Thief as it is right now is almost immortal with stealth
no.
A skilled one is unkillable.
no.
then learn to win without bs
then learn to win without bs
learn to take defeat without kittening.
well i don’t like it when I die on my thief, but i manage to win lots without BS. you can too!
Thief as it is right now is almost immortal with stealth
no.
A skilled one is unkillable.
A skilled one is skilled if you wanna kill a skilled one get yourself skilled and stop blaming on the stealth to be broken.
to be honest, if we get revealed for 3-4s, okay, no problem. I don’t give a kitten. I will probably die if a zerg is hunting me, if i don’t have initiative. Otherwise they won’t catch me.
And a 3-4s reveal every 40s. I can live with that. The ranger won’t live that long, so he could activate it twice.
On the other hand, if we get revealed for 10s. Then the fight will change significantly. At least if you have a build based on stealth.
In that case, well, have at least one weaponset which doesn’t rely on stealth, so you can kite until reveal is gone.
Nevertheless, I think this skill facing one class isn’t the right solution to fix problems.
You wont get revelead for 10 seconds i dont think but as long as sic em is up (10s) i think going stealth will get you revealed again. Not quite the same thing though
Honestly? Stealth is a crutch, plain and simple. Learn to play without it, and that’s where the real skill takes places.
Thanks for the advice. Going to work on my no-stealth backstab thief in order to get some real skills.
Good. You shouldn’t rely on stealth to get you anywhere in the game. No other class does. Even those that have access to stealth have other options for when it’s on CD or they’re in Revealed.
Right over your head. There is no Backstab without stealth. Also, those classes that don’t use stealth are designed around not having stealth.
Mesmer has 3 traits and 4 skills pertaining to stealth; Engie has 1 skill, one trait and one combo; Ranger has 1 skill and 2 traits; and Thief has 5 skills, 2 combos, 14 traits and a class mechanic devoted to stealth.
I realize what he was inferring. Backstab builds can still have minimal stealth, and you should be able to build around not having it 95% of the time. No matter your build, the steal mechanic will always grant you some form of stealth, and it’s on you to learn to not rely on it for survivability, escaping and anything else.
I think giving hard counters to stealth is fine, but if you take that hard counter they should have to sacrifice equally useful mechanics. Negating stealth, a mechanic that thieves have based many of their builds around can be a complete game changer.
Also, with these hard counters to stealth, Anet should increase the durability of the thief class, imo.
I like the stealth mechanic and if I ran around with everyone negating stealth, it would be very disappointing. But, as many of you, I would adapt. And if not, I would just play another class.
I dodge his ultra-telegraphed CnD
ultra… ultra telegraphed? no… no it isnt… maul is ultra telegraphed… HB is ultra telegraphed… meteor shower is ultra telegraphed
and this is ranger getting the ‘counter’, you just C+D off the kitten pet
Don’t even respond to him. He’s an ultra-telegraphed thief-only player who tries to make like he knows the game.
CnD doesn’t require you to face the target btw. GG for melee attacks that take less skill than moving your camera towards what you want to hit.
Revealed on an ability that requires a visible target is no more a counter to Stealth then Stun or Daze is.
It might last a bit longer, but we dont know that yet.As it stands there is still nothing to actively track a Thief in stealth or pull him out if it, and that is what i consider an actual counter to Stealth.
actively track a thief in stealth? what is the point of stealth then?
They just want a thief served with a hot platter to them!!!
Just chill man, he wasn’t suggesting anything. Thieves are almost worst than rangers on the forums… wow.
I would say the thief forum is pretty much the worst place to be. Even worse than the Ranger forum…at least they’ve got SOME reasons to complain. The WvW, thief-only players that come here and whine about PvE are something else…inhuman is the right word I think.
Honestly? Stealth is a crutch, plain and simple. Learn to play without it, and that’s where the real skill takes places.
Thanks for the advice. Going to work on my no-stealth backstab thief in order to get some real skills.
Good. You shouldn’t rely on stealth to get you anywhere in the game. No other class does. Even those that have access to stealth have other options for when it’s on CD or they’re in Revealed.
Right over your head. There is no Backstab without stealth. Also, those classes that don’t use stealth are designed around not having stealth.
Mesmer has 3 traits and 4 skills pertaining to stealth; Engie has 1 skill, one trait and one combo; Ranger has 1 skill and 2 traits; and Thief has 5 skills, 2 combos, 14 traits and a class mechanic devoted to stealth.
I think I see your problem. D/D should be a high risk, high rewards setup. By adding a counter to stealth, isn’t that technically making the high risk part?
