Guild Wars 2

Hey all,

I have never played thief before. Decided to roll one when I got an ascended armor drop with Apothecary stats; when I asked guildies what class would use it they suggested thief. So, having never played it, I’m hoping some nice people in the forum here can point me to some good builds that use those stats. I would like to use the thief mainly for WvW solo/small group roaming. I could also use it for PvE and/or dungeons if it would be viable. FYI – I do not PvP, so something that is just fun and fairly easy to play would be great. I don’t have to make a full set of ascended or use 100% Apothecary, but if I’m hoping to at least work in the armor somewhere.

I really wish the search function worked on this forum. Would have been nice to find this info myself :p Anyway, I will appreciate any and all suggestions.

http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?fYAQNAoYVlcmiP3ey8E+5EB3ji60m6p4rltTBWlPA-jUyAIOBRaBI5BgCBlHLiGb1sIas6Zioa1Nm5uIa1CBsYNA-w

Spam 3, dodge a lot, and don’t stray from Caltrops.

You won’t like it for PvE. For WvW roaming (solo or small group), you can slot it into any P/D condition-based build (which can easily leverage the stats on that piece).

You can use apothecary for one piece but otherwise make the rest dire for condition roaming builds.

LOL…. wow. Just looked at the health on that build, Viking. I’m used to playing warrior and necro. Seeing such low health numbers makes me scared :o I do realize though that thief is an in/out kind of class rather than an in-your-face kind. It will take some getting used to.

Thanks for the info so far! I’ll look in the build section for the type you describe Interceptor.

^ Welcome to Thief. We barely crack 10k base HP at level 80. However, note that he included a lot of Toughness (Armor gets up to 3000), and the playstyle involves a lot of healing during stealth and condition removal, so it’s workable in real situations.

But uhh, Applied Fortitude is probably going to be your friend regardless. And a lot of us will throw a little Vitality into a build if we need to.

ozmaniandevil.6805:

Hey all,

I have never played thief before. Decided to roll one when I got an ascended armor drop with Apothecary stats; when I asked guildies what class would use it they suggested thief. So, having never played it, I’m hoping some nice people in the forum here can point me to some good builds that use those stats. I would like to use the thief mainly for WvW solo/small group roaming. I could also use it for PvE and/or dungeons if it would be viable. FYI – I do not PvP, so something that is just fun and fairly easy to play would be great. I don’t have to make a full set of ascended or use 100% Apothecary, but if I’m hoping to at least work in the armor somewhere.

I really wish the search function worked on this forum. Would have been nice to find this info myself :p Anyway, I will appreciate any and all suggestions.

I use dire armour but with full apothecary accessories. healing power is 819 and I use signet of malice. works pretty well for me

Viking Jorun.5413:

http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?fYAQNAoYVlcmiP3ey8E+5EB3ji60m6p4rltTBWlPA-jUyAIOBRaBI5BgCBlHLiGb1sIas6Zioa1Nm5uIa1CBsYNA-w

Spam 3, dodge a lot, and don’t stray from Caltrops.

Wow, I thought I was the only one who used this build. Albeit I use Bountiful Theft instead of Long Reach, and run with Roll for Initiative usually instead of Blinding Powder. Though I’ll take Smokescreen instead of Roll for Initiative if I’m going to be up against anybody abusing projectiles or when soloing camps.

Btw, for some knowledge to you ozma, anything that procs a condition seems to also activate the healing on the Signet of Malice, so don’t be afraid to abuse the power of Caltrops and the SB#4 while in stealth, it really adds up the healing factor. Don’t be afraid to abuse Dagger Storm either in a group, the Signet will keep your health up. Especially nice if you Shadow Refuge before running in the group attacking while on Tower/Keep defense, since you can immediately rush back into the Tower/Keep near the end of the Dagger Storm to avoid getting ganked by CC. Though if the enemies are doing that perpetual Retaliation BS, you WILL need to back off fast to avoid killing yourself, as even that Signet of Malice can’t heal enough to stop the retal damage from doing a number on you (it can really only half the damage you’re taking from it at the least).

