Guild Wars 2

Seriously Brujeria….are you really THAT scared of one high damage utility skill? Do you maybe play with zerker runes in sPvP and are too busy figuring out your skills to actually move around while fighting? Because the skill sounds much much better when you cry about it than it is in reality.
If you use any other version of the same skill everyone else uses please share with me because it seriously sounds awesome to burst anyone and anything with just one utility skill without them being able to do anything against it!

Yoru.2687:

I just wish that staff would be more viable for condi thief… then again I feel that right now any class without access to burning doesn’t really have a chance at condi. So maby give Thieves some way to apply burning?

I wouldn’t expect burning to remain so out-of-proportion with the other damaging conditions for much longer…

Nike.2631:

Arrow.4619:

Nike.2631:

All true. Believe me, the prospect of my Thief being a first-round draft pick for raid-tank has me salivating.

Nothing against you as player . . . but I think you’re going to be sorely disappointed.

I’m not offended. What’s your concern? Best capacity to dodge in game, 10% mitigation after dodge, dishes weakness, self-heals left, right, and center (on hit and on spend initiative), evade on #3.

Bunker thieves (all 8 of us in the entire game…) are already incredibly tanky. The last round of changes builds on that like I could only dream of.

Believe me Tempest and Scrapper are way more tanky if they want to and Tempest can even share it with the team. They are a league on their own ^^

Toran.4230:

Believe me Tempest and Scrapper are way more tanky if they want to and Tempest can even share it with the team. They are a league on their own ^^

That just makes me more interested in the try-outs… ’cause I think I can take ’em .

Appreciate the hard work, Karl. It’s starting to show that you are putting thought into this spec. Dodges have really improved. With the changes you listed it gives them that edge they’ve been needing, obviously the animations are still being worked on but in general during beta they felt smoother then before.

As for the proposal for weakening strikes to add a mod effect I vote for taking less damage from weakened foes. It wIll benefit all types of builds, rewarding you for paying attention and applying weakness at key windows in your enemies rotation.

Good work, man

What about right now ! Please help thief, you think they’r good well think again !
https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/3fyzij/is_thief_weak_right_now_pvp_wvw/?ref=share&ref_source=link

Karl how about instead of increasing the effectiveness, just give us protection and keep them with the standard weakness. Or maybe stability.
I do agree though that condi DD thieves need to be a little stronger and the additional condition damage would be very appreciated.

We really need something unique which will help everyone in raids, so that we can also play an important role in raids.

I’m very pleased with the list of fixes to DD.

Thank you very much for your attention.

hope they also see poor value of daredevil’s gm trait – 1 dodge per 30 sec

Only thing i see an issue with is the damage on staff. It’s currently not a viable main weapon for pve or pvp, and with the utility of shortbow, staff cant be used there either. I’d suggest upping the damage on the auto attack (by a lot) and the skill 3. That, in addition to a rework for dust strike to be a dust (similar to smokescale) or dark field would make this a good weapon choice and add more purpose to the class itself, and thus more of a reason to run the spec.

Nike.2631:

Arrow.4619:

Nike.2631:

All true. Believe me, the prospect of my Thief being a first-round draft pick for raid-tank has me salivating.

Nothing against you as player . . . but I think you’re going to be sorely disappointed.

I’m not offended. What’s your concern? Best capacity to dodge in game, 10% mitigation after dodge, dishes weakness, self-heals left, right, and center (on hit and on spend initiative), evade on #3.

Bunker thieves (all 8 of us in the entire game…) are already incredibly tanky. The last round of changes builds on that like I could only dream of.

Wow! Nike you just might be onto something there. Kudos!

I’ve never tried a bunker thief, but I can see why you’d be getting excited, given what you quoted. I’ve mulled over the idea of a combat medic thief using the DD line. Perhaps I’ll look into both one day.

I’m just so happy to read about someone playing a build that is rare and enjoyable for them — who’s finding the hidden gems and synergies in the traits that many of us might quickly dismiss. Sets a great example.