This change will be fantastic for non-stealth S/P thieves.
how? they’d just be unaffected right?
so reavel is 4s? hahaha, I was thinking we would be revealed for 10s. come on, 4s are like peanuts. Have fun rangers, I will now start kitten you, just because you are the only class who can’t whine about stealth any more.
You know what the biggest problems with thieves is? They are weak, so they need to learn dodging. As soon as they can dodge, they kill everyone else. Because everyone think, if a thief stealths, you can just wait for the thief without moving. And then you are surprised if we run behind you and do a critical hit.
Yeah, the OP thieves, learn dodging and get skill.
Funny fact is, we get nerfes, because you aren’t able to learn how to kill a thief.
But if Anet goes on like that, i just can laugh.
Actually they do the right thing with 4s reveal. It doesn’t hurt thieves, but rangers can’t whine about thieves anymore.
I don’t think giving other classes the Revealed status is an acceptable way to provide counter-play to invisibility.
Revealed, as a self-regulation mechanic on Thieves for Stealth attacks, is perfectly fine. However, when given to other classes to apply on Thieves, Revealed becomes a hard-counter to the Stealth mechanic, completely disabling the mechanic and all it’s related effects and abilities and traits that depend on it. Revealed disables an entire traitline of utility effects for the Thief and disables the Thief’s best burst/control/condi abilities (Stealth attacks), severely crippling any Thief built around any of the above aspects.
Hard counters should not exist in a balanced game, because they result in rock-paper-scissors interaction between classes and builds that are simply not fun for the player on the wrong side of the equation.
The fact that hard-counters do not exist currently in GW2 for any other major mechanic for any class is what I consider to be one of the most impressive accomplishments in the design and balance of the PvP aspect of the game. This will no longer be the case once Revealed becomes available to other classes.
I would like to suggest an alternative to Revealed in the form of another effect that specifically counters invisibility, rather than the entire Stealth mechanic. Let’s call it “Detected” for now.
The Detected effect will make the Thief fully visible and targetable for its duration, but will not prevent the Thief from entering the Stealth state itself like Revealed does. This effect will provide counter-play to the invisibility aspect of the Stealth mechanic, but will still allow Thieves to go into the Stealth state to gain the effect of any traits he built for and to access stealth attacks that are a key component of a majority of Thief builds.
In other words, Detected would be a soft-counter to the invisibility aspect of Stealth, but will not hard-counter the entirety of the Stealth mechanic like enemy-induced Revealed would. Detected should be implemented in place of Revealed in the upcoming Sic Em change, and in the previously implemented Stealth Traps in WvW, and in any similar anti-stealth skills going forward.
I feel this would be provide counter-play to invisibility while being much fairer to Thief builds that rely on the Stealth mechanic.
Thoughts?
Posted this in the main GW2 discussions forum. If they’re dead set on providing counter-play to stealth, might as well try to suggest something a bit more reasonable than a hard-counter like Revealed…
This change will be fantastic for non-stealth S/P thieves.
how? they’d just be unaffected right?
It’s fantastic because we can sit back and laugh at the amount of QQ.
Honestly? Stealth is a crutch, plain and simple. Learn to play without it, and that’s where the real skill takes places.
Thanks for the advice. Going to work on my no-stealth backstab thief in order to get some real skills.
Good. You shouldn’t rely on stealth to get you anywhere in the game. No other class does. Even those that have access to stealth have other options for when it’s on CD or they’re in Revealed.
Right over your head. There is no Backstab without stealth. Also, those classes that don’t use stealth are designed around not having stealth.
Mesmer has 3 traits and 4 skills pertaining to stealth; Engie has 1 skill, one trait and one combo; Ranger has 1 skill and 2 traits; and Thief has 5 skills, 2 combos, 14 traits and a class mechanic devoted to stealth.I realize what he was inferring. Backstab builds can still have minimal stealth, and you should be able to build around not having it 95% of the time. No matter your build, the steal mechanic will always grant you some form of stealth, and it’s on you to learn to not rely on it for survivability, escaping and anything else.
Sure you did dude. It makes me wonder if the devs also realizes the same thing.
If you’re not stealthing 95% of the time, then you’re not trying to backstab 95% of the time. And if you’re not trying to backstab 95% of the time with a daggers, then what the hell ARE you doing? Heartseeker only works on low hp and DB requires me to get a new set of gear and re trait. Dancing Daggers bounce (kinda like the way a toothpick bounces off a brick wall) and CnD can’t stealth you when revealed. So then tell me, what’s left?
