Guild Wars 2

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zero Day.2594:

:| We have a necromancer on these forums…

>.>
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>.>
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Sverdvs.3287:

Anet, update please. People want to know.

More like, a grave robber (Thieves, get it?).

Ah yes, a grave robber indeed.

hmm what about “x s of blur at 25%hp” instead of this kitten that we have now?
or “use signet of agility on 25%HP”?

Maybe you should count how many times this trait saves you than it kills you?
I met so many thief getting away and survive because of this trait in WvW.

People tend to have hindsight bias, that they only count the things they’re focused on, which is the time it messed you up. They wouldn’t count the time the skill saves them because the number is too big.

Toxsa.2701:

Maybe you should count how many times this trait saves you than it kills you?
I met so many thief getting away and survive because of this trait in WvW.

People tend to have hindsight bias, that they only count the things they’re focused on, which is the time it messed you up. They wouldn’t count the time the skill saves them because the number is too big.

Counting the times saved doesn’t justify the times it failed.

If it meant to save, it shouldn’t cause death.

Think of it as doctors getting complaints about malpractice.

Last refuge saved my butt more time than it killed me. Just saying

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Toxsa.2701:

Maybe you should count how many times this trait saves you than it kills you?
I met so many thief getting away and survive because of this trait in WvW.

People tend to have hindsight bias, that they only count the things they’re focused on, which is the time it messed you up. They wouldn’t count the time the skill saves them because the number is too big.

Counting the times saved doesn’t justify the times it failed.

If it meant to save, it shouldn’t cause death.

Think of it as doctors getting complaints about malpractice.

Essentially this. Top it off with being forced to take it if you want to invest any points into SA…
Some would rather have a blank trait in its place instead.

Here let’s pick a class you play, and a trait line that’s used quite a bit for said class, and add a minor adept trait that does “Upon reaching 25% HP, there’s a 65% chance to deal X amount of damage to a random nearby opponent and a 35% chance to deal Y amount of damage to yourself”. Clearly, statistically, it will help you more often than not. Great trait!

Zero Day.2594:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Toxsa.2701:

Maybe you should count how many times this trait saves you than it kills you?
I met so many thief getting away and survive because of this trait in WvW.

People tend to have hindsight bias, that they only count the things they’re focused on, which is the time it messed you up. They wouldn’t count the time the skill saves them because the number is too big.

Counting the times saved doesn’t justify the times it failed.

If it meant to save, it shouldn’t cause death.

Think of it as doctors getting complaints about malpractice.

Essentially this. Top it off with being forced to take it if you want to invest any points into SA…
Some would rather have a blank trait in its place instead.

---

Here let’s pick a class you play, and a trait line that’s used quite a bit for said class, and add a minor adept trait that does “Upon reaching 25% HP, there’s a 65% chance to deal X amount of damage to a random nearby opponent and a 35% chance to deal Y amount of damage to yourself”. Clearly, statistically, it will help you more often than not. Great trait!

I agree with you guys this time. I support the removal of Last Refuge and make it a blank trait. I’d rather deal with thieves without Last Refuge. It clearly kills you guys too many times for it to be on the bar. I sympathize you guys alot.

+1 to removal of Last Refuge.

i agree for the removal of last refuge, but not for the reason of attacking and getting revealed, because if im getting to last refuge range im not wanting to attack so im running, and if it pops while im running then good. however, on shortbow shots that bounce or CnD ive been revealed whilst still running, the CnD thing is ive gotten low enough to warrent me to begin to run so i go for the CnD and get last refuged before the hit happens, which then reveals me and i die.

but the trait is mediocre, i both like it, and hate it.

I like the trait
But then again, I don’t really use stealth, so it doesn’t ever get impacted by a reveal when it goes off! xD

Toxsa.2701:

Zero Day.2594:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Toxsa.2701:

Maybe you should count how many times this trait saves you than it kills you?
I met so many thief getting away and survive because of this trait in WvW.

People tend to have hindsight bias, that they only count the things they’re focused on, which is the time it messed you up. They wouldn’t count the time the skill saves them because the number is too big.

Counting the times saved doesn’t justify the times it failed.

If it meant to save, it shouldn’t cause death.

Think of it as doctors getting complaints about malpractice.

Essentially this. Top it off with being forced to take it if you want to invest any points into SA…
Some would rather have a blank trait in its place instead.

---

Here let’s pick a class you play, and a trait line that’s used quite a bit for said class, and add a minor adept trait that does “Upon reaching 25% HP, there’s a 65% chance to deal X amount of damage to a random nearby opponent and a 35% chance to deal Y amount of damage to yourself”. Clearly, statistically, it will help you more often than not. Great trait!

