Guild Wars 2

A while ago, daggers damage was decreased by 50% for almost no reason, however now that it is I would love it if you changed it so something like this.

Dancing Dagger (3 Initiative, down from 4.)
Throw a dagger that cripples nearby foes and returns to you.
Damage: 336
Maximum targets: 3 (down from 4.)
Crippled: 5 s
Poison: 5 s
Combo Finisher: Physical Projectile
Range: 1200

Would be good for D/D, weakness condition may be redundant for S/D though. Change the weakness to poison.

Excalibur.9748:

Would be good for D/D, weakness condition may be redundant for S/D though. Change the weakness to poison.

Good idea, also fits the theme well!

It would really be a nice addition to P/D builds! Then I wouldn’t be pressured to go 10 into DA for poison on steal.

Just a couple things
- DD has already been reduced to 3 init
- As someone else pointed out on the boards, DD is currently bugged – the Cripple does not last the listed amount of time (more like 3s IIRC)

DD’s biggest current issue is velocity – it moves so slowly, people can sneeze and the attack will miss. What DD needs most is a velocity increase, so it can reliably hit targets who are moving at a slight angle from you (while allowing people moving parallel/specifically trying to strafe your attack to still avoid it).

Once we address the velocity issue, we can talk about other things. I think poisoning the first target would be a good addition (and leaving the total targets at 4) – Dagger OH doesn’t have an interrupt like Pistol OH does, and a ranged poison would be nice as a heal mitigator – hitting every bounced target with poison might be a bit much though.

skill damage is influenced by your raw stats ( power .. etc)
at 2800 atack is ~ 336
at 3600 attack is ~460

Wow. 2 for 2 decent ideas, Daecollo! I might actually look for your posts in the future to see what else you come up with.

Mmm, I likey. I can’t speak from a D/D perspective. P/D would definitely love the extra condition. With S/D, I’ll just take whatever buff is on offer. It’s not useless right now, but it is underwhelming. I probably use it for tagging more than anything else.

Am I the only one who see how overpowered this would be?

I mean AoE dmg+poison at 1200 range from an off-hand? >.<’

This is too good in comparison to SB’s Choking Gas. :/

EDIT:
Don’t get me wrong, I like it for my S/D, but I have to be honest how broken this would be.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Am I the only one who see how overpowered this would be?

I mean AoE dmg+poison at 1200 range from an off-hand? >.<’

This is too good in comparison to SB’s Choking Gas. :/

EDIT:
Don’t get me wrong, I like it for my S/D, but I have to be honest how broken this would be.

Not worried about that right now. ANET will do the final tuning.

It would be better to strikes twice to single target.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Am I the only one who see how overpowered this would be?

I mean AoE dmg+poison at 1200 range from an off-hand? >.<’

This is too good in comparison to SB’s Choking Gas. :/

EDIT:
Don’t get me wrong, I like it for my S/D, but I have to be honest how broken this would be.

Range 900
Velocity increase
first target is poisoned
Cripple actually last the listed duration

I think that’s what Dancing Dagger needs.
Velocity increase to counter its current biggest issue (being kittenty at actually hitting and slowing down targets)
Poison one target to help dagger OH compete with Pistol OH
Cripple lasting the correct duration because, well, that’s how it was designed.

I’d switch the poison for torment, but it sounds cool
Don’t expect the 1200 range though, not going to happen..

Black Cat.1024:

I’d switch the poison for torment, but it sounds cool
Don’t expect the 1200 range though, not going to happen..

Torment is only good for condition setups.

Poison is good for both specs, and it’s something Dagger offhand could use (since Pistol OH has Headshot for interrupting heals, it’d be Nice if Dagger OH had something to bring it up to par)

This skill gets a lot of hate due to the past damage decrease but I still use it a lot on my S/D build to slow down runners. Hate to say it but crippled AND poison sounds like too much. Not many skills apply multiple conditions. Just fix the cripple duration and you’ll see this become much more useful.

1200 range is not happening as it would be greater than the shortbow range. On a side note I think they should add a grandmaster trait that increases shortbow range to 1200.

ghettogenius.9174:

This skill gets a lot of hate due to the past damage decrease but I still use it a lot on my S/D build to slow down runners. Hate to say it but crippled AND poison sounds like too much. Not many skills apply multiple conditions. Just fix the cripple duration and you’ll see this become much more useful.

1200 range is not happening as it would be greater than the shortbow range. On a side note I think they should add a grandmaster trait that increases shortbow range to 1200.

Poison only affects the first target – it’s to help Dagger OH compete with Pistol OH, which has alot more general utility than Dagger OH.

