Guild Wars 2

Does anyone else NEVER (or almost never) use the thief’s steal mechanic?

I don’t know what it is but I can never remember to use it. I’ve played all of the classes extensively and I use all of the other classes F1-F4 abilities all the time but I always forget about steal.

It just seems very underwhelming to me. That must be the reason because I have tried and tried and tried to remember to use it but I just can’t.

I think a lot of that is due to the fact that the other abilities provide better feedback (for lack of a better word). When you use steal it is pretty unspectacular. You just warp to the target (assuming it works) and you have an item in your hand. If you are close to your target you don’t even move very far so its like you hardly notice it. Not only that but the item is dependent on who you are stealing from so its not really consistent from fight to fight the way the other classes skills are.

It would be nice if it was spiced up a little so that it did more. Maybe give us different types of steals the way mesmer has different shatters?

F1 – steal (but does half the damage as mug so that it is at least doing something)
F2 – steal then shadowstep away (grab an item and get out, like a thief would actually do)
F3 – shadowstep behind your target and steal from them (setup for backstab, long cooldown)

I don’t want to get too off topic here. I’m really just curious if there are other people out there like me who never use the skill.

I don’t think it needs improvements, it’s fine how it is. What we need to do make f2-4 our Deception skills, and add new utilities because most are useless for our currently viable specs.

you never use it, you suggest how to change it

rofl, its a 35-45 second shadow step that is affected by traits to give boons or do damage (or heal in the incoming patch). If you don’t understand the power of it thats a problem with you not thief profession mechanic o_O

For a profession mechanic, it’s built around way the hell too long of a recharge. It isn’t available for use often enough.

Now that it Won’t crit with mug and heals for 2K the CD is way to long.

PearlGore.7419:

Now that it Won’t crit with mug and heals for 2K the CD is way to long.

Yeah, thieves can’t shadowstep often enough.

Humorless.1573:

PearlGore.7419:

Now that it Won’t crit with mug and heals for 2K the CD is way to long.

Yeah, thieves can’t shadowstep often enough.

Okay?

Steal is pretty spectacular if you take Mug. I like to chain it with Basilisk Venom in WvW to give me an extremely strong, quick engagement. It shaves a few fractions of a second off their possible reaction time which makes it easier to kill people.

It can also be really amazing if you remember what all the steal skills do. Steal from a Guardian and you get a crazy-long 4-second daze. Steal from a Warrior and you get Whirling Axe which deals extremely heavy damage. A lot of the steal skills are really, really strong and the speed at which they let you initiate can hardly be matched.

ChesterWing.5321:

you never use it, you suggest how to change it

I never use it because it’s not worth using IMO. It just isn’t a fun skill. My suggestions were things they could add to make it more useful.

ChesterWing.5321:

rofl, its a 35-45 second shadow step that is affected by traits to give boons or do damage (or heal in the incoming patch). If you don’t understand the power of it thats a problem with you not thief profession mechanic o_O

Thieves already have so many ways to shadow step though, so in that respect the untraited “steal” by itself seems redundant. Stealing boons, healing, or doing damage would be great if they were built into the skill by default but they are not. You need to invest a lot of points to get those perks. Without them the skill is pretty much worthless. No other class has a mechanic that is so initially bad.

That’s why I suggested some alternatives (like the hit and run or the backstab setup) so that it would have some other uses. As it is now, it barely registers above your typical shadow step.

And for the record I’ve tried the traits and the juice ain’t worth the squeeze due to the traits being spread out all over the place.

They should probably move Serpent’s Touch, Improvisation, Mug, and Hidden Thief into Trickery and collapse a lot of those traits. They hinted at collapsing thief traits during SOTG so hopefully that’s what they do.

“I never use it because it’s not worth using IMO. It just isn’t a fun skill. My suggestions were things they could add to make it more useful.”

How can stealing a skull and fearing a necromancer not be fun?

When the game first came out I felt the same way about Steal. I never really used it… never remembered to.
Then I found out that Steal can be used in mid-animation for any skill.
Now I use it all the time. Running a S/P Pistol Whip build in PvE and a boss knocks you back? As soon as you stand up, hit 3 then F1 and watch as you tele to the boss just as the sword slash combo starts. Things like that get really fun in PvP too when you match it with Steal-based traits.

I run a build that doesn’t use any traits for steal and in a fight I more or less use it on CD. If your in a group fight and fight a Mesmer…why would you not want to steal all those boons? Eles, a 10 second chill? or a guardian, a 4 second daze? A free extra stealth from thieves or Whirling Axe from warriors…the skill is amazing…

My biggest problem is stealing a skill that I like then killing the person with out using it. Now I want to save it for the next guy and I’m stuck with no steal :-(

When I have a dagger offhand, Steal is almost always on cooldown because cnd > steal is now in muscle memory.