Kaon….Huh…I like that. It makes a lot of sense. I’ve always held that the biggest problem people have with thieves is not being able to see their attacker. They panic, they don’t know how to move, how to defend, where to attack, and it makes for a free kill. It’s a psychological issue, not a balance issue. People who know how to defend themselves against stealth always respond better and I’ve had days where I’m completely shut down on all my backstabs, forced to flee just because someone was superb at timing their blocks.
Also, I want to see a D/P or D/D thief kill a bunker spirit ranger. Good luck with that one. Even without Sick ‘Em, they’re a pretty kitten hard thief counter.
One more thought: “Focus the pet, that’ll work. Surely.”
Because it’s not like rangers can just take out a new pet when their first one goes down…Odds are you can’t even kill that second pet before his first pet is off recharge which means you’ll just spend 100% of your time fighting his pet constantly getting closer to death while the ranger DPSes you. Even if you can DPS his second pet down in under 10 seconds, what are you left with? No utilities? No initiative? And only about 5 seconds before the pet is back at your heels. This is why people don’t focus the clones/phantasms against a mesmer. Protracted fights against walking zoos work against the person with the less pets.
As for me, hanging up the thief until everyone is over themselves. Warriors are an easy button that I’ve tried to resist pressing, but meh. Obviously ANet doesn’t give a kitten so we’re doing the easy mode.
Kaon….Huh…I like that. It makes a lot of sense. I’ve always held that the biggest problem people have with thieves is not being able to see their attacker. They panic, they don’t know how to move, how to defend, where to attack, and it makes for a free kill. It’s a psychological issue, not a balance issue. People who know how to defend themselves against stealth always respond better and I’ve had days where I’m completely shut down on all my backstabs, forced to flee just because someone was superb at timing their blocks.
Also, I want to see a D/P or D/D thief kill a bunker spirit ranger. Good luck with that one. Even without Sick ‘Em, they’re a pretty kitten hard thief counter.
One more thought: “Focus the pet, that’ll work. Surely.”
Because it’s not like rangers can just take out a new pet when their first one goes down…Odds are you can’t even kill that second pet before his first pet is off recharge which means you’ll just spend 100% of your time fighting his pet constantly getting closer to death while the ranger DPSes you. Even if you can DPS his second pet down in under 10 seconds, what are you left with? No utilities? No initiative? And only about 5 seconds before the pet is back at your heels. This is why people don’t focus the clones/phantasms against a mesmer. Protracted fights against walking zoos work against the person with the less pets.As for me, hanging up the thief until everyone is over themselves. Warriors are an easy button that I’ve tried to resist pressing, but meh. Obviously ANet doesn’t give a kitten so we’re doing the easy mode.
You’re quitting your thief over THIS? Lol. Try an evade thief. Ezmode.
try playing a no stealth thief. It will help you l2p.
S/D is kitten easy to play effectively once you get to know the skills.
Also, why is everyone over-reacting so much? Jesus, it’s not even that bad. We got whiners and then we got people acting like elitists going “Psh, Thieves that actually use stealth, NOOBS L2P!”.
I dodge his ultra-telegraphed CnD
ultra… ultra telegraphed? no… no it isnt… maul is ultra telegraphed… HB is ultra telegraphed… meteor shower is ultra telegraphed
and this is ranger getting the ‘counter’, you just C+D off the kitten pet
Don’t even respond to him. He’s an ultra-telegraphed thief-only player who tries to make like he knows the game.
CnD doesn’t require you to face the target btw. GG for melee attacks that take less skill than moving your camera towards what you want to hit.
Translation: This guy has the word “Thief” in his signature, therefore the only class that he plays is the Thief, because duh, if he played other classes he’d list them in his signature!
Forgive me for calling CnD “ultra-telegraphed” because in my opinion, that’s what it is. Still, whether you agree that it’s “ultra-telegraphed” or not, it’s still telegraphed enough for you to know when to dodge it. The rest of my post is also just as accurate.
I dodge his ultra-telegraphed CnD
ultra… ultra telegraphed? no… no it isnt… maul is ultra telegraphed… HB is ultra telegraphed… meteor shower is ultra telegraphed
and this is ranger getting the ‘counter’, you just C+D off the kitten pet
Don’t even respond to him. He’s an ultra-telegraphed thief-only player who tries to make like he knows the game.
CnD doesn’t require you to face the target btw. GG for melee attacks that take less skill than moving your camera towards what you want to hit.
Translation: This guy has the word “Thief” in his signature, therefore the only class that he plays is the Thief, because duh, if he played other classes he’d list them in his signature!