I sure unearthed a gem with Daredevil! I started using Withdraw instead of Hide in Shadows with my Daredevil, paired with the Trickster trait in Trickery. It ended up synergizing really well in all but one situation — running away from a zerg in WvW LOL. But the extra “free” evade, solid heal. no cast time and extra condi cleanse made a huge difference in PvE, 1v1s, forward facing combat and good kiting. Certainly an unexpected gem I never have tried before.

Nike.2631:

Arrow.4619:

Nike.2631:

All true. Believe me, the prospect of my Thief being a first-round draft pick for raid-tank has me salivating.

Nothing against you as player . . . but I think you’re going to be sorely disappointed.

I’m not offended. What’s your concern? Best capacity to dodge in game, 10% mitigation after dodge, dishes weakness, self-heals left, right, and center (on hit and on spend initiative), evade on #3.

Bunker thieves (all 8 of us in the entire game…) are already incredibly tanky. The last round of changes builds on that like I could only dream of.

There more then 8

babazhook.6805:

Nike.2631:

Arrow.4619:

Nike.2631:

All true. Believe me, the prospect of my Thief being a first-round draft pick for raid-tank has me salivating.

Nothing against you as player . . . but I think you’re going to be sorely disappointed.

I’m not offended. What’s your concern? Best capacity to dodge in game, 10% mitigation after dodge, dishes weakness, self-heals left, right, and center (on hit and on spend initiative), evade on #3.

Bunker thieves (all 8 of us in the entire game…) are already incredibly tanky. The last round of changes builds on that like I could only dream of.

There more then 8

He probably didn’t see those who are in stealth.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

babazhook.6805:

Nike.2631:

Arrow.4619:

Nike.2631:

All true. Believe me, the prospect of my Thief being a first-round draft pick for raid-tank has me salivating.

Nothing against you as player . . . but I think you’re going to be sorely disappointed.

I’m not offended. What’s your concern? Best capacity to dodge in game, 10% mitigation after dodge, dishes weakness, self-heals left, right, and center (on hit and on spend initiative), evade on #3.

Bunker thieves (all 8 of us in the entire game…) are already incredibly tanky. The last round of changes builds on that like I could only dream of.

There more then 8

He probably didn’t see those who are in stealth.

What’s stealth?

I really feel like there are both positive and negative things about this spec. Personally I think the lack of stealth with this spec creates a high(er) skill cap amongst the current thieves and will separate who really knows the class. However I dislike the fact that sword / dagger will be the future meta for DD seeing as Acrobatics took a decent nerf pre Heart of Thorns to pave a clearly visible path for Daredevil. I myself prefer dagger / pistol and short bow. I feel like taking away the stealth aspect of thief somewhat takes away from the initial draw that most people had when making it their main class. The staff skills to me feel like they need tremendous work and more responsive skills.

Also, regardless if it’s a “learn to play” spec in order to be good, I feel like it’s heavily outmatched when it comes to 1v1. I fully understand that it is capable of winning with ease against the average player and simple enough to use in PVE to make a valuable addition in a team. I feel it is outmatched at higher levels of play, namely 1v1, and will remain there. I obviously main thief and would like to see it shine. These new changes are certainly a step in the right direction. However a small suggestion, increase the damage mitigation. I like the direction of applied weakness making an opponent do less damage to you, however I am curious to see if it will be enough to make a difference. Also instead of making the condition removal based on evades, seeing as that requires being attacked and sometimes you just need to breathe from a fight, make them based on the evasions period. A static 1-2 condition removal every evade regardless if it was successful or not. Now I know that the idea is to “reward” evades with an end result, in this case condition removal, however instead of making the reward survivability, introduce utility. It would be nice to see maybe a healing power increase on successful evade or perhaps a super speed buff. Something that doesn’t make your “reward” for timing an evasion correctly simply staying alive longer. This spec revolves around evades and should benefit them in every way possible.