I agree with you guys this time. I support the removal of Last Refuge and make it a blank trait. I’d rather deal with thieves without Last Refuge. It clearly kills you guys too many times for it to be on the bar. I sympathize you guys alot.

+1 to removal of Last Refuge.

Sympathy coming from a non-Thief is not necessary since it comes as either sarcastic or patronizing — we need not either.

The only statistic I am interested in is if Last Refuge is made to be an option, how many Thieves will actually going to pick it?

The consensus, afaik, from actually Thief players are 0 (zero), no Thief wants this kitten.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Toxsa.2701:

Zero Day.2594:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Toxsa.2701:

Maybe you should count how many times this trait saves you than it kills you?
I met so many thief getting away and survive because of this trait in WvW.

People tend to have hindsight bias, that they only count the things they’re focused on, which is the time it messed you up. They wouldn’t count the time the skill saves them because the number is too big.

Counting the times saved doesn’t justify the times it failed.

If it meant to save, it shouldn’t cause death.

Think of it as doctors getting complaints about malpractice.

Essentially this. Top it off with being forced to take it if you want to invest any points into SA…
Some would rather have a blank trait in its place instead.

---

Here let’s pick a class you play, and a trait line that’s used quite a bit for said class, and add a minor adept trait that does “Upon reaching 25% HP, there’s a 65% chance to deal X amount of damage to a random nearby opponent and a 35% chance to deal Y amount of damage to yourself”. Clearly, statistically, it will help you more often than not. Great trait!

I agree with you guys this time. I support the removal of Last Refuge and make it a blank trait. I’d rather deal with thieves without Last Refuge. It clearly kills you guys too many times for it to be on the bar. I sympathize you guys alot.

+1 to removal of Last Refuge.

Sympathy coming from a non-Thief is not necessary since it comes as either sarcastic or patronizing — we need not either.

The only statistic I am interested in is if Last Refuge is made to be an option, how many Thieves will actually going to pick it?

The consensus, afaik, from actually Thief players are 0 (zero), no Thief wants this kitten.

in all honesty, yeah it would be zero, just because its now an option, which there are MUCH better options. i dont think i can think of a situation where someone would take it over another SA trait if it were an actual adept trait

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Toxsa.2701:

Zero Day.2594:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Toxsa.2701:

Maybe you should count how many times this trait saves you than it kills you?
I met so many thief getting away and survive because of this trait in WvW.

People tend to have hindsight bias, that they only count the things they’re focused on, which is the time it messed you up. They wouldn’t count the time the skill saves them because the number is too big.

Counting the times saved doesn’t justify the times it failed.

If it meant to save, it shouldn’t cause death.

Think of it as doctors getting complaints about malpractice.

Essentially this. Top it off with being forced to take it if you want to invest any points into SA…
Some would rather have a blank trait in its place instead.

---

Here let’s pick a class you play, and a trait line that’s used quite a bit for said class, and add a minor adept trait that does “Upon reaching 25% HP, there’s a 65% chance to deal X amount of damage to a random nearby opponent and a 35% chance to deal Y amount of damage to yourself”. Clearly, statistically, it will help you more often than not. Great trait!

I agree with you guys this time. I support the removal of Last Refuge and make it a blank trait. I’d rather deal with thieves without Last Refuge. It clearly kills you guys too many times for it to be on the bar. I sympathize you guys alot.

+1 to removal of Last Refuge.

Sympathy coming from a non-Thief is not necessary since it comes as either sarcastic or patronizing — we need not either.

The only statistic I am interested in is if Last Refuge is made to be an option, how many Thieves will actually going to pick it?

The consensus, afaik, from actually Thief players are 0 (zero), no Thief wants this kitten.

That’s one thing that seems to be flying past his head any way we pitch it to him.

We’re forced to take something that could potentially kill us – but it’s “marketed” as a defensive trait.

Given the option, I wouldn’t say 0, since apparently Toxsa there doesn’t mind it one bit (hell I think he likes it), but it would probably be a very small number compared to how many would choose something else (or nothing) over it.

Actually… why the kitten am I bothering with this guy…

Zero Day.2594:

Given the option, I wouldn’t say 0, since apparently Toxsa there doesn’t mind it one bit (hell I think he likes it), but it would probably be a very small number compared to how many would choose something else (or nothing) over it.