Forgive me for calling CnD “ultra-telegraphed” because in my opinion, that’s what it is. Still, whether you agree that it’s “ultra-telegraphed” or not, it’s still telegraphed enough for you to know when to dodge it. The rest of my post is also just as accurate.
no it isnt… you C+D off the pet, or HS through pistol#5
- also any ranger who isnt running LB/GS gets screwed by stealth, no burst for when you’re revealed and no way to hit you once you stealth (and a kitten stupid pet)
This whole thread can be summarized with one video:
Kaon….Huh…I like that. It makes a lot of sense. I’ve always held that the biggest problem people have with thieves is not being able to see their attacker. They panic, they don’t know how to move, how to defend, where to attack, and it makes for a free kill. It’s a psychological issue, not a balance issue. People who know how to defend themselves against stealth always respond better and I’ve had days where I’m completely shut down on all my backstabs, forced to flee just because someone was superb at timing their blocks.
Also, I want to see a D/P or D/D thief kill a bunker spirit ranger. Good luck with that one. Even without Sick ‘Em, they’re a pretty kitten hard thief counter.
One more thought: “Focus the pet, that’ll work. Surely.”
Because it’s not like rangers can just take out a new pet when their first one goes down…Odds are you can’t even kill that second pet before his first pet is off recharge which means you’ll just spend 100% of your time fighting his pet constantly getting closer to death while the ranger DPSes you. Even if you can DPS his second pet down in under 10 seconds, what are you left with? No utilities? No initiative? And only about 5 seconds before the pet is back at your heels. This is why people don’t focus the clones/phantasms against a mesmer. Protracted fights against walking zoos work against the person with the less pets.As for me, hanging up the thief until everyone is over themselves. Warriors are an easy button that I’ve tried to resist pressing, but meh. Obviously ANet doesn’t give a kitten so we’re doing the easy mode.
You’re quitting your thief over THIS? Lol. Try an evade thief. Ezmode.
I tried an evade thief. Didn’t like it. Beside the point, ArenaNet is just going to continue to introduce more counters to stealth effectively making it nonexistent as a playstyle which means I’m getting shoehorned into playing something I don’t like. I’m not quitting because this is earthshattering. I’m quitting because it’s just going to get much, much worse before it gets any better. And I’d rather not suffer through that when they’re an ezmode stunlock warrior build that’s readily available.
This buff to sic em is not going to change anything, i have never ever seen a thief get the full 4 s of revealed, culling issues and all… (or whatever its called). A good thief should never lose to a ranger in a 1v1 (unless he’s bunkering). But no build should ever be able to win against a bunker in a 1v1 anyways… And regarding the ‘nerf’ to larcenous strike: evade, decent to good damage and boon STEALING is a bit OP for a two skill combination. Im surprised they kept it at 1 boon… And i also don’t see why only a few classes should have boon removal….
And talking about thieves getting nerfs? Rangers have been getting some aswell, dont get me started,…
This buff to sic em is not going to change anything, i have never ever seen a thief get the full 4 s of revealed, culling issues and all… (or whatever its called). A good thief should never lose to a ranger in a 1v1 (unless he’s bunkering). But no build should ever be able to win against a bunker in a 1v1 anyways… And regarding the ‘nerf’ to larcenous strike: evade, decent to good damage and boon STEALING is a bit OP for a two skill combination. Im surprised they kept it at 1 boon… And i also don’t see why only a few classes should have boon removal….
First off, 4 second reveal is in Spvp, wvw/pve have 3 second reveal, secondly, there is NO way at all in game to reduce revealed, so if you played spvp you sure as hell did see a thief get 4 second reveal, you simply cant count well is all. Third, there is no such thing as culling any longer, it was removed, read patch notes. FS/LS does not do decent to good damage more like bad/mediocre damage, is one of the shortest evades in game and it was made to steal two boons because it wasnt useful when it removed one. Many classes (including yours mr ranger) can reapply boons as fast as they are stripped, and thats with skills like null field, corrupt boon (if 2 boons removed is OP how is ALL of them removed ok?), so changed to 1 boon removed means it is no longer a counter to boon builds, since they can reapply faster than you can remove them, hence it will be useless again
This buff to sic em is not going to change anything, i have never ever seen a thief get the full 4 s of revealed, culling issues and all… (or whatever its called). A good thief should never lose to a ranger in a 1v1 (unless he’s bunkering). But no build should ever be able to win against a bunker in a 1v1 anyways… And regarding the ‘nerf’ to larcenous strike: evade, decent to good damage and boon STEALING is a bit OP for a two skill combination. Im surprised they kept it at 1 boon… And i also don’t see why only a few classes should have boon removal….