I’ve heard countless talks about simply not using the grand master traits of this spec to give you the edge in Daredevil in order to 1vX properly. I strongly dislike cutting my given abilities in order to make my class a success and would prefer a better solution. Which seems to be the direction you’re going. I know it’s still in beta, however I still show concern for it because I’d like to stay a thief main.

I also understand that nerfs / “balancing” needs to take place within this spec, however I find it hard to fall for when we’ve let several classes be extremely well rounded over the past three years with few “balancing” features. Everyone playing at a higher level of pvp or even pve understands and can easily identify these classes. In closing, I’d rather have thief / Daredevil strong come launch, and take some hits, rather than it starting weak and staying there due to people who don’t understand it constantly berating it into the nerf zone until it’s “fixed”. I like the changes and I hope to see more in the future.

Nike.2631:

Yoru.2687:

I just wish that staff would be more viable for condi thief… then again I feel that right now any class without access to burning doesn’t really have a chance at condi. So maby give Thieves some way to apply burning?

I wouldn’t expect burning to remain so out-of-proportion with the other damaging conditions for much longer…

I’ve heard nothing that would indicate that. It was still an issue during the beta weekend.

As for thief, I’d just like to see one other change… trickster should remove 2 conditions.

Viridianna.9347:

I really feel like there are both positive and negative things about this spec. Personally I think the lack of stealth with this spec creates a high(er) skill cap amongst the current thieves and will separate who really knows the class. However I dislike the fact that sword / dagger will be the future meta for DD seeing as Acrobatics took a decent nerf pre Heart of Thorns to pave a clearly visible path for Daredevil. I myself prefer dagger / pistol and short bow. I feel like taking away the stealth aspect of thief somewhat takes away from the initial draw that most people had when making it their main class. The staff skills to me feel like they need tremendous work and more responsive skills.

Also, regardless if it’s a “learn to play” spec in order to be good, I feel like it’s heavily outmatched when it comes to 1v1. I fully understand that it is capable of winning with ease against the average player and simple enough to use in PVE to make a valuable addition in a team. I feel it is outmatched at higher levels of play, namely 1v1, and will remain there. I obviously main thief and would like to see it shine. These new changes are certainly a step in the right direction. However a small suggestion, increase the damage mitigation. I like the direction of applied weakness making an opponent do less damage to you, however I am curious to see if it will be enough to make a difference. Also instead of making the condition removal based on evades, seeing as that requires being attacked and sometimes you just need to breathe from a fight, make them based on the evasions period. A static 1-2 condition removal every evade regardless if it was successful or not. Now I know that the idea is to “reward” evades with an end result, in this case condition removal, however instead of making the reward survivability, introduce utility. It would be nice to see maybe a healing power increase on successful evade or perhaps a super speed buff. Something that doesn’t make your “reward” for timing an evasion correctly simply staying alive longer. This spec revolves around evades and should benefit them in every way possible.

I’ve heard countless talks about simply not using the grand master traits of this spec to give you the edge in Daredevil in order to 1vX properly. I strongly dislike cutting my given abilities in order to make my class a success and would prefer a better solution. Which seems to be the direction you’re going. I know it’s still in beta, however I still show concern for it because I’d like to stay a thief main.

I also understand that nerfs / “balancing” needs to take place within this spec, however I find it hard to fall for when we’ve let several classes be extremely well rounded over the past three years with few “balancing” features. Everyone playing at a higher level of pvp or even pve understands and can easily identify these classes. In closing, I’d rather have thief / Daredevil strong come launch, and take some hits, rather than it starting weak and staying there due to people who don’t understand it constantly berating it into the nerf zone until it’s “fixed”. I like the changes and I hope to see more in the future.

There are many things here that I agree with. Due to thief losing one of their key mechanics then the trade off has to make it amazing or why would someone consider bringing a DD into pve now? Very understandable that the spec is new but that doesn’t mean that suddenly the damage will become much better or things such as the GM trait will become useful. For two events the traits were useless so since this is the final BWE that’s kind of troubling.

