Guild Wars 2

So, why should I take this elite? I mean as far as I can tell it’s a 1.5 second stun…..that’s it. Why do so many people take this in their builds…seems kind of weak to me for an elite.

It can literally turn the tide of a fight, and if you use it on a GC, that 1.5 seconds can let you get a free mug, CnD BS which believe me, can make all the difference. You wont see how dire that 1.5 can be until you use it
EDIT: or you can just burst the kitten outta ppl with it :/

thieves have very strong elites.. i switch around depending on mood and situation.

Basilisk is great to increase your chances of landing your burst.

#WhatRedSaid.

It’s one of things, just like most of Thief abilities, that you should be timing.

I just can’t see taking it over thieves guild though…like EVER. And as far as timing goes, it takes a whole second just to cast. So you’re locked up for a second, to lock up your enemy for a second and a half….makes no sense to me at all. I think it’s a very weak elite.

No Walking.6349:

I just can’t see taking it over thieves guild though…like EVER. And as far as timing goes, it takes a whole second just to cast. So you’re locked up for a second, to lock up your enemy for a second and a half….makes no sense to me at all. I think it’s a very weak elite.

Yes but thieves need to pick fights and prepare.. that is the name of the game…

an engagement begins as soon as you notice an enemy. not when you start swinging daggers..

No Walking.6349:

I just can’t see taking it over thieves guild though…like EVER. And as far as timing goes, it takes a whole second just to cast. So you’re locked up for a second, to lock up your enemy for a second and a half….makes no sense to me at all. I think it’s a very weak elite.

Dude, Thieves guild is something I hardly use as they tend to die a lot. I only ever use it in duels against Mesmers. TG is only really useful when you’re running a build with crap damage like p/d condi.

No Walking.6349:

I just can’t see taking it over thieves guild though…like EVER. And as far as timing goes, it takes a whole second just to cast. So you’re locked up for a second, to lock up your enemy for a second and a half….makes no sense to me at all. I think it’s a very weak elite.

You use it before a fight or you apply it again while stealthed. Its so you can lock your target down right at start and land your burst…at least that’s how I’ve use it. I’m not particularly into PvP so I’m not an expert.
Seems kinda useless for PvE though

No Walking.6349:

I just can’t see taking it over thieves guild though…like EVER. And as far as timing goes, it takes a whole second just to cast. So you’re locked up for a second, to lock up your enemy for a second and a half….makes no sense to me at all. I think it’s a very weak elite.

That’s understandable but take this scenario, Lets say you have mug btw for all intensive purposes: Youre fighting a D/P who has unparalleled access to stealth. You pop your thieves guild. If he’s well trained, he will dance around them while invisible to get to you. He will do that all day, I should know, I-I’ve seen it.

Same scenario, you’re fighting this guy and even though it wasn’t mentioned above, let’s pretend you have him to half health and you got some pretty good dmg to deal. Normally at half health he will dance around an restealth until his heal comes back, but not this time, this time you have BV! So you cast it carefully and before he slips into darkness, you mug to him, but you don’t stop there, you cloak and dagger too! Oh but the pain isn’t done! The mighty backstab is here to save the day! And if that still doesn’t work, you usually have enough time to heartseeker for a finish.
Now see how useful it can be? And not just with thieves, with any class it can turn the tables if used right, them being still for 1.5 seconds letting you burst helps, alot.
(to be read fast)*WARNING above scenarios are imaginary based scenarios and your targets can be subject to use a stun break to break out. Any misuse of basilisk venom can be subject for reviewing in which a completely irrelevant aspect of the thief will get nerfed. users must be 18 years or older to handle. Limited uses per fight, results may vary

BV is usful on builds made for it, a total waste in other builds.

If you’re using an specialist build it can be considered even OP and many nerfs to some of our skills were made because of BV and not because of those skills effects. For other Thieves it isn’t that much. I hate that it’s our single underwater skill (Izzy told me loooooooooong ago that TG would be usable underwater U.U) because I don’t specifically build for it, and underwater you don’t have trong enough bursts for it to be effective (and the stronger one needs the target to attack you).

I’ve said this before, but all this (that BV is op and cause for nerfs in specific builds, and total crap in others) is because of the “all venoms have the same recharge” thing.

Because of this design decission BV is a balancing headache and from our utility venoms only Spider and Devourer are good (and Spider could do with a 40 seconds recharge).

In fact all the “next X hits” in the game work that way:

- Ranger’s Sharpening stone, next X attacks apply bleeding recharge of 45 seconds, time to expire 30 seconds.