First off, 4 second reveal is in Spvp, wvw/pve have 3 second reveal, secondly, there is NO way at all in game to reduce revealed, so if you played spvp you sure as hell did see a thief get 4 second reveal, you simply cant count well is all. Third, there is no such thing as culling any longer, it was removed, read patch notes. FS/LS does not do decent to good damage more like bad/mediocre damage, is one of the shortest evades in game and it was made to steal two boons because it wasnt useful when it removed one. Many classes (including yours mr ranger) can reapply boons as fast as they are stripped, and thats with skills like null field, corrupt boon (if 2 boons removed is OP how is ALL of them removed ok?), so changed to 1 boon removed means it is no longer a counter to boon builds, since they can reapply faster than you can remove them, hence it will be useless again
and you have stealth , ability to take boons, ability to evade alot with the correct weapon set (same with rangers – we are also forced to a weapon set except yours does alot more dmg) , ability to burst insane amounts of damage , ability to have 2-3 stun breaks on utility and teleport to different areas in conjunction with a weapon set and a utility. classes have different uses for different things. if rangers had full dmg on their weapons, the crying would be endless and quite frankly , we should be given that option to not take a pet and get the full dmg but anet won’t give it to us.
most of the ranger’s issues against the thief isn’t the ranger himself, it’s the pet ai and mechanics in general. it takes a pet 2 seconds to register someone coming out of stealth before he attacks that person that and it’s a free cnd as the pet can’t dodge not the mention the steal we give you , if running dagger at all is insanely overpowered as HS doesn’t require a huge amount of init vs the heal youre getting AND condition removal out of it. jus sayin, any thief bragging about killing a ranger 1on1 needs to realize how much they actually have it made against us. that’s why we’re getting stealth counter, and like many have said, it’s really not that significant , you just have to pay attention a little more to the skills we use, that’s all.
This buff to sic em is not going to change anything, i have never ever seen a thief get the full 4 s of revealed, culling issues and all… (or whatever its called). A good thief should never lose to a ranger in a 1v1 (unless he’s bunkering). But no build should ever be able to win against a bunker in a 1v1 anyways… And regarding the ‘nerf’ to larcenous strike: evade, decent to good damage and boon STEALING is a bit OP for a two skill combination. Im surprised they kept it at 1 boon… And i also don’t see why only a few classes should have boon removal….
First off, 4 second reveal is in Spvp, wvw/pve have 3 second reveal, secondly, there is NO way at all in game to reduce revealed, so if you played spvp you sure as hell did see a thief get 4 second reveal, you simply cant count well is all. Third, there is no such thing as culling any longer, it was removed, read patch notes. FS/LS does not do decent to good damage more like bad/mediocre damage, is one of the shortest evades in game and it was made to steal two boons because it wasnt useful when it removed one. Many classes (including yours mr ranger) can reapply boons as fast as they are stripped, and thats with skills like null field, corrupt boon (if 2 boons removed is OP how is ALL of them removed ok?), so changed to 1 boon removed means it is no longer a counter to boon builds, since they can reapply faster than you can remove them, hence it will be useless again
and you have stealth , ability to take boons, ability to evade alot with the correct weapon set (same with rangers – we are also forced to a weapon set except yours does alot more dmg) , ability to burst insane amounts of damage , ability to have 2-3 stun breaks on utility and teleport to different areas in conjunction with a weapon set and a utility. classes have different uses for different things. if rangers had full dmg on their weapons, the crying would be endless and quite frankly , we should be given that option to not take a pet and get the full dmg but anet won’t give it to us.
most of the ranger’s issues against the thief isn’t the ranger himself, it’s the pet ai and mechanics in general. it takes a pet 2 seconds to register someone coming out of stealth before he attacks that person that and it’s a free cnd as the pet can’t dodge not the mention the steal we give you , if running dagger at all is insanely overpowered as HS doesn’t require a huge amount of init vs the heal youre getting AND condition removal out of it. jus sayin, any thief bragging about killing a ranger 1on1 needs to realize how much they actually have it made against us. that’s why we’re getting stealth counter, and like many have said, it’s really not that significant , you just have to pay attention a little more to the skills we use, that’s all.
Yeah, because every thief runs 30/30/30/30/30, can use any utility at will and can use every weapon set at the same time.
almsot , if not everything i mentioned is carried in one weapon set and utility choices alone, what 30/30/30/30/30 are you referring to? I play a thief as well by the way because you know , ranger has to play every other class to completely learn it inside and out to even have SOME FORM of a chance in 1on1’s, and even then it’s very tough to beat a good thief as a ranger – i dont even think thief needs to do this except for maybe the mesmer/guardian class. once again, keep spewing more bullkitten please, thieves do it best to try and make themselves out like the victim in gw2.