The build btw is also good for group support, since running with Bountiful Theft, Thrill of the Crime, and Shadow Protector can give the group some nice buffs. Plus spamming SB#2 while in any water fields while running with a skilled zerg can easily crank up the healing to where those getting hit by the water blast can easily get up to full health if you’re not being heavily fired upon.

This build IMO is the perfect WvW build for a thief. It’s good in small groups and zergs, and even good for soloing.

ozmaniandevil.6805:

LOL…. wow. Just looked at the health on that build, Viking. I’m used to playing warrior and necro. Seeing such low health numbers makes me scared :o I do realize though that thief is an in/out kind of class rather than an in-your-face kind. It will take some getting used to.

Thanks for the info so far! I’ll look in the build section for the type you describe Interceptor.

I’ve trolled an entire zerg of 17 NSP at one point on South Camp of our BL, killing 13 in 10 minutes before my zerg arrived to clean the rest up

Signet of Malice is OP against zergs.

You guys are giving me some great info. Much appreciated!

ozmaniandevil.6805:

LOL…. wow. Just looked at the health on that build, Viking. …

Armor and healing do for defence what power and criticals do for offence.

I’m using a 0/0/20/30/20, mixed equipment (Apothecary / Settler / Dire), with some cheap Shaman jewellery to get around 18k health.
A lot of toughness is good but imo after a while some vitality is better than even more toughness since it has diminishing returns.

Imho Assassin’s reward is better than Shadow’s rejuvenation if you are in a zerg or grouped (or soloing PvE) because you will heal more by spamming Death blossom’s than moving around in stealth. (One use of Death’s Blossom’s will heal more than 1 second of stealth.) For solo WvW or for situations where you can’t use Death blossoms (ex: where you could fall) and will switch to P/D, Shadow’s rejuvenation is probably better as you will want to stealth more often.

Even with with the recent Initiative recovery rate upgrade I keep Quick recovery (+1 intit. per 10s.); along with Rolling for initiative with reuse timer boosted by Trickster that will also apply for the reuse timer of Caltrops which is THE ultimate skill for an healing + condition thief.

Rolling for initiative also fits perfectly in the middle of a Death Blossom + dodges routine spam.

As it been said, Signet of Malice is the best choice of healing skill for this type of build (Caltrops, Death’s blossoms, Uncatchable, Dagger storm).

Also it may not be your favourite style of play but with these builds you can own hordes of mobs in solo PvE.
I was clearing the tower of Nightmare on any level and it was not because of my leet player skills but because that’s the sort of thing a good healing thief build enables you to do.

Ayochak.8293:

I’m using a 0/0/20/30/20, mixed equipment (Apothecary / Settler / Dire), with some cheap Shaman jewellery to get around 18k health.
A lot of toughness is good but imo after a while some vitality is better than even more toughness since it has diminishing returns.

Imho Assassin’s reward is better than Shadow’s rejuvenation if you are in a zerg or grouped (or soloing PvE) because you will heal more by spamming Death blossom’s than moving around in stealth. (One use of Death’s Blossom’s will heal more than 1 second of stealth.) For solo WvW or for situations where you can’t use Death blossoms (ex: where you could fall) and will switch to P/D, Shadow’s rejuvenation is probably better as you will want to stealth more often.

Even with with the recent Initiative recovery rate upgrade I keep Quick recovery (+1 intit. per 10s.); along with Rolling for initiative with reuse timer boosted by Trickster that will also apply for the reuse timer of Caltrops which is THE ultimate skill for an healing + condition thief.

Rolling for initiative also fits perfectly in the middle of a Death Blossom + dodges routine spam.

As it been said, Signet of Malice is the best choice of healing skill for this type of build (Caltrops, Death’s blossoms, Uncatchable, Dagger storm).