It doesn’t seem like he likes it either…he just wants Thief to have it, as if, like a charitable donation. He’s just looking out for our well-being after all…and beggars can’t be chooser. That’s how he perceives Thieves.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zero Day.2594:

Given the option, I wouldn’t say 0, since apparently Toxsa there doesn’t mind it one bit (hell I think he likes it), but it would probably be a very small number compared to how many would choose something else (or nothing) over it.

It doesn’t seem like he likes it either…he just wants Thief to have it, as if, like a charitable donation. He’s just looking out for our well-being after all…and beggars can’t be chooser. That’s how he perceives Thieves.

Ah. Makes a bit more sense now. O well, he’s on a holly cause to raise awareness, let him be.

What a funny bunch of fellows in the thief forum.
Even supporting them get flamed.
I genuinely wish Last Refuge gone, not sarcastically, but “practically”.

Just hope you fellows don’t regret it later on and start a bunch of new QQs about why Last Refuge is removed. I start to sympathize Anet now.

You know what’s funny? This;

Toxsa.2701:

Just hope you fellows don’t regret it later on and start a bunch of new QQs about why Last Refuge is removed.

Sorry, I didn’t read the entire thread, since there appears to be intermittent trolling/bickering. I’m just now trying to re-learn how to Thief after not playing for nearly a year.

Is it possible that LR could be changed for HoT? Or is that not very likely?

Eliteseraph.4970:

Sorry, I didn’t read the entire thread, since there appears to be intermittent trolling/bickering. I’m just now trying to re-learn how to Thief after not playing for nearly a year.

Is it possible that LR could be changed for HoT? Or is that not very likely?

Current iteration of changes show no changes for LR. It’s very unlikely there will be a change.

Zero Day.2594:

Eliteseraph.4970:

Sorry, I didn’t read the entire thread, since there appears to be intermittent trolling/bickering. I’m just now trying to re-learn how to Thief after not playing for nearly a year.

Is it possible that LR could be changed for HoT? Or is that not very likely?

Current iteration of changes show no changes for LR. It’s very unlikely there will be a change.

If you’re optimistic, LR will be swapped with Shadow’s Rej for the GM spot…since some players believe that LR is really, really useful.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zero Day.2594:

Eliteseraph.4970:

Sorry, I didn’t read the entire thread, since there appears to be intermittent trolling/bickering. I’m just now trying to re-learn how to Thief after not playing for nearly a year.

Is it possible that LR could be changed for HoT? Or is that not very likely?

Current iteration of changes show no changes for LR. It’s very unlikely there will be a change.

If you’re optimistic, LR will be swapped with Shadow’s Rej for the GM spot…since some players believe that LR is really, really useful.

Since you guys think it does more harm than good, the only suitable trait that fit the spot is -falling damage trait. Otherwise it’d be unfair trade lol… (leave the -20% deception cd inside that adapt trait and pull falling damage out)

Toxsa.2701:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zero Day.2594:

Eliteseraph.4970:

Sorry, I didn’t read the entire thread, since there appears to be intermittent trolling/bickering. I’m just now trying to re-learn how to Thief after not playing for nearly a year.

Is it possible that LR could be changed for HoT? Or is that not very likely?

Current iteration of changes show no changes for LR. It’s very unlikely there will be a change.

If you’re optimistic, LR will be swapped with Shadow’s Rej for the GM spot…since some players believe that LR is really, really useful.

Since you guys think it does more harm than good, the only suitable trait that fit the spot is -falling damage trait. Otherwise it’d be unfair trade lol… (leave the -20% deception cd inside that adapt trait and pull falling damage out)

Nah, what we need is a trait that stuns or fear Ranger pets when they attack us. Or better yet, a trait that interrupts channeled skills when we go in stealth.

The possibility is endless.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Toxsa.2701:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zero Day.2594:

Eliteseraph.4970:

Sorry, I didn’t read the entire thread, since there appears to be intermittent trolling/bickering. I’m just now trying to re-learn how to Thief after not playing for nearly a year.

Is it possible that LR could be changed for HoT? Or is that not very likely?

Current iteration of changes show no changes for LR. It’s very unlikely there will be a change.

If you’re optimistic, LR will be swapped with Shadow’s Rej for the GM spot…since some players believe that LR is really, really useful.

Since you guys think it does more harm than good, the only suitable trait that fit the spot is -falling damage trait. Otherwise it’d be unfair trade lol… (leave the -20% deception cd inside that adapt trait and pull falling damage out)

Nah, what we need is a trait that stuns or fear Ranger pets when they attack us. Or better yet, a trait that interrupts channeled skills when we go in stealth.

The possibility is endless.