If I have a pistol offhand, however, I forget to use Steal. A lot. It just doesn’t flow with it for some reason to me.

Shortbow is a special case. I steal into them and then D-shot backwards while a cluster bomb falls onto their face. It’s one of my little burst combos that keeps me 100% safe thanks to the evade in D-shot and puts me back out at range without wasting a real dodge.

Why don’t you steal? I used to not use steal when I first started playing thief… then I learned I was dumb for not doing so. It’s an instant non-interrupt skill (so you can do it at any time with no penalty and trait it to do much) that is also a gap closer that gives you some extremely nice abilities. Steal an egg? That’s HP and 6 initiative. Gunk? Toss it and you now have a mesmer field that lets you give yourself Chaos Armor (best aura ever) or Confuse your target to all heck. Consume Plasma? Every freaking buff in the game for 10s. Whirling Axe? A powerful projectile-reflecting AoE move that I’ve taken out countless people and ghosts with. Then there’s a massive list of stuns, dazes and debuffs.

So I ask you again, why do you NEVER steal? Even when ranged it’s still worth it as it may give you the winning move. Only P/P doesn’t have a move that lets you jump right back, and why are you using that weapon combo anyways?

Mug is such a wicked talent in WvW, I use basilisk venom + steal combo all day.

Personally I would like to have and f2, discard stolen items if you don’t want it.
Imagine you steal from a mesmer and are now facing a warrior with that new boon hate trait

never stealing with thief is just about as smart of an idea as never swapping attunements on ele or never dodging ever. It just takes soo much out of your game and takes away much of the utility you COULD be bringing. The only classes that can get away with never using their class abilities are warrior and guardian. Warrior b/c they can make use of being lazy with their traits and guardian b/c they have pretty good passives already with their f skills.

Every other class needs to use their class mechanic or else they will be junk.

My steal is on cd 90% of the time when enemies are near. It’s just such a great gap closer/escape tool.

If you trait steal up it gives you and your allies like, 5 boons, poisons your target, debuffs them, does damage to them, turns you invisible, and a thing or three I’m forgetting. Steal is one of the best abilities ever.

This is a really interesting thread, mainly because I’m semi-new to the game and just started a thief. Truthfully, I didn’t even know what steal did! Call me a big noob, but I thought it was more like a combo move…steal something (was thinking maybe you got a crafting item or trophy or something) then it gives you access to the next move.

Now that I understand it, I’ll be using it even more!

I haven’t looked into traits yet (just hit 11) so I’m not sure about making it better, but I agree that as a base skill, it’s a bit more on the weak side than the others, if for no other reason than you don’t know what you’re getting when you steal (at first anyway).

While I don’t know if it’s worth changing the skills for, I think the idea to have different types of steals would be cool, or maybe change the mechanic depending on what weapon is equipped on your main hand. At first I thought changing it from shadow step to a leap backwards would be cool for shortbow, but then when someone above mentioned the move that pushes you back, it makes more sense to shadowstep.

Still, I am excited to get back into game and check out steal with a whole new understanding!

I don’t use steal much either. My thief’s not specifically built to take advantage of Steal so I think that is part of the reason I tend to ignore it. But the other part of the reason is that frankly the few times I’ve tried it I wasn’t impressed with the ability I got. Its a one off skill with a long cooldown that may or may not be effective but robs me of my attack bar until I use it. And using it seems to pull me out of the flow of a fight. I could be hitting something/someone three times, cause bleeding or poisoning or vulnerability, or kiting it or dodging blows coming from more than one direction but instead I’m playing around with the gunk or whatever I’ve stolen. Steal just isn’t the Thief class specific mechanic I care about and really like – that would be Initiative. I will admit that if I could just use the skill as a shadowstep type teleport with say 1-2 seconds of stealth at the end I probably would use it far more often. Bottom line is that whatever becomes the new skill has to beat my using the number 2,3, or 5 skills on my D/D thief and I have no faith that will be the case.

Arrow.4619:

Its a one off skill with a long cooldown that may or may not be effective but robs me of my attack bar until I use it.

It doesn’t rob you of your attack bar; you use f1 to Steal, then f1 again to use what you’ve stolen – your weapon skills remain the same. ( not like when you pick up a single use item from the ground)

And I use Steal more often with my D/D build – I trait it up then use it as a fast gap closer, debuff/buff, poison, extra attack, etc. ability. How often I’m movin’ around in D/D, I really rely on the extra mobility that Steal gives me.

The more you play you will realize the potential of it. Its not only for the ability you actually steal but for movement and gap closing. It also doesnt effect global cooldown and can be used in conjuction with other skills that are ‘casted’.