Regardless, it needs a velocity increase – if you’re hitting runners with DD, its because they haven’t learned moving 1 step to the left or right while the dagger is incoming is enough to make it miss.

evilapprentice.6379:

Black Cat.1024:

I’d switch the poison for torment, but it sounds cool
Don’t expect the 1200 range though, not going to happen..

Torment is only good for condition setups.

Poison is good for both specs, and it’s something Dagger offhand could use (since Pistol OH has Headshot for interrupting heals, it’d be Nice if Dagger OH had something to bring it up to par)

I don’t agree with this that much. Yes, it’s a condition but almost every skill can be useful. For example, If I’m fighting a D/D Backstab thief, using Dancing Dagger when I see the CnD animation starts guarantees successfully putting more pressure on him even in stealth. This is a makeup scenario for the torment part but you get my drift. I’m just saying that It’s impossible to make all sets viable completely. But a torment + cripple could but a pretty nice dent into any melee burst spec. It could also be a really nice opener if they’re running away.

Black Cat.1024:

evilapprentice.6379:

Black Cat.1024:

I’d switch the poison for torment, but it sounds cool
Don’t expect the 1200 range though, not going to happen..

Torment is only good for condition setups.

Poison is good for both specs, and it’s something Dagger offhand could use (since Pistol OH has Headshot for interrupting heals, it’d be Nice if Dagger OH had something to bring it up to par)

I don’t agree with this that much. Yes, it’s a condition but almost every skill can be useful. For example, If I’m fighting a D/D Backstab thief, using Dancing Dagger when I see the CnD animation starts guarantees successfully putting more pressure on him even in stealth. This is a makeup scenario for the torment part but you get my drift. I’m just saying that It’s impossible to make all sets viable completely. But a torment + cripple could but a pretty nice dent into any melee burst spec. It could also be a really nice opener if they’re running away.

You do realize that most Thief specs for Shadow’s Embrace, right?

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Black Cat.1024:

evilapprentice.6379:

Black Cat.1024:

I’d switch the poison for torment, but it sounds cool
Don’t expect the 1200 range though, not going to happen..

Torment is only good for condition setups.

Poison is good for both specs, and it’s something Dagger offhand could use (since Pistol OH has Headshot for interrupting heals, it’d be Nice if Dagger OH had something to bring it up to par)

I don’t agree with this that much. Yes, it’s a condition but almost every skill can be useful. For example, If I’m fighting a D/D Backstab thief, using Dancing Dagger when I see the CnD animation starts guarantees successfully putting more pressure on him even in stealth. This is a makeup scenario for the torment part but you get my drift. I’m just saying that It’s impossible to make all sets viable completely. But a torment + cripple could but a pretty nice dent into any melee burst spec. It could also be a really nice opener if they’re running away.

You do realize that most Thief specs for Shadow’s Embrace, right?

That is absolutely not the point. S/D for example, rely almost exclusively on movement and positioning, usually not going into SA at all. Same goes for them. But I was speaking in general – thinking outside the box on these viable and nonviable builds could be what people need to play. I’ve used Death blossom on a Backstab spec to apply more pressure when needed, and it rewarded me. The fact that not all the traits your weapon skills have are speced to your build doesn’t have to mean they’re not viable. That’s all I’m saying.

Black Cat.1024:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Black Cat.1024:

evilapprentice.6379:

Black Cat.1024:

I’d switch the poison for torment, but it sounds cool
Don’t expect the 1200 range though, not going to happen..

Torment is only good for condition setups.

Poison is good for both specs, and it’s something Dagger offhand could use (since Pistol OH has Headshot for interrupting heals, it’d be Nice if Dagger OH had something to bring it up to par)

I don’t agree with this that much. Yes, it’s a condition but almost every skill can be useful. For example, If I’m fighting a D/D Backstab thief, using Dancing Dagger when I see the CnD animation starts guarantees successfully putting more pressure on him even in stealth. This is a makeup scenario for the torment part but you get my drift. I’m just saying that It’s impossible to make all sets viable completely. But a torment + cripple could but a pretty nice dent into any melee burst spec. It could also be a really nice opener if they’re running away.

You do realize that most Thief specs for Shadow’s Embrace, right?

That is absolutely not the point. S/D for example, rely almost exclusively on movement and positioning, usually not going into SA at all. Same goes for them. But I was speaking in general – thinking outside the box on these viable and nonviable builds could be what people need to play. I’ve used Death blossom on a Backstab spec to apply more pressure when needed, and it rewarded me. The fact that not all the traits your weapon skills have are speced to your build doesn’t have to mean they’re not viable. That’s all I’m saying.

You’re assuming that condition coming from Dagger 4 with torment+cripple will actually put pressure on the thief. I replied that those will simply be stripped by going in stealth — that means, no pressure. In fact, the thief will come out fully healed.

I’d say take torment instead of poison, but oh well