Guild Wars 2

I currently run a S/D+SB thief and am mostly looking for WvW advice.

For gear, I’m currently full valk armor and full zerker trinkets but looking to start crafting ascended gear. Is there a recommended/good toughness and vit that’s good for wvw? I mostly do small coordinated zergs with the guild and small roaming parties by myself.

For runes I’m currently debating between Lyssa and Power runes?

(Also, looking for a relatively flexible setup so that maybe in the future I can swap to d/p if I feel like it)

S/D and D/P are polar opposite when it comes to the source of damage and survivability. S/D might not care much about crit but D/P does. S/D might care much about evasion while D/P about stealth. S/D might favor Health and Toughness, while D/P favors Power and Crit. Thus I don’t think you can craft a single set that favors both.

You have the same problem when it comes to your rune of choice. While Lyssa favors crits, Power favors, well, um, power (duh).

If you are asking for build advice, it will be very helpful to also include your playstyle and preference. That way, players in this community with similar playstyle and preference can help you out.

Examples of playstyle:
- I like to get in, deal burst damage, and get out.
- I like to have staying power while DPSing.
- I like to stay in shadows where it’s safe.

Examples of preference:
- I really like stacking Might.
- I really like Swiftness and Endurance.
- I like pie.

I hope that helps.

It’s actually the opposite, with hidden killer you can ignore crit chance a lot more than with an s/d build, where it’s practically required to proc the sigils and GTFO.

Lyssa runes are not quite worth it anymore after the nerf. The current dominant rune for damage is strength, and failing that, pack or ogre perhaps.

It really does depend on the build you’re planning to run, but if you’re planning on crafting ascended armor(which is IMO a bad idea btw), go for berserker. It’s useful with both d/p and s/d, and you can do PvE as well if you’re ever interested in that. Other than that, d/p works well with valkyrie armor as hidden killer will allow you to mostly ignore precision.

METAShift.2913:

It’s actually the opposite, with hidden killer you can ignore crit chance a lot more than with an s/d build, where it’s practically required to proc the sigils and GTFO.

Who builds 6pts into CritStrike so that they can have 100% crit in stealth using a f-ing S/D?

Don’t be ridiculous. Stop talking now.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

METAShift.2913:

It’s actually the opposite, with hidden killer you can ignore crit chance a lot more than with an s/d build, where it’s practically required to proc the sigils and GTFO.

Who builds 6pts into CritStrike so that they can have 100% crit in stealth using a f-ing S/D?

Don’t be ridiculous. Stop talking now.

I think you misunderstood him.

For S/D I think I’m pretty set on 2/0/0/6/6 (which I think is pretty standard)
As for my playstyle, I like to have staying power and have a good amount of sustain while doing good dmg. I’m willing to sacrifice a little bit of survivability for more dmg as I feel pretty comfortable evading/dodging things in fights.

(Why is crafting ascended so bad? Does this only apply for armor or weapons as well)

Elywood.9017:

For S/D I think I’m pretty set on 2/0/0/6/6 (which I think is pretty standard)
As for my playstyle, I like to have staying power and have a good amount of sustain while doing good dmg. I’m willing to sacrifice a little bit of survivability for more dmg as I feel pretty comfortable evading/dodging things in fights.

There is a build that was posted before that matches your play style and preference. I’ll reply here when I find it.

(Why is crafting ascended so bad? Does this only apply for armor or weapons as well)

Personally, I think Ascended items are a waste of time, specially the weapons.

EDIT:
Found it: HERE"

Sir Vincent III.1286:

METAShift.2913:

It’s actually the opposite, with hidden killer you can ignore crit chance a lot more than with an s/d build, where it’s practically required to proc the sigils and GTFO.

Who builds 6pts into CritStrike so that they can have 100% crit in stealth using a f-ing S/D?

Don’t be ridiculous. Stop talking now.

What? Other way around dude, d/p can build with valkyrie armor and hidden killer so they have less crit chance but make up for that with the trait, while s/d can’t, so berserker gear and thus crit chance is more important for s/d.

