Guild Wars 2

Currently, Infiltrator Strike is over performing because the Shadow Return portion of it is longer then 1200 range. I havent tested the max range yet but it looks like it is 3600 range (no one should have a 3600 range blink/teleport). Please remember to add this to your next balance patch. Thanks.

Doesn’t mesmers portal teleport that far too?

Same range as mesmer portal, nothing to see here, move along.

3600 range you say…

Why do i find this hard to believe.

Adaneshade.2409:

Same range as mesmer portal, nothing to see here, move along.

A 90sec utility vs a spammable ability…come on now….

The tooltip says 1200 range. I don’t think 3600 range is intended.

skupuz.6940:

Adaneshade.2409:

Same range as mesmer portal, nothing to see here, move along.

A 90sec utility vs a spammable ability…come on now….

The tooltip says 1200 range. I don’t think 3600 range is intended.

it’s 90sec because you can teleport your whole party, 3 more parties, and their relatives in one go.
Plus you can’t really spam 3600 range if you got to walk that first.

BobbyT.7192:

skupuz.6940:

Adaneshade.2409:

Same range as mesmer portal, nothing to see here, move along.

A 90sec utility vs a spammable ability…come on now….

The tooltip says 1200 range. I don’t think 3600 range is intended.

it’s 90sec because you can teleport your whole party, 3 more parties, and their relatives in one go.
Plus you can’t really spam 3600 range if you got to walk that first.

You cant spam it but there’s really no CD on it.

Don’t use 1 OP ability to justify a broken mechanic. Just make it 1200 as the tool tip states. Is that too much to ask for?

skupuz.6940:

BobbyT.7192:

skupuz.6940:

Adaneshade.2409:

Same range as mesmer portal, nothing to see here, move along.

A 90sec utility vs a spammable ability…come on now….

The tooltip says 1200 range. I don’t think 3600 range is intended.

it’s 90sec because you can teleport your whole party, 3 more parties, and their relatives in one go.
Plus you can’t really spam 3600 range if you got to walk that first.

You cant spam it but there’s really no CD on it.

Don’t use 1 OP ability to justify a broken mechanic. Just make it 1200 as the tool tip states. Is that too much to ask for?

If you port 3600 range you are gone and you are not coming back lol wtf.

Anyways anet
please fix that Shadow return doesn’t stun break knockbacks, pulls and launches.

Thanks for reporting this. An honorable thief.

skupuz.6940:

BobbyT.7192:

skupuz.6940:

Adaneshade.2409:

Same range as mesmer portal, nothing to see here, move along.

A 90sec utility vs a spammable ability…come on now….

The tooltip says 1200 range. I don’t think 3600 range is intended.

it’s 90sec because you can teleport your whole party, 3 more parties, and their relatives in one go.
Plus you can’t really spam 3600 range if you got to walk that first.

You cant spam it but there’s really no CD on it.

Don’t use 1 OP ability to justify a broken mechanic. Just make it 1200 as the tool tip states. Is that too much to ask for?

I will use 1 OP ability to justify a broken (as ensoriki stated) mechanic thank you very much. ;D

skupuz.6940:

BobbyT.7192:

skupuz.6940:

Adaneshade.2409:

Same range as mesmer portal, nothing to see here, move along.

A 90sec utility vs a spammable ability…come on now….

The tooltip says 1200 range. I don’t think 3600 range is intended.

it’s 90sec because you can teleport your whole party, 3 more parties, and their relatives in one go.
Plus you can’t really spam 3600 range if you got to walk that first.

You cant spam it but there’s really no CD on it.

Don’t use 1 OP ability to justify a broken mechanic. Just make it 1200 as the tool tip states. Is that too much to ask for?

Yeah correct the tooltip because it’s not an inf strike thing.
Both Shadowsteps are longer than the tooltip.
Fix the tooltip.

Columba.9730:

Thanks for reporting this. An honorable thief.

