Guild Wars 2

Is there going to be such a thing? I play like Yashis. I like to 1v5 or more. D/D + S/D atm.

I am running valk armor, divinity runes, berserker everything else.

I just got ascended back piece and rings/ammy for thief as well. Only missing earrings and now my class gets nerfed.

I feel like that since our class is losing at least 20% the amount of time in stealth due the nerf that there won’t be a spot for the “balanced” thief anymore.

We will have to go completely glass or condition. After nerf thief won’t be able to stay in a fight even with all defensive traits because we will be forced to be visible way more often. There won’t be such a thing as using CND to gain positioning.

I think we will be forced to kill something quickly and run like hell, which sounds more like a glass cannon to me than a balanced thief.

Forget thief in spvp, if they can’t stealth as much they will eat my HB combo much easier from my warrior. This change practically nullifies the thief in spvp imo.

How else are people preparing to deal with the nerf? I think I will have to completely change the way I play the game as a thief. Thank you ANet, just what I wanted.

EDIT: I was playing my thief this weekend and I was solo as usual. Some ranger I killed invites me to group and the first thing he says is “I can’t wait for your playstyle to get nerfed.”

Funny thing is, I never “abused” cnd against him, not once. I killed him flat out with regular revealed and using stealth attack every time.

Our class is getting nerfed because of kittens like this guy, really?

Hopefully they do not cater to the bad players and go through with the nerf. A lot of people will legit quit the class.

No one wants to play a weaker Warrior.

Good thieves will be fine. Baddies will quit. If u wanna play attrition u can still play p/d successfully. U were never meant to zerg surf ad infinitum with almost zero risk. Now you’ll have to think and plan like the rest of us.

If this is tough for you, maybe you should start preparing emotionally for the mug nerf. I seriously hope u guys get some buffs as well.

Lulz at CnD chaining being “balanced”

You have sword, use that Infiltrator’s Strike/Shadow Return, man. I find I don’t even need stealth with over half of my encounters if I use that properly.

Stealth is not the only utility that Thieves have. Most of our weapon skills provide evasion on top of our normal dodge. My thief will not be affected that much by this change.

Just saying, this change is a huge playstyle nerf for the balanced thief. Possibly killing the build all together…

I think the “balanced” thief will be a thing of the past and from now on you are either playing condition or glass.

This change hurts build diversity and lessens the value of all “stealth” traits. I didn’t see any buffs from ANet to our class in compensation for the huge nerf.

I honestly think that the “balanced” thief will be a thing of the past now because of this change.

What about sPvP thieves? For real, with the nerf in spvp thieves will be free points. The second they come out of stealth and I know their stun break is down they are eating HB+frenzy+bull charge. As it is now, thieves are pretty easy to beat in spvp. After change I think thieves won’t have a place in spvp.

EDIT: I’m not trying discuss the change itself but rather what people are thinking about changing to adapt to it. I think the change is kitten and shouldn’t an issues. I would have told all the QQers “L2P”, but ANet listened to you. You have already won. I am trying to learn to live with it.

What about shadow return when fighting a warrior? Not to mention, in my build at least, that GS warrior noob combo MAY take me to 25% health even if I just eat the whole thing …. MAYBE.

Switch to D/P. More unified, more mobile, more utility, and you can sit in the smoke field for the full duration of revealed.

swinsk.6410:

Just saying, this change is a huge playstyle nerf for the balanced thief. Possibly killing the build all together…

I think the “balanced” thief will be a thing of the past and from now on you are either playing condition or glass.

This change hurts build diversity and lessens the value of all “stealth” traits. I didn’t see any buffs from ANet to our class in compensation for the huge nerf.

I honestly think that the “balanced” thief will be a thing of the past now because of this change.

What about sPvP thieves? For real, with the nerf in spvp thieves will be free points. The second they come out of stealth and I know their stun break is down they are eating HB+frenzy+bull charge. As it is now, thieves are pretty easy to beat in spvp. After change I think thieves won’t have a place in spvp.

EDIT: I’m not trying discuss the change itself but rather what people are thinking about changing to adapt to it. I think the change is kitten and shouldn’t an issues. I would have told all the QQers “L2P”, but ANet listened to you. You have already won. I am trying to learn to live with it.

….
Playing in Soldier runes is balanced….many thieves drop into Soldiers to get some staying power.

I really wonder about this balanced thief because it doesn’t sound anything of the sort if you care about this nerf. In wvw S/D dazes for 3s, reveal last 3s. Doing the math…hmmm.. It’s not an issue there.