If things were out of hand it could be much easier to fix and many people won’t be thinking about quitting their classes. Than starting the class very weak and begging for some support to become useful.

Dorian.8542:

Only thing i see an issue with is the damage on staff. It’s currently not a viable main weapon for pve or pvp, and with the utility of shortbow, staff cant be used there either. I’d suggest upping the damage on the auto attack (by a lot) and the skill 3. That, in addition to a rework for dust strike to be a dust (similar to smokescale) or dark field would make this a good weapon choice and add more purpose to the class itself, and thus more of a reason to run the spec.

damage on staff is fine. overtuned, even. it’s utility that is lacking on staff.

giving staff a smoke field would make it objectively better than black powder, and we really don’t need two skills that do the same thing. i’m perfectly fine with staff not getting any stealth, or even combo fields. that said, dust strike does need to affect enemies around the daredevil, not in front of him. especially since, you know, so much of the spec’s combat style keeps putting you with your back against the target (bound, vault, weakening charge).

as for skill 3, it doesn’t need damage. it needs something else though. i and a few others suggested daze. there’s also the interesting option (IMO) of moving the autoattack’s reflect to this skill, so you have more control over it (though i think i’d rather have the daze). some people want a follow-up skill that leaps you back, though if vault gets improved range (plz 900 range), i’d like to see instead this skill throwing you even further away.

style.6173:

As for thief, I’d just like to see one other change… trickster should remove 2 conditions.

i was thinking of picking trickster for my condi DD, and i was surprised to see that it’s only 1 condition. whole trait is probably balanced around withdraw and scorpion wire.

rangers can have 2 conditions (and fury, but that’s why it’s a GM trait), why can’t we? it’s pretty much the same trait >.>

sirjarros.4107:

Wow! Nike you just might be onto something there. Kudos!

Super Unicorn used to be a well known and even respected part of the meta-build line up for Thieves. It’s never actually stopped working and for the most part you can see the Devs going out of their way to not nerf it and even buff it. It also does something we don’t see enough with the poor mis-used word… it’s ACTUALLY metagaming: Examining the expectations and most likely choices of your opponents and preying on their assumptions. It plays so completely unlike stealth-reliant “+1 thieves” that people make mistakes engaging Super Unicorns.

You know what being revealed does to a super unicorn? Nothing. At worst it makes them not Dagger #5/Dagger #1 you… a move already very low on their priority to begin with but something they might slip in every once in a while to keep you honest. And you aren’t chained to SB in your off slot because you don’t run away from fights. You also don’t necessarily have to win fights to win matches. You make fights, even 2-on-1s against you, drag out forever. You take and hold points and force the enemy to come to you and free up the map for your teammates to sweep it.

Not as sexy as ‘big numbers/big damage’, but fun and effective. And very, very much being given powerful new tools to weave into the design with the Daredevil line.

babazhook.6805:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

babazhook.6805:

Nike.2631:

Bunker thieves (all 8 of us in the entire game…) are already incredibly tanky. The last round of changes builds on that like I could only dream of.

There more then 8

He probably didn’t see those who are in stealth.

What’s stealth?

Ex-actly!

Nike.2631:

sirjarros.4107:

Wow! Nike you just might be onto something there. Kudos!

Super Unicorn used to be a well known and even respected part of the meta-build line up for Thieves. It’s never actually stopped working and for the most part you can see the Devs going out of their way to not nerf it and even buff it. It also does something we don’t see enough with the poor mis-used word… it’s ACTUALLY metagaming: Examining the expectations and most likely choices of your opponents and preying on their assumptions. It plays so completely unlike stealth-reliant “+1 thieves” that people make mistakes engaging Super Unicorns.

You know what being revealed does to a super unicorn? Nothing. At worst it makes them not Dagger #5/Dagger #1 you… a move already very low on their priority to begin with but something they might slip in every once in a while to keep you honest. And you aren’t chained to SB in your off slot because you don’t run away from fights. You also don’t necessarily have to win fights to win matches. You make fights, even 2-on-1s against you, drag out forever. You take and hold points and force the enemy to come to you and free up the map for your teammates to sweep it.