Yeah, thanks for reporting this, hopefully they fix the tooltip soon

They might as well “fix” ranger’s pet range, especially since they never lose aggro now, 1200 range kthx.

ITT: thieves making excuses why a broken ability is okay when they use it.

Infiltrator strike is fine. Very fun ability. It’s hilarious watching 10 people chase you and then shadow stepping behind them all

Only 1 time in WvW have i ever encountered a smart group of people that had a few people camp the obvious white shadow return circle

As for anything else…the thief is the master of mobility. Every noob comes onto these forums to complain about stealth, now you’re complaining about the thief’s speed?

What’s next, “omg plz anet mesmer shouldn’t be able to use illusions; omg anet warrior too much hp; omg anet ranger should not have pet; omg anet guardian shouldn’t be able to block; omg anet elementalist should not cast spells.”

Seriously.

But, since you did bring up something sword related, you might as well alert them that Flanking Strike AI still needs some work!

The maximum range of the current bugged implementation of Shadow Return is… as far as you can run before it vanishes. In theory you could use it at 40 million range if you could run that far before it becomes Infiltrators Strike again, the red bar does appear under it when it exceeds the tool-tip range but it’s still useable.
Similar effect with the Shadow Return portion of Shadowstep.

Coffeebot.3921:

Similar effect with the Shadow Return portion of Shadowstep.

Untrue. Shadowstep’s Shadow Return will port you a maximum of 1200 units in the direction of the white circle.

IS does need fixing though, either the SR part or the tooltip.

If it really is 3600 and the tooltip says 1200 they should fix it.

They should also fix the Shadow Pursuit (second part of Shadow Trap) and let it be 10000 as the tooltip says and not stop on the first mosquito in the field.

Daendur.2357:

If it really is 3600 and the tooltip says 1200 they should fix it.

They should also fix the Shadow Pursuit (second part of Shadow Trap) and let it be 10000 as the tooltip says and not stop on the first mosquito in the field.

Hmm i did use shadow trap for some time and it was working perfectly for me. Sometimes i even got a loading screen when i was far enough lol ( seriously).

when i tried it, it was a mess… it only worked if there was nothing between me and marked foe. A tree = stop. A corner = stop …
i don’t even think we can find 10,000 units of plain terrain.
It could be one of the most funny and tactical skills ever, but it has to work properly.
Moreover, since 10000 is a lot, a distance tracker should be glad.

Kellhus.8071:

ITT: thieves making excuses why a broken ability is okay when they use it.

ITT: people like to browse the forums for the class they don’t like but never learn anything.

i think IS doesnt need any SR range fixing, bcos SR cant gain altitude, SR is stopped if u re infront of something (like, u cant SR to ur exact save point) , even i think the IS initial blink range is quite short, well IS is very usefull for chasing but, with 600 range i rarely hit my target (or its me who is a noob thief anyway) .

And im gonna mention Flanking Strike that ive never hit the button for wvw battles..
^^ any thoughts about FS ?

Daendur.2357:

when i tried it, it was a mess… it only worked if there was nothing between me and marked foe. A tree = stop. A corner = stop …
i don’t even think we can find 10,000 units of plain terrain.
It could be one of the most funny and tactical skills ever, but it has to work properly.
Moreover, since 10000 is a lot, a distance tracker should be glad.

well said

If IS is bugged it needs to be fixed (I haven’t plaid s/d in a long time nor tested this though). I don’t see why that’s even up for debate…

@Noktern… FS can save your hide. It’s great for evading when you’re out of endurance. It’s great for ripping off protection/fury/stacks of might. The 2nd hit of it does the same damage as C&D so make sure it does that 2nd hit. It’s not something you spam though.

Someone got trolled by a s/d thief.

Did you chase him very far and then he just hit shadowreturn?

Almost make me want to cry for you!

If you can’t pressure someone enough to use it before 3600 units or whatever then what’s the point? You are just mad your group of 10 idiots couldn’t zerg down 1 thief. Next time don’t be a group of bads and leave a couple at the white circle. You do know about that right?