I run S/P + Shortbow a good 70% of the time, going S/D + Shortbow the other 30%.
As an S/P my Stealth skills are His and SR. I spend, VERY little time in stealth.
If you’re build is so contingent on stealth, that this change destroys it, is not balanced or you do not know how to play it to significant potential.
There isn’t a pletheora of thieves playing sword in tpvp off the top of my head I can pull out Ackwin and Sinoctis wave? Everyone else is on the D/P time with a couple D/D’s generally low ranked. Stealth is not that big a deal. Whether they are playing in Soldier runes and being far sturdy than you are as “balanced” or Berserker. They don’t just drop dead. Learn to manipulate Inf strike, and a warrior isn’t bursting you with a great sword until you’re out of initiative to begin or pre-occupied. Survived warriors at 4k hp, in frenzy just by pressing 2 and warping out. If you’re running a tanker spec it’s not even debatable. Now Whirling strike is a threat. Hundred blades? Meh.

Greatsword warriors are easily kited by the shortbow. Hundred blades is with no doubt the least of your worries. In fact the whole frenzy +HB combo, get’s ignored by Two uses of Distracting shot even if you are immobilized.
You run S/D + D/D.
Interesting tip, Cast Inf strike without a target if you so please. You now have a stun break and to boot will move away from him if immobilized. If immobilized you can D/D Deathblossom or Flanking strike to mitigate damage.

I really won’t have to change anything other than ceasing to chain CnD’s on a Shadow arts S/D build. Don’t waste stealth, if the hit isn’t going to happen then just reposition yourself. It’s only 3 seconds. the 3/4s you were in stealth will of recovered 15-40% of your endurance depending on vigor. Running daggers, 1 auto will boost that up significantly. You get 3s of reveal which you can just dodge through. You can basically easily get 1 dodge whenever you so feel after Stealthing with a dodge wasting 1s. If 2s of vulnerability is too much for you to handle at all, brah.
Step your game up.

swinsk.6410:

Just saying, this change is a huge playstyle nerf for the balanced thief. Possibly killing the build all together…

I think the “balanced” thief will be a thing of the past and from now on you are either playing condition or glass.

This change hurts build diversity and lessens the value of all “stealth” traits. I didn’t see any buffs from ANet to our class in compensation for the huge nerf.

I honestly think that the “balanced” thief will be a thing of the past now because of this change.

What about sPvP thieves? For real, with the nerf in spvp thieves will be free points. The second they come out of stealth and I know their stun break is down they are eating HB+frenzy+bull charge. As it is now, thieves are pretty easy to beat in spvp. After change I think thieves won’t have a place in spvp.

EDIT: I’m not trying discuss the change itself but rather what people are thinking about changing to adapt to it. I think the change is kitten and shouldn’t an issues. I would have told all the QQers “L2P”, but ANet listened to you. You have already won. I am trying to learn to live with it.

err…if a warrior bull charge, steal from his teammate to get out of range…yes you can activate steal while KD’d. Besides, what’s your teammate doing allowing a thief engage first? sigh

Please, use examples from smart thieves, not from bad ones, because it only further reinforcae the fact that this change will weed out the baddies.

ensoriki.5789:

swinsk.6410:

Just saying, this change is a huge playstyle nerf for the balanced thief. Possibly killing the build all together…

I think the “balanced” thief will be a thing of the past and from now on you are either playing condition or glass.

This change hurts build diversity and lessens the value of all “stealth” traits. I didn’t see any buffs from ANet to our class in compensation for the huge nerf.

I honestly think that the “balanced” thief will be a thing of the past now because of this change.

What about sPvP thieves? For real, with the nerf in spvp thieves will be free points. The second they come out of stealth and I know their stun break is down they are eating HB+frenzy+bull charge. As it is now, thieves are pretty easy to beat in spvp. After change I think thieves won’t have a place in spvp.

EDIT: I’m not trying discuss the change itself but rather what people are thinking about changing to adapt to it. I think the change is kitten and shouldn’t an issues. I would have told all the QQers “L2P”, but ANet listened to you. You have already won. I am trying to learn to live with it.

….
Playing in Soldier runes is balanced….many thieves drop into Soldiers to get some staying power.

I really wonder about this balanced thief because it doesn’t sound anything of the sort if you care about this nerf. In wvw S/D dazes for 3s, reveal last 3s. Doing the math…hmmm.. It’s not an issue there.

