Guild Wars 2

Currently all shadow steps can easily be interrupted by simple things such as rocks or higher/lower elevation. You can fix this easily by simply changing the mechanic as if it acts like a mesmer portal.

Understand that what I ask is not a buff, but a fix. This has been a problem since launch, I hope this gets looked at.

It wont. :P

Nothing is ever > Living Story.

+1 I believe this is a huge problem w/ the “shadow step” mechanic…I call these situations “snag’s”….. I get snagged on the landscape about 1/4 shadowsteps… which is utterly ridiculous by my accounts…. so…. 1/4 times… ur utility/wepskill not only does not work according to written descriptions/player planning… but… about 1/3 of those “snags”… put you in a VERY VERY BAD SITUATION….

Happens to me a lot, and it’s frustrating.

why nerf shadow trap?

Excalibur.9748:

why nerf shadow trap?

because whenever it works as intended, it’s essentially the thief’s personal portal, with no casting animation, instant porting, and stunbreaking. so it does need a nerf (most likely a timer before it wears out, or something similar), but it also needs to be fixed so it doesn’t rely on shadowstepping, which is broken by the slightest elevation or gap on the terrain.

Make it move you through terrain like mesmer portal and then put a timer on duration and limit on distance (same distance as mesmer portal imo). Hell, take off the stun break if you want, just let me use it to get up terrain like a mesmer portal can.

the thing about the trap is thou… it is just that… “a trap”…which requires an enemy to trip it… unlike a mesmer portal… idk if a nerf is needed for such a mechanic….and yes…there already is a distance limit on it.

It was mentioned to put a cast time on the return ..
But how would a cast-time work when stunned… (and when it doesn’t work, why is it a stunbreaker?)

The trap should be imo, an instant teleport when triggered (and stunbreaking) but just a normal shadowstep when not triggered. Right now this skill is, if we ignore the obstacle problem, kitten good to escape nasty situations.

Unfortunately, it can’t be a portal if it stays relatively the same since it can last for long periods of time with no way to remove it by enemies.

Every fort in WvW would have 2-3 thieves hanging out with a shadow trap next to the champion to retake anything lost.

Rafahil.2857:

Understand that what I ask is not a buff, but a fix. This has been a problem since launch, I hope this gets looked at.

Not likely. As you say, it’s been there since launch which indicates their sloppy pathing algorithm is either very low on their priority list or too hard to fix. Or both.

because whenever it works as intended, it’s essentially …

It has seen various changes, never asked for, so why would it get nerfed if they can just keep up the tradition and change it. ;p

Maybe they’re looking for more data on the shadow-stepping glitches and this is their way of getting us to use shadow-stepping more, now that sword #2 wakitten.

Def needs work, yarr.

I’ve started to find I can minorly abuse the pathing lately. With Mug and other traits, I heal a decent amount whenever I Steal. However, if I really need healing, I don’t want to shadowstep back into melee range. So, if there’s anything like shin-high terrain or the like really close by, I can sometimes use it to block the shadowstep, but still gain all the benefits of Steal.

But, it’s a very minor gain that I’d gladly trade for it to actually shadowstep to my target instead.

Main problem I guess is that supposedly you mark the target who triggers the trap, so you dont shadowstep to a location is to a player instead.

Or your target gets killed. You’re not required to put it on a location where a target is likely to trigger it – and if, you could place it where any hostile npc would trigger it first.

RogueTigeR.3160:

the thing about the trap is thou… it is just that… “a trap”…which requires an enemy to trip it… unlike a mesmer portal… idk if a nerf is needed for such a mechanic….and yes…there already is a distance limit on it.

try using the skill, and read the changes that they made to it. You don’t need an enemy to trip it anymore…in fact it is way better when no-one trips it, so you can use it as a free escape, just like the pre-nerf shadowstep. Seeing as how they nerfed shadowstep, the OP is just anticipating a similar nerf for shadow trap…unfortunately in addition to occasionally giving amazing results, it also breaks fairly consistently, which is why the OP is complaining, and I wholeheartedly agree. It may be a bit overpowered, although honestly, it is more limited than pre-nerf shadowstep, so I think it is acceptable that it is more powerful….maybe make the max range 3k instead of 10k, and then fix the teleport so it works always. I don’t know how they would address keep walls and such, because that is still a potential issue if they fixed the pathing so it worked as described.

doesnt need a nerf. i think this was the gift for taking away stun breaker on shadow return which we had for lack of stability aegis blocks invulnerability and protection…none of which we have still.