If the range really is 3600 that’s definitely broken. There’s no way they intended for a thief to have a spammable teleport (given initiative pool) for a range like that. Enjoy it while it lasts though haha.

edit: so before I get any other people with sub human reading comprehension to reply to this post, I have to add that I know the range on it isn’t 3600. My post was more tongue in cheek than anything else. Calm down forum warriors.

In what universe is this somehow an overperformance? How on earth do you fight? Do you drag each other half-way across the map within the 15 seconds the Thief has before he can use the Return and leave you standing alone miles away from your original location? Couple that with both the fact that IS cannot function on anything except flat terrain, and that you know where the Thief originated from so can plan ahead, and this is a complete non-issue.

It’s not like the Thief can plant his IS, fight on the front line for a few minutes and then port back when he’s in trouble. He has 15 seconds. FIFTEEN. Most 1v1 fights are usually over by then…

Auesis.7301:

In what universe is this somehow an overperformance? How on earth do you fight? Do you drag each other half-way across the map within the 15 seconds the Thief has before he can use the Return and leave you standing alone miles away from your original location? Couple that with both the fact that IS cannot function on anything except flat terrain, and that you know where the Thief originated from so can plan ahead, and this is a complete non-issue.

It’s not like the Thief can plant his IS, fight on the front line for a few minutes and then port back when he’s in trouble. He has 15 seconds. FIFTEEN. Most 1v1 fights are usually over by then…

In WvW, fight do drag out far from it’s original location.

skupuz.6940:

Auesis.7301:

In what universe is this somehow an overperformance? How on earth do you fight? Do you drag each other half-way across the map within the 15 seconds the Thief has before he can use the Return and leave you standing alone miles away from your original location? Couple that with both the fact that IS cannot function on anything except flat terrain, and that you know where the Thief originated from so can plan ahead, and this is a complete non-issue.

It’s not like the Thief can plant his IS, fight on the front line for a few minutes and then port back when he’s in trouble. He has 15 seconds. FIFTEEN. Most 1v1 fights are usually over by then…

In WvW, fight do drag out far from it’s original location.

Of course they do, but not within fifteen kitten seconds. Even then, you see the icon on his status bar, you see yourself getting immobilised by the attack (if you were close enough), you see where he came from. I don’t get it. What’s the problem?

Shemsu.8721:

Harbinger.9645:

If the range really is 3600 that’s definitely broken. There’s no way they intended for a thief to have a spammable teleport (given initiative pool) for a range like that. Enjoy it while it lasts though haha.

You do not have the slightest idea what your talking about. IS has a range of 600. Shadow Return sends you back to your original location. In order to achieve even the base shadow return range, you have to cast IS get your 600 blink, then RUN the other 600, in order to teleport 1200 back. How is that Spammable 3600? Next time, research before your ignorance becomes so clear

Calm yourself there buddy. I never said I did any research hence my post was qualified with an IF in front of it. I was going on what was reported by someone else. I even threw in a haha to show that my post was light hearted in nature. Thanks for the clarification though, but leave the flame bait at the door there’s no need for your attitude pal.

Harbinger.9645:

If the range really is 3600 that’s definitely broken. There’s no way they intended for a thief to have a spammable teleport (given initiative pool) for a range like that. Enjoy it while it lasts though haha.

Do people even understand the concept of displacement.
You have 17s.
Move 3600 units, 17s.
Upon 17s how much time do you have to fight?
To anyone who is conscious of the sword set.
It’s not a Dagger, assuming the person being attacked is sleeping it would still take 5-12s to kill someone who is afk. In other words.
The proper way to move a far distance with S/x in a timely fashion?
Usage of Steal and utilities.
What this means? Going without Steal/utilities, or in other words, reducing your ability to actually be a combat threat, and to use steal they have to be within 900 (1200 traited) range exactly or it fails and goes on interrupt recharge, full recharge if you are in combat state.