I run S/P + Shortbow a good 70% of the time, going S/D + Shortbow the other 30%.
As an S/P my Stealth skills are His and SR. I spend, VERY little time in stealth.
If you’re build is so contingent on stealth, that this change destroys it, is not balanced or you do not know how to play it to significant potential.
There isn’t a pletheora of thieves playing sword in tpvp off the top of my head I can pull out Ackwin and Sinoctis wave? Everyone else is on the D/P time with a couple D/D’s generally low ranked. Stealth is not that big a deal. Whether they are playing in Soldier runes and being far sturdy than you are as “balanced” or Berserker. They don’t just drop dead. Learn to manipulate Inf strike, and a warrior isn’t bursting you with a great sword until you’re out of initiative to begin or pre-occupied. Survived warriors at 4k hp, in frenzy just by pressing 2 and warping out. If you’re running a tanker spec it’s not even debatable. Now Whirling strike is a threat. Hundred blades? Meh.

Greatsword warriors are easily kited by the shortbow. Hundred blades is with no doubt the least of your worries. In fact the whole frenzy +HB combo, get’s ignored by Two uses of Distracting shot even if you are immobilized.
You run S/D + D/D.
Interesting tip, Cast Inf strike without a target if you so please. You now have a stun break and to boot will move away from him if immobilized. If immobilized you can D/D Deathblossom or Flanking strike to mitigate damage.

I really won’t have to change anything other than ceasing to chain CnD’s on a Shadow arts S/D build. Don’t waste stealth, if the hit isn’t going to happen then just reposition yourself. It’s only 3 seconds. the 3/4s you were in stealth will of recovered 15-40% of your endurance depending on vigor. Running daggers, 1 auto will boost that up significantly. You get 3s of reveal which you can just dodge through. You can basically easily get 1 dodge whenever you so feel after Stealthing with a dodge wasting 1s. If 2s of vulnerability is too much for you to handle at all, brah.
Step your game up.

Just three simple questions.

Which mode do you play more; WvW or s/tPvP? Do you play S/P in WvW? Do you solo, play ikittenmain, or follow the commander?

Thanks

Tpvp. Yup, far more S/D in WvW however, depends if I feel to retrait. ikittenmain? wot? I get a group of 5-10 people which is enough to a) do smaller objectives in the case of a 5 man group and b) take on towers successfully in the 10.

Well, I can speak from experience that everything Ensoriki has stated is correct and…

1. Which mode do you play more?
(I play them pretty equally)

2. Do you play S/P in WvW?
(No I play S/D as does he, so he stated.)

3. Do you solo?
(Almost exclusively, with the occasional duo. I avoid commanders and the rubbish that follow them.)

EDIT – credited the wrong individual with stating correct data.

Maugetarr.6823:

Switch to D/P. More unified, more mobile, more utility, and you can sit in the smoke field for the full duration of revealed.

Yea I was talking with some people in another forum and this seemed to be the best answer.

I really hate pistol offhand. I think it looks stupid and I am not a find of blinding powder.

I think this is going to be the best option though.

swinsk.6410:

Just saying, this change is a huge playstyle nerf for the balanced thief. Possibly killing the build all together…

I think the “balanced” thief will be a thing of the past and from now on you are either playing condition or glass.

This change hurts build diversity and lessens the value of all “stealth” traits. I didn’t see any buffs from ANet to our class in compensation for the huge nerf.

I honestly think that the “balanced” thief will be a thing of the past now because of this change.

What about sPvP thieves? For real, with the nerf in spvp thieves will be free points. The second they come out of stealth and I know their stun break is down they are eating HB+frenzy+bull charge. As it is now, thieves are pretty easy to beat in spvp. After change I think thieves won’t have a place in spvp.

EDIT: I’m not trying discuss the change itself but rather what people are thinking about changing to adapt to it. I think the change is kitten and shouldn’t an issues. I would have told all the QQers “L2P”, but ANet listened to you. You have already won. I am trying to learn to live with it.

just check my “non stealth” thief build , has vids to
now imagine if i would use a little stealth in the build ….

sure thiefs perma stealth builds get a hit , but its still viable for pvp just need to find other play styles/ builds

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/PVP-bunker-dodger-build-v2-NEW-Vids/first#post1650816

Sifu.6527:

Just three simple questions.

Which mode do you play more; WvW or s/tPvP? Do you play S/P in WvW? Do you solo, play ikittenmain, or follow the commander?

Thanks

I thought I cleared this up in the original post by saying “I play like Yashis”.

I solo.
I play wvw.