Mug ( dmg when stealing – DA #3 ) will be changing but right now it adds a HUGE damage bonus.

Arrow.4619:

I don’t use steal much either. My thief’s not specifically built to take advantage of Steal so I think that is part of the reason I tend to ignore it. But the other part of the reason is that frankly the few times I’ve tried it I wasn’t impressed with the ability I got. Its a one off skill with a long cooldown that may or may not be effective but robs me of my attack bar until I use it. And using it seems to pull me out of the flow of a fight. I could be hitting something/someone three times, cause bleeding or poisoning or vulnerability, or kiting it or dodging blows coming from more than one direction but instead I’m playing around with the gunk or whatever I’ve stolen. Steal just isn’t the Thief class specific mechanic I care about and really like – that would be Initiative. I will admit that if I could just use the skill as a shadowstep type teleport with say 1-2 seconds of stealth at the end I probably would use it far more often. Bottom line is that whatever becomes the new skill has to beat my using the number 2,3, or 5 skills on my D/D thief and I have no faith that will be the case.

So… you’ve basically never EVER used steal. Not even once. Since like early EARLY beta.
Steal doesn’t rob you of your attack bar, and its primary function is to keep you in the flow of a fight as a gap closer. Unless you’re ranged. In which case its purpose is to take you out of a fight by stealing from bunnies, trash mobs, and anything else in the opposite direction of your target.

Learning how to use stolen items (learning to improvise) is key to getting the most out of steal. Stolen items are, with few exceptions, very powerful. In PvP there are no exceptions, every PvP steal is very powerful. Traiting steal to reinforce a burst, function as an extra stealth, or whatever happens to be in the trait lines you’re already building for specializes it pretty well if there’s nothing else in that major slot you need.

Yeah, you can’t build completely around steal like a mesmer can build around clones or an ele can build around attunement swapping, but that isn’t really the point. Steal’s function is to blend in to whatever it is your thief already does. The trick is, like a lot of the thief’s mechanics, to learn to use it creatively and improvise.

Arrow.4619:

I don’t use steal much either. My thief’s not specifically built to take advantage of Steal so I think that is part of the reason I tend to ignore it. But the other part of the reason is that frankly the few times I’ve tried it I wasn’t impressed with the ability I got. Its a one off skill with a long cooldown that may or may not be effective but robs me of my attack bar until I use it. And using it seems to pull me out of the flow of a fight. I could be hitting something/someone three times, cause bleeding or poisoning or vulnerability, or kiting it or dodging blows coming from more than one direction but instead I’m playing around with the gunk or whatever I’ve stolen. Steal just isn’t the Thief class specific mechanic I care about and really like – that would be Initiative. I will admit that if I could just use the skill as a shadowstep type teleport with say 1-2 seconds of stealth at the end I probably would use it far more often. Bottom line is that whatever becomes the new skill has to beat my using the number 2,3, or 5 skills on my D/D thief and I have no faith that will be the case.

I have to ask, have you ever played a thief? I mean since the game came out. B/c you just described picking up some trash item from the ground, not steal.

randomfightfan.4091:

Arrow.4619:

I don’t use steal much either. My thief’s not specifically built to take advantage of Steal so I think that is part of the reason I tend to ignore it. But the other part of the reason is that frankly the few times I’ve tried it I wasn’t impressed with the ability I got. Its a one off skill with a long cooldown that may or may not be effective but robs me of my attack bar until I use it. And using it seems to pull me out of the flow of a fight. I could be hitting something/someone three times, cause bleeding or poisoning or vulnerability, or kiting it or dodging blows coming from more than one direction but instead I’m playing around with the gunk or whatever I’ve stolen. Steal just isn’t the Thief class specific mechanic I care about and really like – that would be Initiative. I will admit that if I could just use the skill as a shadowstep type teleport with say 1-2 seconds of stealth at the end I probably would use it far more often. Bottom line is that whatever becomes the new skill has to beat my using the number 2,3, or 5 skills on my D/D thief and I have no faith that will be the case.

I have to ask, have you ever played a thief? I mean since the game came out. B/c you just described picking up some trash item from the ground, not steal.

Guy has never played the class.

If you’re anything short of a full ranged thief (and even then…) and don’t use Steal (and Mug) you’re doing something horribly wrong. No "but"s or "if"s. You’re a bad player. Period. Even if completely untraited it’s such a stupid good free gap closer that you have no reason not to use it.

Once the new patch hits, however, that won’t necessarily stay true, but for now, that’s a fact.