Also it may not be your favourite style of play but with these builds you can own hordes of mobs in solo PvE.
I was clearing the tower of Nightmare on any level and it was not because of my leet player skills but because that’s the sort of thing a good healing thief build enables you to do.

But toughness has absolutely no diminishing returns when paired with healing power, and in doing so increases your EHP exponentially with the more healing power you have. Vitality actually has diminishing returns when running a healing build, and is meant to be more of a damage sponge than anything, which decreases your survivability over time when your healing skill itself cannot bring you back to full health. This is why berserkers go for vitality over toughness, since most fights won’t last long enough to need to use a healing skill more than once. More tanky builds, which is the direction you should go with condition builds, rely a lot more on toughness over vitality, mixed with healing power to increase its potency. This is why Rabid necros exist over Carrion, since the trait line any condition necro takes has both condition damage and healing power.

It’s a common misconception since most thieves come from a berserker background and rarely do the math to see why people take vitality over toughness, or in what situations stats have diminishing returns. I don’t blame you for believing that vitality is better, but in this situation, I thought I would spread some light on the subject.

I’m playing S/D as a zerker myself atm but this looks rather interesting (WvW). I do feel rather squishy when in the zerg, even though I’ve learned to stay alive pretty well it’s ALOT of work for it, I am however pretty good in duels and taking camps. Trying a mix of apotechary and dire sounds nice, or is rabid something to go for? do you think I would feel slow solo capping camps compared to my zerker Sword build?

I got an apotechary weapon chest in the bank, would it be wise to take a pistol from it?

Viking Jorun.5413:

This is why Rabid necros exist over Carrion, since the trait line any condition necro takes has both condition damage and healing power.

Now that’s actually wrong; it’s condition damage and precision. Healing power and vitality are in a traitline that most Necros don’t really use, as it’s considered quite bad overall (at least in PvP/WvW) unless you want to trait well-cooldowns.

I think the reasons why Necros go for Rabid over Carrion are on-crit procs, their already high base-hp and the fact that Necro condition weapons scale absolutely terrible with power, thus the power on Carrion would be a complete waste.

That being said; what do you guys think about a P/D Thief going for mostly Carrion? I think it makes some difference in terms of direct damage added, since CnD and Pistol 1 scale decently with power afaik.

>>Rolling for initiative also fits perfectly in the middle of a Death Blossom + dodges routine spam.

I agree. I find it hard to keep RFI off my utility bar even with the enhanced INI regen.

It so useful as a stunbreak in a non stealth build and if one really has to create a gap a Withdraw, dodge RFI can put a lot of space between you and the opponent. The three conditions it cleans are an added bonus.

A very useful skill.

Hey so I went full on apothecary, but wanted to try playing the thief in PvE for a while first so I get the hang of it. I find it takes forever to kill anything with the build. Is there anything I can do to up the kill time without getting an entire new set of gear? Or if I should have an entirely different, zerker-type build for PvE what would you suggest?

^ Yeah, get gear with better damage on it. The only damaging stats you have on full Apoth is secondary condition damage; for PvE, the best way to leverage that is maybe a high-bleed build as either P/D or D/D, using things like Caltrops to help things along.

If you just care about leveling up, Berserker’s is the way to go, with Sword/Pisol. I don’t think that PvE will be good training for WvW, though. For thieves, they are very different styles.

Ok, thanks Interceptor. I used crafting to level right up to 80, so when I say I’m a noob I really mean it – at least as far as the thief goes! I should probably just jump right in to WvW. Worst that happens is I die a lot for the first while until I learn the ropes. I better not mention my server… everyone will be waiting for me… heh.

Thanks again

I would recommend that you start by watching some videos on P/D roaming in WvW, since that’s the most likely thing that you’ll be doing with Apothecary gear. Once you have an idea of what the style is like, it’s just a matter of practicing your fundamentals by giving lots of bags to your enemies in the process of learning.