I roam and take supply camps solo or cut off players attempting to get to objectives. I play like a lone assassin.

I also do spvp but my spvp build is currently P/D condition spec.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

err…if a warrior bull charge, steal from his teammate to get out of range…yes you can activate steal while KD’d. Besides, what’s your teammate doing allowing a thief engage first? sigh

Please, use examples from smart thieves, not from bad ones, because it only further reinforcae the fact that this change will weed out the baddies.

And the same thing can be said about thieves who use Cnd->CnD, learn to adapt to it like you have suggested for bull charge/frenzy/hb.

There is nothing a thief can do about bull charge/frenzy/hb when all of his utilities are on CD. He dies. Previously, he could try to stealth quickly before getting eaten up, but now warriors and other classes will have 3s to apply CC and kitten the thief.

Warriors who frenzy/bull charge/hb on inc vs. thief obviously don’t know what they are doing or don’t play a thief.

In sPVP, thieves will be much easier to kill without the extra stealth. I think the biggest hit to thief will be in sPVP arenas.

EDIT: When I first started playing I died to HB/Bull charge a ton of times before I figured out what stun breaks were and that I could use steal while knocked down. Yes, I died over and over and instead of coming to these boards asking for nerf to warriors I learned how to play.

swinsk.6410:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

err…if a warrior bull charge, steal from his teammate to get out of range…yes you can activate steal while KD’d. Besides, what’s your teammate doing allowing a thief engage first? sigh

Please, use examples from smart thieves, not from bad ones, because it only further reinforcae the fact that this change will weed out the baddies.

And the same thing can be said about thieves who use Cnd->CnD, learn to adapt to it like you have suggested for bull charge/frenzy/hb.

There is nothing a thief can do about bull charge/frenzy/hb when all of his utilities are on CD. He dies. Previously, he could try to stealth quickly before getting eaten up, but now warriors and other classes will have 3s to apply CC and kitten the thief.

Warriors who frenzy/bull charge/hb on inc vs. thief obviously don’t know what they are doing or don’t play a thief.

In sPVP, thieves will be much easier to kill without the extra stealth. I think the biggest hit to thief will be in sPVP arenas.

If you are playing your thief correctly, in a fight vs a GS warrior, Shadow Return is NEVER on CD. If you’re still running a glassy dagger build, then death is deserved.

swinsk.6410:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

err…if a warrior bull charge, steal from his teammate to get out of range…yes you can activate steal while KD’d. Besides, what’s your teammate doing allowing a thief engage first? sigh

Please, use examples from smart thieves, not from bad ones, because it only further reinforcae the fact that this change will weed out the baddies.

And the same thing can be said about thieves who use Cnd->CnD, learn to adapt to it like you have suggested for bull charge/frenzy/hb.

There is nothing a thief can do about bull charge/frenzy/hb when all of his utilities are on CD. He dies. Previously, he could try to stealth quickly before getting eaten up, but now warriors and other classes will have 3s to apply CC and kitten the thief.

Warriors who frenzy/bull charge/hb on inc vs. thief obviously don’t know what they are doing or don’t play a thief.

In sPVP, thieves will be much easier to kill without the extra stealth. I think the biggest hit to thief will be in sPVP arenas.

EDIT: When I first started playing I died to HB/Bull charge a ton of times before I figured out what stun breaks were and that I could use steal while knocked down. Yes, I died over and over and instead of coming to these boards asking for nerf to warriors I learned how to play.

It’s called distracting shot and shadow return.
If you have Sleight of Hand then Steal.
What you’re saying makes no sense…Previously you could stealth quickly to prevent being eaten up. Stealth when? After being hit by Bulls? Wot?
You don’t need stun breaks. Just cripple them and at worst just play the field with Inf strike.
Generally warriors run Leg specialist if they’re serious about that HB burst so they don’t have to rely on Bulls charge to kill you. Otherwise you don’t have much to worry about.

You can also evade the rush with Flanking strike… screw it over with Black Powder, dodge over him with Death Blossom…
Since you do S/D + D/D. Just play Inf strike.

Adaneshade.2409:

If you are playing your thief correctly, in a fight vs a GS warrior, Shadow Return is NEVER on CD. If you’re still running a glassy dagger build, then death is deserved.

You obviously don’t play a warrior because I make thieves blow shadowstep on inc.

I run sword/shield + gs with 5s weapon swap timer.

I simply get in close, use my sword adrenaline skill to root them, swap to GS and use HB without frenzy/bc. Either they shadowstep away or die to HB. Root lasts 4.5s and HB takes 3.5 to cast, so it’s long enough to hit the entire combo.