So after reading and posting here last night, I played a little around with steal and even at low level it can mean the difference between life and death. I am level 13 and was taking on 2 level 14’s, almost dead and realized I had a steal saved up. I used it, it killed one of the mobs and pushed the other back, giving me time to use my heal and win the fight. Without it, I don’t think I could have survived. I don’t know exactly what move it was I used, but still, I think it was pretty awesome!

IMO the potential is high for it’s use and, while I wish they gave more options on how it’s implemented, I do like it a lot.

Steal gives me fury and vigor. Yes, I use it. (pve)

Hi guys, I’m a fairly new player, got the game at beginning of April but got plenty of hours in already!

Was compelled to make my first post on the forums in this thread as I just cannot understand how anybody would choose thief and not use steal. It is so important. Build your traits up accordingly and it deals damage, poisons, buffs and rips boons from your enemy all for yourself and any allies. Then you have the stolen skill to use for free which can be any number of useful skills. Just doesn’t make sense to not steal.

Grimwolf.7163:

For a profession mechanic, it’s built around way the hell too long of a recharge. It isn’t available for use often enough.

Except that it can be traited to have a shorter cool down, and it’s only one of many mechanics that we have. Plus, it’s a skill that has different utility at different points in a fight.

For example, running into a fight, Steal gives you the ability to take the ability that you want that could come in useful later. It Shadowsteps you without having to break stealth, too.

On the other hand, using Steal in the middle of a fight, while nice, really squanders the skill’s possible utility. There are multiple more effective ways to shadowstep to opponents in the middle of a fight than stealing, like Shadow Shot, Infiltrator’s Strike, Shadowstep, Infiltrator’s Signet, etc. In the middle of a fight, also, you typically don’t get the same ability to pick and choose which ability you want to get, either. If there are multiple opponents nearby, each of which you can steal from, good for you. However, the abilities that you can use are still limited.

Steal, against every enemy, has a different amount of usage based on the skill that it gives you. For instance, Stealing from a thief in the middle of a battle isn’t nearly as useful as stealing from him/her at the beginning of the battle. When you steal at the beginning, you can already get your Steal on cooldown, of course, but you can also get your BT ready for use whenever you need it, meaning that, if you get in trouble, you don’t have to Steal->BT, which is a dangerous maneuver that gets you close to the enemy and can be blocked (I believe), evaded, or blinded, in which case you’re probably going to be screwed over. On the other hand, a steal from a warrior might not be so good for use mid-battle (since it can be easily evaded/countered, and it makes you a little vulnerable for a few seconds), but it’s great for using early in a battle so that you can take as much advantage as possible from the ability.

If Steal was the only profession mechanic, I might agree with you. However, it isn’t; it’s just one of many of our mechanics, like initiative, and a ton of stealth and mobility. Moreover, Steal grants us one of multiple very powerful abilities. We can get every boon, or we can apply tons of conditions and grab some chaos armor. We can stealth, apply high DPS, and control enemies with our Steal ability. And, the best part is, we can UNLEASH OUR INNER GARDENER! (which, by the way, is a very, very powerful ability)

So, too long a cool down? Given how it ought to be used, how good the abilities that it grants us are, and the fact that this isn’t our only profession mechanic anyways, I have to disagree.

EDIT: oh, and btw- did I mention that Steal can also be traited to daze, regen three init, deal damage and heal yourself (in the newest patch), apply poison, grant yourself and allies might, fury, and swiftness, and rip two boons off of an enemy and grant them to yourself and allies while also applying vigor?

ChesterWing.5321:

you never use it, you suggest how to change it

rofl, its a 35-45 second shadow step that is affected by traits to give boons or do damage (or heal in the incoming patch). If you don’t understand the power of it thats a problem with you not thief profession mechanic o_O

wrong. eery calss is atleast 2x more/stronger f traits. i would trade steal for ANY set …ANY ANY ANY other set. i have already listed the traits others give ….buffs…..dmg….heals…..steal…even when its traited/spec to do all it can …isnt half of what any of the other classes f1 2 3 4’s can do. its a joke.

I don’t wanna say “then you’ve got the wrong class”, but if you aren’t seeing the usefulness of steal – especially traited – you aren’t doing it right. In PvE, when fighting anything other than bosses, my D/D thief is the scariest thing on the board and Steal plays a big part of that. With all the boons I grab and conditions I lay down with a fully traited Steal, my equipment and skills, they should be renaming the class “the Cuisinart”. Steal is only one half our class skill – the other half being Initiative – but when mixed right they make a hard drink for monsters to swallow. (Mobility is supposed to be one of our defining traits, too, and stealth, but …. Something those Anet guys gotta remember when nerfing our builds is that we’re better in some areas because we got tradeoffs. We have the fewest weapons in the game and no offhand foci.)