Might as well add a minor trait in Marksmanship that applies reveal for 4 seconds on a 10 ICD as counterplay lol. The possibility is endless.

Toxsa.2701:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Toxsa.2701:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zero Day.2594:

Eliteseraph.4970:

Sorry, I didn’t read the entire thread, since there appears to be intermittent trolling/bickering. I’m just now trying to re-learn how to Thief after not playing for nearly a year.

Is it possible that LR could be changed for HoT? Or is that not very likely?

Current iteration of changes show no changes for LR. It’s very unlikely there will be a change.

If you’re optimistic, LR will be swapped with Shadow’s Rej for the GM spot…since some players believe that LR is really, really useful.

Since you guys think it does more harm than good, the only suitable trait that fit the spot is -falling damage trait. Otherwise it’d be unfair trade lol… (leave the -20% deception cd inside that adapt trait and pull falling damage out)

Nah, what we need is a trait that stuns or fear Ranger pets when they attack us. Or better yet, a trait that interrupts channeled skills when we go in stealth.

The possibility is endless.

Might as well add a minor trait in Marksmanship that applies reveal for 4 seconds on a 10 ICD as counterplay lol. The possibility is endless.

That trait suggestion doesn’t belong here. Whatever Rangers wants to do with their pet in their private place is no concern of ours.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Toxsa.2701:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Toxsa.2701:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zero Day.2594:

Eliteseraph.4970:

Sorry, I didn’t read the entire thread, since there appears to be intermittent trolling/bickering. I’m just now trying to re-learn how to Thief after not playing for nearly a year.

Is it possible that LR could be changed for HoT? Or is that not very likely?

Current iteration of changes show no changes for LR. It’s very unlikely there will be a change.

If you’re optimistic, LR will be swapped with Shadow’s Rej for the GM spot…since some players believe that LR is really, really useful.

Since you guys think it does more harm than good, the only suitable trait that fit the spot is -falling damage trait. Otherwise it’d be unfair trade lol… (leave the -20% deception cd inside that adapt trait and pull falling damage out)

Nah, what we need is a trait that stuns or fear Ranger pets when they attack us. Or better yet, a trait that interrupts channeled skills when we go in stealth.

The possibility is endless.

Might as well add a minor trait in Marksmanship that applies reveal for 4 seconds on a 10 ICD as counterplay lol. The possibility is endless.

That trait suggestion doesn’t belong here. Whatever Rangers wants to do with their pet in their private place is no concern of ours.

He’s raising awareness. Now you’re aware.

Zero Day.2594:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Toxsa.2701:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Toxsa.2701:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zero Day.2594:

Eliteseraph.4970:

Sorry, I didn’t read the entire thread, since there appears to be intermittent trolling/bickering. I’m just now trying to re-learn how to Thief after not playing for nearly a year.

Is it possible that LR could be changed for HoT? Or is that not very likely?

Current iteration of changes show no changes for LR. It’s very unlikely there will be a change.

If you’re optimistic, LR will be swapped with Shadow’s Rej for the GM spot…since some players believe that LR is really, really useful.

Since you guys think it does more harm than good, the only suitable trait that fit the spot is -falling damage trait. Otherwise it’d be unfair trade lol… (leave the -20% deception cd inside that adapt trait and pull falling damage out)

Nah, what we need is a trait that stuns or fear Ranger pets when they attack us. Or better yet, a trait that interrupts channeled skills when we go in stealth.

The possibility is endless.

Might as well add a minor trait in Marksmanship that applies reveal for 4 seconds on a 10 ICD as counterplay lol. The possibility is endless.

That trait suggestion doesn’t belong here. Whatever Rangers wants to do with their pet in their private place is no concern of ours.

He’s raising awareness. Now you’re aware.

Is that why he’s pushing for a revealed? Makes sense..

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zero Day.2594:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Toxsa.2701:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Toxsa.2701:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zero Day.2594:

Eliteseraph.4970:

Sorry, I didn’t read the entire thread, since there appears to be intermittent trolling/bickering. I’m just now trying to re-learn how to Thief after not playing for nearly a year.

Is it possible that LR could be changed for HoT? Or is that not very likely?

Current iteration of changes show no changes for LR. It’s very unlikely there will be a change.

If you’re optimistic, LR will be swapped with Shadow’s Rej for the GM spot…since some players believe that LR is really, really useful.

Since you guys think it does more harm than good, the only suitable trait that fit the spot is -falling damage trait. Otherwise it’d be unfair trade lol… (leave the -20% deception cd inside that adapt trait and pull falling damage out)

Nah, what we need is a trait that stuns or fear Ranger pets when they attack us. Or better yet, a trait that interrupts channeled skills when we go in stealth.