- Elementalist’s Arcane Power, next X attacks do critical damage, works the same way too.

In fact with a a tier3 trait, Arcane Power depending on attunement “becomes a venom with 5 uses” (mechanically it works like a venom) that in adition to its main effect it either Chills for 3 seconds per hit (making Ice Drake Venom a complete joke) immobilizes 1 second per hit (with 5 hits, puting Devourer Venom to shame) or Burns for 5 seconds per hit (making Spider Venom look totally UP).

I know it’s with a trait and that they can only use one of the effects at a time, but that Eles got the “best venom” in the game feels wrong.

I think that if instead of 45 seconds recharge and 30 seconds time to expire for every single “next X attacks” skill, each one had a separate cooldown and time to expire balanced with the skill effects, they could balance venoms and make all of them usable in adition to give BV an “elite skill” treatment with some imaginative effect instead that the current “strong 4th utility” used for specialist builds.

People here are talking about just timing it correctly. While that is how you use it to the greatest effect, you’re right; it’s a very weak elite. I’m really not sure why they nerfed it, since it already seemed relatively weak compared to Thieves Guild or (the situational, but oh-so-entertaining) Dagger Storm. That nerf came straight out of left field, at least in my mind.

The build that tends to benefit the most from Basilisk Venom is Backstab burst, where the entire build is based around temporarily incapacitating your opponent and then quickly destroying their hopes and dreams. It’s also nice in venom-sharing builds, but those in and of themselves tend to be lackluster (at least to me).

They nerfed it because there was no counter to being stoned. Which was OP.

Make good use of the 1.5s and you’ll see why.

Ignores stacks of Defiant!

Basalisk Venom is the only Elite I use on my Thief.

Everything else is too situational -

Dagger Storm only really useful against high damage projectiles or large groups of enemies (I don’t tend to engage on large groups of enemies, since Melee and non-projectile ranged abilities will still tear through you especially since Healing and Dodging will interrupt it)

Thieves Guild has a very long cooldown and has downsides such as the Thieves being killed and they are detrimental against other thieves (If you’re both stealthed the Thieves will stand next to you. They give targets to get an easy CnD off etc)

Basalisk Venom has a short cooldown, which means I can use it without trying to wait for “The perfect time” so as to not waste it. It provides a Stun that goes through Defiant which can really help with taking out champions (The amount of times I stunned a Champ who was about to kill someone who then had time to heal up) and in PvP/WvW it gives a decent opening or removes a stun-breaker (Including the secondary utility that most stun-breakers give) and can be cast without breaking stealth (So that 4 second vulnerability when revealed, goes down to 2.5 seconds)

1.5 seconds may not seem like a long time, but if you’ve ever needed to get a heal off now and been delayed by CC before… It can be killer.

There are a variety of one off uses for basilisk venom that are good, such as removing rage type buffs from bezerk units. More generally basilisk venoms fit into a line of thought seen typically in other MMOs – if you can control a fight then group dps will eventually kill the enemy.

for me BV is the best for my build, just because i use lyssa runes ^^

Hahaha pair it with superior runes of Lyssa and you’ll see why people take it

Sepreh.5924:

Hahaha pair it with superior runes of Lyssa and you’ll see why people take it

Run Lyssa and Quick Venoms for goodness every 36s

I wish it was better considering, 1.5s stun is really quite low and with a 45s cooldown is a bit meh, considering other stun skills stun longer, have shorter cooldowns and aren’t elite.

Thats not to say its useless but generally I take daggerstorm over it for most situations, projectile reflection, high group damage, stability.

stinkypants.8419:

Sepreh.5924:

Hahaha pair it with superior runes of Lyssa and you’ll see why people take it

Run Lyssa and Quick Venoms for goodness every 36s

So very true. The only annoyance is that the Lyssa proc has a 50 second cool down, so you can still only activate it every other BV use.

No Walking.6349:

So, why should I take this elite? I mean as far as I can tell it’s a 1.5 second stun…..that’s it. Why do so many people take this in their builds…seems kind of weak to me for an elite.

this video will answer your question…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgxgmQlgt5o&list=UU-SjU98hzx0-TdRsxXuf6kg&index=3

No Walking,

Basilisk Venom is a PvP / WvW skill for burst builds. Beyond that, you’ll only ever use it if you’re running Superior Runes of Lyssa or a Venomous Aura spec. (For the record, that is the build that my PvE Thief uses in grouping situations.)

