Guild Wars 2

saerni.2584:

So are you interested in the build or just name calling? Your choice, because frankly I don’t have time to entertain your petty attitude.

So I have a petty attitude because I humored you by saying everybody likes to run sub-optimal stuff every now and then? That was the truth, btw. I hardly ever run meta. But I see clearly that the builds I use are sub-optimal, to say the least. That doesn’t mean you can’t make it work, but sticking my head up my behind and ignoring that I am intentionally gimping myself compared to another build won’t do me any good.

You assumed I didn’t want to know your build, but off course I do. Who wouldn’t be interested in this meta-breaking SA build?

And you obviously have plenty of time to entertain me.

You asked so I’ll explain. I’m sure there are other SA theory crafted builds out there that benefit in different ways but this is my perspective at least.

P/D, as a condi build, uses stealth attacks to stack bleeds and also defensively to break target. The auto attack damage is “ok” but if you want to kill things having stealth and then stealth attacking are imperative. It is important to note that a ranged main hand will not always be near to a target and therefore won’t always be able to rely on CnD to gain stealth.

Looking to sources of stealth, Hide in Shadows has a long cooldown, but provides condi clear and stealth. This makes it ideal for both defense and damage in this set as long as the cooldown issue is addressed. SA has the cooldown reduction needed. As a bonus this also makes Shadowstep, a “must have” for many thieves, 40 seconds (30 seconds after the return ability expires).

P/D also doesn’t need to use CnD directly for damage. This makes gaining stealth upon steal an attractive option rather than a steal CnD combo. All stealth lasts for 1 second longer and this also helps you when you Sneak Attack at random moments over the slightly longer period. The defensive buff in stealth is nice as well for what it’s worth.

The addition of Rending Shade turns my frequent Sneak Attacks into boon stealing attacks. This let’s me strip stability, protection, regeneration, and resistance. Warriors get shorter periods of resistance and boon heavy classes in general can’t rely on them as much. This trait is very powerful if you are using stealth attacks frequently.

The rest of the build isn’t SA specific so I won’t go into that. The main point is that stealth attacks still matter for my build and SA helps quite a bit in that category both by improving access and the quality of the attacks via Rending Shade.

I have two builds that use SA now , one a P/d for condition where I maximize sneak attack, and one I am trying and tinkering with on power.

The power one I reserve judgment on , but the P/d condition build is made optimal by using SA line. I have toyed with every combination and SA is ideal.

Out of the line I find Hidden thief and RS core to the design of the build. I can flip between SE and the lower deception cooldown having no real preference as both do the job. The need for RS obvious as it how i can strip away boon heavy builds . Hidden thief for combat speed while stealthed so as to shift map location and that nice condition burst on steal (Preload Needle>steal>sneak attack>shadowstrike away with only ini used that off the shadowstrike) That burst applies 5 poison , 8 bleed, 2 torment, 5 confusion , weakness , 5 vuln, an Immob that lasts over 5 seconds and grants 5 might.

It also steals 5 boons off the target in one steal attack combo. At times this can be all a player might stacks, his resistance, regen protection and stability in one swoop. This hardly “suboptimal”.

There certainly an “optimal time” to use that steal burst but timed properly it can end a fight quickly and on p/d condition just can not be done without SA. (Doing this if already stealthed is extra wicked)

saerni.2584:

You asked so I’ll explain. I’m sure there are other SA theory crafted builds out there that benefit in different ways but this is my perspective at least.

P/D, as a condi build, uses stealth attacks to stack bleeds and also defensively to break target. The auto attack damage is “ok” but if you want to kill things having stealth and then stealth attacking are imperative. It is important to note that a ranged main hand will not always be near to a target and therefore won’t always be able to rely on CnD to gain stealth.

Looking to sources of stealth, Hide in Shadows has a long cooldown, but provides condi clear and stealth. This makes it ideal for both defense and damage in this set as long as the cooldown issue is addressed. SA has the cooldown reduction needed. As a bonus this also makes Shadowstep, a “must have” for many thieves, 40 seconds (30 seconds after the return ability expires).

P/D also doesn’t need to use CnD directly for damage. This makes gaining stealth upon steal an attractive option rather than a steal CnD combo. All stealth lasts for 1 second longer and this also helps you when you Sneak Attack at random moments over the slightly longer period. The defensive buff in stealth is nice as well for what it’s worth.

The addition of Rending Shade turns my frequent Sneak Attacks into boon stealing attacks. This let’s me strip stability, protection, regeneration, and resistance. Warriors get shorter periods of resistance and boon heavy classes in general can’t rely on them as much. This trait is very powerful if you are using stealth attacks frequently.

The rest of the build isn’t SA specific so I won’t go into that. The main point is that stealth attacks still matter for my build and SA helps quite a bit in that category both by improving access and the quality of the attacks via Rending Shade.

It sounds good, and it’s nothing I haven’t come up with myself. But, P/D as a set is sub-optimal to begin with, so any traitline wouldn’t change that.

With venoms it is a remarkable build with strong range pressure. Not meta but that really doesn’t mean much. I beat meta thieves all the time.

saerni.2584:

With venoms it is a remarkable build with strong range pressure. Not meta but that really doesn’t mean much. I beat meta thieves all the time.