If you moved 3600 range and pressed it? Now 3600 range out of combat. You’ll lose target, which mean’s being unable to warp back to them to remove even 600 of that unit if you “spammed” it. So you can go walk back 3600 units.
In other words?
It is not spamabble 3600 range blink (nor is it even ground targetted to begin with), to make that statement is clueless to how it works.
It will also flop if it has pathing issues (even if they don’t make sense). What this means is actually quite significant to wvw (and the right side bridge of Spirit watch, which is buggy as hell) where destructable elements generally work very poorly with shadowsteps. Meaning, you may not move, at all using inf strike or Shadow return.

Lettuce break down Thief mobility with a sword.
Inf strike itself cannot be spammed, you have to use shadow return which is 2 ini.
In other words, you have to spend 5 ini.
To actually spam 3 inf strikes is 12 initiative, which are basically 600 movement and suspectible to kiting because you have to warp back in order to use it again, so the farther they move away from your return pt, the less your ability to go back to them, as your immobilize is now a warpback. Meaning if you’re S/P you’re only way to snare em if they’re moving is basically a terrible trait (unless your P/x) or utility skills. Otherwise all you have to do is walk away and you’ve removed the threat of the skill and made it work for you as, his time walking back into your range is basically time for your skills to recharge back. For instance, playing my ranger. I use PB shot, he get’s knocked back. and I can blitz him with a pet swap quickness shot as I walk backwards. He now is forced to move regardless because he has to warp back, and then walk back within 600 units and then warp again to hit me. Common sense. If he’s 3600 units away? The fight is over plain and simple soul exception is combo with Shadowstep, which is (relative to most players) an advance niche strategy, which removes your utility stunbreak from the equation for 50s. If he moved 3600 units without Shadowstep to begin with?
Then this was a scouting routine as he’d have to use IA to get to someone 3600 range away lol wot which would be 12 ini, assuming he’s got 15 in Trickery it works out to about two, than enough time for some regen to use the shadow return. Since Inf signet is out of the picture at a range like that, he wouldn’t be able to target to use inf signet’s warp properties.
In other words, highly situational, relatively impractical but important for when it can be done.
To say it can be “spammed” is straight out hilarious. How do you spam 3600 range? When you need to move 3600 units on 12/15 3 util slots (with only 3 potential shadowsteps only 1 of which has no condition to be used) and then still be an offensive threat outside of your autoattack.
Just doesn’t work like that buds, but you’ll know if you use a Sword for any length of time what the OP is stating makes very, very little sense.
Tanget time.
Considering it also does not stunbreak atm knockback,launch and pull.
Someone advocating for breaking one of the main draws to the sword relative to a 3 hit kill Dagger, lol nonsense.

However since the utility skill Shadowstep works exactly the same, except being ground targetted, 3 condt removal, and having less infiltration time.
Pretty sure this is exactly how it’s supposed to work. As both skills use Shadow return and traverse the same distance.
Will enjoy it, forever.

Note the length of the post wasn’t fully intended for you or the OP. and several pts were reiterated to make sure what made sense was drilled in.

ensoriki.5789:

A lot of really cool but ultimately unnecessary information as a response to something that clearly wasn’t true

Man, you guys have some trouble reading don’t you? I said IF the range is 3600 then it’s broken…is the range 3600? No? Then obviously it doesn’t need to be fixed. It’s called a conditional IF/THEN statement. Deal with it.

Except that would require you to use Sword. Pass.

Harbinger.9645:

ensoriki.5789:

A lot of really cool but ultimately unnecessary information as a response to something that clearly wasn’t true

Man, you guys have some trouble reading don’t you? I said IF the range is 3600 then it’s broken…is the range 3600? No? Then obviously it doesn’t need to be fixed. It’s called a conditional IF/THEN statement. Deal with it.

His comment is on shadow return moving you 3600 units not inf strike.
But it seems you didn’t even know how the skill worked anyways so lol.

Except that would require you to use Sword. Pass.

