 2 (With a single might stack permanently up) I’ll use the following:
1000 damage weapon (No variance, nice round number to use), 2000 Power (Nice average power), 50% crit chance (Nice round number, also an average target), 100% base crit damage (Very high, about average target for a full Crit damage focused build pre-runes) and a GC light armour target (1800 armour) on an ability with a co-efficient of 1 (A nice average attack, something like an auto-attack)

1000 * 2210 * (1 * (0.5 * 2.6)) / 1800 = 1596.1 Average damage for 5 Scholar 1 Divinity
1000 * 2190 * (1 * (0.5 * 2.5)) * 1.05 / 1800 = 1596.8 Average damage for 6 Strength

The difference in it is very small (0.7 damage in this case) but this doesn’t factor in the 20% increased duration of Might (Allowing for more stacks of Might to be achieved) or the 3% chance to gain Might when hit.

Naturally, the 5 Scholar 1 Divinity will pull ahead when crit chance increases while the Strength runes will pull ahead if less crits occur.

If going for a Might build, it may be beneficial to go for 2x Strength, 2x Hoelbrak and 2x Fire runes for a total of 75 Power + 60% Might duration to maximise Might stacks.

If considering that Power of Inertia (Acro 10) gives 15 seconds of Might + Feline Grace (Acro 15) allows 1 Dodge per 5 seconds you can average out 3 Might stacks base.

With 60% Might duration from runes and the 15% from 15 in Acro (75% duration) the Might will last 26 Seconds and will allow for an average of 5 Might stacks (175 Power)

To maximise this you can go 30 Acro + 60% Might duration + Orrian Truffle and Meat Stew (100% chance for Might + 40% Endurance regeneration) this will give each dodge 2 Might stacks for 28.5 Seconds. With an average of 1 dodge per 3.57 seconds you can average out 14 Might Stacks (490 Power)

I run full scholar myself. Used to run full ruby orb. I’ve also played with full divinity. Have to say full scholar is worth every penny I spent on it. Something a lot of thieves will over look though is Vampirism runes. If you don’t mind toning down your dmg a bit the extra healing/dmg from the life steal and mist form on >10% is amazing if your diving with full glass gear.

Professor Sensei.2941:

Something a lot of thieves will over look though is Vampirism runes. If you don’t mind toning down your dmg a bit the extra healing/dmg from the life steal and mist form on >10% is amazing if your diving with full glass gear.

Vampirism Runes are great on a Thief.

They synergise very well with the low cooldown heals such as Withdraw and Signet of Malice allowing them to become even stronger heals due to the additional 975 life siphon they cause (Which deals damage that ignores armour)

I used to run them, until I decided I wanted to get more health and crit damage from Beryl Orbs.

No thief love for the thief rune! :P though guess very few people tend to like condition crit hybrid builds

Dasorine.1964:

No thief love for the thief rune! :P though guess very few people tend to like condition crit hybrid builds

That and condition builds don’t get much benefit from the 6 bonus due to percentage damage increases only affecting direct damage.

hence why I stated condition crit hybrid :P

Taril.8619:

red light november.3521:

I am running on all Divinity with Full Valkyrie Gear and Zerker jewels for WvW. I have been swapping through many kinds of gear and build trying to find something I can settle on. Been wasting alot of many that way due to my indecisiveness.

I feel maybe I should swap for scholars and go ahead with more dmg.

For WvW I’d suggest something like 6x Scholar (For burst builds) or 6x Ruby/Beryl Orbs (Really cheap and very effective)

Ruby Orbs give 20 power, 14 Precision and 2% critical damage each. Totalling 120 Power, 84 Precision and 12% critical damage.
Beryl Orbs give 20 power, 14 Vitality and 2% critical damage each. Totalling 120 Power, 84 Vitality and 12% critical damage.

The same damage equation for these (Not including the additional ~4% crit or 840 health as factors in decisions)

1000 * 2120 * (1 * 1.62) / 1800 = 1908 Basic damage equation.

Considering that Orbs cost about 5-10 silver each (Compared to some runes being over 2 gold each) it’s very cost effective for trying out builds.

That said, going into the Heart of the Mists can allow you to try out various runes in your builds (Since all Runes are Free and you have various dummies and Steady Weapons to help test)

Well right now, gold is not the issue because I am trying to go for the best one I can. I just really wish I could come up with a permanent gear and build. However I really appreciate your advise and shall take it into consideration.

I am playing a critical stealth thief in wvw. Condition thief in pve,dungeons