Assassin Signet and what comes next
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C’mon its not that bad. More builds just became accessible. I wouldn’t mind more ‘nerfs’ if they will be like this.
Well, our sword/dagger is useless, sword/pistol is nerfed, pistol/pistol is far from useful(does not harms thief at best), bow is used as a gataway weapon, and sometimes as aoe condition support(which fails against anyone with purge/condition removal). And despite Assassin’s Signet nerf(which is a backstab build nerf) people still demand backstab nerf.
So yeah, maybe not this and maybe not even the next month, but in the end thief is going to be nerfed into the ground.
nerf of backastab build it’s ok in comparison of other classes survivability,i like that they change signet and not skill itself,with this change they have reduced burst damage in general and open that signet to more ways of use,i’m a thief backstabber and i like this nerf,it’s right
Unless… and stay with me on this… you don’t be an idiot and instead you should save your most powerful attacks for the signet? I dunno… requires a bit more thought than getting B1G N4MB3R2 PWN4G3 but with certain attacks it will do more damage than the old signet. I know, it can be difficult doing more than looking at your highest number skill and clicking signet before it. But you can do it kitten
The thing is, the % damage bonus scales exponentially with Might and CritDmg.
Since you can get up to 25stacks of Might for ~5 seconds and 100% crit rate on a single attack, that 50% on the tooltip actually became closer to 200% in actual usage.There’s just no way to sustain those Might and Crit buffs for 5 attacks, so the damage potential WAS nerfed.
You have to look past the tooltip number to the actual damage formula interaction to get a full picture.
But really, who cares if it was nerfed. It was never practical to pop every ability you have in order to buff a single attack and then have precisely 0 utility until all your cooldowns were up again.
And it’s actually better for several other builds now.
Finally someone else who understands it’s not as simple as “+15% over 5 attacks is +75% damage, it’s better!” When you factor in things like traits for short duration buffs, and crit damage scaling the damage reduction becomes much more dramatic.
Like with the pistol whip nerf, the base damage dropped by 15% but the damage in glass cannon builds dropped by more like 30% because of crits, power, and all those other scaling effects.
Pistol whip used to have a tooltip damage for me of 3300something, now it’s 2400something. That’s 27% Then factor in those 250% crit damage hits.. Pistol whip for 10k did NOT get reduced to 8500 as a 15% reduction would indicate, but 6.5-7k.
For assassin signet, you’re still likely going to lose damage in the long run and especially lose burst damage on backstabs because of those compounding scaling effects.
Is the signet more viable for other builds now like pistol whip or unload? Sure, pistol whip is still neutered even with assassin signet, but once every 45s you’ll get an 8500-9000 pistol whip that is what would be more representative of a “15% reduction” instead of a 30-40% reduction, and unload gets about a 10% overall boost once every 45s, and spamming 5 heartseekers in a row will do probably more damage than it ever has done before, once every 45s.
But for backstab builds, don’t pretend it was a buff.
Zapp – 80 Asura Afromancer
I don’t know what’s next, but I’m starting to believe that I know what awaits thiefs at the end of the tunnel. In the end, we’ll have pillow for weapon and 1hp.
People complaining on the forums have managed to get their way getting thieves nerfed every single patch. There is blood in the water now, nerfs will never stop until we’re all autoattacking and autoattack roots us in place.
People know it gets results so they just keep playing squeaky wheel and a certain Anet dev in charge of “balance” obliges, as long as thieves keep the attention away from his babby warriors.
Zapp – 80 Asura Afromancer
C’mon its not that bad. More builds just became accessible. I wouldn’t mind more ‘nerfs’ if they will be like this.
Well, our sword/dagger is useless, sword/pistol is nerfed, pistol/pistol is far from useful(does not harms thief at best), bow is used as a gataway weapon, and sometimes as aoe condition support(which fails against anyone with purge/condition removal). And despite Assassin’s Signet nerf(which is a backstab build nerf) people still demand backstab nerf.
So yeah, maybe not this and maybe not even the next month, but in the end thief is going to be nerfed into the ground.
Lol, your version of useless is pretty much every class’s definition of ‘above average’. Just because we have to spend a few more seconds killing someone now does not make us useless.
Btw, I also play a necromancer, and sometimes a guardian. Lets compare your version of ‘useless’ to our versions of ‘useless’.
(edited by Derk.3189)
I don’t know what’s next, but I’m starting to believe that I know what awaits thiefs at the end of the tunnel. In the end, we’ll have pillow for weapon and 1hp.