Anyway, to the OP, if you like running s/d acrobatics I suggest zerker armor with maybe some valk and/or cavalier trinkets. Your evades and vitality from the acrobatics line should be enough.

Ascended armor in general, IMO, is a waste unless you have nothing else to spend your money on. The stat gain is minimal compared to the effort and you’ll be disappointed if you ever decide to switch builds. Weapons are a different story, as not only do you get the stat boost, but the weapon base damage increases as well, which is much more noticable.

So much contradiction in this thread hahaha but thank you for the link. What are thoughts on good runes?

Elywood.9017:

So much contradiction in this thread hahaha but thank you for the link. What are thoughts on good runes?

With 2/0/0/6/6, you have no way to handle condition outside your utility skills. So, the runes you pick will depend on your overall build.

Other builds handles conditions using food and utility skills so they pick a damage oriented runes (strength, ogre, scholar, etc).

Other builds handles condition using runes by picking Lyssa and picking up damage oriented food.

Other rare builds are condition-phobic that they will take Lyssa (or other anti-condition runes like Melandru) and anti-condition food.

So your runes really depends on how you’ll handle condition based on your chosen trait distribution.

Hm I see thanks. Just curious, do a lot of people run a mix of armor pieces? (i.e celestial, zerker, valk, etc) I’ve never done the math to optimize my stats and was wondering if its actually worth getting separate pieces as opposed to an entire set

Elywood.9017:

Hm I see thanks. Just curious, do a lot of people run a mix of armor pieces? (i.e celestial, zerker, valk, etc) I’ve never done the math to optimize my stats and was wondering if its actually worth getting separate pieces as opposed to an entire set

This is where your preference comes in.

Some builds prefer to have a minimum of 2400 armor, thus they will equip all the pieces that will give them that much armor then the rest of the piece to damage stats.

Basically, it’s about determining which stat you value most, then determining how much of it you prefer, then building toward those goals.

For example, in my build, I used to have full-berserker set. It was great when players in WvW are still inexperienced and generally too poor to purchase decent armor. However over time, I started needing more defense so I picked up pieces that will give me that. My goal was to keep at least 2500 power and 200% crit damage if I can, then I swapped my ’serker pieces to Valkyrie and Soldier pieces.

In the end, my goal is barely met having 2492 power and 193% crit damage, however my survivability has greatly improved.

So my advice is to start with full-set of anything, then tweak it from there.

I recommend reading THIS since it will help you understand the evolution to a build and the reasoning behind it.

For thieves is it better to prioritize armor or HP? (for survivability)

Elywood.9017:

For thieves is it better to prioritize armor or HP? (for survivability)

Definitely HP, we have one of the lowest base HP pools in the game so vitality has more utility for a thief. Also with the heavy condition meta in the game and in WvW vit is helpful in keeping you alive long enough to cleanse. Toughness/armor is more for direct damage.

I read somewhere that with a low cd heal (thief’s withdraw) having toughness/armor is better since it increases your effective hp therefore making healing more effective

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Personally, I think Ascended items are a waste of time, specially the weapons.

EDIT:
Found it: HERE"

The weapons are quite worthwhile in that the cost to make them isn’t very high for the gains. It’s maybe like… 50g to go form 1-500 and make the weapon?

Armor is not really necessary or rather doesn’t really warrant the price.

The one advantage of ascended armor is it usable by all toons that use medium armor.

This is handy if you want to test out various builds on alternate toons.

This is even better if you got a rune set that soul bound and want to try it with another build. Ie I have Rune of the Nightmare on a set that I have moved between three different toons.

I have done this with Monk Runes as well. It just easier and in the long run cheaper.

For S/D I’d go with str8 zerker + 3-5 cavalier pieces. For runes, IMO the best 3 options are Strength, Rage, and Pack. If running acro tree definitely strength with might on dodge, if not- pack or rage. Don’t sleep on rage, can obtain pretty much perma fury with it, an does more damage on crits than pack runess. The ferocity + 5% damage on rage runes does more damage on crit than pack runes, with less precision (but more futy) and less damage on non crits than pack. I prefer the burst potential and fury uptime of rage.