Not as sexy as ‘big numbers/big damage’, but fun and effective. And very, very much being given powerful new tools to weave into the design with the Daredevil line.

I have been playing d/d condi build in WvW for some time on one of my thieves. I always liked it better than P/d . With DD spec it going to be very much better. Even taking unhindered combat over impaling lotus is a marked improvement in the build (ie no immobs to worry on and an ability to chase those guys that turn to run)

Now WITH a new weakening strikes (if it is 10 percent less damage taken) you can trait unhindered and take 20 percent less damage over all. That will be more sustain or with that SOM get al the more healing from Impaling lotus OR if weakening strikes gets a condition tacked on load on yet more conditions.

In that last beta I was getting over 5ks in heals from a DB. That can not be sustained long term but it some decent healing.

Well, after some thought I think we all agree on one thing:

Conditions need to be clearable on thief.

Now, we could just buff the escapist absolution to clear 1-2 conditions per dodge, but then no one would ever use the other 2 traits in the master’s line. Here is my proposal, to make condi clear more viable in other trait lines:

Instead of adding 2 condition clears on a trick, maybe add the caltrops on dodge as a trick to proc with that trait to make a 2 trait combo for good clear on dodging? This way you sacrifice some support and get the condi cleanse you need.
Then there isn’t a need to go for escapist absolution if you want to clear while dodging and opens up other build options.

Then we have reliable condi clear from a number of options.

Also I think a short slow would be awesome on weakining strikes, adding condi pressure and damage mitigation at the same time. Also fits the DD theme

Thanks for these changes. The whole idea of getting a staff was to be able to finally 1v1 people again. Why give us a bruiser option if we are still only forced to decap /finish off weak enemies ect.

This makes me seriously thinking about focusing on thief after all. .:)

Holliday.5786:

Instead of adding 2 condition clears on a trick, maybe add the caltrops on dodge as a trick to proc with that trait to make a 2 trait combo for good clear on dodging? This way you sacrifice some support and get the condi cleanse you need.
Then there isn’t a need to go for escapist absolution if you want to clear while dodging and opens up other build options.

I prefer just adding two condition clears on the trickster trait. That way it can be used by both power and condition builds that want to use it. Your solution is great for condi builds, but isn’t helpful for a power build.

Just a few thoughts on some of the traits and skills after playing daredevil last weekend.

Brawler’s Tenacity
The 10 endurance gain from this trait is just way to low to be noticeable, i think changing the trait to give 20-25 endurance when you hit with a physical skill would be allot better, and reward actually hitting your skills. It would need a small cool down then to not be to strong with multi hit skills.

Pulmonary Impact
maybe change the damage from the pulmonary impact the same as life-leach just without a heal, this would make it ignore the targets armor value, giving a good option against bunker heavy classes while not making the damage higher against more squishy targets.

Weakening Charge
It would maybe make more sense to swap the effect of this attack and the last attack in the staff aa chain, giving the aa chain weakness at the end and giving staff a on demand projectile reflect option. The damage also seems like it need to be tuned down a bit atm.

Punishing Strikes
making this into a counter attack skill would fit the theme of daredevil and staff allot, making it block the next attack then do a blinding strike. Would maybe need a increased initiative cost so it cant be spammed.

Staff Master
changing this to give some endurance when you negate an attack while wielding staff i.e blind block or dodge, would fit the overall theme of the elite spec.

I think these changes would help different the spec from the core thief more.

babazhook.6805:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

babazhook.6805:

Nike.2631:

Arrow.4619:

Nike.2631:

All true. Believe me, the prospect of my Thief being a first-round draft pick for raid-tank has me salivating.

Nothing against you as player . . . but I think you’re going to be sorely disappointed.

I’m not offended. What’s your concern? Best capacity to dodge in game, 10% mitigation after dodge, dishes weakness, self-heals left, right, and center (on hit and on spend initiative), evade on #3.

