Guild Wars 2

People who know me also know that I complained about a bug that let my CnD miss everything (speaking of wvw mostly and it was also buggy in pve).
That bug was shortly gone and is now back as it seems (very hard to find real 1 vs 1 ‘s in wvw). I have no idea if it’s this time server lag (guess not) but it looks the same like the stuff I’ve had with CnD for 1,5 years. My internet connection is at a flawless 26 ping (pingplotter check).

Just saying: not all is fine, CnD and/or D/D thief still needs some attention when it comes to programming.

Not seen an issue while I use s/d

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Not seen an issue while I use s/d

I really need to get a plane to the gw2 headquarters so someone explains to me why on earth I have this bug.

Btw: Are you using CnD only with steal?

Actually, I guess I know what my problem is, auto targeting. Question is if I can finally make it work without it as I never could.

ETA: And it seems as if that was/is the problem (stuff is still autotargeted even if turned off) – need to test it in wvw still though.
Anet, pretty please, could you work on that? I can’t manually click on everything and the “next enemy” and “nearest enemy” options don’t work properly as well – if they would that would be enough for me.
Also it would be cool to lose target automatically if watching a wall and being attacked – but that is superior stuff that’s not THAT needed.

You’re telling me all this time you had auto-targeting on? -.-

Yes, I’m a “girl” – what do you expect?
Besides: it worked before and inbetween.

As a P/D player I have no issues with the performance of CnD.

I wish I could be more helpful though as far as solutions to your issues with the skill :/

whats probably happening is your auto target is procing your holding run butten the target is at -90 degree angle of angle your thief is directly facing causing the skill instantly cancel itself.

i have not played with auto targeting turn on for 3 years but i can tell you with it turn off it working perfectly fine.

I didn’t get the firt part to be honest – and really have problems to play without autotarget. I can’t always manually click on target that fast – so how do you guys do it?

I turned it off for a testrun in PvE and there’s still target promoting which doesn’t work as well – it’s better but I’d really have to manually click everything if I want to hit.

key bind nearest target and next target. You now have 3 options to target some1 in case its too slow to click or what not

I’m having troubles with targeting lately, or decided to tinker around with the options, and “nearest target” doesn’t work at all for me. Sometimes the mob behind me is targeted, next target doesn’t work after that button and so on.

The only thing that halfway works (only tested in pve for now) is next target, or clicking manually.

Jana.6831:

Yes, I’m a “girl” – what do you expect?
Besides: it worked before and inbetween.

Hey, don’t generalize like this. I haven’t had auto target on for years. Then again i play d/p – auto target is suicide on dp.

I just use tab binded to next enemy, call target, target called target, mouse click – those suffice for me. Never had issues targeting anything with it, even mes among 1000 clones.

Cynz.9437:

Hey, don’t generalize like this. I haven’t had auto target on for years. Then again i play d/p – auto target is suicide on dp.

I just use tab binded to next enemy, call target, target called target, mouse click – those suffice for me. Never had issues targeting anything with it, even mes among 1000 clones.

I knew that at least Deceiver would say something like “whaaa autotarget – you noob” that’s why I tried to take the fire out of that. I know that other girls are more pro than I :P (and I mean that).

Next target is really the only thing that halfway works and that only without auto target.
If I have 5 enemies around and want to hit the one who’s right in front of me, do I really have to click on him? That’s my issue, I guess, and autotargeting took care of that until 1,5 years ago and by then I forgot that I’m using it. I just remembered it because my unknown Gandara ally was killed because I jumped against the wall I had in target. Sorry unknown guy, at least I solved (?) what plagued me – that’s a plus, right?

honestly you do not need to target anything on a melee weapon(for any class) because they use a neutral Z axis so regardless of camera angle you play at your skill always achieve max range they can cast at.

major down side to using auto targeting is you lose all control over where your hero.

so then it would come down to you just need to be fast enough to click on your target if you want to steal on them or use a skill that require targeting.

But even without auto targeting I should click on my target, because otherwise the target assist will trigger again and chances are that I won’t hit what I wanted to hit. Like I said, haven’t tried it in wvw yet and just killed stuff in pve which happend to be rather far apart, but the “next target” button usually selects the second target that’s farther way. I will try that some more the next days.

And where do I lose control over? I’ll never lose control over Jost (he’s my one and only hero).

if you use a leap skill near player auto target it leap toward the target over leaping you away can cause annoying problems.