(edited by Ryan.8367)
This buff to sic em is not going to change anything, i have never ever seen a thief get the full 4 s of revealed, culling issues and all… (or whatever its called). A good thief should never lose to a ranger in a 1v1 (unless he’s bunkering). But no build should ever be able to win against a bunker in a 1v1 anyways… And regarding the ‘nerf’ to larcenous strike: evade, decent to good damage and boon STEALING is a bit OP for a two skill combination. Im surprised they kept it at 1 boon… And i also don’t see why only a few classes should have boon removal….
First off, 4 second reveal is in Spvp, wvw/pve have 3 second reveal, secondly, there is NO way at all in game to reduce revealed, so if you played spvp you sure as hell did see a thief get 4 second reveal, you simply cant count well is all. Third, there is no such thing as culling any longer, it was removed, read patch notes. FS/LS does not do decent to good damage more like bad/mediocre damage, is one of the shortest evades in game and it was made to steal two boons because it wasnt useful when it removed one. Many classes (including yours mr ranger) can reapply boons as fast as they are stripped, and thats with skills like null field, corrupt boon (if 2 boons removed is OP how is ALL of them removed ok?), so changed to 1 boon removed means it is no longer a counter to boon builds, since they can reapply faster than you can remove them, hence it will be useless again
and you have stealth , ability to take boons, ability to evade alot with the correct weapon set (same with rangers – we are also forced to a weapon set except yours does alot more dmg) , ability to burst insane amounts of damage , ability to have 2-3 stun breaks on utility and teleport to different areas in conjunction with a weapon set and a utility. classes have different uses for different things. if rangers had full dmg on their weapons, the crying would be endless and quite frankly , we should be given that option to not take a pet and get the full dmg but anet won’t give it to us.
most of the ranger’s issues against the thief isn’t the ranger himself, it’s the pet ai and mechanics in general. it takes a pet 2 seconds to register someone coming out of stealth before he attacks that person that and it’s a free cnd as the pet can’t dodge not the mention the steal we give you , if running dagger at all is insanely overpowered as HS doesn’t require a huge amount of init vs the heal youre getting AND condition removal out of it. jus sayin, any thief bragging about killing a ranger 1on1 needs to realize how much they actually have it made against us. that’s why we’re getting stealth counter, and like many have said, it’s really not that significant , you just have to pay attention a little more to the skills we use, that’s all.
Wow, so much to respond to. First off, you literally didnt address anything in my post that you quoted, at all. Secondly only thief has 2-3 utility stunbreaks? Really? Every class has the option to take multiple stunbreakers if they so choose.
Then you talk about us having stealth (30 SA for full effect(d/d, d/p, s/d)) ability to take boons (20 trickery (s/d)), heavy evades (15 acrobatics) s/d, d/d, s/p)), “insane burst” (25 DA 30 CS d/d) and “teleport to different areas” first off they broke shadowstep pathing months ago now, it fails more often than it works, secondly in order teleport all over like you say, we would need shortbow and use all our initiative. So lets look at this build you have described 25/30/30/15/20 with d/d, s/d, d/p, and shortbow. When did thief get 120 trait points and 4 weapon swaps?
if youre a thief dueling or roaming, youre 30 in SA much like if youre a ranger dueling or roaming youre 30 in WS. the evades from flanking strike (which is simply abused to get the boon steal option by flanking striking the air anyway) and bow are what i was referring to by the way. teleportation (shadow step from sword , shadowstep utility , shadow trap, you could do it with bow but there’s no point really in a fight its mostly used for mobility outside of combat as the init cost doesnt justify anything in combat – kitten). are you kittening dumb or are you just really that naive of your own thief’s capabilities?
(edited by Ryan.8367)
almsot , if not everything i mentioned is carried in one weapon set and utility choices alone, what 30/30/30/30/30 are you referring to? I play a thief as well by the way because you know , ranger has to play every other class to completely learn it inside and out to even have SOME FORM of a chance in 1on1’s, and even then it’s very tough to beat a good thief as a ranger – i dont even think thief needs to do this except for maybe the mesmer/guardian class. once again, keep spewing more bullkitten please, thieves do it best to try and make themselves out like the victim in gw2.
Yeah, because everyone happens to play just one spec. You’re the one spewing bullkitten, and acting like the victim.
if youre a thief dueling or roaming, youre 30 in SA much like if youre a ranger dueling or roaming youre 30 in WS. the evades from flanking strike (which is simply abused to get the boon steal option by flanking striking the air anyway) and bow are what i was referring to by the way. teleportation (shadow step from sword , shadowstep utility , shadow trap, you could do it with bow but there’s no point really in a fight its mostly used for mobility outside of combat as the init cost doesnt justify anything in combat – kitten). are you kittening dumb or are you just really that naive of your own thief’s capabilities?