This will make 90% of thieves drop shadowstep to get out of it. Then I just wait for HB CD and and bull charge them to death next time the pop out of stealth.

swinsk.6410:

Adaneshade.2409:

If you are playing your thief correctly, in a fight vs a GS warrior, Shadow Return is NEVER on CD. If you’re still running a glassy dagger build, then death is deserved.

You obviously don’t play a warrior because I make thieves blow shadowstep on inc.

I run sword/shield + gs with 5s weapon swap timer.

I simply get in close, use my sword adrenaline skill to root them, swap to GS and use HB without frenzy/bc. Either they shadowstep away or die to HB. Root lasts 4.5s and HB takes 3.5 to cast, so it’s long enough to hit the entire combo.

This will make 90% of thieves drop shadowstep to get out of it. Then I just wait for HB CD and and bull charge them to death next time the pop out of stealth.

Not referring to the utility skill, Sword’s #2 does the EXACT SAME THING and is never on CD.

The skill to port back to starting position is called [Shadow Return], just like it is for [Shadow Step]’s secondary.

Use infiltrator’s strike on inc > warrior attempts burst > return > infiltrator’s again > repeat next time he attempts burst. If warrior is smart enough to wait out the timer on return, evade through then infiltrator’s back. It’s possible to have that on 100% uptime.

Use shortbow. Care not for immobilizes.
Use D/D + S/D just hold Shadow return, use Shadowstep for what? You didn’t even get in range.

If you are able to win 1 vs 2 , those oponents are already 1 lvl bellow you.
1 vs 5 is posible only against opponents with high latency, few experience ingame, and less skilled.

ensoriki.5789:

It’s called distracting shot and shadow return.
If you have Sleight of Hand then Steal.
What you’re saying makes no sense…Previously you could stealth quickly to prevent being eaten up. Stealth when? After being hit by Bulls? Wot?
You don’t need stun breaks. Just cripple them and at worst just play the field with Inf strike.
Generally warriors run Leg specialist if they’re serious about that HB burst so they don’t have to rely on Bulls charge to kill you. Otherwise you don’t have much to worry about.

You can also evade the rush with Flanking strike… screw it over with Black Powder, dodge over him with Death Blossom…
Since you do S/D + D/D. Just play Inf strike.

If you have no stun break up and you just blew shadowstep to avoid death and a warrior comes up to you and you know you are going to BS/HB you can chain a cnd or two to get away and either run or distract.

After change, warrior will have 3s to flatten you and he really only needs 1-2.

Evidently he’s never fought a thief that know’s what they are doing. Which, sadly, the odds are in favor of that occurring; as there are way more bad thieves than good ones.

swinsk.6410:

ensoriki.5789:

It’s called distracting shot and shadow return.
If you have Sleight of Hand then Steal.
What you’re saying makes no sense…Previously you could stealth quickly to prevent being eaten up. Stealth when? After being hit by Bulls? Wot?
You don’t need stun breaks. Just cripple them and at worst just play the field with Inf strike.
Generally warriors run Leg specialist if they’re serious about that HB burst so they don’t have to rely on Bulls charge to kill you. Otherwise you don’t have much to worry about.

You can also evade the rush with Flanking strike… screw it over with Black Powder, dodge over him with Death Blossom…
Since you do S/D + D/D. Just play Inf strike.

If you have no stun break up and you just blew shadowstep to avoid death and a warrior comes up to you and you know you are going to BS/HB you can chain a cnd or two to get away and either run or distract.

After change, warrior will have 3s to flatten you and he really only needs 1-2.

You are making the assumption that you’re fighting a DAGGER THIEF. Sword is what the more experienced thieves play, due to the things we’ve been trying to list for you guys.

Okay stealth gets balanced … but don´t you think we get some buffs to iron that out?

Adaneshade.2409:

Not referring to the utility skill, Sword’s #2 does the EXACT SAME THING and is never on CD.

The skill to port back to starting position is called [Shadow Return], just like it is for [Shadow Step]’s secondary.

Use infiltrator’s strike on inc > warrior attempts burst > return > infiltrator’s again > repeat next time he attempts burst. If warrior is smart enough to wait out the timer on return, evade through then infiltrator’s back. It’s possible to have that on 100% uptime.

I think you are forgetting the fact that you have to use the shadowstep first before you can use a shadowreturn.

When fighting a sword/X thief as a warrior or any competent class is not going to try to cc you while return is up.

