Guild Wars 2

hey guys,

I’m fairly new to the game and i’m trying to get a good theif build.

i have it set up now to where my thief causes alot of bleeding by caltrops and dodging…do you guys have any advice?

Thanks!

Don’t bother with a condition build in pvp (with a thief).
It has a limit on how many stacks and the damage is not enough, also many classes have conditioner removers and condition removers prioritize bleeding condition first (Anet themselves have confirmed this) so your main source of damage will get removed within seconds on the target.
It’s better to go with sustainability or mobility or pure burst damage.

The biggest problem with a build that runs caltrops is that an engie can provide point presence better (trapper ranger used to be popular for this reason as well). If you want to have the best capability of doing this type of playstyle, I’d recommend you play engie. They are generally better at 1v1 situations, and great at home and far points.

I have both , a thief dps and a thief confi and in fact, it s funnier the condi thief

You can easily win a 1 vs 2 holding a point.
Calldrop, dodge, Death blossom → evade all the time and you do lot of damage on several targets.
But as they said , if they have a condi remover it will be harder.

An Oak Knob.1275:

Don’t bother with a condition build in pvp (with a thief).
It has a limit on how many stacks and the damage is not enough, also many classes have conditioner removers and condition removers prioritize bleeding condition first (Anet themselves have confirmed this) so your main source of damage will get removed within seconds on the target.
It’s better to go with sustainability or mobility or pure burst damage.

Pretty much this, sadly.

I would enjoy a venom thief if it was viable but the higher level play you go, the less viable it is.

Condition Thieves can be really tough in WvW but they get carried there by the +40% Condition duration food and the ability to instant-gib people with Thieves Guild.

This isn’t viable in sPvP where you builds are less extreme and people run more condition removal.

I run a standard S/D build and every condition Thief I come across is useless. In a 1v1 they are easily countered by switching to Shortbow and while their condition pressure might catch you unprepared once in a while, most of the time they lose a straight-up fight.

And then there’s the fact that the Thief’s role is that of a mobile supporter and burst assist. And a condition build can’t fill that role.

There are 2 condition weapon types.

P/d which is slow, and short lasting. Also not much of a variety of conditions making condition removals not only prioritize, but easily pick off your main dps. Good condition builds don’t rely on 1 or 2 DoT’s, and sadly thief has no choice.

D/d which is predictable, and the evade is half the duration of the attack, making it rather clumsy in terms of staying afloat. It applies a great bleed stack/duration but its so silly watching thieves try it, as the actual attack moves only about 300-400 units and doesn’t stay on top of your target, you have to position yourself to get all 3 hits off.

It’s a sad state, but that’s where thief condition builds rest atm. Until something gets changed soon I would avoid using them, other condition builds do much better with more reward.

NinjaEd.3946:

P/d which is slow, and short lasting. Also not much of a variety of conditions making condition removals not only prioritize, but easily pick off your main dps. Good condition builds don’t rely on 1 or 2 DoT’s, and sadly thief has no choice.

You could run sigils of doom (as p/d+d/d or dual p/d), for poison, and the 15 point minor in Deadly Arts for weakness. You have vulnerability and immobilize on #2, torment on the #3, criple on #4 and vulnerability on #5. Who’s saying there are few conditions for a P/D? And that is without even adding venoms.

P/D is a very durable and reliable condition build for Wvw. It’s a bit too safe and slow for general PvE though, but caltrops is very effective against npc and the build will let you solo many champs.

Lord.4270:

I have both , a thief dps and a thief confi and in fact, it s funnier the condi thief

You can easily win a 1 vs 2 holding a point.
Calldrop, dodge, Death blossom -> evade all the time and you do lot of damage on several targets.
But as they said , if they have a condi remover it will be harder.

if u totally spam the junk out of 3 (deathblossom) in d/d build….u only have about 20% evade time. just sayin’ its actually a very risky skill. 20% is being generous too.

Well, what type of content do you like? PvE PvP, or WvW?

P/D + Sb can be viable as a roamer for Tpvp and WvW, I run it
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fYAQNAqYVlUmKPHfy0E/5EB3Dna0m6p4ritTBWlPA-TsAgyCuIgRNjbGDMSfs+MCY9xcBA

Requiem.8769:

Well, what type of content do you like? PvE PvP, or WvW?

PvE and WvW.

PvE because I the player is mostly in controll.
WvW because of the challenge but also the option to be a roamer.

I don’t like Pvp though, too many other classes can counter me and I have a harder time countering them.

There is a limit of 25 bleed stacks on a target and that cap to be hit in dungeons and world events. Fortunately most players know this and don’t stack many bleeds so you can often get away with it in dungeons.

Man, every 2 months or so I check the forums specifically to see if they made condi thief viable in spvp and wvw… I haven’t played in months because it just depressed the heck out of me with the state its in.

I always figured if they added 5 stacks of bleed to back stab then this build would work but not even that has been done since I quit =/

Or maybe adding a thief mechanic to intensify raw damage based on stacks of bleed on the target.

Loading the game today though to check it out again over the vacation… maybe I can find something I like that I missed a year ago instead of longing for something that’s never going to happen…

Condi thief is very fun though… just that I can’t take that fun game mechanic to wvw unless I’m camp clearing.

frans.8092:

NinjaEd.3946:

P/d which is slow, and short lasting. Also not much of a variety of conditions making condition removals not only prioritize, but easily pick off your main dps. Good condition builds don’t rely on 1 or 2 DoT’s, and sadly thief has no choice.