All that being said 2/0/0/6/6 with strength runes and might on dodge food is probably what I’d run if I felt like investing in strength runes, but I’m having success with 2/6/0/0/6 s/d with rage

Are there some optimal numbers I should be aiming for? I’ve seen like 40%ish for crit chance but its hard to get there without having much precision since I run valk gear atm

If you’re playing S/D with the 2/0/0/6/6 build you’re gonna need a lot of dmg to be effective. You should go really close to full zerk gear, air/fire on s/d maybe bloodlust on sb.
Running might on dodge + runes of strength is the best you can get in term of dmg no doubt (there were a few threads with the matemathic of it some time back)

If you want a cheaper alternative i’d say rune of the privateer (dat parrot) or pack (that +125precision on 6 can give you some room for other stats on gear)

I find it really hard to play an s/d thief good but if you want some results against good players you can’t sacrifice damage for survaival and you’re going to have to get all your timings right. It’s really funny playing against stunlock warriors that can 2shots you if you miss ONE dodge while you have to pull out all the circus’ moves just to scratch them

edit: i used to run valk armor but i really felt like i had to swap to zerk cause else the damage was simply not enough. I’d say 40-45 crit chance is going to be the minimum if you can manage to have a really high fury uptime which you should. You need that mostly to proc the sigils which will make a really big difference

Elywood.9017:

For thieves is it better to prioritize armor or HP? (for survivability)

Elywood.9017:

I read somewhere that with a low cd heal (thief’s withdraw) having toughness/armor is better since it increases your effective hp therefore making healing more effective

This really depends on the meta. When burst Warrior and burst Thieves are running rampant in WvW, toughness + healing power is the default stats.

However, since the meta shifted to condition damage, vitality is the default stat.

As the meta shifts, the default stats shifts with it.

In my chase, I’m too poor to go with the flow so I try to find something that is optimal to deal with both burst and conditions and rely on my expertise and knowledge to close the gap.

A lot of Thieves I’ve seen abandoned both toughness and vitality and going full glass cannon since they have the knowledge and expertise to make that build work for them — but not for me.

DeceiverX.8361:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Personally, I think Ascended items are a waste of time, specially the weapons.

EDIT:
Found it: HERE"

The weapons are quite worthwhile in that the cost to make them isn’t very high for the gains. It’s maybe like… 50g to go form 1-500 and make the weapon?

Armor is not really necessary or rather doesn’t really warrant the price.

The ascended armor is wasteful of both time and gold. The weapon might seems worth it in comparison to exotic, however, if I am to invest the time and gold, I’d rather invest it to a legendary weapon. Thus, to me, ascended weapons are a waste of time.

Runes of the Traveler are still my favorite. I know you get minimal stat increases, but the boost to utility with the condi duration, boon duration, and run speed increases are pretty nice for thieves.

Thanks guys I think I’ve come to the decision that I’m gonna use runes of strength. My question now is, what’s the best way to get my crit chance up because it’s sitting at a measly 25%~

Elywood.9017:

Thanks guys I think I’ve come to the decision that I’m gonna use runes of strength. My question now is, what’s the best way to get my crit chance up because it’s sitting at a measly 25%~

I’ve been playing around with 0/6/0/5/3 for S/D and i’ts not bad. Basically trading mug + steal utility/cooldown for precision ferocity and executioner. Not sure if it’s better than 2/0/0/6/6 but it certainly does more damage and still works great with strength runes. I go 5/3 in acro/trcikery because I think the +3 initiative in trickery outweighs anything at the end of the acro tree. If sticking with 2/0/0/6/6 I’d consider maybe getting an assassins weapon and/or signet of agility (great active on that signet as well).

Hmm I considered signet of agility but would you run it over infiltrator’s/shadowstep/SR? I feel like those are kind of irreplaceable utilities :/

I guess the best alternative is probably assassins or food? (is there a good food that adds precision/crit%)

Elywood.9017:

Hmm I considered signet of agility but would you run it over infiltrator’s/shadowstep/SR? I feel like those are kind of irreplaceable utilities :/

I guess the best alternative is probably assassins or food? (is there a good food that adds precision/crit%)

Food buff is always the way to go and skills that generates the Fury buff.