Inf signet? I don’t see many thieves with 2 stun break utilities. Usually one or the other.

All I am saying is that without the extra stealth, in spvp, they will become easy kills.

We can get into the mechanics of how a fight would normally go but all that does is obstruct the truth of the nerf, which is less stealth.

Less stealth makes the thief more vulnerable.

What I’m saying is most encounters vs a GS warrior already don’t require stealth. And this particular shadowste kitten pammable. Unlike dagger builds, S/D builds use their initiative SOLELY for utility, so I ALWAYS have it up, timer about to drop? Just return and bounce back instantaneously ….. literally. Shadow return never drops.

swinsk.6410:

ensoriki.5789:

It’s called distracting shot and shadow return.
If you have Sleight of Hand then Steal.
What you’re saying makes no sense…Previously you could stealth quickly to prevent being eaten up. Stealth when? After being hit by Bulls? Wot?
You don’t need stun breaks. Just cripple them and at worst just play the field with Inf strike.
Generally warriors run Leg specialist if they’re serious about that HB burst so they don’t have to rely on Bulls charge to kill you. Otherwise you don’t have much to worry about.

You can also evade the rush with Flanking strike… screw it over with Black Powder, dodge over him with Death Blossom…
Since you do S/D + D/D. Just play Inf strike.

If you have no stun break up and you just blew shadowstep to avoid death and a warrior comes up to you and you know you are going to BS/HB you can chain a cnd or two to get away and either run or distract.

After change, warrior will have 3s to flatten you and he really only needs 1-2.

Makes zero sense. If you get hit with bulls CND won’t save you. If you CND chain him he could whirling axe your face. What your saying is literally just making up for bad play. If your out of stun breaks instead of chaining CND kittening run. Switch to sword and inf strike. You now have a stun break. Is this not sensible? If you cannot weapon swap deselect the warrior and HS away creating distance allowing you to pull yourself together. Simple. Otherwise use a util or elite. Blind bulls with signet of shadows. Or dodge it by regaining endurance with Signet of agility. Or run and tripwire or needle trap. Or hit him with ice drake venom or Dancing daggers to slow down bulls charge. Pop shadow refuge or stun break with haste and death blossom.

Adaneshade.2409:

You are making the assumption that you’re fighting a DAGGER THIEF. Sword is what the more experienced thieves play, due to the things we’ve been trying to list for you guys.

I am actually talking about X/D thieves because this change affects players who use stealth as frequently as possible. Any thief with a dagger in offhand is pretty much a stealth thief. We don’t go dagger offhand for dancing dagger, it’s for CND.

I actually run D/D + S/D in wvw and P/D in spvp.

In wvw I start out most fights with S/D and Inf strike because I expect to get CC’d on inc and I don’t want to waste shadowstep.

Advanced players don’t use any certain weapon set. I know great players who run D/D and some who run D/P.

People will always play what they like the most. By assuming that most advanced players use any certain weapon set is making a mistake.

Infiltrators strike is not the answer to visible more often. Blinding powder going D/P is more of a real solution if you are wanting to offer a weaponset solution.

See, that’s where you are wrong. I run dagger offset not for dancing dagger, but for flanking strike. My only use for stealth is the occasional daze. Meaning I already have revealed debuff EVERY TIME I stealth nothing changes.

ensoriki.5789:

Makes zero sense. If you get hit with bulls CND won’t save you. If you CND chain him he could whirling axe your face. What your saying is literally just making up for bad play. If your out of stun breaks instead of chaining CND kittening run. Switch to sword and inf strike. You now have a stun break. Is this not sensible? If you cannot weapon swap deselect the warrior and HS away creating distance allowing you to pull yourself together. Simple.

You didn’t read what I wrote. If your stun break is down and you are trying to “avoid” the bulls charge, it will be significantly harder now because you can’t stealth as often. You will be vulnerable longer and nothing will save you from bulls when you stun breaks are down. Previously, you could CND off someone (not even the warrior) and run away. Now, you won’t be able to CND for 3s and you will die.

That’s all I am trying to say. Obviously you don’t get it.

There are plenty of counters to every ability, even stealth. With this change in effect the thief loses a huge portion of his survivability because he is exposed.

Sure you can keep the infi strike alive for a bit, when you run out of init, then what?

Warrior has plenty of other abilities too besides bulls and hb.