:(.

ensoriki.5789:

His comment is on shadow return moving you 3600 units not inf strike.
But it seems you didn’t even know how the skill worked anyways so lol.

Still stand by what I said, thanks for playing.

ensoriki.5789:

skupuz.6940:

BobbyT.7192:

skupuz.6940:

Adaneshade.2409:

Same range as mesmer portal, nothing to see here, move along.

A 90sec utility vs a spammable ability…come on now….

The tooltip says 1200 range. I don’t think 3600 range is intended.

it’s 90sec because you can teleport your whole party, 3 more parties, and their relatives in one go.
Plus you can’t really spam 3600 range if you got to walk that first.

You cant spam it but there’s really no CD on it.

Don’t use 1 OP ability to justify a broken mechanic. Just make it 1200 as the tool tip states. Is that too much to ask for?

If you port 3600 range you are gone and you are not coming back lol wtf.

Anyways anet
please fix that Shadow return doesn’t stun break knockbacks, pulls and launches.

Hm… let me see.

If a bug is in your favor, then don’t fix it. (Shadow Return exceed tool tip distance = benefit)

If a bug isn’t in your favor, then fix it. (Shadow Return not breaking stealth = negative)

No wonder so many people hate thieves.

Tooltip doesn’t match skill.
Assume skill is wrong, despite updates showing no precedence for that thought.

If players suggest changing a weapon that barely sees play into further obscurity.
Question wtf people are saying.

ensoriki.5789:

Tooltip doesn’t match skill.
Assume skill is wrong, despite updates showing no precedence for that thought.

If players suggest changing a weapon that barely sees play into further obscurity.
Question wtf people are saying.

Just because they haven’t done anything doesn’t mean it is intended. I could CnD keep’s wall during beta and after release. It only got nerf recently because it finally showed up on their radar and up on their list of to do.

I don’t care if one person or several thousands play this weapon set. Either update tool tip or change it to match tool tip.

How can we ask them to fix things like shadow step not breaking stun when we’re not honest and upfront about bugs that favor us?

Sometime you just have to take the nerf… er fix when it happens. So far whenever a tool tip is incorrect the reaction seems to be place it at the least adventitious value so if a tool time said a duration/range of 5 and the game has it at 3 just see sooner or late the tip will be edited, but if a duration/range of 3 and the game has it at 5 then that ability is going to be toned down to 3

skupuz.6940:

Just because they haven’t done anything doesn’t mean it is intended. I could CnD keep’s wall during beta and after release. It only got nerf recently because it finally showed up on their radar and up on their list of to do.

Which is an issue of WvW balance and was detrimental to the actual game in legitimate practice. Soul possibility of this is really in combination with a mesmers portal or some very peculiar triggering of Shadow trap (in theory).

How can we ask them to fix things like shadow step not breaking stun when we’re not honest and upfront about bugs that favor us?

Because one is a matter of actual balance.
And the other isn’t about weapon balance relative to anything, but instead arbitrary weakening based on a tooltip.
If it was actually a matter of balancing the game for the better I’d agree wholeheartedly.

However I’m stillpretty sure it’s still supposed to work exactly like it does now.
Reasons: 1. Gw1. Many shadowsteps worked like this, Recall, Shadow of haste, Shadow Walk, Aura of Displacement and Shadow Meld. Recall, Shadow walk, AoD and Shadow Meld had Spell cast ranges which was about aggro bubble (basically our 1200), but there warp backs were far greater. Think I could go further than the compass with SoH. In other words, this being a legacy characteristic of shadowsteps from GW1.

Reasons 2. All shadowsteps ignore horizontal distance to begin with. We see this with being able to target someone who is 600 units above you, but the pathing to get to them (which shadowsteps inherently use) will be longer than 600 units. The 1200 range to be frank, doesn’t make sense in proportion to how shadowsteps have worked.