Bunker thieves (all 8 of us in the entire game…) are already incredibly tanky. The last round of changes builds on that like I could only dream of.

There more then 8

He probably didn’t see those who are in stealth.

What’s stealth?

I’m under the impression that Shadow/Ninja Nurses build tanky too. I’m probably mistaken.

Karl McLain.5604:

For trait mods, we’d like to experiment with Weakening Strikes slightly, adding a secondary to it within its role of debilitation. Options we’re looking at it:

• Inflict X (torment, bleeding, something) when you weaken a foe.
  or
• Receive less damage from weakened foes.

Once again, thanks for your continued constructive feedback. It’s greatly appreciated.

-Karl

I like all the changes and i really appreciate you taking the time to talk to the thief community.

This is just a thought if you are looking for a way to make thieves more survivable i believe this could help

Weakening Strike Leach life from weakened foes or could give regeneration 5 or 6 seconds.

Not only does this give some survival to the thief by providing sustain instead of redundant damage mitigation which weakness already provides, but could be a small buff to damage as well if it was leaching. If you did choose leaching it could function as Sigil of Leaching or Sigil of Blood instead of percentage such as Invigorating Percision that way condition and power builds benefit in the same way. So it would basicly similar to both options you proposed, damage and sustain instead of damage or sustain

Bandits Defense

I mentioned this in another forum page, could we also make the knock back an option? Sometimes thieves wants to stay on the defensive and not be thrown back into offensive.

Thanks for listening Karl!

Karl McLain.5604:

Here’s a couple other updates that had been in the works and are now in testing.

• Vault: Reduced aftercast by 80ms. Added a 500ms evade at the start of the ability.
• Distracting Daggers: Projectiles from this ability are now counted as 100% projectile finishers.
• Impairing Daggers: Projectiles from this ability are now counted as 100% projectile finishers.
• Weakening Strikes: This trait now grants 10% damage reduction when being struck by a weakened foe, in addition to weakening foes on critical hit.

Woo yess

Karl McLain.5604:

Here’s a couple other updates that had been in the works and are now in testing.

• Vault: Reduced aftercast by 80ms. Added a 500ms evade at the start of the ability.
• Distracting Daggers: Projectiles from this ability are now counted as 100% projectile finishers.
• Impairing Daggers: Projectiles from this ability are now counted as 100% projectile finishers.
• Weakening Strikes: This trait now grants 10% damage reduction when being struck by a weakened foe, in addition to weakening foes on critical hit.

that’s gonna make vaulting in and out of fights much more reliable. thanks! (plz give us more range engis have 800 range on their targeted leap, so it’s not like we’ll break out of maps with it!)

don’t particularly care about projectile finishers, especially on thief (what am i going to do, blind more?), but it’s a nice touch for the sake of consistency. maybe when someone drops a fire field for you, you can throw impairing daggers for an extra 3 stacks of burn, on top of everything else.

like i mentioned last page, i’d have personally preferred 15%, as it would be closer to additive 10%, instead of multiplicative 10% (which totals to 7.5% total reduction), but i won’t complain. it’s still pretty strong.

hoping all the discussion on dust strike and debilitating arc isn’t lost on you

Karl McLain.5604:

Here’s a couple other updates that had been in the works and are now in testing.

• Vault: Reduced aftercast by 80ms. Added a 500ms evade at the start of the ability.
• Distracting Daggers: Projectiles from this ability are now counted as 100% projectile finishers.
• Impairing Daggers: Projectiles from this ability are now counted as 100% projectile finishers.
• Weakening Strikes: This trait now grants 10% damage reduction when being struck by a weakened foe, in addition to weakening foes on critical hit.

Muhuhuwahahahahhhh…

Oh man. Super Unicorn is BACK with a vengeance, baby!

Nike.2631:

Karl McLain.5604:

Here’s a couple other updates that had been in the works and are now in testing.