Everyone who plays a thief knows that with this change in effect that thieves will be much more vulnerable in spvp.

swinsk.6410:

ensoriki.5789:

Makes zero sense. If you get hit with bulls CND won’t save you. If you CND chain him he could whirling axe your face. What your saying is literally just making up for bad play. If your out of stun breaks instead of chaining CND kittening run. Switch to sword and inf strike. You now have a stun break. Is this not sensible? If you cannot weapon swap deselect the warrior and HS away creating distance allowing you to pull yourself together. Simple.

You didn’t read what I wrote. If your stun break is down and you are trying to “avoid” the bulls charge, it will be significantly harder now because you can’t stealth as often. You will be vulnerable longer and nothing will save you from bulls when you stun breaks are down. Previously, you could CND off someone (not even the warrior) and run away. Now, you won’t be able to CND for 3s and you will die.

That’s all I am trying to say. Obviously you don’t get it.

There are plenty of counters to every ability, even stealth. With this change in effect the thief loses a huge portion of his survivability because he is exposed.

Sure you can keep the infi strike alive for a bit, when you run out of init, then what?

Warrior has plenty of other abilities too besides bulls and hb.

Everyone who plays a thief knows that with this change in effect that thieves will be much more vulnerable in spvp.

I’ve never run out of init, and I’ve fought for 10 minutes in a single duel before. Simply don’t use that much for infiltrator’s strike, init regens faster than ya use it.

Adaneshade.2409:

See, that’s where you are wrong. I run dagger offset not for dancing dagger, but for flanking strike. My only use for stealth is the occasional daze. Meaning I already have revealed debuff EVERY TIME I stealth nothing changes.

You are an idiot, no offense. I mean this in a factual way.

Flanking Strike is a sword skill, #3.

Tactical Strike (the daze from stealth) is also a sword skill.

That’s like saying “I run dagger offhand for the backstab not the cnd!”

Really? You are running dagger offhand for CND so that you can use a stealth skill after wards. Which is how I play also. I run dagger offhand so that I can either backstab or daze people from stealth.

The nerf does not affect that. The nerf affects thieves aren’t able to land a style in stealth, which happens plenty of times, for whatever reason and then they need to stealth again quickly to avoid big damage (since thats the only way other than dodging to avoid damage for us).

Thief in spvp is going to get hit hard imo.

And I told you exactly what you can do for D/D + S/D and even missed some strata. In the case another person is there you can inf strike to them too. How about you manage your INI?
No duh they’ll situationally be more vulnerable if they butt cling on stealth. You aren’t defenceless that’s the point. You are the most mobile profession in the game bar ele and are tripping out about the threat of hundred blades….are you SRS right now? Brah?

That is false. Like I said run S/P. I break los I avoid damage. Battle on keep? You can inf strike from corner of staircase on grass onto keep and when ready shadow return back onto grass n pullout. Henge? Warp from either ledge down while your return point is behind a pillar. Mine you can do it behind the metal piece by the point.
Khylo you can be under the clocktower or on outside ledges. The building by pts also works in addition to underneath the wooden high raise.
Silent storm on temple ledge’ alter on the ledge above behind lamp posts or under bridge.
Gate behind pillars or be at staircase to warp up bridge later.
Capricorn, rocks at beach barrels at dock or on the wooden landing or behind the building. Silent storm trees at raven, rocks at Bear and wolf.
Foe fire ledges at graveyard. Fences at quarry and waterfall.

You can mitigate damage by shadowsteping you run S/D get aware and you will compensate.

Death blossom grants evade.
It may be harder but hardly enough to lose sleep over.

You are aware that you don’t get Flanking Strike UNLESS you have dagger offhand right? Mr. GENIOUS?

That statement just goes to prove my case about how little you actually understand thieves.

Flanking Strike is a sword skill, #3. – That´s not true.

It´s a dual skill … only available with S/D

Adaneshade.2409:

I’ve never run out of init, and I’ve fought for 10 minutes in a single duel before. Simply don’t use that much for infiltrator’s strike, init regens faster than ya use it.

I would hope in a duel you don’t run out of init.

because we all care about duels here…

Adaneshade.2409:

You are aware that you don’t get Flanking Strike UNLESS you have dagger offhand right? Mr. GENIOUS?

That statement just goes to prove my case about how little you actually understand thieves.

Sure, I am wrong. It’s a dual skill. Flanking strike still has no daze, you were refering to tactical strike and said flanking strike.

It’s spelt Genius btw. I never called myself that.

ensoriki.5789, I am not concerned about what you can and cannot do to avoid a freaking bulls charge. Stop talking to me about it. It’s a moot point.