I’m a D/D power thief, I don’t use Black Powder – so far leaping has been worse without auto target as far as I remember – mixing up when I tried what, but I did have troubles with leaping recently.

yeah but skill 2 on dagger is heart seeker so if you are within 450 range of a player auto target go oh you wanted to hit that dude so it take you toward it but some time you use heart seeker simply to move around and auto target will not allow you to do that.

Jana.6831:

Cynz.9437:

Hey, don’t generalize like this. I haven’t had auto target on for years. Then again i play d/p – auto target is suicide on dp.

I just use tab binded to next enemy, call target, target called target, mouse click – those suffice for me. Never had issues targeting anything with it, even mes among 1000 clones.

I knew that at least Deceiver would say something like “whaaa autotarget – you noob” that’s why I tried to take the fire out of that. I know that other girls are more pro than I :P (and I mean that).

Next target is really the only thing that halfway works and that only without auto target.
If I have 5 enemies around and want to hit the one who’s right in front of me, do I really have to click on him? That’s my issue, I guess, and autotargeting took care of that until 1,5 years ago and by then I forgot that I’m using it. I just remembered it because my unknown Gandara ally was killed because I jumped against the wall I had in target. Sorry unknown guy, at least I solved (?) what plagued me – that’s a plus, right?

I’m not sexist, sheesh. Women are just as capable as men are to move around a mouse and press buttons.

Woman or not, doesn’t stop you from being an autotarget noob ;D No excuses here, particularly not by throwing the rest of the gals under the bus to escape being labeled scrubby :P

In all seriousness, though, it comes with practice. Moving from any control scheme to another, you’ll be slower at first, but these are just the kinds of things you need to accept to get better and solve such issues. Tab target is your friend, though I only prefer it pretty much in PvE just in case I end up not selecting the target I actually wanted (only usually happens in congested places and I recommend not depending on it since so many gank groups like to run identical-looking characters), and in most cases in PvP environments on D/D you don’t really even need to target the enemy player at all for anything except steal; even Dancing Dagger PbAoE’s, although it needs to be aligned perfectly and quite literally be like < 30 range (so targeting is kind of a big deal for that one). When ganked by another thief, I typically infil signet -> CnD with nothing selected (if not blinded, as odds are the thief is adjacent) or DB or dodge and during the evade frames select the target for the counterattack, just because I know It’d take me a fraction of a second longer to stunbreak/retaliate an interrupt on steal into a combo after being hit by surprise, and there might just not be that time available. Even HS has a hitbox and functions without a target if you space it reasonably well.

You pretty much just need to keep track of where your mouse is when rotating the camera. I’ve gotten into the habit of unconsciously centering it on my character at a specific position on my desk whenever I’m done not moving the camera but moving the mouse. Ultimately building up mouse movement comfort will come in time when using more of the mouse.

I’m going to make a short-term recommendation for practicing which I’d normally never do otherwise, and want to make it absolutely clear that you should never do this for your actual play: Start clicking your skills in training on top of using no autotarget. I know, I can’t believe I’m recommending this; it seems ridiculous, but sweeping all around the screen with the mouse in and out of camera mode will make you get better at keeping track of where it is in relation to the screen and more comfortable of switching between free mouse/camera. You’re going to suck and be slow, and clicking will cause you to lose a ton of speed (and you’ll never reach the point of what you get on a keyboard), but you will see a profound increase in your target selection and overall speed in your mouse hand. Just be sure you don’t get too comfortable with it and end up being a skill-clicker :P

I started as a clicker and still am running around in blobs. We had a very short time in which the mouse cursor was always centered on the screen – I so wish that was an option.
I will try to make my non auto target combat work – I’m pretty sure this time around I’ll make it.

Thanks guys and in all seriousness: I love you – we tried to kill each other over the years but there’s no real grudge – thanks for that =)

Jana.6831:

I started as a clicker and still am running around in blobs. We had a very short time in which the mouse cursor was always centered on the screen – I so wish that was an option.

Uh you do know about action camera right?

Look in your keybinds and the action cam toggle keybind. When active, action cam places a dot in the middle of the screen that is functionally your cursor. When running action cam right click is select/deselect target at the dot. left click is your 1 skill.

I can’t play the game any other way. Mouse wheel click is a perfect place for the toggle imho. Hope it helps.

