Guild Wars 2

In PvP/WvW.

I think I recall using 30 in Acrobatics and 30 in Trickery as a viable S/P or S/D build, but how good is it really?

I imagine the 30 in Acrobatics is spread to the vigor trait upon heal, pain response, and quick pockets. I’m just unsure how much of DPS loss it is when you no longer have 30 in Critical Strikes.

Speaking of Acrobatics, does anyone actually use Hard to Catch? (Shadowsteps away if dazed/stunned/etc) Wouldn’t this trait be so much more useful if it simply break stun instead of teleporting?

I used to have 30 points in Acrobatics while playing S/D evade-spam. It worked well enough even with the Acrobatic traits being a little lackluster.

Hard to Catch is one of these traits you test again every few months, only to realize it still sucks as much as ever. Being randomly displaced is more like CCing yourself rather than being a counter.

Tachii.3506:

I imagine the 30 in Acrobatics is spread to the vigor trait upon heal, pain response, and quick pockets. I’m just unsure how much of DPS loss it is when you no longer have 30 in Critical Strikes.

It can be a fairly significant DPS loss, though you can still do some damage. Going x/x/x/30/30 does bring a lot in the way of survival and utility without relying heavily on stealth though.

I usually use the initiative regen trait instead of quick pockets, but that’s because I usually do s/d + sb.

I’ve never used hard to catch, but I always imagine it will just teleport me into the middle of a zerg or AoEs, so I never feel the need to bother trying it.

x/30/x/30/x with 10 points left over works just fine for sword mainhand builds.

Tachii.3506:

I think I recall using 30 in Acrobatics and 30 in Trickery as a viable S/P or S/D build, but how good is it really?

I imagine the 30 in Acrobatics is spread to the vigor trait upon heal, pain response, and quick pockets. I’m just unsure how much of DPS loss it is when you no longer have 30 in Critical Strikes.

You make up for the DPS loss with gear and food, when it comes to WvW. Assassin’s Reward is also an option for your GM trait. People like to make fun of its Healing Power ratio, but you’re also getting extra lift from Withdraw, Regen (from Pain Response), and Mug when you have a couple hundred points of HP.

Also keep in mind that Fluid Strikes and Lead Attacks are pretty good damage multiplier traits, especially considering how often that you’re using Sword #1.

Probably there will be a nice Quick Pockets build for S/D post-patch, with the independent Sigil cooldowns enabling you to combine things like Hydromancy, Battle, Intelligence, Leeching, whatever. I’ll be experimenting with one of these myself.

Speaking of Acrobatics, does anyone actually use Hard to Catch? (Shadowsteps away if dazed/stunned/etc) Wouldn’t this trait be so much more useful if it simply break stun instead of teleporting?

It would, but for some reason they don’t feel like giving us an auto-stunbreaker.

Now that they are throwing away the old trait system, and are no longer forced to have 2 GM traits, 4 Master traits etc, that should give them more flexibility to ultimately make HtC better than it is currently.

I’ve tried to use Acrobatics 30 a few times, but I just don’t feel like I get enough benefit out of it. Assassin’s Reward just feels too weak, and the healing power fades once initiative is all spent.

There’s a lot in there to boost dodging abilities, but I feel that it’s lacking enough in that respect. One of the main issues is that Dodging is shut down by immobilize, which is becoming increasingly common in PvP. Perhaps if we had some trait that allowed dodging to remove immobilize, it would be more useful. If Fleet of Foot was moved to Grandmaster tier, and removed 2 conditions of all types, then we might see a reason to go 30 in acrobatics.

The problem is…just so many of the Acrobatic Traits are kitten

assin’s Retreat is basically pointless. Master Trapper is only good if you like traps, which I don’t feel are potent enough. Pain Response doesn’t help much against condition spam builds as bleeds just stack right back up. Hard to Catch actually hurts the thief more than helps. Assassin’s Reward is simply too weak of healing to be useful. And Quick Pockets just doesn’t provide enough Initiative.