• Vault: Reduced aftercast by 80ms. Added a 500ms evade at the start of the ability.
• Distracting Daggers: Projectiles from this ability are now counted as 100% projectile finishers.
• Impairing Daggers: Projectiles from this ability are now counted as 100% projectile finishers.
• Weakening Strikes: This trait now grants 10% damage reduction when being struck by a weakened foe, in addition to weakening foes on critical hit.

Muhuhuwahahahahhhh…

Oh man. Super Unicorn is BACK with a vengeance, baby!

you’re just dying to have someone ask you what “super unicorn” is, aren’t you?

Very nice changes. The weakness doing a further 10 percent damage reduction will work nice with s/d as well which has a source of weakness. If s/d traits Unhindered combat over bounding dodger they can get 20 percent .

Daggers(impairing/distracting) as 100 percent projectile finishers will work very nice in poison fields or on the etheral we steal from the engie so more condition sources. They can turn 3 stacks poison into 6 potentially if used in a choking gas field off impairing.

This is very nice. Basically now, as a S/D Thief with Dash, I take 20% less damage from a weakened foes in comparison to what we played during BWE3. ( 10% on dash itself, and those )

That’s very big as far as 1v1 power goes.

daredevil is turning out good still hope they touch up the 4 on the staff before release still though some how.

There we go bois.

Those sound like good changes, although still no word about the more significant changes we believe are necessary. It’s all shuffling deckchairs at the moment.

I like that the daggers will become projectiles, but I don’t really see the point since Staff doesn’t have any fields. This change needs to come in addition to turning Dust Strike into a Darkness or Smoke Field layer.

Don’t get too hyped yet, those things are still just “now in testing”.

Karl McLain.5604:

Here’s a couple other updates that had been in the works and are now in testing.

• Vault: Reduced aftercast by 80ms. Added a 500ms evade at the start of the ability.
• Distracting Daggers: Projectiles from this ability are now counted as 100% projectile finishers.
• Impairing Daggers: Projectiles from this ability are now counted as 100% projectile finishers.
• Weakening Strikes: This trait now grants 10% damage reduction when being struck by a weakened foe, in addition to weakening foes on critical hit.

Man DrD is getting better & better each day. Liking that this line has a lot of defensive options for thief. Consider adding a daze to staff 4 if used up close, this could be a way to improve the skill. I hope that the running/idle animations will change when you guys get the chance. So far thanks to all that are working hard to make this spec awesome!

Karl McLain.5604:

Here’s a couple other updates that had been in the works and are now in testing.

• Vault: Reduced aftercast by 80ms. Added a 500ms evade at the start of the ability.
• Distracting Daggers: Projectiles from this ability are now counted as 100% projectile finishers.
• Impairing Daggers: Projectiles from this ability are now counted as 100% projectile finishers.
• Weakening Strikes: This trait now grants 10% damage reduction when being struck by a weakened foe, in addition to weakening foes on critical hit.

10% reduction of weakening strikes and 100% finishers for moar lifesteals and blinds?

That’s hot.

Any word on core thief rebalances? You’re killing it with the DD stuff here, we’d love to see the trend continue to core thief’s issues some time after release.

Not asking for a commitment, I’m just curious where you guys at anet see the main issues of the core thief lines, utils, and weapons. I know you’ve said you still think pistol needs love, any opinions about acrobatics or venoms?

Evade frames on the knock down portion of Bandit’s Defense would keep it viable.

I totally agree with hollow’s statement above. You should be able to not receive damage during the knock back portion of Bandits defense so that it is actually viable in group fights. It is useful as is now but will be much more viable in group fights because I found myself getting too much damage or being interrupted before I could land the interrupt. Maybe also have the cast time of the interrupt lowered.

Good changes. kinda wishing that they removed number 4 ability and replaced it with anything else though.

Ugh the 21st cant come sooner, really want to mess with a P/P, Staff build in PvP!!!

Karl McLain.5604:

Here’s a couple other updates that had been in the works and are now in testing.