Weirsd. Never would of thought that auto target would do that. I have the target option on, forgot it’s name now but for example if I use rush on and in selected target then target mid rush, the skill would change direction to that target but I doubt that will do anything to melee hit’s.

And no cnd worked normally for me as I use it vs clones/pets.

Eval.2371:

Uh you do know about action camera right?

Look in your keybinds and the action cam toggle keybind. When active, action cam places a dot in the middle of the screen that is functionally your cursor. When running action cam right click is select/deselect target at the dot. left click is your 1 skill.

I can’t play the game any other way. Mouse wheel click is a perfect place for the toggle imho. Hope it helps.

I tried it – doesn’t work for me. And I’m not so sure I could make it work because my playstyle is a bit weird and probably not how others play – If I’m hitting someone I’m running sideways.

Fun fact: My first post on the forums was: “Anet your targeting sucks”.

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Weirsd. Never would of thought that auto target would do that. I have the target option on, forgot it’s name now but for example if I use rush on and in selected target then target mid rush, the skill would change direction to that target but I doubt that will do anything to melee hit’s.

And no cnd worked normally for me as I use it vs clones/pets.

I have the most troubles if the target moves, clones and even pets often don’t.
And maybe there’s more than one reason for my “misses”.
With mesmers I mostly hit their clones when trying to BS them and even having them in target. But that was with auto target.

You can actually try CnD with and without auto target. If you’re used to click “next target” you will probably not notice a difference, but if the target isn’t selected the chances that you’ll miss are pretty high – even in PvE. And in wvw it was really bad tonight, for whatever reason, maybe I was tired.

How do you cnd stealthed foes? Use (hold) right click whike pamming the camera, aiming at your target while using cnd…you can easily do a 180 spin and land cnd from face to back

Maybe you can toggle action cam on, select someone, and then toggle it off. The targeting with action cam is smooth and you don’t need to be really precise with it.

I do that sometimes on p/p.

I never saw you play, but It might be one of the most epic thing to see :p I’m joking here, but still curious.

Eval.2371:

Jana.6831:

I started as a clicker and still am running around in blobs. We had a very short time in which the mouse cursor was always centered on the screen – I so wish that was an option.

Uh you do know about action camera right?

Look in your keybinds and the action cam toggle keybind. When active, action cam places a dot in the middle of the screen that is functionally your cursor. When running action cam right click is select/deselect target at the dot. left click is your 1 skill.

I can’t play the game any other way. Mouse wheel click is a perfect place for the toggle imho. Hope it helps.

Action cam is like the worst for pvp/wvw lol. It forces you in tunnelvision.

Jana.6831:

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Weirsd. Never would of thought that auto target would do that. I have the target option on, forgot it’s name now but for example if I use rush on and in selected target then target mid rush, the skill would change direction to that target but I doubt that will do anything to melee hit’s.

And no cnd worked normally for me as I use it vs clones/pets.

I have the most troubles if the target moves, clones and even pets often don’t.
And maybe there’s more than one reason for my “misses”.
With mesmers I mostly hit their clones when trying to BS them and even having them in target. But that was with auto target.

You can actually try CnD with and without auto target. If you’re used to click “next target” you will probably not notice a difference, but if the target isn’t selected the chances that you’ll miss are pretty high – even in PvE. And in wvw it was really bad tonight, for whatever reason, maybe I was tired.

It happens even without auto-target. It is rather buggy and been like that since launch. I even had my character turn around and backstab a pet instead of enemy i am targeting and don’t have auto-target on soooo….. I reported it couple times but Anet as always couldn’t care less as long as it only affects thief.

As far as next target goes – i just have cam zoomed out almost at max – gives you great field view and you can target most of enemies. In pvp anyway since maps are small.

Oh now that i think about – nice thing about pvp is you have standard models so you don’t have to struggle targeting tiny asuras in middle of miriad of minions. They probably should add such feature to WvW tbh.

Wargameur.6950:

Maybe you can toggle action cam on, select someone, and then toggle it off. The targeting with action cam is smooth and you don’t need to be really precise with it.

I do that sometimes on p/p.

I never saw you play, but It might be one of the most epic thing to see :p I’m joking here, but still curious.

I have no time to toggle.
Yeah, it probably is. If my thief wasn’t that broken I’d make some videos.
But hey a few days ago a condi mes I fought for 15 mins came knocking on or door so I would duel him again. I just passed him, he had perma aegis.