So your suggesting running 30 SA for a s/d evade/boonsteal build? and i’m kittening dumb?
if youre a thief dueling or roaming, youre 30 in SA much like if youre a ranger dueling or roaming youre 30 in WS. the evades from flanking strike (which is simply abused to get the boon steal option by flanking striking the air anyway) and bow are what i was referring to by the way. teleportation (shadow step from sword , shadowstep utility , shadow trap, you could do it with bow but there’s no point really in a fight its mostly used for mobility outside of combat as the init cost doesnt justify anything in combat – kitten). are you kittening dumb or are you just really that naive of your own thief’s capabilities?
So your suggesting running 30 SA for a s/d evade/boonsteal build? and i’m kittening dumb?
He mains a ranger, but “plays a thief as well”, so he’s a veritable “expert”.
Lol at the kitten you part from ryan. Come back when you get some big boy hair.
if youre a thief dueling or roaming, youre 30 in SA much like if youre a ranger dueling or roaming youre 30 in WS. the evades from flanking strike (which is simply abused to get the boon steal option by flanking striking the air anyway) and bow are what i was referring to by the way. teleportation (shadow step from sword , shadowstep utility , shadow trap, you could do it with bow but there’s no point really in a fight its mostly used for mobility outside of combat as the init cost doesnt justify anything in combat – kitten). are you kittening dumb or are you just really that naive of your own thief’s capabilities?
So your suggesting running 30 SA for a s/d evade/boonsteal build? and i’m kittening dumb?
no, for a s/d evasion build id run something mostly in DA/CS , who mentioned anything about pairing a s/d weapon set with 30 in SA? youre the one that mentioned 30 in SA to begin with and the ONLY reason i mentioned s/d wasbecause you had to make it out like i was specifically talking about traits and not weapon sets/utilities to get teleport mobility (which youd prob run shadowstep in an evasion build as well). BP / #5 D / SR for s/d-shortbow evasion , yawn
(edited by Ryan.8367)
dont worry guys, ill wait
who mentioned anything about pairing a s/d weapon set with 30 in SA?
if youre a thief dueling or roaming, youre 30 in SA much like if youre a ranger dueling or roaming youre 30 in WS. the evades from flanking strike (which is simply abused to get the boon steal option by flanking striking the air anyway) and bow are what i was referring to by the way.
i like how my posts got infracted when they didnt even contain anything negative including my latest one. hilarious
“the evades from flanking strike (which is simply abused to get the boon steal option by flanking striking the air anyway) and bow are what i was referring to by the way.” isnt tied the sentence before it, i was replying to you trying to say that i was talking about traits being the only way (specifically 15 in acro) for evasion. please don’t try to say im tying s/d with 30 in SA when im clearly not. thanks!
“the evades from flanking strike (which is simply abused to get the boon steal option by flanking striking the air anyway) and bow are what i was referring to by the way.” isnt tied the sentence before it, i was replying to you trying to say that i was talking about traits being the only way (specifically 15 in acro) for evasion. please don’t try to say im tying s/d with 30 in SA when im clearly not. thanks!
In order to make full use of s/d evades you need much more than 15 in acrobatics, 20 pts for 2 init per 10 seconds and 30 pts for 3 init on swap
As far as that goes the original post i replied to falls into the same fallacy that so many anti-thief posts do, you mention a laundry list of things ‘thief can do’ like its something EVERY build can do, completely ignoring that you can only have a fraction of those things in any build. Feel free to return to the fuzzy animal ranger boards
If a Ranger with Sic em kills you, you should probably go play a game like hello kitty island adventures, because GW2 is too advanced for you, and that’s sad.
“the evades from flanking strike (which is simply abused to get the boon steal option by flanking striking the air anyway) and bow are what i was referring to by the way.” isnt tied the sentence before it, i was replying to you trying to say that i was talking about traits being the only way (specifically 15 in acro) for evasion. please don’t try to say im tying s/d with 30 in SA when im clearly not. thanks!
In order to make full use of s/d evades you need much more than 15 in acrobatics, 20 pts for 2 init per 10 seconds and 30 pts for 3 init on swap
As far as that goes the original post i replied to falls into the same fallacy that so many anti-thief posts do, you mention a laundry list of things ‘thief can do’ like its something EVERY build can do, completely ignoring that you can only have a fraction of those things in any build. Feel free to return to the fuzzy animal ranger boards
and i’ll reply that with a 25/30/0/15/0 build with shortbow and sword/dagger and utilities: Blinding powder , Shadow step , Shadow refuge) and withdrawl you can do pretty much everything i said, once again, youre talking out of your kitten without clear knowledge of what your own class is capable of.