I remember that at one point, Venomous Aura builds were really popular in PvP and people wanted the skill nerfed because of how a devoted Aura build could use that skill. At the same time, people had issues with Basilisk being an instant cast (as per other venoms) since it could give an instant lock down without any kind of animation telegraphing. When combined together, the duration was nerfed down and a cast time as added. Then after some time, the duration was slightly increased.

Wiser with Age.3714:

stinkypants.8419:

Run Lyssa and Quick Venoms for goodness every 36s

So very true. The only annoyance is that the Lyssa proc has a 50 second cool down, so you can still only activate it every other BV use.

[/quote]
hrmm…. not listed here -

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_Lyssa

but that would explain why it didn’t always seem to proc.

Personally I’m a support thief and I must say that I love this skill…

While may not be the best DPS skill (what most of thiefs focus on) it’s a great control skill…

I use venoms based build with this as elite, as I use it I give all my allies (and myself) 2 buffs of basilisk venom, as so I stopped auto attacking before using it and wait the opponent to leave the stoned state (it becomes stoned about 2,5 seconds from allies attacks, since we rarely coordinate) so we get a total of about 5 stoned seconds, with a full coordinated team you could have up to 15seconds of stoned enemy (a litle more as every1 would wait the boss to start moving, so at max about 20s)! when facing just a single boss that may have a deadly attack in a non zerg group (instances especially) this is a lot… especially if you consider the quick venoms trait wich reduces the skill’s cooldown to 36 seconds.

It may not be the ideal “finish the game fast” skill, but when you want to control your opponent it’s, without a doubt, a great skill.

Only one I use at the moment also. Dagger storm I have never used as it is simply very situational, thieves guild is also, although it;s fun popping it in WvW along with ambush. I feel these are non-choices in spvp to be honest and basilisk has alot more precise functionality for me and there’s 4 of them for every thieves guild. Locking down and interrupting and getting in them attacks when needed works well. TG and DS is all about the random aoe type effect ie. will the thief from TG manage to pull target with a wire, do you care? Target has now moved anyway. DS can be avoided and really kind of places you in a vulnerable mode I think.

No Walking.6349:

So, why should I take this elite? I mean as far as I can tell it’s a 1.5 second stun…..that’s it. Why do so many people take this in their builds…seems kind of weak to me for an elite.

you can use runes of lyssa – elite give all bufs and clean all conditions any way 1.5 seconds you can land steal (mug) +backstab+3 auto attacks -over 16k damage

stinkypants.8419:

hrmm…. not listed here -

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_Lyssa

but that would explain why it didn’t always seem to proc.

That’s odd. It was always in the notes at the bottom of the Rune of Lyssa page. Seems like some moron changed the Wiki entry and deleted it off. Sigh.

Yes, it’s a 50 second cool down. Warriors with their signet trait must wait +2 seconds beyond their Elite’s refresh timer to always activate the Lyssa proc. Thieves with their venom trait must wait +14 seconds beyond their Elite’s refresh timer to proc the Lyssa buffs, which most people won’t wait for. Thus it only happens every other proc.

I play Venomous Aura and personally I like Thieves Guild over it. Wit Thieves Guild you get 2 aditonal targets for sharing (and normally your party will be too spread to share with all 5).

Aditionally, the stoning is not stackable, which means that if you’re focusing on a boss and share it, you would need that your allies stop their auto-attacks and take turns with teamspeak to attack (which at the end would drastically reduce their DPS when doing it) if you want to stack the uses of the skill.

IMO it’s only good for Backstab PvP burst builds. It isn’t even good for sharing in organized parties in general for the reason I posted. It MIGHT be good for sharing in PvP groups where you’re perfeclt coordinating with others and each attack a different target… but even then not worth sharing it over taking Thieves Guild and make Spider Venom deal ~4-5K extra damage through Leeching with their attacks.

I like devourer’s venom more for a backstab build.
Reasons are

A) The opponent can’t hit you with most skills if you are behind them
B) Stunbreakers don’t work. Condition cure does, but those skills usually have a cast time
C) Lasts longer
D) I can have a better elite. Thieves guild, for instance.

Doomdesire.9365:

I like devourer’s venom more for a backstab build.
Reasons are

Well I like using both. Reason is that you can mix it up to mess up with their heads. Or use both to prevent “stun removal => dodge” and give you some time to heartseeker them after the backstab. Or use only one at a time and have more often a backstab combo available.

I enjoy seeing enemy thieves running up with BV pre pop. Sometimes I just stop and look afk. BV is a trigger for me, it tells me 2 things this thief won’t have an elite fighting me and most likely he is a full zerker hero. Thieves guild can do more damage then venom. If you know how to time the scorpion wire they do even better