Cynz.9437:

It happens even without auto-target. It is rather buggy and been like that since launch. I even had my character turn around and backstab a pet instead of enemy i am targeting and don’t have auto-target on soooo….. I reported it couple times but Anet as always couldn’t care less as long as it only affects thief.

As far as next target goes – i just have cam zoomed out almost at max – gives you great field view and you can target most of enemies. In pvp anyway since maps are small.

Oh now that i think about – nice thing about pvp is you have standard models so you don’t have to struggle targeting tiny asuras in middle of miriad of minions. They probably should add such feature to WvW tbh.

I know, I think anet changed that because mesmers were complaining (it has become worse but that might be because of my auto target), it is still annoying.
All that’s left in wvw is small scale or monsterblobs, it’s very hard to find single enemies because the balance is so broken, but I have to admit that I haven’t really seen Asuras for a while. All that’s left is human/norn female bunker druids, female sylvari eles, human male dragonhunters and charr zerker berserkers. And necros, but they’re usually a pile of cloth – hard to tell what race.

Might reduce some lag too

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Might reduce some lag too

I live pretty close to EU servers and have around 20-40 ms – better couldn’t be lol. But the bug with pets taking the backstab instead of target does exist.

Is it a bug or more of hit box issue?

Rangers (and mesmers) asked for that, so the latter.

Play visually for awhile and hunt for targets based on what they look like. I use both left and right mouse to manually pick targets, right mouse feels more natural as it’s the one I use for movement/look at the same time but left mouse is deliberate and wont begin attack right away if you’re staggering things out. You’ll also want to have untarget under your control and learning to click dead space so you can use skills for evades or leaps should help building eye to muscle memory for pointing where you want and don’t use action camera.

I know it’s a pain, I still have old reactions from playing first person shooters for so long before mmo’s, so I’m a spaz with my mouse reticle. Find some large groups in a core world map and just imagine your mouse pointer is your weapon, you’ll make some unnecessary pointer movements but you’ll get used to targeting visually.

Cynz.9437:

Eval.2371:

Jana.6831:

I started as a clicker and still am running around in blobs. We had a very short time in which the mouse cursor was always centered on the screen – I so wish that was an option.

Uh you do know about action camera right?

Look in your keybinds and the action cam toggle keybind. When active, action cam places a dot in the middle of the screen that is functionally your cursor. When running action cam right click is select/deselect target at the dot. left click is your 1 skill.

I can’t play the game any other way. Mouse wheel click is a perfect place for the toggle imho. Hope it helps.

Action cam is like the worst for pvp/wvw lol. It forces you in tunnelvision.

Jana.6831:

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Weirsd. Never would of thought that auto target would do that. I have the target option on, forgot it’s name now but for example if I use rush on and in selected target then target mid rush, the skill would change direction to that target but I doubt that will do anything to melee hit’s.

And no cnd worked normally for me as I use it vs clones/pets.

I have the most troubles if the target moves, clones and even pets often don’t.
And maybe there’s more than one reason for my “misses”.
With mesmers I mostly hit their clones when trying to BS them and even having them in target. But that was with auto target.

You can actually try CnD with and without auto target. If you’re used to click “next target” you will probably not notice a difference, but if the target isn’t selected the chances that you’ll miss are pretty high – even in PvE. And in wvw it was really bad tonight, for whatever reason, maybe I was tired.

It happens even without auto-target. It is rather buggy and been like that since launch. I even had my character turn around and backstab a pet instead of enemy i am targeting and don’t have auto-target on soooo….. I reported it couple times but Anet as always couldn’t care less as long as it only affects thief.

As far as next target goes – i just have cam zoomed out almost at max – gives you great field view and you can target most of enemies. In pvp anyway since maps are small.

Oh now that i think about – nice thing about pvp is you have standard models so you don’t have to struggle targeting tiny asuras in middle of miriad of minions. They probably should add such feature to WvW tbh.

Eval is super good at action cam. Just throwing that out there. Superzoom is beneficial for small-zone spacial awareness, though action camera has its own separate benefits such as targetless projectiles. Majorly-zoomed-out camera isn’t a necessity in WvW if you’re quick since you can’t keep an eye on a substantial portion of the map, anyways, unless you’re doing some kind of siege/AC usage over a wall or somesuch, but even then, siege resets your camera to where you had it last if you zoom out when using it. Which does bring back a benefit to a closer zoom – you do get slightly further-ahead sight distance with the closer camera, which can help for setting up plays and scouting in WvW.