You could run sigils of doom (as p/d+d/d or dual p/d), for poison, and the 15 point minor in Deadly Arts for weakness. You have vulnerability and immobilize on #2, torment on the #3, criple on #4 and vulnerability on #5. Who’s saying there are few conditions for a P/D? And that is without even adding venoms.

P/D is a very durable and reliable condition build for Wvw. It’s a bit too safe and slow for general PvE though, but caltrops is very effective against npc and the build will let you solo many champs.

Venoms are not as reliable, because blind/evade/invulnerable/block negates it and consumes a charge, and its a rather long cd for just conditions. Caltrops are great, but unless your fighting someone with tunnel vision they aren’t going to dance with you in a puddle of metal, the red circle is rather obvious. Immobilize is 1 second, hardly breaching 2 seconds if you wana go insane with condition duration, 15 into DA for p/d means the only source of poison you get is stealing, and that’s not frequent for p/d. Vulnerability lasts a few seconds, and the torment is short lasting as well even with good condition duration gear. I’ve messed with p/d and I’m not main condi thief, so it could be my order was wrong but I wasn’t exactly overwhelming people. Even with dodging in their face, #3, steal, #3, #4 through combo fields (100% finisher) and constant use of caltrops both on dodge and utility + stealth skill I wasn’t melting things even with 1200 condition damage and my aa bleed lasting almost 6 seconds. It’s just too slow imo, the aa needs to be sped up and the stealth attack needs to last much longer.

If bleeds are to be the main source of dps on p/d, don’t make it a ridiculous investment just to pull off mediocre dmg that engi or ele can pull off in a fraction of the time with burn. Against profesions or builds that lack good condi clearing, yes p/d works fairly well and keeps the enemy guessing. But in pvp most people have that, because they go into the mists already knowing the basic needs of a well structured build.

The biggest issues I see with condition thief is
-Natural condition duration of skills. This is expected because most of our skills are technically spammable, but bleeds need to be stacked high to deal any good dmg and if they’re wearing off b4 then it defeats the purpose.
-crutches to maintain good condition stacking, like caltrops. Some classes can get conditions from various places, and use their utility skills as stun breakers, condition removers, boon access, w/e. Thief is almost obligated to use caltrops to help keep bleeds up.

NinjaEd.3946:

frans.8092:

NinjaEd.3946:

P/d which is slow, and short lasting. Also not much of a variety of conditions making condition removals not only prioritize, but easily pick off your main dps. Good condition builds don’t rely on 1 or 2 DoT’s, and sadly thief has no choice.

You could run sigils of doom (as p/d+d/d or dual p/d), for poison, and the 15 point minor in Deadly Arts for weakness. You have vulnerability and immobilize on #2, torment on the #3, criple on #4 and vulnerability on #5. Who’s saying there are few conditions for a P/D? And that is without even adding venoms.

P/D is a very durable and reliable condition build for Wvw. It’s a bit too safe and slow for general PvE though, but caltrops is very effective against npc and the build will let you solo many champs.

Venoms are not as reliable, because blind/evade/invulnerable/block negates it and consumes a charge, and its a rather long cd for just conditions. Caltrops are great, but unless your fighting someone with tunnel vision they aren’t going to dance with you in a puddle of metal, the red circle is rather obvious. Immobilize is 1 second, hardly breaching 2 seconds if you wana go insane with condition duration, 15 into DA for p/d means the only source of poison you get is stealing, and that’s not frequent for p/d. Vulnerability lasts a few seconds, and the torment is short lasting as well even with good condition duration gear. I’ve messed with p/d and I’m not main condi thief, so it could be my order was wrong but I wasn’t exactly overwhelming people. Even with dodging in their face, #3, steal, #3, #4 through combo fields (100% finisher) and constant use of caltrops both on dodge and utility + stealth skill I wasn’t melting things even with 1200 condition damage and my aa bleed lasting almost 6 seconds. It’s just too slow imo, the aa needs to be sped up and the stealth attack needs to last much longer.

P/D isn’t going to kill fast, though it’s not always slow. NPC’s will melt with caltrops (and a bit of condition damage/duration boost), at least the melee will dance around in it. You can usually switch out utilities when out-of-combat, so you’re not stuck with it.

Sigil of Doom with some condition duration plus the DA adept trait will net you plenty of poison uptime, it’s used to reduce healing and with the 15 DA minor you apply weakness with poison, which hampers their endurance regen. You will not melt many players easily but it offers a lot of durability and that gives you time to adapt to the situation, which is nice when you’re learning.

The biggest issues I see with condition thief is
…

I am not going to deny those. Just saying you got more conditions then bleed you can apply (on P/D) though most are tactical more then damage.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fYAQRAqY4alUmaPHfS6E/5EB3jki0m694rj1saFoJA-TwAgyCuIKSVkrITRyisFNCYFw2jpHA

can take down just about anyone and is useful for team fights with utilities changed (For example:caltrops) But it is very successful without caltrops.

Conditions in PvE, despite naysayers, have their rightful place. In dungeons, most people are running full zerker builds, so you’ll most likely not deal with overlapping conditions ruining your dps. That said, conditions do a lot less damage than direct damage builds, so it’s mostly a play style choice if you decide to go full condition damage. I would recommend Rampager gear with ruby orbs so you still do decent direct damage and apply good condition damage at the same time.

During large scale PvE events, however, conditions fall off due to limitations that ANet has yet to address properly. Just be mindful of this.