The possibility is endless.

Might as well add a minor trait in Marksmanship that applies reveal for 4 seconds on a 10 ICD as counterplay lol. The possibility is endless.

That trait suggestion doesn’t belong here. Whatever Rangers wants to do with their pet in their private place is no concern of ours.

He’s raising awareness. Now you’re aware.

Is that why he’s pushing for a revealed? Makes sense..

You 2 are two love birds lol.

Toxsa.2701:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zero Day.2594:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Toxsa.2701:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Toxsa.2701:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zero Day.2594:

Eliteseraph.4970:

Sorry, I didn’t read the entire thread, since there appears to be intermittent trolling/bickering. I’m just now trying to re-learn how to Thief after not playing for nearly a year.

Is it possible that LR could be changed for HoT? Or is that not very likely?

Current iteration of changes show no changes for LR. It’s very unlikely there will be a change.

If you’re optimistic, LR will be swapped with Shadow’s Rej for the GM spot…since some players believe that LR is really, really useful.

Since you guys think it does more harm than good, the only suitable trait that fit the spot is -falling damage trait. Otherwise it’d be unfair trade lol… (leave the -20% deception cd inside that adapt trait and pull falling damage out)

Nah, what we need is a trait that stuns or fear Ranger pets when they attack us. Or better yet, a trait that interrupts channeled skills when we go in stealth.

The possibility is endless.

Might as well add a minor trait in Marksmanship that applies reveal for 4 seconds on a 10 ICD as counterplay lol. The possibility is endless.

That trait suggestion doesn’t belong here. Whatever Rangers wants to do with their pet in their private place is no concern of ours.

He’s raising awareness. Now you’re aware.

Is that why he’s pushing for a revealed? Makes sense..

You 2 are two love birds lol.

And you’re just a cutie pie aren’t you…

Toxsa.2701:

What a funny bunch of fellows in the thief forum.
Even supporting them get flamed.
I genuinely wish Last Refuge gone, not sarcastically, but “practically”.

Just hope you fellows don’t regret it later on and start a bunch of new QQs about why Last Refuge is removed. I start to sympathize Anet now.

i think it is safe to say that LR is only defensive trait in entire game that is designed to kill your character instead of helping it….
i am sure majority won’t miss the trait if it was replaced with something reasonable like weak version of cheat death from wow

Go home Toxsa, you’re drunk.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zero Day.2594:

Eliteseraph.4970:

Sorry, I didn’t read the entire thread, since there appears to be intermittent trolling/bickering. I’m just now trying to re-learn how to Thief after not playing for nearly a year.

Is it possible that LR could be changed for HoT? Or is that not very likely?

Current iteration of changes show no changes for LR. It’s very unlikely there will be a change.

If you’re optimistic, LR will be swapped with Shadow’s Rej for the GM spot…since some players believe that LR is really, really useful.

So you drop blinding powder when you are downed and smoke screen when you are in low health?

The 2nd page is brutal.

just remove it altogether.. and change to something like this

Near death reflex : if 10% below hp. refresh deception-type skill , 180 sec iCD

this way it will be put the control to the player instead of kitten activation. this could offset bad playing thief , but we can have more icd to prevent abusing it in pvp. and lowering down the health% so zerk gear won’t be saved that often.

Anymras.5729:

Kadin.2356:

Their “to-do” list shouldn’t take over a year to cycle through. I understand prioritzation but this was straining credibility 6 months ago, now it’s just embarrassing.

It can’t be a hard fix, there are plenty of already existing spell effects that grant “invisiblity” instead of stealth. Seriously just fix it already.

Engineer hobosacks are in a similar situation – since launch, there’s been threads about them, and the response has always been ‘We just don’t have the resources at the moment.’ My theory is that they just keep shoving things into the pipeline, which keeps pushing seemingly small fixes back; if I’m right, then we can expect Last Refuge to be fixed at the same time as Hobosacks: roughly a year after the game has, for all intents and purposes, died.

Well engi’s Lé sack dé hobo is no more, so there you go.

They are so afraid to touch thief it’s almost comical. I truly pity the guy that had to design the new trait line. He probably is/was sweating bullets the entire time. If they do the reveal on the elite spec in any place other than dead last I’ll eat my hat.

Ty for listening anet. Now can u move cloaked in shadow to master? Or I will need to wait another 3 years? U should buff d/d instead of nerfing i guess.