• Vault: Reduced aftercast by 80ms. Added a 500ms evade at the start of the ability.
• Distracting Daggers: Projectiles from this ability are now counted as 100% projectile finishers.
• Impairing Daggers: Projectiles from this ability are now counted as 100% projectile finishers.
• Weakening Strikes: This trait now grants 10% damage reduction when being struck by a weakened foe, in addition to weakening foes on critical hit.

You are officially the BEST dev ever. Time to create the praise Karl fan club. >.> Now I have one question- what kind of animation did we settle on for Bound? The one from Bwe3 (a rapid vertical spin style) , bwe2 (vault style), or a new one? And then I will have no patience for the HoT release day >.>…. I need bifrost.

Thanks for all the updates, Karl! It’s good to see that so much progress is being made.

Karl McLain.5604:

• Bounding Dodger: In addition to granting access to the Bound dodge ability, the thief will gain 10% bonus physical damage for 4 seconds after dodging.
• Lotus Training: In addition to granting access to the Impaling Lotus dodge ability, the thief will gain 10% bonus condition damage for 4 seconds after dodging.
• Unhindered combatant: In addition to granting the Dash dodge ability, the thief will gain 10% damage reduction against physical and condition damage.

This seems to be your response to the ongoing discussion on whether the dodges are worthy of being Grandmaster traits. While not a bad direction to go in, raising the bonuses to 20% would seal the deal.

Karl McLain.5604:

• Fist Flurry: Reduced cast time by 20%. note: The final strike occurs just prior to 1 second.

Palm Strike seems meaningless as a flip skill: you have a short window to use it, and there isn’t much tactical value to delaying it. Why not have it trigger automatically if you land the last hit of Fist Flurry?

Karl McLain.5604:

• Vault: Reduced aftercast by 80ms. Added a 500ms evade at the start of the ability.

This should solve a lot of issues with Vault! I still have a lot of concerns with the Staff relating to utility and internal synergy (especially on skills #1, #3, and #4), but that’s for another, longer post.

Karl McLain.5604:

• Distracting Daggers: Projectiles from this ability are now counted as 100% projectile finishers.

There are still too many limitations on this skill for it to see real use. Removing the 1s ICD between individual dagger throws would put the skill right about where it should be.

Karl McLain.5604:

• Impairing Daggers: Projectiles from this ability are now counted as 100% projectile finishers.

Impairing Daggers is looking pretty solid! There is some weirdness with landing it from max range and/or near obstructions. A projectile speed increase similar to what Distracting Daggers previously received would help a lot.

Karl McLain.5604:

• Weakening Strikes: This trait now grants 10% damage reduction when being struck by a weakened foe, in addition to weakening foes on critical hit.

While Weakening Strikes is sounding great, I have some serious concerns about diversity of choice in the trait tier it currently occupies. Havoc Master is now focused on fighting up close, which makes it less of a general purpose trait than it previously was. Brawler’s Tenacity is only for builds heavily utilizing Physicals, and of arguable use even then. That leaves Weakening Strikes. It’s looking a lot better with the proposed changes, but the crit requirement locks non-crit builds out of using it. This leaves the tier with no good “fallback” choice that works in any build. For this and other reasons, I suggest changing the Weakening Strikes proc to function on hit. Otherwise, looking good!

P.S. Inexplicably, Escapist’s Absolution is still a major. Merge it with Driven Fortitude

Karl McLain.5604:

• Receive less damage from weakened foes.

I’d prefer this option. I like the idea of being able to be tanky enough to survive a bit too, rather than just finish off foes.

As long as Vault fails to be combo’d with Steal or teleports, its going to be useless no matter what’s done to it. So I think that’s the priorty here, not some minor adjustment.

Hi Karl,

I don’t like the changes to Vault. It’s why I think a skill shouldn’t have mobility, offence and defence. I would rather see the distance enhanced (900 would be so nice) and the cast time reduced (to 1/2 second).

And plz improve Dust Strike. It’s nearly always a waste of initative.