(edited by Ryan.8367)
i like how my posts got infracted when they didnt even contain anything negative including my latest one. hilarious
You should take a look at all the posts you’ve made in this thread. Full of trolling, condescension, name calling and telling people off, all because they don’t agree with you.
You have zero credibility with people when you open up with:
Hahaha
The tears are already streaming heavily
grabs his thief tear jar
If you want to discuss things like an adult, then maybe you’ll be treated like one. Come here and waste people’s time with insults and more, and yeah, the mods will likely censor you.
So far, all you’ve done is kitten people off with your attitude and opinions.
Stealth in this game has always been over the top.
I mean lets examine what thieves were saying month’s ago when we said “Stealth is out of line”
They said things like “It only lasts a few seconds, We’re revealed every now and again, we’re not perma stealthed”
But right now, Thieves in this game can actually perma stealth…Which is something they weren’t suppose to be able to do. Which is why you got a bloody in combat stealth every few seconds.
If Anet had any idea of how to balance a game in the first place (and they don’t) they would of never gave you in combat stealth on such a short timer, and they certainly wouldn’t of let you have Stealth with ZERO draw backs.
Stealth in this game has always been over the top.
I mean lets examine what thieves were saying month’s ago when we said “Stealth is out of line”
They said things like “It only lasts a few seconds, We’re revealed every now and again, we’re not perma stealthed”
But right now, Thieves in this game can actually perma stealth…Which is something they weren’t suppose to be able to do. Which is why you got a bloody in combat stealth every few seconds.
If Anet had any idea of how to balance a game in the first place (and they don’t) they would of never gave you in combat stealth on such a short timer, and they certainly wouldn’t of let you have Stealth with ZERO draw backs.
There is a drawback for stealth. When you’re in stealth you’re not doing any damage to the enemy.
I don’t know about you, but to me that is a pretty big drawback.
That’s not a draw back.
Cause they’re not doing damage to you.
Esp when Stealth gives you so many benefits.
Now if Stealth didn’t let you heal/remove conditions you might have a point, Because The other person would be getting those benefits while you weren’t.
But considering most thieves can stealth at half health, and come out 4 seconds later with full health and all the conditions removed off of them, You’re not getting a drawback by stealthing.
That’s not a draw back.
Cause they’re not doing damage to you.
Esp when Stealth gives you so many benefits.
Now if Stealth didn’t let you heal/remove conditions you might have a point, Because The other person would be getting those benefits while you weren’t.
But considering most thieves can stealth at half health, and come out 4 seconds later with full health and all the conditions removed off of them, You’re not getting a drawback by stealthing.
You have to trait for heal on stealth. And classes like warrior with healing signet can heal while the thief is healing in stealth so like I said, the drawback is that the enemy is healing while you’re doing 0 damage.
Another drawback is that you can’t cap objectives while stealthed.
Those 2 drawbacks combined is why S/D is superior to D/P in sPvP.
Also…there is NO guarantee whatsoever that you won’t be damaged during stealth. I can think of many situations why a thief might be damaged while stealthed. It’s not an invincibility mode. I agree if stealth = invincibility then yea it’s OP.
(edited by Excalibur.9748)
That’s not a draw back.
Cause they’re not doing damage to you.
Esp when Stealth gives you so many benefits.
Now if Stealth didn’t let you heal/remove conditions you might have a point, Because The other person would be getting those benefits while you weren’t.
But considering most thieves can stealth at half health, and come out 4 seconds later with full health and all the conditions removed off of them, You’re not getting a drawback by stealthing.
How do thieves get to full health 4 seconds later? The heal in stealth is only about 330 HPS meaning about 1300 or so health by the end of that. If you have more than 1 damaging condition on you (very likely against engis and necros) all you’re effectively doing is canceling one out until it might get removed at the end of 3 seconds. Other professions have both better passive and active condi removal. Lets take cleansing ire on the warrior for example (comparable since its in their toughness line also); cleansing ire rewards the warrior for being more aggressive instead of backing off, resulting in 3 conditions removed every 7 3/4 seconds while encouraging them to attack for the condition clear. It’s the equivalent to us getting the benefits of ‘while in stealth’ to ‘upon revealed’ instead. That would cause you to benefit from keeping up pressure rather than having to drop pressure 50% or so of the time to gain a noticeable benefit from traiting into stealth.
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