That’s not what we were talking about though. I beat meta all the time, because who the hell likes meta?

Too many people who insist a weapon set isn’t viable. Presumably because it isn’t in the meta. Sorry for mistaking you as one of them.

Cygnus.6903:

saerni.2584:

20k ish HP for full dire. Less if they run some trailblazers or other set.

Once they are forced out of stealth they will be burning initiative to regain it. You just need to interrupt their leap and force BP to expire to make them stay visible. Drop AoE traps on top of yourself and then more AoE on the BP if they are in stealth.

20k HP on something with 3k defense is pretty disgusting…

Once they are out of stealth, they can dodge, dodge again, dodge again, dodge yet again, use shadow step, use shortbow 5, really. A thief that doesn’t use this decease of a build is hard enough to kill. Ghosts still retain enough of those options to survive a few seconds of reveal.

‘You just need to interrupt the leap’. For a lot of classes that means you have to reach the BP first.

People acting like it’s easy to do anything against this build are almost as bad as it’s users.

Where does ghost thief get its ability to dodge dodge dodge and dodge again? They give up Acro and DD so as to trait in DA, Sa and trickery. They have two dodges.

babazhook.6805:

Cygnus.6903:

saerni.2584:

20k ish HP for full dire. Less if they run some trailblazers or other set.

Once they are forced out of stealth they will be burning initiative to regain it. You just need to interrupt their leap and force BP to expire to make them stay visible. Drop AoE traps on top of yourself and then more AoE on the BP if they are in stealth.

20k HP on something with 3k defense is pretty disgusting…

Once they are out of stealth, they can dodge, dodge again, dodge again, dodge yet again, use shadow step, use shortbow 5, really. A thief that doesn’t use this decease of a build is hard enough to kill. Ghosts still retain enough of those options to survive a few seconds of reveal.

‘You just need to interrupt the leap’. For a lot of classes that means you have to reach the BP first.

People acting like it’s easy to do anything against this build are almost as bad as it’s users.

Where does ghost thief get its ability to dodge dodge dodge and dodge again? They give up Acro and DD so as to trait in DA, Sa and trickery. They have two dodges.

I play da/trick/DD on my P/D condi trapper, dash and the DD heal give good dodges and mobility but I don’t permastealth and have minimal cleanse. Pretty sure the build he’s talking about is that old 30/30/30/30/30 build cropping up again.

That said, the reason I don’t permastealth is because with 20k health, 3.3k armor, dash mobility, shadow trap to engage or ooc, a 3 second invuln and 2.65k condi damage on a full spike I rarely find I need that much stealth anyways.

Worst crap that ever hit GW2.

saerni.2584:

Too many people who insist a weapon set isn’t viable. Presumably because it isn’t in the meta. Sorry for mistaking you as one of them.

Make it personal all you want. I said you are gimping yourself using P/D, and you do. You know you do.

That doesn’t mean you can’t use it with reasonable success, especially in WvW. But I already mentioned all of this, why do I even keep trying?

babazhook.6805:

Cygnus.6903:

saerni.2584:

20k ish HP for full dire. Less if they run some trailblazers or other set.

Once they are forced out of stealth they will be burning initiative to regain it. You just need to interrupt their leap and force BP to expire to make them stay visible. Drop AoE traps on top of yourself and then more AoE on the BP if they are in stealth.

20k HP on something with 3k defense is pretty disgusting…

Once they are out of stealth, they can dodge, dodge again, dodge again, dodge yet again, use shadow step, use shortbow 5, really. A thief that doesn’t use this decease of a build is hard enough to kill. Ghosts still retain enough of those options to survive a few seconds of reveal.

‘You just need to interrupt the leap’. For a lot of classes that means you have to reach the BP first.

People acting like it’s easy to do anything against this build are almost as bad as it’s users.

Where does ghost thief get its ability to dodge dodge dodge and dodge again? They give up Acro and DD so as to trait in DA, Sa and trickery. They have two dodges.

Amazing. After all I’ve said, this is all you come up with.

GG with this topic. I’m out.

I’ve been successful using it in the past in PvP and PvE and WvW. I’m not sure why you are so invested in telling other people they aren’t playing good builds when you don’t play those builds.

And it’s not personal. It’s just I’m tired of people talking about things they know little about.

I’m playing necromancer and mesmer in WvW. No one of them can fight trapper thief because they just don’t see it.
Stealth disruptor is interesting but useless. Thief just runs away. So you can’t kill it at all.
D/P thief can escape too, but he’s not invulnurable and heavily depends on player’s skill.

Trapper thief shouldn’t exist in his current form. Fight can be more or less honest, but trapper thief just never takes a fight.

What could be changed. Traps should be used only as burst, not as the single tool of kill.
It could be fullfilled with trap activation delay of 1-2 sec. Than thief should kite enemy into a trap (just like dragonhunters do). May be increasing trap burst damage. I think it will be rather fair.
Another variant is to make impossilbe for thief to immobilize enemy inside trap without revealing himself.

Anyway, builds capable of killing enemy without any risk for themselves shouldn’t exist in game.

Lolz. Ghost thieves. Because they die right?