People complaining on the forums have managed to get their way getting thieves nerfed every single patch. There is blood in the water now, nerfs will never stop until we’re all autoattacking and autoattack roots us in place.
People know it gets results so they just keep playing squeaky wheel and a certain Anet dev in charge of “balance” obliges, as long as thieves keep the attention away from his babby warriors.
Why on earth do you think its ok that a class can do 10k+ damage in ONE hit?
I don’t know what’s next, but I’m starting to believe that I know what awaits thiefs at the end of the tunnel. In the end, we’ll have pillow for weapon and 1hp.
People complaining on the forums have managed to get their way getting thieves nerfed every single patch. There is blood in the water now, nerfs will never stop until we’re all autoattacking and autoattack roots us in place.
People know it gets results so they just keep playing squeaky wheel and a certain Anet dev in charge of “balance” obliges, as long as thieves keep the attention away from his babby warriors.
Why on earth do you think its ok that a class can do 10k+ damage in ONE hit?
“One hit” is relative. The problem is that BS damage is heavy to compensate for what is supposed to be a tactically challenging “set up”, but certain combos allow that set up to be completely mitigated (mainly stealth+C&D closer). This transitions a back-loaded combo (work to get into position and do mediocre damage which is then made up for by the rewarding end-strike) into a heavily front-loaded combo (jump in and hit hard as the first thing you do). Once you’ve got a front-loaded high-damage hit the balance is even further thrown off by the ability to continue to front-load activated effects, which is what ultimately throws BS out of whack.
There’s nothing fundamentally wrong with a high-damage hit, but what I expect was a completely unanticipated combo managed to tweak the natural balance points of back stab in particular.
I don’t know what’s next, but I’m starting to believe that I know what awaits thiefs at the end of the tunnel. In the end, we’ll have pillow for weapon and 1hp.
People complaining on the forums have managed to get their way getting thieves nerfed every single patch. There is blood in the water now, nerfs will never stop until we’re all autoattacking and autoattack roots us in place.
People know it gets results so they just keep playing squeaky wheel and a certain Anet dev in charge of “balance” obliges, as long as thieves keep the attention away from his babby warriors.
Why on earth do you think its ok that a class can do 10k+ damage in ONE hit?
“One hit” is relative. The problem is that BS damage is heavy to compensate for what is supposed to be a tactically challenging “set up”, but certain combos allow that set up to be completely mitigated (mainly stealth+C&D closer). This transitions a back-loaded combo (work to get into position and do mediocre damage which is then made up for by the rewarding end-strike) into a heavily front-loaded combo (jump in and hit hard as the first thing you do). Once you’ve got a front-loaded high-damage hit the balance is even further thrown off by the ability to continue to front-load activated effects, which is what ultimately throws BS out of whack.
There’s nothing fundamentally wrong with a high-damage hit, but what I expect was a completely unanticipated combo managed to tweak the natural balance points of back stab in particular.
But that’s exactly why there IS a problem with high-damage hits. Every other class in this game operates on a different level of effort = payoff. I actually have backstab killed someone with my eyes closed.
I see someone with back facing me. I click on him and move to range. I close my eyes.
F1→5→X(Assassin’s Signet)→1. Enemy downed.
The funny thing is, if gold farmers wanted to, they could probably program bots to do exactly the same thing, with extremely high levels of success.
I don’t know what’s next, but I’m starting to believe that I know what awaits thiefs at the end of the tunnel. In the end, we’ll have pillow for weapon and 1hp.
People complaining on the forums have managed to get their way getting thieves nerfed every single patch. There is blood in the water now, nerfs will never stop until we’re all autoattacking and autoattack roots us in place.
People know it gets results so they just keep playing squeaky wheel and a certain Anet dev in charge of “balance” obliges, as long as thieves keep the attention away from his babby warriors.
Why on earth do you think its ok that a class can do 10k+ damage in ONE hit?
“One hit” is relative. The problem is that BS damage is heavy to compensate for what is supposed to be a tactically challenging “set up”, but certain combos allow that set up to be completely mitigated (mainly stealth+C&D closer). This transitions a back-loaded combo (work to get into position and do mediocre damage which is then made up for by the rewarding end-strike) into a heavily front-loaded combo (jump in and hit hard as the first thing you do). Once you’ve got a front-loaded high-damage hit the balance is even further thrown off by the ability to continue to front-load activated effects, which is what ultimately throws BS out of whack.