hence ….its fine. its risky bc it can be triggered….. its risky bc if u activate it its 45 seconds you are no longer in a fight….big deal. not like you did something game changing by running away. this just replaces the need for blidning powder/shadow refuge. big…f-ing….deal.

bobross.5034:

RogueTigeR.3160:

the thing about the trap is thou… it is just that… “a trap”…which requires an enemy to trip it… unlike a mesmer portal… idk if a nerf is needed for such a mechanic….and yes…there already is a distance limit on it.

try using the skill, and read the changes that they made to it. You don’t need an enemy to trip it anymore…in fact it is way better when no-one trips it, so you can use it as a free escape, just like the pre-nerf shadowstep. Seeing as how they nerfed shadowstep, the OP is just anticipating a similar nerf for shadow trap…unfortunately in addition to occasionally giving amazing results, it also breaks fairly consistently, which is why the OP is complaining, and I wholeheartedly agree. It may be a bit overpowered, although honestly, it is more limited than pre-nerf shadowstep, so I think it is acceptable that it is more powerful….maybe make the max range 3k instead of 10k, and then fix the teleport so it works always. I don’t know how they would address keep walls and such, because that is still a potential issue if they fixed the pathing so it worked as described.

pre nerf shadowstep?

Travlane.5948:

bobross.5034:

RogueTigeR.3160:

the thing about the trap is thou… it is just that… “a trap”…which requires an enemy to trip it… unlike a mesmer portal… idk if a nerf is needed for such a mechanic….and yes…there already is a distance limit on it.

try using the skill, and read the changes that they made to it. You don’t need an enemy to trip it anymore…in fact it is way better when no-one trips it, so you can use it as a free escape, just like the pre-nerf shadowstep. Seeing as how they nerfed shadowstep, the OP is just anticipating a similar nerf for shadow trap…unfortunately in addition to occasionally giving amazing results, it also breaks fairly consistently, which is why the OP is complaining, and I wholeheartedly agree. It may be a bit overpowered, although honestly, it is more limited than pre-nerf shadowstep, so I think it is acceptable that it is more powerful….maybe make the max range 3k instead of 10k, and then fix the teleport so it works always. I don’t know how they would address keep walls and such, because that is still a potential issue if they fixed the pathing so it worked as described.

pre nerf shadowstep?

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shadowstep

shadowstep / shadowreturn

used to have an infinite range on shadowreturn, so you could go all the way back to wherever you were when you cast it…You could actually tp so far that you’d get a loading screen. The issue then, as it is now is that weird pathing issues can cause you to occasionally teleport barely any distance at all. So it could save your life, or not….it was always a gamble.

Shadow trap can also give you that loading screen sometimes…then again, sometimes it just gets you killed.

bobross.5034:

RogueTigeR.3160:

the thing about the trap is thou… it is just that… “a trap”…which requires an enemy to trip it… unlike a mesmer portal… idk if a nerf is needed for such a mechanic….and yes…there already is a distance limit on it.

try using the skill, and read the changes that they made to it.

TY…. have been busy lately and havn’t had much time to keep up w/ the ANet changes. And I do/did/probably will continue to use shadowtrap more than I’d say 80% of “real” (1st toon created/only toon/ most played toon) thieves out there. It is a GREAT skill. IMO… it epitomizes the thief’s mechanic….

The change(s) to shadowtrap imo are more of a control feature and if you follow me, a “shadowstep” designed at the archetype or essence of the function rather than an OP skill mechanic that ANet didn’t pre-balance properly and needs a nerf IMO:

- 45 sec’s: Obviously the recharge puts more emphasis on using the Master Trapper trait and dissuades thieves who are not “trap oriented” from using it as an “OP teleport at whim skill”; with the trait to match the skill(s), the new time becomes really negligible given the nature of the skill workings.
- Original Location on Destroy: Which is more OP??: Allowing thieves to destroy and replant traps which they’ve just realized are better located in a different position/the positioning has become more beneficial in a different local just this instant?… OR… MAKE the thief go RETRIEVE their trap in order to replant it??…
- Stun Breaker: As for the shadowtrap breaking stuns, IMO this should have always been, if shadowtrap is indeed a true example of the thief mechanic. All “true” shadowstep skills DO break stuns: Shadowstep (Utility Skill)/ Shadow Return, Infiltrator’s Signet, Steal. It only makes sense that if Shadowtrap is to be a “true” shadowstep mechanic, that it break stun as well.
- Skill Recharge Start: Recharge initiating on Shadow Pursuit/ Destroy only makes sense if we break down the skill as a “true” shadowstep… Shadowtrap is just that, a shadowstep, only stretched out over time and space: Setting the trap is the usual “shadowstep” skill usage…an enemy triggering the trap is the internal mechanism of the skill checking that an enemy is within range for the shadowstep to occur. Shadow Pursuit to the enemy is the act of shadowstepping to the enemy within range, and Destroy is essentially the failed attempt at shadowstepping because no enemy has triggered the internal “within range” switch and the skill user winds up at the original location of the use of the shadowstepping skill mechanism. Normally, this is termed as a “failed” shadowstep, but when we stretch out over distance and time the operation of shadowstepping, we see this can be beneficial given the Shadow Trap’s macro-environmental nature. *Just because something is beneficial at certain times, does that alone make it unbalanced?.. or is balance more of a control system with harmonic design?
- Addition of Boons: As for the might/fury….I see this as a way for thieves to gain boons a little more often (given we utilize only a couple/handful of them) without altering/adding more boons to the trait lines. IMO, as this IS a trap, it makes perfect sense that THIS instance/skill be the one to gain the boons and leave the majority of the thieve’s skills at current settings. Maybe this is just happy thinking thou…..maybe they felt bad for the poor ol’ thief to have to step back to his trap in order to move it :P

The ShadowTrap is perhaps one of the most elegantly designed skills there are: It is a skill modeled after a game mechanic which epitomizes the profession which carries it: shadowstep, only… It is slooowwwwwed down over much much time…and therefore given a greater range. The pursuit mechanism is basically a “yes” from the server stating “there IS an enemy w/in range for shadowstep”, only this internal check is not instant, but delayed. I am a designer myself and ArenaNet designers went over and beyond on this skill if you ask me. It is Very Very exquisitely designed.

Nerf it?… No…. Most people want to nerf skills which are TOO FAST!… "that DPS is THRU THE ROOF… (skills outputting damage at an excelled pace), not a skill which is sooooo slow that it doesn’t complete it’s “true” function, the shadowstep of the thief to the opponent, until they are actually able to do so…..

Thank You,
RogueTigeR

Dahkeus.8243:

Make it move you through terrain like mesmer portal and then put a timer on duration and limit on distance (same distance as mesmer portal imo). Hell, take off the stun break if you want, just let me use it to get up terrain like a mesmer portal can.

OMG YES! This would be perfect. It’s not like we don’t have 3 more other stun breaks but this would make JPs that much less stressful to comlete.

If it also gets portal’s cd (90s) ^^

Iavra.8510:

If it also gets portal’s cd (90s) ^^

Portal moves 20 people, shadowtrap moves 1. Why would it have the same cd?

10.000 range

Well no, you are right. But also consider that shadow trap (even as is currently) makes it near to impossible to ever catch a thief in a keep. Combined with players able to abuse the inactive counter (not getting kicked after lying dead for 15mins) makes a once opened keep keep (or at least the outer wall) impossible to fully close again.

As already stated, the real culprit is abusing the inactive-timer. Once killed, you should be kicked after a short amount of time (5 mins?) unless you wp first regardless of what you are doing (aside from getting ressed ofc).

Not sure Shadow Stepping will get you far with all the walls you typically find in a keep.

seriously this still isnt fixed?

idk y this skill would get a nerf—— buged sense launch

been to long the pathing problems just need to be fixed…. either fix the shadow step or throw in the towel and make it a port ….

but the skill just needs to be reliable it gets caught up way to much and is no more than a gamic for a couple knee slaps if your lucky and don’t get tripped up trying to use it

Nice necro.

Btw, they won’t fix this skill. They’re going to leave it as it is without saying a word, because they don’t want thieves having more mobility.

No valid path to target.

Need I say more?

Multiple threads have been created in regards to Shadow Trap and it’s pathing, including my old shadow trap thread. I don’t know when they will actually receive the message from their community though

The trap won’t need a nerf. But it definitely needs a fix.

Shadow step can never work as a teleport.
Mesmers need to fiscally go to both ends of the portal, shadow step does not, you would teleport to your ground target, that would mean you could teleport onto a keep wall (in wvwvw) or in PvP you could teleport to places that have no valid walk path and be unreachable to other players, and with deadeye around the corner imagine how it would be…

This wasn’t a problem at launch, it was a problem right after they decided they wanted it to not work correctly. I used to use it all the time but since they intentionally broke it I haven’t touched it since.