We all know how to avoid them.

My point is that thieves are now missing their #1 tool to avoid getting bursted by any class. That is chain stealth.

You cannot argue me on this because it is a fact.

Point still stands, anyone clueless enough to make that argument shouldn’t even be posting in thief forums.

Congrats on winning the spelling bee though :-P

Adaneshade.2409:

Point still stands, anyone clueless enough to make that argument shouldn’t even be posting in thief forums.

Congrats on winning the spelling bee though :-P

It’s not an arguement, it’s a fact. This nerf seriously affects the survivability of this class.

So far the best suggestion is to respec to D/P and use blinding powder for the loss of survivability.

swinsk.6410:

Adaneshade.2409:

I’ve never run out of init, and I’ve fought for 10 minutes in a single duel before. Simply don’t use that much for infiltrator’s strike, init regens faster than ya use it.

I would hope in a duel you don’t run out of init.

because we all care about duels here…

You only ran out of Init if you try to avoid every possible damage that you would sustain. That’s a wrong way to play a thief. Often times, you need to gamble and take some hits to deal the maximum amount of damage possible. In my experience, I’m always on top in a duel situation and the only stealth skill I use is Hide in Shadows.

Inf Strike/Shadow Return drives anyone bonkers when dueling with a thief.

Your “facts” are inaccurate. I actually play a S/D thief as a main, not a warrior.

I do not now, nor will I ever utilize chain stealthing. The same can be said of any player who truly understands how to use the weapon set. Stealth spam is simply a crutch for those that make frequent mistakes.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

swinsk.6410:

Adaneshade.2409:

I’ve never run out of init, and I’ve fought for 10 minutes in a single duel before. Simply don’t use that much for infiltrator’s strike, init regens faster than ya use it.

I would hope in a duel you don’t run out of init.

because we all care about duels here…

You only ran out of Init if you try to avoid every possible damage that you would sustain. That’s a wrong way to play a thief. Often times, you need to gamble and take some hits to deal the maximum amount of damage possible. In my experience, I’m always on top in a duel situation and the only stealth skill I use is Hide in Shadows.

Inf Strike/Shadow Return drives anyone bonkers when dueling with a thief.

This, except it’s not so much a gamble. I have 3k armor and 19k hp, even with the full burst rotation, a GS warrior isn’t just going to “flatten” me(as swinsk put it).

swinsk.6410:

Adaneshade.2409:

Point still stands, anyone clueless enough to make that argument shouldn’t even be posting in thief forums.

Congrats on winning the spelling bee though :-P

It’s not an arguement, it’s a fact. This nerf seriously affects the survivability of this class.

So far the best suggestion is to respec to D/P and use blinding powder for the loss of survivability.

You are yet to prove your ground that the upcoming “nerf” is a loss of survivability.

swinsk.6410:

ensoriki.5789, I am not concerned about what you can and cannot do to avoid a freaking bulls charge. Stop talking to me about it. It’s a moot point.

We all know how to avoid them.

My point is that thieves are now missing their #1 tool to avoid getting bursted by any class. That is chain stealth.

You cannot argue me on this because it is a fact.

It isn’t its situational. So long as you continue it it works otherwise you are subject to a back stab like everyone else. Chaining can also get you killed under certain utils by exposing your crutch play and end up get aoe cc’d and then smashed.

The point means little Chain CND is nerfed but you aren’t defenceless regardless so it is not something to lose sleep over unless you can justify how it is ‘required’ to successfully play a thief and you have not.

In addition it basically does not even touch certain weapon sets.

swinsk.6410:

Sure, I am wrong. It’s a dual skill. Flanking strike still has no daze, you were refering to tactical strike and said flanking strike.

Not exactly. He said: I run dagger offset not for dancing dagger, but for flanking strike. My only use for stealth is the occasional daze. Meaning I already have revealed debuff EVERY TIME I stealth nothing changes.

He runs S/D for Flanking Strike. This establishes the connection between his statement and the previous “all /D affected” (and he clarifies that he uses S/D for FS, which may be an unnecessary comment).

Separately, he states that Daze is the only reason why he uses the stealth in the S/D set, and therefore he always has revealed anyways.

There’s no reason to automatically relate the two statements. Although I’d still give it a 33% chance he meant to say Tactical Strike, I don’t think it’s guaranteed. I think there’s a reasonable 2/3s chance that he just threw in extraneous explanation for why he uses S/D (perhaps to reinforce the fact that it is not “just for CND stealth”).