There’s nothing fundamentally wrong with a high-damage hit, but what I expect was a completely unanticipated combo managed to tweak the natural balance points of back stab in particular.
But that’s exactly why there IS a problem with high-damage hits. Every other class in this game operates on a different level of effort = payoff. I actually have backstab killed someone with my eyes closed.
I see someone with back facing me. I click on him and move to range. I close my eyes.
F1->5->X(Assassin’s Signet)->1. Enemy downed.The funny thing is, if gold farmers wanted to, they could probably program bots to do exactly the same thing, with extremely high levels of success.
That isn’t a problem with backstab, that is a problem with an ability combo negating the build-in balance counterpoints to backstab (and, in some respects the pre-nerf Assassin’s Signet). On its own, BS is pretty well balanced
And a bot that could kill one mob every 30+ seconds would be pretty terrible, not that what they’re using now is much better.
I don’t know what’s next, but I’m starting to believe that I know what awaits thiefs at the end of the tunnel. In the end, we’ll have pillow for weapon and 1hp.
People complaining on the forums have managed to get their way getting thieves nerfed every single patch. There is blood in the water now, nerfs will never stop until we’re all autoattacking and autoattack roots us in place.
People know it gets results so they just keep playing squeaky wheel and a certain Anet dev in charge of “balance” obliges, as long as thieves keep the attention away from his babby warriors.
Why on earth do you think its ok that a class can do 10k+ damage in ONE hit?
“One hit” is relative. The problem is that BS damage is heavy to compensate for what is supposed to be a tactically challenging “set up”, but certain combos allow that set up to be completely mitigated (mainly stealth+C&D closer). This transitions a back-loaded combo (work to get into position and do mediocre damage which is then made up for by the rewarding end-strike) into a heavily front-loaded combo (jump in and hit hard as the first thing you do). Once you’ve got a front-loaded high-damage hit the balance is even further thrown off by the ability to continue to front-load activated effects, which is what ultimately throws BS out of whack.
There’s nothing fundamentally wrong with a high-damage hit, but what I expect was a completely unanticipated combo managed to tweak the natural balance points of back stab in particular.
But that’s exactly why there IS a problem with high-damage hits. Every other class in this game operates on a different level of effort = payoff. I actually have backstab killed someone with my eyes closed.
I see someone with back facing me. I click on him and move to range. I close my eyes.
F1->5->X(Assassin’s Signet)->1. Enemy downed.The funny thing is, if gold farmers wanted to, they could probably program bots to do exactly the same thing, with extremely high levels of success.
That isn’t a problem with backstab, that is a problem with an ability combo negating the build-in balance counterpoints to backstab (and, in some respects the pre-nerf Assassin’s Signet). On its own, BS is pretty well balanced
And a bot that could kill one mob every 30+ seconds would be pretty terrible, not that what they’re using now is much better.
Nah, if they added their bots to sPvP. When Fort Aspenwood in GW1 became lucrative to farm with bots, it was flooded with bots. If sPvP had anything that could translate into a profitable product, it will be flooded with bots too.
I find it ridiculous that mug deals as much damage as it does. Look at terror, somewhat the necromancer equivalent of mug. It does 1.5x poison damage per second of fear. You can go out of your way to get 4 seconds of fear if you completely base your build around it.
Thats around 1k damage, and thats if you are downed btw, because the Death Shroud fear will only get to 2 seconds! Whoopdy do! Class balance! See what I mean when I say thieves are effortless to do well with? Yes, backstab might not be the problem, but nothing can take it out of the equation of the actual problem now.
The class has been balanced as of last patch.
Nothing left to fix except for channeled attacks still locking on when in stealth and addressing the rendering issue in WvW.
I don’t know what’s next, but I’m starting to believe that I know what awaits thiefs at the end of the tunnel. In the end, we’ll have pillow for weapon and 1hp.
People complaining on the forums have managed to get their way getting thieves nerfed every single patch. There is blood in the water now, nerfs will never stop until we’re all autoattacking and autoattack roots us in place.
People know it gets results so they just keep playing squeaky wheel and a certain Anet dev in charge of “balance” obliges, as long as thieves keep the attention away from his babby warriors.
Why on earth do you think its ok that a class can do 10k+ damage in ONE hit?
hundred blades, evis, and don’t tell me because that’s a combo it’s okay, it’s still 1 skill.
Zapp – 80 Asura Afromancer
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