Reason 3. It actually seems about more or less the range of the map (zoomed in). Though seeing anything different would be difficult. Which again is reminiscent of Shadowsteps return distance (for a certain few) being slightly larger than the map. By range of the map I mean Horizontally/diagonally.

Reason 4. The range on the return doesn’t make sense to how it’s used. It’s an approach to a person, from a person. If they kited 1 step backwards it would flop. Especially thinking about the weird kitten pathing shadowsteps have that can send you horizontally.

Reason 5. Has always felt like a copy n paste job from Shadowstep which again shares the exact same range, and again it’s existance of a range indicator doesn’t make any sense except for arbitrarily restating the range of Shadowstep itself.
However, full range is still pretty mind boggling, and easily surpasses 3600 range lol.

If it was without precedence maybe I’d see it as more than a tooltip, but there is literally a history of skills like Inf strike created by Anet. Also I doubt it’s range is shorter than Shadow Traps.
It’s not about pick n choosing bugs.
I don’t think it’s a bug, it’s the nature of the skill.
Reminds me exactly of Shadow walk, Shadow of haste and AoD. Well more Walk and AoD than SoH.
What actually seemed odd is the discrepancy between, inf signet and Steal’s reactions, but I assumed it is because inf signet is specifically a movement skill, while Steal having the possible function as an attack does not.

Not that I care for the actual full range it can traverse (which is rather obscene, no use for it, since you need a waypoint/portal) anyways, but it’s practical range, which is about 2500-3000 for catching those kitten rtl eles.
Still doesn’t look like anything but an incorrect tooltip, which they’ll address on their own time to make up for their lack of balance changes.

Aberrant.6749:

If IS is bugged it needs to be fixed (I haven’t plaid s/d in a long time nor tested this though). I don’t see why that’s even up for debate…

@Noktern… FS can save your hide. It’s great for evading when you’re out of endurance. It’s great for ripping off protection/fury/stacks of might. The 2nd hit of it does the same damage as C&D so make sure it does that 2nd hit. It’s not something you spam though.

for evading purpose, yes. but for ripping off boon, its quite a much failure because of the animation isnt it? its like random accuracy. Its not spammable i understand, but its not reliable either. Out Of Topic btw.. sorry

I agree with the OP,

Pls fix the tooltip.

Return skills having more range then the initial makes sense, as you’d frequently move around while combat. But, I’d rather see the return range limited to, say, 1600 or 2400. As it is now, the long return range is more of a con then a pre in many situations.

ensoriki.5789:

skupuz.6940:

BobbyT.7192:

skupuz.6940:

Adaneshade.2409:

Same range as mesmer portal, nothing to see here, move along.

A 90sec utility vs a spammable ability…come on now….

The tooltip says 1200 range. I don’t think 3600 range is intended.

it’s 90sec because you can teleport your whole party, 3 more parties, and their relatives in one go.
Plus you can’t really spam 3600 range if you got to walk that first.

You cant spam it but there’s really no CD on it.

Don’t use 1 OP ability to justify a broken mechanic. Just make it 1200 as the tool tip states. Is that too much to ask for?

If you port 3600 range you are gone and you are not coming back lol wtf.

Anyways anet
please fix that Shadow return doesn’t stun break knockbacks, pulls and launches.

You have to have a return set as in phase 2 of the ability. The tooltip only refers to the initial port. So the thief not gonna be able to just use it to just run away.

The return has a set duration which isn’t very long at all, not like we can set a return up, go into a fight for a while then magically port back, unless we plan that fight to only last like 10 secs lol.

Get over it even at 1200 range it would be fine. You are not going to catch a thief who does this then stealth’s unless you have allies so get over it. 1200 range 3600 range doesn’t matter You are not going to catch them even if you know the range is limited get over it already.

frans.8092:

Return skills having more range then the initial makes sense, as you’d frequently move around while combat. But, I’d rather see the return range limited to, say, 1600 or 2400. As it is now, the long return range is more of a con then a pre in many situations.

Not true, its more of a con not knowing where your going, or getting stuck on terrain.