I like 30 Acrobatics for S/D + D/P. The damage is significantly lower than with 25 in Deadly Arts, but with those extra dodges and condition removal (which really does help VS condition nukes when they bring you down below 75% health) you have what you need to last much longer - often longer than is necessary to get the kill. You can hold nodes long enough to kill a far point bunker. The low-stealth uptime contributes toward capturing nodes. The mobility is great, and very useful for team fights. 15+ Acrobatics with D/P is a counter to the ever increasing number of hammer/longbow warriors and pistol whip thieves. The cleave on sword with the condition removal and extra dodges allows you to stay in fights against spirit rangers and turret engineers long enough to, and quickly get rid of their pets and turrets before re-focusing on the player. 25 Acrobatics is a fair damage bonus of +10%. The extra health is defense against burst. Assassin’s Reward contributes to your survivability somewhat, although I do have to say it should be made stronger because it is currently a grand master trait about 33% weaker than the regeneration boon. Quick pockets can also be helpful if you’re using D/P alternate, so you can be sure to get the initiative you need to stealth and escape a 1vX if need be.

I like 30 in acro for WvW with S/P since most people will focus a thief especially if he seldom if ever stealths, so I just dodge around all day to kitten ’em off.

Also never use assassin’s reward or hard to catch as both are absolute garbage (Especially assassin’s reward).

WonderfulCT.6278:

Also never use assassin’s reward or hard to catch as both are absolute garbage (Especially assassin’s reward).

Assassin’s Reward is not that bad. Your options for healing are limited as a Sword-user with deep Acrobatics — especially if you can’t use SoM effectively — and over time the health return is roughly equivalent to what you’d get from Mug.

It could be better as a GM trait, for sure, but calling it “absolute garbage” is hyperbolic nonsense.

I just started a thief and I’ve been trying to come up with a viable WvW build that does not rely on stealth. But everything I come up with – well, stelth would just be better.

I really want to make a pressure thief – like the old pressure Sin builds from GW1. But can’t quite find the right combo.

You all will probably laugh but I’m trying 10/0/10/30/20 now.

The only time I ever spec for 30 Acro is when I was trolling with the endless dodge build.

Johje Holan.4607:

I just started a thief and I’ve been trying to come up with a viable WvW build that does not rely on stealth. But everything I come up with - well, stelth would just be better.

I really want to make a pressure thief - like the old pressure Sin builds from GW1. But can’t quite find the right combo.

You all will probably laugh but I’m trying 10/0/10/30/20 now.

I find the best way to apply pressure is with evasive builds. Stealth can be pressuring, but only to a squishy because they’ll be worrying about that back stab. Against non-squishies, time in stealth is merely time they get to spend healing; they won’t be worrying too much and therefore won’t be pressured. An evasive and constantly attacking build can pressure anyone. The most important skills for this, I’ve found, are Flanking Strike+Larcenous Strike, and Shadow Shot. Shadow shot is amazing, I always feel kitten when I don’t take D/P. Blind on demand, gap closer, decent damage, and key to beating those stun warriors.

Acrobatics is the best way to leave stealth builds behind. Still, it has many drawbacks and overall isn’t as effective kitten for defenses but it puts up a very fair fight. Problem is many SA traits are on command and something you can really count on while acrobatics are more so background noise that wiggle you away from melting.

Stealth breaks target entirely and lets you position yourself more freely while acrobatics lets you bounce around more freely while giving you some neat stats (universal defense vitality and boon duration).

I prefer a mix of the 2 (x/x/20/20/x) in some builds, since I don’t like to sit around in stealth for more than a few seconds but I don’t care for more than 2 of the acrobatics traits for defense. Wish fleet of foot was a single condi clear every 10 seconds, then I would gladly spec 30 and say “so long SA and last refuge!”.

Thanks everyone. I also think the grandmaster traits right now is a bit lackluster. And Fleet of Foot (or whatever one it was that remove immob on dodge) certainly should remove the internal cooldown at least. That’d give a dilemna decision for Pain Response, since it seems it’s the typical favourite for the master trait.

It just doesn’t seem like 30 in acrobatics is the style for me.

Quick pockets is probably the most useful GM trait out of the whole lot really, and I think you can accumulate a decent amount of Might Stacks with Power of Inertia.

If you also want a good amount of HP instead of Toughness especially if you put 0 into Shadow Arts, then it is still viable even though putting 30 in Trickery or elsewhere may be more useful. (Practiced Tolerance in CS)