…

Backstab has an attack hitbox, and can thus be bodyblocked, like all hitbox-based abilities, even if you have a target behind it selected. Mesmers often run clone generation on dodge or stealth/decoy, so bodyblocking happens regularly with them. It’s not a bug but just the way clones are generated getting in the way and how single-target skills in the game are treated in general, except for true single-target/non-hitboxed skills like Necro’s Axe.

I’m also almost positive standard models can be displayed in all formats, including PvE, since it also helps with performance problems on low-end PC’s. If it’s not there now, it definitely was at one point, since I’ve personally used the option in blobs in WvW in the past.

i tried using action cam my personal view on it is it horrible everything about it make me frustrated but probably because i played 4 years with out it lol.

You don’t need action camera, hold right mouse button does the same thing.

I’m basically a noob again and that sucks “ahaha look at this platinum rank who just leaped into nothing”. It will take me a few weeks until I’m used to combat without auto target.
It was definitively my problem and D/D works better without it. In zergfights I’ll have to spam tab instead of F now, otherwise I’m not hitting anything with auto attack.

Tried actioncam again but I twist and turn too much – too fast for the cam.

I can’t do it either, and I prefer holding RMB down, but to each his own.

Yo anet, if you read this and decide to fix auto targeting (to how it has been) – please note that in the patchnotes.

Honestly, what currently baffles me is why there’s so little emphasis on combat in this game.

ETA: Daggerstorm is about a third worse without auto target. So if we’re talking about what should be balanced we now need to say which game mode and which targeting mode we use so that others get where we’re coming from… …. ….
Or I need to decide: “I’m going to do some solo roaming, so auto target off – waaah a blob fight, I need my auto target LET ME OC SO THAT I CAN SWITCH.”

Jana.6831:

Yo anet, if you read this and decide to fix auto targeting (to how it has been) – please note that in the patchnotes.

Honestly, what currently baffles me is why there’s so little emphasis on combat in this game.

ETA: Daggerstorm is about a third worse without auto target. So if we’re talking about what should be balanced we now need to say which game mode and which targeting mode we use so that others get where we’re coming from… …. ….
Or I need to decide: “I’m going to do some solo roaming, so auto target off – waaah a blob fight, I need my auto target LET ME OC SO THAT I CAN SWITCH.”

I don’t understand how daggerStorm is worse without auto targetting…..

I’m not really sure either, since reflects don’t need it and the skill’s a target-less AoE.

For daggerstorm you don’t want to have a target, otherwise the program thinks you want to only hit that target.

So yeah, I’m not a happy camper right now because I really have problems to make manual targeting work for me.

ETA: I’m still hitting others around that, but it’s less hits than with auto target or without having anyone in target. At least it seems so, you guys know I’m the emotional thief.

I’ve never experienced DS not hitting players which aren’t my target.

Granted, I haven’t used DS in probably over two years.

Yeah and it seems as if targeting, no matter if auto or manual, is a work in progress, some days I can hit mobs while turning 180 degree, other days I miss.

I haven’t really been in wvw lately, but it seems as if manual target works a lot better against enemy players, wheras it’s good/worse against mobs in PvE.

i can tell you that i personally have almost every assist option turn off in the game simply do to having no control over them.

the link show option of what i run i do not know if it will help you but i used it for last 4 years

http://i.imgur.com/j0hEblG.jpg

Auto target worked really fine for me – and it seems as if I’m really missing it.
That’s just my playstyle – sounds weird but it is true, I don’t always concentrate on one target, I might CnD on one guy and BS the next – all pretty complicated with manual target.

if you want to CnD 1 target you can do it with out targeting same with back stab only time you need targeting is if you are using something that require targeting. if you want i make you a mini video showing it ?

You always need a target for CnD to hit halfway properly – otherwise it switches to auto target and then the target might not be your target anymore. Same with BS lately as it seems.
I don’t need a video for that, but thanks =)

You guys can always try it yourselves.
How I came to what my problem was was really that I tried to hit the guy in front of me and jumped against a wall “Umm, maybe CnD doesn’t hit because the program thinks I have something else in target” and it seems as if that is true.
But, like I said, anet doesn’t really say whether or not they’re tinkering around with targeting but it seems they do, so what is true today might not be true tomorrow.